Trade!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Tek_XX]

If you had to, whom, or who would it be?

[Hemotivo]

Elson for Rebounds

[Please_dont_ban_me]

Elson

for

Jakim Noah of the Bulls :D

[m33p0]

elson for andy!

[loveforthegame]

Did you hear Marv Albert after Pop talked at the start of the 4th quarter? Something about Pop saying in the next 2 weeks that if things hadn't improved changes were going to be made. Whether it was guys off the bench moving into the starting lineup or possible trades. Since when did they talk about trades?

[Hemotivo]

marv albert?

[ChumpDumper]

I would not trade for Marv Albert.

[T Park]

CIA pop.

That means no ones leaving...

[loveforthegame]

Sorry Kevin Harlin or whatever his name is. The comments were made right after Pop talked to Cheryl Miller at the start of the 4th quarter.

[ManuTim_best of Fwiendz]

Hey, if a trade had been made before in our 2005 campaign, i don't have a problem with them looking for someone.

[Hemotivo]

I would not trade for Marv Albert.
:lol

who was doing the play by play tonight?

[Hemotivo]

kevin harlan maybe

[MaNu4Tres]

All I ask is for a Big man that plays like he has a pair defensively. Guards laugh when they see any of our bigs except duncan in the paint. Most specifically Oberto and Bonner.

[T Park]

All I ask is for a Big man that plays like he has a pair defensively. Guards laugh when they see any of our bigs except duncan in the paint. Most specifically Oberto and Bonner.

Miss the playoffs last year?

[MaNu4Tres]

Yes lets put all of our eggs in the basket with a 37 year old on his last legs repeating his playoff 07' defensive performace. Good thinking.

If you don't notice the hole in our interior defense I don't know what games your watching.

[T Park]

Yes lets put all of our eggs in the basket with a 37 year old on his last legs repeating his playoff 07' defensive performace. Good thinking.



Oberto and Bonner are 37?

What team are you watching?

[Hemotivo]

Mutombo is older and still block shots
:lol

[MaNu4Tres]

Robert Horry is the only big man who played interior defense last year in the playoffs, besides Tim Duncan.

Oh wait ...now i remember...your right I forgot about the Oberto Bonner flying to the boards and blocking shots from the weak side every game. Your right Oberto/ Bonner block party 07'.

[Hemotivo]

oberto can grab some reb


but pop play small ball in the 4th

[MaNu4Tres]

The last 3 minutes Oberto was in the game. Sliding trying to take a charge by flopping on lebrons last bucket. I think he slid a good 10 feet. Instead of standing his ground and keeping his hands up like a man. He's been nothing but a back cut/ rebound tipping, walking And 1 for every guard in the NBA.

[T Park]

Robert Horry is the only big man who played interior defense last year in the playoffs, besides Tim Duncan.

Oh wait ...now i remember...your right I forgot about the Oberto Bonner flying to the boards and blocking shots from the weak side every game. Your right Oberto/ Bonner block party 07'.

Yeah cause that shot blocking came in handy vs Cleveland and Utah.

What shot blocking stud center is available for signing or trading?

Names please.

[Hemotivo]

just the last 3 minutes?

give him the last 6 minutes
:bang a couple of offensive reb. by varejao over barry :bang

[Obstructed_View]

All I ask is for a Big man that plays like he has a pair defensively. Guards laugh when they see any of our bigs except duncan in the paint. Most specifically Oberto and Bonner.
They laugh because it's so rare to see the Spurs bigs anywhere but on the bench. Most specifically Oberto and Elson.

[MaNu4Tres]

http://www.nba.com/spurs/stats/2006/conf_finals_stats.html

http://www.nba.com/spurs/stats/2006/nba_finals_stats.html

Right again T-Park...Oberto exploded in the Blocking category. And every other category rather. So Oberto made open lay ups in the Jazz series YAY.

[T Park]

The last 3 minutes Oberto was in the game. Sliding trying to take a charge by flopping on lebrons last bucket. I think he slid a good 10 feet. Instead of standing his ground and keeping his hands up like a man. He's been nothing but a back cut/ rebound tipping, walking And 1 for every guard in the NBA.

Your a fucking idiot :lol

Lebron threw an elbow straight into his goddamn chest and knocked him over.

Quit talking out of your ass and watch the games.

[Obstructed_View]

Finley was third in blocks, so he should be the starting center. It's all so simple now!

[Hemotivo]

remember how bowen and oberto double team lebron in the finals

and remember the 4th q of game 4 (2007 finals)

like tpark said

[T Park]

Right again T-Park...Oberto exploded in the Blocking category. And every other category rather. So Oberto made open lay ups in the Jazz series YAY.

Waiting on the names.

Show also his stats for game 4 the clinching game in Cleveland.

Sorry that his 20 blocks didn't show up or anything, he just made clutch baskets and played good defense.


Sorry theres no stats to show that genius.

[T Park]

remember how bowen and oberto double team lebron in the finals

and remember the 4th q of game 4 (2007 finals)



BUT BUT HE DIDNT HAVE ANY BLOCKS!!!!

[Hemotivo]

:lol

[MaNu4Tres]

Your a fucking idiot :lol

Lebron threw an elbow straight into his goddamn chest and knocked him over.

Quit talking out of your ass and watch the games.


It was his Lebron's head, yes it could have knocked him over. But you could tell Oberto's intention was to flop and take the charge, instead of standing his ground with his hands up like a man.

[T Park]

But you could tell Oberto's intention was to flop and take the charge, instead of standing his ground with his hands up like a man

and get a foul charged him, and an and1.

either that, or lebron still makes the shot, and he did nothing but stand there.

Genius :tu

[MaNu4Tres]

remember how bowen and oberto double team lebron in the finals

and remember the 4th q of game 4 (2007 finals)

like tpark said


Yes y'all are right. It is so seldom to find a big man with the foot speed of Oberto to Double Team LeBron.

[T Park]

BTW

what is this horseshit

"Stand there like a man"

So is Manu less of a man when he flops and creates a foul?

(awaits onslaught)

[T Park]

It is so seldom to find a big man with the foot speed of Oberto to Double Team LeBron.

