Hillary crumbling?

[Yonivore]

She's got her husband running blocker for her; complaining the "guys are piling on." Then, her campaign is busted -- twice -- planting softball questions. And, now; Wolf Blitzer is saying he's been warned not to pick on her at the upcoming Vegas debate.

What a wimp.

[George Gervin's Afro]

She's got her husband running blocker for her; complaining the "guys are piling on." Then, her campaign is busted -- twice -- planting softball questions. And, now; Wolf Blitzer is saying he's been warned not to pick on her at the upcoming Vegas debate.

What a wimp.



I can't believe someone on her staff tried to plant questions..


sincerely,

jeff gannon

[AZLouis]

FEMA must do political consultations as a side gig.

[Yonivore]

I can't believe someone on her staff tried to plant questions..


sincerely,

jeff gannon
Coming out of the closet, are you?

Hey, since you're here, let me ask you something. Why were your press credentials questioned when you asked a pertinent question of the president during a 2005 Press Conference but, not 18 months earlier when you did a 3 part story on your interview of former Ambassador Joseph Wilson?

Oh, and since it is only alleged (probably because the question was somewhat derogatory of Democrats) the White House planted the question, why do you believe people would analogize your experience with that of Presidential Candidate Hillary Clinton, whose campaign has already admitted to planting the questions?

Just curious. Oh, and are you selling your anus again Georg...uh, Jeff?

[George Gervin's Afro]

Coming out of the closet, are you?

Hey, since you're here, let me ask you something. Why were your press credentials questioned when you asked a pertinent question of the president during a 2005 Press Conference but, not 18 months earlier when you did a 3 part story on your interview of former Ambassador Joseph Wilson?

Oh, and since it is only alleged (probably because the question was somewhat derogatory of Democrats) the White House planted the question, why do you believe people would analogize your experience with that of Presidential Candidate Hillary Clinton, whose campaign has already admitted to planting the questions?

Just curious. Oh, and are you selling your anus again Georg...uh, Jeff?


So are you on record stating that President Bush's staff never planted questions at any of his past press conferences?


Yes or no.

[Yonivore]

So are you on record stating that President Bush's staff never planted questions at any of his past press conferences?


Yes or no.
I have no idea Jeff, uh...Goerge; I'm not in that decision matrix.

I do know the Clinton campaign has admitted to planting them.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I have no idea Jeff, uh...Goerge; I'm not in that decision matrix.

I do know the Clinton campaign has admitted to planting them.


So then I can surmise that you think planting questions is bad and dishonest.

[Yonivore]

So then I can surmise that you think planting questions is bad and dishonest.
I think getting caught can fucking destroy a presidential campaign. Especially when added to the fact your husband is running blocker against the "guys" and Wolf has his dander up about being warned not to pick on you.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I think getting caught can fucking destroy a presidential campaign.


Your not answering the question. If my memory serves me correctly you have been hammering hillary for not being able to answer a yes or no question.

so i will ask again, is planting a question in a press conference bad and dishonest? yes or no.


The reason I ask is because I have known you to be a hypocrite and inconsistent with your outrage.

[Yonivore]

Your not answering the question. If my memory serves me correctly you have been hammering hillary for not being able to answer a yes or no question.
So what, I'm not running for president...feel free to not vote for me.


so i will ask again, is planting a question in a press conference bad and dishonest? yes or no.
Well, aside from not being a yes or no question like -- "Do you support Governor Spitzer's plan to give driver licenses to illegal immigrants," the question is not relevant to this thread.

But, I'll say no, it's not bad and yes, it's dishonest.

What's the harm in planting questions? I think the practice of planting questions is simply a way of systematically pushing policy questions to the head of the queue so that the candidate can answer it before an audience? After all both the question and answer are delivered publicly. Who cares that it was set up behind the scenes?

I think the offense taken probably stems from the subtle dishonesty inherent in the manipulation of the situation. When one attends a politically rally, it is with the expectation that audience events are unscripted and spontaneous. When an ordinary person comes to such a rally it is under the impression that he is on an equal footing with everyone else in the hall with respect to the persons onstage. What a shock to discover that some are more equal than others.

Since the bandwidth at campaign question and answers is limited -- only a few can be entertained -- an arrangement to plant questioners essentially steals bandwidth from the rest of the audience by reserving part of it to ringers, who are engaged to loft a policy volleyball so the candidate can spike it.

Politics has always been a stage. Voters know this. But they are sometimes lulled into believing there are unrehearsed events. And it's understandable if they are disappointed to learn those events are rehearsed as well. Stalin once derided Trotsky as "a common, noisy champion with faked muscles", implying that his own political muscles were real. Among politicians, how are we to know?


The reason I ask is because I have known you to be a hypocrite and inconsistent with your outrage.
You've not known me to be anything. You don't know me at all. Plus, I think you're mistaking my amusement at Hillary's quandry with outrage.

That, in itself, is amusing, Jeff...you don't mind if I call you Jeff, do you?

[Yonivore]

Hey, Jeff, speaking of hypocrites are you ready to "own up" to the fact you were wrong here?


When I find that I have been wrong I own up to it. it's very simple to do. you man up and admit you were wrong. i have never seen that once from you so i guess i could assume you feel on this board your are 100% correct?
You said that in another thread and then spent the rest of that thread avoiding owning up to being wrong.

In fact, during the course of that thread we were unable to find a single instance where you "owned up" to being wrong but, did find several instance where I admitted to being wrong.

Who's the hypocrite.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Hey, Jeff, speaking of hypocrites are you ready to "own up" to the fact you were wrong here?


You said that in another thread and then spent the rest of that thread avoiding owning up to being wrong.

In fact, during the course of that thread we were unable to find a single instance where you "owned up" to being wrong but, did find several instance where I admitted to being wrong.

