A New Up and Coming Religion

[RandomGuy]

The " 9-11 Truth" religion, also known as the Church of the Holy Conspiracy Theory.

I occasionally have talked with christian creationists about evolution and noticed a parallel between the rhetoric and general tone of those discussions and my discussions with "truthers" about 9-11 conspiracy theories.

I have come to the inescapable conclusion that the "truth" movement is simply interested in converting me into their religion rather than any rational questioning of events.

This Church of the Holy Conspiracy Theory has virtual churches in the form of conspiracy website forums, where non-beleivers are banned, and discussion about all manner of anything related to the evil conspiracy are passed around, much like bible/quran/torah discussions are held by various groups of established religions.

One can donate to the Holy Websites, buy T-shirts and coffee-cups, as well as DVDs that look and sound astonishingly like prosletysing videos for various religions.

You have prophets like the Alex Joneses (both the professor and the screaming talk show host), who tell their followers what to think and how to "properly" view events.

There is all sorts of dogma that cannot be questioned, and even various schisms, like the "no planers" and "controlled demolition" adherents.

The dogma and presented material must be accepted without fact-checking or critical thinking, and must simply be believed at face value.

You have wild-eyed believers who come in internet forums such as this one and do the equivalent of the street preachers who scream "whore" and "sinner" at you as you walk to work on the sidewalk, as if that will convince you of the righteousness of their cause.

These "truth" preachers will post endlessly about their religion and give numerous links to various websites, and get you to watch a million shitty youtube recruiting videos. If you don't believe them, you are a "sheeple" or a "shill" if you dare question their dogma.

They are not concerned with logic or science, they are only concerned with spreading the Word of the Holy Conspiracy Theory and attempting to gain converts.

I am not against religions per se, as I feel that they can be positive forces in the world.

BUT

This religion is based on lies, half-truths, and pseudo-science, and I have not seen anything even remotely redeeming about it, and that makes it something to struggle against.

[Phenomanul]

I am not against religions per se, as I feel that they can be positive forces in the world.

BUT

This religion is based on lies, half-truths, and pseudo-science, and I have not seen anything even remotely redeeming about it, and that makes it something to struggle against.

Unlike the creeds of most 'religions', these comspiracists don't purport to offer any constructive paths to self-enlightenment, nor do they value service towards others, or at the least engender attributes of compassion, patience, mercy, kindness or grace. They are also indifferent on the essential topic of the 'meaning of life' and are completely mum on the value of life itself... Without addressing either, their movement would hardly qualify as a 'religion'.

I understand the analogy you are trying to make. But in doing so, you are severely devaluing, and smearing the good will behind 'religion' - particularly the Christian one which you've singled out only on cause of the minority Creationist belief-set.

We've been through this before... I don't agree with the 9-11 conspiracists anymore than you do. But I would be overly cautious of trying to lump them with Christians... It is an unjust and grotesque comparison.

[xrayzebra]

You might want to lump the "Global Warming" folks in with
the bunch. RNR is the prime example of one of these new
worshipers. Humankind is wrecking the earth by living like
humans. We need to go back to the stone age way of living.

[RandomGuy]

Unlike the creeds of most 'religions', these comspiracists don't purport to offer any constructive paths to self-enlightenment, nor do they value service towards others, or at the least engender attributes of compassion, patience, mercy, kindness or grace. They are also indifferent on the essential topic of the 'meaning of life' and are completely mum on the value of life itself... Without addressing either, their movement would hardly qualify as a 'religion'.

I understand the analogy you are trying to make. But in doing so, you are severely devaluing, and smearing the good will behind 'religion' - particularly the Christian one which you've singled out only on cause of the minority Creationist belief-set.

We've been through this before... I don't agree with the 9-11 conspiracists anymore than you do. But I would be overly cautious of trying to lump them with Christians... It is an unjust and grotesque comparison.

You are exactly right, and I should have made that point a bit more clear.

The "truth" movement represents the worst of the left/libertarian movement, just like the street preachers and Westside baptist church represent the worst of Christianity, and Al Qaeda represents the worst of islam.

