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Indazone

08-15-2007, 04:10 PM

Found this over on the Rockets board and thought it was hilarious. It has generated a lot of discussion and insults lol. Thought it would be amusing to post it here. Whether or not the story is true or not is another story. If Vspan did say these things then there are probably some embellishments to it.

VSPAN BLOG
It was just announced in Athens media that the Spurs have now signed Ime Udoka and now have 14 players under contract and only have one roster spot open and would like to add both draft picks Marcus Williams and Tiago Splitter, but because of Splitter's buyout may not be able to add him.

They have Williams unsigned and also would like to add another big man.

Apparently the buyout with Spanoulis was agreed upon, UNTIL France and Greece just played each other.......

The report comes from Panathinaikos team reporter and seems to indicate that there chances of signing Spanoulis have dropped.

They reported that after the France vs. Greece game Tony Parker called up Greg Popovich and R.C. Buford and requested that Spanoulis not be bought out and that Marcus William's roster spot go to him.

Apparently Parker told the Spurs that Spanoulis is much better than Jacque Vaughn or Beno Udrih and that he is ready to step in and be the primary backup immediately.

It was also reported that after the game Parker insisted on dining with Spanoulis and was insistent on convincing him to say with the Spurs.

It was reported interestingly enough that Spanoulis told Parker that his father had recently died and that his mother had become very depressed over this and was suicidal. He had asked for a leave of absence from the team and Jeff Van Gundy denied it he said that a radio cast mentions this is rumored to be the final straw for Spanoulis with Van Gundy.

They also apparently reported that Spanoulis has now changed his mind after talking to Parker after Parker told him that Popovich plays no favorites and that Rafer Alston would have never played over him in SA.

Spanoulis has supposedly now informed the Spurs GM that he wants to play in SA and also it was said that Buford wants to keep him, but because Spanoulis changed his mind after they signed Udoka they might not be able to, but they might work a trade to keep him because they believe he is "another Manu."

This is really good part below, this comes from what my brother says Vassilis told him..........

Supposedly Spanoulis now "hates the city of Houston and the Rockets fans" because,

1. Jeff Van Gundy made up the whole "I was T-Mac in Greece" thing and the press knew it and printed it just because Van Gundy told them to. That the radio people talked about it just because Van Gundy told them to even though they admitted to Spanoulis that Van Gundy told them it was made up.

2. The fans believed it was true and mercilessly mocked Spanoulis for it.

3. After he had asked for a family leave because of his mother's ill health after his father's death and Jeff Van Gundy denied it, Spanoulis' mom called up team GM "CD" and assistant GM Daryl Morey and asked them if Spanoulis could come home. Jeff Van Gundy would not agree to it, threatening to suspend him and sue him if he breached his contract. The Rockets management disagreed but according to Spanoulis always did what Van Gundy wanted.

Van Gundy then went to the press according to Spanoulis and leaked to them that "his mom cried on the phone and begged for her son to come back" and told the writers to put in a context that made Spanoulis look bad.

The fans then again ruthlessly attacked and mocked his mother without knowing what was going on.

4. Spanoulis said that he told the Rockets after the playoffs he would never play for them again because he didn't believe anything they told him.

His story is the Rockets GM and Vice President promised him 20-25 minutes of playing time before he signed with them and that at training camp he was told by them he would start over Rafer Alston after the first week of scrimmages. Then Jeff Van Gundy later told him he would not play all year because his wife had ordered him not to play him since he was a rookie and that might cost some games, which could cause Jeff Van Gundy to lose his job and his wife told Jeff Van Gundy that she would not accept "less spending money." This according to Spanoulis was the reason given for why Jeff Van Gundy told him "you will not play as long as I'm in charge. Go back to Greece where they still play basketball in barns."

Spanoulis says that both Yao and Mcgrady went to Van Gundy requesting that Spanoulis start because in practice he was always abusing the other point guards. They were apparently told to shut up and tow the team line.

Spanoulis says that when some fans began asking why Spanoulis was not playing, Van Gundy instructed a Houston reporter to "make up a story that Spanoulis had played horribly in practice and that he would not make it in the NBA."

This in contrast to him actually abusing Rafer Alston in practice. From Spanoulis' story this was confirmed by the Rockets former GM CD who was told to "go fu** himself" by Van Gundy when he told the coach that after watching practice he saw Spanoulis was by far the best point guard.

Spanoulis claims that he regularly read the Houston fans forum clutchfans.net and noticed that many of the fans there actually believed he was "terrible" and were brainwashed by the politics of Van Gundy. He now "has zero respect for the fans of Houston."

5. On his exit interview with the Rockets new GM Daryl Morey, Spanoulis was told by Morey that Shane Battier told the GM Spanoulis was the third best player on the team and it was not even close and that he had asked Van Gundy why he was being benched and Van Gundy had told him "I asked CD (is this the other GM?) for a new starting point guard because Rafer Alston is a joke, I told him I wanted Mike James back. CD told me I could go after him. What happened was Mike agreed to play for us, then CD set it up behind my back so they would not sign him and made up bogus excuses about trade kickers and options.

They intended all along not to sign him because they wanted Spanoulis. They've been on his jock for years. I told CD specifically that I didn't want any Euro trash on my team and that the guy sucked. Dennis (??) made me watch tape of him and I was so pissed off when I saw how good the guy was. So I decided to make it a point that I would bench the fu**** just to piss off the management so much that they would never go against my player requests again. Even though Spanoulis is clearly much better than Mike James I had to make a point to them and I did."

Per Spanoulis' story Morey then told him that Van Gundy would be fired and that his antics were so out of control and had caused so many problems on the team that it was "beyond disastrous." Spanoulis claims Morey told him that he could not even stand to be in the same room with Van Gundy and called him the "Napoleon coach."

6. Spanoulis had his agent fly to Houston and have a meeting with "CD". CD called Van Gundy up to his office and told him to play Spanoulis or he would be fired. Van Gundy agreed. Spanoulis says after the meeting Van Gundy told him "you are done in this league forever you stupid motherf*****."

Van Gundy then played Spanoulis against San Antonio and then told him "you won't play anything but garbage time again."

Spanoulis says that after this Van Gundy told him, "CD told me you have been reading "the Chronicle Blogs" and listening to the sports radio and reading the fan forum online and that you are pissed off at all the false reports which are coming from me making up things about you and how the fans are believing it. Well just to let you know I post on that forum all the time and they all believe every damn word I say, I control the whole opinion there with the way I post and manipulate them. The fans are all a bunch of stupid losers and I own the Chronicle reporters and the radio talk guys."

Apparently Spanoulis claims he "almost snapped" when his brother called him saying his mother was suicidal and the doctors said he was needed and when he requested leave from the team and was granted it from management that Van Gundy told him "you leave and I'll make sure you never ever get another contract in the NBA ever. Go ahead and don't ever expect your sorry *** to get out of Greece again after all the trash I'll tell every GM and coach in the league about you."

Spanoulis says that Morey and Rick Adelman and Yao and McGrady tried to convince him to stay but that he was so distraught over the experience that he viewed the NBA and city of Houston as "total hell."

He says that Yao told him, "in practice you are every bit as good if not better than Steve Nash is, Jeff is just so damn mean and stupid." And that "when the season ended I told the owner if he did not fire the coach I would go back to China. I simply cannot stand his ridiculous crap and antics anymore, I have been taking this crap from him for so long now."

Apparently Yao told Spanoulis that the Rockets owner was furious with Van Gundy for what he did to Spanoulis because the Rockets media revenue department had said it would cost them about $10 million in lost revenues a year from Greece by no longer having Spanoulis on the team.

A person named "Dennis" it was said left the Rockets and joined San Antonio and personally set up the trade of Scola and Butler just to get Spanoulis because he "believes I can be an all star." But I still told him I was too disturbed from experience with Van Gundy to come back. But now I have changed my mind as Tony Parker has explained to me it is just Van Gundy that acts this way in NBA coaches not all NBA coaches. Now if I can stay with Spurs I will.

CubanMustGo

08-15-2007, 04:15 PM

damn long story made up by a n00b forum

Indazone

08-15-2007, 04:17 PM

I just cut and paste. I don't write these things.

Kori Ellis

08-15-2007, 04:23 PM

I just cut and paste. I don't write these things.

Then please add a link to who wrote it.

Thanks.

Welcome to the forum.

Kori Ellis

08-15-2007, 04:25 PM

because Spanoulis changed his mind after they signed Udoka

They haven't signed Udoka.

Indazone

08-15-2007, 04:26 PM

Then please add a link to who wrote it.

Thanks.

Welcome to the forum.

If ya want the link, then here it is. www.clutchfans.com

Kori Ellis

08-15-2007, 04:27 PM

Here's the thread link - http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=133523 Apparently they copied it from another forum.

Solid D

08-15-2007, 04:29 PM

CD = Carroll Dawson

Some of that looks like it's right out of The Onion or from the Beno Udrih Book of Realities.

Kori Ellis

08-15-2007, 04:30 PM

CD = Carroll Dawson

Some of that looks like it's right out of The Onion or from the Beno Udrih Book of Realities.

I especially liked the part where the Spurs think he's "another Manu" :lmao

Bruno

08-15-2007, 04:51 PM

So it's a post about V-Span written by a Greek fan ?

It's likely written with big exaggerations but it seems that there are some truth behind that.

V-Span is a very good prospect. He is ready to play in SA, I really hope that Spurs will keep him. IMO, he could become a very good combo guard in nba. I even think that he is a better nba prospect than Scola.

AFBlue

08-15-2007, 04:53 PM

What I want to know is if some of the facts are true...

Did Greece recently play France?

Was Tony actually at the game?

Did Tony take V-Span out to dinner?

If those three factoids are wrong, you can bet the rest of the story is bogus....

But if the Spurs could dump Beno, I wouldn't mind V-Span taking his place....won't happen though.

saporvida

08-15-2007, 04:54 PM

I especially liked the part where the Spurs think he's "another Manu" :lmao

maybe not to say he is exactly like manu but maybe a diamond in the ruff...

i dont know but i would had loved to see this guy play for us.

Reggie Miller

08-15-2007, 04:56 PM

Let's put it this way:

When you read the above article/blog post, did you ever find yourself saying, "JVG would never act like that. It's just not in his character."

Yeah, me neither.

That part rings true, at least. Also, if the part about Yao Ming is true, then we defintiely know why Van Gundy was fired. Some of it may be that VSpan is delusional, but I could also see his teammates building him up and saying complimentary things about him if they knew about his family situation. I won't be surprised if most of this article/post proves to be correct.

Bruno

08-15-2007, 04:57 PM

What I want to know is if some of the facts are true...

Did Greece recently play France?

Was Tony actually at the game?

