PDA

View Full Version : ESPN Column About Horry



ajh18
05-20-2007, 09:13 PM
In case it hasn't been posted:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=wojciechowski_gene&id=2877137&sportCat=nba

-school' Horry would knock down Nash againBy Gene Wojciechowski
ESPN.com
Archive

SAN ANTONIO -- Trust me, they don't call him "Cheap Shot Bob" in this town. Instead, Robert Horry, the man whose shoulder shiver helped alter the look and feel of the NBA playoffs, received something Sunday afternoon that you don't see and hear every day: a spontaneous, heartfelt standing ovation that lasted a full 30 seconds.

For checking into the game.

"They just missed him," said the Spurs' Michael Finley of the reception. "As fans, you miss having a valuable part of your team."



D. Clarke Evans/Getty Images
Robert Horry can't understand the uproar over his foul on Steve Nash.
Horry didn't put up much of a linescore in the San Antonio Spurs' 108-100 victory against the Utah Jazz in Game 1 of the Western Conference finals. But he didn't have to. All he really had to do was show up.

"I'm just happy they accepted me back," said Horry, who can now count on exactly one finger the number of times he's gotten a standing O for reporting to the scorer's table. "It was funny."

Or as Jazz guard Derek Fisher, a former Horry teammate with the Los Angeles Lakers said, "I was actually jealous."

Exiled to David Stern's penal colony for two games, Horry finally returned to the court ... and to a hero's welcome. The cheers weren't for his three rebounds, two assists and one blocked shot in 16:32 of playing time. It was for what happened last Monday in this same AT&T Center. Phoenix Suns' point guard Steve Nash can tell you all about it.

Horry's controversial body check of Nash in the closing seconds of Game 4 sent tremors through the Suns-Spurs series. Horry was suspended for those two games, but it was the one-game suspension of the Suns' Amare Stoudemire and Boris Diaw (for leaving the bench area following Horry's flagrant foul) that created a national uproar.

The short-handed Suns lost Game 5 at home and were closed out here last Friday evening. Afterward, Nash said Stern's decision to suspend Stoudemire and Diaw "will forever haunt us." It won't haunt Horry. The man previously known as "Big Shot Bob" has a long history of winning championships (no active player has won more than Horry's six NBA titles) and of making plays that matter. But the Nash controversy continues to puzzle him because, he said, he didn't do anything wrong.




"I'm an old-fashioned player, an old-school player who will foul you and foul you hard."


Robert Horry



"I'm still amazed at the notoriety that this one play got compared to Baron Davis' foul [against Fisher in the Golden State-Utah series] and Mikki Moore's foul [against Aleksandar Pavlovic in the Cleveland Cavaliers series]," Horry said. "Those were like malicious fouls in my eyes. Guys who can't protect themselves off their feet. Blow to the head."

According to the Horry School of Fouling, his shoulder-check on Nash was perfectly acceptable playoff etiquette. That's why he didn't understand why everyone -- Nash, Stoudemire and Diaw, the media -- got bent like a paper clip.

"You know what?" Horry said. "If I had the situation to do all over again I would still [do it]. That's just the way I'm programmed. You go over there and foul, and you foul them hard. The only thing I wish I could have changed is that it wouldn't have been that close to the scorer's table. Other than that, I'm an old-fashioned player, an old-school player who will foul you and foul you hard."

Nash was a rookie when Horry joined the Suns in 1996. They used to play one-on-one together in the Suns' practice gym. They took car drives together. Horry respected Nash then, and he respects him now. But that doesn't mean Nash, or anybody for that matter, gets a free pass in the postseason.

"I think on my part -- and I think [Nash has] been in the league long enough to realize -- it's just basketball," Horry said. "I can understand if I had clotheslined him and tried to hurt him, but that was just a bump. Hopefully in his eyes he'll look at it as just basketball and no hard feelings. Because when you're trying to win you have no friends until you walk off the court."

Horry probably doesn't have many friends in Phoenix, not that he cares. He said Stoudemire and Diaw only have themselves to blame for getting suspended.



