possible Miguel Cabrera deals

[JamStone]

plenty of talks to Angels and Dodgers, but for Detroit Tigers fans, new reports by Ken Rosenthal rumor that Tigers and Marlins in serious talks about a trade involving Miguel Cabrera and Dontrelle Willis for a package including Andrew Miller and Cameron Maybin.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/7525396

[JMarkJohns]

That would be amazing. You'd have to think they'd get a few more prospects, but that's a hell of a trade for Detroit, regardless.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Two things:

1. I think the Marlins are using the Tigers to drive up the price for Miggy.

2. DD's man-love for Maybin would ultimately kill this deal.

[JamStone]

My first reaction was that too. They are using the Tigers to get more from the Angels. And, with DD's connections with the Marlins, he might very well be in on it to help his old club out. But, if the deal really does have legs, it's pretty exciting.

[K-State Spur]

Maybin's a stud, but hard to believe that he + Miller is anywhere near enough for both Cabrera and Willis.

[JMarkJohns]

Maybin's a stud, but hard to believe that he + Miller is anywhere near enough for both Cabrera and Willis.

That's what I'm saying. At least one more very good prospect (not elite, but near) needs to be included and at least one other above average prospect.

I do think, however, the Tiger's offer bests any legit offer from any other team. Some team's could offer as much or more, but are just unwilling.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

The Tigers and Marlins are hammering out the final details on an eight-player trade that would send third baseman Miguel Cabrera and left-handed starter Dontrelle Willis to Detroit for a left-hander Andrew Miller, outfielder Cameron Maybin and four other prospects.

http://wintermeetings.mlblogs.com/nashvilleconfidential/

I guess Illitch wants to win now and I love him for it. Six prospects is a heavy price to pay.

[Pistons < Spurs]

WOW! Go TIGERS!

[JamStone]

On ESPN now ... and it's basically a done deal pending language in the trade agreement and physicals.

WOW!

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I love this trade and how it went down. No hourly update on ESPN by Gammons(who said this trade wouldn't happen), just stay quietly behind the scenes and work the phones.

Willis is the key to this deal. If he regain half of his form, the Tigers can compete with the BoSox, even if they get Santana.

Grandy
Polanco
Cabrera
Maggs
Sheff
Guillen
Renteria
Pudge
Thames/Jacque Jones

That's a sick lineup.

Even better, SP:

Verlander
Rogers
Bondo
Willis
Robertson

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Rabelo is part of the deal with Maybin, Miller and three other prospects.

[Burn531]

I got Dela Cruz, Holliman, Sizemore and Larish from the mlive forums. Could be false though.

[Thunder Dan]

son of a bitch. The Marlins are bad for baseball, they are basically a community triple-A team. The Central should be interesting again this year.

[FromWayDowntown]

Pretty solid effort by the Tigers to stay in the 2007 AL Arms Race. Cabrera could be a monsterous upgrade at 3B and Willis should add some depth to that staff.

And the Marlins appear to have done again what they did between 1997 and 2003 and then again a few years ago; I'm not sure that any club in the majors is better at taking existing talent and turning it into major league-ready players instead of long-off prospects.

[FromWayDowntown]

son of a bitch. The Marlins are bad for baseball, they are basically a community triple-A team. The Central should be interesting again this year.

A community Triple-A team that is the only franchise other than the Yankees and Red Sox to win multiple World Series since 1997.

2007 - Red Sox
2006 - Cardinals
2005 - White Sox
2004 - Red Sox
2003 - Marlins
2002 - Angels
2001 - Diamondbacks
2000 - Yankees
1999 - Yankees
1998 - Yankees
1997 - Marlins

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Pretty solid effort by the Tigers to stay in the 2007 AL Arms Race. Cabrera could be a monsterous upgrade at 3B and Willis should add some depth to that staff.

And the Marlins appear to have done again what they did between 1997 and 2003 and then again a few years ago; I'm not sure that any club in the majors is better at taking existing talent and turning it into major league-ready players instead of long-off prospects.


