Belichick has been taping since 2000

[ata]

Belichick has been taping since 2000, Goodell tells Specter

By LAURIE KELLMAN, Associated Press Writer
February 13, 2008
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Bill Belichick has been illegally taping opponents' defensive signals since he became the New England Patriots' coach in 2000, according to Sen. Arlen Specter, who said NFL commissioner Roger Goodell told him that during a meeting Wednesday.

"There was confirmation that there has been taping since 2000, when Coach Belichick took over," Specter said.

Whole story: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-goodell-specter&prov=ap&type=lgns

[stretch]

Strip them of their entire draft this year, and suspend Belichick.

[monosylab1k]

Now if Specter can find a way to prove that the Patriots caused McNabb to forget how to run a 2-minute drill, he can be a little more happy with the Eagles' Super Bowl defeat.

[monoslobsond1ck]

:cry But every single team has been doing this since 2000. It is not fair that Belichick gets called out for it :cry

[BruceBowenFan]

he just got caught

[TheFaggotryAnnex]

I need proof that video tapes in general exist. If I don't see them before my eyes how do I know they exist? They could be figments of my imagination. This is all some conspiracy to put a black mark on Ladainian Tomlinson's legacy. He has proven to be the class of the league with the way he bitches about other teams celebrating, attacks opposing head coaches, calls out entire franchises for cheating when his own fans will make the assertion that the Chargers lie on injury reports and therefore also cheat themselves, sitting the entire AFC Championship game due to a mysterious pre-existing knee injury that was completely absent from aforementioned injury report, with his helmet on, with a visor, and making proclamations of how classy he is to the media.

[TheSanityAnnex]

I need proof that video tapes in general exist. If I don't see them before my eyes how do I know they exist? They could be figments of my imagination. This is all some conspiracy to put a black mark on Ladainian Tomlinson's legacy. He has proven to be the class of the league with the way he bitches about other teams celebrating, attacks opposing head coaches, calls out entire franchises for cheating when his own fans will make the assertion that the Chargers lie on injury reports and therefore also cheat themselves, sitting the entire AFC Championship game due to a mysterious pre-existing knee injury that was completely absent from aforementioned injury report, with his helmet on, with a visor, and making proclamations of how classy he is to the media.:lol the troll you try and mock me with doesn't mock me at all, but instead just gives you an outlet to cry more, therefore reinforcing what a whining bitch you are.

Have a nice day Mono, can't wait to hear how you defend these most recent allegations.

[monosylab1k]

oh hey my troll got a response. i guess if it was so pathetic nobody would have said shit about it. but they did. kick ass :tu

[san antonio spurs]

Strip them of their entire draft this year, and suspend Belichick.
The general public just found out this but Godell knew this from day one because Belichik admited it himself when he reported.
The commissioner then proceeded to punish him with cash and draft picks.
He can't punish him twice for the same thing just because the public got a clue.

[Spuradicator]

Belichick should be suspened. Goodell has proved in a short time to be an increadibly weak commish.

[monosylab1k]

Have a nice day Mono, can't wait to hear how you defend these most recent allegations.
:lmao as has already been pointed out in this thread, this is NOTHING NEW. Goodell knew about this the entire time, and his punishment of the Patriots was based on this knowlege.

This is only news to douchebag Charger fans like you and that douchebag Eagle fan Senator who is wasting time with this bullshit, instead of figuring out how to make our country a little less fucked up. America should be outraged that our government feels the need to waste their time and hard-earned tax dollars on this shit.

There are terrorists out there trying to murder each and every one of us, and Arlen Spector feels the need to settle a score with a fucking football team that beat his beloved Eagles? What an asshole.

[monosylab1k]

As much as you'd like to pretend it doesn't exist, TSA, you should be quaking in fear that the government is stupid enough to get involved in this.

Much like the steroids scandal in baseball, it started with Barry Bonds & Jose Canseco, but pretty soon expanded to McGwire, Sosa, Palmeiro, Pettitte, Knoblauch, and now Clemens.

