Stern defends Suns suspensions

[Pistons < Spurs]

I didn't see this posted anywhere. If I missed it my apologies.



Stern defends Suns suspensions


At a breakfast at US Airways Center on Thursday to officially announce Phoenix had been awarded the 2009 All-Star game, Suns president Rick Welts joked from a podium on stage, “If an altercation breaks out up here, you are not to leave the immediate vicinity of your assigned table.”

The comment drew chuckles from the crowd of mostly corporate sponsors and media members and even a smile from NBA Commissioner David Stern, sitting two chairs to the left of where Welts was speaking.

But about an hour later, when Stern was asked about his decision to stick to the letter of the law during last season’s playoffs and suspend Phoenix’s Amaré Stoudemire and Boris Diaw after they left the bench area in Game 4 of the Suns-Spurs series on May 14, the commissioner was not laughing.

Often defensive and even smug at times in his explanation, Stern admitted at one point he wished “that I could get past this” before adding, “I think it’s constructive for me to answer the questions here.”

Despite the opinion there should be a gray area open to interpretation within the rule, Stern said he will not change or modify it because “the idea that we’re supposed to determine the intent of somebody is a problem” and the rule has been “consistently announced and persistently enforced.”

“My determination at that time not to make a special exception for the Suns was something that I can’t apologize for, but I can understand how people would feel,” said Stern, making his first appearance in the Valley since Game 4.

“I’m sorry it happened. I think games should be decided on their merits … with teams at full force if they can, but part of playing in the NBA is knowing what the rules are.”

That explanation correlates with why the league is changing its rules regarding referees and gambling, said Stern, who dismissed the notion of a double standard.

“The rule had never been enforced and these guys (referees) have been behaving in this way (gambling legally) for as many years as I can remember. I said, 'OK, I’m in charge of this organization. … I’m not going to make a mockery out of it by trying to take a couple of people down with a rule that’s overly broad and poorly enforced.’ Now if you’d like to compare that to the rule about coming off the bench, I think it speaks for itself.”

When it was suggested that his former decision cost the Suns the series, Stern responded, “People seem to forget what actually happened after this. There were two more games right? And the Suns lost both of them? Right?”

Stern said he consulted with the league’s competition committee before announcing the suspensions and was told he was doing the right thing.

“This is a serious issue with large men coming off the bench. I put the issue squarely to our competition committee, and the players who played at the meeting thought I had lost my mind for even raising the issue. They said, 'When you’re out there, you just don’t know. It’s a scary place to be. People come at you and they’re liable to do almost anything.’ … That is what Hall of Famers were telling me. I was trying to be fair because there was some suggestion that the rule needed to be modified. I said, 'Guys, talk to me.’ They said, 'Shut up and go on to the next subject.’ ”

As for his last-minute change of plans to skip Game 5 in Phoenix, Stern said, “I thought it was the better part of valor not to come right to the face of that and seemingly stir up more sort of in your face. … I thought that might be viewed as trying to make a point I wasn’t trying to make.”


http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/101551

[Amuseddaysleeper]

yeah, but the suns weren't at full force in game 5


I mean, that's what I'd expect to retort with.

[T Park]

When it was suggested that his former decision cost the Suns the series, Stern responded, “People seem to forget what actually happened after this. There were two more games right? And the Suns lost both of them? Right?”


1 at home.


Also, what was the Suns's excuse for losing Game 1, At home, with everyone?

I'm still waiting for that answer.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

1 at home.


Also, what was the Suns's excuse for losing Game 1, At home, with everyone?

I'm still waiting for that answer.


BECAUSE TONY PARKER BROKE NASH's NOSE

/excuse

[some_user86]

1 at home.


Also, what was the Suns's excuse for losing Game 1, At home, with everyone?

I'm still waiting for that answer.

The general excuse is that Nash had the bloody nose, taking him out several times during the last critical moments.

Whatever.

There are a million excuses to everything, but ultimately, it boils down to the other team simply being better in a 7-game series. We have a million reasons why we didn't win in 2000 (TD's knee), 2001 (D.A.'s shoulder), 2004 (0.4), and 2006 (Manu's foul). But ultimately, each of those times there were equally valid reasons why we lost and strong reasons why if those tangibles don't occur we still would have lost. Tangibles occur in every series. True champions win despite those. Ultimately, Suns fan need to figure out what they need to overcome the tangibles (defense).

[some_user86]

BECAUSE TONY PARKER BROKE NASH's NOSE

/excuse

Beat me to it, haha.

[timmy21_4rings]

Stern is once again a main....I loved this:

“People seem to forget what actually happened after this. There were two more games right? And the Suns lost both of them? Right?”

[RonMexico]

Stern is once again a main....I loved this:

“People seem to forget what actually happened after this. There were two more games right? And the Suns lost both of them? Right?”

I saw that too, but it's slightly inaccurate... They only lost one with Diaw and Amare back, so I would accept this comment more freely if there were a 7th game.

The issue should have been put to rest a while ago but I think it's funny that he basically gave a multi-million dollar gift (in tourism, etc) to the city by giving them their 2nd ASG in 16 years.

Has a city even received two in the last 20 years? (This is completely from memory, so correct me if I'm wrong):

1990 - Miami
1991 - Charlotte
1992 - Orlando
1993 - Utah
1994 - Minnesota
1995 - Phoenix
1996 - San Antonio
1997 - Cleveland
1998 - New York
1999 - None (Lockout)
2000 - Oakland
2001 - Washington
2002 - Philly
2003 - Atlanta
2004 - LA
2005 - Denver
2006 - Houston
2007 - Vegas
2008 - New Orleans
2009 - Phoenix

I can't remember who was supposed to host it in 1999, but I'm pretty sure they got skipped over and the original plan was kept for Okland to host it. Still, you have to think that Phoenix might have gotten handed the ASG as a consolation prize. At least I think that's what it is and I might try to fly back home and go to it in '09 if I can.

