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View Full Version : My Crazy Game 5 Idea.



aaronstampler
05-16-2007, 03:30 AM
We've always defended ourselves as the classy team, the team above thuggish tactics, trash talking, excessive taunting, and whining about the refs after the game. No this reputation is in serious jeopardy, perhaps forever, because of one stupid foul by Horry and the drama that followed.

So if our classy reputation means anything, let's really shove it up everyone's ass and walk the walk like we talk to talk.

LET'S SIT TIMMY TOMORROW.

Why not? Seriously, why the fuck not? It's not an elimination game. We still have one loss to play with. We don't even have to make it like an official protest of the Stu Jackson decision. We can just say he had a sore ankle or something, even though the true reason will be obvious to everyone.

The NBA wants a ridiculous, small ball game? Let's give it to them. Their star big is out, our star big is out. Their 3rd best big is out? Our 3rd best big is out. Fair game, fair fight. Let's just play midget ball for 48 mins.

It would shut up every critic, it would shut up their taunting fans, it would blow away the broadcasters. No matter what they say about us, they can't can't call us cheaters and they can't say we're not classy. It would send a message to the world and to the Suns that we didn't want the Amare/Diaw suspensions to happen. It wasn't our idea.

You don't think all of the Suns momentum would be sucked right out of that building? Nobody would know what to think. It would totally fuck with the Suns minds and all their intensity and focus would be gone in a flash. Whatever desire the refs might have had to screw us would be forgetten and they'd be impressived with our chutzpah and our principles.

I don't know if we'd win or lose, but either way we'd make our point.

And even if we lost, we'd kick the holy shit out of them in Games 6 and 7 because the mental edge would be ours.

That's just my crazy idea. Go ahead and blast me if you want. I think it'd be the only way to untaint the series and the playoffs as a whole. And our integrity wouldn't be compromised.

ChumpDumper
05-16-2007, 03:33 AM
The only fair thing to do is to wait for them to start a fight and then have Duncan and Finley rush the court.

We're waiting.

MaNuMaNiAc
05-16-2007, 03:33 AM
has to be the dumbest idea in the history of ideas! the whole image thing is a fans thing! not important! what matters is the championship, and you take advantage of whatever comes your way! Give me a break!

Tigole Bitties
05-16-2007, 03:35 AM
Ricola.... Ridiculous

gtownspur
05-16-2007, 03:37 AM
I'm glad i'm republican and not an appeaser.

ZStomp
05-16-2007, 03:40 AM
Worst idea fucken ever.

AnkleBreaker21
05-16-2007, 03:42 AM
what kinda weed you smokin and where can i get some:lmao:lmao

dav4463
05-16-2007, 03:43 AM
I'm glad i'm republican and not an appeaser.

me too!

Strike
05-16-2007, 03:44 AM
Fucking retarded idea.

mikekim
05-16-2007, 03:45 AM
I think... it would be cool and interesting for a good 2 minutes...

Then we'll get crushed. And no mental edge for Game 6 because our self-esteem would hit an all-time low for being called "dirty" and "incredibly stupid."

Sorry...I didn't really WANT to blast you...if that's worth anything. But you did give me the okay.

gtownspur
05-16-2007, 03:49 AM
We've always defended ourselves as the classy team, the team above thuggish tactics, trash talking, excessive taunting, and whining about the refs after the game. No this reputation is in serious jeopardy, perhaps forever, because of one stupid foul by Horry and the drama that followed.

So if our classy reputation means anything, let's really shove it up everyone's ass and walk the walk like we talk to talk.

LET'S SIT TIMMY TOMORROW.

Why not? Seriously, why the fuck not? It's not an elimination game. We still have one loss to play with. We don't even have to make it like an official protest of the Stu Jackson decision. We can just say he had a sore ankle or something, even though the true reason will be obvious to everyone.

The NBA wants a ridiculous, small ball game? Let's give it to them. Their star big is out, our star big is out. Their 3rd best big is out? Our 3rd best big is out. Fair game, fair fight. Let's just play midget ball for 48 mins.

It would shut up every critic, it would shut up their taunting fans, it would blow away the broadcasters. No matter what they say about us, they can't can't call us cheaters and they can't say we're not classy. It would send a message to the world and to the Suns that we didn't want the Amare/Diaw suspensions to happen. It wasn't our idea.