Who's the hypocrite.




Quote:
Originally Posted by George Gervin's Afro




here's one.. Yoni was right! Wow i think that may be the first time!



Yonivore
I applaud your honesty.


There you idiot. You even thanked me for my honesty. Don't fuck with me. But,but technically you didn't admit you were wrong.. :rolleyes

admitting you were wrong.. :lol " Iraq didn't have wmds".. that was one of 4 examples of how you were wrong..

[xrayzebra]

So then I can surmise that you think planting questions is bad and dishonest.

Not really. I have told you before it is not unheard of and
used all the time. The bad thing is when you are ask a
question that wasn't planted and you rant and rave at that
person for trying to get a "gotcha". Now that is wrong. You
gotta take the bad with the good. And Billary just cant
handle the latter, a question not planted. And she got
found out. Not that it will hurt her, she and her bunch will
spin out of it and woe unto those who snitched her off.

:spin

[xrayzebra]

Don't fuck with me. ..

Now you sound like Billary..... :madrun :lol

[Yonivore]

There you idiot. You even thanked me for my honesty.
That's not an admission you were wrong. That's a recognition that I was right. I don't even know what was your opinion on the matter being discussed. For all I know, you agreed with me from the get go.


Don't fuck with me.
:lmao Don't fuck with you? What grade are you in?


But,but technically you didn't admit you were wrong.. :rolleyes
Where, in the examples I gave, did I not technically admit I was wrong.


admitting you were wrong.. :lol " Iraq didn't have wmds".. that was one of 4 examples of how you were wrong..
I'm not admitting I was wrong because I'm not convinced I am. I believe Jimmy Hoffa was murdered and I'm not going to admit I was wrong simply because a body hasn't been produced.

We have a difference of opinion on that matter and just because I won't ascede to your demand that I agree with you doesn't mean I'm refusing to admit I was wrong.

[Yonivore]

Oh, and I went back an looked at this quote in context:

here's one.. Yoni was right! Wow i think that may be the first time!
You never admitted you were wrong and, up to that point you had never said I was wrong either. The recognition came at the end of one of your signature interrogations where you demand I support my opinion with a link (which I had already done but, not to your satisfaction). When I found a story that met with your approval, you posted the above.

So, no, I've yet to come across an example of where you've admitted you were wrong. Hell, you won't even admit it in the thread where you claimed I never admitted to being wrong 100% of the time and I, in turn, produced several threads that demonstrated just the opposite.

You can't even man up on that mistake.

:lmao "Don't fuck with me!" OMG, that's freakin' hilarious.

[Holt's Cat]

When the government stages a press conference with questions posed by government employees pretending to be members of a free press it's cool. When a politician holds a Q&A with a partisan crowd we are supposed to be shocked when it turns out a few members were plants.

Yoni needs to find a better blog to rip off.

[Yonivore]

When the government stages a press conference with questions posed by government employees pretending to be members of a free press it's cool. When a politician holds a Q&A with a partisan crowd we are supposed to be shocked when it turns out a few members were plants.
Where did I say any of that? I never said it was cool for FEMA to have their fake news conference; in fact, I don't think I've ever commented on the matter. And, I'm not shocked -- nor do I think anyone should be -- that Hillary Clinton planted questions in her campaign audiences.


Yoni needs to find a better blog to rip off.
I only steal from the best.

[Ocotillo]

Oh wow, Yoni takes issue with something regarding the Clinton campaign. Stop the presses!

It doesn't matter, Gravel would beat the GOP nominee in '08.

[ChumpDumper]

So instead of a 30 point lead she has a 20 point lead.

[Yonivore]

Oh wow, Yoni takes issue with something regarding the Clinton campaign. Stop the presses!
What is it with you people and trying to pin some kind of disgust on my pointing out the Hillary Campaign is fucking up? I thought it was funny that she got busted. I also think it will severly damage her campaign when taken along with all the other gaffes she's made of recent.

I don't care that she planted questions. I care that she got caught and it's causing her grief. She's a rank amateur at this campaigning when put next to her husband.

It's funny to watch her have to wiggle and dance her way around issues because she doesn't know what she believes about anything.


It doesn't matter, Gravel would beat the GOP nominee in '08.
Well, the Democrats may end up with gravel as the nominee so, I guess we'll see.

[Holt's Cat]

Thanks to GWB for expanding the Executive Branch's reach for HRC.

[Yonivore]

Thanks to GWB for expanding the Executive Branch's reach for HRC.
Yeah, you wish.

[Walter Craparita]

How long before that girl who fessed up disappears.

[Yonivore]

When a Clinton is caught with his/her pants down, one of the first things to happen is its gaggle of sycophants in the press roll out the “everyone does it” excuse. Everyone perjures in depositions. Everyone gropes widows. Everyone stuffs secret documents down his pants.

Brian Montopoli (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/13/politics/main3496586.shtml) of CBS news trotted out “everyone does it” to cover the planted question scandal. Hillary allegedly has not taken a question from an audience member that was not a planted question.

Montopoli couched his story as a question: “Do Campaigns Routinely Plant Questions?”

He quotes an ex-McCain spokesman, an anonymous “political consultant,” and CBS’s own Nicole Wallace.

An anonymous political consultant? There is no such beast. They are all about self-promotion.

The one I give most credence to is CBS’s in-house expert.


“Do campaigns go in and say, ‘We want people to talk about their experiences with social security?’ Sure,” Wallace says. “It’s not unheard of to steer questions. But scripting of a question is where any candidate is going to run into trouble.”