Maybin showed last year that he still needs a few seasons in the Minors and Miller was basically a one pitch pitcher last year. The drafting of Porcello made Miller expendable.

DD must have cried when adding Maybin to the deal.

[Flintstones32]

yeah maybin is going to be a stud, but he does need a few more seasons. A great deal by the tigers though. Very excited for the season to get going. Also as has already been said, if Willis can get back to the top of his game, Tigers pitching is going to be scary good.

[tlongII]

Great trade for the Tigers. If they're healthy they should be neck and neck with the Bosox. I wish the M's would get some pitching.

[timvp]

As long as Cabrera doesn't keep getting fatter and fatter, this is a really nice deal for the Tigers. He's one of the most purely talented players in the game. And Willis is a couple seasons removed from being a certified stud.

That said, knowing the Marlins trading history, they'll probably come out pretty nice in this deal, as well.

[jochhejaam]

Brandon Inge is having a terrible, horrible, no good, very bad day.



Great trade!

[Marklar MM]

As long as Cabrera doesn't keep getting fatter and fatter

Reports state he has lost 15+ pounds.

[JamStone]

Miguel Cabrera has "DH" written all over his pancake ass. Extraordinary hitter who will underwhelm at third base, especially after the last couple seasons where Tiger fans have seen Inge made some spectacular defensive plays.

Maybin should be a stud. And, one pitch or not, I think Andrew Miller already is a stud.

Hopefully Comerica Park's huge gaps will be friendly to Willis. He still has talent, but I think hitters got used to his unconventional wind up. The better AL line-ups may be offset a little bit by Comerica Park and hitters not being used to Dontrelle's pitching motion. Hopefully.

I think both teams got what they wanted in the trade.

Tigers farm system is completely empty at this point aside from a few third level pitching prospects and Rick Porcello.

I still like the trade though. Especially since Willis and Cabrera are so young, so giving up the future isn't so bad since Willis and Cabrera should still have many years left in the majors. Need to sign Cabrera to an extension.

[Marklar MM]

Miguel Cabrera has "DH" written all over his pancake ass. Extraordinary hitter who will underwhelm at third base, especially after the last couple seasons where Tiger fans have seen Inge made some spectacular defensive plays.

Need to sign Cabrera to an extension.


While you can say that about Cabrera, I really believe he will lose weight to play for a championship, seeing as it is reported he has lost 15+ pounds. Remember...when he wasn't overweight, he was a very solid defensive player.

As to re-signing Cabrera, I also think they should re-sign Willis.

[K-State Spur]

He'll lose weight to get paid. To win a championship is probably saying too much at this point.

[JamStone]

I don't know. Fat people love to eat. I hope so though.

[jochhejaam]

[QUOTE=JamStone]Miguel Cabrera has "DH" written all over his pancake ass. Extraordinary hitter who will underwhelm at third base, especially after the last couple seasons where Tiger fans have seen Inge made some spectacular defensive plays.
FWIW;
311 games at 3B for Cabrera over the last 2 years with 40 errors.

309 games at 3B for Inge over the last 2 years with 40 errors.

However, I've never seen Cabrera play.


Spectacular plays or not, Inge's hitting was pretty atrocious last year, so I was hoping to get his bat out of the lineup. Sheffield can DH and Jacque Jones and Thames can platoon in left...?

[Extra Stout]

son of a bitch. The Marlins are bad for baseball, they are basically a community triple-A team. The Central should be interesting again this year.
It's hard to maintain any kind of payroll when only 375 people show up to watch your games.

[Thunder Dan]

A community Triple-A team that is the only franchise other than the Yankees and Red Sox to win multiple World Series since 1997.

2007 - Red Sox
2006 - Cardinals
2005 - White Sox
2004 - Red Sox
2003 - Marlins
2002 - Angels
2001 - Diamondbacks
2000 - Yankees
1999 - Yankees
1998 - Yankees
1997 - Marlins

I meant it more along the lines of they get prospects ready to trade to other teams. Once a guy gets good they trade him and they have no intentions of winning.

