Is anyone passionately FOR Hillary Clinton?

[CosmicCowboy]

OK, I admit that I am a middle of the road Republican/Independent ( I never agree 100% with the Republican platform especially on divisive issues like abortion rights) and tend to socialize/work with folk that share similar beliefs but virtually everyone I know DESPISES Hillary Clinton.

I keep reading that Texans love Hillary, especially Hispanics, and that Texas is where Hillary is going to make her big comeback.

There is a huge cross section of folks in here that share a love of basketball but are very politically diverse...

Who in here is passionately FOR Hillary Clinton and why?

[johnsmith]

I too have wondered this.

Who the fuck are these people voting for that lagoon creature?

[Mister Sinister]

I've never thought of Hillary as a lagoon creature. Just a woman with a penis.

[monosylab1k]

I don't think it's so much that Texans love Hilary, just that they aren't too fond of a black guy being president.

[Spurminator]

I'm with you. Hillary Clinton is like the Nickleback of politics. She gets a lot of play, but I don't know anyone who likes her.

And I work in advertising, which is full of liberals.

[Heath Ledger]

Hillary needs to get back into the kitchen where she belongs. I heard she can cook a mean taco.

[samikeyp]

Hillary needs to get back into the kitchen where she belongs. I heard she can cook a mean taco.


Supposedly, she can lick a mean taco too.

Allegedly.

:smokin

[Fat Bones]

I like her laugh...it gives me goosebumps.

[CosmicCowboy]

I like her laugh...it gives me goosebumps.

:lmao

Her laugh gives me Wizard of Oz flashbacks...

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/images/wizardofzwitchmelt1.JPG

[BonnerDynasty]

OIoMsqEYyUU

[florige]

One of the reason is probably for what Bill Clinton did for the minorities. I'm curious to see how much of the Hispanic vote Obama has taken from Hillary since his streak.

[Heath Ledger]

If she doesnt win Texas it's game over.

[florige]

I know this doesn't count for much, but a few weeks ago she was leading by a comfortable margin in this poll.....

http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2008/02/19/aol-straw-poll-feb-19-25/?ncid=NWS00010000000001




She had better have the debate of her life, or it's over!

[missmyzte]

I feel like I'm letting down a fellow woman but I just can't vote for her. International relations, particularly countries in the middle-east, are extremely important and I just don't see them respecting a female president given their culture. Plus, I just like Obama and hope he wins.

[Jimcs50]

Better her than some rag head Muslim for Pres.....imo

[johnsmith]

Better her than some rag head Muslim for Pres.....imo


Wow, that's a pretty big mozza ball to throw out there Jim.

[spurster]

Random points.

Clinton and Obama are nearly tied in Texas by the latest poll.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5gAv9x9X3zViluq8PWqu7aZZJ8QowD8UT0K500

I think she is admired and detested in part because she is a tough, strong woman.

The Middle East doesn't appear to have any problems with Secretary of State Rice, so why should a woman president be a issue there? [Edit: Recall Madeline Albright, too.]

I'm voting for Obama, BTW.

[florige]

I work with a few conservative Republicans who say they voted for Obama just because he would be easier to get rid of than Clinton in the general election. I thought that it would be the other way around.

[John Kerry]

Just vote for me instead, it's not too late! I'm still reporting for duty!

[Twisted_Dawg]

I've never thought of Hillary as a lagoon creature. Just a woman with a penis.

A big 9 incher at that.

[Melmart1]

I know someone passionately for Hillary ... the dumb bitch who woke me up at the crack of dawn on Monday to ask if I was aware of when the primary was and who would I be voting for.

I was an Edwards girl. Not sure who I am voting for now. But the thought of NOT voting for someone because a bunch of misogynists in the Middle East won't take her seriously makes me angry.

[CosmicCowboy]

Damn

150 views and the ONLY pro-Hillary post is:


Better her than some rag head Muslim for Pres.....imo

:lmao

Looks like she is in for a monumental ass whoopin in Texas :lol

[Evan]

She certainly stirs up the pot against her but for her, no.

I get so tired of her defenders claiming sexism when a black man is so popular.

I just don't see how you can be so against a woman but be progressive enough to want a black man in office. Her supporters simply want to guilt you into accepting her. It's desperation.

[atxrocker]

i ain't passionate about anyone in this election. i'm just less passionate about obama than hillary.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

she needs to be sent off on her socialistic-merry-ass back to arkansas or new york or whereever. i'm all for a woman to run this country, mind you, but not that scornful woman.

[peewee's lovechild]

I'm voting for Hillary on March 4th.

I don't get the whole Barak Obama appeal.

He says he's against old school politics. He says that Hillary is part of the old politics regime. Yet, he was quick to align himself with Ted Kennedy. Yea, that guy who's been in politics since the 60s. The Kennedy family IS old school politics, but he had no qualms aligning himself with Ted. He even made sure that he was sitting next to him during the State of The Union address.

He proudly says that he was one of the only ones that didn't vote for the Iraq war. He admonishes Hillary for voting for the Iraq War. Yet, he proudly boasts support from Democrats who did vote for the war. If he's so big on calling out Hillary for voting for the Iraq War, shouldn't he also call out his supporters who have done the same?

There are several inconsistencies on Obama's behalf. But, everyone is blinded by his speeches. He has made some damn good speeches, I must admit. But, they're just speeches nonetheless.

[peewee's lovechild]

However, I do agree that if she doesn't win big in Texas and Ohio, it's pretty much over.

[peewee's lovechild]

she needs to be sent off on her socialistic-merry-ass back to arkansas or new york or whereever. i'm all for a woman to run this country, mind you, but not that scornful woman.

Explain the scornful part.

[atxrocker]

There are several inconsistencies on Obama's behalf. But, everyone is blinded by his speeches. He has made some damn good speeches, I must admit. But, they're just speeches nonetheless.


but...but, he's the great black hope. and he is going to bring real change. i know he will cause he has said so many atimes.

[atxrocker]

plus he has gotten some music stars to put together a cheesy music video for him, doesn't that count for something??

[peewee's lovechild]

but...but, he's the great black hope. and he is going to bring real change. i know he will cause he has said so many atimes.

He hasn't explained how this "real change" is going to come about.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Explain the scornful part.KiIP_KDQmXs

[Hillary]

Thank you all for your support!! I love you too!!

