It was nice while it lasted

[Jimcs50]

In the last few weeks, I have come to the realization that this Spurs team is not a contender any longer. I am resigned to the fact that the Spurs' championship years are officially over. In the Tim Duncan era, the Spurs never lost to the Rockets at home, the Spurs had a huge winning streak against the Jazz and always found ways to win in the end of close games, but for the most part they just punished the Jazz, and the Spurs never lost a season series to the Mavericks or the Cavaliers. Our team can now only beat the likes of the Charlottes (oops), the Bostons and the New Jerseys of the league, and throw in a few wins over the Wizzards, and Magic and other Eastern playoff teams.

Now in just a few short weeks, all that has changed. The Spurs are nothing more than a shadow of their former selves. The will is still there, but they just do not have the talent to beat the top teams any more. I still love them, and I will still follow them, but my expectations are trivial.

:depressed

I can now just look back with nostalgia and try to remember the good times, the times when the Spurs were the team everyone on TNT touted as the team to beat, the organization that every team should try to emulate, and the team that played deep into the playoffs.

Alas, now I can only look forward to an occasional win over an overconfident legitimate contender, a win only possible because the Spurs snuck up on them at the right time and upset them. I will smile to myself knowingly, for this will cause their fans on their boards to curse their coaching staff for allowing their team to lose to a team like our beloved, but mediocre NBA team.

[Kori Ellis]

Mediocre = .500 not 3rd best record in the league.

But point taken, I guess. *shrug*

[SAtown]

Will you change your mind if they win tonight?

[mardigan]

Wait till we get knocked out of the playoffs until you get nostalgic

[Leetonidas]

No, you're wrong. The talent is there, but the will is not...right now.

[objective]

3rd best record in the league . . . for now.

Since Christmas they are 11-8

[timvp]

It's about time you broke out your jinxing capabilities for good use.

:smokin

[Bruno]

It's clear that Suns and Mavs are better right now than Spurs and it seems higly unlikely that Spurs beat them in a 7 game serie.
However, I still think that Spurs' are talented enough to win it all. I will wait to see how they are in march/april before saying that they won't win this year.

[WalterBenitez]

No, you're wrong. The talent is there, but the will is not...right now.

I think it is question of kicking a couple of as***s to realign the will

[johnpaulwall21]

its hard to tell in this league who will win it all. 3 years ago the no name pistons beat a unbeatable allstar laker squad. the next year the suns had the hype to win a championship but lost to us in 5. The next year Detroit was on a tear and they slaughtered us both matches but they fell apart in the playoffs. Miami won the championship and beat a good dallas team, and miami wasnt even in the same league as spurs or dallas but they came out on top. Anything can happen...............

[BigVee]

With all due respect to a poster with 28K+ posts, I think your analysis is flawed. While you may be right about where the Spurs now find themselves in the hierarchy of the league, I believe it has more to do with the rise of the teams you mentioned as opposed the decline of the Spurs. Pho has never been better, the Mavs have assembled more talent than ever, Utah has its best team in years, the Rockets have TMac and a 7'6"er unlike anyone the league has ever seen. Let's see if the Spurs can adjust to this improved level of competition before we bury them.

[Pugglekicker_21]

its age. after the road trip things will balance out

[twincam]

its hard to tell in this league who will win it all. 3 years ago the no name pistons beat a unbeatable allstar laker squad. the next year the suns had the hype to win a championship but lost to us in 5. The next year Detroit was on a tear and they slaughtered us both matches but they fell apart in the playoffs. Miami won the championship and beat a good dallas team, and miami wasnt even in the same league as spurs or dallas but they came out on top. Anything can happen...............

