Spurs vs. Suns Game 5 - Grades

[timvp]

Tim Duncan
Duncan had a streaky game but he was a huge part of the win. He struggled early on but recovered on both ends of the court like champions do. Once he started to punish single-team coverage, he forced the Suns to send help. Once the Suns made that adjustment, it opened the floodgates for shots from downtown. His defense near the end of the game was almost perfect. Not the best of Duncan, but good enough.
Grade: B+


Manu Ginobili
Sure, Ginobili had some big turnovers in the fourth quarter. But like I always say regarding Ginobili, as long as he's being aggressive then I'm happy. His 26 points led the way for the Spurs and he hit many huge free throws down the stretch. Also worthy of note were his huge rebounds he snagged at various points in the game and possessions of possessed defense. He's still relying on his three-pointer a tad too much, but no one can fault his effort. Ginobili gave everything he possible could for the Spurs to win.
Grade: B+


Tony Parker
I was proud of the way Parker fought through adversity in this game. His jumper wasn't falling for most of the game and that allowed the Suns to really pack the paint on him. Instead of folding and just depending on others, he kept fighting. Because of that, the Spurs were rewarded with a great effort down the stretch from their point guard. He hit a jumper to tie the game for the first time in the second half. Parker also got the assists on the other final two baskets, three-pointers from Finley and Bowen. Defensively, Parker continued his amazing play. Quietly, he's been the best defender on the team this series.
Grade: B


Bruce Bowen
Bowen's three-pointer with 36 seconds to go in the game might go down as the biggest shot of his career. It gave the Spurs a lead that they never relinquished. On top of that, he played amazing defense on Nash down the stretch. While that hasn't always been the case this series, he was in top form in the fourth quarter on Nash.
Grade: B+


Francisco Elson
Elson looked lost. He had a couple of decent plays but he was a liability when he was on the court. More concentration while on the court would help matters.
Grade: D+


Michael Finley
Finley hit some big buckets and was one of the few Spurs not hesitating on their shot. His defense down the stretch was greatly improved and his will to win was apparent all game. He missed some shots but overall, Finley did his part.
Grade: B-


Brent Barry
As good as Barry was in Games 3 and 4, that's how bad he was in Game 5. Honestly, I'm not totally sure he made the flight to Phoenix. No points, one assists and one rebound in 16 minutes is not exactly what the Spurs had in mind coming off his last two performances. Timid Barry was back.
Grade: D


Fabricio Oberto
Early on, it seemed like Oberto was the only Spur who wanted to win. He came ready to play and ready to take home the victory. You couldn't say that for too many Spurs in the beginning of the contest. However, Oberto became a liability when the Suns went to their mini-ball lineup.
Grade: B-


Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A


Jacque Vaughn
If it's possible to play a worse six minutes, I'd like to see it. Well, as long as it's on the other team. Vaughn was literally the best player for the Suns. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to watch when Vaughn is in the game. Please for the love of all that is holy, please stop shooting the ball, Jacque. Please?
Grade: D


Pop
It was a tale of two halves for Pop. In the first half, he was getting outcoached and was being stubborn. The lineup the Suns put on the court screamed for small ball from the Spurs. Yet Pop decided he was going to let Shawn Marion go for Wilt Chamberlain numbers in the first half. Luckily, Pop came to his senses and put a lineup out there that could compete with what the Suns had to play with. He leaned heavily on his stars in the second half, which was the right call. He also learned from the last game and did a better job of conserving timeouts.
Grade: C+

[Strike]

Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A

:lmao

Gold. Wait, not gold. PLATINUM

[Admidave50]

I was waiting for your post for a long time, LOL @ Horry & Vaughn comments

[Kamnik]

Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A




i saw this one coming :lol


thanks Rob and Amare :smokin

[L.I.T]

Finally got to watch the game. Parker has seriously been an unsung hero on the defensive end. It's like he's shutting people down for the first time in his career.

I'd probably give an A to Ginobili on the strength of that fourth quarter, the only really bad turnover in that period I saw was that Vickesque pass (high and to the right) to Parker.

[mVp]

Horry deserves an A+ :lol

[Strike]

Robert Horry - Clutch even when he doesn't play!

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Francisco Elson
Elson looked lost. He had a couple of decent plays but he was a liability when he was on the court. More concentration while on the court would help matters.
Grade: D+



D Plus? Hmm...a little generous there on Elson.

[MannyIsGod]

You gotta give my boy Bonner a grade too. And I'd give him a D. He didn't do anything but he looked scared on the few attempts and looks he got.

[sabar]

Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A


Jacque Vaughn
If it's possible to play a worse six minutes, I'd like to see it. Well, as long as it's on the other team. Vaughn was literally the best player for the Suns. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to watch when Vaughn is in the game. Please for the love of all that is holy, please stop shooting the ball, Jacque. Please?
Grade: D:lmao

Don't forget Bonner!

These grades would make an awesome sports column in the Express News. Anyways, pretty much dead on. I'd bump Manu up and lower Elson and Vaughn.

[VaSpursFan]

vaughn deserves a F------. his intentions are noble but he just doesn't have the talent to execute. he should facilitate the offense period. no jumpers and no wild drives to the basket.

[travis2]

Pop
It was a tale of two halves for Pop. In the first half, he was getting outcoached and was being stubborn. The lineup the Suns put on the court screamed for small ball from the Spurs. Yet Pop decided he was going to let Shawn Marion go for Wilt Chamberlain numbers in the first half. Luckily, Pop came to his senses and put a lineup out there that could compete with what the Suns had to play with. He leaned heavily on his stars in the second half, which was the right call. He also learned from the last game and did a better job of conserving timeouts.
Grade: C+

Oh, but doesn't small ball lose games?

:rolleyes

One would hope this game would put that particular fallacy to rest, but I just know some people here will continue to watch games with a mini-TV in their ass...

Nice call, timvp...

[ca®lo]

just an A for horry?? come on timvp thats an automatic A++!! :)

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Didn't see the game, but great call on TP's defence this series. He's been exceptional. :tu

[Texas_Ranger]

Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A




:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

[Spurs Brazil]

Francisco Elson
Elson looked lost. He had a couple of decent plays but he was a liability when he was on the court. More concentration while on the court would help matters.
Grade: D+

I'm worried about game 6

Elson is playing so bad and with no Horry he'll see more minutes next game.