[RC's Boss]

I saw that too, but it's slightly inaccurate... They only lost one with Diaw and Amare back, so I would accept this comment more freely if there were a 7th game.

The issue should have been put to rest a while ago but I think it's funny that he basically gave a multi-million dollar gift (in tourism, etc) to the city by giving them their 2nd ASG in 16 years.

Has a city even received two in the last 20 years? (This is completely from memory, so correct me if I'm wrong):

1990 - Miami
1991 - Charlotte
1992 - Orlando
1993 - Utah
1994 - Minnesota
1995 - Phoenix
1996 - San Antonio
1997 - Cleveland
1998 - New York
1999 - None (Lockout)
2000 - Oakland
2001 - Washington
2002 - Philly
2003 - Atlanta
2004 - LA
2005 - Denver
2006 - Houston
2007 - Vegas
2008 - New Orleans
2009 - Phoenix

I can't remember who was supposed to host it in 1999, but I'm pretty sure they got skipped over and the original plan was kept for Okland to host it. Still, you have to think that Phoenix might have gotten handed the ASG as a consolation prize. At least I think that's what it is and I might try to fly back home and go to it in '09 if I can.
Houston also had it in '88 I believe..... And PHX getting the ASG as a consolation prize????? You are reaching.

[RonMexico]

Houston also had it in '88 I believe..... And PHX getting the ASG as a consolation prize????? You are reaching.

Horry received 2 games in the playoffs for something that was only worth one I believe. The Suns have one of the older arenas in the league (even though it was only built in 1993), so I doubt they were even much on the radar for another ASG before this year. If you're doubting the political side of Stern, then I fear you're missing a large part of his personality (i.e. the guy who puts a dress code on his players).

And I'm pretty sure it was Chicago in '88, but I could be wrong.

[samikeyp]

Chicago was 88, Houston was 89

[RonMexico]

And, akin, to my previous statement, the Rockets were in a new arena when they got it the 2nd time.

[1Parker1]

yeah, but the suns weren't at full force in game 5


I mean, that's what I'd expect to retort with.


What are you talking about? The "altercation" happened in Game 4. Diaw and Stoudamaire were suspended in Game 5. They were back for Game 6. Regardless of whether or not they were suspended, Suns still would have had to win a Game 6 in San Antonio to advance. And they still had their full team for Game 6 and Game 7 if it had gone to that....

[Jimcs50]

I think that Stern would love for SA and Phoenix to hook up again in the playoffs this year and he would be exstatic if SA beat them again, sans any controversy. Then he would say: "See, it did not matter....get the fuck over it" :)

[easjer]

What are you talking about? The "altercation" happened in Game 4. Diaw and Stoudamaire were suspended in Game 5. They were back for Game 6. Regardless of whether or not they were suspended, Suns still would have had to win a Game 6 in San Antonio to advance. And they still had their full team for Game 6 and Game 7 if it had gone to that....

And the Spurs were without Robert Horry (first option off the bench at the 4) for Game 6. So, yeah.

And let's not forget that Robert Horry was suspended for 2 games for something that other players in similar situations in teh WCSF were not suspended for at all. Talk about make-ups. It was ludicrous that a body check, with arms and elbows in delivered to Nash's body (rather than his ankles, legs, head) got him suspended for 2 games, when elbows flying in the GS series didn't warrant a single suspension.

I do think that changing the other rule for officials and gambling was unfortuante though. It weakened his case, even if the rule was never enforced.

For me, the final and most telling point is that the rule was submitted to the owners for review and change and not one owner outside of Sarver wanted it amended or altered or revoked.

[da_suns_fan__]

1 at home.


Also, what was the Suns's excuse for losing Game 1, At home, with everyone?

I'm still waiting for that answer.


Whats the Spurs exuse for losing Game 4, at home, with everyone?

Suns aren't suppose to win EVERY game to prove that theyre the better team.

They won game four. Game one is moot since they won back HCA.

[BeerIsGood!]

The Spurs were able to win with one fewer player than the Suns and the Suns couldn't win with one fewer player than the Spurs. The Suns were given an advantage in game 6 with Horry's bullshit extra game suspension and they still got handled. That's the end of the story, Suns were the worse team and they know it.

[anakha]

Suns aren't suppose to win EVERY game to prove that theyre the better team.

No, but they're supposed to win four out of seven to do so.

[JMarkJohns]

http://www.worldbank.org/html/extdr/kosovo/photos/deadhorse.jpg

Everyone can put the sticks away...

[easjer]

Whats the Spurs exuse for losing Game 4, at home, with everyone?

Suns aren't suppose to win EVERY game to prove that theyre the better team.

They won game four. Game one is moot since they won back HCA.

A) What difference does it make?

B) If you want an excuse, then why don't we just use the old referree excuse? The officials were terrible in that game.

C) I'm not making excuses. They dropped a lead they should have held, and let the Suns back in. Again, what difference does it make, since the Spurs won when it mattered most? If the Suns were the better team, they should have forced a game 7 when the Spurs were still down a man.