Very well said. I agree with you 100%. It seems to me that once they are in their struggle, people simply 'give up'. And once they get their swagger back, everyone is quick to jump the bandwagon, which is something I certainly HATE. But it happens all of the time. I too criticize the Spurs on disappointing losses, it's a natural reaction, because I care when they lose. BUT, I DON'T GIVE UP on them and say that their championship contending days are over. It's not over, period.
On a side note: From the way the Spurs are playing (CURRENTLY), I don't see them pulling it out against Phoenix tonight. Until they show me that they've regained their swagger, then I can atest that they'll prevail against their opponents. This is a reality and not being BIASED. Too many people here are simply too biased. They don't see or refuse to see the reality. You hit the nail right on the head with what you mentioned. The Spurs will lose some games, and win most. But, this is an up and down season, like every season. They will bounce back...plain and simple. The playoff season is what counts. I feel they will be a favorite to win, because they are still healthy. People need to be patient and let it be. The Spurs are missing just one ingredient: P-O-I-S-E. I've been dictating this word way too many times, and will continue to do so until they get back to where they belong...TRUE LEGITIMENT CONTENDERS.

[GrandeDavid]

At least Duncan and the Spurs still own the Celtics. Don't puss out folks, the playoffs are a long ways off. The Spurs will be ready by April, they only have upside.

[Jimcs50]

Mediocre = .500 not 3rd best record in the league.

But point taken, I guess. *shrug*

Kori, it is mediocre to me if you can not win it all....not that they are not capable of being the 3rd best team, but if you are one and done in the playoffs, then that is mediocre, IMO.

No offense intended.....just waxing philosophical.

[ducks]

one bandwagoner jumping off the wagon
do not let the door hit you on the way out!

[Jimcs50]

With all due respect to a poster with 28K+ posts, I think your analysis is flawed. While you may be right about where the Spurs now find themselves in the hierarchy of the league, I believe it has more to do with the rise of the teams you mentioned as opposed the decline of the Spurs. Pho has never been better, the Mavs have assembled more talent than ever, Utah has its best team in years, the Rockets have TMac and a 7'6"er unlike anyone the league has ever seen. Let's see if the Spurs can adjust to this improved level of competition before we bury them.


How can it be that Dallas, Phoenix, Utah, Houston and Cleveland all got so much better in just one year? It is more likely that the Spurs have slipped and will continue to do so, given their ages.


My intention is not to argue here, I just had to turn a page on a new Spurs chapter and lower my expectations.

:)

[Don Quixote]

Well let's not jump off the wagon so soon, guys. Still alot of ball to be played and our time as a powerhouse isn't yet over.

However, this is clearly the weakest Spurs team since ... 01?

It's not a question, with the Spurs anyway, of how hard they play. They played their hearts out last night, the night before, and just about all the time. They lost to Utah because Utah made the plays at the end and are, generally speaking, younger, bigger, faster, and more talented. As are the Mavs and the Suns.

So ... is this team championship caliber? No, I don't think so. But it's nothing a couple of offseason moves and good draft picks won't fix. We still have Tim, Manu, Tony, after all.

[ALVAREZ6]

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/166/slcc1090201001024x768ag3.jpg

[boutons_]

"3rd best record in the league."

In Jan, they played at a 46-36 rate. 0.560 ball, which would put them a 7th WC seed today, and starting with Suns or Mavs in first round.

Ca c'est tres mediocre, Mme Ellis.

I disagree about the talent. The talent is there, but the will/desire to play defense and RB is not. The Spurs have a serious psychological problem, not a talent problem, and not something a trade in the next couple weeks is gonna fix.

It's Tim's team, fixed/winning or broken/losing, and it's his team to fix.

We've seen Francisco and Fabricio play MUCH better. Tim has to tell them, confront them, that the defense and RB and no excessive fouling (and the season) is riding on their shoulders no less than it is on the Big 3s' shoulders. Both those guys have to pick it up.

[Kori Ellis]

It doesn't just matter what rate they played in January. The games in the other months count too. :lol

[Budkin]

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/166/slcc1090201001024x768ag3.jpg

Man this picture just about sums up the season so far...

[Kori Ellis]

Man this picture just about sums up the season so far...

Yeah there's a similar one of Tony from yesterday too. I felt sorry for both of them.

[lefty]

Quitters

[boutons_]

RIF

Jim said "In the last few weeks,..."

One can write off Nov/Dec annually as "Tim always starts slow..", "new guys", etc,etc. But consistently bad play in Jan with a .0.560 record isn't really Spurs in the last 4 years.