Did Tony take V-Span out to dinner?

Yes
Yes
I don't know but there are reports from Greece newspapers about Parker speaking to Spanoulis to convince him to stay in SA.

BigVee

08-15-2007, 05:01 PM

Man, if the Spurs get this guy for $1.9mil? Unreal. He isn't Manu, but he definitely can play.

Indazone

08-15-2007, 05:02 PM

Actually there is in another section of this forum under Spanoulis waived. Here's what has been said.

Re: Spanoulis waived ?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno

Some updates :
http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=702794

Spanoulis is a good player, I hope Spurs will keep him if he agrees to play in SA.

A Greek poster has translated today's article about Spanoulis, thanks to him :

Quote:

Vasilis Spanoulis had the chance on Saturday not only to play once again against Tony Parker but to talk to him as well. The two of them also met on Sunday during the break between the two games of the tournament (France vs Slovenia and Greece vs Serbia).
"I know we got you" Parker said. The two of them (born in '82) know each other since 2000 when Greece played against France twice.
The newly wed star of the Spurs tried to convince his new teammate by telling him "Reconsider. I think it would be better for you if you played with the Spurs". Parker has won 3 titles with the Spurs.
Spanoulis has expressed an interest in returning to Greece, even though he has been offered the chance to play with the best team in the world (as the americans call the NBA champions).
But since he has not been released yet, he appears to be reconsidering his initial decision, something that wouldn't have happened if he was traded to a team other than the Spurs.

Quote:

Spanoulis will be both closer to and further from being released from the Spurs on Tuesday. It all depends on what San Antonio will do.
Ime Udoka has signed a 2-year contract for 2 millions per year and has become the 14th player. This is where Spanoulis come sinto play. If the Spurs want to sign 2 more players, they will have to buy out Spanoulis.
If Spanoulis is released in favor of a more experienced guard, he will receive half of the 1,944,000 dollars on his contract. The Spurs have an option for a third year worth 2,088,000. Even if the Spurs keep Spanoulis, they have the option to release him next summer.
The final countdown will begin on Tuesday, that is if RC Buford wants to release Spanoulis. Spurs have both the watermelon and the knife right now.
Vasilis can only wait. At least things are moving on.

note: The article is written by a reporter of the team that wants to sign him, so they are more than likely expressing their own hopes of signing him. I don't think they have any sources that would indicate the Spurs are planning to release Billy.

whottt

08-15-2007, 05:06 PM

My take:

1.Spurs hired a former Rockets FO guy....and in fact I recall reading on this forum in an article posted that he had Vassilis did have a good relationship.

2. Mrs. Ellis can laugh about VSpan being another Manu...but their careers up to this point are eerily similar...and VSpan has shown himself to be a big game player. Forget where VSpan was taken in the draft...Manu was a pretty late second round pick too. In fact...he was about as late as you could get.

3. Ask yourself this...
Would the Rockets have traded VSpan for Scola and Butler if he was still willing to play for them?

I don't think so.

That tells you how highly they regarded him.

4. Anyone that doesn't think the Spurs have wanted to move Beno since about halfway through last season is naive.

5. Anyone that thinks they are content to ride it out with a PG rotation of Parker and Vaughn is equally naive.

Stay tuned...

Oh fact 6:

Jeff Van Gundy got fired...

whottt

08-15-2007, 05:10 PM

Fact 7:

If you were a PG...wouldn't you hate Van Gundy's style of ball?

Kori Ellis

08-15-2007, 05:11 PM

Mrs. Ellis can laugh about VSpan being another Manu...but their careers up to this point are eerily similar...and VSpan has shown himself to be a big game player. Forget where VSpan was taken in the draft...Manu was a pretty late second round pick too. In fact...he was about as late as you could get

When Noel went to rookie initiation camp in NY last year, Spanoulis tore up everyone. I know he is decent.

But I just don't know what he can play. To me he's not a point guard and he may too small to play the 2. He's wild like Manu, that's for sure.

Kori Ellis

08-15-2007, 05:11 PM

Fact 7:

If you were a PG...wouldn't you hate Van Gundy's style of ball?

He's not really a PG.
He's a small shooting guard.
He only averaged about 3 assists in 30 minutes with Panathinaikos in 05-06.

Solid D

08-15-2007, 05:14 PM

Interesting expression by the Greek reporter. Here in the USA, someone like Johnny Ludden would not choose that expression, "The Spurs have both the watermelon and the knife" in their negotiations with ____________.

mcdunk

08-15-2007, 05:17 PM

He's not really a PG.
He's a small shooting guard.
He only averaged about 3 assists in 30 minutes with Panathinaikos in 05-06.
Looks like he would be a very good upgrade to Beno.

whottt

08-15-2007, 05:20 PM

He's not really a PG.
He's a small shooting guard.
He only averaged about 3 assists in 30 minutes with Panathinaikos in 05-06.

I know...

And that's exactly the kind of PG Pop wants.

He doesn't want a guy dropping 15 times a game...he wants a guy that can penetrate and score and creates his passing opportunities off his own scoring...

IOW...he wants a guy that can impact Spurs games similar to the way in which Tony Parker impacts them.

There's a reason every PG that suits up for the Spurs turns into a guy that tries to take it into the paint and score virtually every time he touches the ball...

Because one Gregg Poppovish demands that from his PG's.

That's why Barry stays in his doghouse...inspite of having the truest PG mind and skill set on the team.

That's why every one from Jacque Vaugh to CJ Watson try to score on multiple defenders in the paint, from the second they enter the game with seemingly little or no reprimand from Spurs brass.

whottt

08-15-2007, 05:21 PM

I also think it's totally in Parker's past history to try and GM...he's done it since he was 20 years old...

Edit: I also think he's dead on in this case.

Bruno

08-15-2007, 05:27 PM

I think that Spanoulis can play PG. He won't be a pass first PG but a scoring PG like TP.
Don't forget too that euro assists aren't the same thing at all than nba assists. Spanoulis was 8th in assist per game in the Euroleague with his 3 apg.

stéphane

08-15-2007, 05:37 PM

After seeing all the posters in here bashing spanoulis(for good reasons), I was a bit waiting for france-greece to get a chance to see him play. And honestly I was really surprised at how good he was keeping in mind he hasn't play all year long !
And just for Kori, sure he is more of a shooting PG or combo guard like *cough* B*** U. *cough*, but believe me the comparison between Mister B. and Spanoulis stops right there. Their ball handling skills and ability to drive have nothing in common.
And don't you think it could be some gambling from the front office for what you all call "the trade". I mean they liked Spanoulis and they knew they could either lower salaries or just get a good back up point...

picnroll

08-15-2007, 05:43 PM

It's been since the 12th century that the Spurs have had a decent backup PG. Worth a shot.

thekingrobert

08-15-2007, 05:47 PM

i hope he wants to come and play get beno out of here and we're okay

magic

08-15-2007, 06:05 PM

What I want to know is if some of the facts are true...

Did Greece recently play France?

Was Tony actually at the game?

http://www.eurobasket.com/transactions.asp?NewsNo=41

timvp

08-15-2007, 06:08 PM

Like I've been saying, the Spurs are in a no lose situation. They either free up money and a roster spot or can bring in a quality prospect. I think V-Span could be a quality NBA player, especially off the bench. The only thing I question is if he'll meltdown the first time Pop gets in his face. He doesn't seem like the most stable of characters.

Mr. Body

08-15-2007, 06:11 PM

Wow, is this guy a complete fruitcake diva. He's delusional, high-strung, and paranoid. Combine that with his terrible production playing in the NBA last year and I see an A-1 prospect!

Mr. Body

08-15-2007, 06:14 PM

3. Ask yourself this...
Would the Rockets have traded VSpan for Scola and Butler if he was still willing to play for them?

I don't think so.

That tells you how highly they regarded him.

Of course they would have traded him away. They were ecstatic he was going to leave without a trace after leaving his contract on the table. What the fuck are you talking about? They hated the guy, he was awful last year, and there's no reason to think he wouldn't be awful this year, especially stacked behind all the (much better) guards they already have.

timvp

08-15-2007, 06:22 PM

It's classic how whottt is all of a sudden V-Span's number one fan, when a couple weeks ago he was making fun of timvp for liking him.

:rolleyes

P.S.

Props to Parker for being a team first player. I'm not sure how many players would actively recruit a player who plays the same position.

pad300

08-15-2007, 06:28 PM

Props to Parker for being a team first player. I'm not sure how many players would actively recruit a player who plays the same position.

You never know - it might be a trick to lock-up his irreplacibility long-term with yet another sucky back-up pg... :devil :p:

wildbill2u

08-15-2007, 06:35 PM

Fact: Van Gundy owned the media over here in Houston.

Fact: Van Gundy and V-Span seemed to have issues that went beyond playing.

Fact: V-Span vowed never to play again in the U.S. because of the way VG treated him.

Possibility: Parker may have tried to persuade him to come back and give it a shot with the Spurs.

timvp

08-15-2007, 06:39 PM

wildchild

08-15-2007, 06:40 PM

Before were mavs idiot fans, now they're the roxfans... rox(roxie)fan, scolarules... damn :bang

wildchild

08-15-2007, 06:44 PM

Mr. Body

08-15-2007, 07:14 PM

We could live and win with that

Because Spanoulis would have no impact on whether we win or lose.

RC's Boss

08-15-2007, 07:15 PM

Bandwagon Bill

08-15-2007, 07:35 PM

Centers
Fabricio Oberto
Francisco Elson
Ian Mahinmi

Power Forwards
Tim Duncan
Robert Horry
Matt Bonner

Small Forwards
Bruce Bowen
Michael Finley
Ime Udoka

Shooting Guards
Manu Ginobili
Brent Barry
Marcus Williams

Point Guards
Tony Parker
Vassilis Spanoulis
Jacque Vaughn

I could live with that. :smokin

I don't know how good Span is on D, or how good he could be surrounded by the best in the business, but to me that is the important factor. On that depth chart Finley could rotate to the SG spot (and possibly Udoka) for certain lineups, and possibly Span could get a few minutes there on the court with Parker against two small guard lineups. It could make the Spurs even more versitile if the kid can play the 2 against smaller guards when necesssary and can defend adequately.

The Spurs are in a no lose... because replacing the lump of nothing that is Beno with Span can at worst be a lateral move if Span is a complete bust that never plays.

Indazone

08-15-2007, 07:36 PM

Before were mavs idiot fans, now they're the roxfans... rox(roxie)fan, scolarules... damn :bang

LMAO well he does doens't he? Scola to the Rockets for Vspan and a bag of chips! I'd do that trade anyday. I expect Scola to average 10-12 ppg with 10 rpg about like David Lee of New York :p:

RC's Boss

08-15-2007, 07:38 PM

LMAO well he does doens't he? Scola to the Rockets for Vspan and a bag of chips! I'd do that trade anyday. I expect Scola to average 10-12 ppg with 10 rpg about like David Lee of New York :p:
Scola doesn't rebound or defend well. He's a scorer... something the Rockets didn't need from a PF.

