Doctor shot in stone oak

[King]

If anyone hears her name, can you post it? My doctor is in that office. JB?

[mrsmaalox]

If anyone hears her name, can you post it? My doctor is in that office. JB?
Details please.

[King]

I'm typing this from an iPhone, so I'm not getting wordy. Its on the news. From what I know, a patient's husband was upset with her treatment and shot the doc in the parking lot multiple times. Cops showed up and shot the suspect multiple times. 200 block of Sonterra

[Kori Ellis]

Details please.
http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=f2f5b1b2-ade5-4afd-b4b5-360946d20124

That's more details but the doctors name isn't there.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

SAN ANTONIO -- A shooting was reported Friday in front of an office complex Friday afternoon on the city's North Side.

Unconfirmed reports indicate that a woman was shot and the shooter was taken into police custody.

The shooting happened at 255 East Sonterra.

ksat.com

[peewee's lovechild]

Damn, I thought the Soufside was bad.

[Kori Ellis]

There's been a shooting at a North Side medical building.

The shooting took place at 255 East Sonterra.

The San Antonio Police Department said they received a call around 1:15 p.m. reporting that a woman at the building had been shot 3 times by a gunman.

The San Antonio Police Department is now reporting that a man shot a female doctor who was treating his wife. A police officer then arrived at the scene and found the man still standing over the doctor. The man refused to surrender his weapon and was shot by the officer. The doctor and the man have both been taken to University Hospital.

The building is a short distance from Reagan High School. A spokesperson for the Northeast Side School District says schools in the district are NOT under lockdown.

News 4 has a crew on the scene and will provide additional details as they become available.

[mrsmaalox]

Damn, I thought the Soufside was bad.

Right here in my own neighborhood!! We could call this the Norfside now.

[peewee's lovechild]

Right here in my own neighborhood!! We could call this the Norfside now.

I had no idea you were such a badass.

[mrsmaalox]

I had no idea you were such a badass.

Yea, but you had a feeling right? :cooldevil

[BacktoBasics]

Someone was a mexican or a black. I'm certain of it.

[SpursWoman]

Someone was a mexican or a black. I'm certain of it.


In Sonterra? I dunno .... :spin

[Fillmoe]

did either one of them die?

[MoSpur]

That is crazy.

[Los Spurs]

This world is getting crazier by the minute... I'm glad I have a good relationship with my Doctors.

[peewee's lovechild]

So, if I'm getting this right, the husband shot the doctor who happens to be female.

What kind of man would do that?

[Los Spurs]

So, if I'm getting this right, the husband shot the doctor who happens to be female.

What kind of man would do that?

:devil was in him

[peewee's lovechild]

:devil was in him

The Devil is in me too, but I don't go around shooting women.

[SpursWoman]

I just heard that the doctor didn't make it. :(

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

I'm updating at this link.

http://www.ksat.com/news/15795300/detail.html

Doc died at University Hospital at 2:27 p.m.

[Fillmoe]

thats some cold shit... i bet the dude ends up living.... its a cold cold world

[King]

Well...it was her. Can't say the name yet, nor how I heard it. But, it was her.

[peewee's lovechild]

I'm updating at this link.

http://www.ksat.com/news/15795300/detail.html

Doc died at University Hospital at 2:27 p.m.


That chicken shit bastard better not survive.

[thispego]

Well...it was her. Can't say the name yet, nor how I heard it. But, it was her.
might as well just tell us. you gonna get in trouble?

[peewee's lovechild]

"An officer nearby responded to the scene and found the shooter standing over the victim, according to police."

[King]

Not in trouble, but I'm assuming not all next of kin has been notified. And since the board is so wide-spread, and the place is so local - it's not far-fetched that somebody knows her/them. It'll be on the news soon enough, I'm sure. There are a lot of us from the office that use that medical center. That's how I found out. News travels fast.

[Denver>SA]

woai has the name


julie abbot

[thispego]

what kind of doctor was she?

[Denver>SA]

http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=f2f5b1b2-ade5-4afd-b4b5-360946d20124

[Denver>SA]

http://www.woai.com/media/news/9/7/2/972f5d0a-fc86-488b-b7d3-968c013cda3b/Story.jpg

[thispego]

what kind of doctor was she?
Internal Medicine

[thispego]

Sad, very very Sad

[King]

what kind of doctor was she?

Internal Medicine. General practice.

[King]

gah...

Witnesses told News 4 Dr. Abbott was attempting to break up a fight between the man and his wife at the time of the shooting.

[MoSpur]

So, she was trying to do good and the guy shoots her??? Wow.

[peewee's lovechild]

gah...

Witnesses told News 4 Dr. Abbott was attempting to break up a fight between the man and his wife at the time of the shooting.


No good deed goes unpunished.

[Denver>SA]

No good deed goes unpunished.
:married:

[MannyIsGod]

Why did it suspect it was your doctor? There are tons of doctors in that area.

[King]

Not just the area, it was the exact address of the medical offices. I saw that it was 255 Sonterra, and a female doctor. Just a gut feeling.

[mrsmaalox]

Really terrible.

[FromWayDowntown]

That's terrible, terrible news. It's shameful that some jackass could inflict such needless pain because someone had the temerity to tell him that he was acting like a jackass.

[BacktoBasics]

That's terrible, terrible news. It's shameful that some jackass could inflict such needless pain because someone had the temerity to tell him that he was acting like a jackass.
Maybe she attacked him and he defended himself with his legal firearm. Thank god we let people own and carry guns. I know I've gotten into fights with strangers before when people try to tell me to stop yelling and belittling my wife in public.

There is always two sides

[thispego]

Maybe she attacked him and he defended himself with his legal firearm. Thank god we let people own and carry guns. I know I've gotten into fights with strangers before when people try to tell me to stop yelling and belittling my wife in public.

There is always two sides
try again

[FromWayDowntown]

Maybe she attacked him and he defended himself with his legal firearm. Thank god we let people own and carry guns. I know I've gotten into fights with strangers before when people try to tell me to stop yelling and belittling my wife in public.

There is always two sides

If he was fighting with his wife, as was reported, being "attacked" by an intervener is hardly an excuse for killing that intervener.

You're right, however, that I should be reluctant to jump to conclusions without knowing what actually happened. My apologies for assuming the guy is a scumbag -- I should wait to see if the facts prove him to be a scumbag.

Your admission, however, is rather curious . . . . I'm not sure that a man has some fundamental right to yell at or belittle his wife in public or to shoot anyone who interferes with his exercise of that "right."

[BacktoBasics]

try againAlthough not likely it could very well happen. She stuck her nose in someone else's business. She may have gone after him. As if any of us here know.

I can promise you this much. Had a women and a man been fighting and a man went over to break it up and some bitch shot him. We'd all be taking a completely different spin on this.

"yeah some stranger came over and attacked Billy blah blah blah so I shot him." You guys all think alike. 99% of the general public flat fails to even begin to try to think something out. They just eat whats in front of them because they're hungry like stupid fucking cattle.

I wouldn't be suprised if the cop unloaded his gun a bit early too. Can never be too careful with people these days. Not saying the cop did anything wrong...just sayin.

[Johnny_Blaze_47]

This information is based on a preliminary investigation. At approximately 1:15 PM, San Antonio Police received a call for a shooting at 225 E. Sonterra. Officer Michael Blanquiz, a 7-year veteran, was in the immediate area and arrived within one minute of the call. As Officer Blanquiz arrived, he proceeded to the rear of the medical building and immediately saw a male standing over a female, who was shot and lying on the ground. Officer Blanquiz also saw that the male was armed with a handgun. Officer Blanquiz immediately exited his patrol car, drew his service weapon, and verbally ordered the suspect to drop his weapon. Instead, the suspect began to advance towards Officer Blanquiz. Officer Blanquiz retreated for cover behind his patrol car, while at the same time the suspect continued to advance. Fearing for his life, and the life of bystanders, Officer Blanquiz fired his weapon multiple times, striking the suspect. After being shot, the suspect went down and was then contained for medical attention. Officer Blanquiz was not injured. The revolver handgun the suspect was holding was recovered at the scene.

EMS responded to the scene and both the suspect and victim were transported to University Hospital for treatment. The victim, identified below, subsequently died from her gunshot wounds and the suspect is currently in surgery at University Hospital. The victim is a physician at the location where the shooting occurred, and it’s believed that the suspect is the spouse of one of the victim’s patients. At this time, the motive of the shooting is not known.

The identity of the suspect is being withheld pending the filing of formal charges.

[FromWayDowntown]

I can promise you this much. Had a women and a man been fighting and a man went over to break it up and some bitch shot him. We'd all be taking a completely different spin on this.

If a woman shot a man who was just trying to break up a fight, I'd think that was an indefensible act, too.

[tlongII]

Sometimes B2B just needs to shut the hell up.

[King]

Although not likely it could very well happen. She stuck her nose in someone else's business. She may have gone after him. As if any of us here know.

I can promise you this much. Had a women and a man been fighting and a man went over to break it up and some bitch shot him. We'd all be taking a completely different spin on this.

"yeah some stranger came over and attacked Billy blah blah blah so I shot him." You guys all think alike. 99% of the general public flat fails to even begin to try to think something out. They just eat whats in front of them because they're hungry like stupid fucking cattle.

I wouldn't be suprised if the cop unloaded his gun a bit early too. Can never be too careful with people these days. Not saying the cop did anything wrong...just sayin.

So, if the fight was physical, she shouldn't have 'stuck her nose in someone's business?'

I thought you taught common sense, coach.

[Los Spurs]

Sometimes B2B just needs to shut the hell up.

:toast

[BacktoBasics]

So, if the fight was physical, she shouldn't have 'stuck her nose in someone's business?'

I thought you taught common sense, coach.Yep. Common sense just told you it could cost you your life. You fail to see the finality in death I guess. That situation was absolutely none of her fucking business. I applaud her efforts to be a good human being. I think she meant to do the right thing or so it seems so far. But look at what it cost her. Her family, husband and kids if she has them will forever be without her. No amount of courage and honor can replace what is now gone. No memory or good time will ever bring her back no matter what load of shit someone feeds them to give comfort.

Why you people feel that doing good or that good was done can actually justify or replace life is beyond me. Fuck that I'd rather have my wife, mom or sister back.

People get so wrapped up in the notion of doing good and doing whats "right". Sometimes whats lost in the big picture far out weighs the "right" within the moment. I can promise you this much and without a shread of doubt if she could still breath and think she'd regret her move.

So in its most simple of terms common sense should show you something here. It won't though people will continue to think along some ficticious noble bullshit line because it helps give them reason and value for living.

[BacktoBasics]

Sometimes B2B just needs to shut the hell up.
Yeah because making it a conversation and bringing other perspectives to the table has no place on a message board.

[tlongII]

Yeah because making it a conversation and bringing other perspectives to the table has no place on a message board.

In this case you are full of shit.

