Brent Barry gets multi year deal???

[smahmood26]

I did not see this posted anywhere. This is according to WOAI

Brent Barry is returning to the Spurs. Barry who was traded to the Sonics, and then waived, chose to return to the Spurs over offers from Phoenix, Dallas, Boston and Houston. The story was first reported by the Arizona Republic.
Suns General Manager Steve Kerr confirmed to News 4's Don Harris that Barry's ties to San Antonio were just too strong to sign with another team.
"He thought about it for four or five days." Kerr said, "We thought we had a great shot, but ultimately he chose to stay in San Antonio."
Barry will sign a new contract for a pro-rated portion of the veterans minimum contract, but sources also say the new deal will also include a guaranteed contract for next season and perhaps a partial guarantee for the 2009-2010 season. Because Barry was traded, released and now re-signed with the Spurs he will not be eligible to play for another three weeks. Barry is also still recovering from a torn calf muscle and was likely going to miss another 2 weeks anyway.

[T Park]

Cool.

I was hopin hed get resigned in the offseason as it is.

Hes still got gas left in the tank.

[Brutalis]

Yeah BB got plenty left in him. Just not as many minutes as he used to get in his career is why the skeptics will moan.

[ChumpDumper]

Sounds right. It won't keep the Spurs from spending their exceptions this summer. The only limiting factor on that will be years -- it would have to be a great player to get more than two seasons.

[Real Tomato Ketchup]

Think he worked in a no trade clause?

[PM5K]

He'll be our Steve Kerr season after next, he'll ride the pine and come in at the end of a big game to hit a three, shooters don't get old...

[smahmood26]

The brilliance that is Buford and Pop. Get Kurt Thomas for basically a late first round pick. Bring back Barry and all of a sudden our "shooters" are in place and we added bulk and toughness.

[timvp]

Barry making Jacque Vaughn money is a good deal. Shooters who barely jump when they shoot last forever. See: Miller, Reggie; Perkins, Sam.

[Spurminator]

Could Barry have gotten a better deal in free agency this summer? Seems like he's still an above-minimum player.

[still.focused]

Barry making Jacque Vaughn money is a good deal. Shooters who barely jump when they shoot last forever. See: Miller, Reggie; Perkins, Sam.
Reggie Miller most definitely left the floor when he shot

[WalterBenitez]

Great news.

[timvp]

Reggie Miller most definitely left the floor when he shotHe left the ground but his jumper had a lot of arm to it. It wasn't a classic jumpshot where the power for the shot comes from the legs. For example, Finley has a picture perfect jumper ... but once he can't jump anymore, his career will be over.

[Holt's Cat]

So basically Barry gets the vet min next season and a guarantee of maybe half a mil in 2009-10. In other words, not an issue.

[barbacoataco]

If this is true, are the chances of Finley returning less likely? I think the Spurs HAVE to add some youth in the SG/SF area, and with Bowen, Udoka, Ginobili and Barry all over 30, is there room for Finley in that group?

[Budkin]

I'm just glad Brent is a Spur again. Very glad!

[Holt's Cat]

If this is true, are the chances of Finley returning less likely? I think the Spurs HAVE to add some youth in the SG/SF area, and with Bowen, Udoka, Ginobili and Barry all over 30, is there room for Finley in that group?


Maybe. Who knows? If the Spurs win a title this year he might just retire. It's not like he hasn't been banking the last couple of years.

[whottt]

Could Barry have gotten a better deal in free agency this summer? Seems like he's still an above-minimum player.


Yeah...he could have, if he'd finished out the season with the Suns...possibly even the Rockets. But if he went to the Suns he could have definitely set himself up for a nice one year deal with some team seeking a shooter/ball handler with championsip experience...

Put it this way...he could have gotten the Vet min from any team in the league...he just had 5-6 elite and capped out teams fighting for his services when he can't even play due to injury.

And the Suns would have boosted his numbers.


He definitely passed up money to stay with the Spurs...he turned down Shaq and Nash asking him to join their team...


Nobody should ever qustion Brent Barry's loyalty to this organization after this...and anyone that does is a dickhead. And no one should ever question his desire to win a championship...becausse he's chosen both of those over money twice now.

And he knows playing Pop's system is not going to be an optimum boost to his numbers or career.

[Medvedenko]

Was there any doubt that he would return...please, this was planned from the get go.

[whottt]

He left the ground but his jumper had a lot of arm to it. It wasn't a classic jumpshot where the power for the shot comes from the legs. For example, Finley has a picture perfect jumper ... but once he can't jump anymore, his career will be over.



timvp is right on this...and Barry doesn't jump at all. Steve Kerr jumped about 5 times as much as Barry does on his threes.

[whottt]

Was there any doubt that he would return...please, this was planned from the get go.


Maybe, maybe not...I certainly wasn't 100% convinced he'd be back.

[Agloco]

Yeah...he could have, if he'd finished out the season with the Suns...possibly even the Rockets. But if he went to the Suns he could have definitely set himself up for a nice one year deal with some team seeking a shooter/ball handler with championsip experience...

Put it this way...he could have gotten the Vet min from any team in the league...he just had 5-6 elite and capped out teams fighting for his services when he can't even play due to injury.

And the Suns would have boosted his numbers.


He definitely passed up money to stay with the Spurs...he turned down Shaq and Nash asking him to join their team...


Nobody should ever qustion Brent Barry's loyalty to this organization after this...and anyone that does is a dickhead. And no one should ever question his desire to win a championship...becausse he's chosen both of those over money twice now.
And he knows playing Pop's system is not going to be an optimum boost to his numbers or career.


