Ocho-Cinco to Cowboys?

[macdude06]

Posted: Thursday March 20, 2008 08:32AM ET
Chad Johnson could've climbed on the coffee table on the middle of the Best Damn Sports Show Period set tonight and yelled at the top of his lungs "Trade me to to Dallas!!!" And he really wouldn't have been much more clear than he was in batting his eyes in the direction of Valley Ranch. "If I end up in Dallas, I would just look at which finger I'm gonna put it on," Johnson declared. "That's it. Ain't no ifs, ands or buts about it."

Dallas Morning News

I WISH :smokin

[stretch]

get the fuck out.

[monosylab1k]

I am so sick of hearing about Chad Johnson. I used to enjoy his antics but he's annoying as hell now. What team would want a prick like that?

[samikeyp]

I am so sick of hearing about Chad Johnson. I used to enjoy his antics but he's annoying as hell now. What team would want a prick like that?

A team whose top 4 WR's include one aging Pro-Bowler, another coming off injuries and getting older and one who is young but yaps his mouth more than he catches. Also a team whose tight end led the team in catches.

A team who seems to thrive in a circus like atmosphere.

Sounds like Dallas to me.

[Evan]

A team who seems to thrive in a circus like atmosphere.

Sounds like Dallas to me.

Circus? How?

Everything they do gets blown up by the media and I don't recall any real problems here for some time.

[2centsworth]

for a 3rd rounder maybe.

[Dirk Nowitzki]

I'd prefer Lions WR Roy Williams. Basically a much younger version of TO who is also fast. Can we fucking even afford ocho-cinco? I dont think we have any capspace to make such a move.


BTW I heard if they trade Saftey Roy Williams he counts against the cap regardless. Either way I say if the Bengals want him, they can have him.

[Evan]

Can we fucking even afford ocho-cinco? I dont think we have any capspace to make such a move.

This is a total pipe dream but I think Dallas is right at the cap but one of the lowest teams in the NFL in dead money cap space. As in Dallas doesn't have a bunch of cap space eaten up by players no lober here like we did in the 90's and early 00's. Also I don't think they have a bunch of weird restructured deals.

But..you can safely do that a few times I gues but I would rather not go down that road again.

[Evan]

for a 3rd rounder maybe.

Is that what you would give up or is that what you think Cin would want?

[Dirk Nowitzki]

If Boldin could be had, I would easily take him. Washington isnt getting him but it shouldnt be a surprise they are involved in every rumor. Philly could land him. Mcnabb (hate to say this cuz he plays on a divisional rival) is due to have some fucking help. He is pushing the Eagles front office to do something. A guy like Boldin makes that passing O solid again. Guys like Reggie Brown, Baskins (may not have that name right) would be nice supporting options for Boldin. Plus the Eagles D is going to be really good if they can stay healthy. Oh and I forgot they have one of the most underrated and unselfish backs in the league in Brian Westbrook who is coming off his best season ever. He will only get better. As much as I hate the eagles due to them being our most hated rival (along with them OWNING us over the past decade), I love Westbrook.

[samikeyp]

Circus? How?

Everything they do gets blown up by the media and I don't recall any real problems here for some time.


I am as big of a Cowboys fan as there is and have been since birth. I won't say when that was but the President at the time "was not a crook" :lol

Cowboys history is full of colorful figures, the latest being TO. Does the media feed into it? Absolutely but T.O. does quite a bit to feed it also. It wasn't as bad this year as the year before but if Johnson came in, that spotlight will be brighter.

[Evan]

I am as big of a Cowboys fan as there is and have been since birth. I won't say when that was but the President at the time "was not a crook" :lol

Cowboys history is full of colorful figures, the latest being TO. Does the media feed into it? Absolutely but T.O. does quite a bit to feed it also. It wasn't as bad this year as the year before but if Johnson came in, that spotlight will be brighter.

Ok fair enough. :toast

I thought you were referring to the modern Cowboys. Cowboys will always be in the spotlight. I would rather have that than the complete apathy that the Rangers have.

[macdude06]

i heard if dallas restructures romo's deal and TO's that could save around 5-6 million

[Evan]

i heard if dallas restructures romo's deal and TO's that could save around 5-6 million

This is TO's last year and yeah Romo would be the first to mess with I guess but I don't want to start doing that again unless Dallas is 100% sure they are that close.