AP Photo/Eric Gay
Tim Duncan and the Spurs were too much for the Jazz on Sunday.
"They complained ... like I can get in their heads and play Nintendo with their minds and bodies and get them to walk out onto the court," Horry said.

No, he said, this was about something more basic. This was about the unwritten code of playoff basketball that Horry, now in his 15th season, learned during the 1994 NBA Finals. The New York Knicks vs. Horry's Houston Rockets. Horry went in for a dunk and Knicks enforcer Anthony Mason took him out. Horry bounced hard against the wooden floor.

"I had two sprained wrists and a hairline fracture in my ass after it happened," he said. "I knew what had happened, but I was hurt. I got up after that, but it was still painful. You just played on. You don't worry about it. Nobody [from the Rockets' bench] ran over there trying to push and shove, trying to cause anything. It was just a hard foul and you get up and go."

Nash eventually got up, but it was obvious after the Game 6 close-out loss that he felt that the suspensions had denied the Suns a chance to compete on an even level. I agreed and told Horry that the best postseason series had been reduced to what-ifs.

Horry scoffed at it.

"Every year's going to be a what-if," he said. "That's the game of basketball. What if a guy turns his ankle? What if a guy gets in a car wreck coming to the arena? There are so many different aspects that could happen that nobody knows. Only the man upstairs knows."

Except that Horry's foul on Nash wasn't an accident. It was done on purpose and with the Suns' victory already assured. Doesn't matter to Horry. The playoff code is the playoff code. And he isn't the only one who thinks that way.

"It's a part of our game," said Fisher, an 11-year veteran. "It's not like he picked him up and threw [Nash] over the scorer's table. He hit him."

So I asked Horry what he'll do if the same set of circumstances present themselves in the series against the Jazz. Utah guard Deron Williams dribbling down the court ... the Jazz comfortably ahead in the final minute ... seconds ticking off the game clock.

Horry looks at me like I've asked him if he wears socks during the game. Of course, he'd foul Williams.

"But I'd fall down this time and make it look like I'm trying to take a charge," he said. "I've got to look like I'm trying to get ready to take a charge and fall down. Then everybody would be like, 'Oh, he got knocked down too.'"

Horry is laughing now. He gets up from the chair in front of his locker and begins to walk away. "Can't tell more secrets," he said.

Gene Wojciechowski is the senior national columnist for ESPN.com. You can contact him at [email protected].

td4mvp3
05-20-2007, 09:14 PM
i was just about to post that.

Jockularity!
05-20-2007, 09:18 PM
Gene Woj;aljfd;lkjfsdalk;fjschski has had a real hard-on against the Spurs the last week. I'm pretty sure he's the one who got the * ball rolling.

LilMissSPURfect
05-20-2007, 09:20 PM
its harder for some i guess

CubanMustGo
05-20-2007, 09:21 PM
Yep, Wojo was the fucker who had that * in his Game 6 article.

I'm sure he's thinking that all he's doing here is giving Horry the rope to hang himself. Fuck 'im.

BTW I wrote a response (comment) to that article which said basically "The team with the cute white guy lost and Suns fans and sportswriters need to deal with it" and the ESPN.com assholes TOSd me. No cussing, no insulting other posters.

infinite styles
05-20-2007, 09:24 PM
Seriously he needs to get a life. I guess he figures that actually coming up with something original is too hard so he sticks with the easy stuff.

vander
05-20-2007, 09:25 PM
"But I'd fall down this time and make it look like I'm trying to take a charge," he said. "I've got to look like I'm trying to get ready to take a charge and fall down. Then everybody would be like, 'Oh, he got knocked down too.'"

exactly what I said when it happened, dude, you've got to flop there, its the status quo on the NBA today, and because Horry stood strong, every one thinks that he tried to kill nash.

iflyabeech
05-20-2007, 09:26 PM
The standing o was badass and loud!!!