Do you think it was more a case of Brent wanting to come back on his own or was he clued into an "under the table" deal with Presti and crew in Seattle and just played along with it?

I'm not sure what to think about it, nor does it matter I suppose. Just glad he's back on board. He did look like he was having some good moments for us again this year.

[whottt]

Do you think it was more a case of Brent wanting to come back on his own or was he clued into an "under the table" deal with Presti and crew in Seattle and just played along with it?


Unless he's getting paid something under the table I don't see how that would disqualify this being an act of loyalty.

Just because the Spurs and Sonics worked out some deal doesn't mean Barry would go along with it.



I want to see how much the Mavs offered...Cuban said he offered Barry more than any other team to join the Mavs...

[Medvedenko]

Maybe, maybe not...I certainly wasn't 100% convinced he'd be back.

How could you be 100% convinced on it....are you on the Spurs payroll, do you hang out with pop, rc and presti....that's the whole point. Everything was supposed to happen above board.

[whottt]

How could you be 100% convinced on it....are you on the Spurs payroll, do you hang out with pop, rc and presti....that's the whole point. Everything was supposed to happen above board.


Then why did you just ask if there was any doubt about whether he'd ever return...there obviously was.

[Ghost Writer]

Could Barry have gotten a better deal in free agency this summer? Seems like he's still an above-minimum player.
If it were about the money, he'd be playing for more in DAL or PHX.

His wife didn't wanna move!

[remingtonbo2001]

If it were about the money, he'd be playing for more in DAL or PHX.

His wife didn't wanna move!

Bingo!

[Medvedenko]

Then why did you just ask if there was any doubt about whether he'd ever return...there obviously was.

I didn't ask if there was doubt...just responding to your not being sure. No worries. I'm glad he's back and not with any other team.

[wildbill2u]

With some players, it isn't always about fame and fortune, the big money and the big cities.

The Spurs have had lots of wonderful players with this character trait in them over the past: DROP, Duncan; Gervin among others.

[AFBlue]

It's not that I'm bagging the multi-year deal because it doesn't necessarily guarantee him playing time....

BUT, we've been talking for years about the Spurs retooling their lineup and injecting youth. Yet, if they continue to extend contracts and take up roster spots with guys in their mid-late 30s, aren't the Spurs moving further from that target?

I guess the questions that now crosses my mind is, what do they do with Finley at the end of this season? He has been a solid professional and good (though streaky at times) addition to this team. Do the Spurs say "we like you Fin, but we've reached our 'old wing player' quota" or do they say "we welcome you back" and put off their infusion of youth yet another year?

Interested to hear where you think the Spurs go from here....

[Strike]

Honestly I was glad to see him get traded. If he wants to come back, fine. But at least make good use of that roster spot.

[boutons_]

So Brent will have only 3 weeks at the end of the season to get in game shape for his few MPG and be ready for the POs.

Damn, I hope is calf holds up this time.

[AFBlue]

It's not that I'm bagging the multi-year deal because it doesn't necessarily guarantee him playing time....

BUT, we've been talking for years about the Spurs retooling their lineup and injecting youth. Yet, if they continue to extend contracts and take up roster spots with guys in their mid-late 30s, aren't the Spurs moving further from that target?

I guess the questions that now crosses my mind is, what do they do with Finley at the end of this season? He has been a solid professional and good (though streaky at times) addition to this team. Do the Spurs say "we like you Fin, but we've reached our 'old wing player' quota" or do they say "we welcome you back" and put off their infusion of youth yet another year?

Interested to hear where you think the Spurs go from here....

Same question for Finley applies to Damon Stoudamire and Kurt Thomas as well. Hell, maybe even Robert Horry decides not to call it quits...

What do the Spurs do?

[Bruno]

Spurs need to be younger but they must stay competitive.

They can't let a player like Finley go if they haven't someone able to play at his level.

Could Spurs be able to find someone as good as Finley via FA this summer ?
Not sure and you had to keep in mind the 2010 plan. Maybe Spurs aren't ready to give a contract longer than 2 years this summer.

Spurs could also decide to keep Finley and add some prospect to fill the roster and hope that they could soon take Finley's place. It's risky because prospects often doesn't pan out.

IMO, Spurs will re-sign Finley this summer if he doesn't retire. They will try to add one or two SG/SF prospect via draft or FA.

[SenorSpur]

It's not that I'm bagging the multi-year deal because it doesn't necessarily guarantee him playing time....

BUT, we've been talking for years about the Spurs retooling their lineup and injecting youth. Yet, if they continue to extend contracts and take up roster spots with guys in their mid-late 30s, aren't the Spurs moving further from that target?

I guess the questions that now crosses my mind is, what do they do with Finley at the end of this season? He has been a solid professional and good (though streaky at times) addition to this team. Do the Spurs say "we like you Fin, but we've reached our 'old wing player' quota" or do they say "we welcome you back" and put off their infusion of youth yet another year?

Interested to hear where you think the Spurs go from here....

Good question and one that dominates my thoughts. The most significant portion of this Barry announcement is the committment to him beyond this season. So much for him retiring at the end of the year.

Despite the jubilance over Barry coming back, I'm looking at the big picture. If the Spurs are commiting multiple years to Barry (and good for him), they CANNOT bring back Finley under any circumstances - unless something goofy happens like maybe Bruce suddenly retires. Sorry Fin. Good professional and a valuable contributer over the last 3 seasons, but he's been a streaky shooter. All that said, he cannot come back next year. We have reached the maximum limit on age at the swing position. :bang

The league's best athletes are found at a position where the Spurs are the oldest. This must end. They CANNOT continue to trot out swingmen that are 35 years of age and older. A younger replacement needs to be identified as soon as this season is over. That has to be priority number 1 in the offseason.