If I heard correctly, some TV guy said the Spurs are 25-6 on the RRT in the previous 4 years. That would be 6-2 on this RRT. If they finish 4-4, Jim would be more right than you.

[Kori Ellis]

RIF

Jim said "In the last few weeks,..."

One can write off Nov/Dec annually as "Tim always starts slow..", "new guys", etc,etc. But consistently bad play in Jan with a .0.560 record isn't really Spurs in the last 4 years.

If I heard correctly, some TV guy said the Spurs are 25-6 on the RRT in the previous 4 years. That would be 6-2 on this RRT. If they finish 4-4, Jim would be more right than you.

Actually it just depends on your definition of mediocre. Mediocre to me is not a team that makes the playoffs. Mediocre to me is a .500 or sub .500 ball club that misses the playoffs or gets swept in the first round at the most.

But mediocre to Jim is a team that doesn't win a title.

[Hoy]

The Spurs will be ready by April, they only have upside.

But that precisely is the problem. The real culprit of the Spurs dlcline is age. We are old and by the April, we'll be even older. We'll be playing even worse because we would be older by the playoff time. Unless complacent Pop change his mind and force accelerate our two youngers, we are looking at worsening team prospect. Tick-tock. Time is our enemy. Future is grim.

[boutons_]

I NEVER bought the defense of "but Spurs' overall record is blah blah".

I compare the Spurs to the high standards they've kept themselves to for years, and to the other currently top 3 or 4 teams, ie, the ones that matter in the playoffs. Any Spurs level below that is my definition of mediocrity.

[duncanchick21]

:toast :madrun thanks to all the real supporters of this team!!! your words are very encouraging!!! I still believe baby!! I ain't quitting on them!!! go spurs go

[smeagol]

But mediocre to Jim is a team that doesn't win a title.

Because Jim and almost every other Spur fan is spoiled.

[johnpaulwall21]

Yeah there's a similar one of Tony from yesterday too. I felt sorry for both of them.

Does anyone have that picture? :wakeup

[1Parker1]

But mediocre to Jim is a team that doesn't win a title.

Well, while you're right, I think when it comes to the Spurs, not winning a title last season and perhaps not this season is mediocre. Tim Duncan's, Tony Parker's, Manu Ginobili's don't come along often. It's frustrating to know that this team is a trade or two away from seriously contending with the likes of the Mavs and Suns, however, they haven't done anything to take a step closer to that. Mavs, Suns, Lakers, Jazz, etc. have all gotten significantly better these past few seasons, while the Spurs have remained the same. Under the new rules and new competition, it's hard to continue to win that way, especially whent he guys you bring in don't play a lick of defense (cough* Barry, Beno, Elson, and Company).

[Obstructed_View]

There's no question the Spurs are playing poorly, but everyone is healthy. This team is not a trade or two away from contending, they are 48 minutes of effort away from contending. As immensely frustrating it is to watch everyone not named Tim mail it in game after game, I don't care where they finish. I've seen enough of what they can do in flashes that I wouldn't count them out in the playoffs as long as they are playing good basketball by then. The problem is that they might not. It doesn't appear that anyone in the organization or even a significant portion of the fanbase sees any urgency or is willing to exert any pressure on them.

On that subject, where's the expectation of excellence? Did it disappear last year during the regular season when the coach was reluctant to crack the whip on the team just because they were going through the motions?

[Obstructed_View]

Because Jim and almost every other Spur fan is spoiled.
The Spurs should be a better team than this. Anybody that thinks otherwise doesn't know anything about basketball. Spoiled has nothing to do with it.

[LilMissSPURfect]

SPOILED hit it on the head!...


"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."

[Russ]

It was nice while it lasted.

Spoken like a true blue St. Louis Cardinals fan just before the playoffs started.

[Obstructed_View]

SPOILED hit it on the head!...


"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit."

The above two statements seem to be opposed.

The Spurs, especially over the last 20 games, are playing with no heart and no consistency. Mediocrity appears to be a habit, too. The fans should expect more than that. If they play their hardest and get beat, that's something entirely different, and it hasn't happened in a long time.

