Damn I'm glad we let Stephen Jackson go over a couple mil a year

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

:madrun

[picnroll]

... and what about small ball?

[phxspurfan]

yeah that was a mistake...but then again he could have went into the stands as a member of the Spurs :/

[nkdlunch]

If we still had Jackson + Antonio Daniels, we'd be unstoppable

[The Truth #6]

He would have given us headaches but nothing compared to the Hedo/Barry/Finley anxiety. The dude wanted to play for the Spurs, and he wasn't a geriatric veteran. Not making that happen still annoys me. We invested 2 years into him, got him to learn the system, and then let him walk.

[picnroll]

If Spurs had given Jack the money he wanted how would they have resigned Manu?

[ducks]

:madrun
sj>manu in game 1

[K-State Spur]

dude wanted to play for the Spurs, and he wasn't a geriatric veteran.

Obviously not that much since he turned down the best offer on the market for him. That doesn't mean that he didn't do what was best for him just the same.

[RobinsontoDuncan]

If Spurs had given Jack the money he wanted how would they have resigned Manu?


Bird Rights. There's a reason there are less than 10 teams under the salary cap in the NBA, its a soft cap.

Now, the ownership being cheap is something else all together

[phxspurfan]

If we still had Jackson + Antonio Daniels, we'd be unstoppable


I was thinking this too after watching AD almost drop a triple double today.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

If Spurs had given Jack the money he wanted how would they have resigned Manu?

This is such a red herring. We had Manu's bird rights. Hell, Denver actually tried to give him more than he ended up signing for, and he stayed.

Buckets is stepping up hitting shots tonight in Dallas, and he's also checking some guy named Nowitzki at the defensive end and limiting him to 13 points with 7 to play (4-14 from the field now).

For another two million a year, I'd take him over Finley AND Barry.

[ducks]

I was thinking this too after watching AD almost drop a triple double today.
ad could do that when he is the main and only option on a team

[picnroll]

Bird Rights. There's a reason there are less than 10 teams under the salary cap in the NBA, its a soft cap.

Now, the ownership being cheap is something else all together
Spurs didn't have full Bird's rights.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Spurs didn't have full Bird's rights.

They obviously didn't need them either given the market and the 'interest' of others.

Damn, Buckets just dropped another three on Dallas to push out their lead. Oh well, we've got Finley and Barry to lead us to the promised land.
:hat :bang

[sammy]

Sjax is playing well rebounding and shooting three's! We must not forget that Sjax was part of winning our Championship! I really miss him because he's athletic and can shoot the 3! Probably woudn't have gotten into trouble if he stayed here!

[ducks]

time to trade manu for sj

[kevm2]

I wish we had him. He's just what this team needs, but hey, getting under the luxury tax and running bargain budget teams is what really matters.

[ducks]

sj went to the hawks for peanuts when to pacers and got traded from that because pacers could not wait to get rid of him
he is helping them now because he has playoff experience

[ducks]

sj this year did not shot that well
he has played well though as a gs

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Sj would have never gone to the Hawks for one year if we had just given him a better deal. But Holt Cat gets a few million more in the bank and we get to watch Barry choke in the playoffs for the same price.

[SenorSpur]

Sjax is playing well rebounding and shooting three's! We must not forget that Sjax was part of winning our Championship! I really miss him because he's athletic and can shoot the 3! Probably woudn't have gotten into trouble if he stayed here!

This past Saturday, ESPN Classic reran the 2003 quarterfinal matchup between Spurs & Suns. It was good to see a lineup of SJax, Ginobili, Parker, Robinson and Duncan during the late stages of the game. SJax was clutch in that game (8-8 FTs, 19 points).

Even during that 2003 season, the announcer cited at least 3-4 games where SJax hit either game-winners or game-tying baskets. Yes, I miss him too.

[ShoogarBear]

At least SJax helped keep Mav Fan from posting in here for one night.

[T Park]

:lmao

this is the same guy that had in his sig a picture of Barry.

and it said

LET HIM PLAY

:lmao

[Budkin]

I was sad when Jax left but we still won a championship without him. I have fond memories of 03 Game 6 in both the WCF and the Finals.

