Time to exit, Peter.

[Marcus Bryant]

It's been a fun ride. But as Spurs fans we need more. It's painful to see Tim Duncan at this point in his career forced to carry this supporting cast. He deserves more. Loyal Spurs fans deserve more.

So it's time to step aside for someone who will make the commitment to ensure that this team has the best possible shot at making the most of the rest of an NBA legend's career.

Adios.

[Leetonidas]

I agree. Peter Holt is gay. We need a big spender.

[ChumpDumper]

Who?

[Extra Stout]

I'm starting to question whether Tim Duncan will re-up next year.

[SsKSpurs21]

what we need is a pure scorer. someone who can catch fire and take us out of these 4-5 minute scoring droughts!

[Marcus Bryant]

I'm starting to question whether Tim Duncan will re-up next year.

Spurs seem to have gone about it all wrong. You don't keep TD by setting yourself up for max flexibility should he leave....

[SenorSpur]

The only time the owner and FO were motivated to keep improving the roster was when Tim was on short 3-year contracts. The moment he re-upped to a max deal, they FO got complacent.

[Marcus Bryant]

I think Holt has a different sort of motivation now...

[phxspurfan]

what we need is a pure scorer. someone who can catch fire and take us out of these 4-5 minute scoring droughts!


so we need kobe

[mFFL03]

wow...no faith in their team whatsoever.

[ChumpDumper]

Classy.

[phxspurfan]

oh, and tayshaun prince
how bout shane battier
udonis haslem
corey magette
jason kidd
how bout we trade everybody

[dbreiden83080]

The only time the owner and FO were motivated to keep improving the roster was when Tim was on short 3-year contracts. The moment he re-upped to a max deal, they FO got complacent.

No way look the Spurs FO if need be will do the right thing in the offseason and spend the money in the FA market or make the trades they need to make to improve this team around Timmy. I don't believe they would betray Tim and let this team go south just to save a few bucks after everything he has done for them over the years. The Spurs would be nothing without Tim Duncan and they know that.

[TDMVPDPOY]

david robinson and sean elliot owns a small share in the spurs, time to spend dudes :D:D

[Manu_The _Best]

It's been a fun ride. But as Spurs fans we need more. It's painful to see Tim Duncan at this point in his career forced to carry this supporting cast. He deserves more. Loyal Spurs fans deserve more.

So it's time to step aside for someone who will make the commitment to ensure that this team has the best possible shot at making the most of the rest of an NBA legend's career.

Adios.

Agree. In today's NBA in order to compete, you would need to spend more $$$$, but to the opposite Holt is trying to SAVE at the expense of the Fans and Timmy's legendary career...too bad... :bang :bang :bang :madrun :madrun :madrun :madrun :madrun

[slayermin]

How about Oprah? She's a billionaire and the Spurs are a classy organization.

[kris]

It's been a fun ride. But as Spurs fans we need more. It's painful to see Tim Duncan at this point in his career forced to carry this supporting cast. He deserves more. Loyal Spurs fans deserve more.

So it's time to step aside for someone who will make the commitment to ensure that this team has the best possible shot at making the most of the rest of an NBA legend's career.

Adios.

The supporting cast sucks, but so does Duncan. Nice cover job, but not on my watch.

Let me end by quoting you.

"It's painful to see Tim Duncan at this point in his career." - Marcus Bryant

[bresilhac]

You idiots should get off of Holt's back already. How can one be so stupid as to question the motives of an owner that has brought you three Championships. It's too moronic to think about but since so many of you SpursTalk Einsteins have felt it necessary to knock a true winner I have to come his defense. If it wasn't for this owner and his brilliant Front office moves we would have nothing hanging from the rafters but the jersey's of a bunch of losers. Keep in mind that the Spurs are the winningest team in pro sports during the Holt era. And with the big three locked in contractually they should be at or near the top for several more years. How would you like to have the Raptors or Knicks in town instead of the Spurs? Duh.

[Marcus Bryant]

Duncan's only locked in through next season. Nice try.

[TDMVPDPOY]

does tim duncan even play for the spurs?