Personally, I was hoping for at least 2 new swingmen, but at this point, I'll settle for one. :rolleyes

[SenorSpur]

Spurs need to be younger but they must stay competitive.

They can't let a player like Finley go if they haven't someone able to play at his level.

Could Spurs be able to find someone as good as Finley via FA this summer ?
Not sure and you had to keep in mind the 2010 plan. Maybe Spurs aren't ready to give a contract longer than 2 years this summer.

Spurs could also decide to keep Finley and add some prospect to fill the roster and hope that they could soon take Finley's place. It's risky because prospects often doesn't pan out.

IMO, Spurs will re-sign Finley this summer if he doesn't retire. They will try to add one or two SG/SF prospect via draft or FA.

There's no way they can keep both Finley and Barry, yet add someone else. They already have five swingmen (Gino, Barry, Udoka, Bowen & Finley). If they add another one via the draft or FA, they will have six. There will be a huge logjam that will not work.

[whottt]

Finley's closer to being physically done than Barry in terms of game...although Barry may now be the more injury prone of the two.

Barry plays pretty much the way he always has whereas Finley's not half the player he once was.

One thing is for certain though...Barry's dunking days are over with these calf injuries...




Hmmm...this actually gives me a great idea for a thread.

[Bruno]

There's no way they can keep both Finley and Barry, yet add someone else. They already have five swingmen (Gino, Barry, Udoka, Bowen & Finley). If they add another one via the draft or FA, they will have six. There will be a huge logjam that will not work.

Stephen Jackson plan. The prospect could spend his first year learning the system in Austin and at practice.

Who do you want to sign this summer to replace Finley ?

[loveforthegame]

Good news is that he'll be back next year but it doesn't look good for Finley when you figure Udoka will get more minutes and have a bigger role. I can see Finley playing a couple more years.

[SenorSpur]

Stephen Jackson plan. The prospect could spend his first year learning the system in Austin and at practice.

Who do you want to sign this summer to replace Finley ?

It has to be obvious. Because they need to get younger at the position! By the start of next season, the Spurs wil have 3 swingmen that will be at least 36 years old! The league's best athletes and toughest defensive matchups are found at the swing position - a position where the Spurs are the oldest.

[Bruno]

Because they need to get younger at the position! By the start of next season, the Spurs wil have 3 swingmen that will be at least 36 years old!

You didn't get what I've said.

We both agree that Spurs should go younger. The real question is how to do that ?

I didn't say that your idea of not re-signing Finley is good or bad. I just ask you who do you want to sign to takes Finley spot.

A 2008 free agent list :
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=2008freeagents

Just tell me who do you realistically want to sign and for what contract.



The league's best athletes and toughest defensive matchups are found at the swing position - a position where the Spurs are the oldest.

I take an old Bruce over any young player to defend league's best athletes.

[SenorSpur]

You didn't get what I've said.

We both agree that Spurs should go younger. The real question is how to do that ?

I didn't say that your idea of not re-signing Finley is good or bad. I just ask you who do you want to sign to takes Finley spot.

A 2008 free agent list :
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=2008freeagents

Just tell me who do you realistically want to sign and for what contract. .

My personal, primary favorties are all within medium-age range:
Corey Maggette - may be 2 expensive for the Spurs budget. (3yr, $22.5m)
James Jones - could be in the Spurs price range (3yrs, $13m)
Mikael Pietrus - not accomplished enough to garner more than his current low-ball contract (3yrs $11m)

Secondary options: These guys do not have much on their resumes, which means they could likely come cheap:
Trevor Ariza - Pluck him away from the Fakers (3yrs, $11m)
Jarvis Hayes - (3yrs, $5.25m)
Gerald Green - (2yrs, $3.2m)

Even with these additions, the Spurs should still add another SF via draft.


I take an old Bruce over any young player to defend league's best athletes.
So would I. Bruce can play until he can no longer run. He's truly ageless.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Good move. Brent is a great glue guy, he energises the team when he's on the court, can play PG in a pinch, and still has some game left. It's also good for the team from a continuity point of view, and it means that if I come to live in SA next season I'll get to see him play live again! :D

That means we really only have to sign a young swingman, and will have the MLE to do it.

Big rotation - Duncan/Oberto/Splitter/Mahinmi/Thomas(?)
Swing - Ginobili/Bowen/Udoka/Barry/???(James Jones, Carlos Delfino, etc.)
PG - Parker/whoever we choose to keep

Horry's gone after this season, and I assume that Finley will be too.

[angel_luv]

We're getting Brent back? Yea!

I was expecting something good to happen today. :)

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

It actually happened yesterday.

[xmas1997]

VSpan.

I think Pop and RC have already laid the groundwork for him joining the team next year.

[clubalien]

I don't get WHY barry would want to LOCK in the vet min when he could get more or at any time get vet min from any NBA club, UNLESS HE is worried he will never recover from his injury ( which i doubt the spurs would resign him then)

[remingtonbo2001]

We're getting Brent back? Yea!

I was expecting something good to happen today. :)

Is that what your horoscope said...:lol

[clubalien]

If it were about the money, he'd be playing for more in DAL or PHX.