[macdude06]

This is TO's last year and yeah Romo would be the first to mess with I guess but I don't want to start doing that again unless Dallas is 100% sure they are that close.

sign TO to an extension with more gauranteed just later in the signing

[Evan]

Yeah I hear ya but TO and Chad on a long term basis....not so sure.

Never happen anyway but what a WR tandem...

[macdude06]

Chad Said he could get along..Hes gettin up in age where he wants to win..Call me crazy but i could see it happeneing..this is the 2nd year To hasnt calle dhim a problem. OCHO hasnt really ever caused a problem..just b/c he likes to show off doesnt mean hes a bad guy

[leemajors]

the boys are bumping up against the cap already. taking on a salary like that won't happen, even with a trade. i'd rather they draft someone.

[Evan]

the boys are bumping up against the cap already. taking on a salary like that won't happen, even with a trade. i'd rather they draft someone.

Agree.

[macdude06]

trade for OCHO sign for a new contract that is backloaded and when theres no salary cap room we are good...most rookie wideouts take awhile to produce

[leemajors]

trade for OCHO sign for a new contract that is backloaded and when theres no salary cap room we are good...most rookie wideouts take awhile to produce
backloaded contracts blow. JJ has actually been pretty good about frontloading stuff recently.

[2centsworth]

Is that what you would give up or is that what you think Cin would want?
what I think at most what the cowboys should give up. Chad is one of my favorites, but he's a cancer.

[macdude06]

backloaded contracts blow. JJ has actually been pretty good about frontloading stuff recently.

but when there is no salary cap in 10'then restructure it

[leemajors]

but when there is no salary cap in 10'then restructure it
there won't be a football season if there isn't a cap.

[macdude06]

there won't be a football season if there isn't a cap.

What?? You havent heard there getting rid of it..they vote on it i think in Nov. But Jerry said it loos like there wont be one

[Evan]

there won't be a football season if there isn't a cap.

There will be at least one year with no cap.

[macdude06]

they said once they get rid of it in 2010 then there will never be a salary cap again

[kskonn]

roy for chad would work for me, but if it is true that Roy still counts against the cap even if we trade him then I guess that won't work. It is also important to note that the cowboys could potentially end up with 4-5 very good draft picks that they will have to sign, I assume and Hope one of those is a receiver. I would also love to see them go afer Boldin and try to trade a 3rd for Fabian Washington, that guy has a dream contract. They would maybe have to even give up a second to get him and his incredibly awesome contract.If they could somehow get Bolding and Washington that would give them a lot of flexibility in the draft. I was looking online just now and it shows that they have 17 million in Cap space, I am assuming that does not include the potential salary for Hamlin if he signs the franchise tag tender, but I think they will work out a deal with him before the season.

[macdude06]

Dallas has about 3 million left in salary cap..If we trade Roy it counts like 4-5 million against us..

[kskonn]

Dallas has about 3 million left in salary cap..If we trade Roy it counts like 4-5 million against us..

Is that 3 million number assuming that we will pay hamlin 10mil this year? That sucks about roy. Is that from his signing bonus? I wonder how we are going to sign our draft picks.

[Evan]

Is that 3 million number assuming that we will pay hamlin 10mil this year? That sucks about roy. Is that from his signing bonus? I wonder how we are going to sign our draft picks.

The cap works different for for draft picks and players who are new to the league in general but still counts on the overall cap, just in a different way.

Don't ask me how exactly because I have tried so hard to understand it and it gives me such tired head. It's why the Cowboys were able to sign Drew Henson even though they had little cap space but then had limited room to sign their draft picks.

[macdude06]

30) Detroit: $4.4 million
31) Dallas: $3.9 million
32) Pittsburgh: $1.3 million

Just so you know.


best way to save money..
Cut Brad Johnson is the smart thing to do.

It will be $2.8M to keep him for next year. $2M base + 833k pro-rated signing bonus

By cutting him after June 1 we can save $2M on the cap. By cutting him before June 1 we can save $1.2M on the cap.

and restructure romo will help alot

[kskonn]

I thought Romos deal that took over this year would help with the cap? He must have a high base salary the first couple of years, I guess they could put it into a roster bonus or signing bonus to even it out over the life of his contract.

