Big 12 Saturday Basketball

[SrA Husker]

Final Scores:
Iowa State 64, at Texas Tech 76

Second Half:
Oklahoma 25, at Texas 40

Halftime:
Nebraska 32, at Texas A&M 25

First Half:
Kansas 24, at Oklahoma State 28

Late Games:
Colorado at Missouri
Kansas State at Baylor

[1369]

Wow, OSU upsets Kansas and A&M gets upset by Nebraska.

Got a hunch Capt. Mike is going to be on this like ugly on a gorilla.

[SrA Husker]

Frankly, I'm surprised he hasn't already posted 7 threads about it. A solid road victory for Nebraska today. I'm very pleased.

[K-State Spur]

Wow, OSU upsets Kansas and A&M gets upset by Nebraska.

Got a hunch Capt. Mike is going to be on this like ugly on a gorilla.

he can tout that great NIT resume builder.

[MajorMike]

Why? There aren't any KU fans here.

Anyway Neb's win proves OSU's win at atm wasn't really all that, because atm isn't really all that.

On the flip side... OSU has beaten 3 tourney teams in a row and lost to 2 others by 2 and 3.

[johngateswhiteley]

...this is getting ridiculous. Turgeon!!!

[SrA Husker]

...this is getting ridiculous. Turgeon!!!

This should of actually been expected... Turgeon's teams have with few exceptions collapsed down the stretch.

[Herschel Walker]

Looks like OU's chode exploded before their sneakers touched the Erwin Center's floor.

[MajorMike]

This should of actually been expected... Turgeon's teams have with few exceptions collapsed down the stretch.

KState and I tried to tell you this several times when he was hired... however most of you rudely brushed us off as nay-sayers.

[MajorMike]

CBS Front Page (http://cbs.sportsline.com/)

[SrA Husker]

Despite Beasley putting up half of KSU's points, they go down at Baylor. And Mike, I never doubted you when you did say that about turgeon...

EDIT - Oops, I didn't realize this wasn't a final score, ESPN made it sound like it was.

[AFBlue]

Despite Beasley putting up half of KSU's points, they go down at Baylor. And Mike, I never doubted you when you did say that about turgeon...

EDIT - Oops, I didn't realize this wasn't a final score, ESPN made it sound like it was.

It's final now...

Baylor FTW, despite a Big 12 record 44 from Beasley and another 30 from Bill Walker. Baylor led once again by Jerrells.

[K-State Spur]

Beasley sets a big 12 record for points in a game. That's his 3rd 40 point game this year. For comparison, Durant had 0.

Cats playing poorly and not deserving to win + Baylor tossing in more slop than I've seen in a long time (it's been a while since I've seen that many shots hit the rim that many times yet still eventually fall into the hoop) = 4th straight road loss.

This was also a game where both coaches seemed overmatched by each other. Scott Drew got the win, but never came close to adjusting to Beasley, continually giving him open looks (compared to the brilliant strategy Doc Sadler employed on him earlier this week). Frank Martin meanwhile, has still yet to get through to his guys that it's fairly important to - at some point - get between your man and the hoop.

[IcemanCometh]

Durant > Beasley

[MajorMike]

I ain't knocking him, he's an awesome player. However he is not even close to the defensive player Durant was.

[RonMexico]

We blow.

[K-State Spur]

I ain't knocking him, he's an awesome player. However he is not even close to the defensive player Durant was.

is that serious?

beasley's not great, but durant was awful defensively. when he was named to the all defensive team, it completely invalidated the award.

[K-State Spur]

Durant > Beasley

based on what?

there's good arguments for both players.

beasley's better in the post, durant was a better pure shooter.

beasley's a much more efficient scorer. he averages as many points as durant did despite playing almost 5 minutes less per game. he also shoots a higher percentage from the floor (and only 1 percentage point less from 3).

and, since he plays the majority of his game on the low block, it's easier for teams to double and triple team him compared to durant for him to get his points.

he's also a superior rebounder to durant.

for comparison in their efficiency - beasley averages 1.52 points per shot. durant averaged 1.4 (still a great total).

it's also debatable as to who had more talent around them. durant had a true PG, which Beasley doesn't have. Walker may be a better scorer than Texas' second best scorer last year. But outside of him, Beasley hasn't gotten much help from anybody else.

[MajorMike]

is that serious?

beasley's not great, but durant was awful defensively. when he was named to the all defensive team, it completely invalidated the award.

Well, that's what I would expect you to say.

I'm guessing the B12 coaches aren't going to vote a kid they don't think deserves it onto the team.