[picnroll]

You're about as right about this one as you are about small ball. With no comfort room and only an MLE to offer Spurs would have teams going hard after Manu.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

:lmao

this is the same guy that had in his sig a picture of Barry.

and it said

LET HIM PLAY

:lmao

:lmao Look at the carney posting random bullshit completely unrelated to the topic at hand.

TPark: would you trade having Buckets on this team for Brent Barry? Hell, Brent Barry AND Michael Finley. Because the combined salary of those two is more than what the difference in price from what we were paying Jax and what it would have taken to keep him.

[NorCal510]

My Team Is The Best Fuck The Rest!

[T Park]

TPark: would you trade having Buckets on this team for Brent Barry? Hell, Brent Barry AND Michael Finley. Because the combined salary of those two is more than what the difference in price from what we were paying Jax and what it would have taken to keep him.

You know I would.

I was for trading for Jackson when he became available.

It didn't happen.

Fegan fucked around, and he decided to turn down the 3 year contract.

So thats in the past.

babbling about it now is pointless

[ducks]

Sj Played Better Then Manu And Barry Tonight

[MI21]

Jack's defense has always been pretty damn good, people seem to forget that.

I miss him :( Or at least a player on the Spurs like him...

[King]

What are your thoughts on the Rod Strickland pass?

[NO LIMIT ARMY COMMANDER]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/2003/playoffs/news/2003/06/15/jackson_sider_ap/t1_jackson_ap.jpghttp://www.nba.com/media/act_stephen_jackson.jpg

Mav Killer

[Budkin]

What are your thoughts on the Rod Strickland pass?

Nice. :lmao

[coachmac87]

well we dont have stepehn jackson and never will...spurs could not afford him and manu and tony...get over him...hes a thug

[T Park]

hes not a thug.

Thats the bunchest bunch of bull i've ever heard.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/2003/playoffs/news/2003/06/15/jackson_sider_ap/t1_jackson_ap.jpghttp://www.nba.com/media/act_stephen_jackson.jpg

Mav Killer

Agreed.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

well we dont have stepehn jackson and never will...spurs could not afford him and manu and tony...get over him...hes a thug

That's weak coming from you coach.

Oh, and by the way, Stephen Jackson's salary this year = 2 million dollars less than Barry and Finley's salaries combined.

Thanks for playing though.

[coachmac87]

jax is a walking turnover

[MI21]

jax is a walking turnover

Sure, very turnover prone when he was a Spur.

But he isn't the same player as back then. That is a pet hate of mine, when people still think a player is exactly the same as when he was a Spur.

His handles have improved, there still below average if he is playing SG, but they aren't nearly as bad as before.

[NO LIMIT ARMY COMMANDER]

He has huevos of steel, my friend.

[coachmac87]

ya but where would he fit into the spurs system now...he is not worth the money that u will eventually have to give him to keep him..hes not worth the investment

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

hes not a thug.

Thats the bunchest bunch of bull i've ever heard.

C'mon TPark, how is he not a thug? He went into the stands in the brawl, then there's the gun incident in Pacerland - ever since he left us his thugish tendencies have come out.

I love what SJax did as a Spur, but to pretend that he's a choirboy is absurd. That being said, if he'd opted to stay here, I think the veteran leadership around him might have kept him out of trouble.

[ploto]

Jax is crazy, but I will give him one thing-- he has a killer instinct. Not sure if any of the current Spurs have one.

[gilmor]

Sj Played Better Then Manu And Barry Tonight

Ducks, how about 05, 06?

U need to compare the two for the rest of the past years also.. I still think that Manu > SJax

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

jax is a walking turnover

He had one more than Manu or TP today. Yeah, that's pretty horrible. He also chipped in two steals and a block to cancel them out.



ya but where would he fit into the spurs system now...he is not worth the money that u will eventually have to give him to keep him..hes not worth the investment

Um, I don't know, maybe the spot we're having to play 86 year old Michael Finley and a guy who is the definition of anti-clutch (Barry).

Not worth the money?

Salary this year: 6.1 million
next year: 6.6 million
2008 - 2009: 7.14 million
2009 - 2010: 7.7 million

Meanwhile

Brent + Finley: 8 million
next year: 8.6 million

But yeah, I guess I see your point, we'd be hosed in 2009 :rolleyes

Who needs to win more titles before Duncan gets old? Let's just pack it in, be happy with what we have, and let Holt Cat bank.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Ducks, how about 05, 06?

