Here's a "big trade" the Spurs could easily make.

[Holt's Cat]

Spurs receive
Jason Kidd

Nets receive
Tony Parker
Brent Barry
Francisco Elson


Successful Trade Scenario
Congratulations on a successful trade.

Due to New Jersey and San Antonio being over the cap, the 25% trade rule is invoked. New Jersey and San Antonio had to be no more than 125% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.


link (http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=4509335)

Since clearly the Spurs have fallen behind in the Western Conference 'trade for the oldest former franchise player' wars and Ghost is wigging out, the Spurs must make this trade. This would give the Spurs a lot of short run pub. Plus a Frenchman can never be a true "balla".

[Ghost Writer]

When is Kidd's contract up?

I am having Gary Payton flashbacks.

[BacktoBasics]

I'm pretty fucking sick and tired of this shit.

[Holt's Cat]

When is Kidd's contract up?

I am having Gary Payton flashbacks.

2009.

[Ghost Writer]

You are setting me up here, but I'll bite:

Trade approved.

You get a walking triple-double that would kill his wife (literally) for a ring in return for the French Phenom and you can still clear Kidd off the books before the big 2010 free agency rush.

We know Kidd and Duncan dig each other.

[Ghost Writer]

Eh... thinking further...

Would Kidd's skill set work in our motion offense?

Just asking.

I would hate to see his playmaking stifled.

In that case, he would not really be worth upsetting the apple cart.

Although his court savvy and rebounding for a guard is unparelelled.

[T Park]

No thanks.

Parker is an all star 20 point a game guy.

After Kidd is gone, in the summer of 09 there isn't shit for PGs to get.

[Holt's Cat]

So the Spurs break up the Big 3 that has brought the Spurs 3 titles in the last 5 seasons for someone who already had his chance to be a part of it in SA? For the next two title runs? Who are they going to replace Kidd with in 2009?

[Holt's Cat]

Eh... thinking further...

Would Kidd's skill set work in our motion offense?

Just asking.

I would hate to see his playmaking stifled.

In that case, he would not really be worth upsetting the apple cart.

Although his court savvy and rebounding for a guard is unparelelled.


I'm pretty sure Kidd would fit in the offense. Who are the Spurs going to replace him with in 2009?

[Holt's Cat]

So 35 year old Kidd > 26 year old Parker?

I thought the Spurs needed to get "younger"?

[Ghost Writer]

So the Spurs break up the Big 3 that has brought the Spurs 3 titles in the last 5 seasons for someone who already had his chance to be a part of it in SA? For the next two title runs? Who are they going to replace Kidd with in 2009?
Uh... yes.

The Spurs have seemed to right the ship with Parker not playing.

What could they do with Kidd.

I'll worry about 2009 in 2009.


Either offer Kidd a modest extension or wait for 2010's big free agent frenzy, where they'd potentially have Kidd off the books for a max contract.

[T Park]

I'll worry about 2009 in 2009.



Thats fantastic, in 09 when the Spurs have no point guard Duncan and Ginobili aging and no one to help shoulder the load, IE Tony Parker.

Great future.

[Holt's Cat]

Uh... yes.

The Spurs have seemed to right the ship with Parker not playing.

That's just a couple regular season games with Ginobili playing out of his mind.





What could they do with Kidd.

I'll worry about 2009 in 2009.

No, we must worry now.




Either offer Kidd a modest extension or wait for 2010's big free agent frenzy, where they'd potentially have Kidd off the books for a max contract.

Who comes with that max contract? They tried that in 2003 and we saw what happened. Kidd will be 200 years old in 2009 why are the Spurs extending him? Don't they need a youth movement?

[urunobili]

you guys should keep debating on the million trade threads you started! :ban:

[ancestron]

Why don't the Spurs just trade everyone for the Minnesota Timberwolves?!?! Get some youth!!! Actually why don't we just trade franchises with them? They can have the entire Spurs franchise and we'll take all the Timberwolves guys! We'll be the San Antonio Timberwolves!!! YES!!! and maybe we can sign Kobe and LeBron and Shaq and Steve Nash and put a big fucking ferris Wheel in the middle of the court so fans can watch from there and then install trap doors in the court and pyrotechnic flames that shoot out of the floor periodically and an alligator pit out of bounds!!! yEA!!!

[Ghost Writer]

Holt's Cat, I am not worried with Kidd on this team now.

I hear you about not being able to bring in a star in 2010, but I would be willing to take my chances in 2 summers to get an All-Star who wants a ring badly now.

Essentially it's Parker for Kidd and cap space as early as 2009.

Hhhhhmm... seeing how the Spurs have managed without Parker in the past month, I would do it.

Scared money don't make none.



P.S.

I know there are homers here that might agree with me, but are too afraid to post.


P.P.S.

You might even do this deal, Holt's.

[Mr. Body]

This board went into the shitter fast.

[Holt's Cat]

Well, you did show up.

[batboy]

This idea hasn't gotten any better in the past five years. We need Tony's scoring from the point, period. Without him our offense is anemic. Duncan would be permanently doubled with Kidd running the point. There is no reason to respect Jason Kidd's offense from the field and he's too old and slow to get to the painted area. Parker helps Duncan not with great dishes, but by having a game himself that commands a little respect.

