Can we expect to repeat with no upgrades?

[The_Game]

Lets face it. This team is an oldish team and not upgrading and adding some young blood is not a good idea. Not when other teams like Houston have upgraded their roster very well this summer. These role players are only going to get older.

Miami failed to upgrade when they won it all last year and look where that got them. First round exit. YOU NEED TO UPGRADE to repeat.

Suns will be a big threat again next year as will Dallas you would of thought with Houston being a team who could give Spurs plenty of problems with their star talent and depth.

Can Spurs really expect to win it all next year as well? as lets face It we caught a big break in the Suns series with the suspensions e.t.c. Can guys like Bowen, Finley, Horry all being a year older help enough again to repeat as champions?

The talk of Odoka would help as although he is 30 he had a great season with Portland last year and he would had good defense, shooting and will add depth.

Obviously having Duncan, Parker and Manu as the main 3 will keep Spurs right up there with the best this coming season but will It be enough with these other contenders who are big threats and a team like Houston who have added alot of talent this summer?

[my2sons]

I'm sure wades injury had nothing to do with that. Plus he is part of their key players, the players mentioned with the exception of bruce are all role players. I think it depends on how drastic other teams change and how quickly they can incorporate all those changes. I think, if healthy and with the way pop watches minutes and is only concerned witht the way the team is playing after mid season, but not falling too far behind...whew...this team has an excellent chance of repeating, dispite all the doom and gloom on this board.

[bdictjames]

Miami lost because of the injuries.

If Spurs got no injuries this year, then a repeat is VERY possible. And Spurs >>> Miami in terms of talent.

[The_Game]

Actually Miami lost because their role players failed to hit shots. Granted Wade wasn't 100% but he still scored over 20+ a game, Shaq also had a good series. Miami's aging role players is what hurt them.

Wasn't comparing the spurs with the heat, I was comparing the situation. Which is pretty much the same.

[SpurYank]

One of the better basketball minds of 2 or 3 decades ago was Tom Nissalke, who may also have been the first Spurs coach back in 1972. One of the things he told Spurs fans then was that he wanted to keep team members playing together as long as possible because they learned to think alike, level certain expectations on each other, and generally believed in the old axiom that experience is the best teacher. He essentially said team play was like fine wine and the team would reap benefits over the long haul. He never quite kept the team "together" because money always dictated where players went to play. Some did stay around long enough to make the Spurs very competitive (Silas, Dietrick).

New players, even young players with "fresh legs," will require several years to jell with the strength of our team (Tony, Manu, Bruce). Our top three will likewise require several years to "learn" their strengths and to expect certain things from them. I have a feeling when we see Brent, Manu, Tim, and others, break for the basket for an uncontested lay up, there was certain body language or looks in their eyes that made the play.

Having said all the above, I'm probably one of the few who think that we actually strengthened ourselves by keeping this team together and continuing to "jell" as a team. Pop probably will do more reviewing known skills then teaching them. If the past is any indication of what is coming for the Spurs, I think it looks good for the immediate future.

[bigfish22]

If it ain't broke, then don't try to fix it

[CosmicCowboy]

I don't think you can "expect" a repeat no matter what you do.

[SAGambler]

One of the better basketball minds of 2 or 3 decades ago was Tom Nissalke, who may also have been the first Spurs coach back in 1972. One of the things he told Spurs fans then was that he wanted to keep team members playing together as long as possible because they learned to think alike, level certain expectations on each other, and generally believed in the old axiom that experience is the best teacher. He essentially said team play was like fine wine and the team would reap benefits over the long haul. He never quite kept the team "together" because money always dictated where players went to play. Some did stay around long enough to make the Spurs very competitive (Silas, Dietrick).

New players, even young players with "fresh legs," will require several years to jell with the strength of our team (Tony, Manu, Bruce). Our top three will likewise require several years to "learn" their strengths and to expect certain things from them. I have a feeling when we see Brent, Manu, Tim, and others, break for the basket for an uncontested lay up, there was certain body language or looks in their eyes that made the play.

Having said all the above, I'm probably one of the few who think that we actually strengthened ourselves by keeping this team together and continuing to "jell" as a team. Pop probably will do more reviewing known skills then teaching them. If the past is any indication of what is coming for the Spurs, I think it looks good for the immediate future.