Once someone in the government figures out "Hey, why don't we investigate everybody else in the league to find out who else has been cheating?" there is going to be an absolute goatfuck. Deny it all you want but you, me, and God all know that you are pissing your pants in fear of the Chargers and every other team being exposed just like the Patriots.

[monosylab1k]

And "they've been taping since 2000" still says nothing conclusive. Belichick could have taped one game in 2000 and then the Jets game and that's it. Zero evidence whatsoever besides that. Zero evidence any SB wins are tainted. No mention whatsoever of 2001, 2003, or 2004. Good job trying to taint the Pats dynasty, Senator, but you failed. Now maybe you can focus on something important, like the fact that this entire country is completely fucked up and there's literally a million things more important for you to spend your time with than showing the world what a bitter Eagle fan you are.

[stretch]

Now if Specter can find a way to prove that the Patriots caused McNabb to forget how to run a 2-minute drill, he can be a little more happy with the Eagles' Super Bowl defeat.
They wouldn't be in a two-minute situation if they didn't cheat. The Eagles would have already had the game won.

[stretch]

The general public just found out this but Godell knew this from day one because Belichik admited it himself when he reported.
The commissioner then proceeded to punish him with cash and draft picks.
He can't punish him twice for the same thing just because the public got a clue.
Then that is total bullshit. He basically got off with a slap on the wrist for cheating for 8 years. They better take more action than this, or the NFL is going to lose a LOT of fans, and the integrity of the league will begin to be questioned like the NBA.

[monosylab1k]

Then that is total bullshit. He basically got off with a slap on the wrist for cheating for 8 years. They better take more action than this, or the NFL is going to lose a LOT of fans, and the integrity of the league will begin to be questioned like the NBA.
It's a waste of time that could be spent fighting terrorism, but if they insist on doing this, they better launch a full-scale investigation questioning all 32 teams, or the integrity of Goodell and Congress will be in serious question.

[monosylab1k]

They wouldn't be in a two-minute situation if they didn't cheat. The Eagles would have already had the game won.
No proof the Patriots cheated in that game.

[stretch]

It's a waste of time that could be spent fighting terrorism, but if they insist on doing this, they better launch a full-scale investigation questioning all 32 teams, or the integrity of Goodell and Congress will be in serious question.
The integrity of Goodell and the Patriots/Bellichick are already in question, and ruined in the eyes of many.

[stretch]

No proof the Patriots cheated in that game.
No proof that they didn't. But there is more reason to believe that they did, as opposed to didn't. If they have been cheating for 8 years (which has been proven), why would they just cheat through regular season games, then on the biggest game of the season, not cheat at all?

More things to ponder...

in the past, a way that the Patriots would always avoid pass rushes for Brady, is to throw screen passes. I always found it odd that EVERY FUCKING TIME a team would blitz, they would just "happen" to throw a screen pass, and then finally when spygate came out, someone on the Eagles said they noticed the same odd coincendences.

Suddenly this year, they get busted, and teams that decided to blitz like crazy (Eagles, Ravens, Giants) get considerable amounts of pressure on Tom Brady, more than he has pretty much ever seen in his career, despite having by far the best offense he has ever had, which should really help take the heat OFF, not add heat. I also noticed FAR less screen passes when opposing teams blitzed, as they had done in the past.

Patriots are fucking cheaters. Plain and simple.

[lefty]

Cheaters or not, they still won 17 straitght games under scrutiny

[san antonio spurs]

There are few points I'd like to adress.
1. The senate can investigate the MLB players' steroids allegations because it's federal law tresspassed.

2. on the other hand (spygate) investing in league rules is a waiste of people's taxes money.

3. Belichik is a smart man. When he reported to Goodell, he admitted that he has been doing that since becoming a head coach in the league (not only with pats, but with the browns also) and that he did not interpret the rule properly. Moreso, he provided proof that other teams' personnel stealing patriots' signals were just escorted out of the stadium and never reported to the league officials. He pleaded ignorance and worked like a charm.
He said if he knew it was prohibited, he would've reported those other teams, but didn't because he thought it was part of the game.


