A lot of Kobe rumors untrue. (link)

[2Cleva]

Sources: Anal intercourse rumor untrue




Randy Wyrick

Another rumor bit the dust Wednesday when sources said stories about anal intercourse between Kobe Bryant and his alleged victim are not true.

A rumor has rocketed across the country that the incident between Bryant and the 19-year-old woman Eagle woman he allegedly sexually assaulted stopped being consensual when Bryant demanded and may have tried to force anal intercourse.

Not true, sources close to the investigation told the Daily.

While sources stopped short of saying the word "anal" would not come up at the trial, they did say the story about acts of anal intercourse or demands for it were not accurate.

Sources said that when the case finally hits trial, it will center on the physical evidence, which sources call "abundant," and the assertion that the alleged victim wanted to leave the room but Bryant did not allow her to leave.

Bryant's arrest warrant included a misdemeanor count of false imprisonment. In Colorado, that means simply that someone wanted to leave an area or situation, but was physically kept from doing so.

The story is one of dozens shooting back and fourth across the country, aided by the Internet, as rumors swirl about this summer's highest profile story.

Among other rumors and reports that Daily sources declare are not true:

- The woman whom Bryant allegedly assaulted received a ride home. Not true. Reports that her clothing was torn are also untrue, sources said. Sources said that the alleged victim managed to get herself home by 11:50 p.m. June 30, after ending the shift at the Lodge at Cordillera at around 11:10 p.m. They also said that although her clothing was disheveled and showed signs that something has occurred, it wasn't torn or ripped, as some reports indicated.

- The woman made previous charges of sexual harassment against another hotel worker at the Lodge at Cordillera. Not true. Another female employee did so, which led to the termination of a Cordillera employee.

- The woman was in Kobe Bryant's room for up to two hours. Not true. She was there for about 20 minutes.

- The woman was hysterical when she returned to the hotel lobby from Bryant's room. Not true. She was in a state of shock and stupor, sources said.

- There was a large disturbance during the time of the incident. Not true.

- Eagle County Sheriff Joe Hoy is personal friends with the woman's family. Not true.

- An attorney in the District Attorney's Office is related to someone in the Eagle County attorney's office. Not true. They share the same last name as the alleged victim, but are not related and had never met.

- Physical evidence alone is enough to convict Kobe Bryant. Not true. Sources have said there is an abundance of physical evidence, although Hurlbert has steadfastly refused to comment on anything regarding the case. Hurlbert did say, though, that no part of the evidence was any more important than any other, and that it was the sum of the evidence being greater than its individual parts that convinced him to charge Bryant with one count of felony sexual assault.

- Bryant can pay off the alleged victim to get out of this. Not true. It is now a matter for the courts and beyond the control of the alleged victim, even if she wanted to call it all off.


Rumors untrue (http://www.vaildaily.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20030806/NEWS/308060103)

[adidas11]

Thank you for the clarification 2Cleva. :cooldevil

[2Cleva]

addidas - no problem but not many want to hear that.

Kobe being a monster makes for better headlines and it represents whats wrong with Black people. They feel they can get all moral and high and mighty with that.

Funny, these same people say they are colorblind but also say black people have issues instead of people of certain backgrounds (economic and social being more important than racial) are where the issues at.

And Kobe's problem isn't economics, social, or racial. He just messed around with a girl who has serious issues.

[kohai]

addidas - no problem but not many want to hear that.

Kobe being a monster makes for better headlines

Just to add some balance...because certains rumors turn out to be NOT true has very little bearing on the actual case. He may yet BE a monster, or not. The justice system will determine his innocence or guilt, based on the evidence and witnesses, not what's on the front page of the Enquirer.

[ducks]

who says that that artcile is true?

just because it is from the daily does not make it true

[2Cleva]

Ducks - touche'. Again, its all outside sources but I do give more credibility to the Vail reports from people there than coverage from Fox and ESPN, who are just trying to get viewers.

Everytime the Vail paper has refuted something, everyone else has stopped running with it. It seems they are easiliy the most reliable source but like you said, no one on the outside really knows for sure.

[ducks]

Meanwhile, The Star magazine reported that Bryant gave his wife more than the $4 million diamond ring in the wake of "indiscretion."

Also on the shopping list: a $65,000 Mercedes, a $76,000 Mercedes, $125,000 earrings, an $1,800 handbag, $315 shoes and $20,000 in Versace clothes. In addition, The Star reported that Bryant paid off the $230,000 mortgage on the home of Sofia Laine, Vanessa's mother.
scoop (http://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/nationworld/orl-sptfun07080703aug07,0,660149.story?coll=orl-sports-headlines)

[Tawnia79]

The Star magazine

that's all you need to know about the credibility of those reports...

