another reason why nash shouldnt be mvp

[Fillmoe]

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/5351/parker235yn1.jpg


he left tony parker drop 235 points on him? :bang

[TDMVPDPOY]

nash allows as most points scored against him when playing against other pgs, thats a fuckn huge weakness in his game, yet that didnt stop him winnin 2 mvps, where dirk who gets bash for not playin defense...

[JMarkJohns]

Wasn't Nash guarding Bowen most of the evening? Seriously, now you're just nitpicking... Yeah, he's an "anticipation" defender, playing you for the charge or steal, and sure, he lacks lateral quickness to stay with most PGs, but he's tough, he sticks his nose in there, tries and tries again. He could be worse. He could not try at all.

If the Suns lose a game, typically it isn't because Nash couldn't defend his opponant. Sometimes, but rarely. However, when they win, it's largely his doing. It's truth and can't really be debated. Whether or not that earns him another MVP is up to the voters. Personally, I don't think he gets it. Whatever. I don't think Nash cares, either.

[Fillmoe]

apparently mofuckas never heard of a joke before.....

[JMarkJohns]

Sure I have. I've heard of you before... :rolleyes

[Amuseddaysleeper]

apparently mofuckas never heard of a joke before.....


hahaha


i am officially a fillmoe fan

[Cry Havoc]

Wasn't Nash guarding Bowen most of the evening? Seriously, now you're just nitpicking... Yeah, he's an "anticipation" defender, playing you for the charge or steal, and sure, he lacks lateral quickness to stay with most PGs, but he's tough, he sticks his nose in there, tries and tries again. He could be worse. He could not try at all.

If the Suns lose a game, typically it isn't because Nash couldn't defend his opponant. Sometimes, but rarely. However, when they win, it's largely his doing. It's truth and can't really be debated. Whether or not that earns him another MVP is up to the voters. Personally, I don't think he gets it. Whatever. I don't think Nash cares, either.

The last time the Spurs met the Suns in the playoffs, Nash guarded Parker (who wasn't nearly the finisher he is now) and got absolutely mauled. Parker is a better defender now, although I don't think the stats will show it, and Nash hasn't picked his D up at all. If Nash tried to D up TP at any point, it's going to be an easy layup or feed in the lane for the Spurs.

The fact that the Suns are forced to put their 2 time MVP on the Spurs weakest offensive driving threat should say something about the quality of his defense.

No one who's so liable should ever win 3 MVP awards.

[monosylab1k]

and God forbid Nash ever have to guard somebody a little bigger than him. Bigger guards get an automatic 2 points on him every time down the court. Nash is easily the worst defender in the NBA that gets any significant playing time (Dirk is almost as bad but there are stretches in every game where he plays solid team defense).

And Amare's defense isn't any better than Nash's. Amare thinks that getting 2 or 3 blocks is great defense even if he gave up 30 points and didn't even bother putting a body on whoever he's guarding in the post.

[monosylab1k]

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/5351/parker235yn1.jpg

And this is just hilarious :lol TNT fucks up so much on their broadcasts it's embarrassing. It's good that they've got EJ, Kenny, and Charles to fall back on - those guys make Thursday nights on TNT must watch TV for me. A couple weeks ago when they busted Charles for coming to work in shorts and sneakers was classic.

[Cry Havoc]

and God forbid Nash ever have to guard somebody a little bigger than him. Bigger guards get an automatic 2 points on him every time down the court. Nash is easily the worst defender in the NBA that gets any significant playing time (Dirk is almost as bad but there are stretches in every game where he plays solid team defense).

And Amare's defense isn't any better than Nash's. Amare thinks that getting 2 or 3 blocks is great defense even if he gave up 30 points and didn't even bother putting a body on whoever he's guarding in the post.

It was amazing how easily Duncan (on two good ankles) humiliated Amare. Have you ever seen a "dominant" post player look so lost on defense?

[cherylsteele]

When a game goes to overtime, why can't TNT cut away a show the other game in the local market instead of Spurs/Suns fans having to wait to see the end of the previous game?
They do that with the NFL all the time don't they?

[cheguevara]

If NBA were to include defense into the MVP equation, it would be Duncan who'd be the MVP(or at least Kobe) not Dirk :lmao

[Cry Havoc]

When a game goes to overtime, why can't TNT cut away a show the other game in the local market instead of Spurs/Suns fans having to wait to see the end of the previous game?
They do that with the NFL all the time don't they?

I'm pretty sure TNT is contractually obligated to show all of the game at first and then the other one. Plus, with the East being wide open like it is, I think a lot of people (coughBullsfans) were interested in that game last night. It was big for the playoff seeding. Almost always, an overtime game with playoff implications is more entertaining from an unbiased fan's standpoint than the 1st quarter of another game.