U need to compare the two for the rest of the past years also.. I still think that Manu > SJax

That's not the comparison that matters though.

Ultimately, it's Manu + Jax >>>> Manu + Barry + Finley

[The Truth #6]

SJax wanted more than 10 million for 3 years. His agent couldn't get anything better. Sjax told the Spurs he'd take their offer but Pop said he had already decided to pursue another direction. That direction of course was Hedo Turkoglu. Ugh. We still could have had him for that weasly contract but Pop had a boner for Hedo at that moment and decided to continue his pursuit of the Turk.

[gilmor]

Aggie, it's called give and take.. provided SJax didn't have any head cases when he was at San Antonio.. f
For a Spurs player, he is very volatile, considering that he went into the stands and shot someone in a club..
Do you think he can fit into Spurs clean culture in the long run? He has already been traded off Pacers' roster.. Do you honestly think that Spurs will keep him if he went into the stands/ shot someone in clubs while playing for the Spurs?

[baseline bum]

I don't even like to think about it anymore. At the bare minimum, the Spurs would have repeated in 2004 if they kept Jack.

[NO LIMIT ARMY COMMANDER]

Jack gambled that he could be worth more than $10 mil guaranteed in the short run and it took him a year but he was right.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Aggie, it's called give and take.. provided SJax didn't have any head cases when he was at San Antonio.. f
For a Spurs player, he is very volatile, considering that he went into the stands and shot someone in a club..
Do you think he can fit into Spurs clean culture in the long run? He has already been traded off Pacers' roster.. Do you honestly think that Spurs will keep him if he went into the stands/ shot someone in clubs while playing for the Spurs?

If he's in SA with Duncan, Manu, Parker, and Pop surrounding him, he never is a party to anything like the Palace brawl, and he's not firing guns at some club in downtown SA.

When in Rome, do as the Romans do. It applies to Jax. When he was here in SA, he was kept in check. He was on a team in Indy with Jermaine O'Neal, Ron Artest, and Al freakin' Harrington. Come on!

[The Truth #6]

Given the arcanity of the Spurs system, we should have valued the two years he had already spent getting acclimated and reinvested in our "product". Finley only now is getting used to the Spurs system. Hopefully White will pan out because we're running out of time for players to suck when they first get here.

[Kori Ellis]

Man. This was going to be my thread to make.

:)

[Fillmoe]

The type of offense the Spurs run isn't one Jackson excels in. Just look at his production with the Pacers compared to what hes doing on the Warriors.

[timvp]

I still don't understand how Jackson didn't retire as a Spur. If you are into winning championships, you might want to have a proven hard ass shooter who isn't scared to drop threes when the playoff lights are on.

Instead the Spurs have Brent Barry passing it right when he gets it to pretend he isn't actually wide open.

:pctoss

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

The type of offense the Spurs run isn't one Jackson excels in. Just look at his production with the Pacers compared to what hes doing on the Warriors.

Exactly. Under Nellie's system he can chuck threes til his arms fall off and still be in the system.

You can play the what ifs til the cows come home. Maybe the Spurs can't resign Manu if Jax stays. Or if they both stay here Jax winds up in Manu's shadow and shoots him. Or he just gets toxic and the Spurs find themselves exactly where Indiana did. Maybe he becomes a six time all star. I think given enough time he'd have found his way into Pop's dog house and there's few who ever get out of it once they are there.

And I know stats don't tell the whole story about being clutch, but given his shooting % I'm guessing that he's shot his teams into just as many holes as he's shot them out of. 31% in the playoffs for his career from behind the arc.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

The type of offense the Spurs run isn't one Jackson excels in. Just look at his production with the Pacers compared to what hes doing on the Warriors.

So 2003 was a dream?

[timvp]

The type of offense the Spurs run isn't one Jackson excels in. Just look at his production with the Pacers compared to what hes doing on the Warriors.

2003.

Game.

[T Park]

its in the past.

Move on.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Exactly. Under Nellie's system he can chuck threes til his arms fall off and still be in the system.

