'The Decider' Could Spark Constitutional Crisis

[Nbadan]

Bush: "I'm the decision-maker" on Iraq


WASHINGTON (AP) -- President Bush, on a collision course with Congress over Iraq, said Friday "I'm the decision-maker" about sending more troops to the war. He challenged skeptical lawmakers not to prematurely condemn his plan.

"I've picked the plan that I think is most likely to succeed," Bush said in an Oval Office meeting with senior military advisers.

The president had strong words for lawmakers on both sides of the aisle who are lining up to support resolutions opposing his decision to send 21,500 troops to Iraq. He challenged them to put up their own ideas. "Some are condemning a plan before it's even had a chance to work," he said.


CNN (http://www.cnn.com/POLITICS/blogs/politicalticker/)

Let's give more war a chance people, your not trying.

:hat

[Nbadan]

More on the Blackwater security helicopter that was shot down....

Inside Baghdad: A city paralysed by fear
By Patrick Cockburn
Published: 25 January 2007


Baghdad is paralysed by fear. Iraqi drivers are terrified of running into impromptu checkpoints where heavily armed men in civilian clothes may drag them out of their cars and kill them for being the wrong religion. Some districts exchange mortar fire every night. This is mayhem beyond the comprehension of George Bush and Tony Blair.

Black smoke was rising over the city centre yesterday as American and Iraqi army troops tried to fight their way into the insurgent district of Haifa Street only a mile north of the Green Zone, home to the government and the US and British embassies. Helicopters flew fast and low past tower blocks, hunting snipers, and armoured vehicles manoeuvred in the streets below.

Many Iraqis who watched the State of the Union address shrugged it off as an irrelevance. "An extra 16,000 US soldiers are not going to be enough to restore order to Baghdad," said Ismail, a Sunni who fled his house in the west of the city, fearing he would be arrested and tortured by the much-feared Shia police commandos.

It is extraordinary that, almost four years after US forces captured Baghdad, they control so little of it. The outlook for Mr Bush's strategy of driving out insurgents from strongholds and preventing them coming back does not look good.

...

On Monday, a helicopter belonging to the US security company Blackwater was shot down as it flew over the Sunni neighbourhood of al-Fadhil, close to the central markets of Baghdad. Several of the five American crew members may have survived the crash but they were later found with gunshot wounds to their heads, as if they had been executed on the ground.

Independent (http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article2183852.ece)

[ChumpDumper]

Eh, are there any posts about a constitutional crisis forthcoming?

[Nbadan]

Eh, are there any posts about a constitutional crisis forthcoming?

You know we are always a few days ahead of the news in this forum, wait for beatch!

:lol

[ChumpDumper]

Yeah, but you're apparently a few days ahead of yourself here.

[clambake]

Maybe he's referring to the composition of Iraq as a whole. Leave off the "al".

[Nbadan]

Yeah, but you're apparently a few days ahead of yourself here.

So you still have doubts that 'the surge' is gonna lead to a legislative battle between the WH and Congress?

I'll give ya 10-1.

[ChumpDumper]

The Democrats don't feel that strongly about it at this point. Most folks are waiting to see what happens. If it fails and Bushy wants to surge more, there could be trouble. Not until then.

[Nbadan]

I don't know. Some of the 08 hopefuls are drawing lines in the sand now.

My guess is their thinking is: Why wait for the inevitable?

[ChumpDumper]

Because they don't want to be on the wrong side if it works.

[01Snake]

Because they don't want to be on the wrong side if it works.

DING DING DING DING

[ChumpDumper]

I don't know why anyone thought Democrats would grow spines just because they won congress by default.

[Nbadan]

Because they don't want to be on the wrong side if it works.

OK, but there's a deeper issue that could be working to force some hands. If this administration is gonna start fighting Iranians, as it seems they are, then acting now would be the only way to cut the legs from under that plan. They certainly aren't gonna cut funding while the troops are already fighting.

[Yonivore]

Because they don't want to be on the wrong side if it works.
I think that's the most intelligent thing you've ever posted Chumpy.

[Nbadan]

not really, Chump knows it wont' work.

[Yonivore]

Back to the title of the thread, where's the "constitutional crisis?"

[ChumpDumper]

If there is enough evidence of US fighting Iranians in Iran, then the Democrats wouldn't and shouldn't have any problem doing something substantial, and there could be your crisis, but this stuff in Iraq hasn't raised to the level yet.

[ChumpDumper]

not really, Chump knows it wont' work.I don't think it will work, but I can't hope against it.

[Yonivore]

not really, Chump knows it wont' work.
It's already working -- and has been for a couple of weeks. That's why there's such a rush to condemn and get it shut down by Democrats -- they can't afford for it to work.

Read some Milblogs and Spookblogs -- Those guys know what's happening in Iraq.

[Nbadan]

Back to the title of the thread, where's the "constitutional crisis?"

Hey numbnuts, even governer Pitaki came out against Dubya's surge. That's how many presidential hopefuls and their alliances?

[Bandit2981]

The president had strong words for lawmakers on both sides of the aisle who are lining up to support resolutions opposing his decision to send 21,500 troops to Iraq. He challenged them to put up their own ideas.
What a dumbfuck. John Murtha has a plan, Joe Biden has a plan, Hillary Clinton has a plan, the bi-partisan Iraq Study Group has a plan... :rolleyes

[1369]

What a dumbfuck. John Murtha has a plan, Joe Biden has a plan, Hillary Clinton has a plan, the bi-partisan Iraq Study Group has a plan... :rolleyes

Who are half a planet away from where the fighting is.

How about we go with the plan that the folks who are going to execute it have come up with instead of the misguided musings of a bunch of self serving politicians?