Well put. It seems not many fans understand this. Chemistry on a team can go just as far if not farther than pure talent alone. That's why I don't (at least this next season) see Houston being the dynamo that everyone is predicting.

I think once again it comes down to the Spurs, the Suns, and the Mavs, and I don't think Phoenix has done themselves any favors by getting rid of the one guy that can half way guard Duncan. And who knows what state of mind the Mavs will be in after the past two season debacles they have been part of.

In a nutshell, I see no reason, other than major injuries to one or more of the big 3, that the Spurs can't repeat.

I just don't get it why people don't understand what we have in this Spurs team. And why they always think it can "be made better" by bringing in new players.

[Capt Bringdown]

Didn't we have new roster members on each of our title runs?
Resting on your laurels and hoping for free passes from Father Time is a piss poor strategy IMO.

Now is not the time to be so damned conservative and timid (not to mention cheap). Our window of opportunity is closing in the Duncan era. We need upgrades, that's an undeniable fact. So far it looks like this off season is a zero. Here's to hoping the FO can take advantage of the time we have left with Duncan. We're gonna miss these days so very badly when it's over. Get it done, guys.

[mountainballer]

If it ain't broke, then don't try to fix it
or
If you don't go forward, you go backwards.

people can choose. I take the latter philosophy, especially in sports.
the "old" players have another year in their legs and we shouldn't forget, that last year Spurs were quite lucky regarding injuries. a team with such an old roster can't count on another injury free season. (I'm not counting "little" injuries, that force a player to miss some 5 games). during 20 PO games Spurs didn't have a single missed game of a rotation player because of injuries. that's quite amazing but also unusually.

so, of course it is possible to repeat with this roster, but I guess it would take even more luck than last season. IMO the Spurs need to at least add two younger players. (not thinking about rookies like Ian or Williams, thinking about high energy guys players like Barnes for example)

[RC's Boss]

If it ain't broke, then don't try to fix it
:toast

[Reggie Miller]

The entire NBA would benefit from a true minor league system. A team with the Spurs' stability would benefit even more. For example, the Oakland A's and Atlanta Braves have a unified theory of instruction and player development at every level. That's right up Popovich's alley. Seriously, I bet he would be interested in the challenge of building up a system comparable to that of the European club teams like Real Madrid.

[spursfaninla]

Sure, the thesis of this thread makes sense in general. Kept together, a good team gets better. A championship team kept together will continue to do good things. Therefore, the Spurs should stay together for more championship runs.

HOWEVER, we are not just talking about "fresh legs"...we are talking about a 36 year old starter (bruce) with no other guy with his size to spell him. We are talking about the oldest team in the league. We are talking about looking at a BIG turnover in a year or two, with Horry, Barry, Finley, Vaugn, and Bowen all leaving; guys with important roles in the 8 man rotation.

Sure, leave them in as long as you can. The big 3 matter most. The rest can be replaced when needed.

How about maybe we think about finding guys who can and will watch, learn, and grown into becoming the next guys to play in the rotation, instead of starting over from scratch when they retire and we have to get a completely new guy to start!

[SAGambler]

Didn't we have new roster members on each of our title runs?
Resting on your laurels and hoping for free passes from Father Time is a piss poor strategy IMO.

Now is not the time to be so damned conservative and timid (not to mention cheap). Our window of opportunity is closing in the Duncan era. We need upgrades, that's an undeniable fact. So far it looks like this off season is a zero. Here's to hoping the FO can take advantage of the time we have left with Duncan. We're gonna miss these days so very badly when it's over. Get it done, guys.

Oh yeah. Let's get the "cheap card" in.

Tell me. If it was YOUR money, how many "new players" would you add at a few million each, to ride the bench or wear sports jackets to games?

You act like a few million here and a few million there doesn't matter. But I'm guessing if it were your millions being pissed away, you would change your tune.

Just who the hell is out there, right now, that would make an immediate impact on the current roster? And if they can't make an immediate impact, what do you need them for?

The Spurs have 2 or 3 more years to start bringing in new blood, with maybe the exception of Bruce. Why start today? If you bring in a guy today that is 27, and expect him to ride the bench pretty much for 3 years, guess what? He is going to be 30 (and old, by your standards) by the time he can contribute.