When questions are planted, she says, “It’s a recipe for disaster for a politician who is trying to appear authentic.” Wallace notes that campaigns are constantly trying to balance their desire to control a candidate’s message with their desire for the candidate to be seen as spontaneous and genuine.
The answer is no. Mitt Romney denied it, telling CBS:


“Frankly, in a town hall setting like this, and every setting I’m in, we take all the questions, and we don’t know who the questioners are,” said Romney. “Sometimes there are planted questions that come from other campaigns or people that have a particular interest. But you know what? You take them all, and you respond honestly to the questions you get. That’s part of the process.”
Romney, a veteran of two statewide campaigns before this one, is saying other campaigns plant questions at his meetings.

Brian Montopoli of CBS should have asked the Hillary campaign about that. Is Hillary planting questions to be asked of Edwards, Obama and Giuliani? But Montopoli was not curious. Nobody asks Hillary anything that is not in the script.

So we get everybody-does-it. Good boy. You scooped the New York Times. Here’s your cookie.

[ChumpDumper]

Yoni ripped off Don Surber again.

http://blogs.dailymail.com/donsurber/2007/11/14/cbs/

Is it his job to rip off blogs? He doesn't seem to have time for anything else.

[ChumpDumper]

And if staging audience questions is good enough for the Bush administration, it's good enough for everyone else.

This is yet another nonissue. It's going to take more than this to bring her down.

[Yonivore]

:lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

http://boortz.com/images/funny/lifes_a_bitch_sticker.jpg

[Mr. Peabody]

And if staging audience questions is good enough for the Bush administration, it's good enough for everyone else.

This is yet another nonissue. It's going to take more than this to bring her down.

While it may be true that Bush stages questions, we should expect more from our candidates. I mean, if Bush is the new measuring stick for presidential hopefuls, this country is in its end days.

[DarkReign]

While it may be true that Bush stages questions, we should expect more from our candidates. I mean, if Bush is the new measuring stick for presidential hopefuls, this country is in its end days.

A-fucking-men. Bush is....well, hes GWB, the most laughed at President in my brief stay on Earth.

[Yonivore]

A-fucking-men. Bush is....well, hes GWB, the most laughed at President in my brief stay on Earth.
Were you here when RayGun was president? I think he competed with GWB for the most SNL routines based on his foilables.

[Yonivore]

While it may be true that Bush stages questions, we should expect more from our candidates. I mean, if Bush is the new measuring stick for presidential hopefuls, this country is in its end days.
You think Bush stages questions? Have you ever watched one of his press conferences or campaign appearances? God Bless him, he's as poor an extenporaneous speaker as I am.

Does he prepare for possible questions? Who wouldn't? But, I'm not banking on a belief his campaign ever planted them. If so, they forgot the part of the equation where they tell the candidate who to call on and what question would be asked.

[DarkReign]

Were you here when RayGun was president? I think he competed with GWB for the most SNL routines based on his foilables.

I was born when Reagan was inaugurated. I was 8 when he left office. My knowledge of him is....fleeting to say the least.

I remember the war on drugs though.

[Yonivore]

I was born when Reagan was inaugurated. I was 8 when he left office. My knowledge of him is....fleeting to say the least.

I remember the war on drugs though.
Making fun of Republican Presidents is a grand tradition.

[Yonivore]

Pardon Me? (http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=3866786&page=1)

Hillary Clinton Takes Cash From Recipients of Husband's Controversial Pardons

I think she's losing her buddies in the media now...I guess that's what you get for threatening Wolf Blitzer.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Pardon Me? (http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=3866786&page=1)

Hillary Clinton Takes Cash From Recipients of Husband's Controversial Pardons

I think she's losing her buddies in the media now...I guess that's what you get for threatening Wolf Blitzer.


or maybe she never was buddy buddy with the media to begin with. :rolleyes


In fact, in 2007 alone, Media Matters for America has documented many examples of Fox News personalities and their guests making false, misleading, or offensive claims about Hillary Clinton:

Hannity falsely claimed Clinton "blamed" Bush for mugging of 101-year-old woman

Hannity denounced as "hate speech" Clinton statement that GOP phone-jamming convictions were evidence of "vast right-wing conspiracy"

Hannity falsely claimed Clinton called herself the "JFK of 2008," baselessly blamed her for Giuliani YouTube video

Fox's Hill on Clinton's "Southern drawl": "[I]f she was attending, say, a GLAAD convention, would she speak with a lisp?"

Luntz likened Clinton's praise of Alinsky in her senior thesis to praise of "people from Germany in the 1930s and 40s"

"Madrassa" redux? Gibson cited dubious tabloid article to smear Obama, Clinton

Fox News' Cameron assigned racially charged comments to "Clinton campaign"

WSJ's Kirkpatrick baselessly claimed Clinton "moved right" on abortion, health care

Journal Ed. Report selectively quoted Clinton to claim she is "disingenuous" and "supported the war" in 2004

O'Reilly and Miller recycled false attack on Clinton's attendance at 9-11 memorials

Morris' evidence that Clintons were behind Obama-madrassa smear? "Obviously they were"

Fox's Cameron: Clinton's proposal to tax oil profits would be unpopular with "capitalists"

O'Reilly: "Hillary just looks like a zombie" during SOTU

Morris still pushing allegation that Clinton camp planted Obama smear with Insight

Fox defense of Gibson's report on Obama smear missed mark

Hannity accused Clinton of "leaking" Obama drug story from Obama memoir

I have links and back up to back up every one of these charges.

And I wonder why the Clinton's avoid Fox news.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Pardon Me? (http://www.abcnews.go.com/Politics/Vote2008/story?id=3866786&page=1)

Hillary Clinton Takes Cash From Recipients of Husband's Controversial Pardons

I think she's losing her buddies in the media now...I guess that's what you get for threatening Wolf Blitzer.