[703 Spurz]

BECAUSE TONY PARKER BROKE NASH's NOSE

/excuse

Exactly. Just ask Tony Kornheiser about that one

[thispego]

Horry >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Diaw

Spurs were clearly at the disadvantage

[da_suns_fan__]

Kudos to the Phoenix media for giving him hell:


Stern gets an earful at press conference
If NBA Commissioner David Stern thought Phoenix had a short memory, he thought wrong.

Stern's press conference at US Airways Center that followed the announcement of the 2009 NBA All-Star Game coming here was tense and at times almost uncomfortable. By the end, when someone mentioned "this joyous day" in Phoenix, Stern said,"You could have fooled me."

Hey, we still had questions. The first two came from Channel 15's Craig Fouhy and Channel 10's Jude LaCava. Both asked pointed, stern questions about why the commissioner took a tougher stand with Amaré Stoudemire and Boris Diaw for leaving the bench area after a brief altercation in Game 4 of the Western Conference Finals than he did with with his own officials, whom he recently acknowledged have all violated the contractual prohibition against engaging in gambling.

Stern said it was because the language related to gambling in the NBA bylaws are not specific, unlike the language for leaving the bench.

Stern knew he would be grilled, but I doubt he expected this much. By the end, before a reporter asked a question, he smiled and said, "Are you friend or foe?"

Another interested tidbit: Security was definitely heightened. Two policemen were posted outside the entrance to the press conference and security guards repeatedly checked to make sure the doors were locked.

http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PaolaBoivin/10334

The little coward.

[Walter Craparita]

It was a bitch move to have the ASG in PHX again in the first place. It makes him look like he owes AZ something.

Friend or foe? STFU and tell them how it is Stern. Pay me millions of dollars a season and I would have wtfpwn all those cali-wannabe reporters.

[TampaDude]

Kudos to the Phoenix media for giving him hell:


http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PaolaBoivin/10334

The little coward.

Yeah, I suppose everyone who locks their doors at night, or has an alarm, or has a gun for protection is a coward...whatever...

It's not cowardice, it's common sense. It's a dangerous world out there, and it's better to be safe than sorry.

Oh, BTW...

http://www.tomhooverart.com/_images/misc/full/nba-trophy_full.jpg
NOT YOURS!!!

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

[Armando]

And the Spurs were without Robert Horry (first option off the bench at the 4) for Game 6. So, yeah.

And let's not forget that Robert Horry was suspended for 2 games for something that other players in similar situations in teh WCSF were not suspended for at all. Talk about make-ups. It was ludicrous that a body check, with arms and elbows in delivered to Nash's body (rather than his ankles, legs, head) got him suspended for 2 games, when elbows flying in the GS series didn't warrant a single suspension.

I do think that changing the other rule for officials and gambling was unfortuante though. It weakened his case, even if the rule was never enforced.

For me, the final and most telling point is that the rule was submitted to the owners for review and change and not one owner outside of Sarver wanted it amended or altered or revoked.

This is old news but I have to disagree with you on one thing. Horry being suspended for 2 games does not hurt the Spurs as much as Stoudemire and Diaw being suspended for 1 game. Thats a tradeoff the Spurs would take every time. Even Coach Popovich admitted as much after Game 5.

[Armando]

I guess we will find in December if the Suns learn from the debacle in Game 4 when they travel to San Antonio. I am sure the crowd will be into the game.

[FromWayDowntown]

Why are we still talking about this? Nothing is going to change. A rule that has ALWAYS been enforced to impose suspensions (because the rule mandates suspensions) was enforced in that fashion. The league didn't treat the Suns unfairly -- it simply refused to make an exception for them.

I've yet to hear any Suns fan make a compelling argument for why an exception was somehow warranted for their team.

Moreover, as Stern has said repeatedly, those without a dog in the fight who are resources available for considering the consequences of a ruling (members of the Competition Committee, including Basketball Hall of Famers) said that the ruling was correct.

And the rule, despite red-hot protests about its enforcement from Phoenix, was revisited and remained unchanged.

This is a gigantic non-story, other than the demonstrable refusal of Suns fans to quit whining and let go.

[da_suns_fan__]

Why are we still talking about this? Nothing is going to change. A rule that has ALWAYS been enforced to impose suspensions (because the rule mandates suspensions) was enforced in that fashion. The league didn't treat the Suns unfairly -- it simply refused to make an exception for them.

I've yet to hear any Suns fan make a compelling argument for why an exception was somehow warranted for their team.

Moreover, as Stern has said repeatedly, those without a dog in the fight who are resources available for considering the consequences of a ruling (members of the Competition Committee, including Basketball Hall of Famers) said that the ruling was correct.

And the rule, despite red-hot protests about its enforcement from Phoenix, was revisited and remained unchanged.

This is a gigantic non-story, other than the demonstrable refusal of Suns fans to quit whining and let go.

Yes you have, you just choose to ignore it.

First of all, there wasn't an altercation when Amare and Diaw left the bench. They were just walking over towards Nash after a hard foul when Bell and Horry went at it (and then they immediately stopped).

No different than when Duncan and Bowen walked onto the court when Elson was undercut by James Jones. They were just making sure their teammate was ok just like Amare and Diaw were.

It was egotistical for Stern to the rule the way that he did. Not to mention it was stupid.

Btw - I know Spurs fans (like yourself) are so sick of hearing about this and wish it would just "go away", but thats not our problem. Blame Horry. He's the one who started all of this and he's the reason why your team gets an asterisk.

So you all better get used to it because its never gonna "go away".

[samikeyp]

and he's the reason why your team gets an asterisk.

given by whom?


First of all, there wasn't an altercation

In your opinion...doesn't make it true. The NBA saw it differently. Are you saying that you are better than they are at interpreting their rules?


when Bell and Horry went at it

there is your altercation.