BTW, Vanessa's parents live very near to a friend of mine, and from what I understand they have for most of Vanessa's life... they didn't have $230,000 left on their mortgage

[picnroll]

2Cleva don't you get tired carrying that enormous black chip on your shoulder all the time? A white guy, Clinton, got a consensual blowjob and the media attention it created caused Kobe's ordeal to look like a walk in the park. Unless you're buying into Clinton's claim that he was the first black president. It's the person and the thing, not the race. Get over it.

[WriterNum934]

Sources said that when the case finally hits trial, it will center on the physical evidence, which sources call "abundant,"

2Clev, If you're loving this "source" so much... you should be worried about that little nugget right there.

[ducks]

they didn't have $230,000 left on their mortgage

Ok did your friend ask them what they owe on their house?

is their house not even worth 230K?

or is that just specualtion on your part trying to defend kobe.

If I made as much as kobe my wife's parents house would be paid for. I thinka person who could afford to do that should do that for his our her folks.

[2Cleva]

Writer - Definitely concerned. But if its not torn clothes, bruises, anal, or anything. It looks like its mostly vaginal tearing (easily a result from consensual sex), dna, and testimony. Without seeing the evidence, if thats all they have Kobe will get off.

The evidence has to be proof of real violence, not just sex. The DA has admitted to there being no "smoking gun" and that all of the evidence, including testimony, resulted in charges being filed.

He said/she said. And it will be alot harder to discredit Kobe, especially considering the character witnesses and there is no one stepping up from his past negatively compared to the girl who has had documented suicide attempts (not rumor, her own college police have reported) along with friends who even trying to help her, will be toasted under cross-examination.

[ducks]

Sources said that when the case finally hits trial, it will center on the physical evidence, which sources call "abundant," and the assertion that the alleged victim wanted to leave the room but Bryant did not allow her to leave.

if you believe that arctile you have to believe that to. it is from the same sources

[ducks]

vaginal tearing easy to do without people agreeing to have sex?

really? I wonder if there is any stats to prove that is a common thing.

[2Cleva]

Ducks - Yeah, word is Kobe blocked the door but eventually let her out because she told him she would be back in 15 minutes.

It doesn't say when she wanted to leave the room. If what I heard is correct it was after sex and I guess Kobe wanted more. If it was prior, then yeah, thats a problem.

BTW - the consensual activity prior to them having intercourse wasn't just touching and kissing. Oral relations were supposedly involved. If she willing gave him oral sex, she can forget it.


But its all speculation for now until we see the trial starts and both sides of the story are heard.

[Milton]

Too bad for you Laker fans that rumor about Kobe being on trial for RAPE was found to be........

TRUE.

Go somewhere else if you can't handle that.

[ducks]

I do not want them to go away. it is good to debate.

[ducks]

Meanwhile, The Star magazine reported that Bryant gave his wife more than the $4 million diamond ring in the wake of "indiscretion."

Also on the shopping list: a $65,000 Mercedes, a $76,000 Mercedes, $125,000 earrings, an $1,800 handbag, $315 shoes and $20,000 in Versace clothes. In addition, The Star reported that Bryant paid off the $230,000 mortgage on the home of Sofia Laine, Vanessa's mother.



if that came from the vial paper would you laker fans believe it?

[timvp]

Is there a sicker sight than Laker homers defending a potential rapist and celebrating because he didn't rape her backdoor?

Imagine how foolish these people will look if he did rape her.

:vomit

[2Cleva]

ducks - personally, I do believe he bought more than the ring. Probably a lot of that stuff was things he promised his wife before but is sure to come through now that he's in trouble.

But thats between his wife and him. None of my concern.

As a Laker fan, I want to see him on the court and out of it. As a person, I want justice served. If he did it, he deserves to do time. But I am extremely skeptical of the charges and so are a whole lot of people who aren't Laker fans at all.

In fact, in few surveys do you find that more people believe he's guilty than innocent. And the very few that have had more people thinking he was guilty was right after some false info had leaked/made up by the press.

[2Cleva]

Timvp - maybe the sight of people already sentencing a man who is still innocent according to the consitution?

[timvp]

That was pretty cleva:rolleyes

You admitted, as a Laker fan, you'd want him to get off even if he's guilty.

If you don't see how disgusting that is ... :vomit

[Sigmund Freud]

Whether or not Kobe is a fan of the Princeton offense is a moot point. If she has marks and was distraught after the fact, then he's probably going to be found guilty.