Under Kidd we would need Ginobili to be hot every night. We have a better team now with Parker, nine years of youth and a future to build around.

[Bruno]

I can't believe that MB's trap has worked. :lol

[Holt's Cat]

Holt's Cat, I am not worried with Kidd on this team now.

I hear you about not being able to bring in a star in 2010, but I would be willing to take my chances in 2 summers to get an All-Star who wants a ring badly now.

Essentially it's Parker for Kidd and cap space as early as 2009.

Parker's been an All-Star.

Could the Spurs even land a player as good as Parker in 2009? They had max cap room in 2003 and they ended up with Radoslav Nesterovic.




Hhhhhmm... seeing how the Spurs have managed without Parker in the past month, I would do it.

Scared money don't make none.


What are the Spurs "making" with their money in that case? Parker at the helm has resulted in 3 titles in the last 5 seasons and he's under contract through 2011.



P.S.

I know there are homers here that might agree with me, but are too afraid to post.


P.P.S.

You might even do this deal, Holt's.

Nope. The Spurs are currently set to have flexibility in 2010 to replenish the supporting cast around the Big 3. Kidd had his shot.

[Holt's Cat]

I can't believe that MB's trap has worked. :lol

:smokin

Experience, my friend.

[baseline bum]

Even if Parker came out and said he would force a trade in 09-10, no way in hell I'd trade him for Kidd.

[stxspurs]

dumbest thread ever.....that is all

[Ghost Writer]

I stated my case... the trade looks better now, because Kidd could be off the books in 2009.

We're winning without Parker now.

[Holt's Cat]

I stated my case... the trade looks better now, because Kidd could be off the books in 2009.

We're winning without Parker now.

The Spurs are winning regular season games against Eastern Conference opponents in February with Ginobili dropping 40 a night. Whoop de fucking do.

[Ghost Writer]

So you don't do your trade proposal, because you're afraid of replacing Parker... even with Kidd in hand or his max money off the books in 2009?

You do realize that Parker is not this good as the focal point of a team, right?

[Holt's Cat]

So you don't do your trade proposal, because you're afraid of replacing Parker... even with Kidd in hand or his max money off the books in 2009?

That's a 37 year old Kidd who you'd have to pay near max money to in order to retain him past 2009.

And again, the Spurs haven't done a good job wooing max free agents from other teams, as you've bitched about for the last decade.



You do realize that Parker is not this good as the focal point of a team, right?

Has he had the opportunity? Parker's damn good in the Spurs' system. I'm not sure how you can't understand that.

[baseline bum]

So you don't do your trade proposal, because you're afraid of replacing Parker... even with Kidd in hand or his max money off the books in 2009?

You do realize that Parker is not this good as the focal point of a team, right?

Yeah, so we can sign Rasho again to replace Kidd.

[Ghost Writer]

You guys have that little faith in the front office?

Someday, we'll have to rely on more than lottery balls.

How about we show another kind of "balls."

[stxspurs]

i dont see it good at all....we are winning with manu putting the team on his back....how long do u think he can do that...parker scores and is only going to get better. so if it happened kidd is off in 09 and who is goin g to run the point?.....i dont want to take that chance and hope a big name signs

[Holt's Cat]

You guys have that little faith in the front office?

I have little faith that the Spurs would be able to lure a max free agent to small market San Antonio to play in the shadow of Tim Duncan.




Someday, we'll have to rely on more than lottery balls.

How about we show another kind of "balls."

Or the Spurs could show that they are nuts and make such a trade.

[Ghost Writer]

That's a 37 year old Kidd who you'd have to pay near max money to in order to retain him past 2009.

And again, the Spurs haven't done a good job wooing max free agents from other teams, as you've bitched about for the last decade.



Has he had the opportunity? Parker's damn good in the Spurs' system. I'm not sure how you can't understand that.
I object.

At 37, Kidd doesn't get near-max money and if he demands it, bonjourno to him.

Parker is excellent in our system, but I do not have delusions of him being a star you build around.


The bottom line is that you guys have no confidence in our front office with max money to bring in a replacement star...

... which should make you more open to a trade such as this.

One day, it's going to come down to a trade or a free agent signing to reload the team.

Can't keep counting on lottery balls.

[Ghost Writer]

I have little faith that the Spurs would be able to lure a max free agent to small market San Antonio to play in the shadow of Tim Duncan.
You sound like me prior to the 2003 debacle.

I am cool with a trade like this.

Parker in 2010 and beyond is not going to carry us to the promised land.

[stxspurs]

superstars have already passed up san antonio.......u want to take that chance so to say we had the balls to do that? :drunk

[Holt's Cat]

I object.

At 37, Kidd doesn't get near-max money and if he demands it, bonjourno to him.

Well he isn't going to play for the vet min. And if he isn't worth near max money then you have regressed. Plus you have to count on a max free agent wanting to actually join the Spurs.




Parker is excellent in our system, but I do not have delusions of him being a star you build around.


Delusions? He works. It isn't broke. Why create a problem for yourself?




The bottom line is that you guys have no confidence in our front office with max money to bring in a replacement star...