Bonner also didn't play good yesterday

Maybe small ball will be the best thing for game 6

[SPURS21]

I would have given Vaughn an F

Itis nerve wrecking just knowing that Vaughn is out there. He had some terrible lay-up attempts in the first half, and his shot was simply terrible last night, yet he kept shooting like he was a star trying to shoot his way out of a slump.

[Lebowski Brickowski]

I'd give Pop a solid B.

With Horry, out, it's way hard to go small. Especially with Elson playing like a lost child. Oberto and Bonner can't run well enough with the suns on D OR O to play small ball. Still, Pop gave Elson the chance to prove himself (to no avail obviously.)

Pop DID finally go with Oberto over TD in the 3rd and the Spurs started to hit some shots. Like Kerr said, it forced the perimeter players to step up; thank God they did.

Pop forced the issue w/ thomas on Duncan in the 3rd, and the Spurs opened the half on a big run. He also called some good plays w/ Manu in the 4th.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

I think Bowen's grade could be a little higher, because not only did he hit the big 3 for us; he actually rebounded really well also!

[Lebowski Brickowski]

Vaughn makes my eyes crust over in fear.

[GrandeDavid]

You gotta give my boy Bonner a grade too. And I'd give him a D. He didn't do anything but he looked scared on the few attempts and looks he got.

Especially when he had that open three early, hesitated, dribbled in and ended up passing it away or turning it over, can't remember which. But I was upset because that's why we have him here, to take and make just a couple of threes.

[DarrinS]

Francisco Elson
Elson looked lost. He had a couple of decent plays but he was a liability when he was on the court. More concentration while on the court would help matters.
Grade: D+

Jacque Vaughn
If it's possible to play a worse six minutes, I'd like to see it. Well, as long as it's on the other team. Vaughn was literally the best player for the Suns. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to watch when Vaughn is in the game. Please for the love of all that is holy, please stop shooting the ball, Jacque. Please?
Grade: D





These two guys? Uggghhhh.

[Borosai]

It's time to dust off Beno and let him score some points.

Raindrops!

[violentkitten]

These two guys? Uggghhhh.

no doubt. pop's curtailed elson's minutes in this series but with horry's out he still has to get some minutes. too bad bonner didnt have a good outing in game 5.

[violentkitten]

It's time to dust off Beno and let him score some points.

Raindrops!

pop finally went with barry and manu together on the floor with tp and vaughn on the bench in the 4th last night. not so sure about beno. he might have us clamoring for vaughn if he sees any minutes.

[Xolotl]

I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one that says "oh shit Vaughn is coming in" and "Don't even think about shooting Jac......fuck you missed again"

[Cry Havoc]

Priceless, Timvp. Duncan's defense earned him an A- though. Five blocks, and every other player in the game for both teams combined for 4.

Everyone else.... errrgggg. Manu gets an A+ for effort but minus 50 points for those loony plays of his that end up with the other Spurs going, "Yep. That's his imitation of Homer Simpson." I'll still take it though, he made some good good good plays down the stretch as well.

I'd knock everyone else's grade down a half step. I can't bring myself to give out that many "B's" on a game that was so sloppy.

[Cry Havoc]

I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one that says "oh shit Vaughn is coming in" and "Don't even think about shooting Jac......fuck you missed again"

That's what you think, with your puny 3 dimensions. Jacque plays in five... thousand. At once. And in all the other ones, he's lighting it up like candles on Hannukah. Just look at his mighty leaping abilities!!

...

The Earth's gravity is very strong here. Jacque must go now.

[whottt]

Yeah...don't let Bonner off light, I know he only played 3 minutes, but in that 3 minutes he had a tremendous positive impact(for the Suns)...


I don't think I've ever seen a player look as bad in his first playoff game as Bonner did...he sucked.

[DarrinS]

Jacques Vaughn has relased an instructional video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K2v2XFYg_Q

[MadDog73]

"Ginobili!"

[RealEstateDude]

Bruce Bowen
Bowen's three-pointer with 36 seconds to go in the game might go down as the biggest shot of his career. It gave the Spurs a lead that they never relinquished. On top of that, he played amazing defense on Nash down the stretch. While that hasn't always been the case this series, he was in top form in the fourth quarter on Nash.
Grade: B+




Bowen deserves an A, he played so good I'm considering buying his jersey... :clap

[stéphane]

Timvp I guess you won't have the time to answer this one but well...
I know you always give your grades / your expectations of the players.
But to be honest expectations can be slightly different from a ST poster to another...
I'd like to know wich grade you'd give to each player concerning your expectations...
Just to quantify the output you're awaiting for each of them.
Messy question maybe but whatever... :p

[LavaLamp]

Congrats to the Spurs team for a game well-played. :clap

[lebomb]

Vaughn = Paul Pressy :depressed

[thousandth]

Tim Duncan
Duncan had a streaky game but he was a huge part of the win. He struggled early on but recovered on both ends of the court like champions do. Once he started to punish single-team coverage, he forced the Suns to send help. Once the Suns made that adjustment, it opened the floodgates for shots from downtown. His defense near the end of the game was almost perfect. Not the best of Duncan, but good enough.
Grade: B+


Manu Ginobili
Sure, Ginobili had some big turnovers in the fourth quarter. But like I always say regarding Ginobili, as long as he's being aggressive then I'm happy. His 26 points led the way for the Spurs and he hit many huge free throws down the stretch. Also worthy of note were his huge rebounds he snagged at various points in the game and possessions of possessed defense. He's still relying on his three-pointer a tad too much, but no one can fault his effort. Ginobili gave everything he possible could for the Spurs to win.
Grade: B+


Tony Parker
I was proud of the way Parker fought through adversity in this game. His jumper wasn't falling for most of the game and that allowed the Suns to really pack the paint on him. Instead of folding and just depending on others, he kept fighting. Because of that, the Spurs were rewarded with a great effort down the stretch from their point guard. He hit a jumper to tie the game for the first time in the second half. Parker also got the assists on the other final two baskets, three-pointers from Finley and Bowen. Defensively, Parker continued his amazing play. Quietly, he's been the best defender on the team this series.
Grade: B