FWD is a Spur? Cool!

Dude, I thought we were friends...why didn't you tell me?

[samikeyp]

Nice edit on the whole "Spurs/Spurs fans" thing. :tu

[FromWayDowntown]

FWD is a Spur? Cool!

Dude, I thought we were friends...why didn't you tell me?

I had figured my Adonis-like physique had been a dead give-away. No need to tell you the obvious, I figured.

:)

[samikeyp]

Ahh...my bad. :)

Nice job going incognito! :tu :tu

[FromWayDowntown]

Yes you have, you just choose to ignore it.

First of all, there wasn't an altercation when Amare and Diaw left the bench. They were just walking over towards Nash after a hard foul when Bell and Horry went at it (and then they immediately stopped).

Bell and Horry going at it isn't an altercation? If that's not an altercation, then I guess we have to wait for punches to be thrown for there to be an altercation.


No different than when Duncan and Bowen walked onto the court when Elson was undercut by James Jones. They were just making sure their teammate was ok just like Amare and Diaw were.

The difference, of course, is that there wasn't any pushing and shoving in close quarters when Elson and Jones got tangled up. Elson didn't go seek out Jones to mix things up and Jones didn't go seek out Elson. Bell sought out Horry and the two of them did mix things up -- that alone torpedoes your 967th unavailing attempt to link Jones/Elson and Horry/Nash/Bell.

Again, when you can make a compelling argument for making a first-time exception for the Phoenix Suns, I'll listen. Until then, it's whining.


It was egotistical for Stern to the rule the way that he did. Not to mention it was stupid.

It was egotistical for Stern to enforce that rule in precisely the same fashion that it's always been enforced? That's an interesting spin on egotism. I would have thought that choosing to make an exception that has never before been made would be an egotistical move. The rule compels a suspension for anyone who violates it. Two guys violated it. The rule says they're suspended. Stern just enforced the rule as written.


Btw - I know Spurs fans (like yourself) are so sick of hearing about this and wish it would just "go away", but thats not our problem. Blame Horry. He's the one who started all of this and he's the reason why your team gets an asterisk.

Horry's not the one who brings this up every week.

I got another chance last week to celebrate my team's most recent championship -- the one that followed the 2007 playoffs. For the life of me, I didn't see an asterisk anywhere. None on the trophy; none on the rings; none on the banner.

You might believe yourself the asterisk police, but the bling that goes with winning says your badge is tin foil wrapped around a cardboard cutout that your mother made for you. Enjoy wielding your imaginary powers.


So you all better get used to it because its never gonna "go away".

Obviously. Since we'll hear you whining about 2007 for as long as you're here.

What is, exactly, your fascination with the Spurs anyway?

[MakitTakit]

The fact of the matter is that David Stern, for better or worse, is picking and choosing what the NBA chooses to enforce regarding rules. He leaves no wiggle room when interpreting the Suns suspension in last years playoffs however he wiggles out of giving any punishment for the refs that have been gambling, which is clearly against the rules, stating that the rule needs to be re-looked at. Seems to me he can't have it both ways.....literally interpreting one rule while giving slack on another rule, especially when one is dealing with the intergrity of the game (officials gambling). Obviously Stern doesn't want to draw any more attention to the PR nightmare this potentially represents.

[da_suns_fan__]

Bell and Horry going at it isn't an altercation? If that's not an altercation, then I guess we have to wait for punches to be thrown for there to be an altercation.

Of course it is...but Amare and Diaw left the bench before this happened. They were walking to Nash after seeing him the table so hard. An altercation broke out when they were walking towards him and they realized this and went back to the bench.




It was egotistical for Stern to enforce that rule in precisely the same fashion that it's always been enforced? That's an interesting spin on egotism. I would have thought that choosing to make an exception that has never before been made would be an egotistical move. The rule compels a suspension for anyone who violates it. Two guys violated it. The rule says they're suspended. Stern just enforced the rule as written.

Again, the fact that Amare and Diaw were walking towards Nash isn't the same as leaving the bench during an altercation.

Stern saw an opportunity to show how off his administrative powers and he made a stupid decision. This is where the NATIONAL outrage (not just Suns fans people) comes from. This was not a case of the rule being broken. Stern actually made his own interpretation of what happened and now he has to live with it.




Horry's not the one who brings this up every week.

I got another chance last week to celebrate my team's most recent championship -- the one that followed the 2007 playoffs. For the life of me, I didn't see an asterisk anywhere. None on the trophy; none on the rings; none on the banner.

http://media.bonnint.net/az/2/239/23928.jpg

btw - Surprise surprise that San Antonio fans don't want to admit that there's an asterisk or that their win was tainted. But even you Texans have to admit that there has never been a "champion" questioned or scrutinized as much as the Spurs have been the past few months. Barry Bonds says his record doesnt deserve an asterisk, but its there. People will always bring up that he was on juice when they talk about his home runs just like people will always bring up the suspensions when they talk about the Spurs winning in 2007.






Obviously. Since we'll hear you whining about 2007 for as long as you're here.

Don't blame me. Blame Horry.

WHAT DID YOU EXPECT SPURS FANS? DID YOU THINK EVERYONE WOULD JUST FORGET?



What is, exactly, your fascination with the Spurs anyway?

Please count how many "Suns" threads there are in this forum and get back to me. We'll continue this discussion then.

[samikeyp]

btw - Surprise surprise that San Antonio fans don't want to admit that there's an asterisk

again...placed by whom?