Mr.Bottomtooth

08-15-2007, 07:42 PM

^ :tu

Indazone

08-15-2007, 07:43 PM

In his final season in Argentina, averaged 10.4 points and 4.8 rebounds for Ferro Carril Oeste.

Indazone

08-15-2007, 07:44 PM

Anyway..we'll know by Tue about the Vspan situation.

Mr.Bottomtooth

08-15-2007, 07:45 PM

In his final season in Argentina, averaged 10.4 points and 4.8 rebounds for Ferro Carril Oeste.
5 rebounds in Europe=maybe 3 in NBA. And still nothing about defense.

And he played for Tau Ceramica last year.

smrattler

08-15-2007, 09:30 PM

Ok, that was a major drama queen post. Geez, this makes Beno's recent stupidity look not self-centered at all.

"Spanoulis says that both Yao and Mcgrady went to Van Gundy requesting that Spanoulis start because in practice he was always abusing the other point guards."

- Yao doesn't seem like a guy that would have the type of attitude to question JVG like that to his face. And I find it hard to believe TMac and Yao would ask JVG to "START" VSpan, a rookie that hadn't even played, because of what they saw in practice. How about letting him play 10 mins for starters? Doesn't sound like something a player would think is a good idea. Besides, once you start VSpan, who hadn't played, and if he failed... then what? This was a team that was struggling to stay afloat for a while. They couldn't experiment with starting a rookie PG, they needed to keep pace.

"Spanoulis was told by Morey that Shane Battier told the GM Spanoulis was the third best player on the team and it was not even close"

- I'm not saying Shane has an ego, but all NBA players do, so, did he just put VSpan ahead of himself? And not even close, huh?

"Jeff Van Gundy later told him he would not play all year because his wife had ordered him not to play him since he was a rookie and that might cost some games, which could cause Jeff Van Gundy to lose his job and his wife told Jeff Van Gundy that she would not accept 'less spending money.''"

- Doesn't this sound like something a player (an immature one) would make up about his own coach that he felt had mistreated him? Honestly, how many men joke like this about their wives with their buddies? Probably a lot. Just joking. But in a serious situation, talking to someone you are in conflict with, who actually would do that and make themselves look and sound stupid?

"the Rockets former GM CD who was told to 'go fu** himself' by Van Gundy when he told the coach that after watching practice he saw Spanoulis was by far the best point guard........ then later..... Spanoulis had his agent fly to Houston and have a meeting with "CD". CD called Van Gundy up to his office and told him to play Spanoulis or he would be fired. Van Gundy agreed."

- So, CD was some spineless sap, a paper GM, Sweaty Teddy of NBA managers one day... then a visit by VSpan's agent allows him to grow some nuts and JVG goes fetal?

"He says that Yao told him, 'in practice you are every bit as good if not better than Steve Nash is, Jeff is just so damn mean and stupid.' And that 'when the season ended I told the owner if he did not fire the coach I would go back to China. I simply cannot stand his ridiculous crap and antics anymore, I have been taking this crap from him for so long now.'"

- Again, I don't know Yao from anything, but, since when is this the kind of leadership and authority he has? TMac I could believe easily. Maybe I missed something about Yao, didn't know he had this in him if it's believeable. Also, as good as Steve Nash? The skeptic in me can't help read this and think "self promotion".

"Dennis it was said left the Rockets and joined San Antonio and personally set up the trade of Scola and Butler just to get Spanoulis because he 'believes I can be an all star.' But I still told him I was too disturbed from experience with Van Gundy to come back."

- How does Dennis believe he can be an all-star as TP's backup with 15-20mins/gm max?

Ok, that was the skeptical read from me on this. On the other hand, drama queen crap aside, I wouldn't mind Beno getting shipped off for a bag of Doritos and hanging on to this guy for cheap. But he'll be promised nothing about minutes here up front and nobody will believe he ever was, so I better not hear any whining about it either. If he's willing to find and play his role and play in June, welcome aboard.

RussN

08-15-2007, 09:55 PM

The Truth #6

08-15-2007, 09:55 PM

Who knows, Beno might be a crucial aspect to keeping the locker room running smoothly. Pop gets all his anger out at Beno and then is able to be cool with everybody else. Somebody has to be in the doghouse. Better its a player that actually deserves to be there. Joking?

2centsworth

08-15-2007, 09:57 PM

Props to Parker for being a team first player. I'm not sure how many players would actively recruit a player who plays the same position. he knows he's better than the guy, so it's no big deal. If it was Steve Nash and then maybe he would flinch, but maybe not because at this point Tony is better than just about every PG.

koopa

08-16-2007, 02:04 AM

He's not really a PG.
He's a small shooting guard.
He only averaged about 3 assists in 30 minutes with Panathinaikos in 05-06.

i read this looking up this guy

Spanoulis averaged 15.5 points and 3.1 assists (equivalent to 6.2 assists by NBA score keeping methods)

it's from wikipedia so i don't know how true that is

Bruno

08-16-2007, 02:41 AM

i read this looking up this guy

Spanoulis averaged 15.5 points and 3.1 assists (equivalent to 6.2 assists by NBA score keeping methods)

it's from wikipedia so i don't know how true that is

It's a little exaggerated.

Even if it has some flows, a quick analysis allow to compare nba assists to euroleague assists :

In 05-06, when Spanoulis played the euroleague, teams have averaged 12.5 assists per game.
Last year in nab, teams have averaged 21.3 assist per game.
Euroleague games are only 40 min long. 12.5 assists per 40 min is 15 assists per 48 min.

Spanoulis 3.1 assists in euroleague are equivalent to 4.4 assists in nba.

ggoose25

08-16-2007, 02:42 AM

That's a parker-esque number :toast

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:48 AM

koopa

08-16-2007, 02:58 AM

Fixed :tu

wasting duncan's prime??? you do know we just won this years championship right??? you do know we have won 3 out of the 5 championships right??? you do realize this is a different era and that it's not as easy to keep championship teams together cause of salary cap and shit right???

i guess you can't satisfy everyone

stéphane

08-16-2007, 03:02 AM

It's a little exaggerated.

Even if it has some flows, a quick analysis allow to compare nba assists to euroleague assists :

In 05-06, when Spanoulis played the euroleague, teams have averaged 12.5 assists per game.
Last year in nab, teams have averaged 21.3 assist per game.
Euroleague games are only 40 min long. 12.5 assists per 40 min is 15 assists per 48 min.

Spanoulis 3.1 assists in euroleague are equivalent to 4.4 assists in nba.

I don't know if you can just throw number like that Bruno...
I mean it's just like parker/nash. If you compare assist numbers you'll conclude that nash is 3times the playmaker/passer parker is. But in reality it's just two times :p . Averages depends a lot of the team / the system / what the coach want from a player.
And yes you have to translate averages, but you have to compare team points average and points per possesion (FG% kinda).
As I said earlier, yes he's more a score first PG but his ability to push the ball and drive/dish makes him a real spurs PG.

Slomo

08-16-2007, 03:13 AM

It's a little exaggerated.

Even if it has some flows, a quick analysis allow to compare nba assists to euroleague assists :

In 05-06, when Spanoulis played the euroleague, teams have averaged 12.5 assists per game.
Last year in nab, teams have averaged 21.3 assist per game.
Euroleague games are only 40 min long. 12.5 assists per 40 min is 15 assists per 48 min.

Spanoulis 3.1 assists in euroleague are equivalent to 4.4 assists in nba.I disagree with your logic, mainly because of how assists are counted in the Euroleague compared with the NBA.

If memory serves an assist in the Euroleague is counted only if the ball is passed towards the basket, so if for example TP penetrates under the basket and instead of scoring passes the ball backwards (away from the basket) to Rasho :p: for a dunk :p::p: it wouldn't count as an assist in the Euroleague while it would in the NBA.

Correct? I'm writing this from memory I'm pretty sure you have a rule book stashed somewhere :)

If I'm right that would explain why there's less assists in the Euroleague than they are in the NBA.

GSH

08-16-2007, 03:24 AM

Like I've been saying, this trade was entirely about salary dump and the money. The Spurs have no intention of improving this offseason. Vassilis won't sign, and Holt is wasting Duncan's prime in the name of $$$. That's why they nixed the Scola and Butler for Kobe trade.

I know...

And that's exactly the kind of PG Pop wants. ...

That's why Barry stays in his doghouse...inspite of having the truest PG mind and skill set on the team.

That's why every one from Jacque Vaugh to CJ Watson try to score on multiple defenders in the paint, from the second they enter the game with seemingly little or no reprimand from Spurs brass.

Thank you for being a constant, undeniable reminder that Darwin was right.

Sorry, I know that's complicated...let me translate: Oook oook. Ball-scratch. Display bright-red left ass-cheek.

xcoriate

08-16-2007, 03:35 AM

:lmao @ Whottt copping crap for a fake timvp post...

People re-read.

xcoriate

08-16-2007, 03:39 AM

Secondly - this stuff is all completely baseless, Parker and V-Span played each other and the truth probably stops there.

There is a good chance Parker (possibly at Front Office direction) spoke to Spanoulis though I must admit... whether that had any effect either wayis yet to be seen.

Also I agree the Spurs have put themselves in a win-win (if you discount the fact they traded two bigman prospects for this scenario) situation. It's either roster spot/dollars or a backup point guard.

Hopefully for the fans - the later.

Bruno

08-16-2007, 03:49 AM

I disagree with your logic, mainly because of how assists are counted in the Euroleague compared with the NBA.

That's what I'm saying.
An euroleague assist isn't the same thing than a nba assist. And as you have said the same play could will credit a player of an assist in nba and not in euroleague.

My computation was just to have an idea on how much assists Spanoulis would have make in euroleague with nba assist counting rule. As I said there are some flows in my computation but I think it gives a quite good approximation.

Bruno

08-16-2007, 03:56 AM

I don't know if you can just throw number like that Bruno...
I mean it's just like parker/nash. If you compare assist numbers you'll conclude that nash is 3times the playmaker/passer parker is.

I'm not saying that Spanoulis will average 4.4 assists in 30 min in SA. I was just trying to show that you can't say that 3 euroleague assists are like 6 nba assists.

Averages depends a lot of the team / the system / what the coach want from a player.

Agree and for doubters, one of the best proof of that is Billups assists stats under Sanders compared to his number under Brown.

GSH

08-16-2007, 04:26 AM

That's what I'm saying.
An euroleague assist isn't the same thing than a nba assist. And as you have said the same play could will credit a player of an assist in nba and not in euroleague.