Don Quixote
05-20-2007, 10:41 PM
Look, Wojo at ESPN should be known by now for his mediocre, cliché-ridden drivel. How this guy has a regular job writing about sports is beyond me. I could write stuff just as good and insightful as him, and for a fraction of the $$. So his * article is not even worth mentioning. Like Wilbon said, the Spurs just don't care.

That said, Wojo's article on Horry was much better.

violentkitten
05-20-2007, 10:46 PM
"They complained ... like I can get in their heads and play Nintendo with their minds and bodies and get them to walk out onto the court," Horry said.

but you did rob, you did.

:smokin

Strike
05-20-2007, 10:49 PM
"I'm an old-fashioned player, an old-school player who will foul you and foul you hard."


Robert Horry


:clap Sig worthy.

michaelwcho
05-20-2007, 11:27 PM
Once in awhile, Horry is my favorite player in the L, once in awhile :)

sprrs
05-21-2007, 12:05 AM
According to the Horry School of Fouling, his shoulder-check on Nash was perfectly acceptable playoff etiquette. That's why he didn't understand why everyone -- Nash, Stoudemire and Diaw, the media -- got bent like a paper clip.

"You know what?" Horry said. "If I had the situation to do all over again I would still [do it]. That's just the way I'm programmed. You go over there and foul, and you foul them hard. The only thing I wish I could have changed is that it wouldn't have been that close to the scorer's table. Other than that, I'm an old-fashioned player, an old-school player who will foul you and foul you hard."


"I had two sprained wrists and a hairline fracture in my ass after it happened," he said. "I knew what had happened, but I was hurt. I got up after that, but it was still painful. You just played on. You don't worry about it. Nobody [from the Rockets' bench] ran over there trying to push and shove, trying to cause anything. It was just a hard foul and you get up and go."


A-M-E-N.

sandeepgm
05-21-2007, 01:09 AM
The funny thing about all this is how every teams's fans will stand by their team for whatever crap they do. Last years booing of finley by mavs fan was deemed 'classless' and comments by cuban about the riverwalk created uproar but at the same time people will celebrate bowen's and horry's cheapshots as heroic and comments against them will be said to be made only because the other team's lost.

Horry who basically says that he will do anything(he says as long as he doesnt injure the guy) to get a victory couldnt take all the trash talking etc from the mavs last year. Too bad he cant take what he dishes out.

darkzero1
05-21-2007, 01:20 AM
Meh, every Ahab's got to have a Moby Dick.

judaspriestess
05-21-2007, 01:42 AM
Horry probably doesn't have many friends in Phoenix, not that he cares. He said Stoudemire and Diaw only have themselves to blame for getting suspended.

:elephant Hell yeah!!

The Truth #6
05-21-2007, 02:12 AM
In some language Wojciechowski translates to asshole.

jmard5
05-21-2007, 02:53 AM
like I can get in their heads and play Nintendo with their minds and bodies and get them to walk out onto the court," Horry said.


Is Horry referring to Nintendo Wii or the Nintendo Family Computer? If it is indeed the Family Computer console, then hands-down, he is old fashioned...old-school. :lol


http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/8086/nintendoox1.jpg

To be honest, I feel in love with that console way, way back!

mikekim
05-21-2007, 03:44 AM
The funny thing about all this is how every teams's fans will stand by their team for whatever crap they do. Last years booing of finley by mavs fan was deemed 'classless' and comments by cuban about the riverwalk created uproar but at the same time people will celebrate bowen's and horry's cheapshots as heroic and comments against them will be said to be made only because the other team's lost.

Horry who basically says that he will do anything(he says as long as he doesnt injure the guy) to get a victory couldnt take all the trash talking etc from the mavs last year. Too bad he cant take what he dishes out.

Booing finley was/is classless. So is insulting an entire city.

Bowen and Horry are not dirty players. Although i do think Horry's foul was dumb and was at least a little dirty....still Terry's deliberate, aimed punch at the balls is infinitely dirtier. And Bowen? he's not dirty---meaning he never goes out to intentionally hurt people with his play.