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

You idiots should get off of Holt's back already. How can one be so stupid as to question the motives of an owner that has brought you three Championships. It's too moronic to think about but since so many of you SpursTalk Einsteins have felt it necessary to knock a true winner I have to come his defense. If it wasn't for this owner and his brilliant Front office moves we would have nothing hanging from the rafters but the jersey's of a bunch of losers. Keep in mind that the Spurs are the winningest team in pro sports during the Holt era. And with the big three locked in contractually they should be at or near the top for several more years. How would you like to have the Raptors or Knicks in town instead of the Spurs? Duh.

You don't know much about how this team is run, do you? His brilliant front office moves? Holt wouldn't know what the orange round thing is if Pop wouldn't have told him.

And the irony of your post is that we're fixing to have the Raptors or Knicks pretty quick with the way he is running the team.

[dknights411]

You don't know much about how this team is run, do you? His brilliant front office moves? Holt wouldn't know what the orange round thing is if Pop wouldn't have told him.

And the irony of your post is that we're fixing to have the Raptors or Knicks pretty quick with the way he is running the team.

I wouldn't go THAT far.

[Louie Vega]

wow...no faith in their team whatsoever.

Anything short of a championship is a disappointing season to Spurs fans. Of course, I wouldn't expect you to understand that being a mavs fan and all.

[Louie Vega]

You idiots should get off of Holt's back already. How can one be so stupid as to question the motives of an owner that has brought you three Championships. It's too moronic to think about but since so many of you SpursTalk Einsteins have felt it necessary to knock a true winner I have to come his defense. If it wasn't for this owner and his brilliant Front office moves we would have nothing hanging from the rafters but the jersey's of a bunch of losers. Keep in mind that the Spurs are the winningest team in pro sports during the Holt era. And with the big three locked in contractually they should be at or near the top for several more years. How would you like to have the Raptors or Knicks in town instead of the Spurs? Duh.

:rolleyes That's why Spurs fans are pissed right now jagoff! We are used to the front office pulling rabbits out of their hats!

[zero signal]

I wouldn't go THAT far.

If Duncan doesn't stick around, it would go that far.

I don't think it's an unrealistic scenario, if the Spurs can't contend. TD doesn't seem to be attached to SA the way DRob was.

[Louie Vega]

Oprah would move the spurs to Chicago to become a NBA 2-team city... :lol


Money can't buy you everything people! Look at the Knicks. They got money to burn and they still suck! Imagine, the Knicks money and the Spurs front office combined?!

[Kermit]

holt's not the problem. he's far from being the only tight-wad owner in the league. personnel decesions are what's hurting the team.

[ploto]

holt's not the problem. he's far from being the only tight-wad owner in the league. personnel decesions are what's hurting the team.
But he is involved in these decisons- more than people realize.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I wouldn't go THAT far.

Which part is untrue? Holt doesn't know anything about basketball.

As to the latter part, if they don't put any pieces around Tim, he's going to walk away from this franchise next year when he becomes a free agent.

He almost left once before when it looked like the Spurs weren't going to surround him with players. Or do you think a 45 year old Jacque Vaughn, 330 year old Michael Finley, 200 year old Brent Barry, and 800 year old Robert Horry are going to convince him to stick around? :lol

[Kermit]

well, i would hope he is. he's the owner. however, peter holt didn't scout beno, and he probably didn't propose the signing of one shitty ass mike finley. holt writes the checks and gives the final o.k. i assume but seeing as how his expertise is tractors and not basketball, i doubt he's coming up with possible trade scenarios and free-agent signings. that's what i meant by personnel decisions.

[ajh18]

These attacks on the ownership have always frustrated me, because it's like people expect the ownership group to treat the Spurs like they're a charity or something. The owners (or their families) made their money, invested it in a team, and continue to spend it every year in an effort to both make a profit, and compete for a championship. It probably isn't the most financially prudent way to invest that many milions of dollars, but clearly making money isn't the sole reason for owning an NBA team. Otherwise, you get owners like sterling, who for years let his promising talent walk so that he could turn the most profit he possibly could.