Bruce Bowen
Bowen's three-pointer with 36 seconds to go in the game might go down as the biggest shot of his career. It gave the Spurs a lead that they never relinquished. On top of that, he played amazing defense on Nash down the stretch. While that hasn't always been the case this series, he was in top form in the fourth quarter on Nash.
Grade: B+


Francisco Elson
Elson looked lost. He had a couple of decent plays but he was a liability when he was on the court. More concentration while on the court would help matters.
Grade: D+


Michael Finley
Finley hit some big buckets and was one of the few Spurs not hesitating on their shot. His defense down the stretch was greatly improved and his will to win was apparent all game. He missed some shots but overall, Finley did his part.
Grade: B-


Brent Barry
As good as Barry was in Games 3 and 4, that's how bad he was in Game 5. Honestly, I'm not totally sure he made the flight to Phoenix. No points, one assists and one rebound in 16 minutes is not exactly what the Spurs had in mind coming off his last two performances. Timid Barry was back.
Grade: D


Fabricio Oberto
Early on, it seemed like Oberto was the only Spur who wanted to win. He came ready to play and ready to take home the victory. You couldn't say that for too many Spurs in the beginning of the contest. However, Oberto became a liability when the Suns went to their mini-ball lineup.
Grade: B-


Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A


Jacque Vaughn
If it's possible to play a worse six minutes, I'd like to see it. Well, as long as it's on the other team. Vaughn was literally the best player for the Suns. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to watch when Vaughn is in the game. Please for the love of all that is holy, please stop shooting the ball, Jacque. Please?
Grade: D


Pop
It was a tale of two halves for Pop. In the first half, he was getting outcoached and was being stubborn. The lineup the Suns put on the court screamed for small ball from the Spurs. Yet Pop decided he was going to let Shawn Marion go for Wilt Chamberlain numbers in the first half. Luckily, Pop came to his senses and put a lineup out there that could compete with what the Suns had to play with. He leaned heavily on his stars in the second half, which was the right call. He also learned from the last game and did a better job of conserving timeouts.
Grade: C+

again...timvp: A+! :clap

Question: Manu and Oberto played great together. But, who's starter to next game whit Amare? both boys? :wtf

[timvp]

Yeah...don't let Bonner off light, I know he only played 3 minutes, but in that 3 minutes he had a tremendous positive impact(for the Suns)...


I don't think I've ever seen a player look as bad in his first playoff game as Bonner did...he sucked.

Yeah, I had a Vaughn-ish type cringe when Bonner entered the game. His defense isn't near playoff ready. Maybe some point next year he'll start to understand the defensive concepts better.

Right now, all I gotta say is thank the basketball gods for Oberto. Without Oberto, this team would be dead in the water. Most teams would laugh at the thought of playing Elson or Bonner ... yet that's a reality for San Antonio.

Oh and this wasn't Bonner's first playoff game for those of you scoring at home.

[T Park]

Yeah Oberto has been unreal.

Hopefully he can bring it big one more game, and then get him some rest.

[DarrinS]

Vaughn = Paul Pressy :depressed


Vaughn makes Avery Johnson look like Steve Nash.

[timvp]

If you look at plus/minus per minute, Oberto has been far and away the best Spur in the playoffs.

Here are the plus/minus stats from last night.

Game 5 Plus/Minus
Tony Parker +22
Michael Finley +12
Fabricio Oberto +10
Bruce Bowen +4
Manu Ginobili +2
Matt Bonner +1
Tim Duncan -4
Brent Barry -4
Francisco Elson -11
Jacque Vaughn -17

We should start a SpursTalk donation drive to send Elson and Vaughn to Cancun early. The level of suckage those two guys impose on a game of basketball in six minutes is unreal.

[T Park]

Tony Parker and Michael Finley with the highest plusses?

How can that be!!!

They are the two biggest chokers on the team though....

[DarrinS]

Tony Parker +22
Michael Finley +12
Fabricio Oberto +10
Bruce Bowen +4
Manu Ginobili +2
Matt Bonner +1
Tim Duncan -4
Brent Barry -4
Francisco Elson -11
Jacque Vaughn -17

We should start a SpursTalk donation drive to send Elson and Vaughn to Cancun early. The level of suckage those two guys impose on a game of basketball in six minutes is unreal.

:lmao:

[Bandwagon Bill]

Yeah Oberto has been unreal.

Hopefully he can bring it big one more game, and then get him some rest.

Oberto's not getting any rest. He'll be counted on again against Utah if the Spurs close out one more.

[whottt]

Yeah, I had a Vaughn-ish type cringe when Bonner entered the game. His defense isn't near playoff ready. Maybe some point next year he'll start to understand the defensive concepts better.

Right now, all I gotta say is thank the basketball gods for Oberto. Without Oberto, this team would be dead in the water. Most teams would laugh at the thought of playing Elson or Bonner ... yet that's a reality for San Antonio.

Oh and this wasn't Bonner's first playoff game for those of you scoring at home.



Ok well, there went that excuse...Bonner's appearance left me never wanting him to step foot on the court during a playoff game again. I actually felt myself begin to choke just watching him.

And btw, how come you all of a sudden started taking it easy on Elson?

Last night was easily his worst game as a Spur IMO. F easily.

And Barry didn't get to run any plays...

Surely after 3 years you've noticed...

Barry as a spot up shooter = not very good. Lost. Especially when he's getting inconsistent minutes.


Barry acting as the point or as the initiator of the offense = the smartest ball handler on the team, confident, and IMO, the best passer. Found.


Barry sucks coming in cold off the bench...and I kind of have a problem with the way Pop does this to Shooters...it's what fucked Kerr up too. Kerr went from getting big minutes and being counted on by Jordan to not getting off the bench except in desperation....took him 5 years to acclimate to that role.



RE: Oberto

I've been on the Oberto bandwagon from day 1. Longer than about 90% of the Argentines. I was the guy wanting us to sign Oberto over Rasho...I wanted him over Scola(I still think he gives the team what it needs more than Scola will). I'm not saying he's a HOF'er or anything...I just know what we are going to get from most C VS what we pay them.