You don't think all of the Suns momentum would be sucked right out of that building? Nobody would know what to think. It would totally fuck with the Suns minds and all their intensity and focus would be gone in a flash. Whatever desire the refs might have had to screw us would be forgetten and they'd be impressived with our chutzpah and our principles.

I don't know if we'd win or lose, but either way we'd make our point.

And even if we lost, we'd kick the holy shit out of them in Games 6 and 7 because the mental edge would be ours.

That's just my crazy idea. Go ahead and blast me if you want. I think it'd be the only way to untaint the series and the playoffs as a whole. And our integrity wouldn't be compromised.



Damn Liberals.

L.I.T
05-16-2007, 03:51 AM
Then Manu could be the hero! A master-stroke of genius.

timvp
05-16-2007, 03:53 AM
:td

The Spurs didn't decide the suspensions. Their job is to play the game.

saporvida
05-16-2007, 03:54 AM
has to be the dumbest idea in the history of ideas! the whole image thing is a fans thing! not important! what matters is the championship, and you take advantage of whatever comes your way! Give me a break!

i totally agree... don't they(players & coaches alike) get nba rulebooks? it's like the stupid kid wearing his band shirt to a school that has a dress policy; wear that shit to school and get sent home! so in good fashion, bring yo ass in the vicinity of the altercation and we gonna blast ya at home!

ok not a good analogy but it'll work.

gtownspur
05-16-2007, 03:55 AM
i've got any even better idea.


We should put ankle weights on Manu and when we shoot free throws, we should use a medicine ball.

aaronstampler
05-16-2007, 03:56 AM
I thought the idea would be universally rejected, but in an odd way LJ, I thought you might be the one person on spurstalk to embrace it, just because you seem to be in the minority of people, along with me, who seem to give a shit about the ethics and principles and sportsmanship aspects of the spurs, not just the wins and losses. Those things matter too, at least they matter to me. I don't want them compromised in the name of winning games. Once we go down that slippery slope, we'll be right back to signing the Rodman's and Artests' of the world.

timvp
05-16-2007, 03:56 AM
You are an idiot! The Spurs are all about ignoring their critics. It is not the Spurs fault that the Suns broke the rules!!!

About 12 posters beat you.

saporvida
05-16-2007, 03:57 AM
ps: 4 trophies are better then some dumb reputation we are trying to uphold as fans... we dont play the game for millions so leave it up to the players to decide whether or not they have a rep to keep. im sure the players are more interested in that trophy then their rep on the court.

aaronstampler
05-16-2007, 03:57 AM
i've got any even better idea.


We should put ankle weights on Manu and when we shoot free throws, we should use a medicine ball.


So Manu wasn't already playing with ankle weights on?

Ba dum bump. There, y'all fucking happy?

timvp
05-16-2007, 03:58 AM
I thought the idea would be universally rejected, but in an odd way LJ, I thought you might be the one person on spurstalk to embrace it, just because you seem to be in the minority of people, along with me, who seem to give a shit about the ethics and principles and sportsmanship aspects of the spurs, not just the wins and losses. Those things matter too, at least they matter to me. I don't want them compromised in the name of winning games. Once we go down that slippery slope, we'll be right back to signing the Rodman's and Artests' of the world.

If it were up to the Spurs, Amare and Diaw wouldn't be suspended. If this situation makes anyone look bad, it's the NBA. The Spurs had no control over the disciplinary aspect.

Yeah it sucks, but oh well. If the roles were reversed, I wouldn't want the Suns to sit Steve Nash.

saporvida
05-16-2007, 03:58 AM
I thought the idea would be universally rejected, but in an odd way LJ, I thought you might be the one person on spurstalk to embrace it, just because you seem to be in the minority of people, along with me, who seem to give a shit about the ethics and principles and sportsmanship aspects of the spurs, not just the wins and losses. Those things matter too, at least they matter to me. I don't want them compromised in the name of winning games. Once we go down that slippery slope, we'll be right back to signing the Rodman's and Artests' of the world.


shit... id take rodman back any day, well not now cause he's old.

gtownspur
05-16-2007, 03:59 AM
I thought the idea would be universally rejected, but in an odd way LJ, I thought you might be the one person on spurstalk to embrace it, just because you seem to be in the minority of people, along with me, who seem to give a shit about the ethics and principles and sportsmanship aspects of the spurs, not just the wins and losses. Those things matter too, at least they matter to me. I don't want them compromised in the name of winning games. Once we go down that slippery slope, we'll be right back to signing the Rodman's and Artests' of the world.


