Please

[remingtonbo2001]

Get rid of Elson. I'm officially off the Elson bandwagon.
Terrible game tonight. I sense that he's been told he's on the block. He played very selfish tonight. Plus, he sports a beard all season long, then whenvever the team grows out their RRT beards, he shaves?!? :wtf

I don't care if you have to let him go for a bag of chips.

[Brutalis]

There was an Elson bandwagon? With wheels, actual round wheels?
Nahhh you lie.

And you're pretty much stating what everyone already thinks bud.

[remingtonbo2001]

There was an Elson bandwagon? With wheels, actual round wheels?
Nahhh you lie.

And you're pretty much stating what everyone already thinks bud.


It was a little red wagon.

I guess I let optimism get the best of me.

[Brutalis]

Radio Flyer? Mannn that is sooooo kewl.

[ThomasGranger]

Funny thing is, I remember some Nugs fans coming around and predicting that this is exactly how it would turn out with Elson.

[remingtonbo2001]

Radio Flyer? Mannn that is sooooo kewl.


No, it was a plastic Fischer Price wagon.

[timmy21_4rings]

I would love to see Elson go...With west is becoming bigger and bigger, we need him to play some minutes and use his fouls. If Elson is leaving, I am guessing that it will be for another center.

[DespЏrado]

The guy has become soft incredibly soft...he's a turn style on defense and refuses to fight for rebounds.

I cringed when I saw him play tonight. He has regressed terribly.

[rwb]

Plus, he sports a beard all season long, then whenever the team grows out their RRT beards, he shaves?!? :wtf



Okay, so I'm not the only one who thought that, too. I guess it's hard for him to get enthusiastic at this point, but he's not going to be endearing himself to his next coach either. I agree, it was painful to watch him tonight. Shouldn't he be at least be trying to keep his job?

[T Park]

If you think hes so bad, who would want to take him?

[Thompson]

Elson and Barry for Nocioni?

We'd still have Duncan, Oberto, Horry, and Bonner as big men to get us through the season until Splitter joins us next year.

[dg7md]

Pretty sure the only reason a Elson bandwagon existed was due to his first game vs. the Mavs in '07...

[T Park]

Elson and Barry for Nocioni?



I don't think it works money wise.

Why would the Bulls want either one...

[batboy]

Are the Clippers shopping Kaman or Brand? Surely they have to sign Brand or trade him soon.

I'd throw anyone not named Tim, Tony, Bruce, or Manu at either of them.

[hsxvvd]

Hup Holland!

[timvp]

The guy has become soft incredibly soft...he's a turn style on defense and refuses to fight for rebounds.

I cringed when I saw him play tonight. He has regressed terribly.You know it's bad when people are registering to say how bad Elson is playing . . .

[DespЏrado]

You know it's bad when people are registering to say how bad Elson is playing . . .

:lol Yes, yes it freaking is. I haven't caught many games this year, and what I saw tonight from Elson was such utter crap. He jumps straight in one direction for a rebound and I swear Elson just picks a direction at random to jump in.

He makes me miss Rodman. And I thought it would be a cold day in hell before I would ever said that.

[timvp]

:lol Yes, yes it freaking is. I haven't caught many games this year, and what I saw tonight from Elson was such utter crap. He jumps straight in one direction for a rebound and I swear Elson just picks a random direction to jump him.

He makes me miss Rodman. And I thought it would be a cold day in hell before I ever said that.Yeah, I was quite impressed with how Elson was able to give up two offensive rebounds within seconds of checking into the game.

[whottt]

Elson will pay for that brutal owning he gave me, if it's the last thing I ever do

[timvp]

timvp was so right about Elson, it's scary. He said he'd suck and he's sucking hard. What's ironic now is everyone on the forum hates Elson so much that timvp is the one who often has defend him in arguments.

[Whisky Dog]

Elson plays for the Spurs? I could have sworn he was wearing white tonight...

[sabar]

Good times...

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45931&page=1&pp=26&highlight=Elson

[whottt]

Good times...

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45931&page=1&pp=26&highlight=Elson


That is classic...and to think, if we hadn't signed Elson we might have won a title :depressed










Oh wait...we did win a title...