[ChumpDumper]

The Suns' assistant coaches didn't do their jobs. Iavaroni read too many of his press clippings, thought he was already a head coach and didn't make sure the players stayed near the bench.

[Findog]

1. The Spurs are boring.

2. The Suns have the best television ratings.

3. I'd rather lose scoring 120 points than win scoring 90 points, while rebounding and playing good defense.

4. I will never get over that series and the self-inflicted wounds that resulted in the Suns losing. EVER.

[ChumpDumper]

btw - Surprise surprise that San Antonio fans don't want to admit that there's an asteriskI don't see any asterisk on the NBA site.

[MakitTakit]

In all my years of watching sports I've never seen a fanbase that feels more entitled to something their team hasn't earned than the Ph*enix fans. I think it stems from the coach who clearly has an inferiority complex.

[samikeyp]

Shouldn't the Suns get one too?

*couldn't win either games 1,3 or 6 at full strength.

[Findog]

In all my years of watching sports I've never seen a fanbase that feels more entitled to something their team hasn't earned than the Ph*enix fans. I think it stems from the coach who clearly has an inferiority complex.

What I don't get is the constant whining over how that fatally screwed them over. It doesn't automatically follow that having those players available for G5 decisively swings the series. They had to win a game in San Antonio to avoid elimination and they couldn't do it. The Mavs were in the same position and pulled it out. HCA is nice to have, but if you're a title team, it's not necessary. If the Suns were a championship-caliber team, they would've won G6 when the pressure was on. Only reason they pulled out G4 was bc Pop left Duncan on the bench way too long with that fifth foul. That one was played at the Spurs preferred pace for 44 minutes.

[FromWayDowntown]

WHAT DID YOU EXPECT SPURS FANS? DID YOU THINK EVERYONE WOULD JUST FORGET?

And here I thought that you believed that nobody cares about the Spurs. People would remember that only if they cared, one would think. I don't see there being any sort of wide-spread concern about the propriety of the Spurs' 4th title -- no more than the sanctimonious b.s. that has followed every other title -- but if you insist that it's there, it's then pretty hard to make an argument that nobody cares about the Spurs.

Tin star, buddy.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

I didn't see an asterisk anywhere. None on the trophy; none on the rings; none on the banner.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39507000/jpg/_39507595_ap300spurs.jpg

What's that at the bottom of the Spurs logo? Looks like an asterisk to me. SELF PWNAGE!!1!

[BeerIsGood!]

Wow.

The sad thing is this is all still consuming the hell out of the Suns, and you know this because Nash is still whining about it too. D'Antoni is playing their new, supposedly great, and definitely injury prone acquisition 40 a night in NOVEMBER. I really just feel pity for the Suns team and some fans that this is so deep in their heads that it's never coming out. The Spurs haven't just beaten this team over and over and over again the last several years, they've actually scarred their star player and some of their fans for life!

Why in the world these Suns' people would want to keep reliving their own failure over and over again is beyond me. I guess they like punishing themselves.

[ChumpDumper]

What's that at the bottom of the Spurs logo? Looks like an asterisk to me. SELF PWNAGE!!1!

It's a Star of David -- DAVID STERN!

[FromWayDowntown]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/39507000/jpg/_39507595_ap300spurs.jpg

What's that at the bottom of the Spurs logo? Looks like an asterisk to me. SELF PWNAGE!!1!

:owned


:depressed

[1Parker1]

And the Spurs were without Robert Horry (first option off the bench at the 4) for Game 6. So, yeah.

And let's not forget that Robert Horry was suspended for 2 games for something that other players in similar situations in teh WCSF were not suspended for at all. Talk about make-ups. It was ludicrous that a body check, with arms and elbows in delivered to Nash's body (rather than his ankles, legs, head) got him suspended for 2 games, when elbows flying in the GS series didn't warrant a single suspension.


You are absolutely right on that. The more I look at the replays of that "hip check" on you tube the more I even wonder how the heck it became such a big issue? Nash clearly exagerated by flopping his hands dramtically on the floor behind him like that. And what about Raja Bell further instigating the whole entire thing by going over Horry with fists, not just trash talk? The whole thing was really very minor looking back but was blown out of proportion by the Suns....and sparked by D Antoni and his post game speeches of "well its physical game...but only their half, now we gotta make it on our half." What a DA.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

It's a Star of David -- DAVID STERN!
:lmao
Damn you Chump, now everyone in my office is looking at me for laughing that loud.

[BeerIsGood!]

Shouldn't the Suns get one too?

*couldn't win either games 1,3 or 6 at full strength.

Also,

* couldn't win game 6 with a one man advantage.

[Stargazer]

This is just weird -- how many threads are Spurs fans going to start -- and fill -- with complaints about how Suns fans won't let it go.

Even weirder -- do Spurs fans really think it helps their argument that Stern, of all people, agrees with them? Maybe their right, maybe they aren't, but having Stern on your side is probably a point against.

[Walter Craparita]

Yes you have, you just choose to ignore it.

First of all, there wasn't an altercation when Amare and Diaw left the bench. They were just walking over towards Nash after a hard foul when Bell and Horry went at it (and then they immediately stopped).

No different than when Duncan and Bowen walked onto the court when Elson was undercut by James Jones. They were just making sure their teammate was ok just like Amare and Diaw were.

It was egotistical for Stern to the rule the way that he did. Not to mention it was stupid.

Btw - I know Spurs fans (like yourself) are so sick of hearing about this and wish it would just "go away", but thats not our problem. Blame Horry. He's the one who started all of this and he's the reason why your team gets an asterisk.

