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View Full Version : RealGM: Just A Reminder: Manu Ginobili Isn't An All-Star



jmard5
02-19-2008, 02:13 AM
http://spurs.realgm.com/articles/68/20080218/just_a_reminder_manu_ginobili_isn
Authored by Elliot Cole - February 18, 2008 - 1:37 pm

It’s easy to leave a guy like Manu Ginobili off of the All-Star team. He doesn't have a big media presence, he is notorious for flopping and in the collective public opinion of the San Antonio Spurs he’s buried somewhere underneath Tony Parker, Tim Duncan, and Eva Longoria (not literally, shame on you).

It’s also easy to say that Ginobili’s best years are behind him, or that the Spurs are struggling this year and don’t deserve a second All-Star. But then you take a look at the numbers and a paradigm shift the size of Manu’s nose smacks you in the face.

Ginobili is averaging 20.1 points a game, nothing to sneer at but modest for an All-Star shooting guard. But he also plays fewer minutes (31.1 per a game) than anyone selected for New Orleans, mostly because Popovich and the Spurs’ brass want to keep him fresh for the playoffs.

Take into account his budgeted minutes, now spread out his scoring over a full game. Over the course of 48 minutes, Ginobili averages 31.2 points a game. That’s 5th in the league. Ahead of Dwyane Wade. Ahead of Western Conference starter Allen Iverson. Ahead of Nowitzki, Yao, Boozer and Roy.

Ok, so he’s a better scorer than everyone thought, especially considering that he already has two other All-Star caliber talents on his team. But the thing about Ginobili is that he does everything. Need a rebound? Manu snags an impressive 5 a game from the guard position, including a 15 board night against Toronto (per 48 his average tops Kobe and Roy). Steals? Ninth in the NBA at 2.66 over 48 minutes. Playmaking? He’s 28th in the league in assists per 48 at 7.1, a career high. And get this: only 3 non-point guards are ahead of him (Roy, Wade, and Lebron).

Think about that.. outside of the NBA’s point guards, he’s the 4th best assist guy in the league. While we’re at it that once again puts him ahead of Kobe, who has gotten buckets of media love for passing the ball more this season.

Need shooting? Ginobili is 22nd in the league in 3-point shooting. But few players mesh outside shooting with Ginobili’s ability to get to the stripe. Per 48, only 11 players get to the line more than Manu, and he doesn’t even have the long hair to draw fouls for him anymore.

Of course, Manu’s never been a numbers guy. He’s all about intangibles, up there with Kobe as one of the most competitive players in the modern era. He shoots an amazing 53% in “the clutch”, not to mention 91.9% from the free throw line when the game is tight. Need more? He’s created 22 assists in the last 5 minutes of tight games, but he’s only committed 1 passing turnover. A 22:1 assist to turnover ratio when the defense is set and the game is tight from one of the most balls-to-the-wall players in the league.

Finally, one last stat that trumps them all. When Manu Ginobili is on the bench, the Spurs have been outscored by two points this season. When he’s in the game, the Spurs have scored 250 points more than their opponents. He doesn’t fly like LeBron or have the finesse of Kobe, nor does he have the power of Pierce or the speed of Iverson. But Ginobili is in the same league as all of them, and deserved to be in New Orleans. Then again, maybe Spurs fans want him to be a little pissed off. After all, he’s only averaged 40 points, 10 rebounds, and 7 assists a game over their last 2 wins.

---

:wakeup

smeagol
02-19-2008, 02:30 AM
Trade the guy!

- rascal

Martin R
02-19-2008, 04:38 AM
Ginobili? who?

m33p0
02-19-2008, 06:13 AM
After all, he’s only averaged 40 points, 10 rebounds, and 7 assists a game over their last 2 wins.
not an all-star, huh?
:ihit :ihit :ihit

hsxvvd
02-19-2008, 06:25 AM
Manu does not miss the All-Star game.

The All-Star game misses Manu.

m33p0
02-19-2008, 06:47 AM
Manu does not miss the All-Star game.

The All-Star game misses Manu.
True. big loss for the all star game even though you're statement is askewed chuck norris style.

anyone know how much manu has won in vegas?

manubili
02-19-2008, 06:56 AM
Also, I would like to know how many of the AS guys have three rings or more, as Manu has. Duncan 4, Kobe 3... and?

urunobili
02-19-2008, 06:56 AM
VERY good article!!

vanvannen
02-19-2008, 07:16 AM
great article. It's amazing that an argument about Manu being at the ASG can be backed in numbers, when every Spurs fan knows numbers are the less important factor of his game.
I still can't believe Brandon Freaking Roy was in Oklahoma City and Manu wasn't.

amy020
02-19-2008, 08:26 AM
I just agree with you . manu should be an all star.