As someone else on this forum mentioned, the standing ovation for Horry was not because anyone condoned his actions (although many people joke around with that, and a few are serious about it). It was more because the media and nba "fans" everywhere were taking one hard (and fairly dumb--given the sensitivity of the NBA game today) foul by Horry and using it to personally insult him and even threaten him. Even people who jokingly (or even seriously) applaud the fact that Nash went flying into the scorer's table (as a result of getting hit at the WRONG POINT IN HIS STRIDE by a foul that was NOT THAT HARD) were standing up and applauding only because of how much Horry's been insulted and condemned over the past few days. It was so overblown and exaggerated. (I think I read that the man got racist threats?? ..........)

That's what Woj....ski fails to see and mention.

Woj...ski is a joke.

He should officially change his name to "Woj...ski"

mikekim
05-21-2007, 04:00 AM
Horry Plays For A Texas Team So He Should Get The Death Penalty For The Shit He Pulled You Execute Everyone Else Why Not Whorey?

THIS! this is what puzzles me! Why do people type with just the first letter of every word capitalized??

(I'm sorry, I don't have a real response for your idiotic post...the style of your post elicited a much stronger reaction out of me)

mikekim
05-21-2007, 04:01 AM
oh..got deleted. But yeah...why do people do that (typing with caps on the first letter)??

velik_m
05-21-2007, 04:13 AM
oh..got deleted. But yeah...why do people do that (typing with caps on the first letter)??

They don't. They write in all caps and it gets converted.

ChumpDumper
05-21-2007, 04:15 AM
They're German.

mikekim
05-21-2007, 04:18 AM
They don't. They write in all caps and it gets converted.

Ah...that's another thing I've wondered about too. why do people type in all caps? hmmm...I guess people write in all caps because...they think it looks cool? important? ahh, who knows...

And I also wonder about all these damn acronyms that seem so common to everyone but me. WDAPAAA (What Designates A Phrase As An Acronym)?? Does someone just decide that a phrase is common and starts using it? I have to have urbandictionary.com open on a tab while going through forums sometimes... maybe i'm just out of date.

ATXSPUR
05-21-2007, 04:26 AM
ha!

GhostofAlfrederickHughes
05-21-2007, 07:45 AM
Wojo's a moron. Nobody ever mentioned the fact that it was RAJA BELL who instigated the 'altercation.' Watch the video, Horry turned away and started heading upcourt after the foul. If Bell doesn't get into his face, the suspensions never happen.

ATRAIN
05-21-2007, 08:04 AM
Horry has the most rings for a reason. He knew what he was doing when he did it. Do i agree with it..maybe not.....did Nash Flop........hell yes but who doesn't in this day and age. I think Horry and his big shot ways deserves a standing Ovation all the time. I was glad to see it.

CubanMustGo
05-21-2007, 08:21 AM
What pissed me off was that the CBS employee blogger (on Sportsline.com) yesterday called SA fans "classless" for giving Horry the standing O, because Horry was trying to deliberately injure Poor Little Stevie.

easjer
05-21-2007, 09:06 AM
One hard foul where his arms never left his body and where he aimed at the midsection is not at all the same as a blow to the head or a clothesline.

Nor is it the same thing as booing a player who WANTED to play for your team, but who was cut anyway and decided to continue playing. City smack is just weak.

This author is a hack and I love Robert Horry a little more for having read this.

tom24421
05-21-2007, 10:17 AM
Robert Horry is a bumb! I am no Danny Ainge fan (as coach or player) but, anyone who throws a towel in their coaches face is a bumb! Anyone who makes the kind of foul that Horry did at the end of game four is is bumb! You foul with your hands and arms in the open court at the end of a decided game... and you don't stick out your left elbow for good measure. If you can't see the truth in that than you don't know basketball at all! Comapring a hard foul as you go to the basket to fouling to stop the clock in the open court of a decided game is a dumb comparison for Horry to make. The simple fact of the matter is that Horry was pissed that the Spurs blew the game and wanted to dish out some vigilante justice. Horry made a stupid play and is clearly not man enough to admit it. Anyone who sticks up for Robert Horry is a bumb including everyone that stood up and cheered for him when he entered game 1 of the Western Conference Finals. The Spurs are too good of a team to resort to Robert Horry tactics.