I may be the only person here that actually thinks the FO knows exactly what they are doing and have a plan in place for the future.

[rascal]

Didn't we have new roster members on each of our title runs?
Resting on your laurels and hoping for free passes from Father Time is a piss poor strategy IMO.

Now is not the time to be so damned conservative and timid (not to mention cheap). Our window of opportunity is closing in the Duncan era. We need upgrades, that's an undeniable fact. So far it looks like this off season is a zero. Here's to hoping the FO can take advantage of the time we have left with Duncan. We're gonna miss these days so very badly when it's over. Get it done, guys.

Agree with this. Doing nothing and believing everything will fall into place like it did last year and not trying to get better is not the best strategy. I don't like conservative approaches. You play not to lose by standing pat.

Its better to play to win and look to always try to improve. The spurs did not go 82-0.


The spurs should always pursue trades that will make them better no matter what happened the previous year.

[barbacoataco]

If everyone is healthy like this year, of course the Spurs can repeat. Parker could be even better next year. Ginobili and Finley are the question marks in my mind. If they continue downhill, that could be trouble.

[samikeyp]

One of the better basketball minds of 2 or 3 decades ago was Tom Nissalke, who may also have been the first Spurs coach back in 1972.

You are correct. He coached the Spurs in 73-74 after a stint with the Chaps in 71-72.

[dbestpro]

It's an even year. The system is designed to only win in off years. In other words it takes Duncan, Manu and Tony about two years before they get hungry again.

[El_Mago]

I'm not too worried.

Outside of Houston, no one who is title contention ready has vastly improved out West.

Dallas has not made any big or drastic changes.

Phoenix just shipped away their best defender (guarding Tim Duncan wise).

Denver will have one strong team if they can stay healthy and build chemistry, but I doubt they can beat the Spurs in a seven-game series.

Utah quite frankly has stayed the same, and still do not have a consistent SG.

Golden State still needs to prove they were nothing more than a fluke.

Houston, however, has made pretty good strides.

Steve Francis, Mike James, Tracy McGrady, Luis Scola, Yao Ming
Rafer Alston, Luther Head, Bonzi Wells, Chuck Hayes, Jackie Butler
Others: Rookie PG, Novak, John Lucas III, etc...

[Fabbs]

Celts added a healthy Billy Walton for one of the greatest teams '86
Bulls added Kukoch, then Dennis the Menace
Traitor Spurs owner gave the Flamers Michelle Thompsan for '87 and '88.
Lakers added Grant and off the bench Ron Harper to go along with the refs for their 00-01 repeat.

If Spurs want to continue One n Done, standing pat and saving HoltCat more millions may be the way to go.

However, none of the other teams other then Hou has done much so maybe if Pop limits the minutes and back to backs a repeat can be done as is. Finally.

[Mr. Body]

Celts added a healthy Billy Walton for one of the greatest teams '86
Bulls added Kukoch, then Dennis the Menace
Traitor Spurs owner gave the Flamers Michelle Thompsan for '87 and '88.
Lakers added Grant and off the bench Ron Harper to go along with the refs for their 00-01 repeat.

If Spurs want to continue One n Done, standing pat and saving HoltCat more millions may be the way to go.

However, none of the other teams other then Hou has done much so maybe if Pop limits the minutes and back to backs a repeat can be done as is. Finally.

I agree for the most part. Holt shouldn't spend like a sailor, but the midst of a championship run isn't the time to go down to nickels and dimes. Alas, that's precisely what happened.

[sribb43]

well there wasnt much of any upgrades for the spurs last offseason after the loss to Dallas and they won the champioship this year, make a small aquistion here and there otherwise the spurs are fine as long as they have manu, timmy and tony.

[saporvida]

god i hate that face dirk makes in that picture... you aint no jordan so keep your tongue in your mouth!

[SpursDynasty]

Lets face it. This team is an oldish team and not upgrading and adding some young blood is not a good idea. Not when other teams like Houston have upgraded their roster very well this summer. These role players are only going to get older.

Miami failed to upgrade when they won it all last year and look where that got them. First round exit. YOU NEED TO UPGRADE to repeat.

Suns will be a big threat again next year as will Dallas you would of thought with Houston being a team who could give Spurs plenty of problems with their star talent and depth.