[Viva Las Espuelas]

He hasn't explained how this "real change" is going to come about.no one has. no one has that has a shot. that's just the "headlight" word that's blinding everyone that hates the gop. it's pathetic. i'm ready for the '12 election.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Thank you all for your support!! I love you too!!bang your head against a sharp corner for about an hour and divorce bill.

[peewee's lovechild]

KiIP_KDQmXs

That doesn't explain how Hillary is scornful.
That only explains how Bill is a horndog.

************************************************** *****************

scorn·ful /ˈskɔrnfəl/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[skawrn-fuhl] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–adjective full of scorn; derisive; contemptuous.



scorn (skôrn) Pronunciation Key
n.

Contempt or disdain felt toward a person or object considered despicable or unworthy.

The expression of such an attitude in behavior or speech; derision.
One spoken of or treated with contempt.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

That doesn't explain how Hillary is scornful.
That only explains how Bill is a horndog.

************************************************** *****************

scorn·ful /ˈskɔrnfəl/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[skawrn-fuhl] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation

–adjective full of scorn; derisive; contemptuous.



scorn (skôrn) Pronunciation Key
n.

Contempt or disdain felt toward a person(see video) or object considered despicable or unworthy.

The expression of such an attitude in behavior or speech; derision.
One spoken of or treated with contempt.

[Barack Obama]

He hasn't explained how this "real change" is going to come about.

May I suggest you visit barackobama.com and join the Obamamentum.

[MannyIsGod]

The fact of the matter is that Barak Obama has been against the war in Iraq from the get go. Hillary Clinton is a hawk on foreign relations and thats never going to change. She's been a supporter of failed policies for quite some time. I hate her health care plans and I always have because if anything is going to make us a further bankrupt nation it is her stupid health care ideas.

Barak Obama is not perfect. He's probably too liberal on many stances for me to absolutely love his stances, but I also believe he brings something to the table that we haven't had for a long time. You can rail all you want against him being all style and no substance but thats just not true. And even if it was, the position he's going for is one where style actually counts a lot more than people would ever care to admit. You do a lot more of giving impressions as a president than you do setting policy. Its the absolute truth.

I'm ready to have a well spoken inspiring presences in the oval office again. This country needs a shot in the arm and thats not something Hilary Clinton can provide. She's as polarizing as Bush and she's honestly not too different from him where it matters the most as a president. You can't set legislation on your own from the White House but you sure as hell can make a big dent in foreign policy regardless of what congress wants you to do.

[MannyIsGod]

He hasn't explained how this "real change" is going to come about.WTF do you expect out of a candidate giving stump speeches? He HAS explained things, but he's not going to give you a lecture on how it all is going to work at campaign spots. Do you think thats politicaly practical?

How can you guys buy into the bullshit soundbites that either campaign feeds you?

[MannyIsGod]

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

Go there and tell me its just speeches. Do that after you read every single PDF on every single issue he has listed. Get back to me when you're done.

[peewee's lovechild]

Obamamentum.

:lol :lol

[peewee's lovechild]

Viva, Hillary isn't in the video.

[samikeyp]

Did Hillary ever get the Snuke out? :)



Seriously, I don't have a problem with her, I just think Obama is a better candidate. If she doesn't take Ohio and Texas and probably Pennsylvania, then she will need to practice her "Obama/Clinton for change" speech.

[peewee's lovechild]

WTF do you expect out of a candidate giving stump speeches? He HAS explained things, but he's not going to give you a lecture on how it all is going to work at campaign spots. Do you think thats politicaly practical?

How can you guys buy into the bullshit soundbites that either campaign feeds you?

Quoting Martin Luther King, Jr. isn't substance.

And, I believe it is practical to say how you're going to get things done. The only thing that he's explained on how he's going to get things done is giving all college students a $4,000 credit for school. But, that they have to work it off by joining the Peace Corps, volunteering at a homeless shelter, or learning a new language. Which, is not even practical.

And talking about soundbites, that's all he ever does.

[peewee's lovechild]

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

Go there and tell me its just speeches. Do that after you read every single PDF on every single issue he has listed. Get back to me when you're done.


I'll have to read that.

It's way too lengthy for me to read and comment on it just now.

[Whisky Dog]

The two faced nature of politics makes it impossible to know where to go with your vote. You either vote one way because you've sworn allegance with a party or you look at what they say, what they've done in the past, and try to guess at what they'll do in the future if elected. Picking a president that will align with your beliefs is like picking a needle in a haystack without any needles, it's just not going to happen.


The big question here is this:

Who is going to fuck things up the least?

[peewee's lovechild]

Did Hillary ever get the Snuke out? :)



Seriously, I don't have a problem with her, I just think Obama is a better candidate. If she doesn't take Ohio and Texas and probably Pennsylvania, then she will need to practice her "Obama/Clinton for change" speech.

I don't think it will be an Obama/Clinton or Clinton/Obama ticket.

I think Edward's will be the pick for Vice Prez.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

then she will need to practice her "Obama/Clinton for change" speech.no way in hell will either one of those be a running mate.

[samikeyp]

I thought of Edwards as well but Hillary is too big of a player in the party. With Edwards dropping out of the race when he did, I think that ended his chances for getting on the ticket...although I do see him as a part of an Obama or Clinton cabinet. I also think if Hillary somehow pulls the nomination, Obama will be her VP.


Then again, I once thought that Alfredrick Hughes would be a good NBA player so who knows.

:lol

[Opinionater]

IMHO, if Hillary doesn't win big in both Ohio and TX it will be over for everyone except the Hillary campaign. She didn't work this hard to bow out graciously. She will fight until the convention and it will cause a shake up that could cost the democrats the White House.

[Whisky Dog]

I thought of Edwards as well but Hillary is too big of a player in the party. With Edwards dropping out of the race when he did, I think that ended his chances for getting on the ticket...although I do see him as a part of an Obama or Clinton cabinet. I also think if Hillary somehow pulls the nomination, Obama will be her VP.


Then again, I once thought that Alfredrick Hughes would be a good NBA player so who knows.

:lol

I think the black muslim and the woman ticket would be far too much change at once for this country to stomach, therefore it would be political suicide. That ticket would all but hand McCain the presidency (assuming McCain is the GOP candidate).