Next thing you know we'll be calling the other players "dirty" and bitching for refs approval at public interviews, flopping and hacking and selling hard fouls, as well as signing extremeley stupid power fowards.

ATXSPUR
05-16-2007, 05:28 AM
Easy there. You wouldnt want to give the impression of a drama queen.

Shred
05-16-2007, 06:25 AM
**

VinnyTestesVerde
05-16-2007, 07:37 AM
interesting idea but not worth the risk. it would be a psychological blow to beat the suns sans timmy, but we'd look pretty stupid if we ended up losing the series by not taking advantage of a situation that is in our favor.

DarrinS
05-16-2007, 07:51 AM
Their small ballers would kick our small ballers azz, BIG TIME.

Jimcs50
05-16-2007, 08:02 AM
Better yet, start TD, but tell the Suns that TD will not use the bank shot all night.

:)

wildbill2u
05-16-2007, 08:16 AM
We've always defended ourselves as the classy team, the team above thuggish tactics, trash talking, excessive taunting, and whining about the refs after the game. No this reputation is in serious jeopardy, perhaps forever, because of one stupid foul by Horry and the drama that followed...

I think it'd be the only way to untaint the series and the playoffs as a whole. And our integrity wouldn't be compromised.
Obviously you've not been a Spurs fan long enough to know about the "Bruise Brothers" nor about Detroit's rep when winning their first championships.

All history aside, I'll leave the flaming of you to others. You don't make moral stances in sports--to steal a phrase, "There's no crying in basketball."

Kevin Blackistone
05-16-2007, 08:35 AM
Noble idea, but that would just be letting the Suns off the hook for Stoudemire and Diaw's stupidity. They knew the rule and still fucked up and fucked their team over. They deserve to sit.


Is it at the point now where we are blaming the league for expecting two ADULTS who are making millions of dollars to actually follow the rules of the game, rules that have been around long before either of them were in the league? It's not the league's fault and the league shouldn't look bad. Stoudemire and Diaw should be CHASTISED for being idiots.

SAGambler
05-16-2007, 08:38 AM
I'm glad i'm republican and not an appeaser.

Maybe we shouldn't keep score in game five and just call it a draw. That way no one gets their feelings hurt. And we could have a game 8......

VaSpursFan
05-16-2007, 08:40 AM
this is beyond ridiculous. 2 dimwits that know the rules leave the bench and we want to reward that by sitting timmy...hell no. i hope we kick the shit out of them. this is the fucking playoffs...for all intents and purposes its a war. what general in their right mind would withhold troops because he has an advantage over the other side???

let's get back to thinking logically here.

SAGambler
05-16-2007, 08:44 AM
Better yet... Start Vaughn, Ely, Butler, Red Rocket, and Barry.

In the first five minutes have each one start a fight with their man until all ten are ejected from the game...

Suns would then have to forfeit since they wouldn't have any players left to play.

Hell, no I don't "feel sorry" for the Suns.

Amare and Diaw know the rules.

They broke the rules.

Now they pay.

Tough shit!!!!!!!!!!

But at least give some props to Diaw for not trying to lie his way out of it.

Can't say the same for "Black Jesus"......

reddog 99
05-16-2007, 09:05 AM
I thought the idea would be universally rejected, but in an odd way LJ, I thought you might be the one person on spurstalk to embrace it, just because you seem to be in the minority of people, along with me, who seem to give a shit about the ethics and principles and sportsmanship aspects of the spurs, not just the wins and losses. Those things matter too, at least they matter to me. I don't want them compromised in the name of winning games. Once we go down that slippery slope, we'll be right back to signing the Rodman's and Artests' of the world.

Have you not watched the whole series? Why do you focus on ten seconds of a single game. This series is a battle of many victories and defeats not one isolated incident. Both teams have been hosed and will probably get some more before its over. Its who is left standing after the last shot.

ducks
05-16-2007, 09:08 AM
aaronstampler do you want to sit duncan so manu can score more?

CosmicCowboy
05-16-2007, 09:12 AM
shit... id take rodman back any day, well not now cause he's old.

oh really?