Can Spurs really expect to win it all next year as well? as lets face It we caught a big break in the Suns series with the suspensions e.t.c. Can guys like Bowen, Finley, Horry all being a year older help enough again to repeat as champions?

The talk of Odoka would help as although he is 30 he had a great season with Portland last year and he would had good defense, shooting and will add depth.

Obviously having Duncan, Parker and Manu as the main 3 will keep Spurs right up there with the best this coming season but will It be enough with these other contenders who are big threats and a team like Houston who have added alot of talent this summer?

Oh man. One of the worst posts I've ever seen here.

1. Didn't everyone say the Spurs were "old" and "unathletic" after 2006? Hmm gee I wonder what the Spurs did after that, oh that's right THEY WON THE DAMN CHAMPIONSHIP.

2. To say Miami failed to upgrade and lost is one of the stupidest things ever. Why did Miami win last year? Dwayne Wade. Dwayne Wade was about 25% of what he was last year in this year's playoffs, because of his injury, plain and simple!

3. I thought the Suns and Mavericks were supposed to be a threat this year??? Well they weren't. And Houston? :lol No team with Tracy McGrady will ever win a championship: They blew a 2-0 series lead in 2005, and a 2-0 series lead in 2007. What will a 2-0 series lead mean for the Rockets from now on? Probably nothing.

4. There was no "break" with suspensions. The Spurs had already proved themselves a superior team to Phoenix: Won the season series 2-1, and had a better overall Western Conference record than Phoenix. Phoenix's better record came from playing solid vs. the East. The Spurs have been known this year to get careless and let a couple of meaningless games slip vs. teams such as the Bobcats, Magic, and Cavs.

:lol

[SRJ]

It's an even year. The system is designed to only win in off years. In other words it takes Duncan, Manu and Tony about two years before they get hungry again.

I hope this is some sort of tongue-in-cheek type of comment. In case it was not:

In 1999, the Spurs won the championship. In 2000, Tim Duncan missed the last nine games of the regular season and the playoffs. "Hunger" won't overcome something like "a Duncan injury".

In 2003, the Spurs went 60-22 and won the championship. In 2004, despite having to turn over half the roster and Duncan missing 13 games, they still posted 57-25 and lost in the second round to the eventual Finalists, the Lakers. Was that a hunger issue?

In 2005, the Spurs went 59-23 and won the championship. In 2006, despite Duncan playing most of the year through plantar fasciitis and posting the worst statistical season of his career, the Spurs set a new franchise record 63-19 and lost in the second round to the eventual Finalists, the Mavericks, in seven games. After battling back from a 3-1 series deficit. Hunger?

It's really stupid to think competitors like Popovich, Ginobili, and Duncan don't want to win every single year.

Again, if you were being tongue in cheek, pay no attention to this post.

[Fast Dunk]

For the 10,000.00 time There will be NO REPEAT.

Hopefully the league cleanup the mess from last year and the refs call the games fairly enough, then believe me, there will be no repeat.

[SRJ]

Yeah, it sucks winning every other year. Boo hoo. This no repeat thing has really got me feeling blue. Man, that Fast Dunk guy really knows how to take us down a peg. If only we Spurs fans had something - anything - to throw in the face of a Cavaliers fan...ahh, it's all a pipe dream. Cavs fans have it too good.

[J.T.]

Dallas gave that championship to Miami. To say Miami truly earned that championship as opposed to Dallas choking it to them is just wrong. They were obviously exposed for what they really are this year when they were swept.

The "too old" card has been played too much. If they were too old to beat Dallas in '06, why were they able to beat all the hot teams with young stars like all of the teams they bounced on the way to #4?

The Spurs will always be the Paul Newman of the league while everyone else is trying to be Tom Cruise.

[Fast Dunk]

Dallas gave that championship to Miami. To say Miami truly earned that championship as opposed to Dallas choking it to them is just wrong. They were obviously exposed for what they really are this year when they were swept.

The "too old" card has been played too much. If they were too old to beat Dallas in '06, why were they able to beat all the hot teams with young stars like all of the teams they bounced on the way to #4?

The Spurs will always be the Paul Newman of the league while everyone else is trying to be Tom Cruise.

They needed help to win a title and you know it...

They're too old to win fair and square.

[Mister Sinister]

The Spurs will always be the Paul Newman of the league while everyone else is trying to be Tom Cruise.