[ducks]

Since suns signed Nash, suns are 4-11 against SA, including 1-6 in San Antonio (2-4 since those playoffs, including 0-3 in SA). Home court advantage could be a big factor, and now the lead is down to 2 and we just lost the tie-break.

[RonMexico]

nash allows as most points scored against him when playing against other pgs, thats a fuckn huge weakness in his game, yet that didnt stop him winnin 2 mvps, where dirk who gets bash for not playin defense...

Yeah, Nash only had to guard Parker when Marion went out with his 4th foul (on a very suspect call) in the 3rd. Parker is one of the quickest guys in the league, so it's not a surprise that Nash can't hang with him too well and TP scored 15 of his 35 in the 3rd. However, Parker probably averages the most points in the paint among PGs in the league, so it's obviously not just Nash who gives it up to him.

Jackass.

[RonMexico]

And Amare needs to take a lesson or two from Kurt Thomas about defending your man before he gets the ball. KT would push Duncan at least 5 feet further from the basket than Amare before TD even touched the ball. It's just a classic example of young, athletic guys thinking their physical gifts will win out every time. I like Amare but he wasn't really doing shit on the offensive end, so he needed to pick it up defensively and you can't play team defense when you're letting Duncan catch the ball 2 centimeters from the basket.

[Duncanoypi]

Since suns signed Nash, suns are 4-11 against SA, including 1-6 in San Antonio (2-4 since those playoffs, including 0-3 in SA). Home court advantage could be a big factor, and now the lead is down to 2 and we just lost the tie-break.
who lost the tie-break?....

[ducks]

suns

[ducks]

"San Antonio is a way better defensive team than Dallas is," Phoenix's Shawn Marion said.

[Findog]

"San Antonio is a way better defensive team than Dallas is," Phoenix's Shawn Marion said.

And Dallas is a way better defensive team than Phoenix is. I don't even see why he's bringing the Mavericks into it. It's not like the Suns are going to meet up with Dallas in the playoffs.

Be careful what you wish for fellow Maverick fans -- San Antonio is way better than Phoenix when it comes to playoff basketball. In two weeks everybody starts over at 0-0. We were one dumb foul by Ginobili from getting sent home last year. And we shot 80% from the floor in the first half in Game 7 - that's unheard of. Don't count on that happening again. I'd rather face Phoenix. Those last two wins against us are fool's gold. San Antonio is the more dangerous team.

[Findog]

Lost in all the 2-time MVP talk is the fact that Dallas is MUCH BETTER OFF without him than they ever were with him. When the Lakers traded Shaq away for 60 cents on the dollar, they went from elite to middle of the pack. Dallas took Nash's salary slot and signed Erick Dampier and they got better. Nash fits in well in Phoenix, but it was hardly a blunder for Dallas to let him go. As for strengthening a fellow conference team, they had no choice over his destination

[MrChug]

I think it may be some kind of record or something...

[LilMissSPURfect]

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/5351/parker235yn1.jpg


he left tony parker drop 235 points on him? :bang



:drunk :drunk :drunk :drunk :drunk :p:

[Skip Bayless]

Dallas took Nash's salary slot and signed Erick Dampier and they got better.

along with a pretty good coach. is that Nash's fault?

:drunk

[ponky]

:lol thanks for spreading some of that love fillmoe!


RonMexico, good points about both Nash and Amare. BTW, did you catch JHO's stat line the other night when Dirk sat out for the game? I was hoping you would log on so we could *discuss* this little matter! :p:

[Cry Havoc]

And Amare needs to take a lesson or two from Kurt Thomas about defending your man before he gets the ball. KT would push Duncan at least 5 feet further from the basket than Amare before TD even touched the ball. It's just a classic example of young, athletic guys thinking their physical gifts will win out every time. I like Amare but he wasn't really doing shit on the offensive end, so he needed to pick it up defensively and you can't play team defense when you're letting Duncan catch the ball 2 centimeters from the basket.

I agree with what you said, but if you notice KT wasn't stopping Duncan from getting close to the hoop. A lot of Duncan's shots were close -- he was just very off in the first half. Several attempts just rattled out for him.

I give credit to KT for good D last night, but I'm not sure he'll be as effective come playoff time.

Were I the Suns, I would run Nash at Duncan for the double-team. It's not like Nash can contain his man on D anyway, and with his quick hands he might force a TO. Of course, you leave Spurs players open for that, but if you rotate well enough, you might force Bowen or Finley to drive, which is exactly what Phoenix wants over Duncan taking easy inside shots or Barry/Bowen freeing up on the wing for open 3s.

The problem with Duncan is that you always always always have to double-team him, unless you want him to go off. He's so clutch in the playoffs that he just commands more than one defender, and sometimes that isn't enough. So either you give up 30+ a night to him or you allow open looks for other players. I wouldn't want to be a post player in the West right now unless I played for SA. Duncan is starting to look more and more like the beast of "old" (as some, myself included, said he would).