[peewee's lovechild]

The fact of the matter is that Barak Obama has been against the war in Iraq from the get go. Hillary Clinton is a hawk on foreign relations and thats never going to change. She's been a supporter of failed policies for quite some time. I hate her health care plans and I always have because if anything is going to make us a further bankrupt nation it is her stupid health care ideas.

Barak Obama is not perfect. He's probably too liberal on many stances for me to absolutely love his stances, but I also believe he brings something to the table that we haven't had for a long time. You can rail all you want against him being all style and no substance but thats just not true. And even if it was, the position he's going for is one where style actually counts a lot more than people would ever care to admit. You do a lot more of giving impressions as a president than you do setting policy. Its the absolute truth.

I'm ready to have a well spoken inspiring presences in the oval office again. This country needs a shot in the arm and thats not something Hilary Clinton can provide. She's as polarizing as Bush and she's honestly not too different from him where it matters the most as a president. You can't set legislation on your own from the White House but you sure as hell can make a big dent in foreign policy regardless of what congress wants you to do.


But, what is this "thing" that he brings? I'm not going to vote for someone because everyone is swept up with a "thing" he may have going for him. That's like voting for someone because he's "so hip".

I'll have to read more on that link you sent me to see how he weighs against Hillary, but I refuse to get swept into a trend.

Also, you're right about having a "well spoken presence" in the oval office. But, I don't think Hillary is somehow a worse option than McCain. I don't see how she's not well spoken.

[MannyIsGod]

Quoting Martin Luther King, Jr. isn't substance.

And, I believe it is practical to say how you're going to get things done. The only thing that he's explained on how he's going to get things done is giving all college students a $4,000 credit for school. But, that they have to work it off by joining the Peace Corps, volunteering at a homeless shelter, or learning a new language. Which, is not even practical.

And talking about soundbites, that's all he ever does.Yeah, go read that link or just admit you're speaking out of complete ignorance. He's explained everything, he just doesnt' go into detail in every single stump speech he gives because its impractical. Clinton does the same thing, but because he's a far better speaker than her she's tried to turn it against him as much as possible. First he's all style and no substance, then its just words, and then its plagerism.

Hello, she's borrowed from Obama and Edwards. But that doesn't matter because people only hear the accusation without regard to whether there is anything to back it up.

He has explained everything and I've given you a length to an indepth explation of every single issue he's campaigned upon.

[peewee's lovechild]

I thought of Edwards as well but Hillary is too big of a player in the party. With Edwards dropping out of the race when he did, I think that ended his chances for getting on the ticket...although I do see him as a part of an Obama or Clinton cabinet. I also think if Hillary somehow pulls the nomination, Obama will be her VP.


Then again, I once thought that Alfredrick Hughes would be a good NBA player so who knows.

:lol


I think Hillary and Obama have harmed each other too much to be reconcilliatory enough to be on each others ticket. I think that's why Hillary, if she should pull past the Obama momentum, would choose Edwards. He could help her with the southern vote.

Having said that, Reagan and Bush the first cut each other down in 1980, but still managed to work past their differences to run on the same ticket.

[MannyIsGod]

Obama is not a muslim. The amount of misinformation in this thread is reach very high levels.

[MannyIsGod]

There will be no Clinton vice presidency and there will be no Edwards vice presidency.

I do believe there will be a Bill Richardson VP though.

[florige]

I think the black muslim and the woman ticket would be far too much change at once for this country to stomach, therefore it would be political suicide. That ticket would all but hand McCain the presidency (assuming McCain is the GOP candidate).


I agree 100% with that! (- the muslim part)

[samikeyp]

I think Hillary and Obama have harmed each other too much to be reconcilliatory enough to be on each others ticket. I think that's why Hillary, if she should pull past the Obama momentum, would choose Edwards. He could help her with the southern vote.

Having said that, Reagan and Bush the first cut each other down in 1980, but still managed to work past their differences to run on the same ticket.


So did Kerry and Edwards in 2004.

[MannyIsGod]

But, what is this "thing" that he brings? I'm not going to vote for someone because everyone is swept up with a "thing" he may have going for him. That's like voting for someone because he's "so hip".

I'll have to read more on that link you sent me to see how he weighs against Hillary, but I refuse to get swept into a trend.

Also, you're right about having a "well spoken presence" in the oval office. But, I don't think Hillary is somehow a worse option than McCain. I don't see how she's not well spoken.I would vote 3rd party if it was Hilary and McCain. Its the same fucking person. Actually to be honest, I'd be more likely to vote for McCain but even more likely to vote for a 3rd party candidate.

There are people out there who posses a unique ability to bring people together. I'm not sure how you quantify it or how you explain it but it is a special quality that not everyone has. I guess its part charisma party charm and party ingelligence but I've really gotten the impression this is what Barak has.

You know, it really sounds corny but the truth is that he's given a lot of people hope. On the surface he's a black man suceeding to great heights in what is still a white mans world.

Yeah I don't know how to explain it. But when I see the demographics he's carrying and how this momentum is building I understand that I'm seeing something I'm going to tell my kids about. I saw him speak this Tuesday when he was here and I only saw him speak for a little bit. I've seen other presidential candidates here in San Antonio and none has ever generated the buzz that he did. The line to get into the venue streched for nearly a mile.

The truth is that we're pretty damn fed up with the current administration and what something better and new and when you look at that we have to choose from the only thing that even comes close to countering it is Barak Obama. Maybe its more of a nations frustrations coupled with him being the antiBush than anything else, but even that counts for something at this point.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

So did Kerry and Edwards in 2004.'cause they were both idiots.

[MannyIsGod]

So did Kerry and Edwards in 2004.Not even close. Edwards was a come from behind suprise who never quite got over the hump. The last campaign was over very quickly and can't be compared to this one. There's no way Clinton ever accepts a VP position. Talking about Obama accepting one is foolish considering he's just about got this wrapped up.

[samikeyp]

I would vote 3rd party if it was Hilary and McCain. Its the same fucking person. Actually to be honest, I'd be more likely to vote for McCain but even more likely to vote for a 3rd party candidate.

There are people out there who posses a unique ability to bring people together. I'm not sure how you quantify it or how you explain it but it is a special quality that not everyone has. I guess its part charisma party charm and party ingelligence but I've really gotten the impression this is what Barak has.