My computation was just to have an idea on how much assists Spanoulis would have make in euroleague with nba assist counting rule. As I said there are some flows in my computation but I think it gives a quite good approximation.

Oook eeek. Peel banana. Bare teeth and throw poop at innocent bystanders. (Sorry, all primates look alike to me. That was a formula converting Euroleague assists into NHL power plays.)

The Spurs are having to deal with a shortage of roster spots. Meanwhile, the Suns are carrying Grant Hill, Eric Piatkowski, and Sean Marks. (No offense to Marks, but he's there for the same reason Kevin Willis is on the Mavs roster - Spurs knowledge.) The Mavs are carrying Pops Mensa-Bonsu and Didier Ilunga-Mbenga, and they are excited to have picked up Jose Barea. And the two of them (Suns and Mavs) are competing to bring in P.J. Brown. Better still, the winner will be paying lux tax dollars for him.

I promise you the Spurs didn't take Spanoulis in hopes of paying him $2 Million this season.

Spurs Brazil

08-16-2007, 06:43 AM

http://www.hoopsworld.com/article_23041.shtml

Spurs: Will Spanoulis Join the Spurs?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Bill Ingram
for HOOPSWORLD.com
Aug 16, 2007, 09:09

It seemed to be a foregone conclusion that the Spurs' trade of Jackie Butler and Luis Scola to the Houston Rockets for point guard Vassilis Spanoulis was done strictly to clear roster space. Butler was never going to crack the rotation and Scola wasn't about to join a team that didn't have a starting role for him. It made perfect sense, then, to deal both of them. The fact that they were able to deal them for a player who was unlikely to do anything but welcome a buyout was so much the better. It would leave the Spurs room to sign Ime Udoka and possibly one more free agent - like Troy Hudson, for example.

That was all before Spanoulis dropped 15 points and a load of assists against France in international play last week. Now rumors are flying that Tony Parker is lobbying the Spurs to push for Spanoulis to actually join the team. Spanoulis, for his part, is tired of riding an NBA bench when he could be living it up as Greece's biggest basketball star. He has made no secret of his intention to play for Panathinaikos next season. There's a pretty good chance that even if Parker could persuade the Spurs to reach out to Spanoulis they would find him unwilling to return to the NBA - even if it means playing for a championship.

Then again, the word was that San Antonio was going to release Spanoulis by August 7th, which they didn't do. Why not? Is something going on there?

The Spurs have only two roster spots open and one is most certainly going to Udoka, who is working out final details on a contract that has been in the works for several weeks. The rumor mill has either Marcus Williams or Tiago Splitter landing the last spot, though neither is particularly likely. Williams didn't have much of a showing in summer league and is far more likely to find himself with the Austin Toros than the Spurs. Splitter is also unlikely, as the Spurs have no intention of bringing him over from Europe this year.

San Antonio was among the first teams to reach out to Troy Hudson when it came out that the Timberwolves were going to look at scenarios to move out their veterans. They are said to be leading in the bid for Hudson's services, a move that would also rule out Spanoulis' return to the NBA.

In short, it's interesting that rumors have arisen regarding a new kinship between Spanoulis and Tony Parker. Perhaps this is Tony's way of ignoring his new wife's pandering in the media about her desire to have ten kids. It's strange how America fixates of the slightest little thing celebrities say. As for the Spurs, it doesn't seem that they're making room for Spanoulis any time soon.

Indazone

08-16-2007, 09:03 AM

Actually I hope that Vspan joins the Spurs and makes something of himself. That way that whiny little biotch will have completely OWN JVG. LOL

From a certified JVG hata

Dennis Lindsey

08-16-2007, 09:24 AM

Hey guys, V-Span is definitely not another Manu. Trust me, I traded for him. :lol If Vagina-Span couldn't handle JVG's hard nosed style, what makes you guys think he can do well under Pop? He'd be crying a river walk over there on the bench next to Pop.

The kid got lots of minutes in the preseason and at the start of the season due to injuries. Let's just say that he is a turnover machine. Sure he showed flashes of being a good player but then he'll throw the ball away. Oh yeah, he has a horrible jumpshot, dude had lots of open looks when he played and bricked most of them. The only positives are that he attacks the basket, pesky defender and is a flopper (surprised?). He just never looked comfortable out there.

urunobili

08-16-2007, 09:30 AM

San Antonio would be REALLY upgraded if the guy becomes the scond PG in the team... the way we play ball is more international than any other NBA team... i want this kid.... trade the shit out of Beno...

hater

08-16-2007, 09:52 AM

Apparently .......

seems to indicate...

Apparently...

It was also reported...

It was reported...

They also apparently reported...

Spanoulis has supposedly ...

because they believe he is "another Manu." :lmao

Supposedly...

"in practice you are every bit as good if not better than Steve Nash is, Jeff is just so damn mean and stupid." :lmao

And that "when the season ended I told the owner if he did not fire the coach I would go back to China. I simply cannot stand his ridiculous crap and antics anymore, I have been taking this crap from him for so long now."

:lol

wow. this article is crazy

Van gundy is probably a dick, but Spanoulis might be another Beno as well. interesting.

hater

08-16-2007, 10:10 AM

at the Rockets board, they are convinced Scola is gonna be a force

Mr.Bottomtooth

08-16-2007, 10:15 AM

:lol

Indazone

08-16-2007, 10:17 AM

Scola is a rookie like Landry. They need to sign Landry and Harris so they can all compete for the PF spot. Not sure if Scola is going to rebound as well as Hayes Landry or Harris.

Indazone

08-16-2007, 10:34 AM

Vspan will be a good contributor. The reason I hate JVG is that he puts players in the doghouse and he keeps em rotting on the bench. He doesn't develop young players.

Mitch Cumsteen

08-16-2007, 10:52 AM

All I know is that we've got the watermelon and the knife, bitches!!!

I'm using that phrase at least 5 times today in general conversation, even when it's not applicable/appropriate.

whottt

08-16-2007, 11:04 AM

Thank you for being a constant, undeniable reminder that Darwin was right.

Sorry, I know that's complicated...let me translate: Oook oook. Ball-scratch. Display bright-red left ass-cheek.

LMAO...I've never seen anyone kick their own ass as badly as you just did...Chuck.

Read again, consider the intent of my post, try to think in new ways, that your stupid mind has never concieved of thinking before...let it sink in just how stupid you are for the post you just made...even when the technology of the board tried to protect you from your own stupidity..

Realize how utterly stupid you are...then never attempt to run Darwin award smack at anyone again since the only person in this thread stupid enough to be inline for a Darwin award...is you...stupid.

There is nothing worse than a complete idiot that thinks he's smart.

Solid D

08-16-2007, 11:50 AM

Whottt, are you being a "Cyber Bully"? http://www.isafe.org/

whottt

08-16-2007, 12:09 PM

I'm not being a cyber bully...he's the one that busted out with Darwin awards crap...

Additionally...this is fucking SpursTalk...

People have the entirity of all other combiend message boards on the internet for sacharine content...and this is the only one you can go to where it isn't mandated...if they are here...they must like it.

Why do you hate SpursTalk and want it to be just another message board Solid?

whottt

08-16-2007, 12:13 PM

I understand Kori and TimVP getting tired of all the lame posts by some...

But the stupid should never be given a free pass...it doesn't help them to pretend they aren't stupid. It helps them to let them know just how to stupid they are so they can try to fix it...or at least learn to shut the fuck up and not make it obvious they are stupid, thus humiliating themselves and compounding their own stupid condition.

I saw nothing in the I have a dream post to indicate Kori and TimVP are now championing and protecting the stupid....in fact, they seemed to be coming down on them.

Stupid takes many forms...and it's not always the suck my dick ho form...it can also come in the form of some fucking idiot running Darwin awards smack due to his own stupidity.

wildbill2u

08-16-2007, 12:17 PM

Obstructed_View

08-16-2007, 01:17 PM

The Spurs have no intention of improving this offseason. Vassilis won't sign, and Holt is wasting Duncan's prime in the name of $$$

But the stupid should never be given a free pass...it doesn't help them to pretend they aren't stupid. It helps them to let them know just how to stupid they are so they can try to fix it...or at least learn to shut the fuck up and not make it obvious they are stupid, thus humiliating themselves and compounding their own stupid condition.

Well said, stupid.

BeerIsGood!

08-16-2007, 01:24 PM

I know this will sound stupid, but...if we have Spanoulis under contract, how can he sign with another team he wants to play for without BUYING US OUT?

If it works contractually that way for the Euro teams, why wouldn't it work for us as well?

He can't sign with any Euro team or any team until his contract with the Spurs is absolved in one way or another. That's why people are wondering if the Spurs are trying to get him in camp, because a mutual agreement should have been reached by now to end his contract if that's what both parties want.

timvp

08-16-2007, 01:39 PM

I know this will sound stupid, but...if we have Spanoulis under contract, how can he sign with another team he wants to play for without BUYING US OUT?

If it works contractually that way for the Euro teams, why wouldn't it work for us as well?Actually, V-Span told the Rockets that he'd be willing to pay $350,000 to get out of his contract. I wonder if he has that same offer on the table for the Spurs.

timvp

08-16-2007, 01:42 PM

I'm not being a cyber bully...he's the one that busted out with Darwin awards crap...That looked like some good natured ribbing from Solid D. It was actually funny if you clicked on the link.

However, I will note that you seem to not appreciate Darwin smack. I'll have to remember that for future use.

:smokin

Solid D

08-16-2007, 01:44 PM

I'm not being a cyber bully...he's the one that busted out with Darwin awards crap...

Additionally...this is ****ing SpursTalk...

People have the entirity of all other combiend message boards on the internet for sacharine content...and this is the only one you can go to where it isn't mandated...if they are here...they must like it.

Why do you hate SpursTalk and want it to be just another message board Solid?

You answered my question. No, I don't hate SpursTalk nor do I want to see it become just another message board. There are people here I joke around with like Sequ, Jim, tlong, mouse and you, but I do think we all - me included -need to remember that there are people behind the screen names and that maybe we wouldn't say what we say here if they PM'd us, called us or spoke with us face to face.

The recent sentiments expressed by Kori and LJ made sense to me, although I was slightly light-hearted in my question to you.

whottt

08-16-2007, 01:56 PM

Well said, stupid.\

It was very well said...unfortunately you are too stupid to realize just how well said it actually was...and you went to extra effort just to illustrate the fact.

You know OV...I've always considered you to be stupid...although admittedly, I considered you to be a lesser stupid based on the self awareness your nick would seem to indicate you possess...sort of the stupid elite if you will...

