It's official...Amare no longer LOOMS

[Amarelooms]

This bad ass mother fo has officially arrived. Dude is sick. STill don't understand why people leave him off the pick and rolls. Gotta force Nash to shoot I think...stay on everyone else and force Nash to score 40+ and be physical with his cracker ass :elephant

[ponky]

yup, he arrived at the free throw line 17 times tonight, 4 times less than the entire hawks team...haha, just kidding, i could really care less, i thought he arrived two years ago but i guess he was just teasing

[atxrocker]

cue the amare haters....

[td4mvp21]

Or maybe he got injured?

[ponky]

Or maybe he got injured?

like i said, i was just kidding, don't get all up in your pulpit

he had a ridiculously sick game tonight

[atxrocker]

holy fuck... 43/16/6 w/3 blks. dudes a monster. and of course, the haters are no where to be found.

[dirk4mvp]

This bad ass mother fo has officially arrived. Dude is sick. STill don't understand why people leave him off the pick and rolls. Gotta force Nash to shoot I think...stay on everyone else and force Nash to score 40+ and be physical with his cracker ass :elephant


He's just now arriving? I thought he's been here a while now.

[ALVAREZ6]

punk ass bitch likes to do push-ups...what a champ

[td4mvp21]

like i said, i was just kidding, don't get all up in your pulpit

he had a ridiculously sick game tonight

:lol Sorry.

[N4th4n]

punk ass bitch likes to do push-ups...what a champ

How mature of you to hold one small incident against him for ever. Those push ups were defiantly the defining point of his career.

[confined]

3 words....against...the...hawks

[johnpaulwall21]

3 words....against...the...hawks

yes manu got 24 in a roll against this group of hawks.

[JMarkJohns]

3 words....against...the...hawks

Mi-cro-frac-ture

One word, four syllables...

[confined]

Mi-cro-frac-ture

One word, four syllables...
good job

[JMarkJohns]

good job

I thought since you were so good at pointing out the obvious, that I'd point out something you'd taken for granted.

[TDMVPDPOY]

dude is overrated, only thing his good at is puttin up the points but cant find a win without steve nash, that basically goes for every overrated player on the sons team

[JMarkJohns]

He may be overrated, but such a truth still won't diminish his return from an injury that's crippled equal players.

[atxrocker]

dude is overrated


you're joking, right? if anything, he's been underrated since his injury

[stretch]

thats great and all that he played well. but the Suns still dont play good enough defense or rebound the ball well enough to win against the Mavs or Spurs.

[JMarkJohns]

That may very well turn out true as well. Let's just see if health is on the Suns side come the stretch run (no pun intended) and the playoffs. They'd made strides before injuries took out the likes of Thomas and Diaw and hindered Bell. Let's see if they can regain that top-10 defense (which they were) and keep improving on their rebounding (which, if Amare dominates they way he can with 12 per, could).

[Amare_32]

thats great and all that he played well. but the Suns still dont play good enough defense or rebound the ball well enough to win against the Mavs or Spurs.

The difference between the Mavs and the Suns on defense is closer then you think.

Suns opp FG% - .457

Mavs's opp FG% - .448

Suns opp 3pt % - .345

Mavs opp 3pt % - .350

So all this talk about the Suns defense being nonexistent does not hold water. Now if Mavs and Spurs fans don't want to admit the Suns defense has gotten better then is thier problem. As for the Spurs and Suns here are the numbers.

Spurs opp % - .443

Spurs opp 3pt % .342

So there you have it the gap between the Spurs,Suns and Mavs on defense is not as big as people on this board make it to be.

[JMarkJohns]

Before Thomas went down, the Suns defensive FG% was better than the Mavericks.

[leemajors]

He may be overrated, but such a truth still won't diminish his return from an injury that's crippled equal players.

to be fair, the procedure/rehabilitation seems to have advanced quite a lot. either that or the previous saw some shoddy practicioners. hopefully this means more people will be able to recover from that injury as well as amare has - especially everyday people.

[stretch]

The difference between the Mavs and the Suns on defense is closer then you think.

Suns opp FG% - .457

Mavs's opp FG% - .448

Suns opp 3pt % - .345

Mavs opp 3pt % - .350

So all this talk about the Suns defense being nonexistent does not hold water. Now if Mavs and Spurs fans don't want to admit the Suns defense has gotten better then is thier problem. As for the Spurs and Suns here are the numbers.

Spurs opp % - .443

Spurs opp 3pt % .342

So there you have it the gap between the Spurs,Suns and Mavs on defense is not as big as people on this board make it to be.
once again, numbers dont tell the whole story. a truly good defensive team shows up in the 4th quarter, and can shut teams down when they need to, and win games with defense. the Suns do not do that. if their offensive is not flowing, they are not winning. they are not a team that can get themselves out of a slump with good, physical, shut-down defense. its one thing to get some steals here and there, which apparently the Suns and most fans consider to be good defense, but they are not a team that can flat out shut an opponent down when they need to. you have to be able to do that to win a championship. even teams that werent very spectacular on defense or had average defensive numbers that won championships, were always teams that were capable of turning on the heat, and shutting their opponents down when they needed to most, which is what matters most.