By the way, what I just posted was said by an ex patriots security guard who used to escort outside of the stadium personnel found taping the pats (including the jets' guy). I just can't find the link, when I find I'll post it.

[mardigan]

Specter: Goodell's Spygate explanations don't pass scrutiny
By Mike Fish
ESPN.com
(Archive)
Updated: February 15, 2008, 2:26 AM ET

A day after meeting with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell in Washington D.C., Sen. Arlen Specter said he continues to be troubled by a number of issues surrounding the league's handling of Spygate and will continue his investigation.

Specter (R-Pa.) told ESPN.com that Senate Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.) offered support on Thursday for his inquiry into the New England Patriots' questionable videotaping practices, saying Leahy is "prepared to have the committee pay for people who travel and investigate." Leahy sat in on a part of Wednesday's session with Goodell and league counsel, Specter said.

Sen. Arlen Specter, ranking Republican on the Senate Judiciary Committee, calls Roger Goodell's reasoning for the destroying of the Spygate evidence "absurd."
"I'm determined to go forward," said Specter, the ranking Republican on the Judiciary Committee. "You have answers and positions where [Goodell] is saying that with the destruction of tapes that, 'We did the right thing. We're absolutely sure.'

"Well, that is absurd . . . Goodell says things that don't make sense."

Among the issues that continue to trouble Specter are:

• Goodell's imposition of a penalty -- the loss of a first-round draft pick, a $500,000 fine to coach Bill Belichick and a $250,000 to the team -- before the Patriots had turned over evidence, including notes dating to 2002 and six tapes from the 2006 season and 2007 preseason, requested by the league. The Patriots were caught videotaping defensive signals from the sidelines in their Sept. 9 season opener against the New York Jets. The commissioner imposed his penalty on Sept. 13, four days before New England provided the tapes and notes.

"Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed?" asked Specter, a former Philadelphia district attorney. "The answer is no."

NFL spokesperson Greg Aiello, in response on Thursday, said Goodell's hasty punishment stemmed from the fact that the Patriots had been caught at the Jets game and Belichick's admission that he had been taping signals since he became New England's head coach in 2000. Belichick reportedly told Goodell that he thought he was within the rules to tape other team's signals as long as the information wasn't used in the game at hand.

"[Goodell] issued the discipline as quickly as could to send a strong message to teams that this wouldn't be tolerated, and there'd be a severe penalty if you violated the rules," Aiello said. "The discipline included they had to turn over everything that had related to that taping procedure."

Specter heard that explanation from Goodell on Wednesday. On Thursday, Specter said, "The word absurd and ridiculous keep coming to my mind, because he [Goodell] says it with a straight face."

• Specter said it was unsettling to learn that the tapes, as well as notes, turned over by the Patriots in September had been destroyed in Foxboro rather than in the league's New York offices. Aiello said the documents and tapes were destroyed after they were reviewed by NFL officials Jeffrey Pash and Ray Anderson, and that the call to destroy the material came from Goodell, saying "There's no further use for it, so he said get rid of it."

Specter said the league's suggestion that the material, particularly the notes dating to the 2002 season, was destroyed because it might have afforded a competitive advantage is unbelievable.

"Everything has changed," he said. "Nobody could use those. They are scrap paper -- except evidence."

With the evidence destroyed, Specter said there is no way to tell what advantage the Patriots might have gained in the illegal taping practice.

• Specter is particularly concerned about how the taping might have affected New England's games involving teams from his home state in the 2004 playoffs.

In a preseason opener in August of that year at Gillette Stadium in Foxboro, the Patriots and the Philadelphia Eagles played in what proved to be a preview of the 2005 Super Bowl, won by the Patriots 24-21. And in an Oct. 31 regular-season game in Pittsburgh, the Steelers beat the Patriots 34-20. Those two teams later met in the AFC title game, which New England won, 41-27.

Later Thursday, the Steelers released a statement that read: "We consider the tapes of our coaching staff during our games against the New England Patriots to be a non-issue. In our opinion, they had no impact on the results of those games. The Steelers fully support the manner in which Commissioner Goodell handled the situation and the discipline that he levied against those who violated league rules. We are confident that the Commissioner has taken appropriate action in his investigation of this matter, and will do so again if new information arises which requires further investigation and or discipline."