[ducks]

I think alot of fans think he is innocent because of his clean image. if this was ai. I think alot would have said he did it. internet polls are not very worth a crap in my book. no matter what survey you have. some let you vote 25 times. some let you vote once but if you dump your cach you can vote again.

to me it does not matter if 100 think he is innocent to one that he is gulity.Noone except for kobe and the girl knows 100% that he raped her. I think the da thinks 90% or more that he is gulity. I think them wating 3 weeks that want to make sure they can get a conviction or atleast do not look stupid. if they look stupid all those people could get FIRED.



I am not saying it is wrong to buy your wife a present to ask for forgiveness. people do it all the time. it is only like $20 to him because of how much he makes. But he must feel gulity or is trying to keep them together tell this is over ateast.

if he deserves to do TIME IN JAIL.

[ducks]

PORTLAND, Ore. -- The Portland Trail Blazers announced plans for a player code of conduct and lower ticket prices in a full-page ad appearing in the sports section of Thursday's Oregonian.

scoop (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/story?id=1591916)

maybe lakers should do that to. they have 2 starters in legal trouble

[Tawnia79]

they didn't have $230,000 left on their mortgage

Ok did your friend ask them what they owe on their house?

is their house not even worth 230K?

or is that just specualtion on your part trying to defend kobe.

If I made as much as kobe my wife's parents house would be paid for. I thinka person who could afford to do that should do that for his our her folks.

It's purely speculation on my part... but I've seen their house, and I know how much the houses in their area cost... they're around Five hundred thousand. It's possible that he did pay the mortgage, but if they've lived there as long as I'm told they have, I just doubt that they had THAT MUCH left on their mortgage, that's all...


Is there a sicker sight than Laker homers defending a potential rapist

Tim, I like you, and you've always been pretty even keeled, but this is a bit much... we're Laker homers because we defend one of our own before he's been convicted?? Can I ask what YOU would do? Certainly not attack fellow Spurs fans who defended their favorite player until the end. I just don't get how you expect us to react... Should we be booing and hissing him like everyone else is dying to do, or should we presume his innocence like the law says we should until it has been proven beyond a reasonable doubt that he is guilty?

Someone else said this and I completely appreciate it... Something to the effect of, "I THINK Kobe did it, but it has not been proven beyond a reasonable doubt to me that he did, I just think that he did." That I can understand. Why can't you understand that some Lakers fans may believe the opposite and that it's OK to think that way?

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

2cleva,


If she willing gave him oral sex, she can forget it.


You couldn't be more wrong (but as a Laker homer, not exactly a shocker).

If she said no or stop at any point, regardless what had happened up until said point, he still raped her.

Deal with it.

AHF

[From Way Downtown]

And Kobe's problem isn't economics, social, or racial. He just messed around with a girl who has serious issues.

That, or he raped a girl and those who wish to protect him will go to any length to discredit the victim. Regardless, it seems to me that the quote evidences a Kobe-centric myopia that seriously understates the nature of the charges against Kobe, particularly because it relies on irrelevant information to assume that this was nothing other than "messing around."

I can assure you that the information about her "serious issues" is not going to get into the evidence at trial, because, by Colorado rule, it's not relevant to the charges against Kobe. Colorado Rule of Evidence 404 prohibits the introduction of "character evidence" to prove conformity with that character. Thus, if a defendant is on trial for DUI, the State cannot introduce evidence that the defendant got drunk every night. The same holds true for reports that this woman attempted suicide, tried to get onto American Idol, or anything of that nature. And don't get too excited if much comes out about this girl's sexual history -- Rule 412 makes that evidence almost impossible to introduce.

At this point, the information that is being reported serves only to feed the American appetite for salacious information. Kobe's attorneys/handlers/supporters are interested in getting that information into the public sphere, but only to plant seeds of doubt in the minds of those Eagle County residents who are in the pool of potential jurors. But the voir dire process will weed out most, if not all, of those who might be influenced in either direction by this information, so ultimately, it will play little or no role in how the case is decided.

It is interesting to me, however, that while the media is so busy digging up dirt on this girl, there seems to be very little effort aimed at unearthing whatever skeletons might be in Kobe's closet. So much for objectivity, I guess. . . .

[bigzak25]

if she said no is not on trial.

she says she said no.
he says she said yes.

what they said doesn't matter anymore.
it's what can be proved.

until the evidence comes out, nobody knows.

and even after the evidence comes out,
after the trial is over...
people will still come down on opposite sides of the fence.