I have no confidence that the Spurs can entice a max free agent to join the Spurs in sleepy San Antonio to play in Tim Duncan's shadow. How many big free agent acquisitions did the Jazz make during the days of Stockton and Malone?





... which should make you more open to a trade such as this.

One day, it's going to come down to a trade or a free agent signing to reload the team.

Can't keep counting on lottery balls.

When's that "day"? Five years from now? How does Kidd help the Spurs in that regard?

[baseline bum]

I object.

At 37, Kidd doesn't get near-max money and if he demands it, bonjourno to him.

Parker is excellent in our system, but I do not have delusions of him being a star you build around.


The bottom line is that you guys have no confidence in our front office with max money to bring in a replacement star...

... which should make you more open to a trade such as this.

One day, it's going to come down to a trade or a free agent signing to reload the team.

Can't keep counting on lottery balls.

Huh? I have no faith in being able to sign a max player, so I should be for the Spurs trading a young All-Star so that they can have max capspace in two years? :wtf

[Holt's Cat]

Huh? I have no faith in being able to sign a max player, so I should be for the Spurs trading a young All-Star so that they can have max capspace in two years? :wtf

:lol

Don't worry, he'll eventually bite through the knot he's been twisted into.

[nkdlunch]

Kidd can't shoot or penetrate. Our team needs scorers.

[Ghost Writer]

Just so we're clear... you would not trade for a proven All-Star with a max contract that comes off the books in 2009 for a good (not great) former All-Star, because you have no faith in your front office to leverage cap space to bring in a replacement star.

Please confirm.

[Ryvin1]

only if the nets waive tony parker and we can resign him.. oh yeah and brent barry too..

[Holt's Cat]

Just so we're clear... you would not trade for a proven All-Star with a max contract that comes off the books in 2009 for a good (not great) former All-Star,

...who's 25 years old...



because you have no faith in your front office to leverage cap space to bring in a replacement star.

Please confirm.

Yes, I have no confidence that the Spurs could convince a free agent at Parker's level in 2009, when he's an ancient 28 years old, to come to small market boring ass San Antonio to play in Tim Duncan's shadow.

What do you have against Parker? The Spurs are already set with a young star at point.

[Holt's Cat]

Where do you rank Tony Parker among NBA point guards?

[baseline bum]

Just so we're clear... you would not trade for a proven All-Star with a max contract that comes off the books in 2009 for a good (not great) former All-Star, because you have no faith in your front office to leverage cap space to bring in a replacement star.

Please confirm.


I would not trade a better player who is also much younger and on a cheaper yearly deal for a lesser one with 1 1/2 years max left.

[Ghost Writer]

...who's 25 years old...



Yes, I have no confidence that the Spurs could convince a free agent at Parker's level in 2009, when he's an ancient 28 years old, to come to small market boring ass San Antonio to play in Tim Duncan's shadow.

What do you have against Parker? The Spurs are already set with a young star at point.
El fin.

[Extra Stout]

Never mind.

[Ghost Writer]

I would not trade a better player who is also much younger and on a cheaper yearly deal for a lesser one with 1 1/2 years max left.
Yeah, but we're discussing Kidd for Parker and change. I have no idea what you are describing.

Parker is a top 10 PG in a system that suits his style very well.

Kidd is a top 3 PG who may be the greatest playmaker of the past decade.

[Holt's Cat]

Yeah, but we're discussing Kidd for Parker and change. I have no idea what you are describing.

Parker is a top 10 PG in a system that suits his style very well.

Top 10? What 10 NBA point guards are better than Parker?




Kidd is a top 3 PG who may be the greatest playmaker of the past decade.

Yeah, based on what did last decade. BFD. I thought the Spurs were 'too old' as it stands. Now you're happy moving a 25 year old rising star in exchange for a 36 year old nearing the end of his career?

[baseline bum]

Yeah, but we're discussing Kidd for Parker and change. I have no idea what you are describing.

Parker is a top 10 PG in a system that suits his style very well.

Kidd is a top 3 PG who may be the greatest playmaker of the past decade.

Kidd was a top 3 point guard. No NBA GM would trade Parker for Kidd. Ifi you wanted to trade Parker for Kidd, the time was 5 years ago when Kidd was still a top 5-10 player.

[jag]

Trade ideas/threads are getting old....we sound like suns fans

[Holt's Cat]

Time to help Ghost out. Perhaps Kidd isn't as good today as you recall him being 7 years ago.

[BILLYE]

Spurs receive
Jason Kidd

Nets receive
Tony Parker
Brent Barry
Francisco Elson



link (http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=4509335)

Since clearly the Spurs have fallen behind in the Western Conference 'trade for the oldest former franchise player' wars and Ghost is wigging out, the Spurs must make this trade. This would give the Spurs a lot of short run pub. Plus a Frenchman can never be a true "balla".



this is the dumbest thread I have ever read in my life....i think this trade would make the Gasol trade look good for Memphis. Mike Miller would be the only player that they should trade for, IF they had to make a trade right now....which they don't. we just punked 6 of 9 teams on the road trip and realistically, we should have won all 9 games...WITHOUT Parker. Thank god none of you guys are GM's.

[Holt's Cat]

this is the dumbest thread I have ever read in my life

Only if you are dumb enough to not understand the purpose of this thread.

