KVH Needs "Quiet Time" To Think About Trade

[ludda]

http://blog.nj.com/netsblast/2008/02/play_ball_or_hardball_falk_spe.html

Just got off the phone with David Falk, who as everyone knows, is the uberagent that represents Keith Van Horn.

And if you think all this is a fait accompli, hold on to your hat.

"I can't tell you his intentions, because I told Keith and both owners that this thing has been so tortured, it's best for everyone to just chill out and find out what the league has to say," Falk said.

Nice image, that. David Falk, calming voice of tranquility.

Actually, Falk already knows that the league will probably (likely) tell him that Van Horn has to report to the Nets for one month in order for this deal to be kosher.

"I understand," he said. "But in my history with the league since 1974, I can't remember a trade that has created more drama than this one - from Jerry (Stackhouse) being waived and going back, and a player worried about his Bird rights.

"I told everyone when Van Horn was mentioned in the trade that my strong advice is, 'If you want to do something, you better do it quietly.' And if this has a chance to happen, step back and let some time pass or it would probably ruin the trade."




Odd thing to say, we thought. Falk might be a bloody genius when it comes to doing NBA business, but there's not much he does quietly.

Unless, of course, his client absolutely insists he wants it that way.

And suddenly, that seems to be the important factor in this trade: Keith either has cold feet, or feels that a $2M payday for taking a physical is shameless and needs time to think it through, or he just doesn't want any part of it.

Falk won't say which is closest to the truth.

"I really can't say," the agent said. "He wants some quiet time to reflect on it. And that's what he should be doing.

"He'll make a decision, but it's not going to be 'maybe,' or 70-30. Either he'll do it or he won't do it. And we'll all know in the next 48 to 72 hours."

Not a hint, a high-sign, an indication either way?

"No. I can't indicate either way," Falk said.

Family issue? Are the teams asking too much for Keith to take an unexpected separation from his wife and kids for a month?

"Let's say this," Falk concluded. "Keith is a guy of high integrity, and he has a great relationship with Mark Cuban and Rod Thorn, and he would like to help them both. But he's engaged in some other things, and he has a lot of responsibilities. Now he just has to see if it's workable before he decides what to do. And right now, I don't know what he's going to do."

:lol :lol :lol :lol

[monosylab1k]

he needs to think over flying to New Jersey for a day and collecting 4 million bucks? What a stupid dick.

[mavsfan1000]

KVH putting the screws to Kidd. Revenge time for when Kidd forced KVH out of New Jersey.

[ludda]

Other article said league probably will require him to "play" for the Nets for a month.

All the same, what a fucking drama.

[monosylab1k]

Other article said league probably will require him to "play" for the Nets for a month.
that's a bullshit move, they didn't force McKie to do that, and he was working for ANOTHER TEAM when he got traded.

[sribb43]

of course Falk wants him to do it so that he cn get paid his portion of the deal

[Shank]

Oh, fuck it all in the fucking ass.

[ludda]

Honestly, sounds to me like they're just waiting for the league's decision on how long KVH would have to play, etc etc before KVH makes a decision. And they weren't looking at it today since everyone was still drunk from all stars.

If this is another snag and deal-breaker, this may come a close second to the Mavs loss to the Warriors last season as one of the biggest Mavs farce in history.

[monosylab1k]

How the fuck can Fuehrer Stern pull this bullshit when the Lakers JUST DID THIS with McKie? and he was already employed BY ANOTHER TEAM?

Oh yeah, they're the Lakers.

This league is losing more credibility by the day.

[mavsfan1000]

Gotta love Stern.

[Shank]

Falk already knows what his client is going to do. He's just waiting to hear the word from the NBA as to what his guy is going to have to do.

Tuesday is the day when the Mavs either move on and pull this off or get fucked by Stern and Keith Van Horn.

Great. I can't wait.

[monosylab1k]

Gotta love Stern.
eat shit. this involves more than just the Mavs getting Kidd now. Now it's a concern with the credibility of the league and the fact that, if KVH is forced to be there for a month, an OBVIOUS double standard has just been put on display.