[01Snake]

Who are half a planet away from where the fighting is.

How about we go with the plan that the folks who are going to execute it have come up with instead of the misguided musings of a bunch of self serving politicians?

:lol


Well, I have a plan too. Hell, I think everyone has a plan don't they? I'll stick to plans formulated by those actually in the theater and not a bunch of idiots jockeying for political positions.

[Bandit2981]

Who are half a planet away from where the fighting is.

How about we go with the plan that the folks who are going to execute it have come up with instead of the misguided musings of a bunch of self serving politicians?
Because Bush is "The Decider", not the generals who've seen combat before.

[1369]

"I've picked the plan that I think is most likely to succeed," Bush said in an Oval Office meeting with senior military advisers.

RIF Bandit.

[01Snake]

Because Bush is "The Decider", not the generals who've seen combat before.

Do you think Bush just pulls these plans out of his ass with no military input?

[Bandit2981]

All Bush does is listen to the generals that will tell him what he wants...If they offer a different strategy than what he is looking for, they get replaced.

[01Snake]

All Bush does is listen to the generals that will tell him what he wants...If they offer a different strategy than what he is looking for, they get replaced.

Wow! Do you have the meeting minutes for these meetings? Where exactly do you sit in these meetings since you sure seem to know how they unfold.

[clambake]

No, Shinsieki has the meeting minutes. Well............he has to do something.

If you hadn't noticed, Bush dumped Rummy, too. With every person he fires, they leave with the blame. Bush wears teflon in his own mind.

[Yonivore]

Hey numbnuts, even governer Pitaki came out against Dubya's surge. That's how many presidential hopefuls and their alliances?
That doesn't make it a constitutional crisis. It's called a disagreement.

[Yonivore]

What a dumbfuck. John Murtha has a plan, Joe Biden has a plan, Hillary Clinton has a plan, the bi-partisan Iraq Study Group has a plan... :rolleyes
And, they've all been shot down because they suck.

[Yonivore]

Because Bush is "The Decider", not the generals who've seen combat before.
You're right, his policy is being informed by those who are seeing combat right now...not has beens.

[ChumpDumper]

Wow! Do you have the meeting minutes for these meetings? Where exactly do you sit in these meetings since you sure seem to know how they unfold.Nah, the views of those generals are pretty well known. The president can appoint whatever general he wants, he's just being disingenuous when he says he's listening to the generals on the ground because the generals who were previously in charge didn't want any more troops.

[exstatic]

Do you think Bush just pulls these plans out of his ass with no military input?
Yes. He doesn't listen to anyone else, why would he listen to the generals? You have to understand that Generals are political creatures. Their appointments and promotions are put before Congress. They WILL go with the prevailing wind, which blows from the Whitehouse.

At this point, he's just trying to pass off his failure on the next president, throwing away lives to buy time and try to save himself embarrassment.

[01Snake]

At this point, he's just trying to pass off his failure on the next president, throwing away lives to buy time and try to save himself embarrassment.

Wow! Thanks Boutons.

[gtownspur]

Yes. He doesn't listen to anyone else, why would he listen to the generals? You have to understand that Generals are political creatures. Their appointments and promotions are put before Congress. They WILL go with the prevailing wind, which blows from the Whitehouse.

At this point, he's just trying to pass off his failure on the next president, throwing away lives to buy time and try to save himself embarrassment.


Daily kos is lacking earth shattering insight like this.

WHy not contribute there?

[spurster]

The Democrats are just making a lot of talk at this point, straw men to see what the polls will support. You can see the opposite with the savior DOD secretary saying that even this talk "emboldens the enemy". It will take some guts to cut off funding, which I don't think the Democrats have.

[exstatic]

The Democrats are just making a lot of talk at this point, straw men to see what the polls will support. You can see the opposite with the savior DOD secretary saying that even this talk "emboldens the enemy". It will take some guts to cut off funding, which I don't think the Democrats have.
They'll chop the funds eventually, they just have to let Bush fall flat on his surge face, first.

This whole surge idea is a farce. We are "surging" back up to a force level we had before...that didn't work, then.

[Nbadan]

I agree. They'll eventually have to cut the funds, but I believe that Democratic Party nomination candidates, like Hillary, who voted for the Iraq war resolution in 03, won't win the endorsement of less trusting, but highly-motivated Progressives who drive the major funding mechanisms in the party, unless they back a resolution to cut the Iraq war funding and bring the boys home immediately.

[Nbadan]

For those of you who doubted this could happen...

Feingold Calls War Bluff
By: Roger Simon
January 29, 2007 05:21 PM EST


Senate Democrats oppose the war in Iraq, they just don't plan on stopping it.

They have discovered that standing up to the president is not quite as easy as vilifying him.

Sen. Russ Feingold, D-Wis., has decided, however, to challenge what he calls the "timidity" of Democratic leaders. He is going to introduce legislation cutting off funding for the Iraq war and he may do it, he told me, as early as this week.

I reached him by telephone Monday in Fond du Lac, Wis., where he was conducting one of his "Listening Sessions" with voters during a snowstorm.

I asked him whether Democratic voters were further to the left than their elected leaders, especially their presidential candidates, when it came to the war.

"That is not only true of Democrats," Feingold said, "it is true of the public as a whole. The mainstream view of the American people is to get out of Iraq.".............

Cutting off funds only for the planned 21,500 troop surge in Iraq and passing resolutions condemning the war has become the fallback position of Senate Democrats who are fearful of being portrayed as unpatriotic, cowardly, "Mommy Party" haters of the military.

Politico (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0107/2506.html)

We'll see how the announced Democratic Party nominees respond. Will Hillary try and kill it?