In the 24 months between Jan. 1994 and Jan. 1996, long before Monica Lewinsky entered the picture and back when Whitewater was about an alleged crooked land deal, Nightline devoted 19 programs to the then-unfolding scandal and investigation, for which no Clinton White House official was ever indicted.

vs.


But during the 24 months between Sept. 2003 and Sept. 2005, Nightline set aside just three programs to the unfolding CIA leak investigation, for which Libby, an assistant to the president, was indicted. On the night of the Libby indictments, Nightline devoted just five percent of its program to that topic.

but,but the MSM media loves the Clinton's and hates bush.. :rolleyes

[xrayzebra]

A-fucking-men. Bush is....well, hes GWB, the most laughed at President in my brief stay on Earth.

Both you and Mr. Pea can make fun of the President. But
one thing you cant say. He has been consistent on his
foreign policy. Protect the United States. He has changed
strategy in Iraq, but it all has been to the good.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Both you and Mr. Pea can make fun of the President. But
one thing you cant say. He has been consistent on his
foreign policy. Protect the United States. He has changed
strategy in Iraq, but it all has been to the good.


consistent? or did he have any other choice but to stick it out? bush is smart enough to know that if he declared iraq as a mistake then he and the war whores would suffer the wrath of the American people. he simply stcuk by his war..

[xrayzebra]

consistent? or did he have any other choice but to stick it out? bush is smart enough to know that if he declared iraq as a mistake then he and the war whores would suffer the wrath of the American people. he simply stcuk by his war..

GGA you still here. The bus is fixing to leave, go get under
it. You have no opinion on anything.

[Walter Craparita]

I understand the hate for Bush...perfectly understand it.

Anyone who supports Hillary though...That's pretty scary.

[Yonivore]

I have links and back up to back up every one of these charges.
And, I'll bet you're not afraid to use them. Right?

Who cares? If you have links post 'em. What's the point in threatening us with them?

[Yonivore]

Both you and Mr. Pea can make fun of the President. But
one thing you cant say. He has been consistent on his
foreign policy. Protect the United States. He has changed
strategy in Iraq, but it all has been to the good.
And, now, he's trying to get us all to our turkey dinners on time. God Bless 'im.

[xrayzebra]

And, now, he's trying to get us all to our turkey dinners on time. God Bless 'im.

Yeah, it is damn change. It would be nice if he had
just quoted George Washingtons declaration on the
first Thanksgiving. Now that would have set off some
fireworks. You know, people don't want to know the
truth about our history. Anyhow for those interested.
click on the link below. But if you are a hater of God,
don't read it.




Our First President's Thanksgiving (http://www.earlyamerica.com/earlyamerica/firsts/thanksgiving/thankstext.html)

[Holt's Cat]

Politics ceased to be about ideology or actual policies long ago. Now it's about hanging on the doings of certain individuals like teenage girls hang on the latest doings of movie and music stars. Seriously. Hillary Clinton's campaign is like mother's milk to middle aged white males with broadband. Groupies of the weirdest stripe.

[Yonivore]

Politics ceased to be about ideology or actual policies long ago. Now it's about hanging on the doings of certain individuals like teenage girls hang on the latest doings of movie and music stars. Seriously. Hillary Clinton's campaign is like mother's milk to middle aged white males with broadband. Groupies of the weirdest stripe.
WTF?!?! Drinking already?

[ChumpDumper]

Would you understand it if he posted it in a blog you could rip off?

[Nbadan]

WTF?!?! Drinking already?


Well,.........he is a Ron Pauler...

:smokin

[DarkReign]

I understand the hate for Bush...perfectly understand it.

Anyone who supports Hillary though...That's pretty scary.

A-fucking-men.....again....

[Mr. Peabody]

You think Bush stages questions? Have you ever watched one of his press conferences or campaign appearances? God Bless him, he's as poor an extenporaneous speaker as I am.

Does he prepare for possible questions? Who wouldn't? But, I'm not banking on a belief his campaign ever planted them. If so, they forgot the part of the equation where they tell the candidate who to call on and what question would be asked.

What I was referring to were the staged town halls that Bush was notorious for during the last election. And I am not even saying that h is alone in doing this, but again, this should not be the new standard.

[Yonivore]

What I was referring to were the staged town halls that Bush was notorious for during the last election.
Okay, I googled this and what I come up with are accusations the audience was screened and that people the organizers believed would be disruptive (Such as Code Pink, etc...) were not allowed entrance.

I couldn't find any allegations his campaign planted questions or questioners.


And I am not even saying that he is alone in doing this, but again, this should not be the new standard.
I agree.

[Nbadan]

I couldn't find any allegations his campaign planted questions or questioners.

WTF?!?

:lmao


Let's see Dubya do Clinton-type townhalls then...nothing Dubya does is spontaneous..

[Yonivore]

WTF?!?

:lmao


Let's see Dubya do Clinton-type townhalls then...nothing Dubya does is spontaneous..
Just because you say it and it is repeated a thousand times, doesn't make it true.

The Clinton campaign was busted planting questions...and confessed to it. Point to a source that does the same on any of Bush's appearances.

[Nbadan]

Well lets start with Dubya's banned interview (http://youtube.com/watch?v=Fze2J2Ve9is)....

[George Gervin's Afro]

Well lets start with Dubya's banned interview (http://youtube.com/watch?v=Fze2J2Ve9is)....


How embarassing... Bush is telling this woman that he, Saddam, had the capacity to build these weapons (wmds).. so we have now heard that he had the intent... so i wonder which one is true..did he intend to or did he have the capacity to build them..

[Nbadan]

The really embarassing part is that Dubya never answers a question directly....he goes off into a obvious canned speech about Iraq and every-time the foreign interviewer tries to redirect him to the original question, he just goes back on his little no-answer, answer tangent....