As a Suns fan, I am willing to admit that the Spurs are no doubt a great team and likely would have won the series anyway. I also think that Stat and Diaw are to blame for their own suspensions for thinking before they acted. I agree that there must me a punishment for leaving the bench during an altercation. However, I also feel that the punishment should fit the crime. If a player from the bench contributes to the altercation then they should be fined AND suspended. If a player serves as peacemaker or does not escalate the situation they should still be fined, but not suspended. Anyway, the rule is a rule and I think the NBA made the right decision, but from the Suns perspective it was, no doubt, a tough pill to swallow.

Having said all that, Robert Horry is a bumb. He was a bumb before he played for San Antonio and still is!

Don Quixote
05-21-2007, 10:22 AM
The funny thing about all this is how every teams's fans will stand by their team for whatever crap they do. Last years booing of finley by mavs fan was deemed 'classless' and comments by cuban about the riverwalk created uproar but at the same time people will celebrate bowen's and horry's cheapshots as heroic and comments against them will be said to be made only because the other team's lost.

Horry who basically says that he will do anything(he says as long as he doesnt injure the guy) to get a victory couldnt take all the trash talking etc from the mavs last year. Too bad he cant take what he dishes out.

Not unlike Mavs Fan ... where has he been? For all he dished out this year, he's been strangely absent the past couple of weeks. Oh wait, he's at home watching some other team win the trophy. Good riddance, I say. Come back when your team has won something.

mikekim
05-21-2007, 11:50 AM
Robert Horry is a bumb! I am no Danny Ainge fan (as coach or player) but, anyone who throws a towel in their coaches face is a bumb! Anyone who makes the kind of foul that Horry did at the end of game four is is bumb! You foul with your hands and arms in the open court at the end of a decided game... and you don't stick out your left elbow for good measure. If you can't see the truth in that than you don't know basketball at all! Comapring a hard foul as you go to the basket to fouling to stop the clock in the open court of a decided game is a dumb comparison for Horry to make. The simple fact of the matter is that Horry was pissed that the Spurs blew the game and wanted to dish out some vigilante justice. Horry made a stupid play and is clearly not man enough to admit it. Anyone who sticks up for Robert Horry is a bumb including everyone that stood up and cheered for him when he entered game 1 of the Western Conference Finals. The Spurs are too good of a team to resort to Robert Horry tactics.

As a Suns fan, I am willing to admit that the Spurs are no doubt a great team and likely would have won the series anyway. I also think that Stat and Diaw are to blame for their own suspensions for thinking before they acted. I agree that there must me a punishment for leaving the bench during an altercation. However, I also feel that the punishment should fit the crime. If a player from the bench contributes to the altercation then they should be fined AND suspended. If a player serves as peacemaker or does not escalate the situation they should still be fined, but not suspended. Anyway, the rule is a rule and I think the NBA made the right decision, but from the Suns perspective it was, no doubt, a tough pill to swallow.

Having said all that, Robert Horry is a bumb. He was a bumb before he played for San Antonio and still is!

It's "bum," and Robert Horry and Spurs fans are not "bums." (except for the baseline bums.) And they DID NOT think before they acted. And I don't think you understand the rules of the NBA. And Amare wasn't walking onto the court to serve as a peacemaker--nor was he going to check on Nash nor to "check in," as he so adamantly claimed in the post-game conference and interviews.

Soul_Patch
05-21-2007, 12:01 PM
bumb :reading :dizzy

YoMamaIsCallin
05-21-2007, 12:07 PM
I am really glad to see this interview with Horry. I agree with him 100% and have been posting this since day zero of "the incident". The Horry foul on Nash was a Flagrant 2 hard foul in today's game (10 years ago it would have just been a common foul). But it was nothing close to an intent to injure, and should not have caused a suspension. Horry did not go for the head. Horry did not hit someone in the air. It was just a good clean hard playoff foul.