[thispego]

Laughing My Fucking Ass Off at how smart and enlightened B2B thinks he is :lmao :lmao

[BacktoBasics]

In this case you are full of shit.How am I full of shit? She's fucking dead you blind fuck. She's not coming home all because she got in the middle of some other families business.

I'm not saying she attacted the dude for no reason....that was sarcasm and hypothetical. Jesus fuck sake.

I bet right now her family is wondering why this had to happen and why her and why her good deed goes punished. Answer: because she put herself in the middle of a situation that she shouldn't have. No fucking way was her life worth whatever effort she put into breaking this fight up. She wasn't protecting her child or her family or a helpless 5 year old from a rapist. Wake up people...your good deed doesn't carry on after death. Its death its final.

Sounds like some white trash piece of shit was banging his wife around and she popped in. Should have called security or maybe she did but no way would I ever think that any one of her family members wouldn't change the situation and plead with her to not take action, no way they think what she did was worth it.

Good deed: Yes
Bad choice: Yes

Sorry you can only look at things one fucking way.

[Shelly]

My husband said her name sounded familiar to him so he may have spoken with her before.

Very tragic.

[BacktoBasics]

Laughing My Fucking Ass Off at how smart and enlightened B2B thinks he is :lmao :lmaoThere is nothing enlightening about it. She's fucking dead dude. She's not going to make dinner for her family tonight or be served a nice meal. She's fucking dead and all for absolutely nothing. She should have walked.

Had this been any one of your family members you'd have wished they stayed out of it too.

[Denver>SA]

There is nothing enlightening about it. She's fucking dead dude. She's not going to make dinner for her family tonight or be served a nice meal. She's fucking dead and all for absolutely nothing. She should have walked.

Had this been any one of your family members you'd have wished they stayed out of it too.
And maybe if she had not intervened then the woman who was arguing with her husband might be dead.

[Shelly]

Or maybe she intervened because the lady was her patient and it's possible she knew the husband too.

[tlongII]

How am I full of shit? She's fucking dead you blind fuck. She's not coming home all because she got in the middle of some other families business.

I'm not saying she attacted the dude for no reason....that was sarcasm and hypothetical. Jesus fuck sake.

I bet right now her family is wondering why this had to happen and why her and why her good deed goes punished. Answer: because she put herself in the middle of a situation that she shouldn't have. No fucking way was her life worth whatever effort she put into breaking this fight up. She wasn't protecting her child or her family or a helpless 5 year old from a rapist. Wake up people...your good deed doesn't carry on after death. Its death its final.

Sounds like some white trash piece of shit was banging his wife around and she popped in. Should have called security or maybe she did but no way would I ever think that any one of her family members wouldn't change the situation and plead with her to not take action, no way they think what she did was worth it.

Good deed: Yes
Bad choice: Yes

Sorry you can only look at things one fucking way.

Listen up you clueless fuck. You were originally trying to argue that it was within the killer's rights to shoot the woman doctor. Do you want me to quote your original post? How the hell was that doctor supposed to know that the dude would pull a gun when she intervened anyway? She did what any individual would have done in that situation. Now shut the hell up!

[BacktoBasics]

And maybe if she had not intervened then the woman who was arguing with her husband might be dead.I'm sure none of her family would consider it a worthy trade. I'm sure she (now dead) probably doesn't consider it a fair swap either. Again somewhere along the line you people think one good deed equates to losing life and thats just fine and dandy. Sometimes that way of thinking applies. I would gladly give up my life to save my son but no way I give up my life to save the life of some stranger I don't know, especially another adult.

[tlongII]

Or maybe she intervened because the lady was her patient and it's possible she knew the husband too.

Exactly. That is hardly a bad choice.

[Twisted_Dawg]

Maybe she attacked him and he defended himself with his legal firearm. Thank god we let people own and carry guns. I know I've gotten into fights with strangers before when people try to tell me to stop yelling and belittling my wife in public.
There is always two sides

.....and you had another thread in which you were offering to be a life coach???

[BacktoBasics]

Listen up you clueless fuck. You were originally trying to argue that it was within the killer's rights to shoot the woman doctor. Do you want me to quote your original post? How the hell was that doctor supposed to know that the dude would pull a gun when she intervened anyway? She did what any individual would have done in that situation. Now shut the hell up!I never questioned her motive to help, you fuck. I simply said common sense stated that it turned out to be the wrong choice. That is exactly why you mind your own god damn business and protect yourself and your family first. She dead and not coming back it was obviously the wrong choice.

I wasn't arguing the killers right I just said what if and I was being sarcastic you stupid arrogant dude ass.

[BacktoBasics]

.....and you had another thread in which you were offering to be a life coach???I seriously can't believe how many stupid people can't tell the difference between sarcasm and reality. Are you really this stupid to think I was serious with that statement. You thought I was being serious. How fucking stupid can you possibly be?

[marini martini]

Well, there goes the neighborhood.

[Denver>SA]

:pctoss

[BacktoBasics]

Exactly. That is hardly a bad choice.Really. Did you know she died? I guess it all turned out ok. Hardly a bad choice when you lose your life over fucking nothing.

[Denver>SA]

I'm sure none of her family would consider it a worthy trade. I'm sure she (now dead) probably doesn't consider it a fair swap either. Again somewhere along the line you people think one good deed equates to losing life and thats just fine and dandy. Sometimes that way of thinking applies. I would gladly give up my life to save my son but no way I give up my life to save the life of some stranger I don't know, especially another adult.
I take it you are not a man of
religion..

[BacktoBasics]

I take it you are not a man or religion..Yes I am a religion. Church of Dirties

[greywheel]

There is always two sides

You started defending the shooter because we do not know the full story. But now you continue to criticize the doctor even though you do not know the full story.

[tlongII]

I never questioned her motive to help, you fuck. I simply said common sense stated that it turned out to be the wrong choice. That is exactly why you mind your own god damn business and protect yourself and your family first. She dead and not coming back it was obviously the wrong choice.

I wasn't arguing the killers right I just said what if and I was being sarcastic you stupid arrogant dude ass.

Jane, you ignorant slut. You can always use 20-20 hindsight observations to back up absurd claims like yours. One of the problems we have in this country is that too many people mind their own business.

[Twisted_Dawg]

I seriously can't believe how many stupid people can't tell the difference between sarcasm and reality. Are you really this stupid to think I was serious with that statement. You thought I was being serious. How fucking stupid can you possibly be?

...Who on this board would take a stupid fucking idiot like you seriously?

[FromWayDowntown]

I never questioned her motive to help, you fuck. I simply said common sense stated that it turned out to be the wrong choice. That is exactly why you mind your own god damn business and protect yourself and your family first. She dead and not coming back it was obviously the wrong choice.

I wasn't arguing the killers right I just said what if and I was being sarcastic you stupid arrogant dude ass.

And my original post is that it's shameful that someone like the killer would resort to shooting a person who bothered to intervene in his efforts to fight his wife.

My comment was more of a societal lament. Your retort is more of a WTF can anyone do about things like this except watch a husband fight with (beat the shit out of?) his wife. The fact that some in our society just resort immediately to violence to deal with issues strikes me as something to be concerned about.

[BacktoBasics]

Jane, you ignorant slut. You can always use 20-20 hindsight observations to back up absurd claims like yours. One of the problems we have in this country is that too many people mind their own business.

Greywheel -

I wasn't defending the shooter. I just put out a different train of thought. Why can't you people wake the fuck up and understand that I simply opened up a thought for conversation. I in no way defended the shooter. Thats it, you idiots ran with that and started crying. Stop, read, comprehend and discuss.

T2 -

I hardly thinks its as simple as hindsight being 20-20. I would not have gotten in the middle of something like that. Nor would have my wife. We mind our own fucking business because you never know with people these days and I prefer to go home each day and retain life. Had it been a child maybe but at the end of the day no other life is worth my own unless its a very unique situation.

Now had some dude dropped his keys and she picked them up for him and he shot her then I'd say wellllll 20-20 and hindsight and you just never know blah blah blah. To me anytime you get in the middle of someone else's bullshit its a risk. Obviously judging by the outcome it was a risk she shouldn't have taken.

[Shelly]

Doctor gunned down in Stone Oak

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA040508.01A.DoctorKilled.3b84047.html

Web Posted: 04/05/2008 12:22 AM CDT

Graeme Zielinski, Robert Crowe, Michelle Mondo and Melissa Ludwig
Express-News

A popular San Antonio doctor was gunned down in the shadow of her practice Friday afternoon, and the man suspected of being the shooter then was shot by an officer who arrived at the scene not long after the initial gunfire, police said.

Julie Abbott, 47, a doctor of internal medicine who was said to be uncommonly beloved by patients and peers, was shot multiple times behind the offices of iMED Internal Medicine at 255 E. Sonterra Blvd. and was pronounced dead at University Hospital at 2:27 p.m.

The suspect underwent surgery and was in critical condition Friday night at University Hospital. He's believed to be the husband of one of Abbott's patients, though no motive was immediately apparent, police said.

Magistrate Court records show a man named Timothy McCloskey, 52, had been charged by proxy Friday with murder and attempted capital murder of a police officer/firefighter. A combined bond was set at $225,000.

Police spokesmen were not available late Friday to confirm that McCloskey was the suspect.

A call to a number listed under McCloskey's name was not answered.

A receptionist in a nearby building, who did not see the shooting, said a witness told her that a husband and wife had been fighting in the parking lot shortly before Abbott was shot, though police could not immediately confirm this.
More coverage
•Your Turn: Tell us what you think of this incident, and tell us about Dr. Julie Abbott if you knew her.
KENS video: Watch the broadcast

Dr. Shailesh C. Kadakia, a gastrointestinal specialist who worked closely with Abbott for about five years, said he was told by some of Abbott's co-workers that she was shot while trying to intervene in a dispute between a husband and wife.

"I think she tried to find out what the problem was," Kadakia said. "She tried to intervene. This is so sad."

The officer who shot the suspect was Michael Blanquiz, a seven-year veteran who happened to be in the area near the time of the shooting, around 1:15 p.m., police said.

"As (Blanquiz) pulled up onto the scene, he saw the shooter standing over the victim," Police Chief William McManus said. "He got out of his car, took cover behind his door, ordered the suspect to drop his weapon. The suspect advanced on the officer and the officer fired multiple rounds, striking the suspect multiple times."

Michelle Arsate said her mother works in the medical office and called her to tell her one of the doctors had been shot.

"She got scared and hid," Arsate said of her mother. "For a while, I didn't know what was going on. I was worried that he was still in" there.

At the Abbott home in a North Side subdivision, The Forest at Stone Oak, friends and neighbors were stopping by Friday evening, bearing condolences for Ben Abbott, the victim's husband, who declined comment.

"He's devastated," said the couple's pastor, Robert Emmitt with the Community Bible Church.

Julie Abbott "lived her life for the Lord, her husband and others," Emmitt said from the couple's home. "And she gave her life the same way."