You don't remember him going MIA in the playoffs and finally showing up in Vegas with Madonna?

Fuck Dennis Rodman.

cherylsteele
05-16-2007, 10:08 AM
Damn Liberals.
You can call me a liberal if you want but, I think it is a stupid idea too.

Spider TX
05-16-2007, 10:14 AM
has to be the dumbest idea in the history of ideas! the whole image thing is a fans thing! not important! what matters is the championship, and you take advantage of whatever comes your way! Give me a break!

No, the dumbest idea came from a Suns fan on our board saying they should just forfeit game 5 because if they don't and run themselves to death, they won't have anything left for a game 6 or 7. So forfeiting would help them win game 6 and 7. These 2 ideas rical each other in stupidity.

Stargazer
05-16-2007, 10:52 AM
This would have been a great idea. See my posts on the "keys to game 5" thread for the same suggestion.

Unfortunately, the reaction of Spurs fans on this board says it all: "If we do that, we're afraid we'll lose the game." And that, my friends, is why any Spurs victory will be forever tainted.

VaSpursFan
05-16-2007, 10:57 AM
This would have been a great idea. See my posts on the "keys to game 5" thread for the same suggestion.

Unfortunately, the reaction of Spurs fans on this board says it all: "If we do that, we're afraid we'll lose the game." And that, my friends, is why any Spurs victory will be forever tainted.

there will be no taint if we win...if those dimwits stayed on the bench, it wouldn't have been and issue. no one from the spurs bench got up...

MaNuMaNiAc
05-16-2007, 11:29 AM
This would have been a great idea. See my posts on the "keys to game 5" thread for the same suggestion.

Unfortunately, the reaction of Spurs fans on this board says it all: "If we do that, we're afraid we'll lose the game." And that, my friends, is why any Spurs victory will be forever tainted.aah so because your superstar is a dumbass, we should purposely bench ours to make you people feel better about the fact you're going to lose either way? You are pathetic.

DarrinS
05-16-2007, 11:30 AM
How about they just decide game 5 with a rock,paper,scissors tournament?

nkdlunch
05-16-2007, 11:32 AM
Better yet, start TD, but tell the Suns that TD will not use the bank shot all night.

:)

play Timmy with a blindfold

nkdlunch
05-16-2007, 11:32 AM
lol i had a similar idea but it was sitting manu and finley or something.


their 2nd and 4th best players and ours.

anywho, game 5

we would just need to sit Parker down. Horry is already sitting 2 games.

ChumpDumper
05-16-2007, 11:34 AM
This would have been a great idea. See my posts on the "keys to game 5" thread for the same suggestion.

Unfortunately, the reaction of Spurs fans on this board says it all: "If we do that, we're afraid we'll lose the game." And that, my friends, is why any Spurs victory will be forever tainted.The only reason you are suggesting it in the first place is because you are afraid the Suns will lose the game.

DarrinS
05-16-2007, 11:35 AM
To really level the playing field, we could sit Jacques Vaughn.

T Park
05-16-2007, 11:56 AM
along with me, who seem to give a shit about the ethics and principles and sportsmanship aspects of the spurs, not just the wins and losses

So if the Spurs win the game, its not ethical and whatever?

Christ go away.

GrandeDavid
05-16-2007, 12:00 PM
We've always defended ourselves as the classy team, the team above thuggish tactics, trash talking, excessive taunting, and whining about the refs after the game. No this reputation is in serious jeopardy, perhaps forever, because of one stupid foul by Horry and the drama that followed.

So if our classy reputation means anything, let's really shove it up everyone's ass and walk the walk like we talk to talk.

LET'S SIT TIMMY TOMORROW.

Why not? Seriously, why the fuck not? It's not an elimination game. We still have one loss to play with. We don't even have to make it like an official protest of the Stu Jackson decision. We can just say he had a sore ankle or something, even though the true reason will be obvious to everyone.

The NBA wants a ridiculous, small ball game? Let's give it to them. Their star big is out, our star big is out. Their 3rd best big is out? Our 3rd best big is out. Fair game, fair fight. Let's just play midget ball for 48 mins.

It would shut up every critic, it would shut up their taunting fans, it would blow away the broadcasters. No matter what they say about us, they can't can't call us cheaters and they can't say we're not classy. It would send a message to the world and to the Suns that we didn't want the Amare/Diaw suspensions to happen. It wasn't our idea.