However, given the structure of that post and the...well it's almost like you are proud of your cluelessness, of the compound cluelessness you willingly embraced by doing essentially the same thing the other idiot did...I am definitely going to have to bust you back down to the lower levels of the stupid. For your own good...as well as mine.

I considered for a moment that you might actually not be stupid and that might just be a childlike attempt at yanking my chain...

But taking a look at your posting history...no, there is no intelligence in your past that would indicate you have the mental capacity to actually get the original post, and therefore must be classified as a stupid. Sad actually...to think someone isn't that stupid and come to the shocking realization that they are in fact...incredibly stupid.

But anyway...

Stupidity in and of itself is not a bad thing...it's only when the stupid take their stupidity out on others that it becomes an annoyance and a hazzard...

Just because you are stupid doesn't mean you have to be harmful to the non-stupid. All you have to do is...not post, and you won't be hurting anyone with your stupidity but yourself. Remember that and you'll have taken a huge step forward in being less stupid than you are now. You'll be the noble stupid..if not the elite...and it will get you off the bottom rung where you now reside. I wish you the best.

Wasn't the rewarding? The non-stupid helping the stupid be less stupid...the way it should be. :tu It makes me feel good about life.

timvp

08-16-2007, 01:58 PM

Where does timvp rank in the whottt stupid-o-meter?

:hungry:

Solid D

08-16-2007, 01:59 PM

That looked like some good natured ribbing from Solid D. It was actually funny if you clicked on the link.

However, I will note that you seem to not appreciate Darwin smack. I'll have to remember that for future use.

:smokin

Yeah, I thought the link was appropriately funny, too.

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:00 PM

I'd tell you...but seeing as how you pink anyone not singing kumbaya these days...that'd be kind of stupid on my part.

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:02 PM

That looked like some good natured ribbing from Solid D. It was actually funny if you clicked on the link.

Solid D is not good natured...he's an isidiously evil and manipulative troll.

However, I will note that you seem to not appreciate Darwin smack. I'll have to remember that for future use.

:smokin

Ok...tell 1997 I said hi when you are borrowing it's smack.

Solid D

08-16-2007, 02:02 PM

Give whottt the choice to argue over whether whottt is stupid or Cro-Magnon, he could take either argument to the max in duel with timvp.

Corey Feldman

08-16-2007, 02:09 PM

\

It was very well said...unfortunately you are too stupid to realize just how well said it actually was...and you went to extra effort just to illustrate the fact.

You know OV...I've always considered you to be stupid...although admittedly, I considered you to be a lesser stupid based on the self awareness your nick would seem to indicate you possess...sort of the stupid elite if you will...

However, given the structure of that post and the...well it's almost like you are proud of your cluelessness, of the compound cluelessness you willingly embraced by doing essentially the same thing the other idiot did...I am definitely going to have to bust you back down to the lower levels of the stupid. For your own good...as well as mine.

I considered for a moment that you might actually not be stupid and that might just be a childlike attempt at yanking my chain...

But taking a look at your posting history...no, there is no intelligence in your past that would indicate you have the mental capacity to actually get the original post, and therefore must be classified as a stupid. Sad actually...to think someone isn't that stupid and come to the shocking realization that they are in fact...incredibly stupid.

But anyway...

Stupidity in and of itself is not a bad thing...it's only when the stupid take their stupidity out on others that it becomes an annoyance and a hazzard...

Just because you are stupid doesn't mean you have to be harmful to the non-stupid. All you have to do is...not post, and you won't be hurting anyone with your stupidity but yourself. Remember that and you'll have taken a huge step forward in being less stupid than you are now. You'll be the noble stupid..if not the elite...and it will get you off the bottom rung where you now reside. I wish you the best.

Wasn't the rewarding? The non-stupid helping the stupid be less stupid...the way it should be. :tu It makes me feel good about life.

Hey man, be cool.

timvp

08-16-2007, 02:11 PM

I'd tell you...but seeing as how you pink anyone not singing kumbaya these days...that'd be kind of stupid on my part.So I take it whottt ranks rather high on the whottt stupid-o-meter.

timvp

08-16-2007, 02:12 PM

Ok...tell 1997 I said hi when you are borrowing it's smack.That smack worked to induce a multi-post meltdown. Looks like it's still effective.

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:15 PM

Give whottt the choice to argue over whether he is stupid or Cro-Magnon, he could take either argument to the max in duel with timvp.

I'd much rather engage in a debate about why passive agressive behavior is veiwed with such reverence by message board frequenters of this era...maybe it's because it's almost like having a personality...although not too much of one ;) In any case...you're welcome, Kung Fu Master

BeerIsGood!

08-16-2007, 02:17 PM

Whottt. The human pull string toy.

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:17 PM

That smack worked to induce a multi-post meltdown. Looks like it's still effective.

Link?

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:19 PM

Whottt. The human pull string toy.

17, 996 posts worth...in fact I'd say the first post I ever made on any message board was a meltdown based on your definition of me.

I guess I'm in a constant state of meltdown which means that post wasn't remarkable at all...and in fact was an act of stupidity since, based on my posting history and your interpretation of my posts...I am always in a state of meltdown. So what good was the extra effort? It wasn't..it was in fact, still stupid.

Obstructed_View

08-16-2007, 02:28 PM

Stupidity in and of itself is not a bad thing...it's only when the stupid take their stupidity out on others that it becomes an annoyance and a hazzard...
Well said again, Cooter. In addition to being stupid, you are more an annoyance than a "hazzard".

I'll just call ya "stupid" for short. It'll be easier for you to remember since you already answer to it.

BeerIsGood!

08-16-2007, 02:28 PM

I was trying to find a good visual of the pull string toy, but only found shitty ones that didn't live up to what I believed would have been a good visual. Therefore, I abandoned the visual and went with a short, punctuated post for the effect. Was abandoning the visual due to lack of one that met my standards a decidedly un-stupid move, or is my nit picking and ridiculously high standards for something as stupid as a pull string toy visual stupid?

medstudent

08-16-2007, 02:29 PM

Whottt. The human pull string toy.

Yep.

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:31 PM

whottt
-----------------------------
Last edited by Solid D : Today at 02:13 PM.

:lol

You want it (http://www.mediabistro.com/fishbowlLA/original/hansa%20goat.jpg) back?

And you're welcome ;)

PS: Always bet on the Cro-Magnon against the stupid.

whottt

08-16-2007, 02:38 PM

Well said again, Cooter. In addition to being stupid, you are more an annoyance than a "hazzard".

Only to the stupid...that's what is so amusing about it.

I'll just call ya "stupid" for short. It'll be easier for you to remember since you already answer to it.

Sigh...to do that would be a huge step back down the ladder of the stupidity for you...

saporvida

08-16-2007, 02:59 PM

you're stupid! no you're stupid!

shut the fuck up already.

lotr1trekkie

08-16-2007, 03:09 PM

We need a Greek for geographic diversity. If Tony liked him he must be OK. Beno is a lost cause anyway. Willl the Fo be happy with Tony convincing him to come here.

MaNs1

08-16-2007, 03:24 PM

That's what I'm saying.
An euroleague assist isn't the same thing than a nba assist. And as you have said the same play could will credit a player of an assist in nba and not in euroleague.

My computation was just to have an idea on how much assists Spanoulis would have make in euroleague with nba assist counting rule. As I said there are some flows in my computation but I think it gives a quite good approximation.
Hollinger made a calculation of how Euroleague numbers translate on the NBA level....

So on AVERAGE euroleague's players assist rate when they make the jump in the NBA increases by 31%..

Check the full article here : http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2007/insider/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&id=2920870&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnba %2fdraft2007%2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumni st%3dhollinger_john%26id%3d2920870

P.S : On the OP ...Its so stupid its not even funny.

whottt

08-16-2007, 03:51 PM

You answered my question. No, I don't hate SpursTalk nor do I want to see it become just another message board. There are people here I joke around with like Sequ, Jim, tlong, mouse and you, but I do think we all - me included -need to remember that there are people behind the screen names and that maybe we wouldn't say what we say here if they PM'd us, called us or spoke with us face to face.

None of us act the same way in real life...no matter how much we think we do.

I am not an obnoxious argumentative ass in real life...

At the same time...if I am talking shit with a friend of mine and someone I don't know comes up and starts lecturing me or taking an opinion I was offering in jest seriously...I am going to thank essentially the same thing...

That this individual is at heart, a self absorbed stupid ass that thinks people don't exist if he's not around. Call it a personality quirk or whatever.

And if he obnoxiously gets into my face about it I will be every bit the ass I can be here.

The recent sentiments expressed by Kori and LJ made sense to me, although I was slightly light-hearted in my question to you.

I just disagree with your definition of a personal attack...

I don't know what you look like, what you do for a living...how can anything I say to you be of a personal nature?

You know who gets attacked on this board by my definition?

TPark and Sequ...they get constantly ripped about their height, about their weight, by people they don't even know and it's done by the good old nice board regs as well. And it has been as long as I've been on this board.

I think I've made about 5 attacks of that nature...in my entire time on this board. I think I took a shot at Sequ once, Blaze once, Tlong once and maybe Alvarez or someone once and I ripped the hell out of IminLakerLand long ago when she was being a real bitch and she had her photo in her avatar.

Sure it doesn't bother them and they handle it well...but that doesn't change the fact that is a personal attack...not calling someone you don't know an idiot. If someone takes that personally...they are kind of proving my point, so maybe it is a personal attack. But it's not my fault that a general insult just happens to strike a personal nerver...

In fact I'll go on record right now...anyone that willingly admits they are a stupid idiot to me...I will never call a stupid idiot....that way it won't be personal ;)

As for the rest of it...

Well there is something that has made this board extremely successful...is it the graphics? The Spurs winning? Or is it a combination of things...including freedom.

I personally think it's my posts but am open minded enough to consider the fact that it might be other things.

I'd be loathe to change much about this board...at the same time, you do have to draw the line somehwere...

I don't see how calling a guy an idiot that was calling me an idiot is any kind of a mean spirited personal attack...I don't see how you can personally attack anyone you don't know anything about and have never met. I don't see how anyone can take that personally.

wildbill2u

08-16-2007, 04:00 PM

There are a few posters here who have long histories with calling each other out for various alleged stupidities and it often slops over into childish name calling.

This kind of behavior is so boring to the rest of us. Why don't we have a permanent thread called "Behind the Barn" where these arguments can be banished and they can continue to their heart's content? The rule would be that anyone could simply tell these folks to "Take it Behind the Barn" and they'd have to move their argument out of the thread about basketball.

I bet they'd quickly tire of the exchanges of insults when they realized no one was reading them.

Indazone

08-16-2007, 04:13 PM

Kill_Bill_Pana

08-16-2007, 04:22 PM

Hey guys, I am from Greece. I have known Vassilis before for many years now. I have not talked to him since he came back to join national team, I see him time before he leave to Houston.

