Spurs vs. Nuggets Game 5 - Grades

[timvp]

Tim Duncan
Duncan came out a little sluggish but picked it up in the second half to help put the final nail in the Nuggets. Duncan shot the ball well and was rebounding very well in traffic. He was just the rock for the Spurs all series and the backbone to anything they did. It was a tough, physical series for Duncan, but he survived it and did a good job of staying clear of the refs.
Grade: B+


Manu Ginobili
Ginobili played like a rhythm player who never got in rhythm. And that's exactly what happened. He picked up two quick fouls, the first of which probably should have been a no-call. It's hard to blame him because he never got into any kind of a flow.
Grade: C-


Tony Parker
Parker had some reckless passes and some ill-advised shots, but his aggressiveness on both ends of the court helped carry the Spurs in this game. He kept attacking the Nuggets and never let them rest. It wasn't a perfect outing, but it was impressive -- especially when you factor in the job he did on Iverson. AI finished 6-for-22 and even then, most of those six makes came against Bowen. Parker also deserves some credit for getting Finley going. Five of Finley's baskets were off of Parker's passes -- including the first two threes.
Grade: A-


Bruce Bowen
Bowen had a very good defensive showing. He switched seamlessly between AI and Anthony and had success against both of them. He played outstanding defense in the second half and helped the Spurs run away with the win. The series was just another example of why Bowen is one of the best defenders of this generation.
Grade: B+


Francisco Elson
This was by far Elson's best game. It was the first time that he looked comfortable on the defensive end of the court. His rotations were really good and everything he did had a crispness about it that wasn't there the first four games of the series. His stats don't jump off the page, but I thought it was a huge improvement from his first four outings.
Grade: A-


Michael Finley
Finley wants that championship ring. Burying 8-of-9 three-pointers in a closeout game will help him get that ring. Without Finley, the Spurs could have been in for a long night. His outside shooting was been a big asset all series. Lost in his barrage of threes was his defensive effort. He played great on that end of the court.
Grade: A+


Brent Barry
Barry didn't get many minutes but he again looked ready to come in and play playoff basketball. He hit a big three in the first half, which can hopefully help his confidence going into the upcoming series.
Grade: B


Fabricio Oberto
Oberto was the quiet assassin for the Spurs this series. He was a huge boost off the bench. On the series he rebounded well, passed the ball well, made the shots he took and just overall played a very efficient five games. In this game, it was more of the same. Job well done so far in the playoffs by Oberto.
Grade: A-


Robert Horry
Even though Horry didn't have a great outing, he still hit a gigantic three to start off the fourth quarter and followed it with a dunk that put the Spurs up by nine. After that, the Nuggets finally started to ease up. Overall, it was a fantastic series by Horry, giving the Spurs hope that their ol' wily veteran has one more playoff run in him.
Grade: B+


Jacque Vaughn
Four points, three assists, one steal and zero turnovers is the type of line you want to see out of your backup point guard. Vaughn also had a very good night on the defensive end of the court. As the series went on, Vaughn seemed to get more and more comfortable with the Spurs style of play in the playoffs. Good series overall from Vaughn.
Grade: B+


Pop
By out-coaching George Karl pretty handily, Pop helped this series end as abruptly as it did. The Spurs defense seemed to guard AI and Carmelo better and better, which no doubt has a lot to do with Pop. Pop also must have done something right in half time, because the Spurs came out like a totally different team after intermission. Props on a job well done by Pop.
Grade: A-

[T Park]

agree 100% with Elson.

His traps and rotations were superb, maybe the best of the season.

In the 3rd he also came out, challenged shots and grabbed some boards from Camby.

Against Phoenix, he will be in his element, and I'm expecting him to take some minutes from Fab.

[Admidave50]

Waiting for you grades, will you do one for the overall series against the Nuggets?