His wife didn't wanna move!
someone get ian married to a local SA girl i don't wnt to lose this superstar in free agency when he blows up

[beirmeistr]

Barry making Jacque Vaughn money is a good deal. Shooters who barely jump when they shoot last forever. See: Miller, Reggie; Perkins, Sam.
Does that include Rasho too---oh, wait, you said shooters.

[tav1]

In terms of free agents, suggested contracts, and the need to get younger I'm on board with the consensus--and I think either James Jones, Ariza, Delfino and Juan Carlos Navarro make sense. Navarro might be available for cheap, and that appeals to me. We need to make a $ for every 10 c's we have to spend. Navarro can also play some point. Chris Duhon is also available and if we can't land a suitable swing, then he is not a bad option to provide some stability and a spark off the bench. But this is all retread.

I'd like to suggest a few other options than I think the Spurs should consider.

The first possibility is offering the full MLE to Ron Artest. He can replace Finley and Bowen, Barry and Udoka can hold fort at the 3 for another season until we've groomed someone to replace them. Artest can finish games with Ginobli, relagating Bowen to the bench.

The second possibility is using our Beno trade exception for a player like Renaldo Balkman or Wilson Chandler. Someone young to groom behind Bowen.

The third is the need to trade Bonner. Udoka is a better small ball option at the 4. I'm not sure what Bonner could fetch on the trade market, but a another swing or point should be sought. Maybe we could offer Delfino a long contract--longer than Toronto would want to committ to--and work a sign and trade. I don't know, but Bonner must be traded for another guy to shore up the bench.

And, for as much as he's meant to the franchise, a surprise Bowen retirement would get us below cap and put the Spurs in a position to maintain until 2010. I'm just sayin'.

[K-State Spur]

Stephen Jackson plan. The prospect could spend his first year learning the system in Austin and at practice.

Who do you want to sign this summer to replace Finley ?

i was thinking the same thing. if no better options present themselves, bring back finley (steve smith) and add a young athletic project as well.

[angel_luv]

It actually happened yesterday.


Well, I just heard about it today. Either way, good news.


Is that what your horoscope said...:lol


No.

Today is the 29th of February, a day that only happens every four years.
Seems to me like they should be special.

The last Feb 29th was great for me. It was on that day that I met Manu for the first time and, while in line for that, I met one of my best friends. :)

[bdictjames]

Welcome back Brent. We're glad to have you back.

[AFBlue]

In terms of free agents, suggested contracts, and the need to get younger I'm on board with the consensus--and I think either James Jones, Ariza, Delfino and Juan Carlos Navarro make sense. Navarro might be available for cheap, and that appeals to me. We need to make a $ for every 10 c's we have to spend. Navarro can also play some point. Chris Duhon is also available and if we can't land a suitable swing, then he is not a bad option to provide some stability and a spark off the bench. But this is all retread.

I'd like to suggest a few other options than I think the Spurs should consider.

The first possibility is offering the full MLE to Ron Artest. He can replace Finley and Bowen, Barry and Udoka can hold fort at the 3 for another season until we've groomed someone to replace them. Artest can finish games with Ginobli, relagating Bowen to the bench.

The second possibility is using our Beno trade exception for a player like Renaldo Balkman or Wilson Chandler. Someone young to groom behind Bowen.

The third is the need to trade Bonner. Udoka is a better small ball option at the 4. I'm not sure what Bonner could fetch on the trade market, but a another swing or point should be sought. Maybe we could offer Delfino a long contract--longer than Toronto would want to committ to--and work a sign and trade. I don't know, but Bonner must be traded for another guy to shore up the bench.

And, for as much as he's meant to the franchise, a surprise Bowen retirement would get us below cap and put the Spurs in a position to maintain until 2010. I'm just sayin'.

All of these are good and plausible suggestions, but Bruno is alluding to a very good point...

When you combine a FAs likely contract demand with their talent, are you going to get a better deal than Finley?

Some suggested FAs should be ruled out because they're too far-fetched, like Corey Maggette (sorry SenorSpur!), while others are also unlikely because of their "restricted" status (i.e. Navarro, Delfino, 2004 1st rounders).

After those considerations you're essentially left with:

Mickael Pietrus
James Jones
Jarvis Hayes
Gerald Green

I guess the question then becomes, will any of those above individuals be willing to take a two-year deal, or a three-year deal with the third year as a team option? And, while they may be younger, are they really an upgrade over Finley talent-wise?

That's obviously what the Spurs FO will be looking at this Summer, but here would be my guess....

Spurs hold off on any FA that may have an "impact" to the roster next year, and instead opt to get younger on the wing with a draft choice or with someone currently in the system (i.e. Williams).

Of the other two veterans with expiring contracts, I see one staying on (Kurt Thomas) and one moving on (Damon Stoudamire). There is another opportunity to inject some fresh, young talent.

[tav1]

I hear what Bruno is saying but I do think there are better options than Finley. James Jones is a better option and is unrestricted, as you know. I'm sure you'll agree that we should exhast those options before falling back on Finley.

It's nice to know that our frontline is basically set between now and 2010, though. Udoka will be valuable rotation guy next season. There are servicable options to plug holes. The problem is that the Lakers are very good, and I'm not sure we can compete with them next season if we're merely plugging holes. We can win this year, but we will need to inject the team with a fresh legs for next season if we want to compete for a title then.

[pad300]

All of these are good and plausible suggestions, but Bruno is alluding to a very good point...

When you combine a FAs likely contract demand with their talent, are you going to get a better deal than Finley?

Some suggested FAs should be ruled out because they're too far-fetched, like Corey Maggette (sorry SenorSpur!), while others are also unlikely because of their "restricted" status (i.e. Navarro, Delfino, 2004 1st rounders).