In Peter Holt, what we have is an owner who is willing to spend on those players his front office chooses to go after, with the front office understanding that the owner simply doesn't have as much money as the mark cubans of the world. He CAN'T spend like those people, and I don't believe that his desire to make some profit makes him cheap. Its his investment, and unlike for fans, winning isn't the only outcome. These are millions of his dollars we're talking about. Should he keep spending to the point where he is no longer making money off the team? Or until he actually loses money because the salaries are so high? I don't think it is very reasonable to ask that of ownership. Holt puts a financially responsibe team on the floor that is still consistently in a position to win a title, and I'm proud to support a team that has won without spending like the knicks, blazers of old, or mavs. If fans get fed up with Holt's spending practices, there is always the opportunity to stop going to games and buying spurs merchandise, which would provide a financial incentive for him to put a better product on the floor... but we won't do that, so instead we complain about ownership because it's easier to bitch than to put ourselves in the other person's shoes or to stop supporting our team.

[ploto]

In Peter Holt, what we have is an owner who is willing to spend on those players his front office chooses to go after
You know it took quite an intervention from Pop to get Tony a contract extension for below his market value. You also know it is Holt who has dictated the salary dumping that has led to trades for financial and not basketball reasons.

[Kermit]

"You also know it is Holt who has dictated the salary dumping that has led to trades for financial and not basketball reasons."

such as...

[ajh18]

Exactly. Financial considerations ARE important to Holt, and that isn't unreasonable... but the front office said to give Tony his extension, and in the end, he got it. Whether it took a recommendation or "quite an intervention"...

[Bruno]

Holt isn't a cheap owner. Lest year, Sprus have paid the luxury tax and this year only three are curently over the tax (Spurs, Mavs and Knicks). If people wnat that ownership spend more money they should ask that the relocation of the team in a bigger city.
Loyal spurs fans shave been spoiled, the loyal Warriors fan deserve ten times more to have a ring than the loyal Spurs fan.
Duncan doesn't deserve more. 07' Duncan is far from being an MVP. Dirk or Nash deserve ten times more than Duncan to have a ring this season.

[wildbill2u]

It's been a fun ride. But as Spurs fans we need more. It's painful to see Tim Duncan at this point in his career forced to carry this supporting cast. He deserves more. Loyal Spurs fans deserve more.

So it's time to step aside for someone who will make the commitment to ensure that this team has the best possible shot at making the most of the rest of an NBA legend's career.

Adios.
The next big spender won't be from SA. Perhaps you don't recall that probably the richest man in SA --McCombs--never spent to get a championship. He wrote off the team and sold out to get into the real big boys game of the NFL along with Tom Benson.

Holt stepped in when the team might have gone elsewhere and publicly stated he bought it so San Antonio would keep the Spurs. It was a matter of civic pride, not a great business opportunity.

So who in SA is rich enough to put out the money to buy this team--and commit to keeping it here? Get out your Dun & Bradstreet boys and read 'em and weep.

It's not as though San Antonio has an endless supply of rich fools in line to not only take on a risky investment that can lose money every year, but to endure the criticism of fools that don't have two cents to rub together about how they should spend their money.

Keep bitchin' and moaning about Holt. The next fool in line will be from out of town and will move the team to a bigger market venue. Book it.

[Big Shot Rob]

Maybe Donald Trump could buy the Spurs (lol). The he can have more publicity going head to head with Mark Cuban!

[Marcus Bryant]

Money can't buy you everything people! Look at the Knicks. They got money to burn and they still suck! Imagine, the Knicks money and the Spurs front office combined?!

Problem is, Knicks haven't had a franchise player in forever. Knicks have gone through millions trying to make up for that.

[Marcus Bryant]

holt's not the problem. he's far from being the only tight-wad owner in the league. personnel decesions are what's hurting the team.


Personnel decisions limited by the pursestrings.

[ChumpDumper]

Who is this freespending new owner?