[50 cent]

This thread sucked in 2004. :td

[Holt's Cat]

Apparently it's contagious.

[Ghost Writer]

Exactly.

We're winning without Parker.

Now add Kidd for 2 consecutive playoffs and the ability to sign a max contract as early as the summer of 2009.

[baseline bum]

Apparently it's contagious.

Eh, only the No Limit Army understands your battle tactics. :smokin

[baseline bum]

Exactly.

We're winning without Parker.

Now add Kidd for 2 consecutive playoffs and the ability to sign a max contract as early as the summer of 2009.

Except when we lost to Seattle without Parker.

[Holt's Cat]

Exactly.

We're winning without Parker.

Winning in February against Eastern Conference teams. Did the Spurs beat the C's without Parker?




Now add Kidd for 2 consecutive playoffs and the ability to sign a max contract as early as the summer of 2009.

So what? The Spurs get an older slower past his prime player and then they have to hope they can land a max free agent level talent.

[nkdlunch]

correction: "we are BARELY winning regular season games without Parker with Duncan + Manu playing 40 minutes"

[Ghost Writer]

Hopefully, we won't face SEA in the playoffs. Weak take, base. That was right after Parker went down. We got another PG since then.




P.S.

Jason Kidd

Second player in NBA history to average a triple-double for an entire postseason. Kidd finished with averages of 14.6 points, 10.9 rebounds and 10.9 assists in 12 games during the 2007 NBA playoffs.

Joined Oscar Robertson who averaged 28.8 points, 11.0 assists and 11.0 rebounds in 4 games in a 3-1 first-round loss in 1962.
Jason Kidd is the first person in 10 years to obtain a triple-double for 3 games in a row with 13 points, 12 assists, and 11 rebounds (1/08/2008).



Yeah, he's done.

[Ghost Writer]

Winning in February against Eastern Conference teams. Did the Spurs beat the C's without Parker?




So what? The Spurs get an older slower past his prime player and then they have to hope they can land a max free agent level talent.
We'd beat them with Kidd.

You really have no faith in the front office, huh?

Counting on another #1?

[Extra Stout]

Has Ghost ever really meant anything he's argued, or is he the greatest troll of all time?

Question.

[Holt's Cat]

Hopefully, we won't face SEA in the playoffs. Weak take, base. That was right after Parker went down. We got another PG since then.

And they didnt beat the Celtics. They only beat the Raptors and Cavs due to Ginobili playing out of his mind, but, I know, he sucks too.




P.S.

Jason Kidd

Second player in NBA history to average a triple-double for an entire postseason. Kidd finished with averages of 14.6 points, 10.9 rebounds and 10.9 assists in 12 games during the 2007 NBA playoffs.


And his team went home without a title. That's 36 year old Jason Kidd.

[Holt's Cat]

We'd beat them with Kidd.

Unknown. And that was a Celtics team without Garnett.




You really have no faith in the front office, huh?

Counting on another #1?

That's the same front office that drafted Parker and Ginobili.

Anyways, if you think they should be able to land these max free agents yet somehow are incapable of using the magic 'signing free agent' potion why do you continue to be a fan? It's not going to change. The Spurs will always struggle to land young max level talent to come to small market San Antonio. They've found other means to put together one of the best trios in the NBA. Why must one of those players have been traded for or signed from another team as a max free agent?

Your point has to be the most retarded in ST.com history.

[Holt's Cat]

Has Ghost ever really meant anything he's argued, or is he the greatest troll of all time?

Question.


He means it. A Connecticut psychiatrist has a long-term lucrative client.

[Ghost Writer]

You are sucking all over the place in this thread.

You said Kidd is done and I hit you back with phenomenal stats from 2007-08.

You cry that the Spurs could not beat the Celts w/o Parker and I point out they might with Kidd.

The team is rolling without Parker and you are afraid to add Kidd as his replacement.

You have no faith in your front office, yet are afraid to trade for an All-Star.

TKO.

[Ghost Writer]

Checkmate.

[Holt's Cat]

You said the Spurs' biggest problems are scoring at the small forward position, weakness in the 4/5 rotation, and the overall age of the team. So naturally trading their 25 year old rising star point guard for a 36 year old makes sense to you.

People are laughing at your ass. Hard.


The team is rolling without Parker and you are afraid to add Kidd as his replacement.

The Spurs lost to Seattle, a team that had lost 14 in a row and then they lost to a Celtics team without Kevin Garnett. It took two superhuman performances by Emmanuel Ginobili to beat the Raptors and Cavs. That's hardly "rolling".



You have no faith in your front office, yet are afraid to trade for an All-Star.

I have faith that the front office will be able to continue to use draft picks and shrewd free agent pickups to build a supporting cast around their big 3, 2 of whom are home grown.

You put up stats from Kidd in an entirely different offense, in a weaker conference, and of a player who is likely 2 years from retirement. You bemoan the ineptness of the Spurs' front office yet are ready to run out their top young player and count on their newfound ability to lure a top young free agent to play in small market sleepy San Antonio in the shadow of Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobili.