The couple were active with the church for 10 years, since they moved to the area, Emmitt said. So proficient a Bible study teacher was she, Emmitt said, that she remembered the page numbers to find specific Scripture.

Her friend and fellow church member Ann Wessner referred to the couple as blessed.

"Her greatest joy (was) her husband," Wessner said. "They met the first week at Texas Tech (University) and have been madly in love ever since."

The couple didn't have any children, but they both lavished attention on their cat, Bubba, Wessner said. Ben Abbott taught his wife how to fly-fish and they often went backpacking, Emmitt said.

Julie Abbott came from a large family, one of seven siblings, Emmitt said. One of her brothers is a missionary in Ethiopia, Wessner added, while her father recently retired as a professor in geology at Texas A&M University.

"They're just such a fantastic couple," Wessner said. "She was a true saint."

Chuck Miers, a pharmaceutical representative who said he had known Abbott for three years, said the physician, described as impeccably dressed, was well respected within the medical community, too.

"All patients will tell you that they love their doctors, but ... she was also loved by her peers," Miers said. "She had such a warm relationship with a lot of her peers. The doctors respected her and just loved her. She apparently was just a very jovial, fun person to be around."

Colleagues of Abbott, who was chief of the North Central Baptist Hospital's internal medicine department in 2006 and 2007, are devastated, he said.

"Her leadership was valued," said hospital spokeswoman Karen May. "She's going to be greatly missed."

Dr. Salvatore Barbaro, a cardiologist who had known Abbott for about five years and saw patients referred by her, said she was the rare internal care physician who followed up with patients at the hospital when they needed surgery.

"It's pretty incredible. She really cared," Barbaro said.

"The entire hospital is in shock right now. You've got nurses walking around, doctors walking around — they can't believe it. She was like the darling of the hospital," Barbaro said.

Billy Watson, an 84-year-old patient of Abbott's and a volunteer at the receptionist's desk at North Central Baptist Hospital, continued the description of her as a caring doctor.

Watson said she had had a heart attack and Abbott was there for her during her surgery.

"My son was so impressed with her, he changed doctors," she said.

"She was just a really nice doctor, knowledgeable, and she took time to talk to you," Watson said.

Officer Blanquiz, meanwhile, will be placed on administrative duty, which is standard procedure in all officer-involved shootings, an SAPD news release stated. Police will conduct the investigation and forward their findings to McManus and the Bexar County district attorney's office.

On a police call last year, Blanquiz was involved in the shooting of a man carrying a rifle at a North Side business, according to a 2007 SAPD news release on the incident.

[email protected]

[King]

All the arguments about whether or not she should've intervened is moot - because that's not what happened. There was no argument, and the wife wasn't even in the parking lot when it happened. Neither is the story about him being unhappy with the care. Let's just say that the man was mentally unstable (obviously).

[greywheel]

It was odd that the wife was not mentioned in the police report.

[blizz]

All the arguments about whether or not she should've intervened is moot - because that's not what happened. There was no argument, and the wife wasn't even in the parking lot when it happened. Neither is the story about him being unhappy with the care. Let's just say that the man was mentally unstable (obviously).

how do you know all of this?

[BacktoBasics]

how do you know all of this?Good question. His remarke just completely contradicted the latest report. Not that reports are accurate but still.

[greywheel]

If anyone hears her name, can you post it? My doctor is in that office. JB?

Well...it was her. Can't say the name yet, nor how I heard it. But, it was her.

Probably knows the staff and other patients.

[King]

Yeah - just know the staff and other patients. But, supposedly there was a history of infatuation by the guy towards the doctor. And it wasn't reciprocated.

[BacktoBasics]

Yeah - just know the staff and other patients. But, supposedly there was a history of infatuation by the guy towards the doctor. And it wasn't reciprocated.So whats the motive in reporting (from multiple sources) a completely fictitious account of what allegedly didn't happen?

[ChuckD]

So whats the motive in reporting (from multiple sources) a completely fictitious account of what allegedly didn't happen?
Shit gets mis-reported every day, plus King seems to have some inside knowledge from the practice, and other patients that maybe the news service doesn't have.

[BacktoBasics]

Shit gets mis-reported every day, plus King seems to have some inside knowledge from the practice, and other patients that maybe the news service doesn't have.
I understand that shit gets mis-reported every day but its not as if we are talking about minor details here. We're talking about a completely night and day difference from what King is saying and every other reporting agency thats touched on this. Also noted that it seems like all the other reports are somewhat consistant with King's version being the only one thats entirely different. Its not even close to the same story. Lots of hearsay and inconsistancies. Not saying I don't believe King. I just think its strange that everyone but him has a similar story. He's saying the wife wasn't even there and thats a pretty key piece of the puzzle too. He's saying there was no argument also another key piece.

[PEP]

People "usually" have two reactions when witnessing some sort of disturbance/altercation between a man and a woman. They either look away/avoid or go and intervene/call police.

[BacktoBasics]

I'd just like to hear what King knows. One minute its just "hey what happened at my doctors office" and then next minute he's got men in black type information. Lay it out and back it up with some facts, I'd love to hear what "really" went down.

[ChuckD]

I'd just like to hear what King knows. One minute its just "hey what happened at my doctors office" and then next minute he's got men in black type information. Lay it out and back it up with some facts, I'd love to hear what "really" went down.
I tend to believe people and blogs rather than the media. If the E-N said it was sunny outside, I'd have to open a shade to check. The last thing they want to report is something without a reason. If there was some kind of altercation, and she intervened, then there was a reason. It's OK in your mind, B2B. She had it coming, according to you. The loose ends are tied up. If it's some nutjob with an infatuation, that makes people uneasy and scared. Which do you think they're going to run with?

Nothing to see here folks. Move on.

[King]

I'd guess news runs with story from witnesses of what they thought happened, because they want to be the first to put a story out there. That's why stories are twisted. A lot of the outlets are reporting her husband and three kids...well, she didn't have any kids. They had a cat.

They've had issues with this guy before. Not death type threats, but there was a supposed infatuation towards the doctor. To the point where the doctor and people in the office were concerned about it - but not threatened, yet. There was no fight...she was coming back from lunch.

And add to that, he coded twice last night in the hospital -- but is still alive.

I'm not going into a TON of detail, because I'm sure some of my details are even a little twisted, and I don't want to blur the story more. But, my details are coming from co-workers, and her own family - not news outlets. It's not really men in black type info.

The reason I didn't know anything at first was because it's not exactly easy to get through and get info on phones at a time like that. I heard about it on the news at the same time you did. I just had a later means to more info after it had died down, no pun intended.

[BacktoBasics]

I tend to believe people and blogs rather than the media. If the E-N said it was sunny outside, I'd have to open a shade to check. The last thing they want to report is something without a reason. If there was some kind of altercation, and she intervened, then there was a reason. It's OK in your mind, B2B. She had it coming, according to you. The loose ends are tied up. If it's some nutjob with an infatuation, that makes people uneasy and scared. Which do you think they're going to run with?

Nothing to see here folks. Move on.
No reason to be an asshole I never once said she had it coming. Not one fucking time did I say she deserved any of what happened. Nice fictitious spin though. I mearly said she made the wrong call. Good thing you can read and comprehend.

[BacktoBasics]

I'd guess news runs with story from witnesses of what they thought happened, because they want to be the first to put a story out there. That's why stories are twisted. A lot of the outlets are reporting her husband and three kids...well, she didn't have any kids. They had a cat.

They've had issues with this guy before. Not death type threats, but there was a supposed infatuation towards the doctor. To the point where the doctor and people in the office were concerned about it - but not threatened, yet. There was no fight...she was coming back from lunch.

And add to that, he coded twice last night in the hospital -- but is still alive.

I'm not going into a TON of detail, because I'm sure some of my details are even a little twisted, and I don't want to blur the story more. But, my details are coming from co-workers, and her own family - not news outlets. It's not really men in black type info.

The reason I didn't know anything at first was because it's not exactly easy to get through and get info on phones at a time like that. I heard about it on the news at the same time you did. I just had a later means to more info after it had died down, no pun intended.Thanks for elaborating.

[ChuckD]

No reason to be an asshole I never once said she had it coming. Not one fucking time did I say she deserved any of what happened. Nice fictitious spin though. I mearly said she made the wrong call. Good thing you can read and comprehend.
And now we know she didn't make a "call" at all, don't we?

You sure as hell did try to justify him shooting her by saying she interfered in his family biz or some kind of fight. If that's not you saying "she had it coming", then I don't know what is.

I guess this was even more innocuous than the dropped keys thing. She was simply coming back from lunch.

[macdude06]

i work at the hospital right next to these buildings..i heard the man was dissatisfied with the doctors diagnoses of his wife and she was coming back from lunch...Its a shame..I have seen here a few times in the Er and she was always smiling..She was transported to NCBH and airlifed to University

RIP

[BacktoBasics]

And now we know she didn't make a "call" at all, don't we?

You sure as hell did try to justify him shooting her by saying she interfered in his family biz or some kind of fight. If that's not you saying "she had it coming", then I don't know what is.

I guess this was even more innocuous than the dropped keys thing. She was simply coming back from lunch.How fucking stupid are you. My statement was based on what was reported. Obviously had some guy ambushed her in the parking lot hindsight has no value. If what King said is true there was absolutely nothing that could have been done differently.

I never fucking justified anything, I never said she had it coming I said it was a result of a poor decision that ultimately cost her life...BASED ON HER JUMPING INTO SOMEONE ELSE'S FIGHT/ARGUEMENT/BUSINESS. Not based on random acts or premeditated acts of violence. If that was the case she's a victim plain and simple.

It was an observation of a result from an action that was alleged you twit not her having it coming. Quote me where I said she had it coming or shut the fuck up, you're obviously incapable of looking at different scenarios and discussing, how typically narrow minded of this board. I opened up dialogue based on it happening differently that it was reported and I proposed a "what if" statement. God dammit you people are fucking stupid.

[BacktoBasics]

And now we know she didn't make a "call" at all, don't we?

And no we don't know for sure. We have whats reported by media and whats reported by some guy/gal on a message board. We have no shred of anything thats firm.

I do have no problem leaning twords King'ss info as it seems logical and legit but to believe whats said by some random board member as fact is just as ridiculous as believing aliens killed her and the guberment is covering it up.

[ChuckD]

I said it was a result of a poor decision that ultimately cost her life...BASED ON HER JUMPING INTO SOMEONE ELSE'S FIGHT/ARGUEMENT/BUSINESS.
That decision didn't cost her her life, even if it did happen, which looks doubtful at this point. The decision of the shooter to pull the trigger cost her her life. To me, she did nothing more there to warrant getting shot than what apparently happened: she came back from lunch.