[George Gervin's Afro]

The really embarassing part is that Dubya never answers a question directly....he goes off into a obvious canned speech about Iraq and every-time the foreign interviewer tries to redirect him to the original question, he just goes back on his little no-answer, answer tangent....


'we were attacked on 9/11 was repeated over and over.. everytime she asked him a question he didn't like "we were attacked on 9/11.."

[Nbadan]

See that foreign reporter had nothing to lose, Dubya can't reach his slimy hand to her bosses (unlike the M$M) and I don't think see really cares whether Dubya ever grants her access or another interview again...

[George Gervin's Afro]

her problem was that she didn't buy his bullshit. if I were her I would have explained to the president that he did not have to repeat that the US was attacked on 9/11 over and over and over.. I think she became insulted because he thought she was stupid..

[Nbadan]

Clinton campaigner admits to planting questions...


Eloise Harper Reports: The Clinton campaign has admitted to planting questions in Iowa. They have confirmed that a campaign staffer approached a student to ask Sen. Clinton a question about global warming during a campaign stop at a biodiesel plant in Newton, Iowa, on Nov. 6.

The story was first reported by Patrick Caldwell, a junior at Grinnell College and the features editor of The Scarlet and Black college newspaper. He reported that student Muriel Gallo-Chasanoff was approached by the campaign to ask a question. She told the reporter that "they wanted a question from a college student." She also said that she "noted that staffers prompted Clinton to call on her and another who had been approached before the event, although Clinton used her discretion to select questions and called on people who had not been prepped beforehand. Some of the questions asked were confusing and clearly off-message."

Clinton Campaign spokesperson Mo Elleithee tells ABC News that "on this occasion a member of our staff did discuss a possible question about Sen. Clinton's energy plan at a forum. However, Sen. Clinton did not know which questioners she was calling on during the event. This is not standard policy and will not be repeated again."

The staffer still remains with the Clinton campaign and they would not reveal his or her name. The campaign did not comment on whether this is the only time they have planted questions among audience members.

ABC News (http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2007/11/clinton-camp-ad.html)

[Yonivore]

Who banned the interview? And, if this administration can keep a conspiracy to bring down three buildings with controlled demo charges, I'm thinking they can make an interview -- or interviewer -- disappear.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Who banned the interview? And, if this administration can keep a conspiracy to bring down three buildings with controlled demo charges, I'm thinking they can make an interview -- or interviewer -- disappear.


why do you care? short of bush admitting he wasn't completey honest with the US in the run up to the war you won't believe anything you read... hence you are aptly described as a 'dead ender'..

[Yonivore]

why do you care? short of bush admitting he wasn't completey honest with the US in the run up to the war you won't believe anything you read... hence you are aptly described as a 'dead ender'..
I care because the implication is that Bush had it banned. The cryptic not accompanying the YouTube video isn't very revealing about why they considered it banned.

I figure, if the President -- or anyone on his staff that was sitting right there when it was conducted -- didn't want the thing to be aired, they would have come up with a reason to not allow the recording to leave the building.

So, who banned it is important.

[Nbadan]

http://cagle.msnbc.com/working/071115/streeter.gif

[Nbadan]

More bad news for Hitlary supporters (i.e. the FAUX News crowd), Obama wipes out Huckabee, Romney and Giuliani in Iowa (good representative of the whole country usually) and also beats McCain 50-42.


Mrs. Clinton loses to McCain 48-44 and beats the other contenders by just 4-6 points that Obama is besting by 13-16 points!

20% of REPUBLICANS said they are voting OBAMA! with 7% UNDECIDED!

Only 10% to 13% of the Rs say Clinton.

Obama also does much better among independents, especially against McCain (losing by a few points), while Clinton's clock is cleaned by McCain among Indies by 12 points!

Among Dems, Clinton is 72% to 77%, while Obama is 79% to 84%.

This is a significant new poll and should be discussed and brought to the fromt. As Iowans get to know Obama, he ROMPS.

Survey USA (http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=2d211d2a-ee13-40ab-8455-5a70b9b55bfe)

[Mr. Peabody]

More bad news for Hitlary supporters (i.e. the FAUX News crowd), Obama wipes out Huckabee, Romney and Giuliani in Iowa (good representative of the whole country usually) and also beats McCain 50-42.



Survey USA (http://www.surveyusa.com/client/PollReport.aspx?g=2d211d2a-ee13-40ab-8455-5a70b9b55bfe)

It doesn't matter. The DNC is intent on fielding another candidate who will lose a race that the Demos should win.

[xrayzebra]

It doesn't matter. The DNC is intent on fielding another candidate who will lose a race that the Demos should win.


Your take on "demos should win"? Why?

[Mr. Peabody]

Your take on "demos should win"? Why?

Running after an extremely unpopular Republican president and administration, who started an extremely unpopular war, should make things easier for the Democratic candidate. Hell, the Demos would have won in '04 had they fielded anyone other than John Kerry.

[Extra Stout]

The corporate elites and media types already have decided on Hitlery. You people are so cute following your cherished little illusion that you get to choose the President. :lmao

[Nbadan]

It doesn't matter. The DNC is intent on fielding another candidate who will lose a race that the Demos should win.

Your incredibly correct, but to be fair it was the centrist DCCI that sponsored Kerry and turned the 04 nomination...that was when Demo leaders were under the mistaken belief that electing moderate Demos was the key to winning the Prez....instead of following their hearts...

[Nbadan]

Doesn't look like the Iowans are sticking to the game plan....

By Anne E. Kornblut and Jon Cohen
Washington Post Staff Writers
Monday, November 19, 2007; 5:01 PM


The top three Democratic contenders remain locked in a close battle in Iowa, with Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (N.Y.) seeing her advantages diminish on key fronts, including the questions of experience and which candidate is best prepared to handle the war in Iraq, according to a new Washington Post-ABC News poll.