You've been hit so hard you don't know what's up and what's down. You are a novice when it comes to basketball, only relying on name brands that were on the top of the market 7 years ago. The internets have passed you by old man. It's time to hang up the modem.

Popd@mn.

:cooldevil

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

You don't break up a core that brought you 3 championships in 5 years until it is obvous they are done winning.

Read and repeat.

Is there a simpler NBA axiom?

[Ghost Writer]

Was there a point in that emotional diatribe?

You just admitted that you'd rather Parker for the forseeable future rather than Kidd for the next two postseasons and the ability to go after a max free agent as early as 2009.

Well done.

[Holt's Cat]

Was there a point in that emotional diatribe?

You just admitted that you'd rather Parker for the forseeable future rather than Kidd for the next two postseasons and the ability to go after a max free agent as early as 2009.

Well done.

I'd rather what? Don't get so choked up you can't express yourself clearly.

[Ghost Writer]

I'd rather what? Don't get so choked up you can't express yourself clearly.
Read it again.

You'd rather Parker for the forseeable future, than Kidd for the next two postseasons and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

That's a lot of faith in Parker and very little in your front office.

How soon should we tank a year and make it 3-for-3 in lottery drafts?

2010?

2011?

How much gas does Duncan have left?

Again, please confirm the following:

You'd rather Parker for the forseeable future, than Kidd for the next two postseasons and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

If so, all I can do is sit back and applaud your convictions.

Well done.

:lol

[Holt's Cat]

Trading Parker for Kidd today would be the worst move in Spurs' history.

[Ghost Writer]

Why?

Because you are counting on lottery balls.

Again.

[Holt's Cat]

And you want to make a horrid trade today because of something that might happen 4 years from now.

[adidas11]

Oh...my...god.

We're having the Kidd/Tony Parker debate AGAIN????

5 years later!?!?!?

I thought this issue was done and dusted.

[Holt's Cat]

I can't believe Ghost fell for it. But then again, that was the point.

[FromWayDowntown]

low shooting percentage = dominance

if only the Spurs could find a guy who shoots a low percentage AND wears a headband or has cornrows.

[MegaanLindsay]

No way! Kidd's probably going to those damned Mavs anyway. Parker is not "some Frenchman" He's our MVP last season, remember??

[Ghost Writer]

You would not trade Parker for Kidd and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

Incredulous.

Is our front office that terrible or San Antonio that undesirable?

[Holt's Cat]

Why are the Spurs trading a 25 year old rising star point guard for 36 year old Jason Kidd when the Spurs' problems are age and an inability to lure top free agents to join the team?

[Spurminator]

Putting Kidd in the starting lineup would give us 3 guys who can't shoot. No thanks.

[Ghost Writer]

Why are the Spurs trading a 25 year old rising star point guard for 36 year old Jason Kidd when the Spurs' problems are age and an inability to lure top free agents to join the team?
Because Kidd is still better than Parker and if the front office is worth their salt, they could get a star who is better than both of them as early as 2009.

By your logic, we're fvcked the day Duncan starts to slow down and we realize maybe the other two are great because of him.

One day, we'll need more than draft luck.








I am off for Happy Hour. Could you please sign off on this?:

I would not trade Parker for Kidd and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009. - Holt's Cat

[Sigz]

Trading for Kidd? A player who is on the true 'downside' of his career, for Parker, who hasn't even hit his prime??

[rascal]

I would not trade Parker for Kidd.

I know the thread starter did not want to trade Parker for Kidd.

[rascal]

You would not trade Parker for Kidd and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

Incredulous.

Is our front office that terrible or San Antonio that undesirable?

A little of both. San Antonio is not a top free agent destination. The front office has not had a good record luring top free agents.

[SenorSpur]

Didn't we go through this bullshit scenario 5 years ago?

Let's table anymore prattle about Jason Kidd. We've already got a damn good PG that gives the Spurs another legitimate offensive threat.

Let the Mavs sort out their own bullshit.

[baseline bum]

Hopefully, we won't face SEA in the playoffs. Weak take, base. That was right after Parker went down. We got another PG since then.




P.S.

Jason Kidd

Second player in NBA history to average a triple-double for an entire postseason. Kidd finished with averages of 14.6 points, 10.9 rebounds and 10.9 assists in 12 games during the 2007 NBA playoffs.

Joined Oscar Robertson who averaged 28.8 points, 11.0 assists and 11.0 rebounds in 4 games in a 3-1 first-round loss in 1962.
Jason Kidd is the first person in 10 years to obtain a triple-double for 3 games in a row with 13 points, 12 assists, and 11 rebounds (1/08/2008).



Yeah, he's done.

It's like you haven't seen this guy play at all this year. His team is awful. Don't give me any garbage about how it's not his fault either, because Jefferson and Carter have both been healthy. His jumpshot went from pretty bad to Chris Dudley overnight this season. The guy is an absolute turnstile on defense, and a far cry from Parker there. Yeah, he grabs boards. So what? Is Josh Boone going to be taking them away from him? Kidd's looked like a sour bitch all season ever since he didn't get an extension to his deal, and he would do the exact same thing here.

[anakha]

His jumpshot went from pretty bad to Chris Dudley overnight this season.

Just wanted to say, I found this absolutely hilarious.