[ducks]

they might have refianced it not to long ago. thanks for clearing that up


I will be honest here. if this was dave robinson I would be shocked. I would be looking at the evidence and reports and go from there. Only because he has a cleaner track record then kobe. and I might even defend him. depends on the reports. But I would say if he did it he should go to jail. I would have a hard time with him. any other spur player I would be doing the same thing I am with kobe. Kobe was one of my if not my favorite none spur player. I liked the gy. he was not as cocky but I think a little cocky is good. this has nothing to do with him being a laker. I wanted kobe on the spurs

mayeb people are tied of saying innocent until proven gulity because they believe the court system is corrupt and that stars will get off.

he in gulity or innocent already. no judge or jury has that right. he might get off but if he did rape her he is guilty. I hope he did not.

[adidas11]

Quote: "You admitted, as a Laker fan, you'd want him to get off even if he's guilty."

He never said that TIMVP. He said he wanted him to to be set free, IF HE WASN'T GUILTY.

And don't put words in Laker fans mouths. I, for one, have changed my tune since this case first came out, and I personally think that Kobe might have done it. Only because I can't fathom/imagine a girl risking public humiliation or otherwise by coming forward. Rarely in a case like this (high profile or low profile) is there really any benefit to the woman in this situation. And there is only negativity to be gained. That is why so many women don't come forward in rape situations. The fact that this girl DID speaks volumes to me. THAT is why I'm leaning toward the side of Kobe being guilty.

Honestly TimVP, you've been bringing some of the worst posts that I've ever seen, with relation to this topic.

[Tawnia79]

Only because he has a cleaner track record then kobe.

Kobe has no track record at all... he's never been in trouble, but he's had less time than Robinson has to stay OUT of trouble, so I understand your point.

As for the rest of your post, I completely understand and agree with it.

[KoriEllis]

And it will be alot harder to discredit Kobe, especially considering the character witnesses and there is no one stepping up from his past negatively compared to the girl who has had documented suicide attempts (not rumor, her own college police have reported) along with friends who even trying to help her, will be toasted under cross-examination.

Cleva, if I understand correctly, none of her past (suicide attempts, etc) can even be mentioned in court in Colorado.

Tawnia, if there house was bought for $500,000 15-years ago, they'd have more than $250,000 left to pay on their 30-year mortgage -- the typical mortgage in California. The beginning of a mortgage, the majority of your payments go to interest. So half way through, you have more than half the principle left to pay. (Though I don't believe The Star).

[From Way Downtown]

Cleva, if I understand correctly, none of her past (suicide attempts, etc) can even be mentioned in court in Colorado.

With a handful of very limited exceptions, that's precisely the case -- the ability to bring in that type of character evidence in cases involving sexual crimes is even more limited, because the law specifically protects the victims of sex crimes. Like I say, all of that information is legally irrelevant and won't have any bearing at trial, other than whatever pre-trial effect it might have on the potential jurors.

[Temple Of The Dog]

Cleva, if I understand correctly, none of her past (suicide attempts, etc) can even be mentioned in court in Colorado.

probably not at the trial itself, but at the pre-trial hearing those kinds of things are usually allowed to come out. (directly or indirectly)

the prosecution can overwhelm all of that if they have pictures of her with bruises, or actual testimony from other guests that heard something, etc.

kobe's past will also come up... like when he met his current wife and how old she was at the time. who else kobe has dated or been with... especially if the defense brings up anything about her.

[2Cleva]

tim - believe whatever you like while making up words if it helps you sleep through the night.


Kori - Some of her past can be used if its to prove/disprove the credibility of her claims. They can't bring up previous sexual history but if they can show a pattern of either calling out for attention falsely, or an unstable person who may have decided she said no after the fact, then it could be admissable.

The key is finding revelance. Kobe has two of the best attorneys in the county, who happen to also live in Eagle County. I'm sure they will find a way to get part of the history of the girl admitted.

For example, its been confirmed she did talk about his anatomy after the party. Witnesses for and against her agreed there. Question was context but that will probably be in court.

Also, any witness that the prosecution brings forth is going to have a close relationship with the girl. They will be grilled on the cross examination, especially when they have said things like she's not suicidal even though she's tried to kill her self twice.


Temple - Thats one ace Kobe does have - no history of doing anything like that. No teammate or media person can come foward saying they saw Kobe do anything. That helps his defense a lot.


bigzak/ducks - I agree completely.

Aggie - maybe he still raped her. But a jury would be alot less sympathetic if they knew she had consent to things such as that.

[Milton]

Temple - Thats one ace Kobe does have - no history of doing anything like that. No teammate or media person can come foward saying they saw Kobe do anything. That helps his defense a lot.


That's a rather weak hand. He's already admittted that she was in his room and that was after he initially lied about it to the authorities. He also lied about having sex with her. Now we have reports that she left his room distraught and with visible bruises and that a physical exam revealed further physical damage to her body.