You know, it really sounds corny but the truth is that he's given a lot of people hope. On the surface he's a black man suceeding to great heights in what is still a white mans world.

Yeah I don't know how to explain it. But when I see the demographics he's carrying and how this momentum is building I understand that I'm seeing something I'm going to tell my kids about. I saw him speak this Tuesday when he was here and I only saw him speak for a little bit. I've seen other presidential candidates here in San Antonio and none has ever generated the buzz that he did. The line to get into the venue streched for nearly a mile.

The truth is that we're pretty damn fed up with the current administration and what something better and new and when you look at that we have to choose from the only thing that even comes close to countering it is Barak Obama. Maybe its more of a nations frustrations coupled with him being the antiBush than anything else, but even that counts for something at this point.


yeah but who has bigger balls, Hillary or McCain? :)


Seriously though, good post per usual Manny.

I think you hit it on the head with your last sentence.

[MannyIsGod]

Oh, and I will bet anyone money that Obama carries Texas. Not sure about Ohio but Hilary is not going to win here.

[samikeyp]

Not even close. Edwards was a come from behind suprise who never quite got over the hump. The last campaign was over very quickly and can't be compared to this one. There's no way Clinton ever accepts a VP position. Talking about Obama accepting one is foolish considering he's just about got this wrapped up.


I was referring to the shots Kerry and Edwards took at each other. Not as bad as Bush/Reagan or this year but it's not out of the realm of possibilty that two rivals in the primaries can end up on the same ticket.

I might end up being wrong but I still by the prediction.

I do agree also with what was said earlier, if there is division in the party going into the convention, it could lock the Dems out of the White House.

[samikeyp]

Oh, and I will bet anyone money that Obama carries Texas. Not sure about Ohio but Hilary is not going to win here.


If she doesn't, she is done.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

The truth is that we're pretty damn fed up with the current administration and what something better and new and when you look at that we have to choose from the only thing that even comes close to countering it is Barak Obama. Maybe its more of a nations frustrations coupled with him being the antiBush than anything else, but even that counts for something at this point.i wish people would realize that bush isn't running in this race, so being anti-bush isn't really hip anymore. let's move on with what needs to be done. remember this democratic congress we have has a lower appreciation rating than bush. voting anti-bush isn't the answer.

[peewee's lovechild]

Yeah, go read that link or just admit you're speaking out of complete ignorance. He's explained everything, he just doesnt' go into detail in every single stump speech he gives because its impractical. Clinton does the same thing, but because he's a far better speaker than her she's tried to turn it against him as much as possible. First he's all style and no substance, then its just words, and then its plagerism.

Hello, she's borrowed from Obama and Edwards. But that doesn't matter because people only hear the accusation without regard to whether there is anything to back it up.

He has explained everything and I've given you a length to an indepth explation of every single issue he's campaigned upon.

I'm not speaking out of ignorance. Not at all. I've seen most, if not all of his speeches. It's all about "I was right on the Iraq War", Kennedy, and other buzz words that really have no substance.

I'm not lying about that. I'm not even talking about plagerism or anything like that. I am saying that it's just words, though. He doesn't have the experience that Hillary has. Plus, she has the constant ear and support of a former President. A presidents, I might add, that was pretty damn good.

[florige]

Either way you look at it you guys hold her future in your hands come March 4th.

[MannyIsGod]

Bush may have gotten his 2 terms, but trust me when I say he's screwed the Republican Party for this next election. As long as the Democrats don't royal screw up (which isn't a given by ANY means) they're going to probably gain seats in congress and the presidency.

Being the antiBush may not be hip by your standards, but it sure is going to be a pretty good way to get elected. Its going to be easy to run against the failed policies of this administration.

[samikeyp]

Bush may have gotten his 2 terms, but trust me when I say he's screwed the Republican Party for this next election. As long as the Democrats don't royal screw up (which isn't a given by ANY means) they're going to probably gain seats in congress and the presidency.

Being the antiBush may not be hip by your standards, but it sure is going to be a pretty good way to get elected. Its going to be easy to run against the failed policies of this administration.

Agreed.

Fair or not, it's going to be reality.

[MannyIsGod]

I'm not speaking out of ignorance. Not at all. I've seen most, if not all of his speeches. It's all about "I was right on the Iraq War", Kennedy, and other buzz words that really have no substance.

I'm not lying about that. I'm not even talking about plagerism or anything like that. I am saying that it's just words, though. He doesn't have the experience that Hillary has. Plus, she has the constant ear and support of a former President. A presidents, I might add, that was pretty damn good.Funny, seems to me that Barak has more government service under his belt than Hilary. First Lady is not an elected office. Bush had the constant ear and support of a former president and we saw how well that worked out for him.

Hilary's time in the senate is aweomse if you ask me. She voted for the Iraqi war resolution and her comments on that vote are stellar. I love her experience there, but only because it strenthens the argument for Barak.

And you are speaking out of ignorance Pee-Wee. I'm glad you seen his stump speeches. Thats never where the meat of a candidate is to be found. You say he has no plans but when I give you the plans on how he's going to do everything you're response was "I can't read those now".

If your'e not ignorant to their existance then why would you say they didn't exsist?

[peewee's lovechild]

Obama is not a muslim. The amount of misinformation in this thread is reach very high levels.

He is not.

His father is, or was.

But, I think it's bullshit that people keep using that.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

He is not.

His father is, or was.

But, I think it's bullshit that people keep using that.oh he's Christian. you should see what his preacher preached. no wonder why he distanced himself from him once his campaign started, but i won't let details get in the way of change.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Funny, seems to me that Barak has more government service under his belt than Hilary.
:lol:lol:lol
he isn't even done with his first term as senator.

[MannyIsGod]

:lol:lol:lol
he isn't even done with his first term as senator.Unlike Clinton the US Senate is not his first goverment service.

[Xylus]

We need an atheist to run for president one of these days.

[Spurminator]

We need an atheist to run for president one of these days.

I'm sure we already have, but it will be a while before anyone admits to it.

[Xylus]

I'm sure we already have, but it will be a while before anyone admits to it.
It's a shame that you have to believe in a certain religion in order to get elected president in this country.

[peewee's lovechild]

Funny, seems to me that Barak has more government service under his belt than Hilary. First Lady is not an elected office. Bush had the constant ear and support of a former president and we saw how well that worked out for him.