After those considerations you're essentially left with:

Mickael Pietrus
James Jones
Jarvis Hayes
Gerald Green

I guess the question then becomes, will any of those above individuals be willing to take a two-year deal, or a three-year deal with the third year as a team option? And, while they may be younger, are they really an upgrade over Finley talent-wise?

That's obviously what the Spurs FO will be looking at this Summer, but here would be my guess....

Spurs hold off on any FA that may have an "impact" to the roster next year, and instead opt to get younger on the wing with a draft choice or with someone currently in the system (i.e. Williams).

Of the other two veterans with expiring contracts, I see one staying on (Kurt Thomas) and one moving on (Damon Stoudamire). There is another opportunity to inject some fresh, young talent.


Looking at it, I don't think we spread our money around; the roster will not have that many spots needing filling.
Roster (Currently signed for 08/09, total of 15 spots)
Bigs (5) - Bonner, Oberto, Duncan, Mahinmi, Splitter*
* Almost certain to come on a rookie contract
Wings (4) - Manu, Bowen, Udoka, Barry
Point (2) - Tony, Vaughn

We need a big, 2 wings, and a pg to fill out the roster.
The big will need to be an experienced veteran, as we are already carrying 2 near-rookies (Mahinmi, Splitter). Conveniently, we have Kurt Thomas's bird rights. I expect him to be signed for 2 years, at something around 8 million (4/year). This money would be bird right money, and wouldn't come out of our exceptions.
The PG I expect to be another veteran. Pop loves him a reliable veteran, and chews up rookie PGs. So no point in bringing one in. I wouldn't be surprised to see Stoudamire back, or maybe Cassell for the LLE.
We need 2 wing players...I expect us to draft a wing in the 1st round. There are several who are expected to be drafted 25-30. From DraftExpress, picks 25-29, Tyler Smith (SF, 6'7"), Bill Walker (SF, 6'6"), Sam Young (SF/PF, 6'6"), Brandon Rush (SG/SF 6'7"), Shan Foster (SG 6'6")...That leaves us with 1 spot to fill, and the entire MLE... Not to mention 2 second round picks. I could see us drafting Shawn James or Marcus Dove as a project and keeping them around...

I will say that I can't see Finley back. Senor Spur is right that we need to inject some youth at the wing positions. Given Barry has already jumped into a spot on next season's roster, I think he's moving on (or retiring).

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Great summary, pad300. :tu



Today is the 29th of February, a day that only happens every four years.
Seems to me like they should be special.

The last Feb 29th was great for me. It was on that day that I met Manu for the first time and, while in line for that, I met one of my best friends. :)

Wow, that was a good day for you, Angel. :)

Personally, I can't remember what happened on any previous leap day... :depressed

[Bruno]

When I see unavailable players, I think that :
- The best ones who will ask for more than a 2 years contract aren't good enough eating 2010 cap space.
- The ones able to accept a 2 years contract aren't as good as an old Finley.

Saying that, I understand people that disagrees with this. As suggested by some people, Spurs could do something more creative like a trade or could have still targeted an unknown diamond in the draft.

Finley will be 35 years old with a lot of mileage. He is still scoring 10ppg in 27mpg but he could decide to retire this summer. If he retires, all this discussion will be moot. It's also possible that Barry retire even if he is still under contract.

The "what I would do, if I were GM" discussion is interesting but it's more interesting to know what Spurs FO would do.
If Finley has a decent end of season and doesn't want to retire, do you see Pop saying him "We don't need you because we want to go younger and you can sign elsewhere" ?

[SenorSpur]

All of these are good and plausible suggestions, but Bruno is alluding to a very good point...

When you combine a FAs likely contract demand with their talent, are you going to get a better deal than Finley?

Some suggested FAs should be ruled out because they're too far-fetched, like Corey Maggette (sorry SenorSpur!), while others are also unlikely because of their "restricted" status (i.e. Navarro, Delfino, 2004 1st rounders).

After those considerations you're essentially left with:

Mickael Pietrus
James Jones
Jarvis Hayes
Gerald Green

I guess the question then becomes, will any of those above individuals be willing to take a two-year deal, or a three-year deal with the third year as a team option? And, while they may be younger, are they really an upgrade over Finley talent-wise?

That's obviously what the Spurs FO will be looking at this Summer, but here would be my guess....

Spurs hold off on any FA that may have an "impact" to the roster next year, and instead opt to get younger on the wing with a draft choice or with someone currently in the system (i.e. Williams).

Of the other two veterans with expiring contracts, I see one staying on (Kurt Thomas) and one moving on (Damon Stoudamire). There is another opportunity to inject some fresh, young talent.

At this point, I know Corey Maggette is a pipe dream. In my original post, I did indicate that he'll be far too expensive for the Spurs. I've just had him on my personal wishlist since last year.

[SenorSpur]

If Finley has a decent end of season and doesn't want to retire, do you see Pop saying him "We don't need you because we want to go younger and you can sign elsewhere" ?

Given Pop's soft spot for the 30-something year-old veteran, I can't see him turning Finley away. However, if he can get a free-agent swingman that has equal or better skills, he is compelled to go after him. The foremost objective for Pop and R.C. is to improve the team every year and keep it in championship contention.

One interesting point to the Finley debate is that the exhoribant salary that he's getting from the Mavs will be coming to an end. Thus, he will be an UFA at the end of the season. Therefore, how much will be looking for next season? It's quite possible he may price himself out of the Spurs range anyway.