Every ex-player and ex-coach commentator that I've seen agrees with me that they don't understand why this is so blown out of proportion. It's only the "sports analyst" and media contingents that seem to want to keep whipping this horse.

Can anyone think of another body-to-body foul in the open court with both players' feet on the ground that caused a suspension? I sure can't. I think this is unprecedented.

My theory is that, had Amare/Diaw not come off the bench, Horry would not have been suspended. It was a make-up call.

tom24421
05-21-2007, 02:01 PM
Bum... bumb... my mistake... you still got the message. No one will EVER know what Diaw and Stat's intentions were, but the fact remains that the they did not escalate the altercation. The coaches refrained them from making anything worse so why should they be suspended? Fined yes! Suspended no! If they would have made it to the "altercation" and either made physical contact or made made verbal statements that escalated the situation than the suspensions would have been justified. Depending on what they MIGHT have done, perhaps more than one game would have been warranted. By rule of law... I just think someone should be punished for what they DID do... not what they MIGHT have done. Innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt... ring a bell? Horry is still a bum (thanks for helping my spelling miscue)!!! :bang

Soul_Patch
05-21-2007, 02:04 PM
I agree they did not escalate the situation, but the fact is they broke the rule. The rule all owners for the past 10 years have been signing off on, that has been enforced numerous times and no one has had a problem with untill now.


There are always what if's, just gotta learn to live with em.

ChumpDumper
05-21-2007, 02:05 PM
By rule of law... I just think someone should be punished for what they DID do.They were punished for what they did do -- they left the bench area during an altercation. It's not like this is a new rule.

Rummpd
05-21-2007, 02:22 PM
The win was not assured, that is why Horry fouled Nash. Wosh is an idiot.

YoMamaIsCallin
05-21-2007, 02:32 PM
Bum... bumb... my mistake... you still got the message. No one will EVER know what Diaw and Stat's intentions were, but the fact remains that the they did not escalate the altercation. The coaches refrained them from making anything worse so why should they be suspended? Fined yes! Suspended no! If they would have made it to the "altercation" and either made physical contact or made made verbal statements that escalated the situation than the suspensions would have been justified. Depending on what they MIGHT have done, perhaps more than one game would have been warranted. By rule of law... I just think someone should be punished for what they DID do... not what they MIGHT have done. Innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt... ring a bell? Horry is still a bum (thanks for helping my spelling miscue)!!! :bang

This is so typical of an immature attitude about rules. You think you're entitled to "fairness" in rules interpretation, by your definition of "fairness". You think that the blame lies with someone else when you break the rules. You think that your intention should be considered.

Sorry to introduce you to the real world in such a harsh fashion -- but -- none of these things is actually true.

I'll leave you with two quotes from the series:

1. Gregg Popovich wrote on the board for his players to see before Game 5:

"Expect nothing. Ask for nothing."

2. Shaq O'Neal, when asked if the suspensions were fair, said:

"Life isn't fair. They don't even let you bring toothpaste on airplanes any more."

MadDog73
05-21-2007, 03:10 PM
Hmm, maybe the fans were giving Horry a standing ovation because this is probably his last Playoffs, and he just got back after being suspended for two days?