In other words

I lose arguement so I point out something insignificant.

[MaNu4Tres]

and get a foul charged him, and an and1.

either that, or lebron still makes the shot, and he did nothing but stand there.

Genius :tu


Any fan or any coach knows shit about basketball would rather have their big man stand his ground and contest a shot rather than look for flopping taking charges. At least thats my opinion.

[MaNu4Tres]

BTW

what is this horseshit

"Stand there like a man"

So is Manu less of a man when he flops and creates a foul?

(awaits onslaught)


It means stand your fuckin ground like the 6'10 and 250 pounder you are and play like it. Not this pussy shit look for flops instead of standing your ground and contesting a shot.

And for Manu, Oberto is lucky he coat-tailed Manu's fire and heart the past 10 years. Without Manu, Oberto would still be playing for Tau Ceramonica.

About Manu's flopping.
Manu is one of the skinniest/weakest shooting guard besides Kevin Martin in the NBA. Yes he flops but thats the only thing he can do when rotating from the weakside defensively. I applaud him for that especially when he takes charges from bigger guys. Manu doesn't have the luxury of an 8 1/2 -9 foot reach like Oberto or a 6'10 250 pound frame. When Oberto rotates defensively teams point and laugh and get their And 1.

[T Park]

And for Manu, Oberto is lucky he coat-tailed Manu's fire and heart the past 10 years. Without Manu, Oberto would still be playing for Tau Ceramonica.



So Oberto played with Manu in Tau?


Yes he flops but thats the only thing he can do when rotating from the weakside defensively. I applaud him for that especially when he takes charges from bigger guys. Manu doesn't have the luxury of an 8 1/2 -9 foot reach like Oberto. When Oberto rotates defensively teams point and laugh and get their And 1.


So in other words

Manu is god

everyone else is shit.

Shocking.

[MaNu4Tres]

So in other words

Manu is god

everyone else is shit.

Shocking.[/QUOTE]


No in other words Oberto blows. (Outside of back cutting, making wide open lay ups, and tipping the ball out for an offensive rebound.)

[T Park]

Yeah Oberto blows.

Genius.

Just genius...

[TDMVPDPOY]

i trade for marcus camby

or some athletic center who can block shots and reb...tyson chandler....

why dont we trade for okafor

[T Park]

Why not trade for Dwight Howard?

[SScarrJ]

Oberto is nothing better than a 3rd or 4th big man in the rotation. He should be coming off the bench splitting time with Horry.

Oberto is wildly inconsistent on the defensive end but for some odd reason people love him.I mean i always remembered our defense being centered around funneling guys to our bigs, but with Oberto on the floor that just turns into easy points. I don't know about you guys but I don't like watching teams run lay up drills and then get free throws on top of it. Don't get me wrong I still think we can win it all with him as our center, but our offense has to be firing on all cylinders. I guess I would just prefer to play it safe and try and package Berry and Elson and maybe even a pick for a guy like Kurt Thomas.

[T Park]

I guess I would just prefer to play it safe and try and package Berry and Elson and maybe even a pick for a guy like Kurt Thomas.



Yeah Kurt Thomas the blocking machine :lmao

[T Park]

I guess I would just prefer to play it safe and try and package Berry and Elson and maybe even a pick for a guy like Kurt Thomas.



Quoted again for someone wanting an interior shot blocker and wanting to trade for Kurt Thomas :lmao

[SScarrJ]

Why don't you quote me where I said hes a shot blocker? Hes a good interior defender who plays good post defense and keeps his hands up. He doesn't allow lay up lines and unlike Oberto he can pull down a rebound. Oh yeah he can also hit a mid range jumper unlike Mr. And 1 whose range consists of a 2 ft lay up.

I guess its comical to trade your 3rd wing and a big man who contributes nothing for a guy who is better than our starting center.

[MaNu4Tres]

Don't you dare argue with T-park the great. No posts= no game.

Kurt Thomas would be an improvement over Oberto for sure. His on the ball defense in the post is superior to Oberto's and he stands his ground and at least contests shots to some extent. Has a better midrange shot and I imagine he can make open lay ups.

[ss1986v2]

Quoted again for someone wanting an interior shot blocker and wanting to trade for Kurt Thomas :lmao
no doubt a very poor/laughable choice as far as shot blockers go, but he still beats the shorts off oberto (1.2 bpg on 25 mpg vs 0.3 bpg on 20 mpg this season; 0.8 bpg vs 0.3 bpg career). not that thats too hard to do though.

[SequSpur]

yeah, whats up with oberto flopping? what a puss.

[T Park]

Is this the same stud interior defender who Parker would blow by for layup after layup?


Don't you dare argue with T-park the great. No posts= no game.

Wanna quote me where I said that?

[BonnerDynasty]

Your a fucking idiot :lol

Lebron threw an elbow straight into his goddamn chest and knocked him over.

Quit talking out of your ass and watch the games.

C'mon man. That was an flop.

Take the homer glasses off.

[MaNu4Tres]

C'mon man. That was an flop.

Take the homer glasses off.


For once an unbiased opinion.

[MaNu4Tres]

Is this the same stud interior defender who Parker would blow by for layup after layup?



Wanna quote me where I said that?



Um I believe Parker blew by everyone last year, if I'm not mistaken. Didn't he get Finals MVP? I'm pretty sure Parker can blow by anyone in the NBA when he's injury free. Then again I may have ridiculous opinions.

[SequSpur]

yeah, whats up with oberto flopping? what a puss.

[T Park]

Then again I may have ridiculous opinions.

saying Oberto is a stiff is pretty Fing rediculous yes.

Justifying Manu flopping then turning around and giving some BS thing about Oberto flopping being bad is rediculous yes.

[genomefreak13]

If you had to, whom, or who would it be?

If I were to choose one, I would say...Barry for James Posey. Posey is a good defensive player and he has a shot from the outside. He's can also be physical on defense because he has a big build.I think posey is tailored made for the spurs. He's,first of all defensive minded.Second, he only shoots when necessary (He's like, bruce bowen). Lasstly, he's scrappy (like manu). A junk yard dog!