[BacktoBasics]

That decision didn't cost her her life, even if it did happen, which looks doubtful at this point. The decision of the shooter to pull the trigger cost her her life. To me, she did nothing more there to warrant getting shot than what apparently happened: she came back from lunch.Thats certainly one perspective but you can't argue that she'd be alive had she not entered into an alleged fight. Again "alleged fight". If that is in fact what happened she could have simply ran and reported or dialed 911 and saught refuge. No doubt that she died at the hand of one horrible person.

[ChuckD]

Thats certainly one perspective but you can't argue that she'd be alive had she not entered into an alleged fight. Again "alleged fight". If that is in fact what happened she could have simply ran and reported or dialed 911 and saught refuge. No doubt that she died at the hand of one horrible person.
I think events have proven you wrong. She apparently didn't interfere in any fight, and yet she's still dead.

I think that's the part that you have a hard time with. You say that neither you nor your wife would ever interfere to save a stranger, because you might get dead. Guess what. It happens even when you don't interfere.

[BacktoBasics]

I think events have proven you wrong. She apparently didn't interfere in any fight, and yet she's still dead.

I think that's the part that you have a hard time with. You say that neither you nor your wife would ever interfere to save a stranger, because you might get dead. Guess what. It happens even when you don't interfere.And then its not her fault you stupid blind fucking moron. I said perviously had it just been some act of violence she is in no way responsible for that. There is nothing to prove wrong you dipshit I fucking agree with everyone on that. Are you so fucking stupid you can't understand that I'm fucking agreeing that had there actually been no altercation she is nothing more than a victim.

WHY IS THIS SO FUCKING DIFFICULT FOR YOU TO UNDERSTAND? WHY? SERIOUSLY WHY ARE YOU SO FUCKING HARD HEADED?

I MOTHERFUCKING AGREE WITH YOU IF THAT IS IN FACT WHAT WENT DOWN YOU STUPID FUCKING MORON. THERE IS NOTHING TO PROVE ME WRONG ON IF I AGREE WITH YOU. FUCKS SAKE GOD YOU'RE FUCKING STUPID.

[BacktoBasics]

She apparently didn't interfere in any fight, and yet she's still dead.

We have no proof of that you fucking dumbass. Once again so there is no more idiotic confusion. If there was no altercation she interfered with she is a victim.

Did you fucking hear that

VICTIM

ONCE AGAIN FOR STUPIDITY

VICTIM

AS IN NOT HER FAULT. CAN YOU READ THIS SHIT?

[midgetonadonkey]

I like large fonts.

[CuckingFunt]

Are you so fucking stupid you can't understand that I'm fucking agreeing that had there actually been no altercation she is nothing more than a victim.

I think the point of contention is the implied "if" in your statement. By stating that she's nothing more than a victim if there was no altercation, you're suggesting that she wasn't a victim is there was an altercation.

Though, I must admit, since there is obviously so much confusion on all the details, I'm highly amused by the amount of righteous indignation on both sides of this argument.

[CuckingFunt]

I like large fonts.And you cannot lie.

[BacktoBasics]

I think the point of contention is the implied "if" in your statement. By stating that she's nothing more than a victim if there was no altercation, you're suggesting that she wasn't a victim is there was an altercation.

Though, I must admit, since there is obviously so much confusion on all the details, I'm highly amused by the amount of righteous indignation on both sides of this argument.Good point. She is still a victim but if there was an altercation. Again "if". Big "if". Then she would still be alive had she stayed out of it. I don't see how you prove that wrong. She avoids confrontation she lives. Oven is hot, touch it get burned. Don't touch it don't get burned.

If there was no altercation then she was a victim of chance and had no wrong or right choice to make. It was out of her hands. Its not as if she could have avoided hitting the meteor had she turned left especially if she had no idea it was headed right for her, but don't tell me any differently if you chose to involve yourself in a meteor shower. She took a risk whether it seemed like one or not.

Or none of it happened and we are talking about an entirely different scenario.

[ChuckD]

By stating that she's nothing more than a victim if there was no altercation, you're suggesting that she wasn't a victim if there was an altercation.
Winna, winna, chicken dinna. Thanks for the succinct 2 line summation, Funt. :)

[BacktoBasics]

Winna, winna, chicken dinna. Thanks for the succinct 2 line summation, Funt. :)I agree and expounded on that.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

B2B talking about using common sense and protecting your familly when not that long ago he created a thread to say he'd fucked with some dude's insulin, which very well could have killed/hurt the guy and put him (B2B) in jail for a long as time.

So much for the common sense ans being able to protect your familly.

Yea...

I'm done reading his bullshit. It's stupid anyways. It doesn't make a bit of sense.

[Kori Ellis]

I don't know why Back to Basics always tries to play this role, but it's truly annoying when it's a thread about a serious matter. Even if there was an altercation, she doesn't deserve to die and she'd still be a victim (the guy didn't shoot her in self defense.) Just back up a little bit when you are talking about human life. You are so condescending to think that you would never be so dumb as for something like this to happen. 1) None of us even know what happened 2) I can't imagine that you could avoid a confrontation, particularly if the other party starts it.

[BacktoBasics]

B2B talking about using common sense and protecting your familly when not that long ago he created a thread to say he'd fucked with some dude's insulin, which very well could have killed/hurt the guy and put him (B2B) in jail for a long as time.

So much for the common sense ans being able to protect your familly.

Yea...

I'm done reading his bullshit. It's stupid anyways. It doesn't make a bit of sense.Yeah that thread was 100% serious and in no way was I joking around to entertain others and myself. Good thing you understand the difference between joke and serious I mean who would have thought I was kidding around about insulin. I was obviously 100% serious to the fucking bone.

Yeah the guy died because of it too. I killed him and guess what my boss didn't care and I still have my job. Cops didn't care either because they know I just meant to play a practical joke on the poor old diabetic fella. There aren't enough roll eyes emoticons to go around.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Sure.

[BacktoBasics]

I don't know why Back to Basics always tries to play this role, but it's truly annoying when it's a thread about a serious matter. Even if there was an altercation, she doesn't deserve to die. Just back up a little bit when you are talking about human life. You are so condescending to think that you would never be so dumb as for something like this to happen. 1) None of us even know what happened 2) I can't imagine that you could avoid a confrontation, particularly if the other party starts it.No but you can stop yourself from getting involved. I'm not stating that it could never happen and if someone attacted her there is obviously nothing she could have done.

I was in a serious conversation and must have been mistaken when message boarding wasn't about

assume
discuss
assume
discuss

They turned it into an arguement by misinterpreting what I was trying to say. I was just pointing out that you shouldn't involve yourself in other people problems good natured or not. Whether thats what happened or not we'll never know.

For the millionth fucking time. I think she is a victim no matter what. I feel for her and her family its unfortunate those who suffer for simply trying to help if thats even what happened.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

So you shouldn't get involved because it presents some type of danger?

Well, if that's the case, just quit driving.

[BacktoBasics]

So you shouldn't get involved because it presents some type of danger?

Well, if that's the case, just quit driving.No quit driving dangerously, don't join the drag race or instigating road rager. You can't control another driver taking you out just like you can't control some random crazy killing you. There is a difference in almost everything this world has to offer and there are many ways to look at things. Bad analogy.

[midgetonadonkey]

No but you can stop yourself from getting involved. I'm not stating that it could never happen and if someone attacted her there is obviously nothing she could have done.

I was in a serious conversation and must have been mistaken when message boarding wasn't about

assume
discuss
assume
discuss

They turned it into an arguement by misinterpreting what I was trying to say. I was just pointing out that you shouldn't involve yourself in other people problems good natured or not. Whether thats what happened or not we'll never know.

For the millionth fucking time. I think she is a victim no matter what. I feel for her and her family its unfortunate those who suffer for simply trying to help if thats even what happened.

I agree with what he is saying. There was a time when I first moved here to San Antonio when I witnessed a dude punch his chick in the mouth outside of a McDonalds and I didn't call the cops about it and refused to get involved because I thought about what could happen to me for doing so. I get what B2B is trying to say but in no way is saying the lady deserved to die for getting involved. It just sucks that good people, trying to help end up being a victim. I feel terribly for the family of the doctor and for her. In a perfect world she would survive and the shooter would die a horrible and painful death, but this isn't a perfect world and it sucks that she had to die.

[BacktoBasics]

I agree with what he is saying. There was a time when I first moved here to San Antonio when I witnessed a dude punch his chick in the mouth outside of a McDonalds and I didn't call the cops about it and refused to get involved because I thought about what could happen to me for doing so. I get what B2B is trying to say but in no way is saying the lady deserved to die for getting involved. It just sucks that good people, trying to help end up being a victim. I feel terribly for the family of the doctor and for her. In a perfect world she would survive and the shooter would die a horrible and painful death, but this isn't a perfect world and it sucks that she had to die.Thank you for thinking like a rational person.

[midgetonadonkey]

Thank you for thinking like a rational person.

Now can I get free life coaching?

[Heath Ledger]

Im not saying the lady deserved to die, but if what was originally reported is true it should serve as a good lesson for people in general to mind their own business.

That being said this is pretty farked up and sad.

[BacktoBasics]

Now can I get free life coaching?Fuck yeah. Anytime you need a rational well thought out sugarfree opinion hit me the fuck up buddy.

[Kori Ellis]

I was just pointing out that you shouldn't involve yourself in other people problems good natured or not.

I disagree. If I see a child or someone vulnerable in jeopardy, I'm going to try to help.

I understand your point of view. When I lived in L.A., a friend of mine was leaving a bar and saw a guy punch a girl in the parking lot. My friend went to assist (didn't really confront the guy but was trying to make sure the female was okay) and then end result was my friend getting stabbed in the throat. It was pretty serious but he didn't die.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

No quit driving dangerously, don't join the drag race or instigating road rager. You can't control another driver taking you out just like you can't control some random crazy killing you. There is a difference in almost everything this world has to offer and there are many ways to look at things. Bad analogy.

But, you can control gettting on the road, and if protecting your familly is the #1 obligation then why put them at risk?

You are still putting yourself into a situation that is completely unpredictable and dangerous.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Im not saying the lady deserved to die, but if what was originally reported is true it should serve as a good lesson for people in general to mind their own business.

That being said this is pretty farked up and sad.

Unless she knew the guy was crazy enough to pull a gun/irrational she did the right thing IMO.

[BacktoBasics]

I disagree. If I see a child or someone vulnerable in jeopardy, I'm going to try to help.

I understand your point of view. When I lived in L.A., a friend of mine was leaving a bar and saw a guy punch a girl in the parking lot. My friend went to assist (didn't really confront the guy but was trying to make sure the female was okay) and then end result was my friend getting stabbed in the throat. It was pretty serious but he didn't die.I totally agree with you to a certain extent. If I saw a child being assulted I would likely jump in and I would understand the risk involved. I'm not saying some tiny women isn't as vulnerable but I have to draw the line somewhere with the value of my life and the reprocussion of interfering. I've been in a few situations that nearly cost me my life or hurt me seriously and it makes you think about what if scenarios and how freely you should be tossing your heroic side around when you've brushed death before.