Hilary's time in the senate is aweomse if you ask me. She voted for the Iraqi war resolution and her comments on that vote are stellar. I love her experience there, but only because it strenthens the argument for Barak.

And you are speaking out of ignorance Pee-Wee. I'm glad you seen his stump speeches. Thats never where the meat of a candidate is to be found. You say he has no plans but when I give you the plans on how he's going to do everything you're response was "I can't read those now".

If your'e not ignorant to their existance then why would you say they didn't exsist?


The ear and support that Bush the second had was Bush the first.
The ear and support that Hillary would have is Bill.
I hope you're not implying that Bush the first = Bill Clinton.

And, Hillary has decades of political experience, not just her current stint as a Senator.

However you may try to make it that I speak out of ignorance, what is the point of speeches? Is it not to try to persuade you to vote for the speaker? That's the whole point, isn't it?

All I'm saying is, that during those speeches I have not been given a clear reason to vote for him. He's has given me nothing in weight to persude me to vote for him. Sure, he's got a website with what he plans to do (and I really don't have time to read up on it just now, being that I'm at work), but so does Hillary.

Hillary, however, has said how she plans to get us out of our economic crisis. She's explained how she would end the Iraq War. She has said she would push for energy independence, improve our education system, reform the immigration system, and help the middle class.

I also appreicate the idea of universal health coverage. Due to the fact that I now have a child and I have to pay up the ying-yang to make sure she's covered, her health care package is much more appealing than Barak's health care plan.

[peewee's lovechild]

Unlike Clinton the US Senate is not his first goverment service.

She's been involved in Civil Service for MUCH longer than Barak.

[johnsmith]

We need an atheist to run for president one of these days.


Are you sure you want a President that doesn't believe there will be ulimate repercussions for his/her actions?

[johnsmith]

Hillary, however, has said how she plans to get us out of our economic crisis. She's explained how she would end the Iraq War. She has said she would push for energy independence, improve our education system, reform the immigration system, and help the middle class.

I also appreicate the idea of universal health coverage. Due to the fact that I now have a child and I have to pay up the ying-yang to make sure she's covered, her health care package is much more appealing than Barak's health care plan.

What a shocking platform for a politician to run on.


They all say this..........it's just that Hillary sounds like a bitch when she does it.

[CosmicCowboy]

The ear and support that Bush the second had was Bush the first.
The ear and support that Hillary would have is Bill.
I hope you're not implying that Bush the first = Bill Clinton.

And, Hillary has decades of political experience, not just her current stint as a Senator.

However you may try to make it that I speak out of ignorance, what is the point of speeches? Is it not to try to persuade you to vote for the speaker? That's the whole point, isn't it?

All I'm saying is, that during those speeches I have not been given a clear reason to vote for him. He's has given me nothing in weight to persude me to vote for him. Sure, he's got a website with what he plans to do (and I really don't have time to read up on it just now, being that I'm at work), but so does Hillary.

Hillary, however, has said how she plans to get us out of our economic crisis. She's explained how she would end the Iraq War. She has said she would push for energy independence, improve our education system, reform the immigration system, and help the middle class.

I also appreicate the idea of universal health coverage. Due to the fact that I now have a child and I have to pay up the ying-yang to make sure she's covered, her health care package is much more appealing than Barak's health care plan.

:lmao

Health care costs out the ying yang.

The difference is that you have a job and are now just paying for YOUR families health care. With universal health care you will not only be paying for yours, but everyone elses that chooses NOT to work.

If you think universal health care will SAVE you money you are delusional.

[monosylab1k]

For guys that like to talk all this bullshit and show off their extreme presidential candidate IQ it's pretty funny that nobody in this thread is spelling Barack's name right.

[Xylus]

Are you sure you want a President that doesn't believe there will be ulimate repercussions for his/her actions?
Is this a serious question?

[Evan]

I'm sure we already have, but it will be a while before anyone admits to it.

Yeah pretty much always thought this.

I am quite sure high level politics have their share the same as the standard population but nobody dare's to go public with it.

[johnsmith]

Is this a serious question?


:stirpot:

[johnsmith]

Yeah pretty much always thought this.

I am quite sure high level politics have their share the same as the standard population but nobody dare's to go public with it.


So the standard population is Atheist?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

:lmao

Health care costs out the ying yang.

The difference is that you have a job and are now just paying for YOUR families health care. With universal health care you will not only be paying for yours, but everyone elses that chooses NOT to work.

If you think universal health care will SAVE you money you are delusional.
do people realize that this "free" universal healthcare isn't that? free. i thought people want small government. this whole "global warming" scam. just wait for the carbon tax. oh and did anyone hear about the Global Poverty Act that just passed in the senate. you'll be happy to see who was the sponsor for that one, but for you "change" people, i don't want to bore you with details.

[Extra Stout]

We need an atheist to run for president one of these days.
Thomas Jefferson was pretty close.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

So the standard population is Atheist?it's headed that way.

[monosylab1k]

So the standard population is Atheist?
up until they think they're gonna die.

[MannyIsGod]

The ear and support that Bush the second had was Bush the first.
The ear and support that Hillary would have is Bill.
I hope you're not implying that Bush the first = Bill Clinton.

And, Hillary has decades of political experience, not just her current stint as a Senator.

However you may try to make it that I speak out of ignorance, what is the point of speeches? Is it not to try to persuade you to vote for the speaker? That's the whole point, isn't it?

All I'm saying is, that during those speeches I have not been given a clear reason to vote for him. He's has given me nothing in weight to persude me to vote for him. Sure, he's got a website with what he plans to do (and I really don't have time to read up on it just now, being that I'm at work), but so does Hillary.

Hillary, however, has said how she plans to get us out of our economic crisis. She's explained how she would end the Iraq War. She has said she would push for energy independence, improve our education system, reform the immigration system, and help the middle class.

I also appreicate the idea of universal health coverage. Due to the fact that I now have a child and I have to pay up the ying-yang to make sure she's covered, her health care package is much more appealing than Barak's health care plan.K - so she's promised you "free" healthcare and Obama hasn't in his speeches.

Thats all you had to say.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

a fine reason you don't discuss religion and politics especially when they're intermingled.

[johnsmith]

it's headed that way.


At a far slower pace then everyone seems to think.