[mavsfan1000]

eat shit. this involves more than just the Mavs getting Kidd now. Now it's a concern with the credibility of the league and the fact that, if KVH is forced to be there for a month, an OBVIOUS double standard has just been put on display.
Which is why I said "gotta love Stern". Though I hate Stern, I still believe the Mavs are better off with Harris and Diop than Kidd and small ball. I do agree that what Stern is doing is wrong though.

[monosylab1k]

anybody who is truly a fan of the NBA should be up in arms over this. This isn't a Mavs issue, this is a league credibility issue. If this bullshit goes down, it's pretty easy to see that the league is playing favorites.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

anybody who is truly a fan of the NBA should be up in arms over this. This isn't a Mavs issue, this is a league credibility issue. If this bullshit goes down, it's pretty easy to see that the league is playing favorites.

It's a complete joke.

[baseline bum]

To me, this sounds like Keith Van Horn trying to squeeze extra money out of the deal, knowing both sides desperately want it and that it has zero chance of happening without him. :lmao

[ludda]

Dude calm down, its just speculation. The league won't review this shit until tommorrow.

[Shank]

League sources saying KVH would have to hang there for at least a month.

$2million+ for 30 days of work (if you want to call it that)?? I don't care how much money you already have - just fucking do it.

[picnroll]

Don't tell me that Cuban didn't clear this with Van Horn before they announced it was a deal that was good to go. :lol

If this thing falls through now the Mavs won't have enough chemistry to make the D league playoffs.

[lurker]

Reflect your way on out of this mess, Keith.

[baseline bum]

League sources saying KVH would have to hang there for at least a month.

$2million+ for 30 days of work (if you want to call it that)?? I don't care how much money you already have - just fucking do it.

I honestly can't see that being enforced. Aaron McKie isn't sitting on the bench in Memphis, is he? It's just Falk acting like it would be to get KVH the maximum possible while still allowing this trade to go through.

[picnroll]

Hold out for a max deal Keith.

[Shank]

Don't tell me that Cuban didn't clear this with Van Horn before they announced it was a deal that was good to go. :lol

If this thing falls through now the Mavs won't have enough chemistry to make the D league playoffs.

I think they learned their lesson from the Dick Breath situation and ok'd this (both sides) before he was added into the trade. He'll report. If we find out that Cuban and Thorn didn't talk to KVH on this - then fuck them both. The NBA should fold up both franchises and allow the players to be drafted by the 28 other teams.

There was some reason why KVH didn't file his retirement papers when he had the chance - it was because he wanted to leave the door open to return. Well, what better door than one that pays you to do jack shit for a month? Not sure what his agent is doing by saying all this. Posturing for what?

[baseline bum]

I can't wait for the "Van Horn fails physical" thread next week. :lol

[Shank]

I honestly can't see that being enforced. Aaron McKie isn't sitting on the bench in Memphis, is he? It's just Falk acting like it would be to get KVH the maximum possible while still allowing this trade to go through.

McKie is sitting there, going through practices and riding the pine at the games. They've adopted him as a sort of "player coach". Weird, I know.

[san antonio spurs]

is playing in the NBA takes out any money value?
He wants to think about collecting millions' dollars for only a month?
This is frustrating for me and I hate the mavs

[monosylab1k]

McKie is sitting there, going through practices and riding the pine at the games. They've adopted him as a sort of "player coach". Weird, I know.
If he's at least going through the motions, then I'm fine with it. If he isn't even suiting up, then there's a problem.

[baseline bum]

Shit, I guess he'll have to be door greeter at Meadowlands for a month. Maybe he wants twice the salary since it'll be 30x the work.

[baseline bum]

If he's at least going through the motions, then I'm fine with it. If he isn't even suiting up, then there's a problem.

He's on the injured list I'm sure, which is where Van Horn will be. The league can't force New Jersey to dress him.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

So, all KVH has to do is report and sit on the bench? The NBA is so fucking stupid sometimes. Doing that doesn't make the trade any more legitimate.

Allow the trades this year and change the rule starting next season.