Oberto is a bargain when you consider the level he is capable of playing at.

I do concede though...he doesn't bring it every game though, and neither does any other C we've had...or Horry...but he brings it in big games.

[whottt]

One other thing on Oberto...I don't think the Spurs brought him over to gauge Scola...I think they brought him over to gauge Javtokas.

Javtokas and Oberto met in the finals of the ULEB Cup and Oberto outplayed him...Javtokas' team won, and Oberto was Spurlike from the FT line, but he got to the line about 15 times against a guy many considered to be one of the best defensive C's in Europe.

[itzsoweezee]

Oh, but doesn't small ball lose games?

:rolleyes

One would hope this game would put that particular fallacy to rest, but I just know some people here will continue to watch games with a mini-TV in their ass...

Nice call, timvp...

you're clearly an idiot. no one says small ball is always a bad idea. against the mavs, it clearly was. against the suns lineup last night, it clearly wasn't. obviously you don't understand basketball.

[travis2]

:lmao

you slay me...

and yes, there are people here who say that small ball is always bad.

Read. Learn.

[Obstructed_View]

Oh, but doesn't small ball lose games?

:rolleyes

One would hope this game would put that particular fallacy to rest, but I just know some people here will continue to watch games with a mini-TV in their ass...

Nice call, timvp...
Retard:

The Spurs didn't play small ball at all last season until the playoffs. It then became the new Spurs style for 100 percent of the last five games of the series against the Mavericks. A series the Spurs lost, by the way because they couldn't stop anyone and scrambled on defense.

This year, they've played the lineup a lot, so the team is prepared when it's used in stretches and short bursts or against a team that has two bigs sitting out. Elson played more minutes last night than Rasho and Nazr did in the last five games of the Mavs series. Finley's plus minus when he's on the floor in small lineups is proof that he's figured out his role on the defensive end of the small lineup.

[travis2]

Retard:

The Spurs didn't play small ball at all last season until the playoffs. It then became the new Spurs style for 100 percent of the last five games of the series against the Mavericks. A series the Spurs lost, by the way because they couldn't stop anyone and scrambled on defense.

This year, they've played the lineup a lot, so the team is prepared when it's used in stretches and short bursts or against a team that has two bigs sitting out. Elson played more minutes last night than Rasho and Nazr did in the last five games of the Mavs series.

Dickhead:

Tell that to the ones who STILL bitch every time small ball is used.

It was the right call then (and I concede the Spurs didn't have as much experience then) and it was the right call last night.

[Obstructed_View]

Dickhead:

Tell that to the ones who STILL bitch every time small ball is used.

It was the right call then (and I concede the Spurs didn't have as much experience then) and it was the right call last night.
It wasn't the right call then. Those of us that said so at the time were right. The 63 win Spurs lost despite home court advantage because they couldn't play defense, the one thing that's won them three championships, and the small lineup couldn't rebound. This year's version of smallball does both much better because the players have actually got some experience with it.

Some of us bitch when small ball is used in an attempt to outscore the opponent rather than play defense. That's usually when Pop plays the lineup for the last three quarters of a game. He hasn't done that at all during the post season. It's not a coincidence that the Spurs are up 3-2.

If Pop just decides to run the triangle starting tomorrow night the Spurs will lose to the Suns. Will it be a bad idea? Phil Jackson has won everywhere with it.

[travis2]

We've been through all this before...you and Kevin O'Keefe's relatives were all shown the error of your ways.

[bigfan]

I have to agree with the grades given again, good work! I again want to say Oberto has been playing great for a pretty long while now and Im damn glad we have him, he's just got good basketball sense, maybe not the biggest or most skilled but good enough. I had high hopes for Elson early this season but maybe he needs more playing practice. Im starting to think Beno over Vaughn now. He cant be any worse and at least Beno can shoot. Re Barry, an off game and pleeeze, no more Mr Timid, I thought we were over that. Shoot the damn ball!

[Obstructed_View]

We've been through all this before...you and Kevin O'Keefe's relatives were all shown the error of your ways.
The Spurs lost to the Mavericks. I said it would happen at the time. I was right. This year has only further proven what I said to be correct.

[travis2]

The Spurs lost to the Mavericks. I said it would happen at the time. I was right. This year has only further proven what I said to be correct.

Had the Spurs played standard big ball they would have lost in fewer games. With small ball they were a shitty play away from going to the WCF. You were wrong.

[Obstructed_View]

Had the Spurs played standard big ball they would have lost in fewer games. With small ball they were a shitty play away from going to the WCF. You were wrong.
The Spurs lost. Saying they would have lost more is just asinine. The team that the Spurs took seven games to lose to went on to get smoked by the Miami Heat, who used their bigs and still managed to keep Dirk from scoring fifty on them every game. The team that the Spurs abandoned in the Mavs series won 63 games.

Reality.

[travis2]

Reality? :lmao You are the one who can't seem to actually watch the games as they are played...

Read. Watch. Learn.

[leemajors]

it's easier to be bullheaded, travis. nazr and rasho couldn't cut it in that series, they had to be benched.

[sprrs]

I'll disagree with Bowen's shot being the biggest of his career. The one he hit in game 7 in '05 was much more impressive.

Otherwise spot on, especially with Horry :lol

[timvp]

And btw, how come you all of a sudden started taking it easy on Elson?

Last night was easily his worst game as a Spur IMO. F easily.

RE: Oberto

I've been on the Oberto bandwagon from day 1.

That's classic coming from you in the same post. You were all over my azz for being hard on Elson early in the playoffs. And when I said Oberto should play more, you scoffed at it.


And Barry didn't get to run any plays...

Surely after 3 years you've noticed...

Barry as a spot up shooter = not very good. Lost. Especially when he's getting inconsistent minutes.


Barry acting as the point or as the initiator of the offense = the smartest ball handler on the team, confident, and IMO, the best passer. Found.


Barry sucks coming in cold off the bench...and I kind of have a problem with the way Pop does this to Shooters...it's what fucked Kerr up too. Kerr went from getting big minutes and being counted on by Jordan to not getting off the bench except in desperation....took him 5 years to acclimate to that role.