[Xylus]

At a far slower pace then everyone seems to think.
I think it's become more acceptable for an atheist to proclaim his/her non-belief, but the percentage of atheists among the general population isn't growing at a very rapid pace.

[Spurminator]

As insistant as Americans are about having a Christian in the Office of President, we are also very flexible when it comes to the degree of his or her spirituality. As long as you say you're a Christian and maybe show up at church a couple times a year, we won't ask questions.

It's very easy for a political figure to keep a Christian facade so there's really no point in making it an issue. It only becomes an issue when you proclaim your atheism.

[Xylus]

As insistant as Americans are about having a Christian in the Office of President, we are also very flexible when it comes to the degree of his or her spirituality. As long as you say you're a Christian and maybe show up at church a couple times a year, we won't ask questions.

It's very easy for a political figure to keep a Christian facade so there's really no point in making it an issue. It only becomes an issue when you proclaim your atheism.
Why does it become a problem, though? Why does it have to be an issue at all?

[JoeChalupa]

I just hope more people than ever get out and participate in this historical election. All the candidates have their websites up and running. Do your own research. Both Barack and Hillary have mentioned their websites in their speeches.

Just get out and Barack the Vote!!!

[peewee's lovechild]

:lmao

Health care costs out the ying yang.

The difference is that you have a job and are now just paying for YOUR families health care. With universal health care you will not only be paying for yours, but everyone elses that chooses NOT to work.

If you think universal health care will SAVE you money you are delusional.

As opposed to the tax money I pay that goes into programs and people I don't give a shit about already?

[peewee's lovechild]

K - so she's promised you "free" healthcare and Obama hasn't in his speeches.

Thats all you had to say.

Good job, you read the last part of my post.

Start from the top.

[peewee's lovechild]

do people realize that this "free" universal healthcare isn't that? free. i thought people want small government. this whole "global warming" scam. just wait for the carbon tax. oh and did anyone hear about the Global Poverty Act that just passed in the senate. you'll be happy to see who was the sponsor for that one, but for you "change" people, i don't want to bore you with details.

How do you propose our government do anything at all without collecting taxes?

Small or big government, taxes are inevitable.

[CosmicCowboy]

As opposed to the tax money I pay that goes into programs and people I don't give a shit about already?

Oh no...they still want that money too...they just want you to pay for their universal health care too.

[Spurminator]

Why does it become a problem, though? Why does it have to be an issue at all?


Because Americans don't like having their beliefs undermined.

We'd rather you pretend to believe what we believe than admit to believing something that contradicts our beliefs.

(That sentence was written horribly I know... but you get what I'm saying?)

[JoeChalupa]

There is also the Clinton/Obama debate on tonight.

[CosmicCowboy]

There is also the Clinton/Obama debate on tonight.

Yeah, no WAY I'm missing that one!
http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s71/ivanadouche/catfight.jpg

[Richard Cranium]

:lmao

[CuckingFunt]

I was an Edwards girl.

Ditto.

I'll be voting for whomever gets the nomination, but I don't have a tremendous amount of faith in either of their ability to beat McCain.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

Ditto.

I'll be voting for whomever gets the nomination, but I don't have a tremendous amount of faith in either of their ability to beat McCain.the writing is on the wall. obama's getting the nomination. he's going to be our next president. the only way mccain will win is if, God forbid, we have another terror attack. this whole "let's talk" to our enemy attitude of obama's is not very settling to me.

[urunobili]

GO Hillary!

[Trainwreck2100]

the writing is on the wall. obama's getting the nomination. he's going to be our next president. the only way mccain will win is if, God forbid, we have another terror attack. this whole "let's talk" to our enemy attitude of obama's is not very settling to me.

I'd wait to see the % of Hispanic voters that vote for him in this primary before I declare him the winner

[JoeChalupa]

the writing is on the wall. obama's getting the nomination. he's going to be our next president. the only way mccain will win is if, God forbid, we have another terror attack. this whole "let's talk" to our enemy attitude of obama's is not very settling to me.

Without talking to the enemy the Berlin wall would not have come down. Keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer.

[JoeChalupa]

I'd wait to see the % of Hispanic voters that vote for him in this primary before I declare him the winner

I feel the younger hispanic vote will go to Barack. The Obamamentum is gaining strength each and every day.

I respect McCain too.

[Spurminator]

Without talking to the enemy the Berlin wall would not have come down.

That sounds like something you may have plagiarized. :nope

[ploto]

I know a lot of college aged women who ARE passionately for Hillary.

[JoeChalupa]

That sounds like something you may have plagiarized. :nope

They are "just words".

[CosmicCowboy]

I know a lot of college aged women who ARE passionately for Hillary.

Well, if you don't do it for yourself then do it for your country.
http://images.jupiterimages.com/common/detail/50/46/22774650.jpg

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

A McCain/Obama election would be an interesting race, really interesting.


For those keeping score on the democratic side, Hillary is done. Once the the momemtum gets going behind a candidate in these primaries it's all but over...and Obama has the momentum.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

manny and peewee, unless something has changed, i thought hilary and obama's health care plans were virtually identical, save for the fact that hillary actually explains how she'd pay for it.

[BonnerDynasty]

How will it affect the economy if interest rates are frozen for 5 years? What about giving the poor victims who were forced into their ARM 90 days to not have to pay what they owe?

Question.

[dallaskd]

OK, I admit that I am a middle of the road Republican/Independent ( I never agree 100% with the Republican platform especially on divisive issues like abortion rights) and tend to socialize/work with folk that share similar beliefs but virtually everyone I know DESPISES Hillary Clinton.

I keep reading that Texans love Hillary, especially Hispanics, and that Texas is where Hillary is going to make her big comeback.

There is a huge cross section of folks in here that share a love of basketball but are very politically diverse...

Who in here is passionately FOR Hillary Clinton and why?

you realize there is a politics forum right below this forum?

[ashbeeigh]

As much as I hate agreeing with Manny in most aspects, a lot of what he has said in this thread is correct. I'd be saying a lot of the same things he has, just not as eloquently.