I tell you though I follow this Jeff Van Gundy/Kill Bill thing through Greek press all along. So many reports about how Van Gundy twisted his words.

Much of this is true. Instead of laughing you should consider what an a-hole Van Gundy is. Consider the following,

S. Francis from the Orlando Magic

"The coach here treats you like you're a player; he treats you like a man," Francis said, comparing Davis with Van Gundy. "He doesn't try to walk around like he's hot stuff. In Houston, that was a problem. He thought he was bigger than the players."

Cuttino Mobley Clippers - Take this for what it's worth. Inteview from 2004

Cuttino Mobley: I mean, I'm not really going to say... I always have fun playing basketball, but this year is a lot of fun. When Rudy [Tomjanovich] was there [in Houston], it was a lot of fun. Running up and down, that's what people want to see. We're just getting to show our talent a little more. And everybody love each other. We all go out with each other, restaurants. We pull together, just like our boys in Houston, Yao and Mo, Jimmy, we're close, too. We miss those dudes, but we're over here, we've having fun. That's what basketball is about. Not no dictatorship, know what I mean?

InsideHoops.com: Is that what it felt like over there (in Houston under Van Gundy), a dictatorship?

Cuttino Mobley: Yeah, I mean, people try to control you because they think it's to the best, but sometimes it's right, and sometimes it's not, but, whatever the case is.

This from the Chronicle Feb 14th, 2007 with exact words from JVG. Now tell me this isn't an asinine thing to say about your own players?

All Greek in Houston
With Tuesday's trade for Jake Tsakalidis, the Rockets have both Greek players in the NBA, Tsakalidis and guard Vassilis Spanoulis.

"It will give someone for Billy to (complain) to, so that will be good," coach Jeff Van Gundy said. "We'll just sit him right over there and Billy can (complain) to him about how he's getting (shafted). That will be good."

**note original word was bit** and edited to (complain) and original word was screwed and changed to (shafted).

Told that will make him even more popular in Athens, Van Gundy said., "I like Billy a lot more than they like me."

Spanoulis said he was looking forward to having another Greek player on the team and introducing Tsakalidis to the Houston Greek community.

"I know him," Spanoulis said. "I never played with him. He can be very good guy for our team and good for me to have some company here, more. I can show him."

Asked who was the Rockets' best Greek player, Spanoulis said, "I don't know. Different positions."

Well actually V-Span did speak about the T-Mac in Greece Statement in the Greek newspapers. I did a babelfish translation of it awhile back. What V-Span actually said is that he wanted playing time and went to Jeff Van Gundy and told him that his role on the Greek team was more like T-Mac's scoring role on the Rockets rather than the spot up shooter role he had with the Rockets.

In Greece he played the role of driving, penetrating scoring point guard like Tony Parker. This was the role that Carroll Dawson and Dennis Lindsey and Daryl Morey signed him to play in Houston.

Jeff Van Gundy then decided this would not be allowed. Vassilis was only allowed to play off the ball and stand at the 3 point line. He was also NEVER once allowed to play point guard as can be shown here:

http://www.82games.com/0607/06HOU4C.HTM

He only played SG/SF

Vassilis asked Van Gundy to let him play PG and run pick and roll and penetrate and get to foul line and asked that he stopped being asked to guard bigger players in the post at SF on D.

Now this from sport24.gr website

Van Gundy then went to the Houston paper and radio and said "Can you believe this guy? He told me, hey, you know back in Greece I'm as good as T-Mac, and here I should be rookie of the year."

Then he laughed at him and said,

"He's lucky I didn't ship his ass back to Greece when he got off the plane. He's a foul prone, turnover machine that can't shoot and can't guard anyone. Of course, I told CD that before they signed him, saying I didn't want his lame ass. But I admit I said this having never seen him play.

Yeah, I saw some tapes Dennis made me look at and he was good, especially he was damn good on D, yeah he looked real good in camp too, but as far as I am concerned he's trash. I don't change my opinion on players I don't want. A rookie is a rookie, is a rookie, is a rookie. I told his ass I don't play rookies unless there's a ton of injuries, period. He didn't like it and asked for more PT. Good luck getting out of the doghouse now Billy [laughs]."

This lie went further. They then had a Greek man impersonate him on the Houston sports radio and said it was actually him. Talking with Greek accent saying, "Hey, I am Vasili, I T-Mac back in Greece, I all-star, I be rookie of year but Jeff Van Gundy is so mean to me. Jeff Van Gundy sucks."

They didn't say it was fake until the whole fan base had turned against Kill Bill.

Billy's mom was suicidal, this was reported in Greece and that Billy was denied team absence from Van Gundy. Nothing at all wrong about this report here.

He never said he was T-Mac in Greece.

Jeff Van Gundy twisted his words so that V-Span came out looking like an arse. So when I read this story, I can see a legitimacy to most if not all of it.

Feigen of Houston Chronicle reported this:

also got this interesting quote from Dikembe Mutombo:

“I just spent a week with my kids, and I talked with my wife about it again,” Mutombo said. “I’m just frustrated with the fact there was a chance to go to the second round, at least. After contributing the way I did contribute during the course of the season, I felt I did deserve a little time in the playoffs to play. The opportunity was not given to me. I’m a little bit disappointed about it.”

So not only has Van Gundy managed to piss off rookies (e.g. Vassilis Spanoulis) and veterans (i.e. Bonzi Wells), but also LEGENDS OF THE GAME like Dikembe. What a shame. If the Rockets get rid of Van Gundy, will you consider coming back, Deke?

Speaking of Spanoulis, Vassilis had the following to say:

“Now is time to rest a little bit, to clear my mind for a big season for me, maybe the toughest in my life, in my career,” said Spanoulis.

“I want to speak with the guys and know what’s going on with my future. We’ll see. I have a contract. I can’t say now nothing. I have to clear my mind, rest and get with the guys up in the office who showed me a lot of love and support this year.

“I love this team, but I have to think what is best for my future. The people here showed me a lot of love, a lot of support a lot of advice this year.”

I find it interesting that Spanoulis said “the guys up in the office who showed me a lot of love and support this year.” That would mean Carroll Dawson, Dennis Lindsey, and Daryl Morey. To me, that shows the front office personnel might have been frustrated with how Van Gundy was handling Spanoulis (as well as other players, perhaps).

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl...kn/4274775.html

Oct. 19, 2006, 11:14PM
ROCKETS NOTES: Spanoulis draws Nash comparison

By FRAN BLINEBURY AND JONATHAN FEIGEN
Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle

Are the Rockets ready for Steve Nasharopoulos of Athens?

As you would expect, progress is coming in small steps for Vassilis Spanoulis. The star of the Greek national team had 10 points, eight assists and four turnovers in 22 minutes against Milwaukee.

"Every day for me is a new lesson," Spanoulis said. "I learn new things every day about the NBA, because it's totally different than playing in Europe. Every day I'm learning my teammates a little better, and that makes things better for me."

Spanoulis' tallest teammate is quite impressed.

"He is great," said Yao Ming. "He can see the court. He always makes the right decision. He makes passes to the right people, and passes are right on target.

"Give him time, and I think he will maybe be like Steve Nash one day."

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl...en/4328224.html

Quote to note

Not that anyone ever suspected that Jeff Van Gundy is wary of rookie mistakes, but when speaking of last season's Knicks, he offered this week's finishing quote.

"Everybody gets excited about youth except the coach, because he knows youth means mistakes, mistakes mean losses, losses mean you're fired. While everyone else was pumped up, "We got four rookies, we got four rookies,' you know, my (backside) ain't going to be here very long."

original (backside) was ass

http://blogs.chron.com/nba/2006/09/...n_line_one.html

TMac on line one

He (T-Mac) said Vassilis Spanoulis has "a tremendous upside."

http://www.clutchfans.net/news/1385...ved_by_rockets/

Spanoulis feels deceived by Rockets
Houston guard speaks out in Greek newspaper, says he could return to Europe
SATURDAY, JANUARY 20, 2007 3:02 PM CST
By Clutch
Copyright 2007 ClutchFans.net
Spanoulis feels deceived by Rockets
An interview with Rocket guard Vassilis Spanoulis was published on Saturday by Eleftherotypia, a daily newspaper out of Athens, Greece, and the 6-foot-4 point was not kind to the Rockets organization.

"The GM of the team was in Athens frequently, they were calling me on the phone every day," says Spanoulis of Rockets GM Carroll Dawson before he signed with Houston. "So much money, so much attention, so much interest -- just for me to play for one minute or not at all?"

I will try to meet Vassilis when he comes back to Athens, I will try to go to where the team is and maybe ask him about this. I know him since he plays with Maroussi BC.

Please I ask Spurs fans do not be fooled by lies and tactic of Jeff Van Gundy like Rockets fans was.

Also note that Yao did lambaste Van Gundy after the playoffs he said he did not understand why he was so stupid and always so stubborn, why his offense always so boring and predictable? Other team always know every play beforehand. Also Jeff just stupid to not play Spanoulis and Snyder.

I hope as Billy friend he plays well with Spurs. Rockets no good for him. If not he comes back plays for Pana.

So Billy either plays for NBA champions Spurs of San Antonio or for Greek League/Eurocup/Euroleague triple crown champions Panathinaikos of Athens.

Streakyshooter08

08-16-2007, 04:59 PM

@ Kill Bill Pana: Welcome to the forum. :) I would also like to see what he can do with the Spurs. When do you think a decision will be made where he plays next year?

Solid D

08-16-2007, 05:22 PM

Interesting first post Kill Bill Pana. Welcome.

whottt

08-16-2007, 05:40 PM

None of that is relevatory to me really...

Van Gundy has always been over-rated IMO...a lot of people like to compare him to Pop because he has a defensive mindset etc...

Frankly, that is a huge insult to Pop.

Van Gundy is not as good of a coach as Pop, he's not as good of a player handler as Pop.

Even the guys that get pissed at Pop and don't want to play for him, don't really grind their axe against him...

Pop can be tough, he can rip the hell out of players, but he also generally gives them a fair chance to suceed....especially when it comes to rookie PG's.

I could see some problems with Vassilis down the road, mainly of the cultural nature...this guy definitely speaks his mind...but he's also got a nice upside and is worth finding out for certain if he can be a contributing player on an NBA team. He's been a huge big game player in his career up to this point. And unlike Sarunas...this kid has the physical ability to play in the NBA.

Indazone

08-16-2007, 05:44 PM

@ Kill Bill Pana: Welcome to the forum. :) I would also like to see what he can do with the Spurs. When do you think a decision will be made where he plays next year?

As I said earlier, you'll know by next Tue. At least that was what was being reported. I don't know the significance of Tue but that's what people have been saying.