[FromWayDowntown]

. . . . Once a guy gets good they trade him and they have no intentions of winning.

Except, of course, in the years in which they win.

[Thunder Dan]

Except, of course, in the years in which they win.

yeah I know. I remember in the 1997 offseason when they made the Yankees look cheap. Their only goal was to win a World Series so they went out and got a ton of players, won the Series, then traded them all. They did a scaled down version of that in 2003 after they won the Series.

[Extra Stout]

yeah I know. I remember in the 1997 offseason when they made the Yankees look cheap. Their only goal was to win a World Series so they went out and got a ton of players, won the Series, then traded them all. They did a scaled down version of that in 2003 after they won the Series.
They have been trying to do something, ANYTHING, to get people in Miami to go to games. They tried upping the payroll and fielding a competitive team through free agency. Miami yawned. They tried building a team of exciting young prospects and fielding a competitive team that way. Miami scratched its scrotch and flipped over to the World Series of Poker.

So all that's left to do is to have as low a payroll as possible so they don't go bankrupt in the meantime, and see if somebody in Portland will build them a stadium.

Baseball in Miami has failed.

[FromWayDowntown]

yeah I know. I remember in the 1997 offseason when they made the Yankees look cheap. Their only goal was to win a World Series so they went out and got a ton of players, won the Series, then traded them all. They did a scaled down version of that in 2003 after they won the Series.

I'm not sure that the 1997 and 2003 teams were built in the same fashion. The 1997 team was a bunch of mercenaries; the 2003 team was constructed through good transactions, most of which were trades:

C: Pudge Rodriguez (free agent, winter 2003)
1B: Derrick Lee (acquired via trade for Kevin Brown)
2B: Luis Castillo (signed by Marlins as amateur free agent)
SS: Alex Gonzalez (signed by Marlins as amateur free agent)
3B: Mike Lowell (acquired via trade from Yankees)
LF: Miguel Cabrera (signed by Marlins as amateur free agent)
CF: Juan Pierre (acquired via trade from Rockies for Charles Johnson and others)
RF: Juan Encarnacion (acquired via trade from Cincinnati)

SP: Josh Beckett (drafted by Marlins 1999)
SP: Brad Penny (acquired via trade from Arizona for Matt Mantei)
SP: Mark Redman (acquired via trade from Detroit)
SP: Carl Pavano (acquired via trade from Montreal)
SP: Dontrelle Willis (acquired via trade from Chicago Cubs)
CL: Braden Looper (acquired via trade from St. Louis for Edgar Renteria)
RP: Chad Fox (signed as street free agent, mid 2003 after release by Red Sox)
RP: Ugueth Urbina (acquired via trade from Rangers in mid-2003)
RP: Rick Helling (signed as street free agent, mid 2003 after release by Orioles)

That bunch wasn't a paid-for team; that was a constructed team made through a series of very good trades. I see very much the same thing going on with the Marlins right now. They couldn't afford to keep the established stars on their roster for very much longer; rather than letting those guys walk without getting anything back, the Marlins sought out the best prospects they could find. They'll play those guys along with the kids they already have: Hanley Ramirez, Dan Uggla, Josh Willingham, Jeremy Hermida, and the stable of young arms they're developing down there.

I'm not saying that the Marlins are going to win another World Series in the near future; but as teams with messed-up economics go, the Marlins at least make shrewd moves that give them a chance -- far more than can be said for clubs like the Pirates, Royals, and Devil Rays.

[Thunder Dan]

I'm not saying that the Marlins are going to win another World Series in the near future; but as teams with messed-up economics go, the Marlins at least make shrewd moves that give them a chance -- far more than can be said for clubs like the Pirates, Royals, and Devil Rays.

Well the Marlins have the best scouting department in baseball hands down. That is what seperates them from the perennial losers of MLB.

[AFBlue]

Well the Marlins have the best scouting department in baseball hands down. That is what seperates them from the perennial losers of MLB.


The Marlins win for several reasons...