[baseline bum]

So, all KVH has to do is report and sit on the bench? The NBA is so fucking stupid sometimes. Doing that doesn't make the trade any more legitimate.

Allow the trades this year and change the rule starting next season.

Pretty hard to change that rule. When Van Horn left, it sounded like he was seriously thinking of coming back in a year. You can't not allow players to take time off while retaining their Bird Rights.

[monosylab1k]

So, all KVH has to do is report and sit on the bench? The NBA is so fucking stupid sometimes. Doing that doesn't make the trade any more legitimate.

Allow the trades this year and change the rule starting next season.
agreed. alot of these BS loopholes do need to be closed up.

my problem is just if the league isn't forcing the Grizzlies to do anything with McKie, but then turn around and impose rules on Van Horn & the Nets.

if McKie's being forced to go through the motions the same as Van Horn will, then at least there's consistency in that.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Pretty hard to change that rule. When Van Horn left, it sounded like he was seriously thinking of coming back in a year. You can't not allow players to take time off while retaining their Bird Rights.


Something can be done. IIRC, Indiana could still, conceivably, trade Rik Smits. That's a little much, no?

[LakeShow]

Sounds like they want him to be there the whole season.

Kidd trade on hold another day
Van Horn's involvement latest hurdle in blockbuster
Posted: Monday February 18, 2008 4:38PM; Updated: Monday February 18, 2008 6:17PM
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Former Mavericks forward Keith Van Horn hasn't played since the 2006 playoffs.
Former Mavericks forward Keith Van Horn hasn't played since the 2006 playoffs.
AP

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By Chris Mannix, SI.com

The long-anticipated trade of Jason Kidd to the Dallas Mavericks will have to wait at least one more day.

The delay in getting NBA approval for the trade involves the inclusion of the semi-retired Keith Van Horn, according to league sources.

Van Horn has yet to sign off on certain stipluations laid out by the NBA that he must honor once he signs his contract, the sources said. Those conditions are believed to be that Van Horn, who has not played since the 2006 NBA Finals, must take a physical in New Jersey and maintain some kind of presence with the Nets for the rest of the season.

Dallas still owns Van Horn's rights -- the 32-year-old has not filed retirement papers with the league -- so his involvement in the trade is essentially to make the salary numbers work. He'd be signed then traded -- and, like Kidd, he'd be heading back to his original team.

After intial attempts to finalize a deal for Kidd collapsed last week, the Mavericks and Nets agreed to a revised deal Sunday night, with Van Horn and Trenton Hassell replacing Jerry Stackhouse and Devean George from the original proposal. New Jersey also would receive Devin Harris, DeSagana Diop, Maurice Ager, two first-round picks and $3 million.

"There's been a lot of talk that the deal is close to being done,'' Kidd said after helping the Eastern Conference win the All-Star Game on Sunday night. "I've heard that before. [When] I get a call from Rod [Thorn, the Nets' president] or [Mavericks owner Mark] Cuban, then it will be official.''

The Nets thought they had worked out a deal with the Mavericks last Wednesday, but George exercised his right to block the trade.

However, the deal may have been in trouble before that. Earlier that day, Stackhouse told The Associated Press that he may be able to rejoin the Mavs, an indication the Nets planned to buy out his contract.

"I get 30 days to rest, then I'll be right back," Stackhouse said. "I ain't going nowhere."

Thorn said Friday that he had no side deal Stackhouse, an illegal arrangement that could have put the trade in jeopardy.

"I'm perfectly willing to take Stackhouse on my team. You can't make deals like that," Thorn said. "Those are illegal. You can't do that. I'm not going to do it."

The Associated Press contributed to this report

[monosylab1k]

Van Horn has yet to sign off on certain stipluations laid out by the NBA that he must honor once he signs his contract, the sources said. Those conditions are believed to be that Van Horn, who has not played since the 2006 NBA Finals, must take a physical in New Jersey and maintain some kind of presence with the Nets for the rest of the season.

If these same rules apply to Aaron McKie, then no problem.

If these same rules weren't put in place with him, that's a HUGE problem.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I'm just waiting for Rick Mahorn to be included in a trade by the 76ers. Maybe they can get John Salley from the Lakers.