Keep them coming :)

[FromWayDowntown]

I think even C- for Ginobili tonight might be a bit generous. He never got in the flow, but he also made some bad decisions that didn't help his effort to get into the flow. He seems to be over-dribbling at times and I thought he hoisted a couple of ill-advised shots. He just seemed to be pressing when he got chances and I thought he generally hurt more than he helped tonight.

[T Park]

Ginobili had one of the worst games I've seen him have in a very very long time.

[TampaDude]

Ginobili had one of the worst games I've seen him have in a very very long time.

Ditto...

[DannyT]

duncan had some nice finishes and not goin weak on the offensive end

[ducks]

this game suprised me
I thought manu would go off in second half
this is one of his worse ever playoff games

[boutons_]

Manu been scary bad.

He's gotta find his game.

[aaronstampler]

As badly as he played, he only played 17 minutes, so Pop tried to minimize the damage as best as he could.

[aaronstampler]

One mistake Pop made in an otherwise well coached game was that Parker-Finley-Bowen-Horry-Oberto line-up in the end of the 2nd quarter.

Tony, with clothes on: 33 minutes, +19.
Tony, bareass nekkid: 3 minutes, -8

[E20]

Ginobili did play amazingly bad.

Timvp, Beno saw some time at the end. What do you give him?

[timvp]

Perhaps Manu should have been graded a little harsher, but I gave him a break because he wasn't needed in the fourth quarter -- where he can oftentimes turn a D game into a B or A game.

Manu needs to come out ready to roll against the Suns. His offense is going to be a huge key in that series.

[Marcus Bryant]

Beno saw some time at the end. What do you give him?

E for effort?

[timvp]

Ginobili did play amazingly bad.

Timvp, Beno saw some time at the end. What do you give him?

Beno's pass to the ref at the end of the game showed his outstanding court vision hasn't left him even though he hasn't played much of late.

:hat

[aaronstampler]

Perhaps Manu should have been graded a little harsher, but I gave him a break because he wasn't needed in the fourth quarter -- where he can oftentimes turn a D game into a B or A game.

Manu needs to come out ready to roll against the Suns. His offense is going to be a huge key in that series.


It'll be interesting how they guard him. He'll probably see a lot of Raja Bell (torched him in Phoenix but struggled against him in SA), but maybe every once in a while they might throw Marion at him instead.

If LB is ever on him, Manu has to go right at him.

I think overall he has to go to the basket a lot stronger against Phoenix because they don't have the shotblockers that Denver does.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

timvp, I wanna hear your thoughts on Oberto real quick

you always said before the playoffs that he was going to be crucial for the Spurs and his big game experience seems to be paying off....so do you think Oberto can keep this up as he seems to fare well against the Suns.


i have to say, him, finley, and the resurgence of horry has been a very pleasant surprise.

[T Park]

If LB is ever on him, Manu has to go right at him

Hell, he would'nt take Steve Blake to the hole, let alone L friggen B.

Ginobili from minute one vs Phoenix, needs to get the ball, penetrate and just dominate the matchups.

Marion can defend him decently, but, BUT, Bell can sometimes guard him, but some screen and rolls will change and help that immensly.

[PM5K]

TimVP A+

[timvp]

timvp, I wanna hear your thoughts on Oberto real quick

you always said before the playoffs that he was going to be crucial for the Spurs and his big game experience seems to be paying off....so do you think Oberto can keep this up as he seems to fare well against the Suns.


i have to say, him, finley, and the resurgence of horry has been a very pleasant surprise.

It depends how the Suns decide to play. If they go small and put Marion at PF and Amare at C, the Spurs are going to match by going small. If Kurt Thomas sees time alongside Amare, that's when Oberto will come in handy.

But seeing how the Suns have been playing and knowing that D'Antoni will try to keep Horry off the court as much as possible, the Suns will probably go small. If that's the case, the X-Factor for the series will switch from Oberto to Brent Barry.

Either way, Oberto has earned some playing time. When Duncan rests, Oberto right now looks like the best option to replace him as the big in a small ball lineup.