Carry on. :lol

[SenorSpur]

Because Kidd is still better than Parker and if the front office is worth their salt, they could get a star who is better than both of them as early as 2009.

By your logic, we're fvcked the day Duncan starts to slow down and we realize maybe the other two are great because of him.

One day, we'll need more than draft luck.






I am off for Happy Hour. Could you please sign off on this?:

I would not trade Parker for Kidd and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009. - Holt's Cat

PLEASE! Kidd can't shoot. Never could shoot. I'll take my chances on a PG who is probably the quickest PG in the league and is one of the perennial leader in scoring points the paint. And who already has 3 rings and was the NBA Finals MVP.

Sounds to me like you've started Happy Hour a bit soon. :toast

Let it die, already!

[DAINTX]

Parker > Kidd. Parker's future >>>>>>>Kidd's.

[remingtonbo2001]

Why couldn't the Mavs close this trade?

:pctoss

[Agloco]

You would not trade Parker for Kidd and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

Incredulous.

Is our front office that terrible or San Antonio that undesirable?


Why don't you share some of that wisdom with us and disclose who exactly is coming to save the day in 2009 if this goes down?

[himat]

You guys are going overboard. The Spurs are not going to make a blockbuster deal unless they get a good player handed to them like the Lakers did.

[BigBigSpur]

Yeah, but we're discussing Kidd for Parker and change. I have no idea what you are describing.

Parker is a top 10 PG in a system that suits his style very well.

Kidd is a top 3 PG who may be the greatest playmaker of the past decade.

We don't need Kidd, and he's too old. Maybe we will trade Parker long long later, but never for Kidd.
Moreover, Spurs don't need great playmaker like Suns. Because the Spurs play as a whole, everyone does his role, everyone can be playmaker.

[SenorSpur]

Shut it down, already!

[fyatuk]

Read it again.

You'd rather Parker for the forseeable future, than Kidd for the next two postseasons and the ability to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.


I didn't realize "Parker" and "Kidd" were verbs. What exactly are those acts? :spin

And yes, I'd much rather have Parker than Kidd, and Kidd would not allow a max signing when he came off the books anyway.

Salary cap would be somewhere around 59-60 million it looks like. Spurs would have 40 million occupied by 5 players They only have 8 players under contract next year also, so they have to sign 5 players, most likely at about 2-3 million per average, so there goes 10-15 million of that unless they are 1 year deals, which isn't likely. That gives you a salary of 0f 50-55 million for 10 players, needing to sign 3 more players on 5 million.

Not even close to max capable, considering max salary will be something like 20 mil.

Also, replace Parker with Kidd makes next years salary 63 mil with only 8 players signed, and that doesn't include Splitter and whatever backups they might want. Remember, they have to have 13 players under contract, and the luxury tax will be about 70 mil at most.

That's not even getting to how Parker's game fits in much better with the Spurs system as it is currently set up.

[ducks]

this thread should be locked for stupidity
this was discussed to death already
tp finals mvp jason kidd no finals mvp

[vander]

Remember when Jason Kidd won that finals MVP? man he was something else, Parker's best days are probably behind him anyways, so I wouldn't mind trading him for someone who is younger, cheaper, has a better jumper, and more championship experience like Kidd.

[genomefreak13]

No... Kidd for parker doesn't work for me. Kidd is a gamble... I don't like to to gamble on the spurs' chances. Parker provides speed and chemistry to the spurs - i wound not change that just to accommodate kidd (and his effort to get of NJ)

Kidd maybe a a walking triple double but his numbers never brought championships to any team he's on. Parker on the other hand did it three times. So the "if it's not broken don't fix" it policy still stick.

If you want a real change to happen, bring back Mahinmi into the rotation. We could use another big man.

[703 Spurz]

Spurs receive
Jason Kidd

Nets receive
Tony Parker
Brent Barry
Francisco Elson



link (http://www.realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=4509335)

Since clearly the Spurs have fallen behind in the Western Conference 'trade for the oldest former franchise player' wars and Ghost is wigging out, the Spurs must make this trade. This would give the Spurs a lot of short run pub. Plus a Frenchman can never be a true "balla".

Worst trade ever practically. Parker is too young to trade for a 35 yr old albino. No thanks

[colargol]

This thread is not the worst ever seen.....

Trade T.Parker+Elson+ Barry for J.Kidd AND Manu+ Udoka+ Horry for V.Carter

And Holt's Cat said " Post the worst topic in the world or i'll eat your soul....."
And i post the first thing that came to my head, just so happened to be, the Worst post in the World it was the Worst post in the World

This is not the worst post in the world, no, this is just a Tribute.....

[ATX Spur]

I can't wait for the Trade Deadline to pass so I won't have to be subjected to the braindead morons going off the deep end in this thread. Please let it come soon!

[m33p0]

I can't wait for the Trade Deadline to pass so I won't have to be subjected to the braindead morons going off the deep end in this thread. Please let it come soon!
:tu

[Ghost Writer]

The difference now is that you could get a very capable Kidd for the next two postseasons and be able to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

That's not tempting to anyone as Duncan approaches his mid-30s?


Question.

[kace]

stupid thread, downgrading this forum. too bad.