Not that I don't like barry. He's also a great player, he can shoot from the outside and can also do defense. But to get something , you must give something. He's the only guy in the bench ,except finley, that is enticing enough to the other teams. Boston , can really benefit from barry's three point shooting. That will give them a fourth option on offense (besides the big three). What you think guys? fair deal?

[SScarrJ]

So wait a second, just because K. Thomas gave up some lay ups to one of the better finishers in the NBA you dont think hes is a good defender? I guess by that logic you dont think that highly of Duncan, because he gets dunked on at least once a week

[T Park]

So wait a second, just because K. Thomas gave up some lay ups to one of the better finishers in the NBA you dont think hes is a good defender? I guess by that logic you dont think that highly of Duncan, because he gets dunked on at least once a week

same logic you guys use for Oberto.

[MaNu4Tres]

saying Oberto is a stiff is pretty Fing rediculous yes.

Justifying Manu flopping then turning around and giving some BS thing about Oberto flopping being bad is rediculous yes.


Oberto is a stiff. He's should be nothing more than the 4th big in our rotation. You tell me what he brings besides back cutting, making open lay ups, and tipping the ball for offensive rebounds .5 times a game.

Oberto is a big man. Big men who flop defensively are pussies.

[MaNu4Tres]

I'd take Rasho back for Oberto's salary in a heartbeat.

[T Park]

You tell me what he brings besides back cutting, making open lay ups, and tipping the ball for offensive rebounds .5 times a game.



Obviously nothing you know far more about the game than Gregg Popovich who thinks Oberto is a hell of a player.


Oberto is a big man. Big men who flop defensively are pussies.

But if Manu does it, its GOLD!!!

GENIUS!!

:lol

[T Park]

I'd take Rasho back for Oberto's salary in a heartbeat.

name me the games Rasho had like Oberto's in the playoffs please?

Stats also to back em up, cause stats tell the whole story.

[MaNu4Tres]

Pop has also said Beno is a hell of a player.

[MaNu4Tres]

Manu has no choice when rotating defensively to take a charge. He's a fraile stick. He can't stand his ground and contest shots like big men should.

[T Park]

:lmao

Thats the comeback

"Well well well pop said Beno is a hell of a player"

Pardon me


BTW

when Oberto put 21 and 13 on the Nuggets

what does that say about Marcus Camby?

[SScarrJ]

same logic you guys use for Oberto.
Kind of different wouldnt you say?

Kurt Thomas was giving up lay ups with zero help side defense on the Phoenix Suns who pay zero attention to defense. Also most of that series he was defending Duncan.

Oberto is playing alongside Tim Duncan and inside Poppavich's system that preaches defense.


Good comparison though.

[T Park]

Manu has no choice when rotating defensively to take a charge. He's a fraile stick. He can't stand his ground and contest shots like big men should\


God what apuss

[T Park]

Oberto is playing alongside Tim Duncan and inside Poppavich's system that preaches defense.



:lmao @ spelling Pop's name

congrats on botching that one there.


Whatever, you guys can bag on Oberto all you want, but where were you guys earlier this year when he was busting out double doubles left and right saying he is a stiff?

question

[Kori Ellis]

Oberto did flop. But it was also offensive. If not for running into Oberto, right before that for pushing with off arm on Bowen. But you aren't going to get that call that often.

Anyway, the Spurs game wasn't about a flop, or TP's missed free thows or Manu's miss at the end, it was about playing like crap for the majority of the game. If you keep getting down big, you have to expend all your energy crawling back. You could tell Tony/Manu were running out of gas at the end.

Anyway, Spurs Big 3 were pretty decent today. The rest of the team sucked though.

Write down all the excuses or complaints you want.

"We won't win with this old team."

"It's only one loss."

"Our bigs outside Tim suck."

"4 Rings!!"

blahblahblah

The Spurs aren't a very cohesive unit right now. Blame it on too many injuries not giving them enough time on the court together. Blame it on not enough trust in the role players, leading to too much one-on-one play from Manu and Tony. Blame it on Duncan not trying that hard on D.

I'm not that worried. Last year in January, I didn't like the Spurs team and I worried/complained a lot. I hated our bigs and I thought Barry should be dealt. Pop and the Spurs f'd me over and won a Championship. So apparently they know what they are doing. :lol

Pop will call them soft. The team will respond. They'll go on a 10 game winning streak. They'll drop a couple games to crap teams. And then we'll roll the dice and head into the playoffs and see what happens.

[SScarrJ]

gotta love when people go after spelling on a message board. Forgive me master of the English language,I didn't take the time to Google the correct spelling,It made my whole arguement insignificant.


Where was i when Oberto was pulling down double double? I wasn't bitching about him because he was actually doing his job. Forgive me for not having faith in a 3rd year player who so far has been inconsistent at best. When someone not named Tim, Tony, Manu, or Bruce isn't performing I'd prefer to have a backup plan. I don't want to go into the playoffs with a glaring weakness

[MaNu4Tres]

:lmao

Thats the comeback

"Well well well pop said Beno is a hell of a player"

Pardon me


BTW

when Oberto put 21 and 13 on the Nuggets

what does that say about Marcus Camby?



Pop always praises his players at one time or another to some extent. There is that mutual respect no matter how much PT a player gets or how he performs. You hardly ever hear Pop dog one his players in the media. Just because he has said Oberto and Beno are hell of a player doesn't justify that they are superb. Yes Oberto had a 2 -4 good games in the playoffs. Overall in the end hes nothing better than a 4th big in the rotation. Just an average big guy.( 5 points 5 boards .2 blocks in 20 mpg.)

And that game says nothing about Marcus Camby. Camby is a proven defensive rebounding blocking machine thats why he got DPOY award last year.

[T Park]

gotta love when people go after spelling on a message board. Forgive me master of the English language,I didn't take the time to Google the correct spelling,It made my whole arguement insignificant.



Well if your a Spurs fan I would think you would at least know how to spell the coach's name right

don't get so butt hurt.


Where was i when Oberto was pulling down double double? I wasn't bitching about him because he was actually doing his job.

