O'Neal is an idiot.

[Marcus Bryant]

No, not Shaq. That's another thread for another day. Why was he even involved in anything last night? Some franchise player he is.

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

Yeah, but he did get the best punch in.

http://www.idleidol.com/images/pacerspistonsktfo.gif

[ducks]

I think he could really get hit hard
he went in th etunnel nad came back out

the pacers just got elimated in the east for this year

[Marcus Bryant]

And the way he got involved was lame. The scuffle between that fan and Artest was over. O'Neal wasnt even involved until he rushed a much smaller man who wasn't threatening anyone and basically sucker punched him. Fucking lame and stupid. He deserves to pay for his stupidity. He could have been seriously hurt, he's perhaps in a position to lose a ton of money through fines and litigation, and he definitely hurt his reputation.

[ducks]

and unfortuantly our tax dollars might pay for his food if he goes to he jail house

[GrandeDavid]

I've always thought JO was a big pussy since his heartless effort when it counted in the 2002 World Championship....in Indianapolis, mind you. Jermaine O'Neal is an idiot, just like Stephen Jackson, Stephen Smith and that stupid balla wanna be in that suit who "bum rushed" a 5'4" fan lying on the court. F- all of those losers! Thank God for our San Antonio Spurs. Can you guys imagine Manu and Tim going after some fans? lol lol

And thank God Buckets ain't around no mo'.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

I think it was the fault of the fans and the Pistons. Let me put it my way:

Ben Wallace is embarrased that his team is losing by 15 points to their hated Rivals. Ron Artest commits a hard foul, but nothing horrible, he gets worse everynight just fighting for rebounds. Ben Wallace loses it, attacks Ron Artest and starts a bench clearing brawl. Ron Artest does something I give him tremendous credit for, nothing. He doesnt even throw a puch back. Look, Ron has problems, but i think he was really trying to change yesterday, he probably wanted nothing more than to go beserck but he didn't, he was taking one for the team.

Now he is doing his damndest not to jump into this fight right next to him when a fan starts throwing beer and food all over him, he goes crazy, but damn even when he tried to leave the stands there was a fan who followed him. What are you supposed to do? Yeah he should be suspended but for christs sake, this one was the Fans' fault, trowing beer, food, and chairs at players? come on.

[TheWriter]

Why can't people see that a grown man with a history of hotheadedness ran INTO THE FREAKIN' STANDS! Unless he was about to give someone CPR, he had no excuse. He had a small plastic cup thrown on him. Seriously, how do you justify his actions?

[myhc]

Its simple. Both the fan and Artest are to be blamed relatively equally (in terms of order, fan 1st, then Artest). Any other one sided argument placing full blame on either the fan or Artest is not looking at both sides of the picture.

[TheWriter]

In terms of order - Artest . Fan . Wallace

Wallace only started the on court chaos.

The fan threw a plastic cup.

Artest RAN INTO THE STANDS that then caused the aftermath.

[Dex]

Anyone who thinks that getting hit with a plastic cup is justification for seriously assaulting someone has got their head up their ass. Throwing something back, shouting a few obsenities, I might let these things go. The way Artest attacked that fan was not justified.

I wouldn't even expect a stranger on the street to react that foolishly, let alone a person who is SUPPOSED to be a professional and role-model. Way to keep your fuckin cool, man.

Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing him get booted out of the league.

[Dex]

Furthermore, BIG ups to Rasheed Wallace on the entire incident.

After a career filled with technicals and outbursts, Wallace has made an appreciative effort to keep his emotions under control within the past couple seasons. This was never more evident than last night, when Rasheed Wallace was constantly seen trying to RESTORE the peace, rather than disrupt it. He was even helping out Pacers players, despite the huge altercation that had just taken place.

Good to see old dogs CAN learn new tricks.

[boutons]

"BIG ups to Rasheed Wallace"

When I first read about riot here, my first reaction to the mention of "Wallace" was Rasheed. Very disappointed to hear it was really Ben. Everything I've heard about Ben has been more that positive, even exemplary, including his interviews. Very sorry he's right in the middle of biggest NBA fuckup in decades.

[Useruser666]

It's simple to asses blame for what happened. Anyone who did anything is at fault. I don't think that's unreasonable or unfair. You threw something you're at fault. You shoved some one you're at faul. You punched some one, etc. The penalties are what needs to be looked at carefuly. I really do bealieve that they should be pretty harsh. I don't think any player should be banned forever but I think a ton of games and a wad of cash should be spanked out of some of them.