So you all better get used to it because its never gonna "go away".

Bowen and Duncan stepped on the court when there was NOT an altercation. Elson quickly got up and started running down the floor.

or no?

All I know is at the end of everyone of these arguments, there is always one winner and one loser and the sides never change. :downspin:

[RonMexico]

It was a bitch move to have the ASG in PHX again in the first place. It makes him look like he owes AZ something.

Friend or foe? STFU and tell them how it is Stern. Pay me millions of dollars a season and I would have wtfpwn all those cali-wannabe reporters.

At least you agree with me that I think he's tried to give the city a gift with the ASG... I mean, he doesn't want to ostracize a fan base of 2.5 million of a team with a sold out season.

[Avitus1]

The Suns wont let this go until they win the championship, so it'll never be let go.

[ChumpDumper]

At least you agree with me that I think he's tried to give the city a gift with the ASG... I mean, he doesn't want to ostracize a fan base of 2.5 million of a team with a sold out season.Were ticket sales down after the past postseason? If not, this theory makes no sense.

[RonMexico]

Were ticket sales down after the past postseason? If not, this theory makes no sense.

No, the season is sold out, but the dynamic of the Phoenix fan-base (i.e. transient, non-native, lots of Californians) was obviously on display during the MLB playoffs where it was widely-publicized that there were tickets available for Rockies-Dbacks.

And the Suns fans that have jumped on the bandwagon the past few years can easily jump off... Stern thinks about such things more than you think. I'm even more convinced of this after his recent interview on Rome's radio show, where the guy basically knew verbatum every recent article/tv show/commentary about his league, the NFL, and the MLB. It amazes me how much he has a pulse on the public perception of his league.

[easjer]

This is just weird -- how many threads are Spurs fans going to start -- and fill -- with complaints about how Suns fans won't let it go.

Even weirder -- do Spurs fans really think it helps their argument that Stern, of all people, agrees with them? Maybe their right, maybe they aren't, but having Stern on your side is probably a point against.


Thread was started by a Pistons fan.


Just sayin'.

[CubanMustGo]

Even weirder -- do Spurs fans really think it helps their argument that Stern, of all people, agrees with them? Maybe their right, maybe they aren't, but having Stern on your side is probably a point against.

Oh yeah, having the NBA commissioner agree is really a point against. I'd rather have someone as wise, knowlegeable, and unbiased as Mike D'Antoni on our side. :rolleyes

[ChumpDumper]

And the Suns fans that have jumped on the bandwagon the past few years can easily jump off...If they didn't jump off after that, there's no reason to try to bring them back.
Stern thinks about such things more than you think. I'm even more convinced of this after his recent interview on Rome's radio show, where the guy basically knew verbatum every recent article/tv show/commentary about his league, the NFL, and the MLB. It amazes me how much he has a pulse on the public perception of his league.He just had the largest audience for an NBA game ever tonight -- and it wasn't nationally televised in the US. Stern doesn't sweat the domestic market as much as he used to.

[RonMexico]

If they didn't jump off after that, there's no reason to try to bring them back.He just had the largest audience for an NBA game ever tonight -- and it wasn't nationally televised in the US. Stern doesn't sweat the domestic market as much as he used to.

Yeah, if he didn't I'm pretty sure that he wouldn't have instituted the dress code rule a couple of years ago... because it's obvious that 200 million Chinese care about what the players wear to the game more than rich white men. It's not like they were tuning in to watch players from their homeland or anything.

[exstatic]

Weird. Phoenix fans think that somehow, they might have won a hypothetical game seven. Newsflash: SA has all but painted their logo on your fucking court. WE OWN the fucking desert. Here's Phoenix's gallant effort at defending their "homecourt" against SA in the last five years:

2003 1-2
2005 0-3
2007 1-2

[ChumpDumper]

Yeah, if he didn't I'm pretty sure that he wouldn't have instituted the dress code rule a couple of years ago... because it's obvious that 200 million Chinese care about what the players wear to the game more than rich white men. It's not like they were tuning in to watch players from their homeland or anything.I said "not as much" not "not at all."

Besides, you failed to show any real monetary fallout from bumpgate -- so there's no reason to asuage fans who aren't going to be going to the ASG anyway.

[jbspurs]

Whats the Spurs exuse for losing Game 4, at home, with everyone?

Suns aren't suppose to win EVERY game to prove that theyre the better team.

They won game four. Game one is moot since they won back HCA.


WHATS THE SPURS EXCUSE FOR LOSING GAME 4?


NONE

SPURS Don't make excuses.
We're not like the SUNS.... O yeah! Gotta blame somebody...!!

[kimberly]

BECAUSE TONY PARKER BROKE NASH's NOSE

/excuse
I know ..How did anybody forget? I am a Spurs fan but at the same time I felt bad for Nash. But Barbosa was really stupid at the end of that game. Fouling too early and got into fouling again Tony before the inbound.

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/6256/vlcsnap147004nf1.png

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/9522/vlcsnap142458bl0.png

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/4839/vlcsnap142074nm1.png

[THE SIXTH MAN]

Injuries are a part of the game. And thats playoff basketball for you. No excuses.

[TampaDude]

Of course it is...but Amare and Diaw left the bench before this happened. They were walking to Nash after seeing him the table so hard. An altercation broke out when they were walking towards him and they realized this and went back to the bench.

Again, the fact that Amare and Diaw were walking towards Nash isn't the same as leaving the bench during an altercation.

Stern saw an opportunity to show how off his administrative powers and he made a stupid decision. This is where the NATIONAL outrage (not just Suns fans people) comes from. This was not a case of the rule being broken. Stern actually made his own interpretation of what happened and now he has to live with it.