1Parker1
02-19-2008, 08:34 AM
Well, the West is packed with guards. I think Brandon Roy was having a great season when the voting took place. The only guard you can argue who didn't deserve to be there was Iverson.

beirmeistr
02-19-2008, 08:42 AM
When he's in the game, the Spurs have scored 250 more points than the opponent.
Not even Ripley wouls believe that!

Radiosparks
02-19-2008, 09:03 AM
Great article!

SAGambler
02-19-2008, 10:11 AM
Only fans (in this case Spurs fans) of the team he is playing for and get to watch him night after night, can fully appreciate what Manu brings to the game.

About the only National Atention he gets, is when Barkley screams out his name on the TNT telecasts.

Other fans see him in arenas around the country, and figure, yeah this guy is pretty good, but if he was AS material, we'd hear a lot more about him in the media. Most fans would never believe that he is on a level of a Kobe Bryant. What is there to be done on a BB court that Manu doesn't do?

And yeah, the AS game missed Manu, more than Manu missed them.

The latest on his resume: The Only player in NBA history to average 22/6/6 on a 9 game road trip.

And I still think that 46 point assault in Cleveland was kind of an in-your-fucking-face performace for all those that didn't select him to go to New Orleans. Here's hoping Manu cleaned up in Las Vegas instead.

JamStone
02-19-2008, 10:30 AM
Also, I would like to know how many of the AS guys have three rings or more, as Manu has. Duncan 4, Kobe 3... and?

Devean George and Derek Fisher have 3 each ...

mathbzh
02-19-2008, 10:31 AM
It is 24/6/6

I wonder how long were the road trips in the "BIG O" days.

oligarchy
02-19-2008, 10:45 AM
Devean George and Derek Fisher have 3 each ...

I didn't know they were in the ASG. That's news. ;)

jmard5
02-19-2008, 11:06 AM
Devean George and Derek Fisher have 3 each ...

Devean George and Derek Fisher played in the all-star game?

T Park
02-19-2008, 11:09 AM
Well, the West is packed with guards. I think Brandon Roy was having a great season when the voting took place. The only guard you can argue who didn't deserve to be there was Iverson.

Uh no, AI deserved to be there.

Brandon Roy over Manu did not.

TMTTRIO
02-19-2008, 11:27 AM
Great article. Manu's plays like an All Star even if he's not one. Like Pop said Manu's been a huge reason as to why all the teams he's been on during his career have won some kind of championship. I think the thing that really killed Manu's chances are all the injuries with the Spurs and the Spurs not there as the top team. I don't care though. I'm glad he got to go to Vegas and have fun and forget about basketball for a while. Besides he would've tried to play defense in the AS game again :lol.

mathbzh
02-19-2008, 11:37 AM
I'm glad he got to go to Vegas and have fun and forget about basketball for a while.

Is the ASG basketball?

JamStone
02-19-2008, 11:57 AM
Devean George and Derek Fisher played in the all-star game?


No they didn't, but someone implying an argument that a player deserves to be in the all star game more because they have multiple championship rings is faulty.

1Parker1
02-19-2008, 12:24 PM
Uh no, AI deserved to be there.

Brandon Roy over Manu did not.


Why? Cuz AI has flashy stats? Take a look at Roy and his all around game. It's not even close.

jag
02-19-2008, 12:35 PM
So many players get snubbed every year, i'm not worried about manu not getting in...he gets recognition when it matters, like during the finals.

WalterBenitez
02-19-2008, 01:01 PM
Manu does not miss the All-Star game.
The All-Star game misses Manu.

Good reading ... BTW, Manu won't never understand how to play lazy :rolleyes

101A
02-19-2008, 01:06 PM
All of this love for the player of the big 3 who HAS NOT (yet) been a final's MVP.

Manu is playing the best ball of his career, IMO. If Parker comes back to form, and Tim is Tim. Forget about it.

phxspurfan
02-19-2008, 01:06 PM
Uh no, AI deserved to be there.

Brandon Roy over Manu did not.


I want to hear the reasoning for this...

Brandon Roy, during the first half of the season, led his team to a ridiculous streak of winning basketball. Manu did provide leadership for the Spurs, but he also got injured and didn't contribute to his team as much as Roy.