So, when he plays bad trade him, when hes playing good

silence

the epitome of a "hater"

[Kori Ellis]

Well if your a Spurs fan I would think you would at least know how to spell the coach's name right

don't get so butt hurt.



I don't think you have a right to ever question anyone's spelling. :lol

[T Park]

Yes Oberto had a 2 -4 good games in the playoffs. Overall in the end hes nothing better than a 4th big in the rotation. Just an average big guy.( 5 points 5 boards .2 blocks in 20 mpg.)


2-4 games in the playoffs?


Your shitting me...

He was fucking huge in every win they had.

Sorry but as you will someday learn kiddo, players do alot of things that matter that don't show up in the stat sheet.

A rotation that forces a bad shot.

A screen under the basket that opens up an open three for Bowen in the corner.

Learn to watch the games, Oberto was a stud damn near all playoffs long.

[T Park]

I don't think you have a right to ever question anyone's spelling

I don't think Sequ has a right to question my fanhood yet nothings said about that.

[Kori Ellis]

I don't think Sequ has a right to question my fanhood yet nothings said about that.

You and Sequ have both quit on your team over and over. You are both good fans, who both talk out of your asses sometimes.

[LBJ dunks on Duncan]

Who's oberto?

[Kori Ellis]

Who's oberto?

Spurs fans pretending to be Cavs fans?

New low?

[SScarrJ]

Did i say trade him? Nope I said we should try and get an upgrade and move him to the bench. I mean we have depth at the wing with Manu, Finley, Bowen, Berry, and Udoka. Plus we have Elson who looks to have moved into the Malik and Nazr doghouse. So what would you rather do, Stand Pat or try and upgrade the team by moving two guys who are expendable?

I didn't realize shuffling the team around was so personal to you. Outside of Tim, Manu, Tony, and Bowen I really don't care if we move players as long as it makes us a better team. I bet you were one of those people who cried when Malik was traded to New York.

If wanting to make the Spurs a better basketball team makes me a hater then so be it. I'd rather be that then some blind fan who will follow an inconsistent player off a cliff because you want to remember some of the good games he'd had.

[colargol]

TP for center..... he's a league leader in points in the paint and he shoots free throws as a center .

:downspin: :rolleyes

[MaNu4Tres]

Oberto did flop. But it was also offensive. If not for running into Oberto, right before that for pushing with off arm on Bowen. But you aren't going to get that call that often.

Anyway, the Spurs game wasn't about a flop, or TP's missed free thows or Manu's miss at the end, it was about playing like crap for the majority of the game. If you keep getting down big, you have to expend all your energy crawling back. You could tell Tony/Manu were running out of gas at the end.

Anyway, Spurs Big 3 were pretty decent today. The rest of the team sucked though.

Write down all the excuses or complaints you want.

"We won't win with this old team."

"It's only one loss."

"Our bigs outside Tim suck."

"4 Rings!!"

blahblahblah

The Spurs aren't a very cohesive unit right now. Blame it on too many injuries not giving them enough time on the court together. Blame it on not enough trust in the role players, leading to too much one-on-one play from Manu and Tony. Blame it on Duncan not trying that hard on D.

I'm not that worried. Last year in January, I didn't like the Spurs team and I worried/complained a lot. I hated our bigs and I thought Barry should be dealt. Pop and the Spurs f'd me over and won a Championship. So apparently they know what they are doing. :lol

Pop will call them soft. The team will respond. They'll go on a 10 game winning streak. They'll drop a couple games to crap teams. And then we'll roll the dice and head into the playoffs and see what happens.




I'm not firing up the flares yet. I was only stating Oberto's lack of cahoones. There is a hole in our interior defense that I wish our management could help via trade,but realistically i know its probably not going to happen. When it's all said and done in May and godwillingly June its going to come down to the Horry's interior Defense, The play of the Big 3, Injuries, and we will need two of our other wings to be on from three. What saddens me is when its said and done we are going to rely on 37 year old Horry to play like he did in 07 defensively for us to be where we want to be.

[MaNu4Tres]

Did i say trade him? Nope I said we should try and get an upgrade and move him to the bench. I mean we have depth at the wing with Manu, Finley, Bowen, Berry, and Udoka. Plus we have Elson who looks to have moved into the Malik and Nazr doghouse. So what would you rather do, Stand Pat or try and upgrade the team by moving two guys who are expendable?

I didn't realize shuffling the team around was so personal to you. Outside of Tim, Manu, Tony, and Bowen I really don't care if we move players as long as it makes us a better team. I bet you were one of those people who cried when Malik was traded to New York.

If wanting to make the Spurs a better basketball team makes me a hater then so be it. I'd rather be that then some blind fan who will follow an inconsistent player off a cliff because you want to remember some of the good games he'd had.




lol WELL PUT SSCARRJ

[T Park]

I bet you were one of those people who cried when Malik was traded to New York.


Nope I applauded the trade 100%

but of course when one assumes....


If wanting to make the Spurs a better basketball team makes me a hater then so be it. I'd rather be that then some blind fan who will follow an inconsistent player off a cliff because you want to remember some of the good games he'd had.




No, Im just realistic.

You cannot and will not acquire a better center than Fabricio Oberto in today's league with what the Spurs have without screwing up the chemistry of this team.

period.

[MaNu4Tres]

No, Im just realistic.

You cannot and will not acquire a better center than Fabricio Oberto in today's league with what the Spurs have without screwing up the chemistry of this team.

period.



You could sign PJ Brown and move Oberto to the bench or perhaps trade him for a pack of skittles. I.E Scola deal

[Kori Ellis]

You cannot and will not acquire a better center than Fabricio Oberto in today's league with what the Spurs have without screwing up the chemistry of this team.

period.

Maybe "will not" is true. But "cannot" is crazy. It's possible to trade without f'ing up your team. Remember when everyone said Detroit destroyed their team chemistry by trading for Rasheed.

[T Park]

When it's all said and done in May and godwillingly June its going to come down to the Horry's interior Defense,

Yeah just like in the finals when Horry hardly played.