I really liked SJax when he was here. I wished he could have been with the Spurs. I am more than ok now with who the Spurs have now though. I am really sad that SJax acted that way. Does anyone think Indy should have gotten rid of Artest now? What's his trade value at the moment? 3 cups of Gatorade?

[myhc]

[QUOTE=Dex]Anyone who thinks that getting hit with a plastic cup is justification for seriously assaulting someone has got their head up their ass. [QUOTE]

Did you send a letter to the idiots at ESPN? Screamin A Smith and the rest? What I said, and I hope you weren't addressing me, because I agree with you, is that the fan started the whole thing but Artest blew it up by going into the stands. Like I said, I don't believe you can levy full blame on one side or the other because both parties were equally wrong. The fan for being a knucklehead and Artest for pulling a Vernon Maxwell and endangering everyone around him.

[FromWayDowntown]

Furthermore, BIG ups to Rasheed Wallace on the entire incident.

It was REALLY curious to me that Rasheed was the only Pistons player to go into the stands to try to help Artest and Jackson, and that his role in trying to help was an effort to calm Pistons fans. Either Rasheed has truly grown up, or there've been some serious underestimations of his character. Whatever the case, Rasheed deserves much respect for doing what he could to keep the peace.


Ben Wallace is embarrased that his team is losing by 15 points to their hated Rivals. Ron Artest commits a hard foul, but nothing horrible, he gets worse everynight just fighting for rebounds. Ben Wallace loses it, attacks Ron Artest and starts a bench clearing brawl.

That's just factually-wrong. When the incident only involved the players, the players on the benches stayed where they were. The replays I've seen show the Pacers players restraining each other from leaving the bench area. It was a scrum among the 10 guys on the floor that started this thing, and that melee was totally on Artest and Ben Wallace, both of whom should get suspensions for that alone.


Ron Artest does something I give him tremendous credit for, nothing. He doesnt even throw a puch back. Look, Ron has problems, but i think he was really trying to change yesterday, he probably wanted nothing more than to go beserck but he didn't, he was taking one for the team.

Fair enough, but now you're saying that he's somehow justified for going into the stands by the fact that a fan threw something at him -- see below. It's curious that we've arrived at a point where an act like that fan's is somehow a justification for physical violence.


Now he is doing his damndest not to jump into this fight right next to him when a fan starts throwing beer and food all over him, he goes crazy, but damn even when he tried to leave the stands there was a fan who followed him. What are you supposed to do?

What is he supposed to do? Uh, stay where he is and let the arena security or the police handle the situation. They make an announcement at every NBA game I've ever been to, to the effect of "any fan throwing anything onto the court will be ejected and subject to arrest." The league has a contingency in place for handling that situation. A rush of adrenaline or testosterone doesn't mean that you get to go beat the crap out of someone. Having your feelings hurt, or being subjected to an unpleasant circumstance doesn't give you that justification, either. I don't understand why so many (including the talking heads at ESPN last night) are so willing to give these players a pass when they committed acts that are patently illegal.


Yeah he should be suspended but for christs sake, this one was the Fans' fault, trowing beer, food, and chairs at players? come on.

My ass -- what started the escalation of the riot? The fan threw a beer. Had Artest stayed where he was, or had he been told to go to the locker room, there would have been no riot. Artest might have been mad, and he might have even been wet or had a bruise, but none of those conditions give rise to a justification for pursuing physical violence against another person. You may wish it did, but as a matter of law, Artest was completely unjustified in going into the stands. And the crap that erupted began solely because Artest made a decision to enter the stands and exact some sort of bullshit revenge. For that, he should be suspended for a very long time, should face significant criminal charges, and will likely face substantial civil liability. And justifiably so.

[samikeyp]

It all goes back to the "street thug", "and-1" ghetto mentality of more and more of these young players. If your life or the lives of yout family is being threatened, then yes defend yourself but a plastic beer cup? Please. It was stupid on all parts. Someone mentioned earlier on the board that no one here gets it because we are "suburbanites". Bullshit. Being stupid and immature is not endemic to where you were raised. You are supposed to be a professional athlete...act like it. And because you buy a ticket does not give you the right to be an asshole.