Illinois Senator Barack Obama gets the support of 30 percent of likely Democratic caucus-goers in Iowa, compared to 26 percent for Clinton, 22 percent for former senator John Edwards and 11 percent for New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson. The results are only marginally changed from a Post-ABC poll in late July, but in a state likely to set the course for the rest of the nominating process, there are significant signs of progress for Obama -- and harbingers of concern for Clinton.

Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/19/AR2007111900940.html?hpid=topnews)

The Wing-nuts are panicking now....Hiltary, their candidate of choice, is fading...time to pull a old trick from the Nixon playbook and use Robert Novak to 'leak' (fucker) another story that Clinton has dirt on Obama...

[Nbadan]

Hillary Clinton Laughs About NAFTA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBypp2hqxaQ)

[Nbadan]

New Hampshire poll (Dec. 17, 2003). Dean 45%, Kerry 20%, 15% undecided


Read this ARG poll from December 2003 to realize how Hillary Clinton's 15% lead in New Hampshire is nothing at this point, due to the difficulty in predicting primary outcomes.

Hillary supporters cannot claim that the huge number of undecided is not the case in 2007, but the fact is that according to this same ARG poll, only 15% of respondents claimed to be undecided back then.

ARG (http://americanresearchgroup.com/nhpoll/dem/)

[Walter Craparita]

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a253/DZRick/ChristmasNutcracker.jpg

[DarkReign]

The corporate elites and media types already have decided on Hitlery. You people are so cute following your cherished little illusion that you get to choose the President. :lmao

I agree completely. But at what point do we take that illusion and turn it back into fact?

Some say the 08 election is going to be a reeeeeeeal turning point for this country...and I am not talking about the election itself.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I agree completely. But at what point do we take that illusion and turn it back into fact?

Some say the 08 election is going to be a reeeeeeeal turning point for this country...and I am not talking about the election itself.I wish i knew the answer to the first question. I wish I did. Even as a kid I always wondered why people dropped out of the race because they ran out of money. Imagine if that wasn't the case. This next election will show what kind of backbone we have to the whole world. If Hillary is sworn in, and I pray everyday that she isn't, I will have no longer have faith in our system and will feel more and more like our country isn't as strong as it once was.

[clambake]

I will have no longer have faith in our system and will feel more and more like our country isn't as strong as it once was.
where have you been, solitary confinement?

[DarkReign]

where have you been, solitary confinement?

I think youre being overdramatic. I think his point was, Yeah, this is bad. But if we elect someone who would absolutely make it worse, than this country is a shithole and really doesnt deserve what it has anymore anyway.

If thats not his point, oh well, it certainly is mine.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I think youre being overdramatic. I think his point was, Yeah, this is bad. But if we elect someone who would absolutely make it worse, than this country is a shithole and really doesnt deserve what it has anymore anyway.

If thats not his point, oh well, it certainly is mine.exactly.

[xrayzebra]

It doesn't matter. The DNC is intent on fielding another candidate who will lose a race that the Demos should win.

With your point of view, guess we can do away with the
Primaries.


Hey, everyone, we still have a whole blasted year until
the election. Get a grip.

[Nbadan]

I think youre being overdramatic. I think his point was, Yeah, this is bad. But if we elect someone who would absolutely make it worse, than this country is a shithole and really doesnt deserve what it has anymore anyway.

If thats not his point, oh well, it certainly is mine.

I really don't see how any candidate besides the Bush-crime family could make it worse - still, the Neo-cons have a vested interest in controlling the Presidency - because if we elect a Prez that they don't control, there is a good probability that they all go to jail for war crimes and crimes against humanity....as I've posted before in the Naomi Campbell thread, we are on the brink of all out fascism in the U.S...9 of the 10 steps she outlines have already been full-filled, all that is left is for Dubya to turn his version of the SS - blackwater - on U.S. citizens...which is already happening in cases of disasters - but god forbid there should be another terra attack on U.S. soil - then we will see the fascists dogs take their masks off and it will be the end of Democracy in the U.S...

[Nbadan]

Clinton's lead in New Hampshire is narrowing -- down 7 points since September -- according to the latest CNN/WMUR-TV poll.


Clinton now gets 36% support, followed by Obama at 22% (up 2 points), John Edwards at 13% (up 1 point). In September, Clinton
led Obama 43%-20%, and Edwards was at 12%, so Clinton's lead over Obama has shrunk from 23 points to 14 points in the past
two months.

Also:

Richardson 12%.
Dennis Kucinich 3%
Joe Biden 2%
Chris Dodd 1%

Kucinich has as many supporters as Biden and Dodd combined. Wow.

47% of those polled remain undecided, so I expect many to finally make up their minds after Jan. 3's Iowa caucus results roll in.

Link (http://www.unh.edu/survey-center/news/pdf/primary2008_demprim112007.pdf)

[xrayzebra]

I really don't see how any candidate besides the Bush-crime family could make it worse - still, the Neo-cons have a vested interest in controlling the Presidency - because if we elect a Prez that they don't control, there is a good probability that they all go to jail for war crimes and crimes against humanity....as I've posted before in the Naomi Campbell thread, we are on the brink of all out fascism in the U.S...9 of the 10 steps she outlines have already been full-filled, all that is left is for Dubya to turn his version of the SS - blackwater - on U.S. citizens...which is already happening in cases of disasters - but god forbid there should be another terra attack on U.S. soil - then we will see the fascists dogs take their masks off and it will be the end of Democracy in the U.S...

Talk about being a "drama queen". Dan, you sure are
up for the nomination. You better get of the U.S. and
get yourself to Europe or other parts before hold Hitler
himself arises and takes over.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Talk about being a "drama queen". Dan, you sure are
up for the nomination. You better get of the U.S. and
get yourself to Europe or other parts before hold Hitler
himself arises and takes over.


hitler is dead. as far as i am aware he did not come back to life. let this talking point die a slow and miserable death..