[loveforthegame]

If Finley was about money then he would have taken the other offers on the table over the Spurs a few years ago. He won't be getting MLE offers from teams if he continues to play and the Spurs don't want him.

And Cuban will be paying Finley until he's 40 because of the deferred payment clause in his contract when he was waived. Finley will be getting $5 million a year from Cuban long after he retires.

[coopdogg3]

What would you guys think about Josh Childress? He's not the Bowen-replacement that we've been looking for - but I'm beginning to think there is no Bowen replacement.

7. Josh Childress, Hawks -- Childress doesn't get nearly the respect or hype of many of his teammates in Atlanta, but he's been a devastatingly effective sixth man and seems expendable given all of Atlanta's wing talent. He probably can't get more than a midlevel deal on this market, but he'd be a bargain at that price.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=FreeAgents--071127

2004-05 .470 .823 13.6 8.1 2.5 54.3 15.1 10.6 15.1 11.8 15.22
2005-06 .552 .766 13.2 6.9 2.3 62.6 15.9 12.3 13.1 10.3 15.83
2006-07 .504 .795 14.1 6.7 2.5 58.6 15.5 9.8 14.7 10.1 16.24
2007-08 .589 .839 16.2 6.6 1.9 65.9 11.6 12.0 15.1 9.5 18.11
2007-08 (projected) .510 .780 14.5 6.5 2.8 59.7 16.42 10.7 15.18 9.91 16.60

2006-07 season: One of the game's most underrated players, Childress missed 27 games with injuries and predictably failed to maintain the crazy 55.2 percent shooting mark of a season earlier. However, his game developed enough in other areas that he still showed a gentle improvement in PER. Although used as a sub he was effectively a starter, averaging 36.9 minutes a game and often entering just a few minutes into the contest.

While his percentages weren't quite as high, Childress remained one of the rare perimeter players who can make an impact without needing the ball. He ranked seventh among small forwards in true shooting percentage and 10th in free throw attempts per field goal attempt, allowing him to score at a decent clip despite taking relatively few shots. Childress also cut down his turnovers from a season earlier, putting him ahead of the league average for his position.

Scouting report: A solid two-way player, Childress is an athletic wing who is a strong finisher around the basket and an outstanding offensive rebounder. He also draws fouls at a high rate and converts from the charity stripe, which is what helps keep his TS% so high.

He's a good ball handler and can get to the basket against slower players, but opponents lay off him because they don't respect his jumper, and that limits his opportunities. Childress didn't shoot the J often last season, and when he did it wasn't pretty. He made 33.8 percent from downtown and just 30.4 percent of his long 2-pointers. He shoots a flick shot from under his chin a la Shawn Marion, but without as much arc or accuracy.

At 6-8, Childress' size makes him a good defender against bigger wing players and an excellent roamer in zones, although he can be outmuscled by wide bodies in post-ups. He was often used as a stopper but isn't quite in that caliber in terms of his lateral movement.

2007-08 outlook: Childress is due for an extension this fall and should get a fairly sizable reward for his production the past few seasons, though it's likely his low national exposure will work against him. Similar players have been rewarded with five-year deals in the $40-50 million range, but one wonders if he'll get much above $30 million because of his relative anonymity.

Nonetheless, if you're looking for a Sixth Man Award candidate, you might want to stop here for a minute. Childress played huge minutes as a reserve last season and is likely to do so again, and he's been one of the most productive subs in basketball the past two seasons. And while Manu Ginobili and Leandro Barbosa are the clear front-runners, they might end up starting by year-end. Additionally the Hawks should be a lot better this season, and surprise teams tend to be massively overrepresented in individual award votes.

I'm not saying to go to Vegas and plunk down $100 on him winning it, but crazier things have happened.

Of course, he might work his way in as a starter himself. Certainly there was no reason to have him playing behind Marvin Williams other than that the Hawks seemed to like using him off the pine.

Most similar at age: Sean Elliott

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/players/hollinger?playerId=2373

Don't know how well Childress would work into the "2010 Plan", but he could be a good player for the MLE. Our resident Atlanta Hawk expert, Chump, might know how he's playing this year. LOL.

[ducks]

barry will play the three point specialist that horry is playing

bonner will take horry's minutes though

[Rummpd]

They are signing that "never been" Giracheck (or however you spell it) as a consolation prize.

Just like if you cannot have Tim Duncan they went after Shaq - I like Kerr but he is really on the hotspot as a GM right now.

[AFBlue]

At this point, I know Corey Maggette is a pipe dream. In my original post, I did indicate that he'll be far too expensive for the Spurs. I've just had him on my personal wishlist since last year.

I know, and I share your opinion on this guy. There were so many naysayers that thought Maggette would be a chemistry problem when the Spurs were rumored to go after him last year offering BENO and Brent....rediculous.

I would LOVE to somehow get Maggette on this team and IMO, he is a guy that you bust 2010 for in some way if need be.

But as you indictated, it's such a longshot I'm guessing it never happens.

[Spurs Brazil]

There were actually two interested teams in the Brent Barry hunt -- as much as we love Bones, not sure we can call it a full-fledged sweepstakes -- that could have claimed Barry off waivers.

Neither Phoenix nor Golden State had anywhere close to the requisite salary-cap room to absorb Barry's $5.5 million salary, but both teams possess a sizable trade exception that, according to league rules, could have been used to snag Barry before he had the right to choose his next stop after clearing waivers.

The Suns, though, are more than $3.5 million into luxury-tax territory already. Had they used their $8.1 million trade exception created last summer when Kurt Thomas was dealt to Seattle, Barry would have cost them nearly $8 million for the rest of the season in salary and tax payments. Although Barry had less than half of his salary remaining with all teams at or close to the 60-game mark, Phoenix would have been required to pay the full $5.5 million in luxury tax on Barry at season's end.