Obama brings me the hope that this government can come together to work together to create a better place for this country through not being a "divided" states of America, but a "united" states of America.




unless something has changed, i thought hilary and obama's health care plans were virtually identical, save for the fact that hillary actually explains how she'd pay for it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_7xDxUn0AY8


Not very true.

and here it is from his website:




National Health Insurance Exchange: The Obama plan will create a National Health Insurance Exchange to help individuals who wish to purchase a private insurance plan. The Exchange will act as a watchdog group and help reform the private insurance market by creating rules and standards for participating insurance plans to ensure fairness and to make individual coverage more affordable and accessible. Insurers would have to issue every applicant a policy, and charge fair and stable premiums that will not depend upon health status. The Exchange will require that all the plans offered are at least as generous as the new public plan and have the same standards for quality and efficiency. The Exchange would evaluate plans and make the differences among the plans, including cost of services, public.





What's she going to do for me, who pays $113/month for healthcare?

[ShoogarBear]

Why does it become a problem, though? Why does it have to be an issue at all?Because hypocrisy is as American as apple pie.

[GaryJohnston]

Fuck that bitch

[Trainwreck2100]

I just came from the rally, and i deeply appreciate the college aged women the support Hillary.

[gameFACE]

To answer the original question I know one guy at work who a few months ago was passionately supporting Hillary. His main reason was to vote against any Republican candidate. I haven't asked him how he feels about Obama of late since Obama has all the momentum.

I'm going for Obama! He's the most genuine of the three major candidates left. McCain would just be a continuation of the doom and gloom approach Bush's administration has. Obama has the potential to be a real uniter. Nothing wrong with that. I was at the rally on Tuesday but my mind had been made up a few weeks ago. Hillary and McCain rub people the wrong way.

And the truth is - no candidate has ANY better experience than the other or is more qualified.

[Jekka]

I really wanted to be passionately for Hillary - I really, really want to see a woman in the White House (that isn't an arm accessory from the Stepford line), and honestly I tried to rationalize her as my choice for a while because I wanted to see a woman there. But, I'd rather wait for a different female candidate to make that happen.

It's still pretty damn sad to me that we haven't had a female president yet, and if Hillary doesn't get the nomination this time around, I have a hard time thinking of another woman right now who could generate as much attention. I have faith that some woman will do it in my lifetime, but it has to be someone better, less polarizing, more likeable and uniting.

[MannyIsGod]

manny and peewee, unless something has changed, i thought hilary and obama's health care plans were virtually identical, save for the fact that hillary actually explains how she'd pay for it.And the part where Hillary fines you for not having health insurance if you don't want it.

[DarkReign]

but it has to be someone better, less polarizing, more likeable and uniting.

I would agree. Hillary is much too divisive, whether its her fault or not is debatable, but it it doesnt make it any less true.

To answer the thread title, if Hillary wins the nomination, Im voting McCain/Other in a heartbeat.

If Obama wins the nomination, then I'll actually have a choice and will need to listen to the "debates" and platforms and read up on their individual plans.

Healthcare sounds all well and good, but that idea still needs to pass Congress. If the Dems pick up seats in both Houses, then it *might* happen.

If they dont, or even lose seats in either House, then Healthcare is a pipe dream and you'll have elected a President on terms that never will have materialized.

Therefore, I would suggest looking to other issues and qualities as a barometer for your vote. ie foreign policy, fiscal responsibility, domestic policy and overall government reform.

Healthcare, as I have been reminded repeatedly in the Other forum, is the single most expensive venture this country would ever undertake. I dont know about you folks, but I am taxed enough. I dont have children, I own a house and I make damn good coin. I dont have exemptions to minimize what the government already takes from me, and what they take is significant.

And the things that they take FOR are social programs I will NEVER benefit from. Nor will any of you who are 32 or younger. Medicaid? Medicare? Social Security?

All gone. Yet we pay for it.

My point is, I am for universal healthcare, but the only way to do it is a complete reform of the tax code and how we are taxed, IMO. You cant just add-on ANOTHER tax onto already existing taxes. Thats lunacy.

Since none of the current crop of candidates are willing to discuss the shitty taxation in this country, then thats a nonstarter for any discussion of healthcare and the added taxes that would need to be incurred to pay for it.

All in all, Im saying....look upon other issues to make your decision. Healthcare is just as fanciful of a dream as it was in the mid-90s...nothing has changed in that regard.

[Evan]

They only way I will vote for McCain is if Clinton wins the dem party.

The damage done by Bush in splitting the parties further will only be widened by her.

Even her own supporters are feeling betrayed by her now that they are seeing how much of her campaign money she has wasted.

I think she can do an awesome job in the right place but not at the top. I am not against her, just against her as president. It's good to have a bulldog like her set in a direction to get something done but I don't think she could handle the top gig.

[JoeChalupa]

I think she did well last night but it is time to pass the torch to a new era.

SI SE PUEDE!!

[johnsmith]

I think she did well last night but it is time to pass the torch to a new era.

SI SE PUEDE!!


This I fully agree with, regardless of the political party. Can we finally steer away from the most worthless generation of all time "the baby boomers" and let them retire and eat up all the money.

Let's just get rid of them for christ sake.

I'm already annoyed by the surge of "senior citizen rights" bullshit we are going to hear about over the next 15-20 years and it hasn't even started yet.

[Jimcs50]

I guess I am ok with Obama being President, but if he appoints Marion Barry as ambassador to Columbia, then I am going to think that we fucked up royally.

:)

[Evan]

I think we have had enough Bush's and Clinton's over the past few decades to last this country till the end of its days.

Its been since the 80's!!!!!!!!

[atxrocker]

if this shit goes down to obama/mccain, i may end up not voting at all in this shitty election

[Evan]

Can you be bought? Do you take paypal?

[clambake]

if you're worried about the economy or foreign policy, then you can't vote for mccain.

[Evan]

if you're worried about the economy or foreign policy, then you can't vote for mccain.

100 more years of war!

Sounds like a great plan to me! :ihit :ihit :ihit :ihit

[JoeChalupa]

if this shit goes down to obama/mccain, i may end up not voting at all in this shitty election

Then I don't want to hear any bitchin' when you have a shitty day after the election. :p:

[ploto]

Men do not have to worry-- women in this country will never reach the level of power and accomplishment of which they are capable because of other women.

[Heath Ledger]

Universal Healthcare ain't ever gonna happen. It's a fairy tale.

[Evan]

Universal Healthcare ain't ever gonna happen. It's a fairy tale.

I don't believe that.

[Heath Ledger]

Trust me, i just asked Satan and he told me "When hell freezes over"

[BonnerDynasty]

How will it affect the economy if interest rates are frozen for 5 years? What about giving the poor victims who were forced into their ARM 90 days to not have to pay what they owe?

