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Kori Ellis
01-28-2007, 02:36 AM
Buck Harvey: Spurs' hope: Bad Pop turning good

Web Posted: 01/27/2007 09:27 PM CST

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/basketball/nba/spurs/stories/MYSA012807.01C.COL.BKNharvey.spurs.17c0c70.html

San Antonio Express-News

At times on the sidelines he's looked resigned. Other times, vindictive.
He peeled off the last layers of Beno Udrih's confidence, then confused Tony Parker with a don't-shoot-as-much equation. He's stuck with Michael Finley when Brent Barry had more going, and he's found new ways to downgrade the Spurs' defense.

Is this the worst Spurs' defense in six to eight years? Or since Walter Berry was a Spur?

He's said a few things he never said before, such as announcing the Spurs won't make a trade. And now he closes the cabin door behind him for takeoff, sealing off the Spurs for their rodeo road trip, continuing the role he has made for himself.

He's played the bad Pop, and, if the Spurs are to have any chance this spring, he has to be the good.

He works the good-bad roles, albeit with an asterisk; Popovich's emotions are often real instead of calculated. At times this season, when the Spurs have looked like the worst third-best team in league history, his reactions have been heartfelt.

But he knows the power of his personality, and he doesn't mind going to an extreme. Years ago, when he was the general manager, he came up with a strategy to out-crazy a crazy named Dennis Rodman.

It was an act, but it put Rodman on his heels. There have been similar moments in recent years, when he would exit his locker room after a considerable scolding, then ask a staffer, with a smile, if he had been convincing.

Avery Johnson controls his franchise with similar force (wonder where he got it?), but good players usually lead good teams. Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson — they dominated the ball and those around them.

But Tim Duncan is more of a nurturing leader. Manu Ginobili has hold of his Argentina national team, but he prefers to blend here. And while Michael Finley displays dignity and occasional direction, he's not a star anymore.

So it's up to Popovich, as it has been since Avery Johnson and Mario Elie left town, to fix what is wrong. In doing so, Popovich, who has never minded sacrificing a few games to make a point, has added to the disorder.

It's no secret he can be temperamental, and he will wear on players at times. There's been griping in his locker room this season, albeit not the kind of howl that destroys a team, and he's added to a climate that has led to losses.

That climate was there last week, for example, when the Rockets beat the Spurs without Yao Ming. The Spurs had little energy and less fun; if this were Minnesota, Kevin McHale would have come out of the stands to fire his coach.

But that's the strength in this good-Pop, bad-Pop world. He's his own boss. He can create doubt, shuffle his lineups, breed some unhappiness — then clean up the mess with a new tone and plan.

He's done it in the past, and he seems to have started the good-Pop transition last week with his declaration that the Spurs will play with what they have. No one rules out the possibility of a deal a month before the trade deadline — especially a franchise that has been looking for a more athletic swingman — so here's the guess:

Popovich figured the fractured state of his team couldn't handle a few more weeks of unrest. He built this team for his style of coaching as much as he did for Duncan, going heavy on shooters with experience, so it was time to send a message to everyone they were in this together and should relax.

His best manipulation and coaching likely won't be enough. He doesn't have the talent that is in Dallas or Phoenix, and this rodeo road trip is more rugged than any the Spurs have faced in the past. No one would be shocked if the Spurs return from this trip in sixth place in the West.

But Popovich has Duncan. He has Ginobili and a core that has won championships. And he has his peculiar way of forging a team through an up-and-down process of stress.

Beginning today, in Los Angeles, good Pop tries to emerge.

CubanMustGo
01-28-2007, 02:39 AM
Hopefully good Pop rotations will also emerge.

MannyIsGod
01-28-2007, 02:42 AM
No shit. His rotations have been downright horrible this year. This has been Pops worst year of coaching by far, IMO.

1Parker1
01-28-2007, 10:08 AM
Nice article. Harvey pretty much hit the nail on almost everything.

And he's right, that with this current team, even Pop's best manipulation and coaching skills won't get them past the Suns and Mavs. :tu

ploto
01-28-2007, 10:40 AM
There's been griping in his locker room this season...

That's rather revealing....

ploto
01-28-2007, 10:42 AM
No shit. His rotations have been downright horrible this year. This has been Pops worst year of coaching by far, IMO.
Did you ever stop to think that maybe Pop isn't so thrilled himself with how this team was put together and some of the personnel decisions that were made. He KNEW what the team needed and we all know that it didn't really face those needs.

boutons_
01-28-2007, 11:11 AM
I'm both Brent and Michael, and everybody else, understands why Michael is getting so many more minutes while Brent is shooting much better.