Hmmmm.....must have been the Bonner signing :tu

[J.T.]

I don't know why people are freaking. The defense is still there, Barry is crucial to the offense and is hurt, Parker is hurt. That's why the points aren't there. Spurs are in good shape when those two get back.

[sabar]

Ha, if you look through the old stuff everyone was jumping ship with Elson talk http://spurstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/smilol.gif

The best parts:

Elson would cost us a title
Better than Nazr/Rasho
Would be our enforcer
Would be a lock in to start over Oberto
No love for Oberto

Meh, it's all moot seeing how he's not even in the rotation I guess.

Same deal with Bonner pretty much...

There's some other stuff, but searching is slooooooow on posts over a year for me.

[whottt]

I've never gotten all the Elson hate...I still don't get it. He's not near as bad as people make him out to be...

He's inconsisent...but if he was consistent, he wouldn't be playing for the Spurs.



The thing is...Pop doghouses guys, cut their minutes, and everyone rips them like they are the worst player in the world...

Their confidence gets destroyed, which makes them play even worse and then everyone wonders why they are regressing....



I think Pop does it to test their mental toughness more than anything else, but also because it's clearly his way or the highway...it's kind of a brutal thing to do...but after 4 titles I am not going to question it anymore. It's Pop's thing...a mindset I don't really get, but it does work and doesn't seem to have a detrimental impact on the club....and sometimes, Pop is right to do it.


The only issue I have is that often these guys aren't nearly as bad as the board makes them out to be. I think that's the case with Elson...he was Denver's 3rd string RFA C and we signed him for 2-3 mil a year...what were people expecting? Drob?

[sabar]

Too high of expectations (funny considering his salary and where he was in draft). His playtime has impacted his game as he's down from his ~20 mpg that he had his first year here and in Denver.

Frankly, I expect nothing out of him except to be in position for an easy dunk every once in a while. Yeah, I'd like higher rebounding numbers and some blocks, but then he wouldn't be making his salary either.

Anyway, expect Elson to pop in a three like Nazr and get a permenant spot in the doghouse.

[Spurms Chumps]

mouse is worse than you guys

[JPB]

If you think hes so bad, who would want to take him?

Expiring contract.

[remingtonbo2001]

If you think hes so bad, who would want to take him?

New York.

He's not bad (talent-wise). It just seems like he isn't even trying at this point.

[timvp]

That is classic...and to think, if we hadn't signed Elson we might have won a title :depressed

Oh wait...we did win a title...

Hmmmm.....must have been the Bonner signing :tuYeah, Elson was such a huge part of last year's championship run :rolleyes

Let's face it, the Spurs got damn lucky Oberto stepped up to fill the need for a real center. If Oberto doesn't step up, the Spurs don't win the championship last year. Oberto was horrible for a lot of last year but found a new level in the playoffs and was huge during the run. Without Oberto versus the Jazz, the Jazz could have seriously won that series.

Oh and you scoffed at the idea of Oberto coming up big in the playoffs, and instead backed ya boy Elson. Another nice take for your resume :tu


I've never gotten all the Elson hate...I still don't get it. He's not near as bad as people make him out to be...He's pretty damn bad. You like him because he dunks and dunks make you excited.

That said, in case you haven't noticed I've been one of the few fans trying to hold off the Elson mob this season. I knew Elson was bad when the Spurs signed him so his play this season doesn't surprise me at all. Really, I don't think Elson is playing that bad, he's just playing like Francisco Elson. Scrubs play like scrubs.

I do think he's a bit underrated now because like I've been saying, if something were to happen to Oberto, I'd go with Elson as the starting center. Sure he sucks but it's better than seeing Horry or Bonner as the starter. Horry needs to come off the bench and I don't trust Bonner in a starting role.

If the Spurs trade Elson without getting a decent big back, that'd be a mistake. He has had a while to absorb the system and right now as an 11th man off the bench he's relatively valuable. My problem with the Elson signing was it appeared that Elson was going to be the starter. And he actually was the starter until Oberto woke up from his coma and saved the season for the Spurs.

[timvp]

I think that's the case with Elson...he was Denver's 3rd string RFA C and we signed him for 2-3 mil a year...what were people expecting? Drob?Oh and this defeatist reasoning is always lame. Just because you sign someone to a cheap contract doesn't give the player the right to suck.