That's just me tho, apparently you think they have no intergrity.

[K-State Spur]

they voted him because of his block numbers (which are only slightly higher than Beas).

MLB coaches voted Raphael Palmeiro a gold glove when he only played 20 games at 1B one season, so the 'they know what they're doing' argument doesn't always fly. it's a popularity contest just like everything else.

Durant was a solid weakside shot blocker. However, he also left his man wide open to do it. He also struggled to say between wing players and the hoop.

You know who else is a good weakside shot blocker? Amare Stoudamire. But how is he as an overall defender?

Hell, most Texas fans will admit that defense wasn't exactly Durant's strength (but his offense more than made up for it).

[MajorMike]

they voted him because of his block numbers (which are only slightly higher than Beas).
Durant was a solid weakside shot blocker. However, he also left his man wide open to do it. He also struggled to say between wing players and the hoop.

You know who else is a good weakside shot blocker? Amare Stoudamire. But how is he as an overall defender?

So NBA coaches are smart enough to see thru that but B12 coaches aren't.

[K-State Spur]

i don't put much stock in NBA awards either. (it should also be pointed out that most college coaches don't actually vote themselves, they just pass the ballot over to their SID)

touting durant as a great defender tells everybody that you never actually bothered watching him on that end of the court.

that is all.

[MajorMike]

i don't put much stock in NBA awards either. (it should also be pointed out that most college coaches don't actually vote themselves, they just pass the ballot over to their SID)

touting durant as a great defender tells everybody that you never actually bothered watching him on that end of the court.

that is all.


We aren't talking football polls; we are talking basketball and we are talking end of year awards. Just like the SIDs may vote all year for the coach in football, we all know the coach actually does the last ballot.

Point 1, SIDs don't vote for end of year awards or polls, and point 2, you haven't made one factual point yet.

Just be swole and stop creating facts.

[K-State Spur]

how can you make a factual point about defense? there aren't many defensive stats, and the ones available are often misleading.

any point we make is somewhat subjective. but having watched durant extensively at two levels, he has yet to show consistent quality defense at either.

[MajorMike]

And yet, he was an All B12 Defensive 1st teamer while Beasley won't be. That is factual.

[K-State Spur]

as i said, the award is invalidated.

last year's KSU - UT game is on ESPN classic tomorrow. watch it. durant continually leaves his man that created open shots for texas to get burned. his defense (or lack of) played a major role in the Horns getting upset.

this 'tactic' was not limited to this individual game by any means. there were more wings than just Cartier Martin that had a career day thanks to Durant last year (an OSU fan should be well aware of this).

[MajorMike]

And yet, Durant is quantifiably better than Beasley defensively.

[samikeyp]

I give the nod to Durant but damn that kid Beasley is good.

[degenerate_gambler]

We blow.


...paging Melvin Watkins.

[leemajors]

where is CBF's postgame report complete with pictures? i was sitting right next to AJ's woman on the pom pom squad - she is hot!

http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb64/beestrofowler/IMG_0091.jpg
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb64/beestrofowler/IMG_0090.jpg
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb64/beestrofowler/IMG_0089.jpg

[K-State Spur]

And yet, Durant is quantifiably better than Beasley defensively.

how is that?

blocks/steals/fouls committed are all in durant's favor, but it's close.

if those stats = All-Big 12 defense 1st team for Durant. then i should expect beasley to be All-Big 12 defense 2nd team this year.

...except that (like baseball) the defensive stats available don't really tell a good story of how good a defender a player is.

[MajorMike]

if those stats = All-Big 12 defense 1st team for Durant. then i should expect beasley to be All-Big 12 defense 2nd team this year.

Then we agree Durant was a better defender; thanks much.

[K-State Spur]

so, in your opinion, the defensive basketball stats available are an accurate portrayal of the quality of defender???

you would argue that rashard lewis is a better defensive player than bruce? (hell, his stats across the board - blocks/steals/defensive rebounds/fouls committed - are superior).

and while i would argue that beasley is a better defender than durant, it's like arguing which miniature dog is better. neither is/was much a defender in their big 12 time thus far.

[MajorMike]

Ok, Mr. Tangent, please add more smoke to your screen of lame denials, when I have never once mentioned stats. It is what it is, and it is.

[K-State Spur]

Ok, Mr. Tangent, please add more smoke to your screen of lame denials, when I have never once mentioned stats. It is what it is, and it is.


And yet, Durant is quantifiably better than Beasley defensively.

If you've found a way to quantify something without the use of numbers, please DO TELL!