But there has to be a point where Michael's window to start scoring, as a pure scorer, has got to close.

TDMVPDPOY
01-28-2007, 12:02 PM
finally popabitch is taken his can of whoop-ass medication? :(

Budkin
01-28-2007, 12:41 PM
Agreed that this has been Pop's worst year of coaching. Way too much experimenting going on, awful rotations, etc. Maybe if he gets his shit together the team will follow. How about it Pop?

Marcus Bryant
01-28-2007, 12:49 PM
Props to Pop. He's trying every trick he knows to get a team with this supporting cast to win in today's NBA.

MannyIsGod
01-28-2007, 12:57 PM
Did you ever stop to think that maybe Pop isn't so thrilled himself with how this team was put together and some of the personnel decisions that were made. He KNEW what the team needed and we all know that it didn't really face those needs.

Um, there has been more vocal talk about trades this year than any year before, Pop talked about needing a Derrick McKey type player in the off-season and didn't get it, and the teams all around play are all indications that Pop isn't happy with the way this team was put together.

I don't understand what your point was, but it wasn't as though the Spurs had many options in the offseason in filling their needs. They didn't have draft picks that were going to do it for them, they didn't have a roster full of tradeable assets, so how exactly where they going to address their needs?

itzsoweezee
01-28-2007, 01:39 PM
Hopefully good Pop rotations will also emerge.

cosign. and hopefully, no more small ball.

Aggie Hoopsfan
01-28-2007, 01:48 PM
But Tim Duncan is more of a nurturing leader. Manu Ginobili has hold of his Argentina national team, but he prefers to blend here. And while Michael Finley displays dignity and occasional direction, he's not a star anymore.

So it's up to Popovich, as it has been since Avery Johnson and Mario Elie left town, to fix what is wrong. In doing so, Popovich, who has never minded sacrificing a few games to make a point, has added to the disorder.


Pretty fucking pathetic. The only reason Manu won't step up as leader is because Pop has made it clear this is Duncan's team. They need to let Manu do what he does best - lead.



His best manipulation and coaching likely won't be enough. He doesn't have the talent that is in Dallas or Phoenix

That's nice, the excuses have already started but hey, feel free to not criticize Pop for putting together a team like that.

1Parker1
01-28-2007, 01:53 PM
That's nice, the excuses have already started but hey, feel free to not criticize Pop for putting together a team like that.

:wtf Do you even know how to read, or is criticism always your natural response to everything? If you'd learn to read, I did agree with the article and other posters that basically said Pop is not coaching very well this season so far. We do need a trade to get more athetic enough to beat teams like the Mavs, Suns, and even the Lakers and no amount of coaching geniusness may save the team. Unless Ginobili miraculously goes to 2005 Manu for 4 series.

MannyIsGod
01-28-2007, 02:06 PM
FWIW, there is reason to believe that this years Manu can surpass what Manu did in 05, even in the playoffs.

Marcus Bryant
01-28-2007, 02:07 PM
That's nice, the excuses have already started but hey, feel free to not criticize Pop for putting together a team like that.

How about that he was not free to do?

ploto
01-28-2007, 02:09 PM
Pop talked about needing a Derrick McKey type player in the off-season and didn't get it, and the teams all around play are all indications that Pop isn't happy with the way this team was put together.

What I meant is Pop is having to struggle through figuring out rotations because of the make-up of the team. Pop likes certain roles and plugging players into those roles, but some of those roles have no one to fill them. And people like to blame Pop for that but Pop definitely does not get from "above" everything he wants.


How about that he was not free to do?
Just what I meant: Pop is not responsible for all the decisons the Spurs have made recently where personnel is considered.

MannyIsGod
01-28-2007, 02:10 PM
Figuring things out is one thing. Consistently starting fourth quarters with horrible lineups time and time again is quite another.

Aggie Hoopsfan
01-28-2007, 02:12 PM
:wtf Do you even know how to read, or is criticism always your natural response to everything? If you'd learn to read, I did agree with the article and other posters that basically said Pop is not coaching very well this season so far. We do need a trade to get more athetic enough to beat teams like the Mavs, Suns, and even the Lakers and no amount of coaching geniusness may save the team. Unless Ginobili miraculously goes to 2005 Manu for 4 series.