[Spurs Dynasty 21]

In the last few weeks, I have come to the realization that this Spurs team is not a contender any longer. I am resigned to the fact that the Spurs' championship years are officially over. In the Tim Duncan era, the Spurs never lost to the Rockets at home, the Spurs had a huge winning streak against the Jazz and always found ways to win in the end of close games, but for the most part they just punished the Jazz, and the Spurs never lost a season series to the Mavericks or the Cavaliers. Our team can now only beat the likes of the Charlottes (oops), the Bostons and the New Jerseys of the league, and throw in a few wins over the Wizzards, and Magic and other Eastern playoff teams.

Now in just a few short weeks, all that has changed. The Spurs are nothing more than a shadow of their former selves. The will is still there, but they just do not have the talent to beat the top teams any more. I still love them, and I will still follow them, but my expectations are trivial.

:depressed

I can now just look back with nostalgia and try to remember the good times, the times when the Spurs were the team everyone on TNT touted as the team to beat, the organization that every team should try to emulate, and the team that played deep into the playoffs.

Alas, now I can only look forward to an occasional win over an overconfident legitimate contender, a win only possible because the Spurs snuck up on them at the right time and upset them. I will smile to myself knowingly, for this will cause their fans on their boards to curse their coaching staff for allowing their team to lose to a team like our beloved, but mediocre NBA team.



you see what you said was true, but what is TRULY pathetic is that Duncan and Parker are in their prime right now


but the Spurs think they can put shit pieces around them and win

[mavs>spurs2]

its hard to tell in this league who will win it all. 3 years ago the no name pistons beat a unbeatable allstar laker squad. the next year the suns had the hype to win a championship but lost to us in 5. The next year Detroit was on a tear and they slaughtered us both matches but they fell apart in the playoffs. Miami won the championship and beat a good dallas team, and miami wasnt even in the same league as spurs or dallas but they came out on top. Anything can happen...............

Nice post. I was especially surprised when Detroit beat the Lakers in 03, I almost didn't even bother watching game 1. Just goes to show that anything can happen.

[lefty]

:toast :madrun thanks to all the real supporters of this team!!! your words are very encouraging!!! I still believe baby!! I ain't quitting on them!!! go spurs go
:clap :clap :clap :clap

[Russ]

its hard to tell in this league who will win it all. 3 years ago the no name pistons beat a unbeatable allstar laker squad. the next year the suns had the hype to win a championship but lost to us in 5. The next year Detroit was on a tear and they slaughtered us both matches but they fell apart in the playoffs. Miami won the championship and beat a good dallas team, and miami wasnt even in the same league as spurs or dallas but they came out on top. Anything can happen...............

Add the '01 Spurs (painfully) to that litany. Best record in the league all for naught.

(And, for Spurs-Mavs comparisons this year, I believe the Spurs beat the Lakers 3-1 regular season that year before getting swept in the playoffs.)

[Nero]

I disagree about the talent. The talent is there, but the will/desire to play defense and RB is not. The Spurs have a serious psychological problem, not a talent problem, and not something a trade in the next couple weeks is gonna fix.




I disagree completely with this. I still think the Spurs system , coaching, and ability of TD to make bad players look good is better than any other team. I think our talent level is trash. Tell me another team in the league that has 3 players who get about 20 min/night and shoot a collective 35% from the field and 30% 3pt to go with their shitty defense and lack of rebounding, physical play, speed. TD has also lost a slight step. TP is great and so is Manu, however his minutes are limited. Barry is a decent 6th man. Nobody else on the roster would fetch above the league minimum in the NBA market.

[romsho]

In the last few weeks, I have come to the realization that this Spurs team is not a contender any longer. I am resigned to the fact that the Spurs' championship years are officially over. In the Tim Duncan era, the Spurs never lost to the Rockets at home, the Spurs had a huge winning streak against the Jazz and always found ways to win in the end of close games, but for the most part they just punished the Jazz, and the Spurs never lost a season series to the Mavericks or the Cavaliers. Our team can now only beat the likes of the Charlottes (oops), the Bostons and the New Jerseys of the league, and throw in a few wins over the Wizzards, and Magic and other Eastern playoff teams.