If Pop wants to get a little risky, he might see if Oberto, Horry and Elson can buy time on Diaw.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

what i hope manu does, (though he was starting at the time) was immediately when the spurs won the jumpball, Manu would get a dunkw ithin 5 seconds to start virtually every game

[aaronstampler]

Hell, he would'nt take Steve Blake to the hole, let alone L friggen B.

Ginobili from minute one vs Phoenix, needs to get the ball, penetrate and just dominate the matchups.

Marion can defend him decently, but, BUT, Bell can sometimes guard him, but some screen and rolls will change and help that immensly.


It wasn't about Blake, TPark, it was about who was waiting behind Blake. Karl made it pretty clear their whole defensive focus was to not allow Manu room to penetrate.

[T Park]

If Pop wants to get a little risky, he might see if Oberto, Horry and Elson can buy time on Diaw.

Elson could guard him.

Oberto, hes too slow to stay in front.

Horry Also.

Might have to play zone alot, so that you CAN keep Horry in there.


Small ball opponents are gonna be gritting their teeth for the next couple weeks.

[T Park]

It wasn't about Blake, TPark, it was about who was waiting behind Blake

Yeah that Eduardo Najera is an intimidating interior defender no question :lol

[aaronstampler]

I can't believe that of all Spurs, the guy to break Manu's streak of six straight playoff series as the team's leader in +/- was broken by his countryman. Your final tally..

Oberto +24
Duncan +19
Finley +19
Parker +15
Barry +14
Ginobili +13
Horry +12
Bowen +6
Vaughn +6
Elson -9

[aaronstampler]

Yeah that Eduardo Najera is an intimidating interior defender no question :lol

Like seriously, why do you always have to be a dick? You can't just enjoy the win without piling on a player for two hours afterward?

[T Park]

Elson being a -9 is such a misnomer, its horrible.

[T Park]

Like seriously, why do you always have to be a dick? You can't just enjoy the win without piling on a player for two hours afterward


How am I being a dick?

Im just being honest.

Ginobili was pathetic, and deserves to be ripped for it.

It is a win, but if Ginobili brings that unagressiveness against Phoenix, this team is toast.

[aaronstampler]

Well it was -17 before today.

[aaronstampler]

How am I being a dick?

Im just being honest.

Ginobili was pathetic, and deserves to be ripped for it.

It is a win, but if Ginobili brings that unagressiveness against Phoenix, this team is toast.

He was bad today. But don't act like he was terrible the whole series.

[ducks]

How am I being a dick?

Im just being honest.

Ginobili was pathetic, and deserves to be ripped for it.

It is a win, but if Ginobili brings that unagressiveness against Phoenix, this team is toast.
you posted spurs were going back to denver land in game thread also

spurs can beat suns with a bad game by manu and a great game by everyone else
manu is key though
without him the spurs would have to have a guy shot 8-9 from downtown to win

[aaronstampler]

Whatever. TPark was the one shitting his pants both before the series and after Game 1 when most people with some common sense and faith in the team told him it'd be over in 5.

[DarrinS]

You give Elson too much credit. Yes, this was his best game, but he couldn't possibly have regressed any further.


I'm very impressed by Oberto. He just plays extremely smart basketball.


Props to Finley on his shooting and his defense.


Parker and Tim played steady. Manu looked a bit sluggish tonight.


EDIT> Not that you give a crap, but I enjoy reading these posts after each game.

[gilmor]

As always, TiMVP grades were top-notch!!

I noticed how TiMVP is ignoring Aaron.. muahahhaa.. cos Aaron is worth SHITs..

TPark, you should take the cue and ignore Aaron..

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Most of the grades were pretty on. (I don't know about Elson's .)

And Timvp got it right, Manu's two fouls took him out of rhythm very early.

Anyway, the Spurs did their job for these big games. I think the second round will be a whole other organism entirely. Can't wait for Sunday.

Oberto's definitely a big improvement from last year's 5 spot centers playing beside Timmy. He's been showing the little things he's doesfor the Argentine NT.

