Election Petition - Paper Trail

[MannyIsGod]

I'm going to be circulating a petition once we get the final draft stating that the citizens of bexar county want a system that leaves a paper trail.

It is not partisan in nature, it just states that the system in it's current state is vulnerable and we would like that to change.

Please list here if you are intersted in signining it, we will come to you.

[Hook Dem]

Sounds reasonable to me Manny!

[Drachen]

Im down, I dont understand why this wasnt there in the first place....
Oh, could you also put on there that we want a way to write in a vote as well (they could program a keyboard on those things).

[2pac]

Damn Bexar County.

Harris Rules!

[Marcus Bryant]

What a hero.

[MannyIsGod]

Maybe, but I'll still never reach your heights Marcus.

Drachen, that's a whole seperate issue, along with the fact that all write in cantidates must be approved by the state before the election. Go figure how that one works.

[2pac]

Maybe, but I'll still never reach your heights Marcus.

Drachen, that's a whole seperate issue, along with the fact that all write in cantidates must be approved by the state before the election. Go figure how that one works.

So my vote for Carlos Beltran didnt count?

[exstatic]

I prefer the scantron sheets to touchscreen, anyday.

[Useruser666]

I want a touch screen that is shaped like a butterfly!

But seriously, I agree on having a hard copy of the electronic voting machines. I'm note sure how exactly that will change things if the machines are supposedly rigged in the first place. If it is rigged to vote this way or that, can't it be rigged to print out that same stuff. I also find it kind of funny that after the paper ballot fiasco, we went to more machine voting, and now there are such out cries for paper records.

[Drachen]

I want a touch screen that is shaped like a butterfly!

But seriously, I agree on having a hard copy of the electronic voting machines. I'm note sure how exactly that will change things if the machines are supposedly rigged in the first place. If it is rigged to vote this way or that, can't it be rigged to print out that same stuff. I also find it kind of funny that after the paper ballot fiasco, we went to more machine voting, and now there are such out cries for paper records.

Well it could have a printer, that you are able to check the results, then you drop it in the ballot box. In such an important event, redundant systems should be in place to stop breaches.

Oh, and I thought that the state approval, was only to get a candidate ON the ballot. In fact I know that there was one state (illinois?) where Nader didnt get his petition in on time (1 day late) and it was rejected for him to be on the ballot, and he said afterward, "well I guess I will have to rely on write in votes."

[Yonivore]

I believe Travis County has electronic voting machines that produce a hard copy audit trail.

[MannyIsGod]

well, to get on the initial ballot you need the signatures, but then the secratary of state here in texas must also approve the write in cantidates for which votes will be counted.

Nader for instance was an approved write in cantidate even though he didnt' appear anywhere on the ballot.

[exstatic]

But seriously, I agree on having a hard copy of the electronic voting machines. I'm note sure how exactly that will change things if the machines are supposedly rigged in the first place.

The ballots themselves are paper, like the test sheets where you fill in the ovals. You scan in the sheet to cast and record your vote, and the sheets are kept for recount purposes. Nothing happens after the fact.

[Useruser666]

The point I was trying to make is that if the machines themselves are supposedly rigged, any output, electronic or otherwise would be rigged too. Right? I think it's a good idea to have a paper backup in any case.

[JoeChalupa]

I'm for it. There must be accountability.

[Useruser666]

Haven't any of the election officials heard of "Print Screen"?

[MannyIsGod]

No, because you get to see the paper backup and verify that it has your votes.

Nevada had a great system where the machines showed you the paper behind a glass sheild, then when you gave the ok it was filed away.

[exstatic]

The point I was trying to make is that if the machines themselves are supposedly rigged, any output, electronic or otherwise would be rigged too.

The point is that with scantron, the paper is the INPUT, not the output. Your vote is recorded on paper, THEN counted and tabulated electronicly.

[Useruser666]

The point is that with scantron, the paper is the INPUT, not the output. Your vote is recorded on paper, THEN counted and tabulated electronicly.

Ok, but how does that work for touch screen voting?

[exstatic]

It doesn't. I don't want touch screen, simply because there IS no accountability. The issues that you raise are in full force.

[Useruser666]

I thought the purpose of touch screen voting was to make the actual selection easier for the voter. I.E. the voter could touch the picture of the candidate they wanted.

[Nbadan]

I thought the purpose of touch screen voting was to make the actual selection easier for the voter. I.E. the voter could touch the picture of the candidate they wanted.

Why is it we can print a copy of our account activity at any ATM but we can't print a copy of our vote when we are voting for the most important office in the land?

The Problems go well beyond just printing a paper ballot though Manny. WE should not have two brothers who pledge millions of dollars to Republican causes controlling 80% of the electronic voting. We should not run our E-voting machines on antiquated propriatory software that can be easily accessed, manipulated and purged of any shady activity. We should not let a Private company who has been found guilty of providing faulty voting machines in a court of law in other states provide the E-voting machines in our counties. WE should guarantee the transparency of E-voting by providing two copies of hard votes, one for the voter and a seperate one for a ballot box in cases of recount. WE should negate the appearance of impropriety by regulating once and for all who can be at polling places and what actions or inactions are unacceptable. WE should guarantee that Poll places and voting machines are dispersed among the electorate based on past voting patterns, so that Republicans can't just walk up in vote in Republican districts while Democrats have to wait 9 hours to vote on faulty equipment.

WE should all do these things.

[Useruser666]

Why is it we can print a copy of our account activity at any ATM but we can't print a copy of our vote when we are voting for the most important office in the land?

The Problems go well beyond just printing a paper ballot though Manny. WE should not have two brothers who pledge millions of dollars to Republican causes controlling 80% of the electronic voting. We should not run our E-voting machines on antiquated propriatory software that can be easily accessed, manipulated and purged of any shady activity. We should not let a Private company who has been found guilty of providing faulty voting machines in a court of law in other states provide the E-voting machines in our counties. WE should guarantee the transparency of E-voting by providing two copies of hard votes, one for the voter and a seperate one for a ballot box in cases of recount. WE should negate the appearance of impropriety by regulating once and for all who can be at polling places and what actions or inactions are unacceptable. WE should guarantee that Poll places and voting machines are dispersed among the electorate based on past voting patterns, so that Republicans can't just walk up in vote in Republican districts while Democrats have to wait 9 hours to vote on faulty equipment.

WE should all do these things.


I agree with the hard copy back ups.
I agree that there should be short lines. Although, I don't believe there were long lines for only Democrats.
I believe that even the owner of the company who makes the voting machines should have the right to express his/her support for the candidate of their choice. They have the same right as anyone else.
I believe we already have regulations on who and what they may do at polling places. Maybe a review is in order. There is notthing wrong with that.
The contractors who are awarded the jobs to produce the voting machines/systems should be closely watched.
I don't believe we should set up polling sites based totally on prior voting data. If there were ever a great shift that sort of system would not be able to adapt and cause even a greater problem.

[Nbadan]

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