[T Park]

Maybe "will not" is true. But "cannot" is crazy. It's possible to trade without f'ing up your team. Remember when everyone said Detroit destroyed their team chemistry by trading for Rasheed.



Cannot.

There isn't one single center available that will become the new starter.

Oberto is a solid, smart, good player who fits the starting center.

There isn't a center out there thats gonna walk through that door that will supplant him.

Period.

[T Park]

You could sign PJ Brown and move Oberto to the bench or perhaps trade him for a pack of skittles. I.E Scola deal

Seeing as hes retired that would be tough.

Yes, trade a clutch, big game center in Oberto for nothing.

More genius!!!

[MaNu4Tres]

Spurs could have won against the cavs with Bonner at the 5. Cavs were the worst opponent Spurs faced the whole playoffs. Horry's interior defense during the duration of the previous three series was vital to the Spurs success last year.

[Kori Ellis]

Cannot.

There isn't one single center available that will become the new starter.

Oberto is a solid, smart, good player who fits the starting center.

There isn't a center out there thats gonna walk through that door that will supplant him.

Period.

Okay, Mr. Cocky Asshole Authority on basketball.

Get off the forum and come back and read your posts to see what a prick you are being.

Your obnoxious level is ridiculous. Stop talking down to people in everyone of your obnoxious posts.

Remember when you turned over a new leaf at your surgery and you were going to start treating people better? How long did that last? Two weeks?

You are an obnoxious windbag.

[T Park]

:lol

Wow, someone else does it and its ok.

The hypocrisy continues.

I gave an opinion.

Sorry that opinions aren't wanted anymore.

[MaNu4Tres]

Seeing as hes retired that would be tough.

Yes, trade a clutch, big game center in Oberto for nothing.

More genius!!!


I was making fun of the Scola deal, you oblivious spurs homer. I wouldn't trade Oberto for nothing obviously. And P.J Brown hasn't retired. Call me crazy but i still wish pop would give Elson some consistent minutes for a 10 game span. Elson gets lost time to time but hes not looking for flops defensively thats for sure.

[Kori Ellis]

:lol

Wow, someone else does it and its ok.

The hypocrisy continues.

I gave an opinion.

Sorry that opinions aren't wanted anymore.

"CANNOT"
"PERIOD"

No, you didn't offer an opinion. You talk down to everyone. And everyone is sick of it. Mainly me. You don't have any respect for anyone. You treat everyone like you know more than them. News flash. You don't.

[genomefreak13]

Who's oberto?

"Oberto....the prettiest ugliest player alive" - greg popovich

[Tek_XX]

"CANNOT"
"PERIOD"

No, you didn't offer an opinion. You talk down to everyone. And everyone is sick of it. Mainly me. You don't have any respect for anyone. You treat everyone like you know more than them. News flash. You don't.

Amen, i'm glad you said it.

[spurscenter]

1. Sam Cassell
2. Ben Wallace
3. Eddy Curry
4. Zach Randolph
5. Sun Ming Ming =>

[AFBlue]

What was the original question??? I'm sorry I got distracted by all the Oberto bashing and defending. The funny thing is, no one is even saying to trade Oberto.

I find it funny that lost in the fray is the crappy play of Francisco Elson, Matt Bonner, and Robert Horry.

Truth be told, NONE of the Spurs big men (outside of Duncan) inspire any confidence going forward.

Personally, I think Oberto is the most consistent and intelligent, but you can only really count on him to play 20-25 MPG because he gets in foul trouble. And I guess you can hope in a resurgent Robert Horry giving it his one last hurrah. Other than that, the Spurs are pretty much screwed.

So here's the question....

If the Spurs make a trade, will they try to add another big man that would hopefully bring a solid presence, or will the try to add another swingman and resort to going into the playoffs with the small-ball strategy?

Either way, I think it's apparent that something has to be done. Based on the amount of minutes Pop is employing the small-ball lineup, it is clear he's lost a great deal of confidence in his frontline role players.

Bottom Line: Oberto is not the issue...the entire frontcourt outside of Duncan is the issue.

So getting back to the original question I would say to trade one of the frontcourt players (preferably Elson) for cap space and try to pick up PJ Brown, or for another swingman (Rasual Butler?) and concede to go small-ball.

[diego]

though i dont like tpark very much, i'm going to defend him here-

its easy to bag on players for a single play- a missed free throw, a late rotation, a botched layup, an unecessary foul etc etc. But a game of basketball isnt one play, and a season is much more than that. there is a reason the playoffs are 7 game series.

on top of that, NBA bigs dont grow on trees and the salary cap makes it even more difficult to get them. the list of good defensive NBA bigs making less than the MLE has probably less than 5 entries. you cant expect the same production from a 3mill a year player than you do a 10 mill a year player. the less money, the more specialized their role, and oberto's role is indeed specialized. the only guy who we might be able to snag for oberto-level money is pj brown, but brown and oberto are practically the same player.

on top of that, learning the spurs system takes time and in all likelihood any acquisition would be a step back in the short term.

finally, as phat tony mentioned, all of our bigs are playing pretty crap, and I would include duncan in that group. the only way cheap bigs like horry, oberto, elson, bonner are going to look decent in this league is with duncan playing well, especially on the defensive end.

so, to summarize, oberto is a limited player, but he has his strengths, and shotblocking isnt one of them, so its a waste of time to expect that from him. replacing him is difficult and probably not a good idea at this point in the season. his play isnt going to make or break the season; there is a reason Duncan is the team's MVP.

[SAGambler]

Any fan or any coach knows shit about basketball would rather have their big man stand his ground and contest a shot rather than look for flopping taking charges. At least thats my opinion.

I hardly think Fabs was "looking to flop".

Tell you what. Give me 10 feet to build the speed, stand there with your hands in the air while I lower my head into your stomach at 40 mph, and when you go flying backwards on your ass, tell me you were "just flopping". It was such an obvious call. Yet the refs stood there mute.

I suppose Tony, when he went in, took it across the face so hard he couldn't get up off the floor, was "just floppin" too. And BTW, that one was obvious and wasn't called either.

[SAGambler]

For once an unbiased opinion.

I hate to let you in on a secret, but there IS NO SUCH THING AS AN UNBIASED OPINION.