You can play the what ifs til the cows come home. Maybe the Spurs can't resign Manu if Jax stays. Or if they both stay here Jax winds up in Manu's shadow and shoots him. Or he just gets toxic and the Spurs find themselves exactly where Indiana did. Maybe he becomes a six time all star. I think given enough time he'd have found his way into Pop's dog house and there's few who ever get out of it once they are there.

And I know stats don't tell the whole story about being clutch, but given his shooting % I'm guessing that he's shot his teams into just as many holes as he's shot them out of. 31% in the playoffs for his career from behind the arc.

Yeah, he was definitely a streaky shooter, no doubt about it, but my god did Sjax have balls. he THRIVES to hit those pressure shots, and anytime the clock was winding down he always seemed like he wanted the ball more than TD and Manu combined


Every team needs a player like that.

[Kori Ellis]

People who quote stats in regards to SJax are ridiculous. His playoff worth isn't about stats - it's about having a guy who has the balls to step up and take big shots. A player who isn't afraid to step on a team's throat and put them out of their misery *insert stupid criminal/arrest joke here ha ha* with a big dagger 3. He can also be the small ball lineup PF.

[kris]

I'm not moving on Tpark. Steven Jackson should have been leading the way to us eeking out game one verse the Nuggets instead of starting one of the biggest upsets in sports history tonight.

We need someone with some toughness to go along with our pysch major that out pyches himself and plays powder puff basketball.

[T Park]

The nuggets winning this series wouldnt be one of the biggest upsets in sports history.

Hes not here.

He hasnt been here for 4 seasons now.

Yeah, its time to move on.

[Nbadan]

Told ya back then that letting go of Jack for nothing was a big, big mistake.

[Fillmoe]

you cats are so funny man.... how come i never seen one of these threads when dude was shooting the club up?

[Kori Ellis]

you cats are so funny man.... how come i never seen one of these threads when dude was shooting the club up?

You must have missed them. A big group of Spurs fans (myself included) have been wanting Jack back since he left. I cried when he left the Spurs :lol

[Nbadan]

The Spurs dissed Jack. They tried to low-ball him and then took that contract away about a week later.

[Kori Ellis]

The Spurs dissed Jack. They tried to low-ball him and then took that contract away about a week later.

That's not how it went down. They didn't take any offer back from him. His ass agent didn't even respond to the Spurs offer and went searching elsewhere.

[jaespur21]

i like stephen jax when he was here and was upset when they didnt sign him.....with that bein said

ive continued to wanna see him doin good things on the court and tonight was no exception...watch the championship DVDs he hit big shot after big shot and if he was on this team he would be guarding Carmelo right now....But he isnt sooooooo
with the spurs FO makin so many good decisions you cant say much about this 1 except OOPS

[Nbadan]

That's not how it went down. They didn't take any offer back from him. His ass agent didn't even respond to the Spurs offer and went searching elsewhere.

That's called negotiating. Jack loved SA, he played here for a couple of great years for almost free, but Pop doesn't like offensive minded swing-men. Witness the whole fiasco with Sean Elliott.

[MannyIsGod]

WTF? Are you kidding me? Do all of you not remember who Jack's agent was? Do you not remember hearing from him that he wanted to stay here then his agent screwing him into taking crap for money from the Hawks?

Spin this shit however you want, and ignore the fact that had we kept Jax for waht he wanted there was no way we would have Manu today, but all of you hating on the Spurs for this are rewriting history and rewriting it poorly.

Jax is a hell of a player, but lets not just spew bullshit here.

[Nbadan]

Well, shame on us. Paying Jack for helping SA win a Championship would have been wrong. The dude was making bread crumbs here for two years just to get out of NJ.

[ChumpDumper]

It was brought up, but not emphasized. Keeping Jack would have made it much more difficult to keep Manu. no one else offered Manu a contract because the Spurs had the ability and the will to match any reasonable offer and let everyone know it. I suppose one could argue that we shouldn't have signed Rasho, but then who and how much?

My "what if" is what if we had made Manu's first contract for three years instead of two. That would make either of the Manu-or-Jack or Manu-or-Hedo choices we had to make unecessary.

But ultimately, so what?