Can you read? The article is making excuses for Pop. And the only mention of how this team was built is this:


He built this team for his style of coaching as much as he did for Duncan, going heavy on shooters with experience, so it was time to send a message to everyone they were in this together and should relax.

No critical shot at him for putting together a bunch of senior citizens around Duncan, just 'ho hum, he built the team this way and everyone needs to relax'.

The last time he built this team this way (bunch of old fuckers around Duncan), LA smoked us out of the playoffs. You can continue to toe the company line, maybe when we we get swept out of the playoffs by the Mavs you'll get a clue.

Aggie Hoopsfan
01-28-2007, 02:14 PM
What I meant is Pop is having to struggle through figuring out rotations because of the make-up of the team.

In years past Pop already had the formula figured out - always keep two of the three of Manu, Tim, and Tony on the court at all times.

So why is he being a retard about starting the fourth with Manu and a bunch of spare parts? If he can't 'figure out' something he's had figured out for the last three seasons, what does that say about the quality (or more accurately, lack thereof) of his coaching decisions?

ploto
01-28-2007, 02:23 PM
Figuring things out is one thing. Consistently starting fourth quarters with horrible lineups time and time again is quite another.


In years past Pop already had the formula figured out - always keep two of the three of Manu, Tim, and Tony on the court at all times.

So why is he being a retard about starting the fourth with Manu and a bunch of spare parts? If he can't 'figure out' something he's had figured out for the last three seasons, what does that say about the quality (or more accurately, lack thereof) of his coaching decisions?

The Spurs played Houston this week. Last year in March they played Houston at home and started the 4th quarter with Manu, Beno, Finley, Horry, and Nazr. Is that really all that different?

Same with the Lakers- Spurs play them today. Last March to start the 4th quarter: Manu, NVE, Barry, Finley and Rasho.

Pop has been resting Tony and Tim to start the fourth for some time- playing Manu with the bench guys.

More examples:
Last regular season home game last year: Utah- start fourth quarter:
Manu, Beno, Barry, Horry, and Rasho.

At Minnesota the game before:
Manu, NVE, Finley, Oberto, and Rasho

ploto
01-28-2007, 02:42 PM
Where did everybody go?? Sorry to confuse you with facts.

ShoogarBear
01-28-2007, 03:15 PM
Where did everybody go?? Sorry to confuse you with facts.http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1413572&postcount=17

Aggie Hoopsfan
01-28-2007, 03:16 PM
The Spurs played Houston this week. Last year in March they played Houston at home and started the 4th quarter with Manu, Beno, Finley, Horry, and Nazr. Is that really all that different?

Same with the Lakers- Spurs play them today. Last March to start the 4th quarter: Manu, NVE, Barry, Finley and Rasho.

If you really think a lineup like we're rolling out this year that has Robert Horry at center and six foot fucking four Michael Finley at PF is any way comparable to having one of Nazr/Rasho and also Horry on the court, why are we even talking?

Do you know the difference between small ball and having a legitimate seven footer to guard the paint?

Where did we go? We've got a game in 15 minutes, some of us have friends coming over to watch. Don't flatter yourself.

MannyIsGod
01-28-2007, 03:34 PM
You pull 3 games out of your ass as a way to point out that Pop wasn't going too long in the fourth with horrible lineups? Ok Ploto, great job presenting a good case there. Nevermind that the lineups you posted don't prove a damn thing and nevermind that it doesn't say how long he went with those lineups and never mind that its only 3 games out of over 40. Nice.

Aggie Hoopsfan
01-28-2007, 03:47 PM
You pull 3 games out of your ass as a way to point out that Pop wasn't going too long in the fourth with horrible lineups? Ok Ploto, great job presenting a good case there. Nevermind that the lineups you posted don't prove a damn thing and nevermind that it doesn't say how long he went with those lineups and never mind that its only 3 games out of over 40. Nice.

Not to mention ploto is trying to hold up lineups with a genuine seven footer that could defend the paint and block shots to try and defend us playing small ball and getting smoked this year starting the fourth with a 6'8" center and a 6'4" PF.

Amuseddaysleeper
01-28-2007, 04:08 PM
FWIW, there is reason to believe that this years Manu can surpass what Manu did in 05, even in the playoffs.

Yeah but without a bench, even if manu surpasses 05 manu it won't be enough to get past the mavs or suns.


Look at how well Duncan played against the Mavs last year in the playoffs. Arguably the best series of his life...........and we still lost.


We definitely need our big 3 to be play well in the playoffs, but to get to the promised land our bench is what will make or break us.