Barry came in as a spot up shooter in Game 3 and turned that game around. He had the same role in Game 4 and played well. He again had the same role in Game 5 and pulled a classic Barry disappearance. He hasn't run point guard at all this series. You must be seeing things.

The problem with Barry after his 85 years in the league is that he just gets scared sometimes. When on the road, he lets the crowd affect him and he plays like a shook rookie.

[timvp]

The problem with Barry after his 85 years in the league is that he just gets scared sometimes. When on the road, he lets the crowd affect him and he plays like a shook rookie.

Holy crap, I didn't know how right timvp was.

Brent Barry hasn't scored a point on the road in the playoffs. Not one single point. That's ridiculously sick.

And to make it even sicker, he has scored in every single home game.

That proves once and for all that Barry gets scared. WTF is that? I'm floored by these findings.

On the road in the playoffs, zero points in 56 minutes.

At home in the playoffs, 24 points in 54 minutes.

I don't know what more to say. This is like I found the holy grail of timidness.

:wow

[whottt]

That's classic coming from you in the same post. You were all over my azz for being hard on Elson early in the playoffs. And when I said Oberto should play more, you scoffed at it.

Well you act like Elson is the worst player in history most of the time...when he isn't...however, in game 5, he just might have been.





Barry came in as a spot up shooter in Game 3 and turned that game around. He had the same role in Game 4 and played well. He again had the same role in Game 5 and pulled a classic Barry disappearance. He hasn't run point guard at all this series. You must be seeing things.

I see sometimes he gets to run and call plays, and sometimes he doesn't...sometimes he gets touches, and sometimes he just sits in the corner all night.

Last night they looked for him, and found him, but he wasn't touching the ball until it was shot time.

There's definitely a difference.





The problem with Barry after his 85 years in the league is that he just gets scared sometimes. When on the road, he lets the crowd affect him and he plays like a shook rookie.


So you say....

However, IIRC the best game of his Spurs career came in game 1 of the 05 WCF(or was it game 2?) on the road...you just don't get Barry's game, and never have. And you continually attribute to his heart and play, Pop's substitions and minute rationing......

[whottt]

Come to think of it...you were the one saying Elson shouldn't be on the court in the Denver series and would be a factor in this one...I disagreed.

[whottt]

Holy crap, I didn't know how right timvp was.

Brent Barry hasn't scored a point on the road in the playoffs. Not one single point. That's ridiculously sick.

And to make it even sicker, he has scored in every single home game.

That proves once and for all that Barry gets scared. WTF is that? I'm floored by these findings.

On the road in the playoffs, zero points in 56 minutes.

At home in the playoffs, 24 points in 54 minutes.

I don't know what more to say. This is like I found the holy grail of timidness.

:wow


05 VS Phoenix....Game 1 on the road.


Point Disproved...emphatically.

You also tend to diss Manu's road ability...

PWNT.

[Obstructed_View]

Reality? :lmao You are the one who can't seem to actually watch the games as they are played...

Read. Watch. Learn.
Oh, really? Who won the series between smallball and the Mavericks again? I thought your defense was a bogus prediction of what might have happened otherwise, which is just a more severe degree of what ACTUALLY happened.

Get out of here with that shit. It's weaker than the Suns defending Amare.

[Obstructed_View]

Holy crap, I didn't know how right timvp was.
Really, because it seems like you are always on the ball to give him props when he happens to be correct. It's like you keep track of his posts so you can jump on his jock. You have kind of an unnatural thing for him, IMHO.

[gino>yourlife]

Jacque Vaughn
If it's possible to play a worse six minutes, I'd like to see it. Well, as long as it's on the other team. Vaughn was literally the best player for the Suns. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to watch when Vaughn is in the game. Please for the love of all that is holy, please stop shooting the ball, Jacque. Please?
Grade: F

fixed

[TampaDude]

Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A


Classic! :lmao

[timvp]

fixed

The only thing worse than a Jacque Vaughn jumper that misses is a Jacque Vaughn jumper that he makes. That means we'll see another three possessions wasted because he's "confident".

[romsho]

The only thing worse than a Jacque Vaughn jumper that misses is a Jacque Vaughn jumper that he makes. That means we'll see another three possessions wasted because he's "confident".

Agreed. For me the "WTF" moment of the game happened late in the 4th quarter coming out of a timeout, and the play ends up being a Vaughn right top of the key jumper which clanked off the front rim. No timeout should ever result in a play ending in a Jacque Vaughn jumpshot.

[wildbill2u]

vaughn deserves a F------. his intentions are noble but he just doesn't have the talent to execute. he should facilitate the offense period. no jumpers and no wild drives to the basket.
Barry is called out as timid on the road, but at least he has some sense and doesn't try to take over the game if he isn't feeling it. He'll try hard on defense and concentrates on moving the ball on offense to the premiere players.

Vaughn on the other hand, doesn't have enough sense to pet a pig. He tries too hard to be an NBA player and only proves he isn't of that quality with every minute he plays.

A man's gotta know his limitations. Barry does, Vaughn doesn't.

[wildbill2u]

I think Bowen's grade could be a little higher, because not only did he hit the big 3 for us; he actually rebounded really well also!
Take note of why Bowen is getting a few more rebounds than usual--he's actually moving out of the cocoon over on the sideline for a change and getting some rebounds over by the paint and top of the circle.

And on defense, he's having to go to the middle to keep up with Nash and whoever else he's guarding.

Even a blind hog finds an acorn occasionally. These rebounds are literally dropping into his hands because he's there. And that's good--not negative.

[timvp]

Barry is called out as timid on the road, but at least he has some sense and doesn't try to take over the game if he isn't feeling it. He'll try hard on defense and concentrates on moving the ball on offense to the premiere players.

Vaughn on the other hand, doesn't have enough sense to pet a pig. He tries too hard to be an NBA player and only proves he isn't of that quality with every minute he plays.

A man's gotta know his limitations. Barry does, Vaughn doesn't.

Barry is 57,000 times the player Vaughn could ever wish to be. Vaughn is a decent third string point guard. That's where it ends.