[BacktoBasics]

Unless she knew the guy was crazy enough to pull a gun/irrational she did the right thing IMO.ok you're entitled to your opinion but in my eyes the point that she is in fact dead tells me without a doubt she didn't do the right thing or she'd be alive. Right thought process wrong action.

These days you have to assume everyone is capable of the worst. At least I do, I've seen too much crazy shit to think differently. Anyone is capable of anything, guard your life because its your last.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

ok you're entitled to your opinion but in my eyes the point that she is in fact dead tells me without a doubt she didn't do the right thing or she'd be alive. Right thought process wrong action.

These days you have to assume everyone is capable of the worst. At least I do, I've seen too much crazy shit to think differently. Anyone is capable of anything, guard your life because its your last.

But who the hell are you to judge what is right and what isn't?

What if this happened:

Guy shoots wife.
wife dies
guys goes to jail for life
their kids never see them again/go into foster home. grow up without stable familly.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

or, after killing wife, guy escapes scene/kills more people.

[blizz]

But who the hell are you to judge what is right and what isn't?

What if this happened:

Guy shoots wife.
wife dies
guys goes to jail for life
their kids never see them again/go into foster home. grow up without stable familly.

If that's what happened, then that's sad and a tragedy for that family. So she's supposed to give up her life, her marriage, all the good she would have done for people for the CHANCE that some kids she doesn't even know don't grow up in foster care?

[BacktoBasics]

If that's what happened, then that's sad and a tragedy for that family. So she's supposed to give up her life, her marriage, all the good she would have done for people for the CHANCE that some kids she doesn't even know don't grow up in foster care?Exactly. Thats what I'm trying to say.

[blizz]

or, after killing wife, guy escapes scene/kills more people.

See now you're talking about what MIGHT have happened....that's stupid. B2B is talking about what DID happen, and if it happened that way, that it was a bad decision on her part to get involved because it ultimately cost her her life. Kudos for ANYONE who tries to help and/or save people....I don't think he's advocating not trying to help, he was just saying that there could have been better ways. Of course no one thinks that they're gonna get killed by intervening, and I'm sure had she known there was that possibility, she might have re-thought things. I like to argue for argument's sake...that's just how I am...so I can see B2B's point. All he is saying is that the woman chose to get involved, and it turned out to be a bad choice. She's dead. How can any one of you not say that it was a bad choice? She's DEAD.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

If that's what happened, then that's sad and a tragedy for that family. So she's supposed to give up her life, her marriage, all the good she would have done for people for the CHANCE that some kids she doesn't even know don't grow up in foster care?

Don't cops/firement do taht all the time?

If that's the case, if you're ever trapped in a burning house be sure to call the police/firemen and let them know not to come because of the reasons you stated

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Hell, according to you guys none of the firemen involved on 9/11 should have died by trying to rescue people.

It's called doing something for the other people. Having heart. Too many people give a shit about their own lives when they're pathetic, worthless pieces of shit anyways.

[blizz]

Don't cops/firement do taht all the time?

If that's the case, if you're ever trapped in a burning house be sure to call the police/firemen and let them know not to come because of the reasons you stated

That makes absolutely NO fucking sense. You're a moron. She wasn't a cop or a fireman jackass. You're comparing apples to oranges, you're not making any sense, your arguments are weak and until you have something valid, you're wasting my time. I like insightful, well thought out, valid debates....you're just an idiot....bye.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

yea telling me an idiot. nice rebuttal.

[blizz]

Hell, according to you guys none of the firemen involved on 9/11 should have died by trying to rescue people.

It's called doing something for the other people.Having heart. Too many people give a shit about their own lives when they're pathetic, worthless pieces of shit anyway.

again....you're a fucking moron.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

again....you're a fucking moron.

and you are a genius for calling me a moron?

[Spurfect]

I'm sure if she could go into the future and see that the guy pulls out a gun and shoots her dead, she would not have interfered. she did not know that was going to happen to her, she must not have felt that much of a threat for her to go up and try to help.

[Heath Ledger]

i think im in love...

[ChuckD]

Ok, BACK UP. The latest reports don't even have the shooter's wife on scene, so there was nothing to interfere WITH. Poster King has info from people in the medical practice that say the shooter may have had a "thing" for the doctor.

[blizz]

Ok, BACK UP. The latest reports don't even have the shooter's wife on scene, so there was nothing to interfere WITH. Poster King has info from people in the medical practice that say the shooter may have had a "thing" for the doctor.

:clap :clap

And if that IS the case, people will start calling the guy a stalker or an obsessed person before they know the truth, when for all we know, he could have had an affair with her and she broke it off.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

people who risk lives to save/help people = idiots

Why is she any different than someone like a firefighter or cop?

I'd like to hear blizz's genius.

[Heath Ledger]

biff your shoe is untied.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Really.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

biff your shoe is untied.

*Looks down*

[ChuckD]

:clap :clap

And if that IS the case, people will start calling the guy a stalker or an obsessed person before they know the truth, when for all we know, he could have had an affair with her and she broke it off.
King's wife is a patient there, and he's talked to people in the office. If you've ever worked in an office environment, you know that the women discuss and know everything that is going on, and that would have included the late doctor. If this guy creeped her out, she was GOING to tell someone.

Nice random fly off to the "affair" theory, though. Bonus obtuseness points.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

I like how blizz calls me a moron and left without explaining why.

[ShoogarBear]

Someone was a mexican or a black. I'm certain of it.Another little gem buried underneath your stack of them in this thread.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Another little gem buried underneath your stack of them in this thread.

:toast

[Kori Ellis]

See now you're talking about what MIGHT have happened....that's stupid. B2B is talking about what DID happen, and if it happened that way, that it was a bad decision on her part to get involved because it ultimately cost her her life. Kudos for ANYONE who tries to help and/or save people....I don't think he's advocating not trying to help, he was just saying that there could have been better ways. Of course no one thinks that they're gonna get killed by intervening, and I'm sure had she known there was that possibility, she might have re-thought things. I like to argue for argument's sake...that's just how I am...so I can see B2B's point. All he is saying is that the woman chose to get involved, and it turned out to be a bad choice. She's dead. How can any one of you not say that it was a bad choice? She's DEAD.

Ummm.. we don't even know that she intervened on anything, tried to help anyone, tried to break up an argument, choose to get involved in someone else's business. King (who is talking to her family) says she was just coming back from lunch and a guy, who had been bothering her previously, killed her. What should she have re-thought? Going to lunch?

[Kori Ellis]

What's weird to me is that in the initial news or in the police report, they never say that the killer's wife was on the scene. They just mention that they believe that his wife may have been a patient of the doctor. I don't get how anyone here jumped to conclude that the doctor "intervened" about anything.

[Spurfect]

Another little gem buried underneath your stack of them in this thread.


yeah, i like how he started off blasting the doc/making jokes/being a complete insensitive moron, and now being all righteous about it. whatever. oh i also liked how he compared it to if it was a man getting shot by a woman instead. why are we even talking about that here? this woman has JUST BEEN KILLED and he wants to make arguments about "what if it was the other way around"... clueless.

[blizz]

Ummm.. we don't even know that she intervened on anything, tried to help anyone, tried to break up an argument, choose to get involved in someone else's business. King (who is talking to her family) says she was just coming back from lunch and a guy, who had been bothering her previously, killed her. What should she have re-thought? Going to lunch?
Um....ok so we were talking about IF she had tried to break something up...not the lunch thing. Context clues Kori....use em.

[blizz]

King's wife is a patient there, and he's talked to people in the office. If you've ever worked in an office environment, you know that the women discuss and know everything that is going on, and that would have included the late doctor. If this guy creeped her out, she was GOING to tell someone.

Nice random fly off to the "affair" theory, though. Bonus obtuseness points.

We already have several stories out there, my point is that we should rush to conclusions, that's all. King should be talking to the media since he/she knows so much.

[BacktoBasics]

:clap :clap

And if that IS the case, people will start calling the guy a stalker or an obsessed person before they know the truth, when for all we know, he could have had an affair with her and she broke it off.Thank you for understanding.

[Buddy Holly]

Gunman infatuated with slain doctor

Web Posted: 04/05/2008 02:01 PM CDT

Brain Chasnoff
Express-News

A man who alledgedly shot and killed a San Antonio doctor on Friday had been infatuated with her for weeks, writing letters that revealed his romantic desires, police said Saturday.

But Julie Abbott, a doctor of internal medicine, was happily married. She spurned Timothy McCloskey's advances and considered the option of transferring McCloskey's wife -- Abbott's patient and coworker at iMEDO Internal Medicine -- to another doctor, police said.

Friday afternoon, McCloskey, 52, confronted Abbott outside her North Side offices and shot her three times, police said. A police officer then shot McCloskey, who remained in critical condition Saturday at University Hospital.

McCloskey has been charged with murder and attempted capital murder.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA040508.EN.WomanShot.350177a9.html

[BacktoBasics]

yeah, i like how he started off blasting the doc/making jokes/being a complete insensitive moron, and now being all righteous about it. whatever. oh i also liked how he compared it to if it was a man getting shot by a woman instead. why are we even talking about that here? this woman has JUST BEEN KILLED and he wants to make arguments about "what if it was the other way around"... clueless.Totally inaccurate statement. I never once blasted the doctor or joked about it. I made a statement for arguements sake and opened it up for discussion from different angles. Never did I ever blast her. I have nothing but respect for her and her family.

Nothing insensitive about it. You're flat wrong.

[King]

I'm not talking to the media, nor am I going to go into complete detail on what I've heard. I'm just trying to give a little bit of insight to what I've heard (from close friends of the family, who were there last night with the husband -- and friends from the office), and how it's completely different from the news broadcasts. Everything I've heard, has been heard by, or been relayed through the police. So, I'm sure the media knows, or will know more than enough. Their job is to push a story out the door, and then get all the facts. That's how it's been so twisted from the beginning.

[BacktoBasics]

What's weird to me is that in the initial news or in the police report, they never say that the killer's wife was on the scene. They just mention that they believe that his wife may have been a patient of the doctor. I don't get how anyone here jumped to conclude that the doctor "intervened" about anything.
Because it was reported initially that she was trying to break up the fight. Thats what my original statements were based on. Additional reports have surfaced changing the nature of what actually happened.

[King]

Gunman infatuated with slain doctor

Web Posted: 04/05/2008 02:01 PM CDT

Brain Chasnoff
Express-News

A man who alledgedly shot and killed a San Antonio doctor on Friday had been infatuated with her for weeks, writing letters that revealed his romantic desires, police said Saturday.

But Julie Abbott, a doctor of internal medicine, was happily married. She spurned Timothy McCloskey's advances and considered the option of transferring McCloskey's wife -- Abbott's patient and coworker at iMEDO Internal Medicine -- to another doctor, police said.

Friday afternoon, McCloskey, 52, confronted Abbott outside her North Side offices and shot her three times, police said. A police officer then shot McCloskey, who remained in critical condition Saturday at University Hospital.