[Holt's Cat]

I guess I'll have to spell it out in bright shiny colors with pictures next time.

[Ghost Writer]

The difference now is that you could get a very capable Kidd for the next two postseasons and be able to sign a max free agent as early as 2009.

That's not tempting to anyone as Duncan approaches his mid-30s?


Question.
The fact that you homers prefer to count on getting #1 picks in the draft is unsettling.

Is your idea of retirement planning scratch-off tickets?

[ss1986v2]

The fact that you homers prefer to count on getting #1 picks in the draft is unsettling.

Is your idea of retirement planning scratch-off tickets?
*yawn*

your posts are beginning to reach "sequ" levels of predictability and boredom...

[Ghost Writer]

Answer the question.

Front office can't sign anyone good.

Can't/won't trade for anyone good.

Tank a season and pray we get lucky?

Look at the Celtics. They've only gotten "back" after years of mediocrity and trading their future for a shot now.

If you are unwilling to trade for talent, what's the plan to stay good as Duncan approaches his mid-30s?

Please don't say "build around Parker."

[Holt's Cat]

They haven't needed to trade or sign a player who can be a top 3 player on their team because...they already have their top 3 players.

Look at the Celtics, they've made a ton of moves, have had a superstar named Paul Pierce on their team for a decade and haven't won a title in that period.

Why are the Celtics a model for the Spurs to look to?

[Ghost Writer]

The Celtics have not been good, because they did not get Duncan.

Credit the Celtics for doing everything in their power to become a serious contender again.

Imagine if the Spurs had to build around Pierce.

We can't make trades.

We send away our draft picks.

We can't get stars to play here even with max money.

Right?

[Holt's Cat]

The Celtics have not been good, because they did not get Duncan.

Credit the Celtics for doing everything in their power to become a serious contender again.

Imagine if the Spurs had to build around Pierce.

We can't make trades.

We send away our draft picks.

We can't get stars to play here even with max money.

Right?


So the Spurs got Duncan and put a championship level supporting cast around him. Problem solved.

[Brodels]

I'm still curious to see this list of nine point guards that are supposedly better than Parker.

Is Stephon Marbury on the list? Chris Whitney?

[Holt's Cat]

I'm still curious to see this list of nine point guards that are supposedly better than Parker.

Is Stephon Marbury on the list? Chris Whitney?


Let's help the 'tard out with the top 3...

1. Jason Kidd
2. Gary Payton
3. Chris Whitney

[exstatic]

Let's help the 'tard out with the top 3...

1. Jason Kidd
2. Gary Payton
3. Chris Whitney
Is Gary Payton still alive, and if so, doesn't he violate the 'over 30' role of Casper's?

Question.

[Holt's Cat]

Is Gary Payton still alive, and if so, doesn't he violate the 'over 30' role of Casper's?

Question.


But he's a superstar because he's Gary Payton and Gary Payton is a superstar. Besides, he's African-American and sometimes glib.

[Ghost Writer]

I'm still curious to see this list of nine point guards that are supposedly better than Parker.

Is Stephon Marbury on the list? Chris Whitney?
Marbury and Whitney were killing Parker statistically at the time you homers were felating Parker. I never said either was a better player.

All 12 of these PGs are having statistically better seasons than Parker and I am going by season averages (relax with the Parker's been injured rhetoric):

Chris Paul
Baron Davis
Chauncey Billups
Allen Iverson
Steve Nash
Dwayne Wade
Deron Williams
Jason Kidd
Jose Calderon
Mo Williams
Monta Ellis
Brandon Roy

Food for thought.

I said Parker is somewhere in the top ten.

[Ghost Writer]

Is Gary Payton still alive, and if so, doesn't he violate the 'over 30' role of Casper's?

Question.
2002 called and wants its take back.

Make fun of me now for wanting the Spurs to get some help for scraps, sort've like the Bibby trade that was just made.

[Holt's Cat]

Marbury and Whitney were killing Parker statistically at the time you homers were felating Parker. I never said either was a better player.

All 12 of these PGs are having statistically better seasons than Parker and I am going by season averages (relax with the Parker's been injured rhetoric):

Chris Paul
Baron Davis
Chauncey Billups
Allen Iverson
Steve Nash
Dwayne Wade
Deron Williams
Jason Kidd
Jose Calderon
Mo Williams
Monta Ellis
Brandon Roy

Food for thought.

I said Parker is somewhere in the top ten.


rofl

[Holt's Cat]

2002 called and wants its take back.

Make fun of me now for wanting the Spurs to get some help for scraps, sort've like the Bibby trade that was just made.


You mean, get some help that are scraps...

[ChumpDumper]

Build around Stromile.

[Ghost Writer]

Hardee-har-har, guys.

So if I get this right, you all are in favor of doing exactly [I]nothing[?i] to imporve the team.

Stay pat, let the team get older, and pray for a good free agent signing in the future.

But I thought you don't trust the front office to bring anyone god in via free agency?

[Holt's Cat]

Parker is not worse than most of those guys.

Also, not sure how Monta Ellis (http://www.nba.com/playerfile/monta_ellis/index.html) has had a better year stats wise than Tony Parker (http://www.nba.com/playerfile/tony_parker/index.html). That's the first player I bothered to check Ghost's assertion with.