• Specter believes the NFL hasn't gone far enough in its offer of legal protection to former Patriots video assistant Matt Walsh, who has told ESPN.com that he has potentially embarrassing information about the team's taping practices.

The league has offered to indemnify Walsh against exposure to a lawsuit from the Patriots, but the proposal stipulates that Walsh must tell the truth and return anything he took improperly. Under those conditions, the team could still file suit against Walsh even after he turns over evidence to the Patriots and league.

"Matt Walsh is an important guy, and they have made it so conditional," Specter said. "All they got to do is say, 'We're not going to sue you.' It is not a big deal."

Specter said he has spoken with Walsh's attorney three times in the last two days and understands that Walsh is "scared." He said the Judiciary Committee could afford Walsh immunity if Walsh is ever summoned to testify at a Senate hearing. He described both Walsh and his attorney as "cooperative."

• Specter said he was concerned to learn from Walsh's attorney that an NFL security representative, Dick Farley, had been investigating Walsh. Specter said: "I confronted them on that, and Goodell says, 'Yeah, he [Farley] works for us. Yeah, he is a security guy, but we didn't know he was investigating him.' "

Aiello said Thursday that it is an overstatement to suggest the league is investigating Walsh.

"The only thing we're doing is looking at public records and trying to verify his employment history in an effort to learn about him," Aiello said.

Mike Fish is an investigative reporter for ESPN.com. He can be reached at [email protected].


http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3246788

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

"Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed? The answer is no."

That's the hardest thing to swallow. He didn't even make it look like a real investigation.

[mardigan]

"Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed? The answer is no."

That's the hardest thing to swallow. He didn't even make it look like a real investigation.
Yea, that bothers me as well. I think this whole thing is going to get ugly, and I hope Goodell gets fucked.

[J.T.]

Hey guys let's not get too ahead of ourselves here. The senator COULD be a Steelers fan!

[Spurminator]

Pardon my ignorance, but was videotaping illegal before this season?

[monosylab1k]

"Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed? The answer is no."
You forgot one key part of that quote - it was said by Specter. Say what you will, but there is no denying that he absolutely has it in for the Patriots. He's a Pennsylvania senator and fully admitted on the Dan Patrick Show that he wants this investigation because he's an Eagles fan.

Just like the Republicans had it in for McNamee and the Democrats had it in for Clemens, this is exactly the same. There is NOTHING unbiased about what Specter is doing. He is completely against the Patriots and will refuse to see anything but the absolute worst.

Only until other members of Congress get involved will there be the possibility that an unbiased report will be given.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Specter definitely has an axe to grind, but there is no denying that Goodell handed out punishment before having all the evidence/facts.

Nothing will come of this, but it's been shady from the beginning.

[ratm1221]

I love that everyone continues to shit on the Patriots. I enjoy every bit of it.

:clap

[bostonguy]

Cheaters or not, they still won 17 straitght games under scrutiny

Who gives a fuck? They didnt win the superbowl so that winning streak means NOTHING!

[SA Gunslinger]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-02-01-the-bell-tolls_N.htm

"I remember what former Patriots linebacker Ted Johnson told me, shortly after he retired in 2005 after 10 seasons with the team. Johnson said it was not uncommon to receive "tip sheets" on opponents.

"Every now and then I'd get a sheet, one hour before the game, with a list of audibles for our opponent," Johnson said. "I don't know how, but they just showed up."

[monosylab1k]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-02-01-the-bell-tolls_N.htm

"I remember what former Patriots linebacker Ted Johnson told me, shortly after he retired in 2005 after 10 seasons with the team. Johnson said it was not uncommon to receive "tip sheets" on opponents.

"Every now and then I'd get a sheet, one hour before the game, with a list of audibles for our opponent," Johnson said. "I don't know how, but they just showed up."
Um, how do you get offensive audibles from taping defensive signals?

And the Miami Dolphins legally purchased audio tapes of all of Brady's audibles last year. Watch a game on TV and you can eventually decipher audibles yourself.