Bowen was signed to a cheap contract. Oberto's contract was pretty cheap. Udoka signed for just over the minimum. And the 2-year, $6M that Elson signed wasn't exactly chump change. That's more money that it took to get Robert Horry and Horry was already a proven championship quality bigman many times over.

You act like Elson did the Spurs a favor by signing for less. He's actually one of the few players the Spurs have that they paid top dollar to acquire. Actually, he might be the only one.

[Thompson]

I don't think it works money wise.

Why would the Bulls want either one...

Actually, according to hoopshype, the money matches up almost exactly.

Elson $3 million
Barry $5,554,370

Nocioni $8,500,000

When I originally suggested it, I thought Nocioni had a few more years, but this is apparently his last. I thought the Bulls could use the expiring contracts and might as well tank the season to get a good pick (this would allow them to tank without looking like they're tanking quite as much).

I haven't even watched Nocioni in a while, except that I think I read he had a really good game a few months back and I remember how high on him everyone was a couple of years ago. How does he compare to Miller, assuming we could choose either one?

[T Park]

When I originally suggested it, I thought Nocioni had a few more years, but this is apparently his last

He just signed a new contract this offseason.

[Thompson]

He just signed a new contract this offseason.

THAT'S what it was. I though something was weird about that, it didn't seem like it was that long ago. Hoopshype takes a while to update, I guess.

Okay, never mind. Grab Miller.

[callo1]

Naw, we MUST keep Cisco now that the Diesel is in his prime and back in the West.

I bet Pop and R.C. are losing sleep now wondering how we will ever be able to stop the Suns vaunted half court offense.

/sarcasm off

[BonnerDynasty]

Dude got a nice block during Manus 37 pt Mav win.

I'd hate to give up such an athletic big tbh. Trade him, I don't care, but I'm just saying he is pretty much our only big athletic other than Horry.

[remingtonbo2001]

Dude got a nice block during Manus 37 pt Mav win.

I'd hate to give up such an athletic big tbh. Trade him, I don't care, but I'm just saying he is pretty much our only big athletic other than Horry.

I've debated this lately. I LOVE Elson's athletic ability as much as the next guy. It was even nice to see him to form a consistant jumper.
BUT, after watching him put forth maybe 30% effort last night, I've become fed up. Maybe he'll win back my support, I don't know.

For now, I'd prefer to ship him for another big. If Pop wants to give him more opportunities, that's fine with me too.

[objective]

I get a headache whenever Elson is on the floor.

Too bad that the Spurs 06 signings to counter the loss to the Mavs were such a wreckage. A fat Jackie Butler who is now retired on the money the Spurs gave him, and Elson, who might have actually regressed from being a 5&5 3rd string center.

[SenorSpur]

I've never gotten all the Elson hate...I still don't get it. He's not near as bad as people make him out to be...

He's inconsisent...but if he was consistent, he wouldn't be playing for the Spurs.


The only issue I have is that often these guys aren't nearly as bad as the board makes them out to be. I think that's the case with Elson...he was Denver's 3rd string RFA C and we signed him for 2-3 mil a year...what were people expecting? Drob?

My thoughts exactly. It's not like this guy was "tearing up the league" when he played for Denver. I'd love to see him in more of an extended situation against certain matchups, but Pop thinks otherwise.

To follow your point, at times these guys are not as bad as Pop makes them out to be either. Hard to figure why Pop fell in love with NVE, who was past his prime, yet he castrated Beno.

Should the Spurs decide to jettison Elson after this year, he'll probably go somewhere and do well.

[whottt]

LOL timvp...you created the Elson mob bud...are you now scared of the ravenous mob?


Look...Elson is a big tall guy that can jump, is fast, has athleticism and is coordinated...he's not a precise executor of defensive schemes, because he didn't have to develop those skills to get to the NBA. His athleticism is enough...


At the age of 30, he is not going to turn into a guy that's always in the right spot, or executes the game plan to precision...and it's foolhardy to expect that of him.