[td4mvp21]

Three years in a row for Nash would be bullshit-he still doesn't play defense and Dirk is leading his team to a franchise-best regular season. It's not really a competition to me. Dirk is the obvious candidate.

[RonMexico]

CryHavoc, Thomas still was able to put a little more of a body on him and Amare has the athleticism to disrupt more shots if he plays more solid defense in the first 10 seconds of the shot clock.

Additionally, I think they were trying to let Finley and Parker shoot from the outside and finally Findog comes out and hits five 3's... I bet if he'd been doing that all year, we wouldn't have seen those "trade Finely and get Maggette" threads earlier.

There's a point where the wing players (Parker and Finley) start nailing the outside shots and the Suns stop doubling Duncan where he can take Diaw inside at will. Hence, that's why those 3 players had scored 35 straight points by themselves at one point.

[mabber]

CryHavoc, Thomas still was able to put a little more of a body on him and Amare has the athleticism to disrupt more shots if he plays more solid defense in the first 10 seconds of the shot clock.

Additionally, I think they were trying to let Finley and Parker shoot from the outside and finally Findog comes out and hits five 3's... I bet if he'd been doing that all year, we wouldn't have seen those "trade Finely and get Maggette" threads earlier.

There's a point where the wing players (Parker and Finley) start nailing the outside shots and the Suns stop doubling Duncan where he can take Diaw inside at will. Hence, that's why those 3 players had scored 35 straight points by themselves at one point.

I missed the game last night...break down what happened for me please. I've read that the Spurs ran the Suns shooters off the 3 pt line and then played decent interior defense. Was that the main difference?

[RonMexico]

:lol thanks for spreading some of that love fillmoe!


RonMexico, good points about both Nash and Amare. BTW, did you catch JHO's stat line the other night when Dirk sat out for the game? I was hoping you would log on so we could *discuss* this little matter! :p:

Let's not bring up this Josh Howard character, right now. Talk about the worst 24 hours of my life: get terribly drunk last night, see Suns blown out in 3rd quarter then tease me by cutting it to 85-81 and then prove in the last 2 minutes how they can't execute in the halfcourt, then I wake up late with a terrible hangover, find out Billy Gillispie is going to Kentucky, cry all the way to the airport, then get stuck in a middle seat behind some fat guy who leaned his shit all the way back. And now I have to head to a friend's b-day party at a sushi restaurant I hate.

Done complaining - time to try and get some ass.

[RonMexico]

I missed the game last night...break down what happened for me please. I've read that the Spurs ran the Suns shooters off the 3 pt line and then played decent interior defense. Was that the main difference?

Suns were 2-11 from 3 point... they made some bad decisions because interior defense was pretty good and so the A/T ratio was terrible... however, they had plenty of good 3pt looks and probably would have shot more than 11 if they weren't at 18%.

Got dominated in the 2nd half and then made a nice run in the 4th to cut it to 85-81... then they let the Spurs execute in the halfcourt while the Suns thought it was a good idea to throw the ball away and get layups blocked.

[mabber]

Suns were 2-11 from 3 point... they made some bad decisions because interior defense was pretty good and so the A/T ratio was terrible... however, they had plenty of good 3pt looks and probably would have shot more than 11 if they weren't at 18%.

Got dominated in the 2nd half and then made a nice run in the 4th to cut it to 85-81... then they let the Spurs execute in the halfcourt while the Suns thought it was a good idea to throw the ball away and get layups blocked.

Was the game played w/playoff intensity? I thought the Suns/Mav game in Dallas (that Suns won in 2 OT's) was played like that but not the game in Phoenix (just as my point of reference).

[mardigan]

Was the game played w/playoff intensity? I thought the Suns/Mav game in Dallas (that Suns won in 2 OT's) was played like that but not the game in Phoenix (just as my point of reference).
If by intensity you mean the Spurs dominated almost the whole second half then yes

[lurker]

Tony scores 235 points and Finley scores 19 points and 10 points. Amazing.

[mFFL03]

"San Antonio is a way better defensive team than Dallas is," Phoenix's Shawn Marion said.

"I think Dallas is the overall best team in the league right now. We might as well just end the season now and give them the trophy so that we can get down to Playa del Carmen already," Phoenix's Steve Nash said.

[RonMexico]

Was the game played w/playoff intensity? I thought the Suns/Mav game in Dallas (that Suns won in 2 OT's) was played like that but not the game in Phoenix (just as my point of reference).

Spurs played with the intensity they needed (especially defensively) in the 3rd quarter. Suns decided to show some semblance of intensity for about 85 seconds in the 4th quarter and then went back into "fold mode" once the 2 minute mark hit. This was their achilles' heel in the 2005 WCF: unable to execute in the half court down the stretch, while the Spurs execute perfectly and it played out the exact same way on Thursday.