That analogy is made of awesome and epic fucking win.

[spurster]

The Spurs need to add younger players now so they can "repeat" in 2009. A lot of Spurs players play much better in their second year on the team compared to the first. Cases in point include: Parker, SJax, Devin, Finley, Oberto.

[saporvida]

Dallas gave that championship to Miami. To say Miami truly earned that championship as opposed to Dallas choking it to them is just wrong. They were obviously exposed for what they really are this year when they were swept.

The "too old" card has been played too much. If they were too old to beat Dallas in '06, why were they able to beat all the hot teams with young stars like all of the teams they bounced on the way to #4?

The Spurs will always be the Paul Newman of the league while everyone else is trying to be Tom Cruise.

dallas gave miami the championship? for one dallas had nothing in hand to give away and another, who the fuck deliberately chokes just so another team can enjoy the honor of hosting a championship parade?

dallas flat out sucks and if anything was exposed in '06 & '07 it's that dallas doesn't have what it takes mentally or physically to win a championship. are you going to suggest that dallas also gave away the first round to the warriors because dallas is a bunch of nice guys and thought what the hell?

enjoy watching your team choke once again year after year.

[41times]

no!

[SAGambler]

For the 10,000.00 time There will be NO REPEAT.

Hopefully the league cleanup the mess from last year and the refs call the games fairly enough, then believe me, there will be no repeat.

I doubt we will see a repeat of Cleveland being in the ECF either.

ECF will probably be Chicago - Detroit.

So I hope you guys enjoyed your 30 minutes of fame after winning the ECF this past year. You won't be seing it again.

[Reggie Miller]

The Spurs aren't even my favorite team, and I have never been to San Antonio. With that in mind, I would have to say that the Spurs did not overachieve in 1999, 2003, 2005, and 2007. In fact, I would argue that they underachieved, or even choked, in 2004 and 2006.

The Spurs have been the best team in the NBA for at least five years now. If you can't see that, I can't help you. Looking at the statistics alone, the Spurs should be in the Finals every year with their defense. Looking at the play on the floor, there isn't much doubt either.

If the Spurs are as healthy next year as they were this year, they won't need "new" players. Is that a big "IF?" Hell, yes. The real problem is that I don't see younger players contributing to a title run on this team. Does it really matter who ends up getting the DNP- Coach's Decision?

[exstatic]

The Spurs have NEVER brought back the entire rotation to attempt a repeat, let alone the entire 12 man active roster.

2000 No Sean, Mario mails it in...
2004 No DRob, Jack, Speedy
2006 No Devin, Nazr, Rasho

[ManuTastic]

The question is: did anyone else upgrade enough to beat us? Suns got worse by trading Thomas (note to D'Antoni: you need more defense, not less); Houston just bought themselves a nice problem at PG (just wait till the mid-season benchings of Stevie Franchise). Only other serious threat is Dallas, and I frankly didn't see any of the Golden State series (damn the west coast start times) so I admit I don't know what their problem is or what they might do next season. I still think they have the horses to beat us, as they have proven.
Still, staying together and gelling, as has been pointed out, is a much rarer luxury and precious commodity in pro sports than making trades or shaking up the roster. Just sk Melo how he feels about the AI 'upgrade' last season.

[Roxsfan]

Actually Miami lost because their role players failed to hit shots. Granted Wade wasn't 100% but he still scored over 20+ a game, Shaq also had a good series. Miami's aging role players is what hurt them.

Wasn't comparing the spurs with the heat, I was comparing the situation. Which is pretty much the same.

Miami lost because their old vets got what they wanted......a trophy and had zero motivation beyond just saying what everyone wanted to hear.......we will be back, repeat and all that shiit.

Spurs will be right there in the mix, unless something slows down duncan....then forget it........lottery time.

[Roxsfan]

I'm not too worried.

Outside of Houston, no one who is title contention ready has vastly improved out West.

Dallas has not made any big or drastic changes.

Phoenix just shipped away their best defender (guarding Tim Duncan wise).

Denver will have one strong team if they can stay healthy and build chemistry, but I doubt they can beat the Spurs in a seven-game series.

Utah quite frankly has stayed the same, and still do not have a consistent SG.
No, they got worse.....lost derek fisher
Golden State still needs to prove they were nothing more than a fluke.