1. Once they decide to "rebuild", they are absolutely and adamantly dedicated to it - Dontrelle and Miggy were their only/last two trade assets

2. They rebuild with pitching - 6 of the 8 trade pieces were pitching prospects

3. They fill areas of legitimate need - CF Maybin and C Robelo

4. They let their prospects grow while playing MLB competition - Ramirez, Olson, Hermida...now Maybin

[JamStone]

Well the Marlins have the best scouting department in baseball hands down. That is what seperates them from the perennial losers of MLB.


Actually, the reasons the Marlins had been one of the best clubs at scouting in baseball are now employed by the Detroit Tigers.

[AFBlue]

Actually, the reasons the Marlins had been one of the best clubs at scouting in baseball are now employed by the Detroit Tigers.

Miguel Cabrera may have been their best player, but Hanley Ramirez wasn't far behind....and he's still with the Marlins. They still have productive guys in Willingham and Uggla. And they still have a promising young talent in Hermida. Now add Maybin to the mix and they've got a solid young squad.

Also, any number of the Marlins starting pitchers (Olsen, Miller, Sanchez, Johnson, etc.) could be better than Willis was over the last two years.

Bottom Line: Give this squad two years to mature and jell, then add some "ringers" to fill the gaps and you're looking at another contender.

[FromWayDowntown]

Bottom Line: Give this squad two years to mature and jell, then add some "ringers" to fill the gaps and you're looking at another contender.

I think that's increasingly true in the NL East. The Mets seem to be a complete mess; the Phillies have all kinds of offense (at least until playoff time) but don't have much pitching beyond Hamels; the Braves seem to be stuck in mediocrity with no great young players coming up as they resort to Glavine to try to stablize their staff; and who knows what the Nats are doing?

I don't know that it's reasonable to think that Florida could contend in 2008, but if this group matures as it should and sticks together, the Marlins could be right back in that mix again, despite their terrible economics and the badmouthing of the way they ship out talent.

[JamStone]

Miguel Cabrera may have been their best player, but Hanley Ramirez wasn't far behind....and he's still with the Marlins. They still have productive guys in Willingham and Uggla. And they still have a promising young talent in Hermida. Now add Maybin to the mix and they've got a solid young squad.

Also, any number of the Marlins starting pitchers (Olsen, Miller, Sanchez, Johnson, etc.) could be better than Willis was over the last two years.

Bottom Line: Give this squad two years to mature and jell, then add some "ringers" to fill the gaps and you're looking at another contender.


What does that have to do with what I said?

Marlins scouting was considered one of the best because of Dave Dombrowski and his scouting staff. Dave Dombrowski and many of his scouts that were with him at Florida now work for the Tigers.

I said nothing about how good or bad the Marlins might be in a few years.


edit: Oh, I get what you were saying now. I wasn't referring to players, Cabrera and Willis, when I said the reasons why Marlins were great at scouting are employed by the Tigers. I was referring to Dombrowski and his scouts. They made the Marlins one of the best scouting teams in baseball. They now work for Detroit.

[AFBlue]

What does that have to do with what I said?

Marlins scouting was considered one of the best because of Dave Dombrowski and his scouting staff. Dave Dombrowski and many of his scouts that were with him at Florida now work for the Tigers.

I said nothing about how good or bad the Marlins might be in a few years.


edit: Oh, I get what you were saying now. I wasn't referring to players, Cabrera and Willis, when I said the reasons why Marlins were great at scouting are employed by the Tigers. I was referring to Dombrowski and his scouts. They made the Marlins one of the best scouting teams in baseball. They now work for Detroit.

:lol

Whoops!

Thanks for the clarification... :lol

[AFBlue]

Does anyone know if they're planning on moving Hanley to 3B now that there's a vacany?

He clearly has a third baseman's body/power, and he struggled defensively at SS.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Its hard to get fans to show up for games when you have a 10 million payroll every year.

No, it's because Miami is one of the worst sports towns in the country.

[TheTruth]

Go Reds!!!!!!