McCloskey has been charged with murder and attempted capital murder.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA040508.EN.WomanShot.350177a9.html


Well, there you go.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

All that I got from this thread:

I hope to FUCKING GOD I'm never in a situation where I need help and the only people that are around are blizz and B2B

[Buddy Holly]

Someone was a mexican or a black. I'm certain of it.

You're a fucking useless joke of human being. I'm certain of it.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Well, there you go.

Okay.

She should have not intervened then.

THIS is sufficient reason to believe that this guy has some mental problems IMO.

[blizz]

This is getting a little out of hand so I'm done. Some of you don't get debating with valid points. Arguing/debating is cold, isn't open for feelings, opinion, heresay, it's about cold hard facts and this was probably the wrong place to start such a debate. All I'm saying is that I can see the point that B2B was trying to make...right or wrong. There have been things that happened around me that I didn't get involved in and I don't know what would have happened, but I do know that I'm still here and as selfish as that is, that's all that matters to me. My well being and that of my family is all I'll ever get involved with something for. At any rate, I feel terrible for the family of the doctor. Someone lost a wife, someone lost a child, someone lost a sister or cousin and lots of people lost a friend. By all accounts, she was a wonderful person. God Bless her and I'll keep all her loved ones in my prayers. It's a terrible tragedy and I wish it hadn't have happened.

[King]

Okay.

She should have not intervened then.

THIS is sufficient reason to believe that this guy has some mental problems IMO.


She didn't intervene. There was no confrontation. He went there for the doctor.

[Buddy Holly]

Because it was reported initially that she was trying to break up the fight. Thats what my original statements were based on. Additional reports have surfaced changing the nature of what actually happened.

Oh fuck off, you initial bullshit insinuated that she attacked the guy and he was trying to defend himself.

[blizz]

All that I got from this thread:

I hope to FUCKING GOD I'm never in a situation where I need help and the only people that are around are blizz and B2B

You're damn right, I don't know you, you're not worth my life. Sorry bud. If you have a flat tire....well then that's a different story....you're fighting with someone....good luck.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

This is getting a little out of hand so I'm done. Some of you don't get debating with valid points. Arguing/debating is cold, isn't open for feelings, opinion, heresay, it's about cold hard facts and this was probably the wrong place to start such a debate. All I'm saying is that I can see the point that B2B was trying to make...right or wrong. There have been things that happened around me that I didn't get involved in and I don't know what would have happened, but I do know that I'm still here and as selfish as that is, that's all that matters to me. My well being and that of my family is all I'll ever get involved with something for. At any rate, I feel terrible for the family of the doctor. Someone lost a wife, someone lost a child, someone lost a sister or cousin and lots of people lost a friend. By all accounts, she was a wonderful person. God Bless her and I'll keep all her loved ones in my prayers. It's a terrible tragedy and I wish it hadn't have happened.

Valid points, such as calling me/my statments moronic and giving no explenation as to why?

LMFAO

[Kori Ellis]

Um....ok so we were talking about IF she had tried to break something up...not the lunch thing. Context clues Kori....use em.

Sarcasm, dumbass. I was being sarcastic about the lunch because of your rants going on and on about how she shouldn't have tried to break anything up, when it wasn't confirmed anywhere that she confronted/intervened on anything.

[Buddy Holly]

You're damn right, I don't know you, you're not worth my life. Sorry bud. If you have a flat tire....well then that's a different story....you're fighting with someone....good luck.

And I hope when someone's attacking you and you're yelling "help!" all that happens is a dog walks by and pisses on your foot.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

You're damn right, I don't know you, you're not worth my life. Sorry bud. If you have a flat tire....well then that's a different story....you're fighting with someone....good luck.

Pathetic piece of shit. I don't/wouldn't ever want your help.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

And I hope when someone's attacking you and you're yelling "help!" all that happens is a dog walks by and pisses on your foot.

Thank you.

If only a situation like that played out so that we could se the hypocracy of all of this.

[BacktoBasics]

people who risk lives to save/help people = idiots

Why is she any different than someone like a firefighter or cop?

I'd like to hear blizz's genius.
my god you're dumb. Those people get paid to that. Its their job that they chose to do. They chose to risk themselves. If you can't see the difference there is something seriously wrong with you.

[Buddy Holly]

King or Kori, did Mrs. Abbott have a commercial? Her name sounds so familiar.

[King]

Not that I know of.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

my god you're dumb. Those people get paid to that. Its their job that they chose to do. They chose to risk themselves. If you can't see the difference there is something seriously wrong with you.

Bottom line is they all (the Doc and the cops/firemen) risking their lives, money or no money.

And YOU are saying it is not worth it.

[BacktoBasics]

Oh fuck off, you initial bullshit insinuated that she attacked the guy and he was trying to defend himself.
That was a what if scenario I opened for debate. For the 10th fucking time. I wasn't making a blatant point with that remark it was designed to be debated. My god.

What the fuck is wrong with you people. Can you not discuss things from mulitple point of interest?

[Buddy Holly]

Not that I know of.

It's just strange because when I saw the name I instantly felt I had seen it before.

Maybe one of the KSAT website red button commercials?

[BacktoBasics]

Bottom line is they are risking their lives, money or no money.

And YOU are saying it is not worth it.Well its worth it to them. Thats their choice and they understand the sacrifce. Most people getting involved in altercations think of the worst as an afterthougth if at all. Its not up front and center like it is for a firefighter going to a fire. Not to mention a complete lack of training.

[Buddy Holly]

That was a what if scenario I opened for debate. For the 10th fucking time. I wasn't making a blatant point with that remark it was designed to be debated. My god.

What the fuck is wrong with you people. Can you not discuss things from mulitple point of interest?

Then don't fucking say your initial reaction was based on what was being reported. Because what was being reported was she intervened in an argument between a man and his wife.

You decided to totally conger up a scenario where the shooter was the victim.

[BacktoBasics]

Sarcasm, dumbass. I was being sarcastic about the lunch because of your rants going on and on about how she shouldn't have tried to break anything up, when it wasn't confirmed anywhere that she confronted/intervened on anything.Nothing seems to be confirmed one way or the other.

Probably never will be. Sounds to me more and more like she was ambushed and obviously thats completely different than what most of us are arguing over. Although I don't think some see that.

[BacktoBasics]

Then don't fucking say your initial reaction was based on what was being reported. Because what was being reported was she intervened in an argument between a man and his wife.

You decided to totally conger up a scenario where the shooter was the victim.Pay attention my initial reaction was she shouldn't have played peace keeper.

I congered up the attack notion as something to debate. You have your lines crossed and aren't understanding what I'm trying to say. Stop mixing up two different points.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

So she's supposed to give up her life, her marriage, all the good she would have done for people for the CHANCE that some kids she doesn't even know don't grow up in foster care?

You agreed to this (B2B).

Cops, firemen, and soldiers all do it, just like she did (even though she probably thought otherwise at the time)

[Buddy Holly]

Well its worth it to them. Thats their choice and they understand the sacrifce. Most people getting involved in altercations think of the worst as an afterthougth if at all. Its not up front and center like it is for a firefighter going to a fire. Not to mention a complete lack of training.

Someone walking up to stop a fight of course doesn't know the consequences of their actions whether they be null or their life ending but unless the fight is occurring between two people with guns and knives, that probably never crosses their mind.

If we lived in that "what could happen?" state of mind, people would be paralyzed to the world. You wouldn't go get gas because "what if I get hit by a car." People wouldn't fire anyone because "what if that person comes back with a gun." People would live their life because they'd worry about the worst case.

[Buddy Holly]

Pay attention my initial reaction was she shouldn't have played peace keeper.

I congered up the attack notion as something to debate. You have your lines crossed and aren't understanding what I'm trying to say. Stop mixing up two different points.

You obviously need to pay attention to your own bullshit.

After your little race comment your next post contained this:


Maybe she attacked him and he defended himself with his legal firearm. Thank god we let people own and carry guns. I know I've gotten into fights with strangers before when people try to tell me to stop yelling and belittling my wife in public.

There is always two sides

You're so fucking pathetic.

[BacktoBasics]

Someone walking up to stop a fight of course doesn't know the consequences of their actions whether they be null or their life ending but unless the fight is occurring between two people with guns and knives, that probably never crosses their mind.

If we lived in that "what could happen?" state of mind, people would be paralyzed to the world. You wouldn't go get gas because "what if I get hit by a car." People wouldn't fire anyone because "what if that person comes back with a gun." People would live their life because they'd worry about the worst case.Although I see your train of thought I don't compare breaking up a fight to "what if I get hit by a car" while driving that is. Now comparing breaking up a fight to running across a busy highway would be more like it. There have been more than one example in this thread displaying why you shouldn't get in other peoples shit. You could die be injured, hurt and so forth. I for one know that such actions can come with a price. I chose to mind my own business.

Funny you should mention the firing thing. My boss refused to fire our service writer because he fears him. Sad but true. I still can't compare fire a bad worker to getting involved in a domestic dispute.

Fireman, police officers, coastguards all risk their lives by their own choice and its not based on lack of better judgement but hopefully more because they felt it was their calling in life to do so. In any event its a choice and they're trained to do it and they want to do it.

[BacktoBasics]

After your little race comment your next post contained this:



You're so fucking pathetic.I'm really fucking sorry you thought that comment wasn't just dripping with sarcasm. After the obsurd reaction I still felt the thought was open for interpretation and debate. I'm better than I thought if you actually believe I was taking a jab at her. Wake up guy.

[ChuckD]

Gunman infatuated with slain doctor

Web Posted: 04/05/2008 02:01 PM CDT

Brain Chasnoff
Express-News

A man who alledgedly shot and killed a San Antonio doctor on Friday had been infatuated with her for weeks, writing letters that revealed his romantic desires, police said Saturday.

But Julie Abbott, a doctor of internal medicine, was happily married. She spurned Timothy McCloskey's advances and considered the option of transferring McCloskey's wife -- Abbott's patient and coworker at iMEDO Internal Medicine -- to another doctor, police said.

Friday afternoon, McCloskey, 52, confronted Abbott outside her North Side offices and shot her three times, police said. A police officer then shot McCloskey, who remained in critical condition Saturday at University Hospital.

McCloskey has been charged with murder and attempted capital murder.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/metro/stories/MYSA040508.EN.WomanShot.350177a9.html
blizzOWN3D

[Buddy Holly]

I'm really fucking sorry you thought that comment wasn't just dripping with sarcasm. After the obsurd reaction I still felt the thought was open for interpretation and debate. I'm better than I thought if you actually believe I was taking a jab at her. Wake up guy.

Sarcasm? Please, there was no sarcasm in that lame ass post. Well, now there is because your ass had been called out so many times.

[boutons_]

Nancy Grace will sort this all out and reveal the truth.