[ducks]

spurs are over the cap
pretty hard to buy more talent now

[Marcus Bryant]

These attacks on the ownership have always frustrated me, because it's like people expect the ownership group to treat the Spurs like they're a charity or something. The owners (or their families) made their money, invested it in a team, and continue to spend it every year in an effort to both make a profit, and compete for a championship. It probably isn't the most financially prudent way to invest that many milions of dollars, but clearly making money isn't the sole reason for owning an NBA team. Otherwise, you get owners like sterling, who for years let his promising talent walk so that he could turn the most profit he possibly could.

In Peter Holt, what we have is an owner who is willing to spend on those players his front office chooses to go after, with the front office understanding that the owner simply doesn't have as much money as the mark cubans of the world. He CAN'T spend like those people, and I don't believe that his desire to make some profit makes him cheap. Its his investment, and unlike for fans, winning isn't the only outcome. These are millions of his dollars we're talking about. Should he keep spending to the point where he is no longer making money off the team? Or until he actually loses money because the salaries are so high? I don't think it is very reasonable to ask that of ownership. Holt puts a financially responsibe team on the floor that is still consistently in a position to win a title, and I'm proud to support a team that has won without spending like the knicks, blazers of old, or mavs. If fans get fed up with Holt's spending practices, there is always the opportunity to stop going to games and buying spurs merchandise, which would provide a financial incentive for him to put a better product on the floor... but we won't do that, so instead we complain about ownership because it's easier to bitch than to put ourselves in the other person's shoes or to stop supporting our team.


We'll see what happens down the stretch when it becomes apparent the Spurs aren't a legit championship contender. By this point maybe Spurs fans have wisened up. Maybe that will spark a change.

[Marcus Bryant]

Holt isn't a cheap owner. Lest year, Sprus have paid the luxury tax and this year only three are curently over the tax (Spurs, Mavs and Knicks). If people wnat that ownership spend more money they should ask that the relocation of the team in a bigger city.
Loyal spurs fans shave been spoiled, the loyal Warriors fan deserve ten times more to have a ring than the loyal Spurs fan.
Duncan doesn't deserve more. 07' Duncan is far from being an MVP. Dirk or Nash deserve ten times more than Duncan to have a ring this season.


Wow. Spurs paid the lux tax last year. That negates the 5 seasons prior in which they did not. When you consider that the team controls all of the revenues from the facility they play in, it's appalling. The voters didn't grant that so they could do milk it. It was so the team would have every advantage, be it from a basketball friendly arena to no fiscal limitations every season.

The supporting cast could be significantly better if there was not this barrier to taking on deals with more than one more season left on them.

[ducks]

Jason Kidd would solve all of our problems.............and we ALL KNOW IT.

he makes more then duncan :rolleyes :rolleyes

[Marcus Bryant]

Jason Kidd would solve all of our problems.............and we ALL KNOW IT.

Oddly enough, Kidd's contract ends in '09 with a player option after '08. Doubtful he would exercise that, but if he could lock in a sizable extension, it would not be surprising. Hmmm...Peter gets rid of Parker's contract that ends at the end of the 3rd Clinton term. Wouldn't surprise me.

[my2sons]

It's been a fun ride. But as Spurs fans we need more. It's painful to see Tim Duncan at this point in his career forced to carry this supporting cast. He deserves more. Loyal Spurs fans deserve more.

So it's time to step aside for someone who will make the commitment to ensure that this team has the best possible shot at making the most of the rest of an NBA legend's career.

Adios.

why drob carried much less talent for a greater period of time and got blamed for all the franchise woes...timmy is carrying a veteran team to the playoff where it starts all over again and can carry them as far as he wants. what was painful to me was watching drob put all those w's in a season basically alone and not ever getting any help until pop and timmy took over the team. let timmy carry them for a while

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

It's not as though San Antonio has an endless supply of rich fools in line to not only take on a risky investment that can lose money every year, but to endure the criticism of fools that don't have two cents to rub together about how they should spend their money.

Keep bitchin' and moaning about Holt. The next fool in line will be from out of town and will move the team to a bigger market venue. Book it.

This is such a myth about SA folks having no money...