Dude...you really need to go back and watch the video of that game again.

You = teh FAIL.

[SRJ]

Game five was a very winnable game for Phoenix. They just couldn't cash it in because they're a bunch of weak-minded chokes. The suspension bullshit is just an attempt to hide that elephant in the room.

Bitch all you want, Phoenix fans - but you choked away game five. End of story.

[exstatic]

Dude...you really need to go back and watch the video of that game again.

You = teh FAIL.
He's told the lie so many times, he probably believes it's true.

[We born to be bad]

Game five was a very winnable game for Phoenix. They just couldn't cash it in because they're a bunch of weak-minded chokes. The suspension bullshit is just an attempt to hide that elephant in the room.

Bitch all you want, Phoenix fans - but you choked away game five. End of story.

are you stupid or something? this is going to end badly :ihit

[TampaDude]

are you stupid or something? this is going to end badly :ihit

It already did...for the Suns... :lol

[RonMexico]

Injuries are a part of the game. And thats playoff basketball for you. No excuses.

Hahaha - Nash played great after he hurt his nose... it has to do with the fact that they couldn't stop the bleeding to KEEP him out there.

[kskonn]

are you stupid or something? this is going to end badly :ihit


why are you going to make threats to people over the internet?I guess I Better make sure the alarm is set tonight.

[Saguaro]

Game 1 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Parker cheap shot on Nash
Game 2 -- Suns blowout
Game 3 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Donaghy & crew fixing game
Game 4 -- Suns victory

Suns actually swept that series. They were obviously and demonstratively better than the Spurs, and it took the movement of heaven and earth to award the Spurs the series through cheating.

Even awarding them two games was only sufficient to create a 2-2 tie. It was clear that without something outrageous, the Suns would win the series despite the effort to fix it for the Spurs. Thus, the "suspensions." If not for that, you know the league office would have scoured the game tapes looking for a reason to suspend some other key player for the Suns, and you know the officiating in Game 5 would have been even more absurd than it was.

Counting Game 5, the Spurs needed three of their four victories delivered illegitimately. It was an obvious fix. Everybody on Earth who is not a Spurs fan knows this. That is why the 2007 championship is a farce.

[Dex]

Wow.

Some Suns fans are complete morons.

Their team deserves to be cursed.

[SRJ]

Game 1 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Parker cheap shot on Nash

Nash just got the ball stolen on the previous play and was reaching in trying to get it back when their heads collided. If Nash isn't committing a reach-in foul at that point, he doesn't run the risk of bumping heads.

But logic doesn't agree with you, clearly.

[SenorSpur]

Game 1 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Parker cheap shot on Nash
Game 2 -- Suns blowout
Game 3 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Donaghy & crew fixing game
Game 4 -- Suns victory

Suns actually swept that series. They were obviously and demonstratively better than the Spurs, and it took the movement of heaven and earth to award the Spurs the series through cheating.

Even awarding them two games was only sufficient to create a 2-2 tie. It was clear that without something outrageous, the Suns would win the series despite the effort to fix it for the Spurs. Thus, the "suspensions." If not for that, you know the league office would have scoured the game tapes looking for a reason to suspend some other key player for the Suns, and you know the officiating in Game 5 would have been even more absurd than it was.

Counting Game 5, the Spurs needed three of their four victories delivered illegitimately. It was an obvious fix. Everybody on Earth who is not a Spurs fan knows this. That is why the 2007 championship is a farce.

:drunk

[Strike]

It was an obvious fix. Everybody on Earth who is not a Spurs fan knows this. That is why the 2007 championship is a farce.

Ok, fuck stick. Besides Spurs fan, who does this "fix" benefit?

[RonMexico]

I said "not as much" not "not at all."

Besides, you failed to show any real monetary fallout from bumpgate -- so there's no reason to asuage fans who aren't going to be going to the ASG anyway.

Brings the city and fans a huge amount of cash and exposure in tourism a year after they host the Super Bowl - and most likely without the amount of violent activity seen in Vegas.

[703 Spurz]

Game 1 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Parker cheap shot on Nash
Game 2 -- Suns blowout
Game 3 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Donaghy & crew fixing game
Game 4 -- Suns victory

Suns actually swept that series. They were obviously and demonstratively better than the Spurs, and it took the movement of heaven and earth to award the Spurs the series through cheating.

Even awarding them two games was only sufficient to create a 2-2 tie. It was clear that without something outrageous, the Suns would win the series despite the effort to fix it for the Spurs. Thus, the "suspensions." If not for that, you know the league office would have scoured the game tapes looking for a reason to suspend some other key player for the Suns, and you know the officiating in Game 5 would have been even more absurd than it was.

Counting Game 5, the Spurs needed three of their four victories delivered illegitimately. It was an obvious fix. Everybody on Earth who is not a Spurs fan knows this. That is why the 2007 championship is a farce.

But of course. Phoenix swept the series. It all makes sense now :lol

Fucking idiot :toast

[RonMexico]

Props to Saguaro for the funniest post of the year... and one that has incited rage in numerous Spurs fans thus far.

Is it so difficult to read sarcasm on this board or do you all just take yourselves and the Spurs too seriously?

[CubanMustGo]

Props to Saguaro for the funniest post of the year... and one that has incited rage in numerous Spurs fans thus far.

Is it so difficult to read sarcasm on this board or do you all just take yourselves and the Spurs too seriously?

Be honest - with "fans" like _da_suns_fan_, etc it's hard to know what's sarcasm and what's not.