[timvp]

I don't buy the case that Jack and Manu couldn't have both fit under the cap. Jack could have been had for a long-term contract that would have fit in the same slot that Barry's contract eventually fit.

[Nbadan]

This conversation has already been played out in too many Balla threads in this forum through the years. It's the philosophical coaching weakness for POP that matters, he doesn't like Balla's like Jack, never has.

[ChumpDumper]

I don't buy the case that Jack and Manu couldn't have both fit under the cap. Jack could have been had for a long-term contract that would have fit in the same slot that Barry's contract eventually fit. Maybe, but would you have been willing to take the chance that Denver or some other team could have made an offer to Manu that that Spurs couldn't have matched?

[SRJ]

If it's fair to bring up Stephen Jackson over his play in one game, I think it's equally fair to bring up Manu's past.

And if the the choice is Jax or Manu, Jax has never reached the heights Ginobili reached in 2005. So in the overall scheme of things, I'd say it worked out better this way.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

I think the broader point here is that our team lacks a player who brings to the table what Jax has - balls, a 3pt shot, decent defence, and decent size/speed for a SF. We've got no mid-sized (6-7 to 6-9) players who fit that bill (Bowen is 6-5 1/2 or 6-6 - when I met him I was taller than he, trust me on this; and Finley was never a great defender). Thus, Melo is going to have a field day. Surprise, surprise, it's that big, defensive 3 man we've been talking about for 2 years, and we still miss him (Bowen is more a defensive 2-guard).

Ugh. Time to rebuild. Get some youth and athleticism, and dump all the old guys off the roster. Can we trade up in this draft for a real talented swing with some size?

[kris]

The nuggets winning this series wouldnt be one of the biggest upsets in sports history.

Hes not here.

He hasnt been here for 4 seasons now.

Yeah, its time to move on.

Was talking about GS winning.

If everybody moved on, there'd be no reason to post on the forum.

SJax was a hardass baller who is exactly what this team needs and he's gone (whatever reason you want to contend) and Spurs aren't getting him back.

I don't care if he was at a strip club at 4am and shot a gun in the air to scare some people, he was a straight up baller and was awesome on the Spurs.

[MannyIsGod]

I think the broader point here is that our team lacks a player who brings to the table what Jax has - balls, a 3pt shot, decent defence, and decent size/speed for a SF. We've got no mid-sized (6-7 to 6-9) players who fit that bill (Bowen is 6-5 1/2 or 6-6 - when I met him I was taller than he, trust me on this; and Finley was never a great defender). Thus, Melo is going to have a field day. Surprise, surprise, it's that big, defensive 3 man we've been talking about for 2 years, and we still miss him (Bowen is more a defensive 2-guard).

Ugh. Time to rebuild. Get some youth and athleticism, and dump all the old guys off the roster. Can we trade up in this draft for a real talented swing with some size?Sorry Matt, but no shit? This is like what, the 34093840938403843098423098430843th thread on the long 3 we don't have?

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Man. This was going to be my thread to make.

:)

:tongue

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

The type of offense the Spurs run isn't one Jackson excels in. Just look at his production with the Pacers compared to what hes doing on the Warriors.

Sincerely, the Spurs 2003 Championship playoff run.

Man, what an ignorant post...

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

you cats are so funny man.... how come i never seen one of these threads when dude was shooting the club up?

Actually a lot of us were posting on here that we were hoping the Spurs would take advantage of Indy's desire to split up the problem children and work out a trade for him...

[ducks]

I think the broader point here is that our team lacks a player who brings to the table what Jax has - balls, a 3pt shot, decent defence, and decent size/speed for a SF. We've got no mid-sized (6-7 to 6-9) players who fit that bill (Bowen is 6-5 1/2 or 6-6 - when I met him I was taller than he, trust me on this; and Finley was never a great defender). Thus, Melo is going to have a field day. Surprise, surprise, it's that big, defensive 3 man we've been talking about for 2 years, and we still miss him (Bowen is more a defensive 2-guard).

Ugh. Time to rebuild. Get some youth and athleticism, and dump all the old guys off the roster. Can we trade up in this draft for a real talented swing with some size?
spurs had a played named manu
nut manu now is not the same player