[picnroll]

I'm just waiting for Rick Mahorn to be included in a trade by the 76ers. Maybe they can get John Salley from the Lakers.
Sorry, Lakers will only trade Sally for Billups.

[baseline bum]

Something can be done. IIRC, Indiana could still, conceivably, trade Rik Smits. That's a little much, no?

Losing Bird Rights is an incredibly stiff price to pay for someone who's not a minimum player. If the league decides to end that loophole, what happens for someone like Varejao who was holding out on his contract and thus not signed? What if he held out for more than a year? You could say a "retired" player cannot be traded after signing, but then that means the Cavs couldn't do a sign and trade with Varejao assuming they've realized he won't come back. So now Varejao can't get a fair market value deal with another team, unless they have significant capspace. There is no way the Player's Association would ever allow Stern to get rid of the ability of players to keep Bird Rights while not on an NBA roster.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

The Pistons will throw in Danny Manning if the Lakers throw in Ron Harper.

Do it, Joe!

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

Losing Bird Rights is an incredibly stiff price to pay for someone who's not a minimum player. If the league decides to end that loophole, what happens for someone like Varejao who was holding out on his contract and thus not signed? What if he held out for more than a year? You could say a "retired" player cannot be traded after signing, but then that means the Cavs couldn't do a sign and trade with Varejao assuming they've realized he won't come back. So now Varejao can't get a fair market value deal with another team, unless they have significant capspace. There is no way the Player's Association would ever allow Stern to get rid of the ability of players to keep Bird Rights while not on an NBA roster.

I'd assume they can cap it, say 3 years.

And if they can't change the rule, stop adding stipulations to these trades. These teams are doing nothing illegal under the CBA.

[nkdlunch]

:lmao at Dallas

[Spurminator]

Fuck, why do they need Keith Van Horn? I'll take $4 million to sit on the bench... I'll even practice with the team.

[baseline bum]

I'd assume they can cap it, say 3 years.

And if they can't change the rule, stop adding stipulations to these trades. These teams are doing nothing illegal under the CBA.

It's not hard to imagine a team in Europe throwing a 3 or 4 year deal at a guy who is unsatisfied with his NBA team's offer, and then we're right back at the exact same problem as before once that deal is up.

[ludda]

Before mavs fans commit suicide, ESPN also reported that their league "sources" said that Stackhouse would be forbidden to go back to the Mavs and Stern cleared that shit up.

Calm down, either by Tues or Wed, Jason Dinosaur Kidd will a mav. Unless KVH really says no and then both the Mavs and Nets should just disband their teams and give up as complete failures.

[baseline bum]

Fuck, why do they need Keith Van Horn? I'll take $4 million to sit on the bench... I'll even practice with the team.

I don't think the Mavs have the MLE left to accommodate you (I think they used part on Eddie Jones; not sure about the rest).

[stretch]

If these same rules apply to Aaron McKie, then no problem.

If these same rules weren't put in place with him, that's a HUGE problem.
I love how that fucking moron (who is a Rockets fan) always tries to shit on the Mavs or suck Kobe's cock but the second anyone calls his shit out, he either doesn't respond, or makes up the most bullshit filled arguments I've seen.

[Findog]

Before mavs fans commit suicide, ESPN also reported that their league "sources" said that Stackhouse would be forbidden to go back to the Mavs and Stern cleared that shit up.

Calm down, either by Tues or Wed, Jason Dinosaur Kidd will a mav. Unless KVH really says no and then both the Mavs and Nets should just disband their teams and give up as complete failures.


Cuban was quoted on Saturday as saying that for KVH to be included in the deal, he had to report and be willing to play, he couldn't just sit at home and collect checks. Then on Sunday the news broke that the trade was back on with KVH in it. After EVERYTHING that has transpired, I cannot imagine that it was not made clear to KVH that his participation hinged on his willingness to physically report.

It sounds to me like the league is making it clear just how much KVH has to do and he wants to name his price for doing it. He's made a ton of money in his career so he's probably not hurting for $4 million in cash, but at the same time, there is such a thing as making it worth your while. I"m pretty sure that this trade is going through but as a Mavs fan, I cannot stress enough how fucking irritating this whole situation has been.