[Obstructed_View]

Barry is 57,000 times the player Vaughn could ever wish to be. Vaughn is a decent third string point guard. That's where it ends.
Well put. One guy is there to take up space on the court while someone else rests, the other one is actually allowed to play.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

So.....................why not use Barry as backup PG (didn't we have this discussion in the playoffs during 2005....)

[whottt]

Yeah, we've been having it for years...

Pop'll figure it out around game 6 or 7 of the finals(again).


I hope.

[gilmor]

I saw Bowen talking to Parker alot in the game..

Maybe it's just me. But I think Bowen is instructing Parker how to guard Nash/Barbosa and asking Parker to pass him the dime when he penetrates..

That's the reason you witness the defense of Parker has improved so much.. and the 2/3 assists to Bowen at the corners

[Obstructed_View]

Um, Parker has been doing a better job of defending than Bowen has.

[SpursWoman]

The only thing worse than a Jacque Vaughn jumper that misses is a Jacque Vaughn jumper that he makes. That means we'll see another three possessions wasted because he's "confident".


I was screaming to put in Beno last night. :(

[gino>yourlife]

The only thing worse than a Jacque Vaughn jumper that misses is a Jacque Vaughn jumper that he makes. That means we'll see another three possessions wasted because he's "confident".


which is why i cheer so hard for TP to do well (no offense timmy and the rest) and stay out of foul trouble, not because that patented teardrop is a thing of beauty, but mainly because i cringe at the thought of turnover machine entering the game :cry

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Manu is done, he has reverted to 2003 form when he'd make a Herky Jerky move, look around left to right like Mark Madsen, drive to a random spot on the floor, jump as high as he can in the air, then pass it straight into the opposing team's hands.

Es ridiculoso

[aaronstampler]

Manu is done, he has reverted to 2003 form when he'd make a Herky Jerky move, look around left to right like Mark Madsen, drive to a random spot on the floor, jump as high as he can in the air, then pass it straight into the opposing team's hands.

Es ridiculoso


You're right. The team totally didn't need those 26 points.

[Obstructed_View]

You're right. The team totally didn't need those 26 points.
I believe that was reverse mojo. What do you think?

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

You're right. The team totally didn't need those 26 points.
:lol For real. I don't get posts like that one above.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

I believe that was reverse mojo. What do you think?
I don't know about that, since obviously Manu did his damage yesterday, how does it apply to game 6? 26 and 10 seems like a need for reverse mojo or the statement that Manu is done is late.
I think it's just made to get a reaction.


Besides anyone actually favor Manu's football pass TO's as opposed to last year's alternatives? They were more of his Manuesque TO's we're so used to, where he gets too ahead of himself and hyper rather than the boneheaded variety (Bibby, and the Dirk foul)
Besides that game, Manu has been avoiding turnovers in the last two series. So I guess I'll take those TO's in a win.

[Obstructed_View]

I don't know about that, since obviously Manu did his damage yesterday, how does it apply to game 6?
I think it's just made to get a reaction.
Tell him Ricky Williams is a fag. It'll make him bust a blood vessel.

[milkyway21]

Francisco Elson
Elson looked lost. He had a couple of decent plays but he was a liability when he was on the court. More concentration while on the court would help matters.
Grade: D+


Michael Finley
Finley hit some big buckets and was one of the few Spurs not hesitating on their shot. His defense down the stretch was greatly improved and his will to win was apparent all game. He missed some shots but overall, Finley did his part.
Grade: B-


Robert Horry
Horry's defense on Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw was fantastic. He kept both players in check single handedly. He didn't get many open shots tonight, but he made all the ones he took. Although he was seventh on the team in plus/minus at +0, his impact went beyond the numbers.
Grade: A


Jacque Vaughn
If it's possible to play a worse six minutes, I'd like to see it. Well, as long as it's on the other team. Vaughn was literally the best player for the Suns. It's gotten to the point that it's hard to watch when Vaughn is in the game. Please for the love of all that is holy, please stop shooting the ball, Jacque. Please?
Grade: D

though i am very disappointed with Elson's play in this playoffs particularly in this series i am sure he can be an impt factor if we win against Phoenix and play against Utah. i think he can stop Okur and bec of his size and athleticism he can help Duncan in the boards.

can we at least try Udrih backing up Parker ahead of Vaughn? I got goose bumbs if I see Vaughn dribbling the ball and trying his way to the rim trying for those lay ups of his in between two big men of opposing teams. I am not pushing for it but just suggesting if we can at least give it a try.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

I don't know about that, since obviously Manu did his damage yesterday, how does it apply to game 6? 26 and 10 seems like a need for reverse mojo or the statement that Manu is done is late.
I think it's just made to get a reaction.


Besides anyone actually favor Manu's football pass TO's as opposed to last year's alternatives? They were more of his Manuesque TO's we're so used to, where he gets too ahead of himself and hyper rather than the boneheaded variety (Bibby, and the Dirk foul)
Besides that game, Manu has been avoiding turnovers in the last two series. So I guess I'll take those TO's in a win.



I was always a Manu fan, then of course he won my heart over in early 2004 regular season with Parker and Duncan out when we lost triple overtime against the Fabulous Four of the Lakers + Deveeen George. Then of course in 2005 he established himself as elite.

But he's lost something, and I keep making comments about how "he's aged 5 years in 5 weeks" to establish how ludicrous his overall turn in play is (barring the possibility of him being injured). I think its revolving completely on confidence and I do not buy the crap about "Pop using him wrong" its horse shit. Pop has fucked up recently but using Manu wrong is not nearly one of the chief fuck ups. Manu has lost something. I don't know what it is exactly but he's lost it. And he needs to fucking find it, because 26 points or 36, if you telegram outlet passes in the fourth quarter down by 3 when Tim fucking Duncan blocks an opponent and gift wraps the ball for you, you're not going to win a championship.
Jazz will bukkake Manu and make Manu 2007 look like Strickland that time he did a no look pass down by 2 or 3 against the Rockets if he keeps playing like this....If he plays consistent this series is over already.