[King]

Fixation is cited in doctor's slaying

Web Posted: 04/06/2008 12:01 AM CDT

Brian Chasnoff and Robert Crowe
Express-News

It started with love letters from an obsessed man and ended abruptly in blood.

Timothy McCloskey first met Dr. Julie Abbott at a Christmas party last year thrown by iMED Internal Medicine, a North Side practice. His wife was working there as a receptionist, and Abbott, an internist, was treating her.

Soon, McCloskey began sending Abbott flowers and letters in which he professed his desire for the married physician. Abbott grew increasingly uneasy about the persistent and unwanted advances, police spokesman Gabe Trevino said Saturday.

Abbott and others at iMED were in the process last week of determining how to deal with McCloskey's fixation. Known for her compassion, Abbott wanted to resolve the situation in a way that would not embarrass McCloskey or his wife.

McCloskey felt spurned, police said, and Friday afternoon the situation escalated into tragedy.

Abbott, 47, had left work early and gotten into her car to go home when McCloskey confronted her in the parking lot behind her office in the 200 block of Sonterra Boulevard, Trevino said. Troubled by the encounter, she got out and walked toward her office.

When police arrived, McCloskey was standing over Abbott's body, holding a handgun. The doctor had been shot three times — in the shoulder, abdomen and face.

She died soon after.

The responding officer, Michael Blanquiz, ordered McCloskey to drop the handgun. When McCloskey refused and advanced toward Blanquiz, the officer fired his gun six times and struck McCloskey four times — in the legs, the hand and the abdomen, Trevino said.

McCloskey, 52, was in critical condition Saturday at University Hospital, where he was charged by proxy with murder and attempted capital murder.

McCloskey's wife was inside the iMED building at the time of the shooting. It was unclear Saturday whether McCloskey was lying in wait for Abbott before he shot her, police said.

Little else is known about Timothy McCloskey. His wife, Ellen, who has been a receptionist in Abbott's office for about six years, told police Friday that McCloskey has struggled with mental illness.

A woman who answered a phone call to Ellen McCloskey's residence Saturday hung up, and no one answered knocks to her door.

A San Antonio private investigator who is familiar with stalking cases said the behavior attributed to McCloskey is different from most stalkers.

"That's such an overt kind of stalking," Mike Kaliski said. "That's an unusual kind. ... They're not upfront like that (about stating their infatuation. And they certainly aren't going to resort to murder for being rejected."

Two police sources and two people with ties to the iMED practice said McCloskey's infatuation with Abbott was so awkward that it had become an issue in the office. Abbott considered the option of transferring McCloskey's wife to another doctor, police said.

Abbott and her husband had planned to take a vacation this weekend because the unwanted attention was stressing them out.

Abbott's husband declined to comment for this report.

A memorial is planned for 11 a.m. Monday at Community Bible Church at 2477 North Loop 1604 East, where Abbott was an active member.

The church's pastor, Robert Emmitt, said many people close to her were unaware of the situation with McCloskey.

[MannyIsGod]

I agree with what he is saying. There was a time when I first moved here to San Antonio when I witnessed a dude punch his chick in the mouth outside of a McDonalds and I didn't call the cops about it and refused to get involved because I thought about what could happen to me for doing so. I get what B2B is trying to say but in no way is saying the lady deserved to die for getting involved. It just sucks that good people, trying to help end up being a victim. I feel terribly for the family of the doctor and for her. In a perfect world she would survive and the shooter would die a horrible and painful death, but this isn't a perfect world and it sucks that she had to die.Wow if thats not the most pussy thing I've ever read on here then I'm not sure what is.

[1369]

The responding officer, Michael Blanquiz, ordered McCloskey to drop the handgun. When McCloskey refused and advanced toward Blanquiz, the officer fired his gun six times and struck McCloskey four times — in the legs, the hand and the abdomen, Trevino said.

Does SAPD not understand the concept of center mass?

[ploto]

So all the debate over intervening in a domestic dispute was baseless, as that was not what even happened. So sad... I had a stalker once- long before they were called stalkers.

[ChuckD]

Does SAPD not understand the concept of center mass?
Understanding and performing are two different things...

If it was a .45, all he needed was the one abdomen shot.

[Fillmoe]

Wow if thats not the most pussy thing I've ever read on here then I'm not sure what is.


why die over some dumb bitch you dont care about?

[ChuckD]

why die over some dumb bitch you dont care about?
You're a Howler monkey. Go find your troop.

[marini martini]

why die over some dumb bitch you dont care about?

STFU, asshole! He had a crush on her ass! He could not take that she would not reciprocate. Confronted her in the parking lot. His wife was not even there. She verbally refuted her feelings for him, then he shot her in the face, shoulder, and abdomen, and she fricking died shortly thereafter.

So r u happy pappy?

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I wouldn't intervene unless I was packing.

I've seen and been around situations where dying is definitely a possibility when trying to be the good Samaritan. It's just not worth it, IMO.

[Fillmoe]

STFU, asshole! He had a crush on her ass! He could not take that she would not reciprocate. Confronted her in the parking lot. His wife was not even there. She verbally refuted her feelings for him, then he shot her in the face, shoulder, and abdomen, and she fricking died shortly thereafter.

So r u happy pappy?


i was talking about his reply to midges reply.... what the fuck are you talkin about?

[Fillmoe]

You're a Howler monkey. Go find your troop.


you would have never been shit without the minstrel show that is Flavor Flav.....

[marini martini]

why die over some dumb bitch you dont care about?

Sorry, that's what I cared about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol

[Fillmoe]

are you drunk? or do you just sound this stupid all the time?

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Wow if thats not the most pussy thing I've ever read on here then I'm not sure what is.

word.

Grow some fucking balls people.

[marini martini]

i was talking about his reply to midges reply.... what the fuck are you talkin about?

Maybe, you know zilchhh, about this stuff, SGTFO :toast

[mrsmaalox]

I wouldn't intervene unless I was packing.

I've seen and been around situations where dying is definitely a possibility when trying to be the good Samaritan. It's just not worth it, IMO.

When I was in nursing school we used to have all these dumbass "awareness raising" exercises, to help us relate to people in different kinds of crisis. One of the exercises was with some law enforcement folks and they told us that domestic disputes are the most dangerous calls they respond to. Because they are additionally fueled by passion. They also said they are the most dangerous situations for good samaritans. And if most people knew that, I think they would still try to help; it's just they way most of us are wired.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

When I was in nursing school we used to have all these dumbass "awareness raising" exercises, to help us relate to people in different kinds of crisis. One of the exercises was with some law enforcement folks and they told us that domestic disputes are the most dangerous calls they respond to. Because they are additionally fueled by passion. They also said they are the most dangerous situations for good samaritans. And if most people knew that, I think they would still try to help; it's just they way most of us are wired.


Of course it's a really easy thing to say you'd do(intervene) but much murkier when the situation presents itself right in front of you.

In the last two years, two of these situations have occurred when I was at the bar. In one, the guy smashed a 32 ounce glass on my buddy's face, splitting his face open from forehead to chin. Over 250 stitches and at least 6 surgeries so far.

In the other, random guy played the white knight and stopped this dude from handling his girlfriend in the bar. Boyfriend left the bar, waited for GS and shot him twice in the face in the parking lot. DOA.

No thanks.

[mrsmaalox]

Of course it's a really easy thing to say you'd do(intervene) but much murkier when the situation presents itself right in front of you.

You are absolutely right about that! I've stopped and helped at accidents, and it was no problem. But I could easily see myself paralyzed with fear in any sort of physical altercation (unless my children were involved). It's just hard to say, but I think most people are "programmed" to stand up for the underdog. That being said, I totally understand someone choosing not to get involved in such a potentially dangerous situation.

[BacktoBasics]

word.

Grow some fucking balls people.balls is being smart enough to keep out of other peoples shit so your kids have a father that actually raises them. Family first is the ultimate balls.

[peewee's lovechild]

balls is being smart enough to keep out of other peoples shit so your kids have a father that actually raises them. Family first is the ultimate balls.

As much as it may make me sound like a pussy, I would intervene for nobody.

If it's really bad, that's what 911 is for.

Midge was right in not getting involved when he saw that dude punching that girl. Who knows what that guy would've done.

And, now that I have a kid, there's no way in holy hell that I'd risk my life or that of my child for any or that.

I'll call 9-11, but that's about it.

I'll defend my kid and my family to death, but I won't do it for others.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I knew that I was too much of a pussy to not intervene and the women getting beat up died or something. That's just me.

Calling the cops isn't going to do any good if the situation calls for immediate attention.

Same thing if a house was burning down and I heard a women/man shouting for help.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

If everyone took an isolationist philosophy we'd have let Nazi's take over the world, or any other danger we're faced with just blow by us if it doesn't threaten us/our family with death.

[Melmart1]

Those who wouldn't step in because of their safety or those of their family ... I wonder what you would think if it was YOUR daughter or sister, wife, whoever who needed help. If they were in trouble and died because nobody intervened, would you lament why nobody stepped in to help them?

[ShoogarBear]

Those who wouldn't step in because of their safety or those of their family ... I wonder what you would think if it was YOUR daughter or sister, wife, whoever who needed help. If they were in trouble and died because nobody intervened, would you lament why nobody stepped in to help them?:reading

[Shelly]

Johnny Blaze--why is KSAT still reporting that their was a dispute and she intervened? I was just watching the noon news and that's they are still saying.

[peewee's lovechild]

I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I knew that I was too much of a pussy to not intervene and the women getting beat up died or something. That's just me.

Calling the cops isn't going to do any good if the situation calls for immediate attention.

Same thing if a house was burning down and I heard a women/man shouting for help.


Yea, getting killed helping someone and leaving my child to be raised by other people makes perfect sense.

[peewee's lovechild]

If everyone took an isolationist philosophy we'd have let Nazi's take over the world, or any other danger we're faced with just blow by us if it doesn't threaten us/our family with death.

That's a stupid ass bullshit statement.

And, by the way, America stood by silently while Hitler slowly took control of Eurpoe.

But, anyway, you make powerful statements that the great debaters of our time can hardly counter.

[peewee's lovechild]

Those who wouldn't step in because of their safety or those of their family ... I wonder what you would think if it was YOUR daughter or sister, wife, whoever who needed help. If they were in trouble and died because nobody intervened, would you lament why nobody stepped in to help them?


If my daughter or sister were in trouble . . . that's when I would intervene. But, they are left to make choices that affect their own lives. If they choose to be with an abusive man and refuse help getting out of that particular situation, what else can one do?

[BacktoBasics]

I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I knew that I was too much of a pussy to not intervene and the women getting beat up died or something. That's just me.

Calling the cops isn't going to do any good if the situation calls for immediate attention.

Same thing if a house was burning down and I heard a women/man shouting for help.you're right you wouldn't be living with yourself you'd have no self and be dead.

[mrsmaalox]

If my daughter or sister were in trouble . . . that's when I would intervene. But, they are left to make choices that affect their own lives. If they choose to be with an abusive man and refuse help getting out of that particular situation, what else can one do?