[mountainballer]

Bottom Line: Oberto is not the issue...the entire frontcourt outside of Duncan is the issue.

So getting back to the original question I would say to trade one of the frontcourt players (preferably Elson) for cap space and try to pick up PJ Brown, or for another swingman (Rasual Butler?) and concede to go small-ball.

agree. Oberto isn't the problem. and he would be versatile enough to play any role in a changed frontcourt line-up, if a trade happened. (this would take Elson another 3 years)
considering that the only somehow attracting asset the Spurs can offer are expiring contracts, the best bet might be to look at teams with players on long term contracts, that might no longer be part of the future plans.

Joel Przybilla? 2006 the Spurs wanted him and offered the MLE. he resigned for the MLE with the Blazers. with Oden comming back 2008, the Blazers might be happy to get rid of his long term contract. next season they will still be lux tax payer, so trading Przybilla for expirings makes even more sense.
(can't tell if he would be the solution. but if asked if I think he would be more helpful than Elson, I would say yes.)

Jeff Foster? he saw one DNP-CD and a just 2 minutes game in the last 3 games of the Pacers. signs that they change the rotation and that he is available as a result? (Foster has another year on his contract at 5.5M per year and Indy also doesn't have significant contracts that expire 2008) I like the idea of bringing him home.

Nick Collison? don't really think that the Sonics are open to trade him right now, but who knows. it was the old management that signed him to his long term contract and the new management in Seattle might have different ideas. as RC should have Presti's number, it's worth a call.

none of the mentioned is a premium player and all are not exactly a bargain (but also not totally overpayed IMO), but they could fit. (in different ways). considering, that next season the Spurs will have a low cost center in Splitter (maybe another cheap frontcourt player in Mahinmi, if he is ready), a not very expensive player in Oberto, there should be room for a 5-6 million player.

btw. I like the idea of getting Butler. not as much as somehow getting James Jones, but Butler is also a nice option. (and a realistic scenario, maybe with the problem, that Hornets and Spurs are now rivals again and might easily meet in the PO)

[tav1]

I posted these on another thread a few days ago, but I still think they make sense:

Of the Knicks Balkman and Chandler are worth looking at simply because they are inexpensive and could potentially fill a need at the wing in future seasons. But I don't see many deals that would get that done. Elson and a #1 for those two is probably as high as the Spurs would go, and maybe that's too high, but I don't see the Knicks biting. That also leaves us thin and dependent on Bonner in the frontcourt. Brent Barry is a player the Knicks could use because of their shit poor spacing, but I don't think the Spurs want to lose him, especially since he is there de facto third point.

The Pistons have three players that we could probably get for Elson and/or a future draft pick: Walter Hermann, Flip Murray and Primoz Brezac. If the Spurs waited until Feb. 14, they could potentially get Murray and Hermann for Elson and a #2. That sounds plausible and might be worthwhile.

Toronto is no longer playing Juan Dixon. They could use a back-up center who is more fleet of foot, and so Dixon for Elson could happen. Again, that *may* help each team and works under the cap.

The Bobcats have injury problems all over the place and could really use a playoff berth: a combination of Dudley, Davidson and Harrington might get them Brent Barry. Dudley has potential, and Davidson and Harrington would shore up the front court for the playoffs.

Memphis: Elson/Barry for Hakim Warrick and Swift would saves Memphis a little money. I'd consider that trade.

Milwaukee: This is my personal fave: Elson and a #1 for Charlie Villanueva. This is doable because Milwaukee only benefits from playing and developing Yi. I'd do this in a heartbeat if I were the Spurs.

Minnesota: With Telfair, Foye and Brewer, Minnesota might want to shed McCants contract. Elson for McCants and Gomes works and is probably worth doing. The Spurs might have to give up a 2nd round draft pick as well.

New Jersey: Nachbar and Marcus Williams might be available, but I don't see a scenario wherein we could get either.

Orlando: Barry and a second round pick might land Arroyo and Foyle. It's lopsided, but Arroyo is not seeing much playing time and Barry would help the Magic more in playoffs. I'd do it.

Portland: If the Blazers want to save money, then Channing Frye for Elson might be worth it. I think Frye wouldn't do much worse than Elson and could potentially be a nice upgrade.

In addition to these, I'd say Phat Tony's Rasual Butler suggestion and Mountainballers Joel Pryzbilla suggestion are the sort of scenarios that are possible and could be beneficial. Pryzbilla's long contract with Splitter and Mahinmi in waiting and Oberto tied up, may not be too wise, though.

[Kori Ellis]

though i dont like tpark very much, i'm going to defend him here-


Are you defending him for treating every single poster like shit in every thread that was posted yesterday? :lol

[1Parker1]

I must say, one trade I really wished they made last year and the year before was Barry. But after watching the Spurs struggle with their offense the past month and their lack of ball movement, I realize that Brent Barry is the next most valuable player on the Spurs after Parker, Duncan, Bowen, and Manu. Brent Barry is more often than not money from 3 point land and he's a good ball handler/distributer, 2 things the Spurs have been lacking especially since he's been out.

[diego]

Are you defending him for treating every single poster like shit in every thread that was posted yesterday? :lol

no, that's exactly what i dont like about him, what i was defending was his stance, that shitting on oberto for not being a shot blocker, and without providing realistic alternatives, is pointless and unfair. would i like to pair dwight howard and duncan? or sheed and duncan? or camby and duncan? sure. but that is impossible and people who shit on our players for specific plays like Manu4Tres did are no better than tpark's infamous "I'll never cheer this team again" routine. a bunch of fairweather bullshit

[MaNu4Tres]

I hardly think Fabs was "looking to flop".

Tell you what. Give me 10 feet to build the speed, stand there with your hands in the air while I lower my head into your stomach at 40 mph, and when you go flying backwards on your ass, tell me you were "just flopping". It was such an obvious call. Yet the refs stood there mute.

I suppose Tony, when he went in, took it across the face so hard he couldn't get up off the floor, was "just floppin" too. And BTW, that one was obvious and wasn't called either.


lol 40 m.p.h in 10 feet i'd like to see that.