[TheMulvany]

The Suns are a bad defensive team. They don't rebound or force turnovers. The difference between shooting 46% and shooting 42% is 2-3 shots. If you get outrebounded by 2 per game that could be the difference between giving up those few percentage points. The end.

[mavsfan1000]

The Suns are a bad defensive team. They don't rebound or force turnovers. The difference between shooting 46% and shooting 42% is 2-3 shots. If you get outrebounded by 2 per game that could be the difference between giving up those few percentage points. The end.
I agree. Amare is getting up big stats in expense to having a shotblocker and an extra rebounder out there. Amare should be playing power forward.

[RonMexico]

I don't even want to justify half of what is being said out here. Amare is a power forward when Kurt Thomas is in. stretch complains that the Suns get a lot of steals to inflate their defensive "numbers" while TheMulvaney contends that they don't cause any turnovers (last I thought... a steal was a turnover...).

No one says the Suns are a lock-down defensive team or a great rebounding team. We're just saying they're better than you give them credit for. That... and Amare is not overrated because of his stats - he did put up a lot in the WIN they had against Denver when Nash was out. Also, he's played the most athletic I've seen him this season after the all-star break, which is nice to see... since a lot of people thought he might be getting winded around this part of the season.

[mavsfan1000]

I think of Kurt Thomas as more of a power forward. Though he is bigger than Diaw but lacks the size to be a center. Kurt Thomas isn't a shot blocker though which I think is the missing piece for the suns to win the championship. A shot blocking center that is.

[Capt Bringdown]

Nobody on the Spurs is capable of guarding his sneakers...

[ALVAREZ6]

How mature of you to hold one small incident against him for ever. Those push ups were defiantly the defining point of his career.
Manu scores 48 points on Suns in Jan. 05

Spurs 4-1 over the Suns in 05 Conference Finals.



Spurs>Suns

[stretch]

I don't even want to justify half of what is being said out here. Amare is a power forward when Kurt Thomas is in. stretch complains that the Suns get a lot of steals to inflate their defensive "numbers" while TheMulvaney contends that they don't cause any turnovers (last I thought... a steal was a turnover...).

No one says the Suns are a lock-down defensive team or a great rebounding team. We're just saying they're better than you give them credit for. That... and Amare is not overrated because of his stats - he did put up a lot in the WIN they had against Denver when Nash was out. Also, he's played the most athletic I've seen him this season after the all-star break, which is nice to see... since a lot of people thought he might be getting winded around this part of the season.
actually, i never said that they get a lot of steals. but periodically, in a game, they will get on a roll and get 2 or 3 quick steals and buckets, and suddenly people think that they are a great defensive team... until they play a good team that knows how to deal with that, and will find a way to get those 2 or 3 buckets right back.

You say that we don't give them enough credit on their defense and rebounding... well we all say that you all give them too much credit... especially to call them a top 10 defensive team in the league, which is absolutely crazy.

[hitmanyr2k]

thats great and all that he played well. but the Suns still dont play good enough defense or rebound the ball well enough to win against the Mavs or Spurs.

I have no doubt in my mind a healthy Suns team will beat the Mavs in the playoffs should they meet. I have more faith in Steve Nash leading (and delivering) in a big series than Dirk. A matchup with the Spurs is cloudy though.

[monosylab1k]

I have more faith in Steve Nash leading (and delivering) in a big series than Dirk.

Where does this faith come from? His past history of delivering in the playoffs? :lol

[dirk4mvp]

Where does this faith come from? His past history of delivering in the playoffs? :lol


Obviously from Nash's Finals appearances.

[monosylab1k]

Obviously from Nash's Finals appearances.

It's funny how every time Dirk loses a series, he chokes...but every time Nash loses a series, it's cuz of his back or cuz he was worn out or cuz he didn't have Amare....so who's the one making excuses?

[hitmanyr2k]

Where does this faith come from? His past history of delivering in the playoffs? :lol

His past history of kicking Dirk's ass with a healthy Suns team and last year giving the Mavs all they could handle with basically half a team.

[monosylab1k]

His past history of kicking Dirk's ass with a healthy Suns team

Past history...you mean once? That one time? That's about as ridiculous as a Mavs fan saying that the Mavs will always beat the Spurs because of their "past history" of beating the Spurs in the playoffs.

[dirk4mvp]

It's funny how every time Dirk loses a series, he chokes...but every time Nash loses a series, it's cuz of his back or cuz he was worn out or cuz he didn't have Amare....so who's the one making excuses?


That's because Nash is one of the two media darlings who never get any negativity.

[dirk4mvp]

His past history of kicking Dirk's ass with a healthy Suns team and last year giving the Mavs all they could handle with basically half a team.


Didn't they still have the 2 time MVP and the guy you said would deliver more in a series that Dirk would?

[hitmanyr2k]

Didn't they still have the 2 time MVP and the guy you said would deliver more in a series that Dirk would?