Like everyone else said, if after the George and Stackhouse FUBARS, if they didn't get all their ducks in a row with KVH, then they have no one but themselves to blame for the mess they're in. A lot of erroneous information has already been put out there already, such as Stack being forbidden to return to Dallas in the event of the trade, and I don't know what to make of Falk's comments. One way or the other I'm sure this trade is going to go down, they long since went past the point of no return, but it might not be until the Thursday deadline, and Kidd might not be a Mav by the tipoff on Wednesday night against NOLA.

I might just have to boycott the Internet until Thursday instead of refreshing shit ad infinitum.

[Evan]

It's a complete joke.

Why is it a complete joke?

[ChumpDumper]

This gets funnier every day.

[Shank]

This gets funnier every day.

Like cancer!

[Findog]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3250819

I just watched that Bob Ley interview with Chris Mannix, and he said the KVH thing isn't going to be a big deal, FWIW...

[loveforthegame]

http://www.nj.com/nets/

Done Deal

by Dave D.
Monday February 18, 2008, 9:34 PM

This time, they're not kidding.

One hour after Rod Thorn groused over the way everybody had jumped to conclusions about the deal died a dozen deaths, he sent word to a team VP last night that the trade "appears to be a go."

The final hurdle was cleared at roughly 9 PM, when Keith Van Horn consented to sign a $4 million contract that makes the trade work financially and report to New Jersey for what is estimated to be 30 days of work.

The Nets will send Jason Kidd and Malik Allen to the Mavericks for Devin Harris, DeSagana Diop, Maurice Ager, Trenton Hassell and Van Horn.

In a separate deal, the Nets will dispatch Antoine Wright to Dallas for a $1.6 million trade exception to create the necessary roster spot for Van Horn.

Until late last night, the teams were considering giving Van Horn a deadline, and both were still concerned that the league was going to create some difficulties about the semi-retired player's obligations.

"If you talk to either side, they'll give you a lecture on the new CBA (Collective Bargaining Agreement)," said one agent, who has a player in the deal but could not be identified out of fear he could affect it.

"The league was looking at loopholes. Dallas felt that because Rod has so much respect with the NBA, he'll get the lowdown of how to make the bare-minimum necessities work without this being on hold.

"It's a daunting task to get a deal like this done, there's so many other things going on. It's a lot to rewrite the constitution in five minutes, but that's what they're really doing."

The league's foremost legal expert, Joel Litvin, put it this way Saturday night: "We have some black and white rules, and we love those rules, but there are a lot of areas involving circumvention where (you examine whether) they are engaged in a transaction that is meant to circumvent the intent of the parties."

The Nets could sympathize. Thorn himself sounded fed up with with the whole convoluted process yesterday, barely leaving the door open to some closure.

"Anything's possible," he said, when asked whether the deal could be passed along to the league office today. "But from where I'm sitting right now, I don't see it.

"We are nowhere right now. We have no deal, so we are nowhere."

Now, apparently, they're somewhere.

Shortly before Thorn climbed aboard his flight from Atlanta, Van Horn signed off -- or so he was told -- on what was believed to be a laundry list of league requirements - when he must report, how long he must stay with the team, and perhaps how often he must participate in practices.

[Spawn]

So the damn thing is finally done? God I hope so because even though all of this was kind of humerous and entertaing at first, all of this drama now is just really getting a little gay.

[Bruno]

S&T a player just to match salaries is using a loophole of the CBA to circumvent the cap.
Making new rules like a player can only by S&T during the summer when he became a FA and S&T must have at least 2 full years guaranteed, will solve this trouble.

Right now, it doesn't break written rules but it's against the spirit of the CBA. I find logical to see the league being careful with that kind of arrangement. I find logical to see them looking more at KVH whose salary will be $4M than at players like Mckie whose salary is below $1M.

[m33p0]

hohohohohhoohhohahahahahahahohaohaohaohahahaohohao ahoho
:lmao :lmao :lmao