tom24421
05-21-2007, 03:23 PM
If you all will look back at my original post this morning you would see that I said that under the current rule I agreed with the NBA's ruling. Amare and Boris did NOT (my mistake again) think before the acted. There is no doubt that under the current rule they should have been suspended. If they wouldn't have then the player's union could appeal any future decision made under that rule. The correct call was made by the league. The conversation that I am trying to create or perhaps the point I am trying to make is that if the rule were just it would be changed to incorporate the language that I propose. Rules are rules, but are always open to human interpretation. Not to get into a civics lessen, but that is what the courts are for. They interpret the laws and hand down punishments based upon the spirit of the law. I guess what I am trying to say is that the rule should be amended FOR FUTURE instances to protect players that don't really do anything. There is a big differnce between a player who takes 5-10 steps and is cut off by an assistant coach and on the other hand a player that sprints into the altercation and starts grabbing and pushing people or talking trash. Even as a Suns fan I would say that if say Kurt Thomas would have done that at the end of one of the games to Tony Parker and then Duncan and Brent Barry steped toward the altercation and the Spurs assistants stopped them before they could actually do anything... I can honestly say that I wouldn't want them to be suspended... becasue they wouldn't have actually DONE anything to warrant a suspension. To be honest, rule or no rule I like the fact that Suns players jumped up like that when they saw one of their teammates get smashed... part of that is just the curiosity of being a human being, but also being ready to help out a teammate. To be honest if the shoe had been on the other foot I think Spurs players would have done the same thing, becasue at least from an outsider perspective if the Spurs are nothing else they are a great TEAM. A trait that the Suns are trying to learn... and if they do they will beat the Spurs in the near future if the managment doesn't panic and start trading poople away. Neverthless... I am a long time Suns fan and Horry is still a bum... without the extra "b" of course. :drunk

ChumpDumper
05-21-2007, 03:29 PM
I guess what I am trying to say is that the rule should be amended FOR FUTURE instances to protect players that don't really do anything.There's no reason to change it. Players should stay near the bench. Period.

Kamnik
05-21-2007, 05:06 PM
you got to love Horry!

fuck all the whiny pussies that call themselves players

hell... i play with my friends and we do a lot of HARD fouls all the time and noone says anything

and some guys whine about hard plays in the playoffs lol

tom24421
05-21-2007, 06:30 PM
There's no reason to change it. Players should stay near the bench. Period.

I know that this is a lame response, but it just came to me and I found it fitting...

"Only a Sith speaks in absolutes."

-Obi Won Kenobi to Anikan Skywalker in Star Wars just before Anikan officially turns into Darth Vader: Episode III

Life is all about the grey area... there is no such thing as black and white... not even the law.

And... Horry is still a bum!

Money316
05-21-2007, 06:44 PM
In some language Wojciechowski translates to asshole.
Polelander I think.

:fro :wtf :fro

ChumpDumper
05-21-2007, 07:28 PM
Inexplicable Star Wars quote.There are already gray areas in the rule. Amare and Boris went far outside those areas.

Stay near the bench.

tom24421
05-21-2007, 08:15 PM
Stay near the bench.

Define "near."

ChumpDumper
05-21-2007, 08:25 PM
Near = Not 20 feet away.

The rule was changed to allow players to do something like stick their toes over the sideline (Pat Ewing did precisely this), not sprint 20 feet away from the bench.

Amare was free to put his toes over the sideline.

tom24421
05-21-2007, 09:20 PM
Amare was free to put his toes over the sideline.

Not that I think it warranted anything but a technical foul for coming on the court during play... but was Duncan "near" the bench or was he too far away when Bowen had to come and get him? ... just as an example of where the barrier actually is... for example

mikekim
05-21-2007, 09:42 PM
Not that I think it warranted anything but a technical foul for coming on the court during play... but was Duncan "near" the bench or was he too far away when Bowen had to come and get him? ... just as an example of where the barrier actually is... for example

There was no altercation. So Duncan was lucky that he did it w/ no altercation. We've already covered this in here (this forum) many times. We realize you're new.

There are many threads discussing the altercation issue and the suspension. The search function is up for now, so I suggest you read through those other threads.

tom24421
05-21-2007, 10:32 PM
There was no altercation. So Duncan was lucky that he did it w/ no altercation. We've already covered this in here (this forum) many times. We realize you're new.

There are many threads discussing the altercation issue and the suspension. The search function is up for now, so I suggest you read through those other threads.

Two issues:

1. Why do I have to go to another thread to discuss the issue. I would agree that I am a novice to posting on message boards, but what is the difference if I post it here or somewhere else. The topic of the thread was Horry's ESPN response to the "altercation." I am being serious... please enlighten me if I am posting incorrectly.