Read and comprehend. I stressed that I have more faith in Nash leading and delivering with a "HEALTHY" Suns team. Not a small, broken down team like the Mavs faced last year.

[N4th4n]

Obviously from Nash's Finals appearances.

No No, the faith comes froms DIRKS finals apperance.

[monosylab1k]

No No, the faith comes froms DIRKS finals apperance.

They played the Suns in the Finals?

[PhxDog]

The Hawks were just "letting" Amare score--it was all part of their game plan...

[RonMexico]

actually, i never said that they get a lot of steals. but periodically, in a game, they will get on a roll and get 2 or 3 quick steals and buckets, and suddenly people think that they are a great defensive team... until they play a good team that knows how to deal with that, and will find a way to get those 2 or 3 buckets right back.

You say that we don't give them enough credit on their defense and rebounding... well we all say that you all give them too much credit... especially to call them a top 10 defensive team in the league, which is absolutely crazy.

I didn't call them a top 10 defensive team. But I do say they are a better defensive team than they were the last two years, and there's a little something to that. Esepecially since I watch every game and you probably only watch the national games and the Mavs games, so I feel a little more confident to discuss their defensive prowess... and also rip on them when they give easy baskets to the Hawks last night.

[RonMexico]

It's probably more that Barkley and Mavs fans have only one reaction to the Suns... and Barkely guaranteed the Hawks would make the playoffs this year...

[monosylab1k]

Either way, March 14th should be a fun night. Probably the only truly meaningful regular season game left for the Mavs and Suns. April 1 too, forgot about that one.

[stretch]

I didn't call them a top 10 defensive team. But I do say they are a better defensive team than they were the last two years, and there's a little something to that. Esepecially since I watch every game and you probably only watch the national games and the Mavs games, so I feel a little more confident to discuss their defensive prowess... and also rip on them when they give easy baskets to the Hawks last night.
No, I never said you called them a top 10 defensive team. But some of your buddies here have. And yes, they have improved, but to only be a little better than the defense that they had the last two years isnt saying much at all. they are still among the poorest defensive squads in the league. when things fall apart for them offensively, they look completely lost. the only thing that keeps them in games are a constant barrage of threes when that happens, but thats obviously not enough if you cannot stop your opponent, especially in the playoffs.

[JMarkJohns]

to be fair, the procedure/rehabilitation seems to have advanced quite a lot. either that or the previous saw some shoddy practicioners. hopefully this means more people will be able to recover from that injury as well as amare has - especially everyday people.

Kenyon Martin (Denver Nuggets) and Juwann McClellan (Arizona Wildcats) would beg to differ. Each undwent microfracture, put in the rehab time, worked their way back into playing shape, suited up and suffered setbacks that will likely cost each their season.

It's not a science yet. It's still very hit or miss.

[P-O-Z]

remeber when amare averaged like 4o points a game aganist the spurs in the wcf

[dirk4mvp]

remeber when amare averaged like 4o points a game aganist the spurs in the wcf


and they still lost? yeah, i remember that.

[RonMexico]

and they still lost? yeah, i remember that.

This is a more complete team than the one that had Q-choke-Rich and Joe Johnson out for half the series... first game Joe comes back, they win and he's the leading scorer... and hopefully, Marion wouldn't only average 7 points for the whole series because Bowen was able to focus only on him when JJ was out.

Still, they had a chance if they didn't fuck themselves by losing at home 3 times... especially when they had game 5 in their grasp until the last 2 mins.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

holy fuck... 43/16/6 w/3 blks. dudes a monster. and of course, the haters are no where to be found.


i still think Amare Stoudemire blows dogs for quarters, yo.

[P-O-Z]

This is a more complete team than the one that had Q-choke-Rich and Joe Johnson out for half the series... first game Joe comes back, they win and he's the leading scorer... and hopefully, Marion wouldn't only average 7 points for the whole series because Bowen was able to focus only on him when JJ was out.

Still, they had a chance if they didn't fuck themselves by losing at home 3 times... especially when they had game 5 in their grasp until the last 2 mins.
I thought you guys were raw when you had jj how did he leave again you guys traded him for boris

[dirk4mvp]

This is a more complete team than the one that had Q-choke-Rich and Joe Johnson out for half the series... first game Joe comes back, they win and he's the leading scorer... and hopefully, Marion wouldn't only average 7 points for the whole series because Bowen was able to focus only on him when JJ was out.

Still, they had a chance if they didn't fuck themselves by losing at home 3 times... especially when they had game 5 in their grasp until the last 2 mins.


Eh, I wasn't really serious, I was just poking shit with a stick.

[leemajors]

Kenyon Martin (Denver Nuggets) and Juwann McClellan (Arizona Wildcats) would beg to differ. Each undwent microfracture, put in the rehab time, worked their way back into playing shape, suited up and suffered setbacks that will likely cost each their season.

It's not a science yet. It's still very hit or miss.

the suns and amare had the good sense to shut him down last season after his initial comeback too. i don't know much about Juwann but Kenyon seems to just have bad luck dating back to college as far as injuries go.