So as much as it would have loved to have him, Phoenix naturally preferred to let Barry clear waivers and then try to convince him not to return to the Spurs. Yet once Barry decided against a switch to the desert, I'd still say it makes more sense for the Suns to settle for Philadelphia's freshly waived Gordan Giricek as a minimum-salaried addition as opposed to bringing Barry in on a high-dollar waiver claim.

Golden State, meanwhile, quietly chased Barry (and his Bay Area ties) hard and still has a $9,999,999 trade exception from its Jason Richardson trade with Charlotte on draft night. The Warriors, furthermore, are some $8.3 million under the luxury-tax threshold, meaning that they could have claimed Barry off waivers with no tax liability.

Yet it appears that the Warriors preferred to hold onto the trade exception -- which doesn't expire until four days after this June's draft -- to save it for something bigger. Which is likewise hard to argue given that many more player-acquisition possibilities present themselves closer to the draft.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Once Barry cleared waivers, Dallas had the most to offer financially. That's because the Mavs declined to spend their $5.2 million mid-level exception last summer and still had more than $3.7 million of that amount to offer to the various buyout recipients like Barry and Sam Cassell, even though all leftover mid-level exceptions get reduced by $31,506 per day starting Jan. 10.

But NBA front-office sources say that Dallas, like Phoenix, was not prepared to make a major cash expenditure on a player who might or might not make a significant stretch-run impact.

With the Mavs believing all along that Barry was headed back to San Antonio, sources say Dallas offered him $1.5 million for the rest of this season and $1.5 million next season.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-080301-02

[tav1]

Josh Childress: there was a report earlier this year that the Spurs took a run at him. He wouldn't be a bad fit, and take a run at him in a sign and trade situation with a team option after year 2. Perhaps, Bonner and Oberto for Childress, or something like that. He's in a weird spot because the Hawks are overloaded at wing and their ownership is crazy. Maybe Atlanta simply wouldn't match.

Maggette is not a bad option, but out of our price range.

From what I've read, Artest will be seeking a multi-year MLE. If we can build in a team option in after two seasons, I'd go for that in a heart beat. His outside stroke is shaky and he's insane, but he can ball. I'm increasingly of the opinion that winning anda healthy team culture could hold him in check.

[xmas1997]

If Finley was about money then he would have taken the other offers on the table over the Spurs a few years ago. He won't be getting MLE offers from teams if he continues to play and the Spurs don't want him.

And Cuban will be paying Finley until he's 40 because of the deferred payment clause in his contract when he was waived. Finley will be getting $5 million a year from Cuban long after he retires.

I agree.
Plus getting Finley for a couple more years at the Vet Min will probably be the way the Spurs go, if he will accept that.
I think he would in order to stay with the Spurs, the team that got him a championship and maybe two by the time it matters most.
Thinking this is the most probably conclusion, still I think the Spurs bring in some younger talent if they can draft them for the developmental league.

[xmas1997]

Josh Childress: there was a report earlier this year that the Spurs took a run at him. He wouldn't be a bad fit, and take a run at him in a sign and trade situation with a team option after year 2. Perhaps, Bonner and Oberto for Childress, or something like that. He's in a weird spot because the Hawks are overloaded at wing and their ownership is crazy. Maybe Atlanta simply wouldn't match.

Maggette is not a bad option, but out of our price range.

From what I've read, Artest will be seeking a multi-year MLE. If we can build in a team option in after two seasons, I'd go for that in a heart beat. His outside stroke is shaky and he's insane, but he can ball. I'm increasingly of the opinion that winning anda healthy team culture could hold him in check.


Not so sure about Artest. IMHO the only thing that will help that guy is consistant Meds, not winning and a healthy culture.
And if I'm right about that, those same Meds would mess with his game. :downspin:

[AFBlue]

What would you guys think about Josh Childress? He's not the Bowen-replacement that we've been looking for - but I'm beginning to think there is no Bowen replacement.

7. Josh Childress, Hawks -- Childress doesn't get nearly the respect or hype of many of his teammates in Atlanta, but he's been a devastatingly effective sixth man and seems expendable given all of Atlanta's wing talent. He probably can't get more than a midlevel deal on this market, but he'd be a bargain at that price.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insider/columns/story?columnist=ford_chad&page=FreeAgents--071127

2004-05 .470 .823 13.6 8.1 2.5 54.3 15.1 10.6 15.1 11.8 15.22
2005-06 .552 .766 13.2 6.9 2.3 62.6 15.9 12.3 13.1 10.3 15.83
2006-07 .504 .795 14.1 6.7 2.5 58.6 15.5 9.8 14.7 10.1 16.24
2007-08 .589 .839 16.2 6.6 1.9 65.9 11.6 12.0 15.1 9.5 18.11
2007-08 (projected) .510 .780 14.5 6.5 2.8 59.7 16.42 10.7 15.18 9.91 16.60

2006-07 season: One of the game's most underrated players, Childress missed 27 games with injuries and predictably failed to maintain the crazy 55.2 percent shooting mark of a season earlier. However, his game developed enough in other areas that he still showed a gentle improvement in PER. Although used as a sub he was effectively a starter, averaging 36.9 minutes a game and often entering just a few minutes into the contest.