2. You statement gets right to my point earlier about the "grey" areas of life and rules, etc. I have already said that the NBA made the right decision, but now I am talking about rule interpretation and I think it is an interesting conversation. Just as I asked the other guy to define "near," I would ask you to define "altercation." Elson dunks the ball and then, I believe, James Jones inadvertantly gets tangled up with him while he is hanging on the rim. Duncan clearly walks out onto the court and starts yelling something to Jones and Bowen has to come get him to sit down. Altercation is defined in the Thesaurus as:

argument
quarrel
disagreement
dispute
exchange
squabble
clash
difference of opinion

So is what Duncan did an "altercation." If Jones would have heard and responded to Duncan by walking toward him what MIGHT have happened? MIGHT is the key word becasue the rule was intended to prevent what MIGHT have happened... that is why the penalty is so harsh. Would it have been an altercation then? By the above synonyms I would say it was an altercation anyway. If it wasn't an altercation or a least "heated words" then why did Bowen have to come and get Duncan? Anyway my point is that at least understand the frustration of the Suns fan when NBA simply rules out the 2nd quarter "altercation" as a non issue. The Suns are being held accountable to the "letter of the law" and I think that under the "letter of the law" one COULD make the same case for the Duncan case. Am I being nitpicky... yes! Do I think UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES that Duncan did NOT deserve to get a suspension... of course I don't think he deserved it... I do think he should have got a technical foul though. Granted... the Suns "altercation" was way more intense but UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES (that being that the Suns coaches prevented the two players from becoming physically involved in the altercation) that a suspension was only warranted because of the LETTER OF THE LAW/RULE, not because of what they players MIGHT have done. Anyway... I hope you don't mind me posting this here and I hope that, UNDER THE LETTER OF THE LAW, you can see the parallel of the two instances. If you don't... no hard feelings. :toast

sandeepgm
05-22-2007, 09:56 AM
Booing finley was/is classless. So is insulting an entire city.

Bowen and Horry are not dirty players. Although i do think Horry's foul was dumb and was at least a little dirty....still Terry's deliberate, aimed punch at the balls is infinitely dirtier. And Bowen? he's not dirty---meaning he never goes out to intentionally hurt people with his play.

As someone else on this forum mentioned, the standing ovation for Horry was not because anyone condoned his actions (although many people joke around with that, and a few are serious about it). It was more because the media and nba "fans" everywhere were taking one hard (and fairly dumb--given the sensitivity of the NBA game today) foul by Horry and using it to personally insult him and even threaten him. Even people who jokingly (or even seriously) applaud the fact that Nash went flying into the scorer's table (as a result of getting hit at the WRONG POINT IN HIS STRIDE by a foul that was NOT THAT HARD) were standing up and applauding only because of how much Horry's been insulted and condemned over the past few days. It was so overblown and exaggerated. (I think I read that the man got racist threats?? ..........)

That's what Woj....ski fails to see and mention.

Woj...ski is a joke.

He should officially change his name to "Woj...ski"



Here is today's link to the star telegram's newspaper saying cuban would welcome finley back.
http://www.star-telegram.com/287/story/110540.html

There is no hostility like you think there is. The only reason being he plays for the mavs rivals and he used to get cheered all the time. Because of the spurs-mavs rivalary they just didnt want him to be comfortable on the court, thats all. With the san antonio riverwalk being muddy, its just smack talk. Thats just the way cuban is. He likes to rile people and maybe get a reaction.

TampaDude
05-22-2007, 10:44 AM
Jeebus, Suns fans...give it a rest, already...the Spurs-Suns series is OVER...let it go...

TampaDude
05-22-2007, 10:47 AM
you got to love Horry!

fuck all the whiny pussies that call themselves players

hell... i play with my friends and we do a lot of HARD fouls all the time and noone says anything

and some guys whine about hard plays in the playoffs lol

Yup...like the old saying goes, "No autopsy, no foul!" :lol

You gotta love Horry for thinking outside the box...maybe he knew Stat and Diaw would come off the bench, maybe he didn't...but he ain't telling! GO SPURS GO!!! :toast