[T Park]

Most of the grades were pretty on. (I don't know about Elson's .)

Elson was great tonight.

Stats don't tell the story.

His defense, his timely bucket, along with rebounding well in that third quarter, sealed this as his best game of the series.

[Kevin Blackistone]

Hell, he would'nt take Steve Blake to the hole, let alone L friggen B.

Ginobili from minute one vs Phoenix, needs to get the ball, penetrate and just dominate the matchups.

Marion can defend him decently, but, BUT, Bell can sometimes guard him, but some screen and rolls will change and help that immensly.

Unless the Suns come up with a shotblocker like Camby and big bodies to knock the shit out of you like Nene and even Anthony, Manu should fare much better. I thought Manu played very well this series (sans tonight) considering Karl was gearing his D to stop him from the get-go. If anything, Manu forced way too much tonight after letting the game come to him in game 4. It was the Manu factor that helped Finley smoke the Nuggets since Karl's D being geared to stop Manu and TP penetration gave Finley target practice.

[Kevin Blackistone]

As always, TiMVP grades were top-notch!!

I noticed how TiMVP is ignoring Aaron.. muahahhaa.. cos Aaron is worth SHITs..

TPark, you should take the cue and ignore Aaron..

I wonder what forum you've been reading. Aaronstampler has some good takes mixed in with some Manu homerism and somewhat outlandish ideas, but TPark is basically a Timvp yes-man. If you want to know what TPark thinks, just ask Timvp.

[T Park]

ah kevin, so if I agree with TIMVP and we have the same ideas on the game, that makes me a yes man.

Classic. When one assumes....

SOME manu homerism from aaron? :lmao

[T Park]

Unless the Suns come up with a shotblocker like Camby and big bodies to knock the shit out of you like Nene and even Anthony, Manu should fare much better. I thought Manu played very well this series (sans tonight) considering Karl was gearing his D to stop him from the get-go. If anything, Manu forced way too much tonight after letting the game come to him in game 4. It was the Manu factor that helped Finley smoke the Nuggets since Karl's D being geared to stop Manu and TP penetration gave Finley target practice.


Well Phoenix will clog the paint and force Manu to shoot outside.

They have better defenders than in 05, Nash has improved defensively, Bell can give Manu fits to hell.


Parker making whoever guards him work, and Ginobili being agressive in going to the hole will be huge.

[jman3000]

t park seemed to be very knowledgeable in person when it came to basketball.

[Kevin Blackistone]

ah kevin, so if I agree with TIMVP and we have the same ideas on the game, that makes me a yes man.

Classic. When one assumes....

SOME manu homerism from aaron? :lmao

I'm not talking about this thread alone, it's a general consensus from what I gather from reading your posts for a while now. Of course, it's my opinion, and you don't have to let it get to you.

[Kevin Blackistone]

Well Phoenix will clog the paint and force Manu to shoot outside.

They have better defenders than in 05, Nash has improved defensively, Bell can give Manu fits to hell.


Parker making whoever guards him work, and Ginobili being agressive in going to the hole will be huge.

Who is going to be the rover on Phoenix's squad that erases shots like Camby? Stoudemire is a decent weak side defender, but I doubt he'll get to Manu's shots nearly as effectively as Camby. Phoenix doesn't have the physicality to shut down the paint and Manu + TP will have the opportunity to own the paint if they are aggressive. That opportunity wasn't there against the Nuggets, so the Spurs attacked from an inside-out standpoint and left a lot of the iso's and high p&r on the shelf.

[Kevin Blackistone]

t park seemed to be very knowledgeable in person when it came to basketball.

Are you sure you weren't too busy hooking it up with the women of Spurstalk and posing for pictures to know the difference?


:p: Sorry, just kidding.

[Admidave50]

I thought Manu played very well this series (sans tonight)

Funny how American people really like to use French words in their sentences.
FYI, "sans" means "without" and you cannot use in such a way.
You should use "à part" or "excepté" but I guess it's less cool.. :toast

[Kori Ellis]

I'm so freakin' tired of the TPark and whoever else vs Aaron Stampler show.