[macdude06]

I thought Romos deal that took over this year would help with the cap? He must have a high base salary the first couple of years, I guess they could put it into a roster bonus or signing bonus to even it out over the life of his contract.

romo signed a 60 omething million dollar contract and is gettin paid 6 million or so this season..

rothlesberger signed a 100 million dollar contract and is gettin paid 2 million this season

[mardigan]

The cap works different for for draft picks and players who are new to the league in general but still counts on the overall cap, just in a different way.

Don't ask me how exactly because I have tried so hard to understand it and it gives me such tired head. It's why the Cowboys were able to sign Drew Henson even though they had little cap space but then had limited room to sign their draft picks.
Jeff Boyer, Rockford, Ohio: I don't really understand the financials of trading players in the NFL, but do know that you can take some cap hits. How big of cap hits would Akin Ayodele or Bobby Carpenter be to the Cowboys if they traded them? Also, can the teams trading for these players help with the cap hit?

Mickey: No, they can't. Now one more time: The cap hits stem from prorated signing bonuses. Those bonuses already have been paid or guaranteed, but are delayed hitting the cap. If you trade a guy, the remainder of the proration accelerates into your cap. Take Ayodele. He's easy. Received a $5 million signing bonus on a five-year deal, so that divides out to $1 million a year. He's been here two years, so two-fifths of the proration already has been accounted for. Another fifth ($1 million) hits this year. If you trade him, then the remaining $2 million also hits, but they would then get back his $2.5 million base salary. So the Cowboys look at it as a $500,000 saving since the $1 million already is counting in 2008 no matter what. I look at it as costing you $3 million for nobody. As for Carpenter, he's more expensive since his signing bonus/guarantees totaled $7.5 million on a five-year deal. That means there still is $4.5 million of unaccounted proration. So trading him means the Cowboys take a $4.5 million hit, and really, his base salary isn't much, like $600,000 or so.

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news.cfm?contentType=5&id=BEBFE20F-F25D-50A1-EB47F7CBC2EB3919

[kskonn]

Jeff Boyer, Rockford, Ohio: I don't really understand the financials of trading players in the NFL, but do know that you can take some cap hits. How big of cap hits would Akin Ayodele or Bobby Carpenter be to the Cowboys if they traded them? Also, can the teams trading for these players help with the cap hit?

Mickey: No, they can't. Now one more time: The cap hits stem from prorated signing bonuses. Those bonuses already have been paid or guaranteed, but are delayed hitting the cap. If you trade a guy, the remainder of the proration accelerates into your cap. Take Ayodele. He's easy. Received a $5 million signing bonus on a five-year deal, so that divides out to $1 million a year. He's been here two years, so two-fifths of the proration already has been accounted for. Another fifth ($1 million) hits this year. If you trade him, then the remaining $2 million also hits, but they would then get back his $2.5 million base salary. So the Cowboys look at it as a $500,000 saving since the $1 million already is counting in 2008 no matter what. I look at it as costing you $3 million for nobody. As for Carpenter, he's more expensive since his signing bonus/guarantees totaled $7.5 million on a five-year deal. That means there still is $4.5 million of unaccounted proration. So trading him means the Cowboys take a $4.5 million hit, and really, his base salary isn't much, like $600,000 or so.

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news.cfm?contentType=5&id=BEBFE20F-F25D-50A1-EB47F7CBC2EB3919


I wonder if a team can send cash that can in turn allow the cowboys to recoup the cap space, same as when a team goes after a player for their signing bonus, similiar to Ricky williams or Michael Vick.

[kskonn]

Also it is a shame that the cowboys have to take a 4.5 million dollar cap hit on Carpenter. From what is sounds like on nfl radio on Sirius a lot of teams would be really interested in having him on their roster.

[Evan]

I wonder if a team can send cash that can in turn allow the cowboys to recoup the cap space, same as when a team goes after a player for their signing bonus, similiar to Ricky williams or Michael Vick.

No. Otherwise rich teams like Dallas and Washington would be taking in trades all the time.

[Evan]

Jeff Boyer, Rockford, Ohio: I don't really understand the financials of trading players in the NFL, but do know that you can take some cap hits. How big of cap hits would Akin Ayodele or Bobby Carpenter be to the Cowboys if they traded them? Also, can the teams trading for these players help with the cap hit?