Now in just a few short weeks, all that has changed. The Spurs are nothing more than a shadow of their former selves. The will is still there, but they just do not have the talent to beat the top teams any more. I still love them, and I will still follow them, but my expectations are trivial.

:depressed

I can now just look back with nostalgia and try to remember the good times, the times when the Spurs were the team everyone on TNT touted as the team to beat, the organization that every team should try to emulate, and the team that played deep into the playoffs.

Alas, now I can only look forward to an occasional win over an overconfident legitimate contender, a win only possible because the Spurs snuck up on them at the right time and upset them. I will smile to myself knowingly, for this will cause their fans on their boards to curse their coaching staff for allowing their team to lose to a team like our beloved, but mediocre NBA team.

Is it really lack of talent or are they just playing shitty? It's hard to believe this same roster minus Rasho, Nazr and Van Exel suddenly can't play 8 months removed from the conference finals. At the moment they collectively have lost the ability to shoot the basketball. They can play alot better. Whether their best is good enough to beat the competition remains to be seen. Don't sleep on em just yet.

[Nero]

Is it really lack of talent or are they just playing shitty? It's hard to believe this same roster minus Rasho, Nazr and Van Exel suddenly can't play 8 months removed from the conference finals. At the moment they collectively have lost the ability to shoot the basketball. They can play alot better. Whether their best is good enough to beat the competition remains to be seen. Don't sleep on em just yet.

The answer is that they still can play, evidenced by their 3rd best record in the L. BUT there is no room for improvement. They're a little worse than they were then and falling fast. Fin and Horry and Beno didn't show up to play this year. Rasho and Nazr were significantly better than Franberto. Tim is pacing himself and not playing up to playoff level + he's probably lost a little. Manu is not playing like playoff Manu either. Bowen looks decidely worse + the rules render him less effective. Pop has lost his edge. Can't complain about Parker and Barry. Are those enough factors to lower a team from Contenders to also-ran? Yes, and all of those things are getting progressively worse. It's not like we have injured players who are getting into game shape, or young talent developing. I'm pinning my hopes of Tim having a post 30 awakening like Hakeem.

[Russ]

I disagree completely with this. I still think the Spurs system , coaching, and ability of TD to make bad players look good is better than any other team. I think our talent level is trash.

Pop hates mistakes more than he loves great plays. Especially in role players. Hence the makeup of the Spurs roster.

They figure the big three will make the plays. The other guys just need to avoid being a collective negative. That result is more easily acheived with players of modest talent than with more flashy (but inconsistent) types.

In other words, don't look for Lamar Odom ever to be a Spur.

[Extra Stout]

The idea that the Spurs still have plenty of talent, but just aren't playing hard enough is wishful thinking, because there is always the hope they might play harder, but there is no hope if they simply aren't good enough.

Obviously, they don't suck. They have an all-time great player surrounding by two very good ones. However, the cast around that nucleus is subpar. They don't suck, but neither are they title material.

That they went 63-19 last year is not relevant. First of all, they replaced two below-average NBA centers in the rotation with two below-average NBDL centers. Second of all, the slope of decline gets pretty steep around age 35. Ask Gary Payton. Third of all, I present the example of the 1983-84 Spurs, who went from the Western Conference Finals in 1983 to utter crap with most of the same players. This team has not declined nearly so much as that one did.

Though it seems clear that this team is not going to win another title with the likes of Horry, Bowen, and Barry (or any title with Finley), the fact remains that there are good years left with the Duncan-Parker-Ginobili nucleus, and they could reload for one more run or two in the next couple of years if they were so motivated.

Alas, it appears that Peter Holt & Co. are content to rest on their laurels and collect their windfall profits upon selling the team. Maybe there will be time for one last run under new ownership. Who knows?

[ca®lo]

what does having the best record in the league thought us?

that its nothing come playoff times. have many times have we had the best record in the league and still went kaput in the playoffs.

in one of the series against the lakers we were even on a huge win streak. then got booted out.

if uve been supporting this team since the robinson/pre duncan era.. then theres no reason no quit on them now.

spoiled. thats the word.