Just STFU already. If you can't talk on topic, zip it.

[RogerIsEatingASandwich]

The grades were pretty accurate. Hopefully Manu will step it up, he was pretty bad for Round 1.

[Kori Ellis]

The grades were pretty accurate. Hopefully Manu will step it up, he was pretty bad for Round 1.

Manu owns the Suns. I'm sure we'll see a couple 30+ point games.

Go Manu!

[Kevin Blackistone]

I'm so freakin' tired of the TPark and whoever else vs Aaron Stampler show.

Just STFU already. If you can't talk on topic, zip it.

Sorry, didn't mean anything malicious about it, just my general observation. But, your playground, your rules...

[Kori Ellis]

Sorry, didn't mean anything malicious about it, just my general observation. But, your playground, your rules...

Oh, I wasn't talking to you. I was talking to TPark and aaron. :lol

[jman3000]

for all the crap vaughn gets about not having a jumper... he's shown a real natch for hitting the open 19-20 footer. he needs a second to set it up... but it's pretty much money at this point.


i know the whole claxton/vaughn comparison has been tossed around... but it really does remind me of that 18 foot jump shot that speedy had a knack for hitting.

[RogerIsEatingASandwich]

Also, if TP can keep up the fantastic D that would be awesome. He's probably been the Spurs' best defender so far, his D on AI was amazing.

[Kevin Blackistone]

Oh, I wasn't talking to you. I was talking to TPark and aaron. :lol
:lol cool.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Vaughn has been solid. I really like this team right now.

[Kevin Blackistone]

Funny how American people really like to use French words in their sentences.
FYI, "sans" means "without" and you cannot use in such a way.
You should use "à part" or "excepté" but I guess it's less cool.. :toast

Thanks for the information. I guess growing up in Texas I haven't been ingrained with the correct use of the French language, but it's interesting to know that I've been incorrectly using that term (although very rarely) for a while. :toast

[MaNuMaNiAc]

I have to say, I'm "eating crow" on what I said about Finley prior to this game. Dude shut me up BIG TIME! it was embarassing :lol I have seen the light though. Finley is the man now in my eyes! 8-9 threes? unreal

[MaNuMaNiAc]

I wonder what forum you've been reading. Aaronstampler has some good takes mixed in with some Manu homerism and somewhat outlandish ideas, but TPark is basically a Timvp yes-man. If you want to know what TPark thinks, just ask Timvp.that is the general consensus yes

[FromWayDowntown]

I don't think there's much chance that we'll see Phoenix employing Denver's defensive strategies against the Spurs.

For one thing, they don't have the personnel to do it as well as Denver did -- they don't have a Nene to bang on Duncan for 4 quarters and, as others have noted, there isn't an eraser like Camby at the back. Parker and other Spurs were frequently deterred on drives in Round one, I think, because they knew that Camby was back there and that it would take something pretty special to get a shot on the rim. In Game 5, Parker was really trying to just get a shot up when he drove and at least twice, he managed only to hit the bottom of the rim -- I'm not sure I'd seen him do that at all during the regular season. Tony in particular should be able to get into the paint against Phoenix, and I don't think he'll meet nearly as much resistance in Round 2 as he did in Round 1.

More than the personnel issue is the philosophical issue. Phoenix is an improved defensive team over the past couple of seasons, but they still don't seem to want to really mix it up with anyone in the paint. If Phoenix decides, at this point, to become a Nuggets-like defense, the Spurs will have already won in part, because Phoenix will have accepted the Spurs desire to dictate tempo and style.

[smeagol]

Whatever. TPark was the one shitting his pants both before the series and after Game 1 when most people with some common sense and faith in the team told him it'd be over in 5.

Seriously, that is the fist time Tpark does that :smokin

[ducks]

Manu owns the Suns. I'm sure we'll see a couple 30+ point games.

Go Manu!


I hope so I also thought he owned the nuggets