Indazone

08-16-2007, 05:45 PM

whottt

08-16-2007, 05:53 PM

Since when have you known an Argentinian,
Since Manu Ginobili and Fabricio Oberto.

Greek,
Never.

Frenchman,

Since Tony Parker...he'll say what he wants, but he doesn't do it stupidly. No one's been ripped as much as Parker has, and he handled it incredibly well which is why he now has the respect of his coach and teamates at the tender age of 25.

or Italian

Well since Manu is of Italian decent...

to not be loud and boistrous and speak his mind? If they don't like something they are going to be in your face telling you.

I am sure Pop wants his players to be honest with him...I am also sure that he doesn't want them to do it with so little tact that it fucks up the chemistry and becomes a distraction on his Championship Team.

If Vassilis is one of those his stay here will be a short one...I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt there though...

I am willing to consider the possiblity that he was lied to by the Rockets and was mishandled by the over-rated Jeff Van Gundy.

All you have to do is listen to Van Gundy do a broadcast and see how he could easily rub people the wrong way...

Very knowledgable about the game...also pretty loudmouthed and abrasive when illustrating that knowledge...on top of that, he doesn't exactly have the type of aura to command respect like Pop does.

A post game conference after a Van Gundy loss often sounds like a bitter little man whining and pouting, trying to pass the responsibility for losing off on anyone but himself, including his players...I've never thought that about Pop...not for one second of his Spurs career.

whottt

08-16-2007, 06:02 PM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 28 (13 members and 15 guests)
whottt, ChumpDumper, Mark in Austin, Das Texan, saporvida, picnroll, The III, magic, TMTTRIO, Scolarules, TwoHandJam, Kill_Bill_Pana, Warlord23 [/quote]

:jawdrop

whottt

08-16-2007, 06:03 PM

Since Chump is back I am officially resigning my position as blind front office jocker of the offseason...there are others that do it far better than I...back in the fold...now :smokin

It was a dirty job...but someone had to do it.

timvp

08-16-2007, 06:05 PM

Das Texan

08-16-2007, 06:06 PM

if v-span became a spur, would that mean that the hot greek chicks would be around too?

whottt

08-16-2007, 06:09 PM

if v-span became a spur, would that mean that the hot greek chicks would be around too?

Maybe...

Unfortunately it also probably means a surge in Nikos posts...

Bruno

08-16-2007, 06:12 PM

Spanoulis will likely be released and sign with Panathinaikos but if he stays, he could really help Spurs.

Spurs have only 3 players who can create their shot (Parker, Ginobili and Duncan). Last year, Parker and Duncan were often on the bench at the same time and the offense was stagnant with only Manu as player to create good scoring opportunities for himself and other players. Spanoulis will give Spurs a 4th player able to create his shot. With him Spurs will be able to have at least 2 creators for 48 min. One of the edge of Spanoulis is that he is big enough to play some SG.

Mr. Body

08-16-2007, 06:19 PM

if v-span became a spur, would that mean that the hot greek chicks would be around too?

There are hot greek chicks?

Kill_Bill_Pana

08-16-2007, 06:21 PM

@ Kill Bill Pana: Welcome to the forum. :) I would also like to see what he can do with the Spurs. When do you think a decision will be made where he plays next year?

I do not know, but Greek press reports from Panathinaikos (best team in world outsiude NBA, Billy's former team) team in Athens he leans to them, but other Greek press (not Pana team related) says he should play with Spurs.

I don't know as he is in Spain now, I cannot talk to him about it.

I do know that in Europe he is much better than Beno is.

In his first year ever in EuroCup (2nd highest league outside NBA) playing with Maroussi BC Athens of Greek League (long-time Greek club powerhouse) he was voted the European 6th man of the year and EuroCup rookie of year. He led Maroussi team in scoring even though he came off the bench. He shot 40 percent average in 3 points in EuroCup.

Then after this year he gets a big free agent contract with Panathinaikos of Athens Greek League (the best basketball team in the world outside NBA), which plays in the Euroleague (best league in world outside of NBA).

He was also offered huge contract by Real Madrid.

Billy was voted Euroleague MVP of week twice during the year, first time a rookie did this since the league re-formatted. He led Pana team in scoring even though he came off the bench. He was voted 10th in Euroleage MVP for the year, highest a rookie ever placed in history since league re-formatted.

He was voted 7th best FIBA player worldwide for the year (this includes performances of all NBA players as well), highest a Euroleague rookie ever placed. He won Euroleague rookie of year award.

FIBA says this rookie is 3rd best point guard outside NBA (Papaloukas and Navarro). But also both other players are much older than Billy and did not do nearly as well as he did when they were rookies.

He gets 2nd team all-Euroleague point guards, first time a rookie does this since league reformats. He gets placed behind Greek player Papaloukas who plays with CSKA Moscow. Everyone says Papaloukas is best player in world that does not play in NBA. Yet he is much older than Billy and already Billy is almost as good. Billy is much better at same age than Papa was.

Euroleague says this rookie is 2nd best point guard outside NBA.

He has 61.8% FG shooting and 36.8% 3 points shooting for year in Euroleague.

Then on our National Team in the 2006 World Championships Billy was our best player. He scores 22 points to lead Greek National Team against Team USA in victory and we finish with Silver Medal. He gets 46.5% FG shooting for the tournament, great for a point guard.

He is best player over Papaloukas (considered best player in world outside NBA) and Diamantidis and he is best defensive player in world outside NBA.

They are older and more experience and Billy is much better in his first Euroleague year than they were. Also Billy's scoring and finishing is much better than both of them. Billy has great D like Greek star guards.

In Euroleague most guards play bad D like Beno but Greek National Team stars play D like Spurs and Rockets team (one of reasons Rockets thought Van Gundy would take Billy).

In Europe, Beno to Billy is like in NBA Parker to Beno, I don't lie. Billy is more talented than Papaloukas who is everyone knows best Europe player. This is why Pana wants him so bad, then we become 2nd team in history to win back to back triple crown. This mean League title, league cup and Euroleague.

Papa is better in Europe than Scola is. To understand what Billy can be for Spurs, when Billy came back from Houston to National Team to start first training sessions, Papaloukas says this in interview:

sports24.gr reporter

(I try to translate my best)

"I could have gone to NBA this year, both Hawks and Heat offer me full MLE to play for them and be starting point guard with them. But I decide not to now after what Jeff Van Gundy does to Vassilis Spanoulis, so I stay with CSKA Moscow for less money. I see NBA is biased and coaches can bench Greek players for no reason for players like Rafer Alston. Vassilis can make it in NBA I know. I know he is better than Rafer Alston, this I have no doubt.

Lots of players in Greek League from NBA and Vassilis owns them. I visit Vassilis at rookie camp in NBA and he toys with American players. Rockets coach is an arrogant ass. Vassilis makes Kirk Hinrich, Chris Paul, and Dwyane Wade look bad in WBC and he cannot even play ahead of Rafer Alston? When Vassilis play last year in Euroleague he is still 2nd best point guard in world outside NBA to me, but by WBC's he was already surpassed me and the Diamond Man (Diamantidis of Panathinaikos Athens), and remember he's best defender in Europe I think 3 times now.

Now, finally I see him again and play against him again as he just comes back to National team. He is now far better than I am. He is much quicker, stronger and more explosive. We are all shocked on the team and cannot believe it.

Even coach (Obradovic) who has believed Vassilis is best guard prospect out of Europe ever, even he says Billy now plays like he is unstoppable. We cannot guard Billy anymore. He simply dominates the whole National Team now. For sure we cannot be beaten at Eurobasket. Everyone will see what he can do, rest of teams will be in trouble. I think Rockets team will look very bad after the Eurobasket.

Vassilis told me he worked on his game all day all night since Van Gundy didn't let him play, he does nothing but work thinking I will show him (Jeff Van Gundy) and I will be best player in world outside NBA in Euroleague. Then other NBA teams will know it was just that stupid coach not me. He also told me he worked with weight training every day and night. He is like a pit bull now in defense, even better than Diamond Man, best defender in Europe.

I am Euroleague MVP but he is now way above me, he is much better than me at same age. Luis Scola (2 time Euroleague MVP) is maybe top 5 player in Europe, me, Daimond Man, Navarro, Luis, Billy. But Billy is much much better I say now than Luis is and he's younger player and much better defender. Rockets team is crazy."

Mr. Body

08-16-2007, 06:23 PM

You said a mouthful for a guy who was terrible in the NBA. Macijauskas was better in the NBA.

magic

08-16-2007, 06:40 PM

He is best player over Papaloukas (considered best player in world outside NBA) and Diamantidis and he is best defensive player in world outside NBA.
:nope
Diamantidis is the best all-around player in the world.

trifyllara ole

lemon

08-19-2007, 08:41 AM

Diamantidis is the best Diamond in the World - NBA will see him in October but never like a player of the league.

lemon

08-22-2007, 05:00 PM

Spanoulis = MVP of Acropolis tournament in Athens against Italy, Lituania, Slovenia.

Mr. Body

08-22-2007, 06:17 PM

Spanoulis = MVP of Acropolis tournament in Athens against Italy, Lituania, Slovenia.

wgaf

magic

08-23-2007, 10:22 PM

V-Span gave a new interview in a Greek newspaper where he talks about the Rockets, Van Gundy, Adelman, Yao, McGrady and other things as well:

You'll face Houston in a friendly game soon (11/10/2007), how does that make you feel?

I'll feel strange for sure, I was there for a year, many things happened. In the end though it's just a friendly game, it's about the team getting better and ready for the next season and that's where our focus will be. It's Rockets vs. Panathinaikos, not Rockets vs. Spanoulis.

Won't you feel like you have to prove something?

No, I'll do what I do in every game and that is play my best so that my team can win. It's not important for me if I play well or not as long as my team wins.

How would you describe the year you had in Houston?

Strange... it surely wasn't like I expected it. I left Greece with dreams but things didn't work out my way. But in basketball, as in life, you don't always get what you expect and in that case you have to make sure that you get something out of even a bad situation and I think I did get something out of this.

What do you think you gained?

It was an important experience for me. I had this dream to play in the NBA since I was a child. For better or worse, I've debunked it. I know now that all this advertising, all this fuss about the NBA is just a myth and nothing more. At least that's how it seems to me...

Was it different or harder than you expected?

No, not harder. Different. It was the difference that made it difficult for me. Different way of life, many games, hardly any training, an undisciplined way of playing and too much individualism, people care more about themselves than they do for the team. That kind of playing just doesn't work for me. Of course, I'm talking only about myself, I know that there are many other players who don't have a problem with that. And I should add that I'm refering solely to my experience with the Rockets; if I was in a team with a more "European" kind of mind-set maybe things would be different.