[AFBlue]

agree. Oberto isn't the problem. and he would be versatile enough to play any role in a changed frontcourt line-up, if a trade happened. (this would take Elson another 3 years)
considering that the only somehow attracting asset the Spurs can offer are expiring contracts, the best bet might be to look at teams with players on long term contracts, that might no longer be part of the future plans.

Joel Przybilla?...

Jeff Foster?....

Nick Collison?....

none of the mentioned is a premium player and all are not exactly a bargain (but also not totally overpayed IMO), but they could fit. (in different ways). considering, that next season the Spurs will have a low cost center in Splitter (maybe another cheap frontcourt player in Mahinmi, if he is ready), a not very expensive player in Oberto, there should be room for a 5-6 million player.

btw. I like the idea of getting Butler. not as much as somehow getting James Jones, but Butler is also a nice option. (and a realistic scenario, maybe with the problem, that Hornets and Spurs are now rivals again and might easily meet in the PO)

I think Pryzbilla is a solid big that is underrated and I don't really question the amount of his contract, but more the length of it....

The Spurs pitched Tim Duncan the idea of leaving some money on the table for 2010 because they have a plan to go out and grab one or two significant players for the future of this team. I don't think they would sacrafice that for Pryzbilla or any other "role player" for that matter.

I also like Foster because of his defense and rebounding, but trading for him might prove difficult because only Brent Barry is a similar salary match....and the more I see Barry knocking down threes and keeping the ball moving on offense, I think the less likely it is that the Spurs trade him. Not to mention the fact that he's the de facto third PG right now.

Collison is another guy signed beyond 2010, but I also question whether he'd be able to play good defense. On a positive note, he has far more offensive game than either of the other two mentioned.

At this point, I think it's really tough to make a move and I don't see many frontcourt options. The Spurs may just have to grin and bear it with their current roster and try to slim down the rotation with the players they've got...which may not include much time, if any, for a couple of the frontcourt guys.

Oh, and on Butler....

I think he's a solid defender that is good at shooting spot-up three pointers. The negative with him is that his contract, if traded for Elson, would likely put the Spurs over the lux tax threshold...and there's that good point you brought up about in-division rivals.

Bottom Line: It'll be tough to get any help this time around...even if the Spurs want to deal.

FWIW, Jackie Butler is still out there.... :fro

[ArgSpursFan.]

I told you all,we should've kept Scola.
We could've have a big guy putting up 8/6 from the bench.
That was the trade that should've not been made.
Now it's too late to be trading shit,we have to deal with what we have.
BTW,Elson sucks mayor ass!!!!

[Bruno]

I don't think Spurs will or should do a trade.
Spurs' team is a great deep team and with few weaknesses. The only way I see a trade is if there is a great opportunity.

If I were Spurs GM, I would do nothing before the deadline. Barring a miracle, I won't do a trade.
At the end of February, I will sign Linton Johnson for the reminder of the season and see if he can help Spurs as small ball PF.
Just before the playoff, I will sign Keith Langford.
Saying that I'm not Spurs GM so what I say is quite useless.

[ploto]

Toronto is no longer playing Juan Dixon. They could use a back-up center who is more fleet of foot, and so Dixon for Elson could happen. Again, that *may* help each team and works under the cap.

With TJ Ford out, Juan Dixon is the back up point guard most nights. Secondly, Raps would rather play Kris Humphries than Elson.

[ploto]

The Spurs aren't a very cohesive unit right now.
It is just odd to me because of all the years these guys have been playing together. I have never seen that many passes to "no one" in one Spurs game!

[ChumpDumper]

Haven't really seen an impact trade proposed, but I'll keep looking.
I told you all,we should've kept Scola.
We could've have a big guy putting up 8/6 from the bench.He wouldn't be doing that here, and that isn't a trade suggestion.

[BacktoBasics]

I'm not reading all 5 pages but I woke up this morning thinking a guy like Martell Webster might be had for a couple of vets with expiring deals and a draft pick or two.

[AFBlue]

I'm not reading all 5 pages but I woke up this morning thinking a guy like Martell Webster might be had for a couple of vets with expiring deals and a draft pick or two.

You might be right about the Blazers moving Webster because they already have a ton of prospects that are set to come across the pond in the next year or two (Koponen, Fernandez, Freeland, etc.).

The issue is what the Spurs have to trade for him...

Webster has really had an excellent season and shot the ball well. More than likely the Blazers will try to capitalize on that by moving him along with one of their bad contracts and get an expiring contract in return. And their "bad" contracts are guys like Raef LaFrentz ($12M) and Darius Miles ($8M).

The only deal the Spurs could make would be Elson + Barry...and that's alot to give up for Martell Webster and Darius Miles...who has one good leg, attitude problems, and a contract that escalates over the next two seasons beyond this one.

I like where your head is, but that's a tough one to pull off.

[Ocotillo]

How about Sequ for a Maverick poster to be named later?

[AFBlue]

One that I just can't get out of my head....

Spurs trade Elson for Mikael Pietrus.

Reasons For:

- Both have expiring contracts, so neither team is under any obligation to retain either player if they don't perform well, but both would have sufficient time to "try out" for their respective new teams to see if they warrant an off-season offer.

- Pietrus is athletic, strong, plays decent defense, and can be a good shooter. He can play both 2 and 3, and might be another guard in the mix for that small-ball 4 position that Pop loves so much...hell, could he be worse than Bones Barry?

Reasons Against:

- Pietrus has a low BBIQ and might find it difficult to adjust to the system in enough time to make a difference in the playoffs.


Bottom Line: It has the makings of a deal with both parties wanting to possibly shake things up and reasonable contracts that expire.

I'd still put the odds against it, but you never know...

[SpurOutofTownFan]

What's the purpose of trading now? when the new person comes over he will have to learn the system etc and will probalby be left out of the team for playoffs.. heck... Udoka is still learning. Trading at this point is a double-edged sword.

[AFBlue]

What's the purpose of trading now? when the new person comes over he will have to learn the system etc and will probalby be left out of the team for playoffs.. heck... Udoka is still learning. Trading at this point is a double-edged sword.