[ChumpDumper]

I'm fine with making a good trade, but so what?

[Holt's Cat]

Hardee-har-har, guys.

So if I get this right, you all are in favor of doing exactly [I]nothing[?i] to imporve the team.

Stay pat, let the team get older

Your solution is to move their youngest star.




, and pray for a good free agent signing in the future.

But I thought you don't trust the front office to bring anyone god in via free agency?

You want the Spurs to enter the free agent market earlier in a less attractive year.

[Holt's Cat]

Calderon (http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jose_calderon/index.html) is averaging 7 points less a night and giving up TP for him would be dumb.

[Ghost Writer]

Look at percentages, 3s made, rebounds, steals, assists.

Trust me, the 12 I listed are are aggregately better.

Scoring average isn't the only criteria Holt's Cat.





The point is that Parker is not a franchise player, but in your trade proposal, you can get a dutiful replacement in Kidd for 2 years and then bring in a bonafide stud in 2009 0r 2010.

[Holt's Cat]

Look at percentages, 3s made, rebounds, steals, assists.

Trust me, the 12 I listed are are aggregately better.


:lol Not really. Well, perhaps all 12 combined...:lol




Scoring average isn't the only criteria Holt's Cat.

Parker averages more points and assists per game than Ellis, first off. What's more important for a scoring point guard? I'm not going to bother looking at the stats of the rest after that. In any event there's maybe 2 other players you can argue for Parker when you look at their age and what they've accomplished in the league.





The point is that Parker is not a franchise player, but in your trade proposal, you can get a dutiful replacement in Kidd for 2 years and then bring in a bonafide stud in 2009 0r 2010.

:lol

What franchise player are the Spurs supposed to land in 2009 via free agency? The Spurs couldn't land a franchise player via free agency in 2003 despite offering a 27 year old Tim Duncan to play with for the next 7 seasons and max money. Of course, you do realize that when trying to land another team's max free agent the player's own team holds a significant advantage with the amount of guaranteed $ they can offer, no?

You are simply incapable of ascertaining the fact that Parker is that "bonafide stud".

[Ghost Writer]

6-1 without Parker and journeyman D. Stoudamire on the Spurs

Yeah, Parker is indispensible.

[Holt's Cat]

Great. When are we moving him for LeBron?

[Ghost Writer]

Parker gets his because other teams are more concerned about Duncan and Manu.

6 wins
1 loss

7-2 overall without Parker

Yet this is who you want to build the franchise around.

[Holt's Cat]

Last night they would have been dropped had they not been playing a cellar team from the East. But since they fucked around and found a way to beat the Bobcats the Spurs need to trade their 25 year old rising star point guard just so they can make a big trade and make some gimp happy.

[Ghost Writer]

7-2

I thought the Spurs held the 'Cats to 65 points.

I must've seen a different game.

7-2

[Extra Stout]

2003 called. It wants its thread back.

[Holt's Cat]

7-2

I thought the Spurs held the 'Cats to 65 points.

I must've seen a different game.

7-2


Well, as long as the Spurs are playing a Suns team without Shaq and the Wizards with nobody and the Knicks, Bobcats, and Pacers they can win in the postseason without Parker. But lookout for those Celtics without Garnett or those mighty Sonics.

[Ghost Writer]

2003 called. It wants its thread back.
Parameters are different 5 years later if you bothered to read.

[Holt's Cat]

Parameters are different 5 years later if you bothered to read.

Yeah, the Spurs won 3 titles during that time doing exactly the opposite of what you argued for.

[Ghost Writer]

Should've been more.

Definitely could've been more.



P.S.

You were the biggest advocate for Kidd in 2003, while I smartly lobbied for Brand.

[Holt's Cat]

They tried Brand too. He wouldn't come to SA because it was a small market.

Should've been more? Yeah, they had a shot at 5 in a row, doing precisely the opposite of what you said they should have done.

[Extra Stout]

Parameters are different 5 years later if you bothered to read.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


The Spurs are wasting Tim Duncan's prime by not making bold, risky moves. Tony Parker is not a championship-caliber point guard.


The Spurs not only can a championship with Tony Parker, they can knock on the door of a dynasty with him.


The Spurs are wasting Tim Duncan's prime by not making bold, risky moves. Tony Parker is not a championship-caliber point guard.

My theory is that somehow Ghost Writer was accelerated very close to the speed of light, such that what we perceive to be five years to him has been two weeks.

[smeagol]

Should've been more.

Definitely could've been more.

This confirms you are fucked in the head.

[Ghost Writer]

They tried Brand too. He wouldn't come to SA because it was a small market.

Should've been more? Yeah, they had a shot at 5 in a row, doing precisely the opposite of what you said they should have done.
What would I have done besides trade for talent?

[ElNono]

My theory is that somehow Ghost Writer was accelerated very close to the speed of light, such that what we perceive to be five years to him has been two weeks.

He's still in the island...

[Ghost Writer]

ElNono translated from Hispanic means "The Void."

[misterx91578]

ok let's trade because they can never go wrong :rolleyes

[Ghost Writer]

ok let's trade because they can never go wrong :rolleyes
Wow.

You're brave.