Mickey: No, they can't. Now one more time: The cap hits stem from prorated signing bonuses. Those bonuses already have been paid or guaranteed, but are delayed hitting the cap. If you trade a guy, the remainder of the proration accelerates into your cap. Take Ayodele. He's easy. Received a $5 million signing bonus on a five-year deal, so that divides out to $1 million a year. He's been here two years, so two-fifths of the proration already has been accounted for. Another fifth ($1 million) hits this year. If you trade him, then the remaining $2 million also hits, but they would then get back his $2.5 million base salary. So the Cowboys look at it as a $500,000 saving since the $1 million already is counting in 2008 no matter what. I look at it as costing you $3 million for nobody. As for Carpenter, he's more expensive since his signing bonus/guarantees totaled $7.5 million on a five-year deal. That means there still is $4.5 million of unaccounted proration. So trading him means the Cowboys take a $4.5 million hit, and really, his base salary isn't much, like $600,000 or so.

http://www.dallascowboys.com/news.cfm?contentType=5&id=BEBFE20F-F25D-50A1-EB47F7CBC2EB3919

2 different things.

You're talking about trading players from the draft. I'm talking about signing draft picks under the cap.

[kskonn]

No. Otherwise rich teams like Dallas and Washington would be taking in trades all the time.


I guess I should have clarified, can a team send cash to be used towards the cap and in turn lose that cap space themselves.

Example

Cowboys trade roy williams, the team who he goes to sends 4 million in cash(the remainder of the prorated signing bonus) In turn they can take the cap hit over the remainder of the roys contract. Still don't think it could happen, just a thought.

[macdude06]

When a player signs a deal, they are paid the bonuses immediately. Then, the bonus cap hit is prorated over the life of the contract. So the player gets the money right away, but, so the cap hit is not ridiculous, the bonus CAP HIT (just a number against the cap. The money has already been dealt) is divided evenly over the whole life of the deal. But when a player is cut or traded, the deal no longer belongs to the team who paid the bonus. Therefore, all remaining cap hit from the bonus gets accelerated into that year's cap space. So even though the money was paid to Chad long ago, the cap hit is still being spaced out, a few million bucks a year, so the cap is not overloaded in one season. If he gets traded, then Cinci has to swallow that hit right away.

That is why Dallas can't take on any of the hit. This isn't the NBA where teams can trade money. It is against the rules AND Chad has already gotten all that money. The issue right now is just a number on Cinci's cap (and the fact they paid a huge bonus worthy of a multi year deal to a guy who only played out like two years for them.)

[Evan]

I guess I should have clarified, can a team send cash to be used towards the cap and in turn lose that cap space themselves.

Example

Cowboys trade roy williams, the team who he goes to sends 4 million in cash(the remainder of the prorated signing bonus) In turn they can take the cap hit over the remainder of the roys contract. Still don't think it could happen, just a thought.

No. That is not how the NFL works. Cap hits are unmovable. If it's on your team there is zero relief.

Like I said, if it was that easy the Cowboys and Redskins would be a sponge for upcoming contracts from teams that can't afford to re-sign a player. That is very much how the English Premier League works (but they don't have a cap but teams commonly trade players for money, it's basically how free agency works in soccer)

[Evan]

When a player signs a deal, they are paid the bonuses immediately. Then, the bonus cap hit is prorated over the life of the contract. So the player gets the money right away, but, so the cap hit is not ridiculous, the bonus CAP HIT (just a number against the cap. The money has already been dealt) is divided evenly over the whole life of the deal. But when a player is cut or traded, the deal no longer belongs to the team who paid the bonus. Therefore, all remaining cap hit from the bonus gets accelerated into that year's cap space. So even though the money was paid to Chad long ago, the cap hit is still being spaced out, a few million bucks a year, so the cap is not overloaded in one season. If he gets traded, then Cinci has to swallow that hit right away.

That is why Dallas can't take on any of the hit. This isn't the NBA where teams can trade money. It is against the rules AND Chad has already gotten all that money. The issue right now is just a number on Cinci's cap (and the fact they paid a huge bonus worthy of a multi year deal to a guy who only played out like two years for them.)

yup yup

[Evan]

The NBA cap system is basically idiotic, the MLB is suicide on its future and the NFL's is so confusing the teams have a group people hired to solely work on the number.

Steven Jones designed the darn thing initially and even he has said it's extremely difficult to know at all times where a team’s cap is at and how it will be affected by various moves until you sit down and really study it.

If I am not mistaken the previous seasons reported cap isn't even turned in yet by the teams. I don't think it's due until right before the draft. So the team has to tell the league what its salary was and explain why and the league verifies it by what the NFLPA reports. I think that is how it basically works.