* Lowry Mays just sold Clear Channel for a couple of billion

* You've got USAA and Toyota in town

* The Butt family (HEB) has net worth over a billion

* Name escapes me but the former president and CEO of Dr. Pepper lives there

* Former president of Southwestern Bell does too

* Frost Bank is a part owner already

[Marcus Bryant]

why drob carried much less talent for a greater period of time and got blamed for all the franchise woes...timmy is carrying a veteran team to the playoff where it starts all over again and can carry them as far as he wants. what was painful to me was watching drob put all those w's in a season basically alone and not ever getting any help until pop and timmy took over the team. let timmy carry them for a while

It's small wonder Red and now Pete have seen little static in the Alamo City.

[phyzik]

man, I cant WAIT to see how this board reacts when Timmy retires and we are back to square one pre-admiral days....

[Marcus Bryant]

man, I cant WAIT to see how this board reacts when Timmy retires and we are back to square one pre-admiral days....

How about when he signs with another team in '08?

[wildbill2u]

We'll see what happens down the stretch when it becomes apparent the Spurs aren't a legit championship contender. By this point maybe Spurs fans have wisened up. Maybe that will spark a change.
When Spurs 'fans' wisen (sic) up" --Do you mean they will sudddenly realize the Spurs aren't a legit Championship contender every year by some inherent Devine right?

Do you really think that 'fans' caterwauling for a legitimate contender for a Championship every year will entice some new rich patron to come in and take over the team from Holt and run it to meet their demands?

So what will these 'wisened' fans do?...stop supporting the team by going to other big-time entertainment venues? Like what? Puff Daddy's Traveling Rap All-stars? You think that will "spark a change?"

I'll tell you what kind of change that will spark. The team will be sold and I doubt there are any rich fools in SA willing to cater to the whimsical desires of fans.

The Spurs came close to leaving before until Holt stepped in and bought all the problems of a basketball franchise in the smallest market in the league. We ought to be down on our knees praying that HE never 'wisens' up.

[Marcus Bryant]

He's been paid back for that and then some.

Anyways, perhaps when fans realize that this team doesn't have much of a chance to win #4 they'll opt not to show up or tune in.

[dknights411]

Geez Marcus, are you emo or something? Besides, it's gonna take a LOT for Duncan not to re-up with the Spurs (and by a lot, I do not mean this current stretch.)

IMHO, Peter Holt has already given San Antonio so much (the AT&T Center, 3 rings, ect...) that he deserves a lot better than this.

[ploto]

Wow. Spurs paid the lux tax last year. That negates the 5 seasons prior in which they did not. When you consider that the team controls all of the revenues from the facility they play in, it's appalling. The voters didn't grant that so they could do milk it. It was so the team would have every advantage, be it from a basketball friendly arena to no fiscal limitations every season.

The supporting cast could be significantly better if there was not this barrier to taking on deals with more than one more season left on them.
People have no idea how much money the Spurs are making- do they?

Despite playing in the league’s third-smallest market, the Spurs are worth $390 million, 11% higher than last year and $37 million above the league average. Thanks to the team's on-court success and the first-rate AT&T Center, the Spurs turned an operating profit (in the sense of earnings before interest, taxes and depreciation) of $11.7 million, compared with $6.9 million for the average NBA franchise.
LINK (http://www.forbes.com/business/2007/01/25/NBA-team-valuations-biz_cz_kmozcs_06nba_0125nbaintro.html)

[Trainwreck2100]

Why, did the spurs all of a sudden stop making a profit?

[Bruno]

http://www.forbes.com/lists/2006/32/biz_06nba_NBA-Team-Valuations_Income.html

Spurs profit is the 15th in the league. A 3% profit is far from being cheap.

[Mr. Body]

What I like is how the front office makes cost-cutting moves like dumping Malik, not resigning Nazr Mohammed, and dumping Rasho's contract, and then we don't get to see any of that as basketball fans.

[Extra Stout]

People are acting as though Peter Holt is sacrificing himself financially for the Spurs. The value of the Spurs has increased over 400% since he bought the team. He has made gobs of cash.

This increase in value came about because the Spurs got a new facility built, from which they retain the lion's share of the revenues. Peter Holt did not pay for that. Sure, Peter Holt worked hard to get the franchise where it is. And in return, his net worth has swelled by a couple hundred million dollars, largely at taxpayer expense.