There has been a lot of talk about your negotations with the Rockets administration last summer, about the things they had promised to you and so on. What is the truth behind all that?

I had talked with the GM, Carroll Dawson. He had come to Athens to talk with me many times. I had already explained to him my mindset, my character, the role I want to assume in the teams I'm playing in. I had told him I wanted to be an active part of the team. I'm not saying that I expected to have the same role I had in Panathinaikos and Greece. I knew that I'd be a rookie with many things to learn, but I wanted to be sure I'd have some function in the team. He had assured me that things would be exactly as I wanted them, that they needed me a lot and that to them I was a player who would play many seasons in Houston and become a valuable player for the team. So after all that, and since the NBA was a childhood dream, I agreed to play there. But things turned out different.

What was the first shock for you?

It wasn't a matter of "shock". First of all I thought that there was contact between the GM and the coach but it turned out that they hadn't talked about me at all. Van Gundy doesn't usually play rookies or Euro players and I was both so it was difficult for me. I had done my homework of course, I knew Van Gundy's reputation beforehand so I spent a lot of time talking with the administration before I joined, telling them there was no way I'd go there unless I had an important role in the team. They managed to convince me that I wouldn't have any problem so I went there.

Your relationship with Van Gundy, things that he said, like that they got Tsakalidis so you could have someone to whine to, how much of all this was true?

In all my life I had the attitude of a man, fair and square. I never had any problem with a coach in my career. On the contrary, I have great respect for the role a coach has in a team. As a player, my job is to follow his instructions for the best of the team. It was just a matter of me and Van Gundy not having the same mindset. He would say one thing in front of me and then say something different behind my back. What you said about Tsakalidis really happened. After a training session he talked to me and said that he was very pleased with my improvement and that if I continued like that I was sure to find my role in the team. He said that I deserved to be in the NBA and that I would become an important player for the Rockets. He said he wanted us to end all our previous disputes. I told him that I respected him and that I would gladly forget all our problems so that we could have a good cooperation. That was two days before Jake signed. Once Jake signed, Van Gundy came out and said that thing about bringing him there so I could whine to him. Two days ago he told me that he didn't want to create any more problems between us and then he went and made a comment like that. I don't hold any grudge against him though, every person has his own quality and standards and I respect that.

Did he ever tell you "I don't see you as part of the team's rotation"?

Yes he did, in spring. He told me: "I don't know you as a player. You weren't my choice and I don't know how to use you. I don't know what kind of player you are, I don't know if you're a winner or a loser. I've seen a couple of DVDs of you playing but I can't form an opinion solely from that." During training, we almost never played against eachother (the players), so he couldn't see me in the court either. At least I had a very good relationship with the players, they were all great guys.

And with McGrady? Because that was written as well, that your relationship wasn't good.

I had a great relationship with Tracy. He believed in me, as did Yao. I respected all of them, because they treated me like an equal, despite all their years in the NBA. And in a very difficult year for me they managed to make me feel better.

Have you talked with any of them since you left Houston?

Yes, I've talked with Battier, Novak, Yao has called me once... I'll keep in touch with some of the guys because it's worth it, it's important to keep friendships like these active.

What about Adelman? Didn't his effort to get you to come back influence you at all?

No, it didn't influence me. I had already made my decision not to come back because NBA didn't fit me. I have great respect for Mr. Adelman and what he did was incredible. It's a very big honor for me that such a well-known, distinguished and experienced coach would call me and try to explain to me how much he wanted me in the team. I didn't expect that. It really surprised me, pleasantly of course. He treated me entirely different than Van Gundy. He knew a lot about me, he had watched many of my European games with Panathinaikos and Greece, he had even watched some of the training sessions at Houston and he told me he didn't understand at all why I didn't play last year. He told me that this year things would be different for me and that he had every intention to utilize me to my full potential. But I had already made my mind and I don't like changing my decisions once I take them.

With all due respect, doesn't that make you a little stubborn?

(Laughs) No, I'm not stubborn. I'm just a realist and I know what's better for me, I know what makes me happy and at this point that was coming back to Greece. Still, it was a privilege to get a phonecall from a coach of the calibre of Adelman and hear all those good things he had to say about me.

McGrady talked to Adelman and told him you should stay, and Morey said that your ability to penetrate is equal to McGrady's. Didn't all that praise make you even for one moment to reconsider your decision?

I thank them a lot for their praise. But I had made my decision. When you're in a situation where you don't feel good about yourself, you're not enjoying what you're doing, the best thing to do is to leave like a gentleman and with your honor intact and I think that's what I did.

Do you regret now that you went to the NBA?

I don't regret anything. I've never regreted a choice I made. I'm happy I made my childhood dream a reality, because if I hadn't, I would always have it in the back of my mind, that I had the chance to go to the NBA and didn't take it. I would always wonder what might have happened. Now I know myself better and I know which way and philosophy of playing suits me.

Would you ever return to the NBA?

The NBA is out of my mind now. I had a lot of time to think about it and I can honestly and with a cool head say that the way of playing and way of life just doesn't suit me.

So you wouldn't try it again?

No, no! I wouldn't because European basketball suits me better. I'm 100% sure of that now.

But if you had played more, wouldn't you change your mind? If all the things they had promised you were realised, wouldn't you stay?

I would stay but only in order to honor my contract. I'm not the kind of person who doesn't honor his contracts. I never left a team in the middle of the year. So I would probably stay all 3 years but then I would leave once my contract was over. It wasn't so much a matter of playing or not, it was a matter that I simply didn't enjoy my life there. I had a very bad time. I made some new friends, met some Greeks that helped me a lot, some good people to whom I'll be eternally grateful, but in the end it all comes down to the fact that the way of life there just doesn't suit me.

ploto

08-23-2007, 10:30 PM

The NBA is out of my mind now. I had a lot of time to think about it and I can honestly and with a cool head say that the way of playing and way of life just doesn't suit me.

So you wouldn't try it again?

No, no! I wouldn't because European basketball suits me better. I'm 100% sure of that now.

So much for the idea that he might join the Spurs next year. Interesting that nowhere were the Spurs mentioned at all.

We had already decided that if I was to stay in the NBA, my brother would come and stay with us as well, despite that meaning that he would have to abandon his career in Greece. This just shows how strong the bond in my family is.
kudos

Indazone

08-23-2007, 10:37 PM

Well maybe the Spurs will have him in 2008.

ChumpDumper

08-23-2007, 10:38 PM

Or maybe we'll get someone who wants to play in the NBA and has the ability to do so.

lemon

08-24-2007, 03:51 PM

I think it was the wrong coach in the wrong place for him
or
the wrong coach (so stupid this coach man! :bang ) in the wrong team.

Kill_Bill_Pana

08-24-2007, 07:36 PM

Billy want me to say one last thing to fans of San Antonio here.

Spurs did want Billy and he was to intend to leave after this year from Greens of Athens as he has opt out after first year of his contract.

But Billy tell me Greens make his buyout very big to try to stop this from happening. Billy's agent sent copy of the buyout, which is $4.55 million in the USD money to Spurs front office.

When Spurs see this and since NBA team inform Billy's agent they can only pay $500,000 in the USD to the buyout, Billy realize that he would have to pay $4.05 million USD to the buyout.

So because of this Billy will play next 3 years in Greece. But he tell me that while he is saying to press he will not return to NBA, he say this mostly for Athens fans of Panathinaikos benefit and assurances.

He do intend to play in NBA after his 3 year contract is over, and he play with European style team. He now say he might possible still play with Rockets after he got another call from coach Adelman recently. Coach Adelman if he sign another contract with Houston would still like him. Billy and his agent finally decide only to play with European friendly teams in NBA.

Spurs, Mavs, Raptors, Suns, Rockets if Adelman still there only.

Billy would not play for Rockets this year or next year because he feel fans hate him, but after 3 years he say they forget.

So sorry guys but because Greens gives Billy huge buyout he has to stay. Greens did this because first time they signs Billy he has small buyout and Greens lose him to Rockets for almost nothing. This time they make sure this not happen with big contract buyout.

Billy understand just Rockets old coach that is so mean and biased and he feel in 3 years he be ready for NBA as starting point guard. He set goal to be undisputed top player in Europe and whole world outside NBA over next 3 years. He then signs MLE and starts in NBA.

Mr. Body

08-24-2007, 10:14 PM

My heart weeps for Billy and the contract he failed to read.

:lol

Call us when he stops being such a colossal, whiny bitch.

:lol :lol

And when he gets good at NBA-type basketball.

:lol :lol :lol

remingtonbo2001

08-25-2007, 07:19 AM

That sucks. We don't play play European basketball here in San Antonio, WE PLAY WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP BASKETBALL.

nfg3

08-25-2007, 09:15 AM

Right on Mr. Body - read the damn contract before signing! After three years he wants to come over and play? At 33? Yeah that's gong to work real well. And who is going to fork over good maoney for him? Not many. Not at 33 and no NBA experience. See ya Billy!

Freeze

08-25-2007, 10:07 AM

BronxCowboy

08-25-2007, 10:08 AM

BronxCowboy

08-25-2007, 10:09 AM

Damn, I'm too slow

Indazone

08-25-2007, 02:56 PM

Well maybe the Spurs will have him in 2008.

So much for getting him in 2008. Yeah maybe by then he'll have learned not to turn the ball over.

ChumpDumper

08-25-2007, 03:06 PM

:lmao I'll wait to see how he changes his story next week.

Now I just think he's too stupid to be a Spur.

Freeze

08-25-2007, 03:47 PM

Billy understand just Rockets old coach that is so mean and biased and he feel in 3 years he be ready for NBA as starting point guard. He set goal to be undisputed top player in Europe and whole world outside NBA over next 3 years. He then signs MLE and starts in NBA.

Bench Parker, start V-Span !!!!
:lol

nfg3

08-25-2007, 03:52 PM

Damn I thought I read were he was turning 30 this year and didn't check his bio. Sorry my mistake. Then if he is going to be 28 that changes things. But three years is a long time in sports and anything could happen. I though originally that he would be a good fit for us but family comes first. Table this for future consideration. Spurs need to make a decision on their 15th spot. Veteran for the short run or youth to develop.

Urclueless

08-26-2007, 08:59 AM

Billie say..
Billie say play Olympiakos..
Billie say..me suck..
Billie say..me no good NBA play..

lemon

08-27-2007, 04:15 AM

That sucks. We don't play play European basketball here in San Antonio, WE PLAY WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP BASKETBALL.

World? World is in USA or USA is in the World? ...

Wait and see the 2 October games and then send your message again...

Bandwagon Bill

03-09-2009, 12:57 AM

Indazone

03-09-2009, 01:05 AM

Ya just had to bump this thread didn't ya? Just let it die