Not exactly true....

Nazr came in a mid-season trade and was able to make an immediate impact during the Spurs' championship run in '05.

[SpurOutofTownFan]

Not exactly true....

Nazr came in a mid-season trade and was able to make an immediate impact during the Spurs' championship run in '05.

Yeah you're right I remember but he was the only option pretty much we had so he had to learn it really quick - I would like to think about that as an exception unless we bring a class A guy which is probably not possible. I don't know - I honestly don't think they will make any trades unless something goes terribly wrong from now to trade time.

[tav1]

With TJ Ford out, Juan Dixon is the back up point guard most nights. Secondly, Raps would rather play Kris Humphries than Elson.

Darrick Martin has assumed Ford's minutes, not Dixon. On the 14th, despite two overtimes, Dixon didn't play.

[tav1]

Strictly for cap purposes, the Blazers might entertain Fyre and Webster for Barry. That hurts the Spurs this summer, though.

[ChumpDumper]

FWIW, Jackie Butler is still out there.... :fro
Screw that. If we're going to get some fat bastard, let's get one that's playing ball now.


http://basketboricua.com/2008_images/galerias/Liga%20Americas/CMO19648.jpg

:domokun

[Hemotivo]

He's playing in the LIGA DE LAS AMERICAS

for Cangrejeros de Santurce (Puerto Rico)
fun player to watch

[Bruno]

[CENTER]Screw that. If we're going to get some fat bastard, let's get one that's playing ball now.


No love for this guy ?

http://www.nba.com/media/dleague/vipers_flash_080109_7.jpg

[ChumpDumper]

I really like that fat bastard. He's forty pounds away from the NBA.

[SenorSpur]

One that I just can't get out of my head....

Spurs trade Elson for Mikael Pietrus.

Reasons For:

- Both have expiring contracts, so neither team is under any obligation to retain either player if they don't perform well, but both would have sufficient time to "try out" for their respective new teams to see if they warrant an off-season offer.

- Pietrus is athletic, strong, plays decent defense, and can be a good shooter. He can play both 2 and 3, and might be another guard in the mix for that small-ball 4 position that Pop loves so much...hell, could he be worse than Bones Barry?

Reasons Against:

- Pietrus has a low BBIQ and might find it difficult to adjust to the system in enough time to make a difference in the playoffs.


Bottom Line: It has the makings of a deal with both parties wanting to possibly shake things up and reasonable contracts that expire.

I'd still put the odds against it, but you never know...

I like it, but why not swap him for Barry instead?

[BonnerDynasty]

I still believe we should just give D Rob some b12, lidocaine, hgh, guerialla horomones and let him come back for one more run.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

I still believe we should just give D Rob some b12, lidocaine, hgh, guerialla horomones and let him come back for one more run.
Just tell him what you want him to do okay?
Just tell him what you want him to do, he'll do it okay?
He'll do it.
Just tell him what you want him to do.

[We born to be bad]

All I ask is for a Big man that plays like he has a pair defensively. Guards laugh when they see any of our bigs except duncan in the paint. Most specifically Oberto and Bonner.

wow! Spurs trade Oberto? YES!!!!!!!!! for Skinner and Sean Marks. PLEASE. please bring us Oberto.

Oberto PPG 5,1 RPG 5,6 MPG 20

Skinner PPG 3,7 RPG 4,2 MPG 15

another underrated center :lol with expensive contract, with triple Oberto's contract ?

Nesterovic PPG 4,4 RPG 4,1 MPG 17

Wallace PPG 4,6 RPG 8,7 MPG 32

Dampier PPG 5,5 RPG 6,7 MPG 22

Prizzilia PPG 4,9 RPG 7,3 MPG 22

Milicic PPG 6,5 RPG 5,6 MPG 24

K Brown PPG 5,3 RPG 5,1 MPG 21

Diop PPG 3,2 RPG 5,2 MPG 18



OBERTO IN SUNS JERSEY! NOW!

01-31-08 Spurs :loser.

[AFBlue]

I like it, but why not swap him for Barry instead?

Spurs need Barry's 3-pt shooting and ball-handling skills alot more than they need Elson's speed.

[ArgSpursFan.]

Haven't really seen an impact trade proposed, but I'll keep looking.
It wasn't a trade proposal,coze a trade wont do any good to the spurs at this point in the season.The fuck up was made in the offseason.


He wouldn't be doing that here, and that isn't a trade suggestion.
Why not,does it have to do with the SA food or something?
You better come up with a stronger argument chump,not this weak ass kind of things.

[SenorSpur]

Spurs need Barry's 3-pt shooting and ball-handling skills alot more than they need Elson's speed.

Good point. But they also need Elson's size, athleticism and quickness for the quicker playoff teams (PHX, FAKERS, DEN)

[AFBlue]

Good point. But they also need Elson's size, athleticism and quickness for the quicker playoff teams (PHX, FAKERS, DEN)

Thought about this...but given how much Pop has tended to distrust his bigs, I think he'd rather go small-ball than stay big (relatively) with Elson.

My guess is that the faster teams get a heavy dose of Finley and Bowen as the small-ball 4.

[ArgSpursFan.]

Pop plays 4 perimetrals +Duncan or Oberto when He goes smallball.
Elson has no chances whensoever of being part of a smallball lineup.

[AFBlue]

Pop plays 4 perimetrals +Duncan or Oberto when He goes smallball.
Elson has no chances whensoever of being part of a smallball lineup.

To SenorSpur's credit, I think he was talking about playing a traditional lineup (Duncan at 4) with Elson as the Center....not having Elson as the small-ball Center.

But to me, I see there being better options than Elson come playoff time. For all his missed time and rough start, I still foresee Horry rounding into shape come playoff time and hitting a stride.

If that happens, I would put Horry out there alongside Duncan or Oberto before I'd let Elson sniff the court.

I also think Bonner, for all his defensive missteps, brings a great deal of energy to the floor and can knock down shots when he plays a controlled game.

Again, whether it's Horry, Bonner, or any of the small-ball options (forgot to include Udoka in my last post)....Elson just doesn't seem to have an edge.