It's like expecting Oberto to turn into a guy that can jump out of the gym...it's just not going to happen...so instead of complaining about what the guy isn't and trying to change it, which is both difficult to do as well as time consuming, not to mention nearly always destined to fail....appreciate what he is and play to that strength.


Elson can play a bad game and still be disruptive, and he can put up big numbers from time to time...that's what he is, that's who he is, might as well accept it and be glad we have a guy with some athelticism to come off the bench.


If he had consistency and a high basketball IQ to go with his athelticism...he wouldn't be on this team for 3 mil per seaon...he'd be contending for an MVP on a different team.


Can't get a Leopard to change his spots.



It's like going to see a James Bond Film and bitching about the plot...

[timvp]

LOL timvp...you created the Elson mob bud...are you now scared of the ravenous mob?Saying Elson was a mistake and sucked isn't a mob ... especially when Elson turned out to be a mistake and sucked.


Look...Elson is a big tall guy that can jump, is fast, has athleticism and is coordinated...he's not a precise executor of defensive schemes, because he didn't have to develop those skills to get to the NBA. His athleticism is enough...


At the age of 30, he is not going to turn into a guy that's always in the right spot, or executes the game plan to precision...and it's foolhardy to expect that of him.


It's like expecting Oberto to turn into a guy that can jump out of the gym...it's just not going to happen...so instead of complaining about what the guy isn't and trying to change it, which is both difficult to do as well as time consuming, not to mention nearly always destined to fail....appreciate what he is and play to that strength.


Elson can play a bad game and still be disruptive, and he can put up big numbers from time to time...that's what he is, that's who he is, might as well accept it and be glad we have a guy with some athelticism to come off the bench. Who is this rant aimed at? Pop?

Even the most hardcore Elson hater can't control Elson not even playing.


If he had consistency and a high basketball IQ to go with his athelticism...he wouldn't be on this team for 3 mil per seaon...he'd be contending for an MVP on a different team. My hyperbole detector exploded.

I still don't get why you think $6M over two years is a cheap contract. That's a good amount of money, especially considering he was Denver's 12th man when the Spurs signed him. I could buy your "Leave Francisco Elson Alone :cry" takes if Elson were a guy making the minimum but the Spurs paid him pretty damn well.

You seem to think that because other bigs are paid more than Elson that Elson shouldn't be expected to improve. I don't really blame Pop for giving up on Elson because Elson hasn't shown much improvement. Elson also doesn't show anything that makes one think he could be a big minute championship contributor.

Elson in his role as 11th man emergency player is a good role for him and a role he fits decently well. But I can't blame Spurs fans for being disappointed in him because with how much Pop and co. hyped him up, Spurs fans were expecting better by now.

[whottt]

Saying Elson was a mistake and sucked isn't a mob ... especially when Elson turned out to be a mistake and sucked.

Who is this rant aimed at? Pop?

No...Pop isn't as critical of Elson as you are....not nearly.






Even the most hardcore Elson hater can't control Elson not even playing.

Pretty good reasons for Elson not playing...Duncan is better, Horry is better, Oberto executes better. And after that it's usually small ball with Finley pulling minutes.

And sometimes Elson is better than Oberto...




My hyperbole detector exploded.

I still don't get why you think $6M over two years is a cheap contract. That's a good amount of money, especially considering he was Denver's 12th man when the Spurs signed him. I could buy your "Leave Francisco Elson Alone :cry" takes if Elson were a guy making the minimum but the Spurs paid him pretty damn well.


No put a gun to the Spurs head to offer him that money...and I don't think he's overpaid for a 7 footer than can do the things he can do...but even if he is...it's because he was RFA.





You seem to think that because other bigs are paid more than Elson that Elson shouldn't be expected to improve.


You can expect it all you want...but it's not going to happen. Does that mean Elson can't contribute? No it doesn't...and we need big with some athletecism and speed.


I don't really blame Pop for giving up on Elson because Elson hasn't shown much improvement. Elson also doesn't show anything that makes one think he could be a big minute championship contributor.

He'd be a bigger minute contributor if he didn't have better players playing ahead of him..and with more minutes would come a better execution of his role...although it would never be his strong suit.




Elson in his role as 11th man emergency player is a good role for him and a role he fits decently well. But I can't blame Spurs fans for being disappointed in him because with how much Pop and co.