Besides, ST rules say that sarcasm has to be in blue.

[Saguaro]

Ok, fuck stick. Besides Spurs fan, who does this "fix" benefit?
It's a "thank you" to Peter Holt for faithful service. (http://www.catdestroyshomes.org/article.php?id=101)

[ChumpDumper]

Brings the city and fans a huge amount of cash and exposure in tourism a year after they host the Super Bowl - and most likely without the amount of violent activity seen in Vegas.None of that has anything to do with this:
Besides, you failed to show any real monetary fallout from bumpgate -- so there's no reason to asuage fans who aren't going to be going to the ASG anyway.

[THE SIXTH MAN]

Hahaha - Nash played great after he hurt his nose... it has to do with the fact that they couldn't stop the bleeding to KEEP him out there.
Exactly. Blood, sprained ankles, whatever. Its apart of the game.

[RonMexico]

Be honest - with "fans" like _da_suns_fan_, etc it's hard to know what's sarcasm and what's not.

Besides, ST rules say that sarcasm has to be in blue.

That's a point well-taken.

Besides, it's equally difficult to convince fans like Chump Dumper that an All-Star Game benefits a city financially. Those fans might not be going to the game, because it's become a corporate piece of garbage, but they'll definitely be tuning in and probably attending the Jam Session activities during the week.

[ChumpDumper]

Besides, you failed to show any real monetary fallout from bumpgate

[phyzik]

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/7430/head1py8.jpg

[RonMexico]

I said he gave the city a gift. The city (aka individual fans) pays the money for season tickets, which the team receives. In an all-star game, the city and the fans receive the financial benefits.

I don't see what's so hard for you to get about the fact that my original statement has very little to do with the season being sold out, and moreso about the city getting the fun and money from All-Star Weekend.

[ChumpDumper]

Still makes no connection to Bumpgate. I don't see why that's so hard for you to get.

[RonMexico]

Bumpgate isn't a real term. Stop using it.

[ChumpDumper]

It's a fine term if only because it annoys you. And you still haven't made any real connection between Bumpgate™ and the ASG.

[We born to be bad]

why are you going to make threats to people over the internet?I guess I Better make sure the alarm is set tonight.

make threats to people? the internet? I don't know what's the matter with you? :dramaquee
Come to visit on January 31st (Spurs 80-Suns113). You are always welcome to our home and I´ll show you the city.:rolleyes

[samikeyp]

make threats to people? the internet? I don't know what's the matter with you?
Come to visit on January 31st (Spurs 80-Suns113). You are always welcome to our home and I´ll show you the city

Hey! No fighting on my birthday...just lots of drinking! :drunk

[We born to be bad]

Hey! No fighting on my birthday...just lots of drinking! :drunk


My drinking buddy, I'll buy you a drink on your birthday :toast

[samikeyp]

Sounds good to me!

[kskonn]

make threats to people? the internet? I don't know what's the matter with you? :dramaquee
Come to visit on January 31st (Spurs 80-Suns113). You are always welcome to our home and I´ll show you the city.:rolleyes


cool. I come to phoenix a lot ,my sister-in-law and brother-in-law live there, they never show me shit. I just assumed by your earlier comment that you were going to start making threats over the internet like many people on this forum like to do. It sounds like we are up to two of us going so it could be a party. Can you get me a ticket to the game?

[We born to be bad]

cool. I come to phoenix a lot ,my sister-in-law and brother-in-law live there, they never show me shit. I just assumed by your earlier comment that you were going to start making threats over the internet like many people on this forum like to do. It sounds like we are up to two of us going so it could be a party. Can you get me a ticket to the game?

Do you want me to buy you one? ticket for Spurs fans? why not? cash and 100 percent commission :lol Don't believe everything its says (on ST). not make threats but city tour? :lol I thought you had more sense than that. Are you so naive? Even so, I don´t say it to offend you. I like the naive boys!(you don't scare, i'm a girl).Check your private mesengger. :spin

[TampaDude]

Game 1 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Parker cheap shot on Nash
Game 2 -- Suns blowout
Game 3 -- would have been a Suns victory if not for Donaghy & crew fixing game
Game 4 -- Suns victory

Suns actually swept that series. They were obviously and demonstratively better than the Spurs, and it took the movement of heaven and earth to award the Spurs the series through cheating.

Even awarding them two games was only sufficient to create a 2-2 tie. It was clear that without something outrageous, the Suns would win the series despite the effort to fix it for the Spurs. Thus, the "suspensions." If not for that, you know the league office would have scoured the game tapes looking for a reason to suspend some other key player for the Suns, and you know the officiating in Game 5 would have been even more absurd than it was.

Counting Game 5, the Spurs needed three of their four victories delivered illegitimately. It was an obvious fix. Everybody on Earth who is not a Spurs fan knows this. That is why the 2007 championship is a farce.

Kids, don't do drugs, m'kay??? :lol

[LilMissSPURfect]

They said, 'Shut up and go on to the next subject.’ ”

[LilMissSPURfect]

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/7430/head1py8.jpg
:lol

[kskonn]

Do you want me to buy you one? ticket for Spurs fans? why not? cash and 100 percent commission :lol Don't believe everything its says (on ST). not make threats but city tour? :lol I thought you had more sense than that. Are you so naive? Even so, I don´t say it to offend you. I like the naive boys!(you don't scare, i'm a girl).Check your private mesengger. :spin

should have put my statement in Blue( agreed color for sarcasm on spurstalk). either way good luck on the 31st unfortunately I will be watching from San Antonio.