Question.


Anyone?

[Heath Ledger]

Well they are talkig about a freeze o foreclosures for a while so that should really help.

[Satan]

Trust me, i just asked Satan and he told me "When hell freezes over"

You need to get off them meds you damn liar.

[JoeChalupa]

Very sad to hear about the Dallas Police Officer killed today while escorting Hillary Clinton's motorcade.

[MannyIsGod]

Men do not have to worry-- women in this country will never reach the level of power and accomplishment of which they are capable because of other women.
You're the most bitter woman I know and thats QUITE an accomplishment considering some of the women I know.

[SpursWoman]

You're the most bitter woman I know and thats QUITE an accomplishment considering some of the women I know.


Didn't we have this conversation at a GTG one time ... about how most women were bitches to each other, which is why both Kori & I have mostly male friends? :lol :lol


I honestly don't have an opinion about any particular candidate ... I'm middle of the road, and when I lean I lean to the right. But now? I just don't know. And I'd vote for a woman in a heartbeat if I felt she was perfect for the job, but I just don't trust Hillary. Maybe because I wasn't a toddler or in diapers when she & Bill were in the White House? I dunno ...

[jcrod]

He sounds good, but its all a pipe dream. He's not going to change shit, its all talk and he is the "it" person right now. Thats the only reason he'll win and everybody is going with the momentum.

He'll realize its a lot easier said than to implement.

It sucks, everybody sucks. Another shitty election yr.

[jcrod]

You're the most bitter woman I know and thats QUITE an accomplishment considering some of the women I know.


She might be, but she's telling the truth here.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

You're the most bitter woman I know and thats QUITE an accomplishment considering some of the women I know.:lol:lol

now that's funny considering the source.

[atxrocker]

He'll realize its a lot easier said than to implement.




you mean his music video didn't convince you? :lol

[whottt]

Hillary is not as bad as everyone makes her out to be...but she's not good at speaking or selling herself, I don't think she's any any better of a diplomat than W was...


It won't be the end of the world if she gets elected...actually it won't be the end of the world if any of the remaining candidates get elected...but it won't be the top of the world either.


I am not passionate about any of these candidates either...and none of them seem to be passionate about anything beyond being the President. They all seem knd of aimless and directionless to me(the reamaining contenders).

[CosmicCowboy]

They all seem knd of aimless and directionless to me

Well, they have already all reached their quota of lies, half truths, and empty promises so they have to avoid the issues they can't fix and can't touch.

We need a "truth" candidate that gets to go to the debates and answer questions too, knowing they can't possibly get elected.

example: What will you do to bring manufacturing jobs back to our country?

answer: Are you kidding? We live in a world economy. A lot of these other countries WANT those industrial jobs and have extremely educated and extremely industrious work forces with the "emerging country" work ethic. Have you looked at the average US kid leaving high school these days? They slid through school with social promotion, don't want to work, don't want to think about work, and just want a week to week paycheck instead of a career. And it just keeps getting worse instead of better. Those jobs are gone for GOOD because those industries are gone for good and more are leaving every day...the last one out won't have to turn the lights out because the government will be too broke to pay the utility bill. Ban imports? Save the jobs? LOL...our inflation rate would be 15%+ and prime interest rates would be 20%+ if we didn't have all these cheap imported goods...We have become a nation living on credit and the bill will eventually become due. But we will definitly have crystal clear air and water because we have chased all the industry out of our country...we can brag about that the next election cycle....

moderator: Mr. Obama, care to respond?

[spurster]

The US govt. doesn't want to do the actions that would keep more jobs here.

1) Affordable health care. It's not just low wages in China, it's less expensive health care. The US would have adopt the best ideas from Europe which would involve taking away profits from health insurance companies, high-priced physicians and high-cost, low-effectiveness health care in general. Of course, this is Evil Socialism. Another element in the free-market direction is to publicize how much each physician and procedure cost and how effective they are. Currently, health care choices by consumers have little with do with costs because the consumers are insulated from costs (need to pay a percentage up to a certain point to provide the incentive to cut costs) and they don't have the information anyway.

2) Tax breaks for keeping jobs here and tax increases for sending jobs offshore.

3) Corporations are supposed to be serving the public interest. I don't anybody in government keeping corporations in line with this pledge. Rather, the government sees enriching shareholders and CEOs as the public interest, not the workers.

[2Blonde]

Damn

150 views and the ONLY pro-Hillary post is:



:lmao

Looks like she is in for a monumental ass whoopin in Texas :lol
I really like her and intend to vote for her. I think she's bad-ass and I would love to see a woman president.

[johngateswhiteley]

I feel like I'm letting down a fellow woman but I just can't vote for her.

i don't understand why any women would feel they are letting down a fellow woman, what! makes no sense...vote for the best candidate, iyo. my goodness.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Obama is a shitty debater. No wonder he dodged debates with Hillary earlier.

Every other word he says is "uh" and he nearly stutters like a 3rd grader on multiple occasions.

I didn't even notice this until i re-watched the Austin debate my sister had recorded, and she was scoffing the shit out of his bad speech habits during debates.

Plus both obama and clinton disagreed on such little things, they were making such big deals about these minor differences it was almost laughable.

[JoeChalupa]

Barack is doing just fine. But it ain't over.....not yet....not yet.

SI SE PUEDE!!

[Trainwreck2100]

yeah, obama isn't eloquent at all.

[Mr. Peabody]

Obama is a shitty debater. No wonder he dodged debates with Hillary earlier.

Every other word he says is "uh" and he nearly stutters like a 3rd grader on multiple occasions.



I agree. He sounds like a third-grader giving his explanations. Obviously that Columbia and Harvard education did him no good.

[jcrod]

Barack is doing just fine. But it ain't over.....not yet....not yet.

SI SE PUEDE!!


NO SE PUEDE, PERO SE CREA!!

[marini martini]

Ya know what?????????? I'm a strong female, but I find it very hard to vote for another supposedly strong female, that didn't kick her looser ass philandering husband to the curb, after his B.J. with Monica was so publicly advertised for all of the world to see. If it was me, I would have cut his pekr off, then served him with papers.

At least the Kennedy's killed Marilynn :oops

Just my OHO :toast