You don't think all of the Suns momentum would be sucked right out of that building? Nobody would know what to think. It would totally fuck with the Suns minds and all their intensity and focus would be gone in a flash. Whatever desire the refs might have had to screw us would be forgetten and they'd be impressived with our chutzpah and our principles.

I don't know if we'd win or lose, but either way we'd make our point.

And even if we lost, we'd kick the holy shit out of them in Games 6 and 7 because the mental edge would be ours.

That's just my crazy idea. Go ahead and blast me if you want. I think it'd be the only way to untaint the series and the playoffs as a whole. And our integrity wouldn't be compromised.

Screw the soft Suns. After the pathetic, sissy acts of Sarver, D'Antoni and Stoudemire, not to mention Bell's dirty play, the flipping of Parker, the clawing of Ginobili and the slamming of Elson, the Suns deserve nothing but having their asses kicked tonight and on Friday, and their dream of their 1st championship anihilated.

duncan228
05-16-2007, 12:02 PM
I thought it would have calmed down here by this morning. It just gets worse.

If the situation were reversed and it was Duncan out does any one think for a minute that the Suns wouldn't run with it? And the Suns fans too?

It is what it is. It's done. The league did it, the Spurs didn't. Horry did what he did, Amare and Diaw did what they did.

Time to move on.
Get game 5.
I believe.

Stargazer
05-16-2007, 12:04 PM
Am I afraid the Suns will lose the game? Not really. They will probably lose (though they just might win), but it won't bother me in the least because everyone knows that they aren't playing at full strength. The Spurs won't get any boost out of a win.

As for Manumaniac's comment, if you're really so sure that the Suns would "lose either way," then why is everyone on this board afraid to sit Duncan? Because you're not sure at all. You lost Game 4 at home, and you know beating the Suns at full strength on the road would have been tough.

And why does it matter whether Horry or Amare or Stern is at fault for the suspensions? I guess I understand that you've convinced yourself that the suspensions were fair or correct. Fine. But that still doesn't change the fact that you haven't beaten the Suns at full strength.

I'll admit it -- I watched every minute of every Suns game this season because I though this might be the year, and I'm bitterly disappointed that it has come to this. If the Suns lost fair and square, I could live with that. At least I would have the resolution of knowing that they just weren't good enough this year to win it all. But to have it taken away by something not relevant to the game . . . . The closest analogy I can think of is losing a season to a labor strike. It makes you realize that the whole season was a farce.

In truth, I feel sorry for Spurs fans as well, for same reason. Even if you win, you too will never have the resolution of knowing whether or not the Spurs were good enough this year to win it all.

Unless you sit Duncan, that is. Do that, and win, and you'll know.

GrandeDavid
05-16-2007, 12:05 PM
**

(air)

That's the only thing in your team's trophy cabinet and up where championship banners will never hang in your team's arena.

SpursFanFirst
05-16-2007, 12:08 PM
I disagree. Robert, Amare, and Boris all broke the rules, and now they're being punished.
Why should the players (who abided by the rules) and the fans suffer more by taking Duncan out? And do you REALLY think that would shut the naysayers up? Absolutely NOT. They're gonna continue to talk and bash the Spurs. It's what they've done for years..."The Spurs are boring." "Bowen is a dirty player." And now? "Horry is dirty." blah blah blah. It's not going to change because we sit Duncan to make it more of an even match up.
What the Spurs need to do tonight is shut up and play good basketball regardless of who the Suns have on the court. Don't play down to them because it seems as though it should be a cake walk...just play basketball. That's really all I want.

MaNuMaNiAc
05-16-2007, 12:10 PM
Am I afraid the Suns will lose the game? Not really. They will probably lose (though they just might win), but it won't bother me in the least because everyone knows that they aren't playing at full strength. The Spurs won't get any boost out of a win.

As for Manumaniac's comment, if you're really so sure that the Suns would "lose either way," then why is everyone on this board afraid to sit Duncan? Because you're not sure at all. You lost Game 4 at home, and you know beating the Suns at full strength on the road would have been tough.

And why does it matter whether Horry or Amare or Stern is at fault for the suspensions? I guess I understand that you've convinced yourself that the suspensions were fair or correct. Fine. But that still doesn't change the fact that you haven't beaten the Suns at full strength.