As for what she said at a party...to paraphrase James Carville it's not hard taking a wad of cash through a sleepy mountain town and getting someone to tell you what you want them to say.

[2Cleva]

Milton - Weak hand? Credibility is everything in this case. If the prosecution could string a line of people saying Kobe did wrong he'd be screwed. But if the defense can bring a long line of people who can vouch for his good character, that is help.

Despite what many may think, infedility isn't looked at as a crime by many, if any. And if his wife is there supporting him, it helps immensely.



But I should leave it alone. As many times as Kobe has raped the Spurs on the court, I see a lot of fans already KNOW he's guilty so a argument over legality means nothing.

[Milton]

How is he credible when he's been lying so freely?


But I should leave it alone. As many times as Kobe has raped the Spurs on the court, I see a lot of fans already KNOW he's guilty so a argument over legality means nothing.

I now know that you are a sad individual with a whack set of priorities. But it isn't surprising that you are so flip when it comes to rape. What matters most is your hero. Sickening.

[Temple Of The Dog]

wasn't kobe's wife underage when they met? (statutory rape) if thats the case, that would be allowed, or at least it would come up.

as far as kobe raping the spurs on the court... lets just hope he doesn't cry like he did when we kicked them out of the playoffs... cause that kind of thing won't play well in prison. it'll get him alot of dates... but... or should i say butt... not much else.

[From Way Downtown]

2Cleva,

You must be operating under a unique set of evidentiary rules if you're so certain that much of this stuff will ever get into evidence.

For example, there are no rules of evidence that will allow the defense to get into suicide attempts unless the State opens the door to such evidence -- something I seriously doubt any prosecutor would ever do.

Reports of her being suicidal have little or no legal bearing on assessing the credibility of these allegations. Even if she attempted suicide once a month, it would have no probative value to assessing whether she was telling the truth about what she claims Kobe did. And whatever miniscule probative value it might have is heavily outweighed by the prejudicial value that same evidence might have.

Simply put, unless Hurlburt is a moron, that evidence will not get in.

As for character witnesses, it's usually pretty hard to bring in a witness who will testify solely to the good or bad character of a particular person. Generally speaking, you can call a character witness to impeach someone whose truthfulness has been directly called into question. But you can only solicit opinions about that person is generally truthful or not. It's damned near impossible to bring in a witness who will only testify that "Kobe is a great guy," or that "Kobe never gets into trouble," or that "Kobe spends all of his free time at church, and gives all of his extra money to dying children," or anything like that. The State would have to open the door to that type of evidence by attacking Kobe's character directly, but that doesn't seem likely to me. If I read Hurlburt correctly, he's going to rely on the physical evidence and the testimonial evidence of the victim (in her statements to police) and those who saw her immediately after the incident. They'll try to raise questions about Kobe's credibility during cross-examination, but I'm sure that they'll stay a long, long distance away from flat-out suggesting that Kobe is lying.

[bigzak25]

http://i.cnn.net/si/basketball/news/2003/08/05/media_tease/t1_kobe2_ap.jpg


Hey baby, I know a great hotel around the corner...:eyebrow

[LittleGeneral]

adidas11 said:


Quote: "You admitted, as a Laker fan, you'd want him to get off even if he's guilty."

He never said that TIMVP.

Actually, he (2Cleva) said something rather close to that: "As a Laker fan, I want to see him on the court and out of it. As a person, I want justice served." Since he made the distinction between himself as a Laker fan (where he simply wants to see Kobe exonerating and back in a Laker jersey) and as a person (where he wants to see Kobe jailed if he did indeed commit the crime), I think it's rather easy to see where timvp got that from. 2Cleva clearly implied that as a Laker fan, he simply wants Kobe to be cleared of the charge.

[Tawnia79]

Tawnia, if there house was bought for $500,000 15-years ago, they'd have more than $250,000 left to pay on their 30-year mortgage -- the typical mortgage in California. The beginning of a mortgage, the majority of your payments go to interest. So half way through, you have more than half the principle left to pay. (Though I don't believe The Star).

Kori, I know that, but my impression was that they have lived there for over 20 years... now my friend could be mistaken, but that's what I've been told.

[letsdoitagain]

if she said no is not on trial.

she says she said no.
he says she said yes.

All she said was that he raped her. Not when she said no.

She could of let him put bananas in her butt but if she then said "stop" or "no" and he then had sex with her, that's rape.

It doesn't matter if they had sex 5 times that night because if she said no more and he still did it, that's rape.

And what "she" says will be very important.

[timvp]

Exactly, LG. Some peeps can't read their own words.



Bump:smokin2