[xrayzebra]

hitler is dead. as far as i am aware he did not come back to life. let this talking point die a slow and miserable death..

Not according to dan. He has arisen.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Not according to dan. He has arisen.


sorry ray.. :lol

[DarkReign]

I dont believe Dan is wrong, in this case. This isnt about Bush/Clinton, its about freedom as we know it. It just-so-happens that Bush was the presiding President during the time when the real power of this country is green-lighting most of the plans theyve had in works for 60 years.

Elect Clinton...fine. Still going to happen. They are all cut from the same cloth. When will you people get this fact. Dem or Repub, it doesnt fucking matter. Their pockets are lined by the same individuals with the same goals in mind.

The dissolution of the US.
The advent of the NAU.
Followed closely by the destruction of basic rights.

That is fascism. I will not stand idly by while it goes down either. I will be dead long before I allow it to unfold having petty bitch-fests over who is cooler, Blue or Red.

[Walter Craparita]

^ Different sides will take America on different paths, will they not?

[Mr. Peabody]

^ Different sides will take America on different paths, will they not?

You get the "illusion" of different sides to make you think that you have a choice. The illusion of choice makes you think you're free and keeps you pacified. There's only one side my friend and there is only one path.

[xrayzebra]

Sheeesh, the shadow knows. So many dark secrets, so many
conspiracies. Whats a guy suppose to do. How do you choose
which side to support and which side to oppose.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Sheeesh, the shadow knows. So many dark secrets, so many
conspiracies. Whats a guy suppose to do. How do you choose
which side to support and which side to oppose.


Well you get by quite easily when you whore every clinton conspiracy theory...

[Nbadan]

Mainstream Media Goes Over the Top
by Bill Hare | Nov 21 2007 - 8:19am |



If ever there was a reason why voters should disregard the mainstream media and not let them influence, much less decide their 2008 presidential votes it was supplied in the November 18 edition of America’s paper of record, the New York Times.

In that Sunday edition two columns by Pulitzer Prize winners were so mind-numbing in their collective absurdities that I have never felt more confident in my life in being a blogger who has constantly referred to the mainstream journalists alongside television commentators, particularly at Fox Fixed News, as “media snake oil.”

For those who may have been otherwise detached or away, important elements of the mainstream media have launched a full court press to confer the 2008 Democratic Party presidential nomination on Hillary Clinton.

In these multi-candidate forums staged for television audiences classified as debates the conventional wisdom among these sources is that Clinton is far outclassing her opposition and appears intent on conveying the message that the other candidates might just as well go away now rather than exhaust themselves for nothing.

When Howard Dean caught fire and developed grass roots strength four years ago how terrified the mainstream media became that the political pros who by natural birthright should be running the process might have a candidate to contend with who was receiving money and enlisting ground support from somewhere other than the corporate-lobbying axis that is silently endowed with the opportunity to run our political process with no interruption desired from intrusive citizens.

After Dean faced a directional mike and was compelled to shout to be heard amid a roomful of boisterous supporters that fateful night in Iowa the media saw an opportunity and pounced. Howard Dean, the story went out far and wide, had flipped out and was clearly not responsible enough to assume the office of the presidency.

Mind you that this was a position then occupied by someone who claimed to obtain advice on matters of war and peace by talking to God, who had blown up frogs as a youngster, and who self-admittedly had consumed alcohol heavily until his fortieth birthday.

Now the mainstream media has another target, Barack Obama, someone that makes their numbers nervous because he too comes from outside the good old reliable Beltway that gives us good old reliable leadership that currently has the dollar at all-time lows and will soon reach a $10 trillion debt, to name just two obvious points as starters.

Since Obama possessed the audacity to say he would talk to even unpopular foreign leaders, the New World Order collectively cringed, and most notably its currently designated poster girl Hillary Clinton.

So now the New York Times has given us two Pulitzer Prize winners serving up opinion about current matters involving Barack Obama in Thomas Friedman and Maureen Dowd.

The story being disseminated by certain mainstream media sources is that Obama lacks the toughness necessary in a president, the kind they perceive that Hillary Clinton admirably possesses. This is another media snake oil pitch to mess with voters’ minds without supplying plausible evidence to back up such a claim, the same kind of approach used against Dean in 2004 in questioning his stability and cautioning that he was a hot head.

Dean was a former competitive amateur wrestler, and this perhaps, according to these experts, accounted for his perceived hostility. Donald Rumsfeld was a college wrestling champion, but that fact was glossed over by the same sources pillorying Dean.

Friedman begins by accepting that Obama has registered a valid point in stating that an American president does not just need to speak to friends or prospective allies but those in profound disagreement as well.

This is fine so far as it goes, but Friedman believes that Obama needs to display a measure of toughness as well if he is to hold such meetings and poses a suggestion on how this element can be provided in discussions with Iran.

Since Dick Cheney must have convinced Iran by now that he possesses the necessary machismo to order an attack then perhaps Obama should consider keeping him on as vice president to complement his discussion strategy. In short, if talk fails then tough guy Cheney will nod to America’s military commanders and battle would be waged.

With Cheney’s past record he is just what Obama does not need. While remaining on the payroll of his old company Halliburton it was Cheney who in private meetings with corporate chieftains presided over the dividing up of Iraq’s oil profits before the first shock and awe attack was ever launched.

It was Cheney that applied pressure on CIA Middle East hands to deliver reports highlighting Iraq’s nuclear capability. It was Cheney who was hellbent to go to war with Iraq as a staunch neoconservative with close ties to William Kristol’s Project for the New American Century, which advocated attacking Iraq long before Bush took office.