While his percentages weren't quite as high, Childress remained one of the rare perimeter players who can make an impact without needing the ball. He ranked seventh among small forwards in true shooting percentage and 10th in free throw attempts per field goal attempt, allowing him to score at a decent clip despite taking relatively few shots. Childress also cut down his turnovers from a season earlier, putting him ahead of the league average for his position.

Scouting report: A solid two-way player, Childress is an athletic wing who is a strong finisher around the basket and an outstanding offensive rebounder. He also draws fouls at a high rate and converts from the charity stripe, which is what helps keep his TS% so high.

He's a good ball handler and can get to the basket against slower players, but opponents lay off him because they don't respect his jumper, and that limits his opportunities. Childress didn't shoot the J often last season, and when he did it wasn't pretty. He made 33.8 percent from downtown and just 30.4 percent of his long 2-pointers. He shoots a flick shot from under his chin a la Shawn Marion, but without as much arc or accuracy.

At 6-8, Childress' size makes him a good defender against bigger wing players and an excellent roamer in zones, although he can be outmuscled by wide bodies in post-ups. He was often used as a stopper but isn't quite in that caliber in terms of his lateral movement.

2007-08 outlook: Childress is due for an extension this fall and should get a fairly sizable reward for his production the past few seasons, though it's likely his low national exposure will work against him. Similar players have been rewarded with five-year deals in the $40-50 million range, but one wonders if he'll get much above $30 million because of his relative anonymity.

Nonetheless, if you're looking for a Sixth Man Award candidate, you might want to stop here for a minute. Childress played huge minutes as a reserve last season and is likely to do so again, and he's been one of the most productive subs in basketball the past two seasons. And while Manu Ginobili and Leandro Barbosa are the clear front-runners, they might end up starting by year-end. Additionally the Hawks should be a lot better this season, and surprise teams tend to be massively overrepresented in individual award votes.

I'm not saying to go to Vegas and plunk down $100 on him winning it, but crazier things have happened.

Of course, he might work his way in as a starter himself. Certainly there was no reason to have him playing behind Marvin Williams other than that the Hawks seemed to like using him off the pine.

Most similar at age: Sean Elliott

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/players/hollinger?playerId=2373

Don't know how well Childress would work into the "2010 Plan", but he could be a good player for the MLE. Our resident Atlanta Hawk expert, Chump, might know how he's playing this year. LOL.

He may be a bench player, but make no mistake about it....he is every bit as important to the success of that team as Williams or even Smith, who start for the Hawks.

I would expect the Hawks to offer a contract greater than the MLE ($6-7M/yr). Or they could just go the easy route and wait for some team to offer him the MLE, then match....which they'd do.

They've still got Williams and Horford on a rookie scale for a few more years, so no decision needs to be made in regards to them for now. And Bibby will be their point guard for at least one more season before they have to decide whether to cut bait with him.

Bottom Line: There's no advantage to letting J-Chill go, so the Hawks will retain him.

[AFBlue]

Josh Childress: there was a report earlier this year that the Spurs took a run at him. He wouldn't be a bad fit, and take a run at him in a sign and trade situation with a team option after year 2. Perhaps, Bonner and Oberto for Childress, or something like that. He's in a weird spot because the Hawks are overloaded at wing and their ownership is crazy. Maybe Atlanta simply wouldn't match.



One quick note on this....the ownership situation has cleared up for now, so I wouldn't foresee any problems with the Hawks making long-term extensions to their players.

Case in point: Assuming the last two years and $30M of a Bibby contract....never woulda happened if the ownership was still in flux.

[AFBlue]

Josh Childress: there was a report earlier this year that the Spurs took a run at him. He wouldn't be a bad fit, and take a run at him in a sign and trade situation with a team option after year 2. Perhaps, Bonner and Oberto for Childress, or something like that. He's in a weird spot because the Hawks are overloaded at wing and their ownership is crazy. Maybe Atlanta simply wouldn't match.



One more note....

The Hawks are not overloaded at wing because they choose to play Williams/Smith at PF and Horford/Pachulia at C.

In a more traditional lineup, I guess you could say that statement was true...but for the Hawks purposes it's not.

[ss1986v2]

He's a good ball handler and can get to the basket against slower players, but opponents lay off him because they don't respect his jumper, and that limits his opportunities. Childress didn't shoot the J often last season, and when he did it wasn't pretty. He made 33.8 percent from downtown and just 30.4 percent of his long 2-pointers. He shoots a flick shot from under his chin a la Shawn Marion, but without as much arc or accuracy.

At 6-8, Childress' size makes him a good defender against bigger wing players and an excellent roamer in zones, although he can be outmuscled by wide bodies in post-ups. He was often used as a stopper but isn't quite in that caliber in terms of his lateral movement.
this has always been my concern with chill. poor perimeter shooting combined with poor foot speed to cover the faster wing players and poor size to cover the bigger wings. hes a good player, and i wouldnt hate having him. just not sure id want to give him 3+ years at the full MLE. theres a couple of players whose skill set i value more.

plus theres the whole "no way the hawks let him walk" issue. chill wont be changing teams unless its in a trade, and the hawks are getting value back.

[Bruno]

For the moment, the 2010 plan is Spurs having $25M in cap space with Duncan, Parker, Splitter, Mahinmi and Spurs' 2008 first round pick.
Spurs could have a little more cap space by giving up on Splitter, Mahinmi or the 2008 first round pick. If they give up on all three, spurs will have $27M in cap space.

$25M is a lot of money to spend.
If Spurs sign a player to a reasonable contract past 2010, it won't mean the end of the 2010 plan. However, I don't see them eating that $3M or $4M of that cap space for some mediocre role players in the James Jones mold.