So he had one good game in which he gave the suns multiple opportunities to beat us. Congrats. Manu that does that every game is at least still Manu. But Manu that does that one every 5 games then just rebounds and turns it over the other 4 is not going to cut it.

[aaronstampler]

I was always a Manu fan, then of course he won my heart over in early 2004 regular season with Parker and Duncan out when we lost triple overtime against the Fabulous Four of the Lakers + Deveeen George. Then of course in 2005 he established himself as elite.

But he's lost something, and I keep making comments about how "he's aged 5 years in 5 weeks" to establish how ludicrous his overall turn in play is (barring the possibility of him being injured). I think its revolving completely on confidence and I do not buy the crap about "Pop using him wrong" its horse shit. Pop has fucked up recently but using Manu wrong is not nearly one of the chief fuck ups. Manu has lost something. I don't know what it is exactly but he's lost it. And he needs to fucking find it, because 26 points or 36, if you telegram outlet passes in the fourth quarter down by 3 when Tim fucking Duncan blocks an opponent and gift wraps the ball for you, you're not going to win a championship.
Jazz will bukkake Manu and make Manu 2007 look like Strickland that time he did a no look pass down by 2 or 3 against the Rockets if he keeps playing like this....If he plays consistent this series is over already.

So he had one good game in which he gave the suns multiple opportunities to beat us. Congrats. Manu that does that every game is at least still Manu. But Manu that does that one every 5 games then just rebounds and turns it over the other 4 is not going to cut it.

Dude you're not fooling anyone. Don't you think I have a memory? You were hating on Manu last season too. And I'm not talking about the Dirk play in Game 7. You were hating on the guy during the regular season and playoffs last year. You're just a hater.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Well i'm not going to call you a liar im sure i hated on manu on this board exactly when you said, moreover im sure i've posted a hate post about every spur except Bowen and Tim on this forum for each playoffs and each regular season so what is your point? Half were probably just to get a rise out of people and have were truthful. So again what is your point?

Manu is laying an egg overall in this playoffs, we must have consistency from our big three if we are to see more W's.


I admitted he's played relatively well last game and in game 3 but where's the consistency? So he had 26 points and gave the suns multiple opportunities in the final minutes to secure a victory. Congrats.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Well i'm not going to call you a liar im sure i hated on manu on this board exactly when you said, moreover im sure i've posted a hate post about every spur except Bowen and Tim on this forum for each playoffs and each regular season so what is your point? Half were probably just to get a rise out of people and have were truthful. So again what is your point?

Manu is laying an egg overall in this playoffs, we must have consistency from our big three if we are to see more W's.


I admitted he's played relatively well last game and in game 3 but where's the consistency? So he had 26 points and gave the suns multiple opportunities in the final minutes to secure a victory. Congrats.
I think you're being overly critical. Manu's underperforming, but don't act like he's been a no-show on the same level as several other top performing players in playoff series. I think Manu so far has left a lot to be desired in terms of consistent scoring and he should look to score more rather than settling the way he has been lately, but you're singling out Manu too much. You talk as if Manu's the reason why we lose in our game losses. Manu was more consistent on scoring in the 2006 playoffs, but the team didn't sweep anybody when he was averaging 20. It's hard to argue that his turnovers last night weren't bad, they could have potentially cost the game, but it happens...and luckily they didn't. Because Manu had more game saving plays than game-fucking ones. Tim fucked up his free throws to negate one block shot of his. That could have cost us the fucking game as well, regardless of what happened before, had Nash sunk a three. Steve Nash had a critical turnover and stepped on the line in his game loss. The point is, these players are still doing more good than bad. I don't think Manu should be penalized for not playing perfect games just because his 2005 performance raised the bar higher than ever. There is such a thing as criticizing or expecting him to do better without throwing him under the bus for subpar performances, saying things like "He's done." Not while the Spurs are still in the post-season hunt as well. Potentially, each series is different. If the Spurs prevail tomorrow in closing out the Suns, who knows how Manu will be in the second half of these playoffs?

But you do have a point, Pop even said, "If Manu doesn't do well, then we're in trouble..."


In your case, I think it would take Manu having a 40 point explosion in tomorrow's game to help contribute for a win, just for his fair weather fans to get off his back a little. I doubt you'd be convinced though.

[thousandth]

though i am very disappointed with Elson's play in this playoffs particularly in this series i am sure he can be an impt factor if we win against Phoenix and play against Utah. i think he can stop Okur and bec of his size and athleticism he can help Duncan in the boards.
can we at least try Udrih backing up Parker ahead of Vaughn? I got goose bumbs if I see Vaughn dribbling the ball and trying his way to the rim trying for those lay ups of his in between two big men of opposing teams. I am not pushing for it but just suggesting if we can at least give it a try.

I´ve a lot respect for you :) , but :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol ...

[smeagol]

Manu is done, he has reverted to 2003 form when he'd make a Herky Jerky move, look around left to right like Mark Madsen, drive to a random spot on the floor, jump as high as he can in the air, then pass it straight into the opposing team's hands.

Es ridiculoso
Do you, mookie and elpimpo get together every night and decide to post the same thing?

By the way, Manu is playing subpar, but as many people who know about basketball point out, he continues to help in many other ways.

And he continues to show he hasn't lost it. As the stampler pointed out, his 26 pts in a game where we were playing an impaired Suns team, and loosing by 16 pts at one point, were crucial in order to keep us in this series.

We would be pretty much done if we were 2-3 at this juncture.

[DarrinS]

Manu has taken a serious beating over the past few years. He's been thrown down like a rag doll, smacked in the nose, almost had his eye taken out, scratched, etc. etc.

I wonder if, over time, that's made him more hesitant to drive into the paint, through traffic? Just wondering. When he plays the best is when he's driving. Yes, he hits an occasional 3, but when that's all he's trying, he becomes very one-dimensional.


Manu (tonight): 24 points, 6 boards, 4 steals, 3 assists.
EDIT> At least one block on either Nash or Barbosa.

[ancestron]

would we rather see Beno instead of Vaughn? honestly.

[Capt Bringdown]

.If he plays consistent this series is over already.