So this little update is worthless.

[monosylab1k]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2696227

[TheSanityAnnex]

still justifying the cheating? :lol

[ancestron]

Fuck the Patriots. Fuck Bill Belichik, Fuck Stetson Boy, Fuck Mike Vrabel, Teddi Bruschi, and all those underhanded cheating classless arrogant bastards for this shit.

[monosylab1k]

still justifying the cheating? :lol
Still justifying LT pussing out in the AFC Championship Game?

[SA Gunslinger]

Um, how do you get offensive audibles from taping defensive signals?

And the Miami Dolphins legally purchased audio tapes of all of Brady's audibles last year. Watch a game on TV and you can eventually decipher audibles yourself.

So this little update is worthless.

Are you sure defensive audibles/signals weren't on that sheet?

[GaryJohnston]

Fuck the Patriots. Fuck Bill Belichik, Fuck Stetson Boy, Fuck Mike Vrabel, Teddi Bruschi, and all those underhanded cheating classless arrogant bastards for this shit.

:toast

Cheating Fucks...and there is no defending it patfan.

[monosylab1k]

Are you sure defensive audibles/signals weren't on that sheet?
Why would Ted Johnson, a linebacker, need to know defensive signals for the other team?

[SA Gunslinger]

Why would Ted Johnson, a linebacker, need to know defensive signals for the other team?

One sheet for the entire team.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Still justifying LT pussing out in the AFC Championship Game?There is nothing to justify anymore. He had a hurt knee that kept him out of most of the Colts game and that knee obviously still hurt.

For you to even compare the two is silly.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y59/underseth/Shit/belick.jpg

[monosylab1k]

There is nothing to justify anymore. He had a hurt knee that kept him out of most of the Colts game and that knee obviously still hurt.
Then tell me why he wasn't on the injury report.

[Spuradicator]

Then tell me why he wasn't on the injury report.

I kind of lost a little respect for LT this past season, but I never doubted his passion for the game. I really think if he could of played effectively he would of put himself in the game.

[Purple & Gold]

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a65/slayer1707/ayr7g6.gif

[mikejones99]

18 wins still is the best ever

[LakerMagic]

You forgot one key part of that quote - it was said by Specter. Say what you will, but there is no denying that he absolutely has it in for the Patriots. He's a Pennsylvania senator and fully admitted on the Dan Patrick Show that he wants this investigation because he's an Eagles fan.

Just like the Republicans had it in for McNamee and the Democrats had it in for Clemens, this is exactly the same. There is NOTHING unbiased about what Specter is doing. He is completely against the Patriots and will refuse to see anything but the absolute worst.

Only until other members of Congress get involved will there be the possibility that an unbiased report will be given.

I applaud Spector's effort to get to the bottom of this. I wonder how much Kraft paid Goodell to sweep this shit under the rug?

[ChuckD]

Why would Ted Johnson, a linebacker, need to know defensive signals for the other team?
The 2000 taping was allegedly of the Rams Superbowl red zone offensive plays run at half/walk through speed. I think defensive players would be very interested in that.

Cheaters don't stick to one side of the ball when they could exploit both. The Patriots are a disgrace, and the NFL only slightly less so by continuing to try to sweep this under the rug.

[monosylab1k]

The 2000 taping was allegedly of the Rams Superbowl red zone offensive plays run at half/walk through speed. I think defensive players would be very interested in that.
Ted Johnson's comments have nothing to do with the Rams walkthrough.

And if someone taped the Rams walkthrough in 2000, 1) it wasn't the Patriots, and 2) it didn't work because Kevin Dyson was a yard short.

You're a disgrace for having no clue what the fuck you're talking about.

[TheSanityAnnex]

You're a disgrace for having no clue what the fuck you're talking about.And you're a disgrace for still defending your teams cheating ways. And what ever happened to you no longer posting here because sports gave you too much of a heartache?

[monosylab1k]

And you're a disgrace for still defending your teams cheating ways. And what ever happened to you no longer posting here because sports gave you too much of a heartache?
Why wasn't LT on the injury report?