But now, after all of that, the team is pinching pennies, and it is directly affecting the product on the floor. And Holt can get away with it, because despite playing in a state-of-the-art facility with a sweetheart deal that any owner would be stupid to walk away from, the inferiority complex among the backwater rubes of San Antonio is so deeply imbedded that they actually fear the Spurs will move if anybody says anything bad about Peter Holt.

There is only one Tim Duncan. One his days are done, the Spurs probably are going to suck for a long time. These last few years of his prime are extremely precious. But, maybe Holt figures that in addition to being backwater rubes, San Antonians might also be front-runners, and that revenues will plummet once Duncan is gone, so he better get out while the getting is good.

Maybe that explains why the team seems to be maneuvering its finances for a sale, rather than putting the best possible team out on the floor for the few remaining years they will still be among the elite. So the remaining years of one of the 10 best players in league history are being squandered. Maybe his roots are so deep now that he doesn't leave no matter what they do. Or maybe he is still all about winning, and sees the handwriting on the wall.

I don't buy this idea that they have to start planning now for the post-Duncan era, and maintaining flexibility for that. It is simple -- they are going to suck for a while. They will not be back among the elite until they get lucky and draft another superstar to build around.

[Kermit]

i sure wish that superstar would be kevin durant. maybe he'll stay in school for a couple more years.

[Marcus Bryant]

What I like is how the front office makes cost-cutting moves like dumping Malik, not resigning Nazr Mohammed, and dumping Rasho's contract, and then we don't get to see any of that as basketball fans.

Right. From a basketball perspective those weren't the great moves many in this forum made them out to be when they went down. Think the Spurs couldn't have benefitted from having a couple of young prospects learning the system over the last couple of years? Plus instead of having a NBA player like a Mohammed or a Rose you have no one.

Also, the assumption from the rose-colored glasses crowd in here is that the Spurs will use the flexibility from the expiring contracts of supporting cast players to replenish that cast. When they don't, there'll be new excuses. Or maybe more of the 'they won 3 titles and you expect more?' claptrap.

GO SPURS GO!

[Marcus Bryant]

People are acting as though Peter Holt is sacrificing himself financially for the Spurs. The value of the Spurs has increased over 400% since he bought the team. He has made gobs of cash.

This increase in value came about because the Spurs got a new facility built, from which they retain the lion's share of the revenues. Peter Holt did not pay for that. Sure, Peter Holt worked hard to get the franchise where it is. And in return, his net worth has swelled by a couple hundred million dollars, largely at taxpayer expense.

But now, after all of that, the team is pinching pennies, and it is directly affecting the product on the floor. And Holt can get away with it, because despite playing in a state-of-the-art facility with a sweetheart deal that any owner would be stupid to walk away from, the inferiority complex among the backwater rubes of San Antonio is so deeply imbedded that they actually fear the Spurs will move if anybody says anything bad about Peter Holt.

There is only one Tim Duncan. One his days are done, the Spurs probably are going to suck for a long time. These last few years of his prime are extremely precious. But, maybe Holt figures that in addition to being backwater rubes, San Antonians might also be front-runners, and that revenues will plummet once Duncan is gone, so he better get out while the getting is good.

Maybe that explains why the team seems to be maneuvering its finances for a sale, rather than putting the best possible team out on the floor for the few remaining years they will still be among the elite. So the remaining years of one of the 10 best players in league history are being squandered. Maybe his roots are so deep now that he doesn't leave no matter what they do. Or maybe he is still all about winning, and sees the handwriting on the wall.

I don't buy this idea that they have to start planning now for the post-Duncan era, and maintaining flexibility for that. It is simple -- they are going to suck for a while. They will not be back among the elite until they get lucky and draft another superstar to build around.


The epitaph.

[ChumpDumper]

So who are you going to elect as the new owner?

[Marcus Bryant]

Maybe you.

[ChumpDumper]

I was going to apply for a job with the new D-League team in the valley, but I will accept the nomination if drafted.