Kinda like they expected Rasho to turn into Darryl Dawkins and Barry to turn into the microwave...doesn't happen all that often.



Spurs fans were expecting better by now.

Eh...we'll see what he does, he still has the ability to stay with almost anyone....and that's a good thing to have in a 7 footer. He might be come in handy against Amare.


I mean look at who some of Elson's best games have come against...the Mavericks, the Pistons, the Heat...at least he picks tough teams to have his up games against....


You just let Cisco smoke his hash and be glad we have some form of athletecism coming off the bench...because we'd be a worse team if all we had was a bunch of slow non jumping stiffs that execute the schemes to perfection.



If Drob becomes available...I'll be right with you in bitching about the Spurs passing him over for Elson :tu

[timvp]

No...Pop isn't as critical of Elson as you are....not nearly. Link to me being overly critical of Elson this season? Pointing out poor play isn't being critical, it's telling the truth.

And Pop not playing Elson at least 20 minutes in a game for over two months and 25 games is about as much criticism as possible. I've thought Elson should have played more during that stretch, but obviously Pop thinks less of him than I do.


And sometimes Elson is better than Oberto...
That's a pretty big change in opinion from you since last year before the playoffs you said Elson > Oberto.

[whottt]

Link to me being overly critical of Elson this season? Pointing out poor play isn't being critical, it's telling the truth.

Ok fair enough...but since you are usually ripping him for boneheaded play...when he's always played like a bonehead...you'd think your expectations would have been lessened by now.

There are two types of Elson games...

A. Where he plays like a bonehead but puts up nice stats.

B. Where he plays like a bonehead and doesn't.


He's almost always disruptive to what the other team is doing...whether he is playing within the system, or not.





And Pop not playing Elson at least 20 minutes in a game for over two months and 25 games is about as much criticism as possible.


In 2003 Kerr played well(within his physical limitations) and within the system virtually every time Pop went to him...didn't keep Pop from icing him for half the season.







I've thought Elson should have played more during that stretch, but obviously Pop thinks less of him than I do.

That's Pop though...I've seen him ice Bonner when Bonner was playing some of his best ball for the Spurs.






That's a pretty big change in opinion from you since last year before the playoffs you said Elson > Oberto.

I said Elson > Oberto against the Suns...not overall. Not overall because neither one of them is Drob...and they are completely different players with completely different skillsets and talents.

I still think that...but we'll see what happens.

I don't like Elson matched up against teams that like to bang inside....like the Jazz or the Nuggets.

[objective]

against the Knicks tonight his +/- number was -12 . . . in only 5 minutes and 26 seconds

he managed to shoot 0-2, get 1 rebound, commit 1 turnover, and commit 3 fouls.

[remingtonbo2001]

At least he was clapping on the sidelines tonight.

[Solid D]

I have never seen Elson play worse than I saw tonight. Since Pop made the decision to put him into the game, Elson would have been better off standing at half court and watching. At least he wouldn't have given up and-1s from there.....

[T Park]

I'd be shocked if hes traded.

Only because I don't think anyone wants to friggen trade anything for him.

[objective]

I get a hacking cough/laugh when I read about how Elson is insurance in case Oberto gets hurt or the like, whether it's for Shaq or Bynum or whoever.

If the Spurs have to rely on Elson ever for any reason, they're done.

Elson isn't insurance for anything but bad basketball. If Oberto's hurt and Elson is they're only option they don't win a title.

[Yuixafun]

Can't get a Leopard to change his spots.




Tell that to Tom Coughlin and the NY Giants.

If a 60+ year old man can sweeten his disposition there is hope for everyone.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

This team needs Splitter.

[T Park]

Hence why they drafted him.

[ploto]

Since Pop made the decision to put him into the game, Elson would have been better off standing at half court and watching. At least he wouldn't have given up and-1s from there.....
Wow- smack talk from Solid D means he was really bad...

[Whisky Dog]

I'd be shocked if hes traded.

Only because I don't think anyone wants to friggen trade anything for him.

$3 mil expiring contract. Anyone trading for Elson won't give a damn about Elson the player, they are basically trading for the $3 mil freed up in a few months.