[TheSanityAnnex]

Why wasn't LT on the injury report?Is that seriously all you have?

Try and relate that to defending a team that has been caught cheating, I dare you.

[ChuckD]

The Pats/Rams SB taping was allegedly of the Rams Superbowl red zone offensive plays run at half/walk through speed. I think defensive players would be very interested in that.

Cheaters don't stick to one side of the ball when they could exploit both. The Patriots are a disgrace, and the NFL only slightly less so by continuing to try to sweep this under the rug.

Happy, fuckface? I don't GAF about Ted Johnson. You're the one that keeps bringing him up, as if that somehow means the Pats didn't cheat on the other side of the ball.

[monosylab1k]

Is that seriously all you have?

Try and relate that to defending a team that has been caught cheating, I dare you.
Try and answer my question for once, I dare you.

[monosylab1k]

I don't GAF about Ted Johnson. You're the one that keeps bringing him up
Wrong. Somebody else brought him up trying to link his comments to Spygate. They were completely wrong.

Get a clue of what the hell you're talking about and try again.

[J.T.]

I hate the Pats as much as the next guy but this is so old now, WGAF. Roger Clemens is much more lulz than Spygate.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Try and answer my question for once, I dare you.He wasn't on the injury report because he thought he could play.

Now justify cheating.

[monosylab1k]

He wasn't on the injury report because he thought he could play.
LT doesn't have any say in whether or not he's on the injury report. The doctors who treat him and the coaching staff decide that. And players who think they can play, and do play, still show up on the injury report all the time.

Try again.

[LakerMagic]

BUMP.......back to the thread topic. That being the patriots being cheating loser fucks.




Belichick has been taping since 2000, Goodell tells Specter

By LAURIE KELLMAN, Associated Press Writer
February 13, 2008
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Bill Belichick has been illegally taping opponents' defensive signals since he became the New England Patriots' coach in 2000, according to Sen. Arlen Specter, who said NFL commissioner Roger Goodell told him that during a meeting Wednesday.

"There was confirmation that there has been taping since 2000, when Coach Belichick took over," Specter said.

Whole story: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-goodell-specter&prov=ap&type=lgns

[TheSanityAnnex]

LT doesn't have any say in whether or not he's on the injury report. The doctors who treat him and the coaching staff decide that. And players who think they can play, and do play, still show up on the injury report all the time.

Try again.Your point?

I answered your question to the best of my knowledge. Could the Chargers have left him off the injury report on purpose knowing there was a chance he may not play, sure. But I don't see the NFL investigating any such matters. I didn't see any fines handed out and haven't heard any clamor about it, except from you.

Now how about you justify your defense of a team that was caught blatantly cheating.

[FlavoredIcecream]

lol patriots.

18-1* :lol :lol :lol :lol

[monosylab1k]

Could the Chargers have left him off the injury report on purpose knowing there was a chance he may not play, sure.
Why would you guess that?

You didn't answer my question, you dodged it like you always have. I'm pretty sure you realize your own hypocrisy at this point so if you want to continue dodging, fine by me.

[peewee's lovechild]

18 wins still is the best ever

No it's not, you idiot.

The 49ers went 18-1 and won the Super Bowl.

The Bears went 18-1 and won the Super Bowl.

The Patriots, however, went 18-1 and lost the Super Bowl.

[monosylab1k]

No it's not, you idiot.

The 49ers went 18-1 and won the Super Bowl.

The Bears went 18-1 and won the Super Bowl.

The Patriots, however, went 18-1 and lost the Super Bowl.
18 wins in a season isn't the best win total ever?

Are the Pats on the same level as the Bears & 49ers? No. Not even fucking close. But to say that 18 wins isn't the best ever is just ignoring facts. 18 wins is the most a team has ever gotten in one season.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Why would you guess that?

You didn't answer my question, you dodged it like you always have. I'm pretty sure you realize your own hypocrisy at this point so if you want to continue dodging, fine by me.:lol

I've said the same thing here about LT and his injury that I've said all along. Please point out my hypocrisy. Actually, fuck it. I'm done with it. It's obvious who's dodging who's questions right now. You, like the team you root for, have no class. Enjoy cheering on a cheating franschise, unless they break your heart again and are forced to stop watching sports.