I'll admit it -- I watched every minute of every Suns game this season because I though this might be the year, and I'm bitterly disappointed that it has come to this. If the Suns lost fair and square, I could live with that. At least I would have the resolution of knowing that they just weren't good enough this year to win it all. But to have it taken away by something not relevant to the game . . . . The closest analogy I can think of is losing a season to a labor strike. It makes you realize that the whole season was a farce.

In truth, I feel sorry for Spurs fans as well, for same reason. Even if you win, you too will never have the resolution of knowing whether or not the Spurs were good enough this year to win it all.

Unless you sit Duncan, that is. Do that, and win, and you'll know.you do understand that is never going to happen, right? Teams don't bench their superstar players because idiotic fans from the opposing team "dared" them to. How old are you for fuck sake?? 15? Your star fucked up, now live with the consequences. You'll most likely lose game 5, and if you do, it'll be on YOUR shoulders, it'll be because YOUR players weren't smart enough to keep cool. Everything else is a pathetic attempt by bitter Suns fans to cope with the fact that you're probably going to lose this series, period.

VaSpursFan
05-16-2007, 12:14 PM
i say crush the suns in game 5. blow those pansies out by 40 and put all the pressure on them for game 6. no fucking mercy...the whining around this is beginnig to annoy the shit out of me. there has never been an uproar like this over a player leaving the bench. just because it happens in the playoffs does not mean the rule should be modified. dumb and dumber blew it for their team...notice that no one from the spurs got off the bench.

SpursFanFirst
05-16-2007, 12:17 PM
Am I afraid the Suns will lose the game? Not really. They will probably lose (though they just might win), but it won't bother me in the least because everyone knows that they aren't playing at full strength. The Spurs won't get any boost out of a win.

Excuses already?


As for Manumaniac's comment, if you're really so sure that the Suns would "lose either way," then why is everyone on this board afraid to sit Duncan? Because you're not sure at all. You lost Game 4 at home, and you know beating the Suns at full strength on the road would have been tough.

:rolleyes Thanks for speaking for us. Nice try.



In truth, I feel sorry for Spurs fans as well, for same reason. Even if you win, you too will never have the resolution of knowing whether or not the Spurs were good enough this year to win it all.

Don't feel sorry for us.
The Spurs have proven time and time again they can beat the Suns, and I believe that the Spurs are good enough to beat the Suns in a 7 game series, with or without your missing players.

MaNuMaNiAc
05-16-2007, 12:24 PM
This is probably the best thing that could have happened to Suns fans. Now if they lose, the whole series was tainted and it didn't count, if they win they are men amongst boys sort of speak. Ultimate excuse for the temper tantrum loving brats that they've been all series long.

ChumpDumper
05-16-2007, 12:44 PM
And why does it matter whether Horry or Amare or Stern is at fault for the suspensions?Because the players are repsonsible for their actions. Horry, Boris and Amare.

CaptainLate
05-16-2007, 01:02 PM
Am I afraid the Suns will lose the game? Not really...The Spurs won't get any boost out of a win.

Not so. They had momentum going back home. A 12-1 closing run on your opponent's floor gives a team confidence they can beat the Spurs on their floor. Now, if we get a win on an opponents floor, we get to come back home and (I would expect) play harder and not make the mistakes in a close out game, in front of the fans, that were made in Game 4.

Findog
05-16-2007, 04:40 PM
http://deadspin.com/sports/nba-playoffs/the-spurs-fan-solution-sit-duncan-260955.php

haha, this made deadspin

Dingle Barry
05-16-2007, 04:45 PM
delete thread ban user

Dingle Barry
05-16-2007, 04:47 PM
http://deadspin.com/sports/nba-playoffs/the-spurs-fan-solution-sit-duncan-260955.php

haha, this made deadspin
"ArkansasFred" had this to say about the picture chosen:

Old Fear: Being buried alive.

New Fear: Tim Duncan's thumbs.

Jesus.

:p:

Findog
05-16-2007, 04:51 PM
"ArkansasFred" had this to say about the picture chosen:

Old Fear: Being buried alive.

New Fear: Tim Duncan's thumbs.

Jesus.

:p:


Those things are frightening.

Amuseddaysleeper
05-16-2007, 07:58 PM
nevermind