Blazers w/o roy = Lottery team / garbage
Spurs w/o Manu = 7th or 8th seed in west. About a 50 win team.

v2freak
02-19-2008, 01:38 PM
His value to the team means more than just stats.

phxspurfan
02-19-2008, 02:54 PM
His value to the team means more than just stats.


Thank you for that John Madden moment.

LilMissSPURfect
02-19-2008, 03:18 PM
Where Manu happens..............

kuato
02-19-2008, 03:26 PM
There is an easy way to know if Manu is an allstar , ask Lebron, ask Kobe, ask Dirk. Ask Nash etc, dont ask the fans.

nfg3
02-19-2008, 04:39 PM
The AS balloting is a fan based beauty contest. Manu doesn't either start or play in a major market with lots of media coverage and exposure. Most don't know who he is outside of Spurs fans and the people who cover the NBA on a regular basis. His minutes dont stack up to other players and the PER is pretty irrelevant to most. Like I said - a fan based beauty contest and I really don't think Manu cares to appeal to that. I think his drive is for rings rather than ASG appearances. But I believe he deserves to be in the ASG. Minute for minute he is one of the best players in the league, especially at crunch time. :tu

hater
02-19-2008, 04:44 PM
Spurs w/o Manu = 7th or 8th seed in west. About a 50 win team.

wrong. Manu singlehandedly won a number of games for us this season. W/out Manu we would be out of the playoffs in about 10th place!

urunobili
02-19-2008, 04:57 PM
There is an easy way to know if Manu is an allstar , ask Lebron, ask Kobe, ask Dirk. Ask Nash etc, dont ask the fans.
:tu

txstr1986
02-19-2008, 05:35 PM
Great article!

You sig is my cellphone wallpaper!

jmard5
02-19-2008, 11:10 PM
Ginobili is averaging 20.1 points a game

Manu snags an impressive 5 a game from the guard position...

outside of the NBA’s point guards, he’s the 4th best assist guy in the league...

Ginobili is 22nd in the league in 3-point shooting...

Per 48, only 11 players get to the line more than Manu...


The intangibles. Manu vs Bobcats

31 mins
Pts: 18
FG: 4/8
FT: 9/11
3PT: 1/4
Reb: 4
Ast: 3
Blk: 1

remingtonbo2001
02-20-2008, 12:06 AM
No they didn't, but someone implying an argument that a player deserves to be in the all star game more because they have multiple championship rings is faulty.

Not when it's Manu Ginobili.

When you pull down 15 boards one night, then 2 nights later go JORDAN in the 4th quarter....You become an exception to the rule.

lefty
02-20-2008, 12:08 AM
Magic
Athletic
Nofuckingway
Unique

greens
02-20-2008, 12:14 AM
Awesome article!

Manu definitely deserved to be in the All Star this year...averaging career highs in basically everything...

vangao
02-20-2008, 12:21 AM
Hi all, I just signed in to leave some stuff, I think that this is the best way to prove to everyone that Manu is an all-star, but if you think about it, they have reason to do it (business). Here is an article that is pretty good about Manu. Cheers.

http://nyismecca.blogspot.com/2007/12/arrogance-and-ignorance.html

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics?sort=per&qual=true&pos=sg&seasonType=2&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnba %2fhollinger%2fstatistics%3fsort%3dper%26qual%3dtr ue%26pos%3dsg%26seasonType%3d2

greens
02-20-2008, 01:45 AM
tranti2007 posted this video of Manu at the 2005 All Stars Game at the manu forum:

Just the Manu highlights/mentions:
http://mx.youtube.com/watch?v=KBS1JnkSO_w

genomefreak13
02-20-2008, 02:17 AM
great article. It's amazing that an argument about Manu being at the ASG can be backed in numbers, when every Spurs fan knows numbers are the less important factor of his game.
I still can't believe Brandon Freaking Roy was in Oklahoma City and Manu wasn't.
:toast

hsxvvd
02-20-2008, 02:47 AM
Brandon Roy & Portland had a huge marketing campaign to get Roy to the All-Star game. The released an I-Roy!

http://ballhype.com/video/portland_s_iroy/

Somehow, I just don't think an I-Manu is the Spurs style.

roycrikside
02-20-2008, 05:50 AM
Let the other guys have their February showcase. Manu gets plenty of time under the national spotlight in May and June. The Finals are the real All-Star game.