Every religion has their nutbags, and my point was simply that the Church of the Holy Conspiracy Theory is populated, in general, by uneducated, unstable, and irrational people.

I was simply singling out Christianity for ease of reference more than anything else. I have spoken to zealots from several religions at various times who all had similar mindsets to the CT movement.

[Yonivore]

We need to go back to the stone age way of living.
It would have to be to a time before we discovered fire or, well, you can just imagine what 6 billion personal fire places might look like...on a global scale.

Why not just progress and go nuclear?

[RandomGuy]

It would have to be to a time before we discovered fire or, well, you can just imagine what 6 billion personal fire places might look like...on a global scale.

Why not just progress and go nuclear?

(raises eyebrow)

A bit off topic, but since no nuclear power plant ANYWHERE has ever been built without massive government subsidies, this is an odd thing for a conservative who believes in small government to say.

[xrayzebra]

(raises eyebrow)

A bit off topic, but since no nuclear power plant ANYWHERE has ever been built without massive government subsidies, this is an odd thing for a conservative who believes in small government to say.

Conservatives do not believe government doesn't have a
part to play in somethings. TVA was a government project,
although brought on by a Democratic administration, or
the Hoover damn project, brought on originally by a
Republican administration but finished under a
Democratic administration. Government does have a
function to provide basic functions. Power being one
of them. Roads/policing/sanitation/water or things of
this nature. But that doesn't mean they should grow
into the concept of taking over family responsibilities.

[RandomGuy]

adapted from a good bit about tax protesters by Daniel Evans

The "Truth" (tm) movement certainly seems to have many of the characteristics of a religious cult.

For example, a religious cult usually has at least some of the following characteristics:

Cults claim a monopoly on truth (or salvation). So, for example, members of a cult will believe that only their members are saved, or will go to heaven, and that everyone on earth is damned. Similarly, the "Truth" (tm) movement believe that only they know the truth about 9-11, and often believe that everyone who disagrees with them is not only ignorant, but a “slave,” “communist,” “statist” (meaing someone who worships government like a religion), or “sheeple” (meaning a sheep-like person).

Cult members are typically isolated from the rest of society, either at the urging of the cult leader (who want to control the thinking of the cult members) or because the cult members themselves feel hostile or alienated from society. Similarly, promoters of the "Truth" (tm) movement typically tell their followers not to talk to "debunkers", and truthers themselves often withdraw from family and friends as they become obsessed with 9-11 conspiracy theories.

Cult members may suffer from “cognitive dissonance” as they find their beliefs leading them further and further from reality. So, for example, a group that believes that the world will end (or space aliens will come to rescue them from earth) on a particular day will not change their beliefs when the expected event does not occur, but will create new beliefs (and new expectations), consist with the old beliefs, in order to explain the dissonance between what they believe should have happened and what actually happened. Similarly,the "Truth" (tm) movement who believe that they are correct will not change their beliefs when they are presented evidence or facts that counter those beliefs, but will simply make up a new theory about why the government is wrong or corrupt.

Cult members frequently engage in self-destructive behavior, giving up fiends, family, spouses, money, and even their lives in order to comply with the demands of their cult. For example, the followers of Jim Jones, at “Jonestown” in Guyana, committed mass suicide (and mass murder) at his urgings. Similarly, tax protesters who have “drunk the kool-aid” will continue to follow the "Truth" (tm) movement nonsense even as it leads them to financial or personal ruin as they ignore every other aspect of their lives.

However, there are significant differences between religious cults and the "Truth" (tm) movement . Most religious cults are founded by charismatic leaders, while the “gurus” of the tax protesting cult are typically as charismatic as a damp dish rag. Most religious cults also impose a very strict standard of thought and conduct, forcing cult members to conform to various aspects of conduct, dress, speech, and thought. However, most "truthers" are inherently anarchistic and it is not unusual to find that some of them who fanatically believe all manner of fantasitic things, each of which conflicts with the others. For that reason, truthers are rarely able to form any kind of a cohesive group large enough to call a “cult.”