So now Barack Obama needs Cheney?

Maureen Dowd presented a column reminiscent of Halloween and midnight goblins. It seems that Hillary Clinton in her infinite strategic brilliance has been alternately evil eyeing and ignoring Barack Obama to the point where the Illinois senator has become so completely psyched out that he cannot even deliver discussion points in an articulate manner.

Dowd even went so far as to write that Hillary’s presumed mastery of Obama related to his tendency to become intimidated by strong women. She buttressed her point by referring to Obama’s joint interview with his wife on Sixty Minutes where husband and wife laughingly exclaimed that his spouse gave him permission to run for president only after he agreed to give up smoking. Thus, Obama is a henpecked husband, rendering him more vulnerable to Hillary’s persuasions.

Dowd’s penchant for fantasy conjures up memories of Peggy “thousand points of light” Noonan. I have been watching the same joint candidate question and answer sessions that Dowd has and fail to see Obama metaphorically falling on his sword under the evil conjuring eye of Hillary Clinton.

Perhaps Dowd has been reading too many Harry Potter books. I found Obama to appear more refreshingly candid and real before an audience than stagy thespian Hillary with those expressions she conveys when other candidates are speaking that appear all too contrived.

At a critical American crossroad Hillary is falling back on conventional gimmickry and responses that all too often appear to be drawn from a Dick Morris playbook emphasizing triangulation.

The recent journalistic efforts of Friedman and Dowd should provide one essential message for America’s voters:

Forget the packaged nonsense being disseminated by the corporate mainstream media. If you are going to view and listen to these candidate exchanges then make up your own minds based on what you have seen and heard.

The Smirking chimp (http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/11147)

[Wild Cobra]

Running after an extremely unpopular Republican president and administration, who started an extremely unpopular war, should make things easier for the Democratic candidate. Hell, the Demos would have won in '04 had they fielded anyone other than John Kerry.
Sad, but likely true.

[Nbadan]

Clinton trails all possible Republican nominees according to a new Zogby poll just released...


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Democratic front-runner Hillary Clinton trails five top Republican presidential contenders in general election match-ups, a drop in support from this summer, according to a poll released on Monday.

Clinton's top Democratic rivals, Barack Obama and John Edwards, still lead Republicans in hypothetical match-ups ahead of the November 4, 2008, presidential election, the survey by Zogby Interactive showed.

Reuters (http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSN2645320920071127?feedType=RSS&feedName=politicsNews&rpc=22&sp=true)

[JoeChalupa]

Barack is gaining ground and if he takes Iowa, and takes it strongly like Newt Gingrich predicts, look for Hillary to kick up the negative attacks up a notch. And if that happens it will hurt her already "bitchy" status.

[boutons_]

the "bitch" has a long way to go to out-bastard Rove, RNC, Mellon-Scaif/FLAG/Swift-boaters, but I don't doubt she'll try.

All in all, campaigns expose American civilizaton at its very best. :)

[DarkReign]

the "bitch" has a long way to go to out-bastard Rove, RNC, Mellon-Scaif/FLAG/Swift-boaters, but I don't doubt she'll try.

All in all, campaigns expose American civilizaton at its very best. :)

We'll see. The Clinton machine isnt even in full effect yet.

[Yonivore]

We'll see. The Clinton machine isnt even in full effect yet.
I think that the Clintons even have a "machine" is one of the reasons voters are being turned off.

[DarkReign]

I think that the Clintons even have a "machine" is one of the reasons voters are being turned off.

I certainly hope youre right.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I think that the Clintons even have a "machine" is one of the reasons voters are being turned off.


:rolleyes

[JoeChalupa]

I think that the Clintons even have a "machine" is one of the reasons voters are being turned off.

As well as the "machine" known as Karl Rove and Dick Cheney have turned voters against the current administration.

[George Gervin's Afro]

As well as the "machine" known as Karl Rove and Dick Cheney have turned voters against the current administration.


This is why people like Yoni really lose me when they make comments like that about Clinton. As if The Clinton's are the first politicians in history to have a 'political machine'.

[JoeChalupa]

This is why people like Yoni really lose me when they make comments like that about Clinton. As if The Clinton's are the first politicians in history to have a 'political machine'.

I concur. The Bush Machine concocted the biggest scam to get us into war in history.

[xrayzebra]

We'll see. The Clinton machine isnt even in full effect yet.

I understand that Clinton, Inc is just trying not to come
in third in Iowa. If she does, Obama is the bright boy
on the street. But I don't think he can beat anyone.

[xrayzebra]

As well as the "machine" known as Karl Rove and Dick Cheney have turned voters against the current administration.

But Joe, the current administration isn't running.

[JoeChalupa]

I understand that Clinton, Inc is just trying not to come
in third in Iowa. If she does, Obama is the bright boy
on the street. But I don't think he can beat anyone.

A recent poll shows Obama beating republicans while Hillary loses.

[JoeChalupa]

But Joe, the current administration isn't running.

It doesn't mean their "machine" doesn't exist.

[Yonivore]

As I said, I think that the Clintons evening having a "machine" is what is turning off voters. I believe the public is sick and tired of "party" politics and "political" machinery.

With the exception of Rudy Guiliani, I don't think any of the other candidates -- Democrat or Republican -- are perceived as being backed by some vast campaign machinery.

We'll see. Unlike George Gervin's Afro, I've been wrong before.

[Nbadan]

Can you hear that? It's the Clinton campaign crumbling...

Iowa Debate Reaction: Focus Group discusses Obama success (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdaROq57qsg)

[BradLohaus]

These guys are good.

Corso's back!

Corso!

[Nbadan]

http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i191/hissyspit/ThisModernWorld-16Dec2007.jpg