Houston, however, has made pretty good strides.

Steve Francis, Mike James, Tracy McGrady, Luis Scola, Yao Ming
Rafer Alston, Luther Head, Bonzi Wells, Chuck Hayes, Jackie Butler
Others: Aaron Brooks, Novak, John Lucas III, etc...
you can't forget Shane Battier, Kirk Snyder,Mutombo? Justin Reed, Mike Harris, a few other unsigned draft picks.........

rafer and JL3 are probably out in return for another 4 maybe.......

looks good on paper, if health upholds...........should be a nightmare for teams coming thru TX





I don't think you can "expect" a repeat no matter what you do.

You can expect a repeat all day, all year long.........to guarantee one on the other hand.........I would agree with your comment.

[SpursFan0728]

IMO, even tho we NEED up-grades
i still see Spurs as a contender in the finals with their roster right now

[Testing]

In fact, I would argue that they underachieved, or even choked, in 2004 and 2006.

Word. They definitely choked both years....though more so in 2006 I think. They were more than capable of beating Dallas, I don't know what happened to them.

[saporvida]

Word. They definitely choked both years....though more so in 2006 I think. They were more than capable of beating Dallas, I don't know what happened to them.


how did the spurs choke?

2004 recap... we were down and came back to see duncan's shot overshadowed by the infamous .4.

2006 recap... we were down and came back to see duncan get fouled(and bowen) not once but twice in the closing seconds of regulation with no call.

if anything we were right there fighting to survive... something i can't say for either LA in 2004 finals or Dallas in 2006 finals. talk about choke jobs... those two teams give the best head.

[Supreme_Being]

Banzai- continous improvement.

[peskypesky]

I don't think it's absolutely crucial for the Spurs to "upgrade" the roster, but it sure would make me feel a bit better to see the FO aggressively trying to do that. I sure would like to see an energy guy like Matt Barnes (or even Anderson Verajao) in a Spurs uniform next year.

[pjjrfan]

The question is: did anyone else upgrade enough to beat us? Suns got worse by trading Thomas (note to D'Antoni: you need more defense, not less); Houston just bought themselves a nice problem at PG (just wait till the mid-season benchings of Stevie Franchise). Only other serious threat is Dallas, and I frankly didn't see any of the Golden State series (damn the west coast start times) so I admit I don't know what their problem is or what they might do next season. I still think they have the horses to beat us, as they have proven.
Still, staying together and gelling, as has been pointed out, is a much rarer luxury and precious commodity in pro sports than making trades or shaking up the roster. Just sk Melo how he feels about the AI 'upgrade' last season.
I think Dallas' problem is upstairs in their heads. They were easily the better team against the Heat, but the Heat gave them a fight and the Mavs wilted, against the Warriors they began the series on their heels and never recovered. The team is very talented but something always holds them back and I think it's more mental than anything else.

I'm a firm believer in bringing back the team as is, injuries will always derail any team, ours is no exception but if healthy Oberto, Elson, Bonner and Vaughn will play better within the system and should improve the team. Also Tony is growing by leaps and his game looks to improve, while Finley, Barry, Manu, Horry and Bowen are set in the rotation and still very capable and fit. And the key of course is a healthy Tim Duncan, with him playing like he has especially in the playoffs this team has a very good chance of repeating. Plus the mental makeup of this team is solid, they don't think they can win, they know it.

[Clutch20]

The Spurs stand pat with their crew knowing their roles. No one will have to yell at anyone else (except maybe Elson) about floor positioning, transitioning, coverage etc.

Rings bring confidence. Riding the bench whether you're a starter or role player will be easier to do this year.

That looseness should contribute to an improved perimeter game. It's not a stretch to say that a couple of the vet's 3 pt. %'s will notch up 1 or 2 levels.

Will Horry team up with Bonner to paint a new layer of aggresive defensive wileyness paired with deadly long distance shooting?

It's the big 3 that cause me to wonder. I don't worry about them, they are the best at what they do. I'm thinking that they do spend quite alot of time looking to see where the other 11 players are at, how they're doing, and by Dec. they will have a pretty good idea as to what kind of Spurs team will take to the floor come Jan. of '08.

Dumb thought but I do think it nonetheless; what about the Eva factor? :married:

Will that impact on Tony's aggressiveness?