Bingo. What one hand giveth the other taketh away. Manu's always going for the cover of Sports Illustrated play, that's his biggest weakness. Frankly, I think some people around here consider him to be the Great White Hope and they cut him too much slack. Trouble is, he's an OK player with a too often dogdy Bball IQ, sometimes good, but not great.

I could do without the hyperboles and the constant need to force stuff that ain't there. If Manu could just play solid basketball, that would be nice. Forget the BS about being the world's best competitor, the fade away step back 3's, the no-look passes that fly out of bounds, the blown defensive assignments due to stupid gambles, the fouls that knock us out of the playoffs.
How about playing good consistant basketball Manu? If you could do that, we'd be resting now.

[aaronstampler]

It's one thing to bash Manu, but just exactly how many subpar shooting and high turnover games is Tony gonna have to string together for some Spurs fans to notice?

Manu's PER in the playoffs is 17.49, 35th best in the league, 3rd best on the team, and a significant drop from his regular season total of 24.18 (11th best in the league).

Tony's PER is 15.28, barely above average, tied for 66th best in the playoffs, 5th on the team, and a just as significant drop from his regular season number of 21.46 (25th best in the league).

When the people who call Manu out do the same for Tony, they'll have some semblance of credibility. Right now of the big three Tim is the only one having a good playoffs, and Horry and Fin are the only other Spurs bettering their regular season production.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics?sort=per&pos=all&seasonType=3

[timvp]

It's one thing to bash Manu, but just exactly how many subpar shooting and high turnover games is Tony gonna have to string together for some Spurs fans to notice?

Manu's PER in the playoffs is 17.49, 35th best in the league, 3rd best on the team, and a significant drop from his regular season total of 24.18 (11th best in the league).

Tony's PER is 15.28, barely above average, tied for 66th best in the playoffs, 5th on the team, and a just as significant drop from his regular season number of 21.46 (25th best in the league).

When the people who call Manu out do the same for Tony, they'll have some semblance of credibility. Right now of the big three Tim is the only one having a good playoffs, and Horry and Fin are the only other Spurs bettering their regular season production.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics?sort=per&pos=all&seasonType=3

If I ever get in trouble, I need to hire stampler as my publicist.

:rollin

[E20]

Bowen should have gotten an A+

[whottt]

Raja Bell is the reason Manu has sucked in this series...is it hard to figure out?

[timvp]

It's one thing to bash Manu, but just exactly how many subpar shooting and high turnover games is Tony gonna have to string together for some Spurs fans to notice?

Manu's PER in the playoffs is 17.49, 35th best in the league, 3rd best on the team, and a significant drop from his regular season total of 24.18 (11th best in the league).

Tony's PER is 15.28, barely above average, tied for 66th best in the playoffs, 5th on the team, and a just as significant drop from his regular season number of 21.46 (25th best in the league).

When the people who call Manu out do the same for Tony, they'll have some semblance of credibility. Right now of the big three Tim is the only one having a good playoffs, and Horry and Fin are the only other Spurs bettering their regular season production.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics?sort=per&pos=all&seasonType=3

To waste time before the game, I took a look at these PER stats. This small of a sample size brought upon some rather humorous insights.

I learned that TJ Ford is not only the best point guard in the league, he's the third best player in the league. That's pretty odd considering he wasn't even the best point guard on his team in the playoffs. But Hollinger's stats are always right.

I learned that Deron Williams is a below average NBA player, ranking behind the likes of Keyon Dooling.

In regards to this series, I learned James Jones > Bruce Bowen and Robert Horry > Shawn Marion.

I also learned that Darko Milicic, Antonio Daniels and Alonzo Mourning should have made the All-Star team seeing as how all three are top 20 players in the NBA.

Good stuff :tu

[ducks]

I don't know about that, since obviously Manu did his damage yesterday, how does it apply to game 6? 26 and 10 seems like a need for reverse mojo or the statement that Manu is done is late.
I think it's just made to get a reaction.


Besides anyone actually favor Manu's football pass TO's as opposed to last year's alternatives? They were more of his Manuesque TO's we're so used to, where he gets too ahead of himself and hyper rather than the boneheaded variety (Bibby, and the Dirk foul)
Besides that game, Manu has been avoiding turnovers in the last two series. So I guess I'll take those TO's in a win.
he played great
however if they lost those 2 big turnovers by him contributed big time to a loss

[timvp]

Raja Bell is the reason Manu has sucked in this series...is it hard to figure out?

A) I don't think Manu has "sucked" this series. His rebounding has been big and he's hit some big shots. It's below what we've come to expect, but still pretty damn decent.

B) The Raja Bell excuse doesn't hold water because he's doing better in this series than he did against Steve Blake or whoever was supposedly guarding him against Denver.

[BeerIsGood!]

Raja Bell is the reason Manu has sucked in this series...is it hard to figure out?

Bell was on him in the 4th quarter and in game 3, and Steve Blake of all people was on him throughout the Denver series. It's not so much Bell as it is a lack of mental focus or confidence. Hopefully being the game 5 savior will raise his level tonight and from here on out. If the Spurs play the way they had in games 1,3, and 4 and Manu comes up big - the Spurs win tonight.

[wildbill2u]

would we rather see Beno instead of Vaughn? honestly.
Actually I would. He could not possibly be worse than Vaughn on BB IQ and has some tools that are superior (shooting and passing)

But I'd rather have Barry than Beno play PG in support for a few minutes.

at this point, anybody but vaughn! :pctoss

[ducks]

tp is doing his part
I wish he was shooting better
last game he did not force shots late
his d is awesome
his legs are tired
not making excuses though for his shooting :pctoss

[Obstructed_View]

Maybe we could have Vaughn dribble the ball past half court, call a timeout and then sub Beno in for him.

[T Park]

I would, in all seriousness, throw Beno out there, and see how he does.

What the hell, he can't do worse than Vaughn has.

Hell, he might hit an open three.

[BeerIsGood!]

I would, in all seriousness, throw Beno out there, and see how he does.

What the hell, he can't do worse than Vaughn has.

Hell, he might hit an open three.

I don't know if I'd pick game 6 to do that. Vaughn isn't making any shots and is taking way too many, but at least at this point he isn't getting his pocket picked for a Marion or Barbosa dunk.