[monosylab1k]

Actually, fuck it. I'm done with it.
Of course you are.

[stretch]

18 wins in a season isn't the best win total ever?

Are the Pats on the same level as the Bears & 49ers? No. Not even fucking close. But to say that 18 wins isn't the best ever is just ignoring facts. 18 wins is the most a team has ever gotten in one season.
There is a difference between most, and best.

18-1 with a superbowl is better than 18-1 without.

You're just pulling things out of your ass to defend them now, when you know that its absolutely ridiculous to compare when there is no worthwhile comparison.

[monosylab1k]

18-1 with a superbowl is better than 18-1 without.
Yeah I already fucking said that.

18 wins is the most wins a team has ever gotten in one season. Therefore, 18 wins is the best win total ever.

Nobody said they were the best 18 win team ever. Just that they got 18 wins.

How fucking hard is it to comprehend, really?

[stretch]

Yeah I already fucking said that.

18 wins is the most wins a team has ever gotten in one season. Therefore, 18 wins is the best win total ever.

Nobody said they were the best 18 win team ever. Just that they got 18 wins.

How fucking hard is it to comprehend, really?
It's just ridiculous the way you are trying to do anything to defend the way your team got raped in the super bowl, after all the cocky crap they did all season and the shit they talked. Fucking accept it and move on to the next chapter, which is now about how they cheated their way to the 3 SBs they won.

[monosylab1k]

It's just ridiculous the way you are trying to do anything to defend the way your team got raped in the super bowl
I was doing no such thing.

SOMEBODY ELSE said "18 wins is the best ever".

Peewee, in his blinding genius, tried to say that 18 wins was not the best ever because there were two other teams that won............18 games.

I pointed out that 18=18.

That's it.

Maybe you should start paying attention to your own team a little more, instead of obsessively hating the Patriots....especially considering the fact that all season I've actually followed the Raiders more closely than you, a so-called "fan", has.

[stretch]

I was doing no such thing.

SOMEBODY ELSE said "18 wins is the best ever".

Peewee, in his blinding genius, tried to say that 18 wins was not the best ever because there were two other teams that won............18 games.

I pointed out that 18=18.

That's it.

Maybe you should start paying attention to your own team a little more, instead of obsessively hating the Patriots....especially considering the fact that all season I've actually followed the Raiders more closely than you, a so-called "fan", has.

And I said, that there is a difference between "most" and "best". You have have a better 18 win season than another 18 win season, such as having 18 wins with a SB is a better 18 win season without a SB.

And I'm curious as to how can you say that you followed the Raiders more closely than I have? Just because I don't talk about them a whole lot doesn't mean I don't know much about them.

[TheSanityAnnex]

Can someone please justify cheating for me? mono seems to believe it is okay but can't seem to give any reasons as to why.

[monosylab1k]

Can someone please justify cheating for me? mono seems to believe it is okay but can't seem to give any reasons as to why.
everybody cheats.

[LakerMagic]

everybody cheats.

weak

[TheSanityAnnex]

everybody cheats.
Is the league aware of this?

[monosylab1k]

Is the league aware of this?
yes.

[stretch]

yes.
obviously not, considering everyone that cheats hasn't been busted.

[TheSanityAnnex]

yes.
:lmao

[monosylab1k]

:lmao
:lmao

[TheSanityAnnex]

I'm glad you stuck around here and kept posting instead of pulling the bitch move you planned on after your meltdown, you bring entertainment to the offseason.

[Fabbs]

And for Mono to spend time away from his volunteer position with handing out jerseys, caps, sweatpants etc with "19-0 Patriots" embroidered on.

That is self sacrafice.

[monosylab1k]

And for Mono to spend time away from his volunteer position with handing out jerseys, caps, sweatpants etc with "19-0 Patriots" embroidered on.

That is self sacrafice.
enjoy Hell.

[TheSanityAnnex]

enjoy Hell.Is that the same place that people who tell other people to die and fucking kill themselves go?