Most abused women don't choose to be with abusive men.

[Melmart1]

If my daughter or sister were in trouble . . . that's when I would intervene. But, they are left to make choices that affect their own lives. If they choose to be with an abusive man and refuse help getting out of that particular situation, what else can one do?
Except that this doctor wasn't in an abusive relationship. She was happily married and apparently had a stalker of sorts.

So, if that was your daughter as an adult, and she was arguing with her stalker and nobody stepped in, you would be OK with that because they were right to mind their own business?

[peewee's lovechild]

Most abused women don't choose to be with abusive men.

You've never lived in the Valley.

Most of the girls/women I have known that have been in an abusive relationship defend their men until the very end.

Now, I realize that I'm making a generalization, but that's been my experience.

[peewee's lovechild]

Except that this doctor wasn't in an abusive relationship. She was happily married and apparently had a stalker of sorts.

So, if that was your daughter as an adult, and she was arguing with her stalker and nobody stepped in, you would be OK with that because they were right to mind their own business?


Oh, don't get me wrong, I'd be pissed if my daughter was killed by some psycho.

But, there is now way in hell I'd blame other people for her death.

Answer this question:

Just what in Hell was anyone supposed to do against a guy with a gun?

I feel badly that the doctor had to die. And, that man was nothing but a chicken shit bastard for doing that to her. But, seriously, what could anyone have done to stop this mad man?

[BacktoBasics]

I love how easy it is for some of you people to just sacrifce your own lives for nothing, I think half of you big talkers are full of shit or simply don't have any children. The thought of your kids going on without you is pretty fucking powerful. I think its a total lack of understanding what exactly death is and what ceasing to exist really means. To simply throw yourself around as if you're some kind of hero is ridiculous. To basically sit here and tell me your life your breath is of less value as some strangers is pretty pathetic. At some point you have to give your self some value or worth.

Every situation is different and will bring a different reaction out of me. I'll give you a very personal example.

Saw a car flip over and land on its roof over on 1604 near Braun area, or a bit past that, when it was just one way each way. I made the judgement to get out and help get the people out to safety. I rendered aide when they needed it most. I felt it was a safe move and I was right there.

Flip side

One night on News Years I was driving down 1604 but down near Bulverde Rd. A BMW crossed the median and slammed head first into an oncoming car. BMW driver was already nearly engulfed in flames. We jumped out and grabbed the driver from the struck car and once we got him out the flames and fire were just too much and we started to hear some serious popping sounds. We all backed off and had to watch the guy burn to death. Just wasn't going to happen. No way was my life worth his in such a close call type of situation.

No one here is saying don't offer help no one here is saying don't render aide to those that need it. I don't know if I'd enter a burning house or not, I haven't been faced with it. I do know that I have no intentions in getting involved in any type of confrontation or questionable situation between two or more adults.

[King]

Except that this doctor wasn't in an abusive relationship. She was happily married and apparently had a stalker of sorts.

So, if that was your daughter as an adult, and she was arguing with her stalker and nobody stepped in, you would be OK with that because they were right to mind their own business?

There's a difference between being OK with it, and understanding why a person didn't intervene. My responsibility is to my wife and my family. Not being there for them is a failure of that responsibility. I didn't sign up to be everybody's hero.

Now, in the case of Julie, the guy confronted her as she was going to her car, and shot her three times. At what point do you not intervene? When you see a knife? When you see a gun? Do you still intervene when weapons are present?

My guess is, most of the people are just playing the vigilante role, when in all actuality, they'd keep their distance. And probably none of these people have ever actually BEEN in a situation that calls for it, so they don't have - but it just looks better to say that they'd be a hero.

[mrsmaalox]

Just what in Hell was anyone supposed to do against a guy with a gun?

I feel badly that the doctor had to die. And, that man was nothing but a chicken shit bastard for doing that to her. But, seriously, what could anyone have done to stop this mad man?

You are right about that. Obviously, he already had his mind made up, someone was going to die. But that just factors in another variable: Would someone be more likely to intervene if the assailant was holding a rock? I still think at the very moment, most people wouldn't stop to make a choice, they would just intervene. That being right, wrong, smart or stupid!

[peewee's lovechild]

No one here is saying don't offer help no one here is saying don't render aide to those that need it. I don't know if I'd enter a burning house or not, I haven't been faced with it. I do know that I have no intentions in getting involved in any type of confrontation or questionable situation between two or more adults.


That's the key.

I help out people as much as I can. And, I'll continue to do so as long as it doesn't inturde on my safety and the safety of the ones I love, mainly my daughter.

I don't understand how any of these people posting consider it "heroic" to get in between a man and a woman having it out when one of these, if not both, are packing heat.

What would this action prove? Nothing. Not a god damn thing. It would only leave my daughter with out a father, and years of counseling in her future.

It doesn't make sense to me that I would sacrifice myself to help someone I don't know and leave my own loved ones to suffer because of it.

Who will be there for my daughter and my loved ones if I should die defending someone?

Nobody.

[peewee's lovechild]

There's a difference between being OK with it, and understanding why a person didn't intervene. My responsibility is to my wife and my family. Not being there for them is a failure of that responsibility. I didn't sign up to be everybody's hero.

Now, in the case of Julie, the guy confronted her as she was going to her car, and shot her three times. At what point do you not intervene? When you see a knife? When you see a gun? Do you still intervene when weapons are present?

My guess is, most of the people are just playing the vigilante role, when in all actuality, they'd keep their distance. And probably none of these people have ever actually BEEN in a situation that calls for it, so they don't have - but it just looks better to say that they'd be a hero.


I agree with everything you said.

[peewee's lovechild]

You are right about that. Obviously, he already had his mind made up, someone was going to die. But that just factors in another variable: Would someone be more likely to intervene if the assailant was holding a rock? I still think at the very moment, most people wouldn't stop to make a choice, they would just intervene. That being right, wrong, smart or stupid!


Well, good luck to them.

I'm going to make sure I make ever right decision to make my daughter safe.

Nothing is more important than that.
And, than means making sure I'm alive to always protect her.

[mrsmaalox]

My guess is, most of the people are just playing the vigilante role, when in all actuality, they'd keep their distance. And probably none of these people have ever actually BEEN in a situation that calls for it, so they don't have - but it just looks better to say that they'd be a hero.

Oh, I don't think anyone here is saying they would intervene because they want to be a hero. I think everyone is stating what they think they would actually do. But at that very moment, who really knows? I honestly don't know what i would do. But I'm pretty sure if I saw a gun, I would definitely take it into consideration first.

[BacktoBasics]

There's a difference between being OK with it, and understanding why a person didn't intervene. My responsibility is to my wife and my family. Not being there for them is a failure of that responsibility. I didn't sign up to be everybody's hero.

Now, in the case of Julie, the guy confronted her as she was going to her car, and shot her three times. At what point do you not intervene? When you see a knife? When you see a gun? Do you still intervene when weapons are present?

My guess is, most of the people are just playing the vigilante role, when in all actuality, they'd keep their distance. And probably none of these people have ever actually BEEN in a situation that calls for it, so they don't have - but it just looks better to say that they'd be a hero.100% fucking agree.

I got my ass ripped up and down on these pages for having what is likely the same set of beliefs and values the rest of you people here.

[King]

..

[mrsmaalox]

100% fucking agree.

I got my ass ripped up and down on these pages for having what is likely the same set of beliefs and values the rest of you people here.

You sure did!! But remember that was when everyone still thought she had intervened in a domestic dispute. Now that the facts are out, not so many villagers out with pitchforks and torches. :lol

[BacktoBasics]

You sure did!! But remember that was when everyone still thought she had intervened in a domestic dispute. Now that the facts are out, not so many villagers out with pitchforks and torches. :lolYeah it never seemed to register that I agreed with everyone about her having no choice in the matter once it was thought or determined that she was in fact a full blown victim of chance not choice.

[Melmart1]

100% fucking agree.

I got my ass ripped up and down on these pages for having what is likely the same set of beliefs and values the rest of you people here.
You got your ass ripped more because you came off like a jackass than for the point you were trying to make. Occasionally you have really good points, but you present your point in such an inflammatory way that it gets lost. I suspect you do it on purpose to get your jollies off, though I could be wrong.

And the only point I was trying to make is that those who mind their own business, that is your prerogative ... just don't cry foul when its someone you love and nobody stopped to help. Because I have personally seen that happen before. That's all.

[peewee's lovechild]

And the only point I was trying to make is that those who mind their own business, that is your prerogative ... just don't cry foul when its someone you love and nobody stopped to help. Because I have personally seen that happen before. That's all.


I get what you're saying.

But, would you intervene if there was a probability of you dying?

[BacktoBasics]

I suspect you do it on purpose to get your jollies off, though I could be wrong.


I haven't gotten my jollies off since the mid 90's

[Melmart1]

I get what you're saying.

But, would you intervene if there was a probability of you dying?
Can't say for sure, but I am fairly sure I would at least call the police. I can't beleive there are people who wouldn't do at least that. I understand not physically intervening ... I get that. But not calling the police? It's anonymous, what the hell kind of harm can that do?

[peewee's lovechild]

Can't say for sure, but I am fairly sure I would at least call the police. I can't beleive there are people who wouldn't do at least that. I understand not physically intervening ... I get that. But not calling the police? It's anonymous, what the hell kind of harm can that do?


That's exactly what I posted earlier!

When I posted that, I was called a pussy.
(Not by you, mind you.)



I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I knew that I was too much of a pussy to not intervene and the women getting beat up died or something. That's just me.

Calling the cops isn't going to do any good if the situation calls for immediate attention.

Same thing if a house was burning down and I heard a women/man shouting for help.



What the fuck was all that?

I like how people think they'd be like Rambo in a situation like that.
The truth is quite the opposite.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

That's a stupid ass bullshit statement.

And, by the way, America stood by silently while Hitler slowly took control of Eurpoe.

But, anyway, you make powerful statements that the great debaters of our time can hardly counter.

Yea, we did, and it's a big part of the reason why a lot of my ancestors didn't live. And I think that's bullshit. We stood pat fora long time while millions of jews/gays/everyone else were rounded up and killed.

Why is it a stupid ass bullshit statement?

[Ronaldo McDonald]

That's exactly what I posted earlier!

When I posted that, I was called a pussy.
(Not by you, mind you.)






What the fuck was all that?

I like how people think they'd be like Rambo in a situation like that.
The truth is quite the opposite.

Who are you to tell me how I'd act in certain situations?

[peewee's lovechild]

Yea, we did, and it's a big part of the reason why a lot of my ancestors didn't live. And I think that's bullshit. We stood pat fora long time while millions of jews/gays/everyone else were rounded up and killed.

Why is it a stupid ass bullshit statement?

Comparing the atrocities of war with not wanting to get killed while two people are having it out is a stupid ass bullshit statement.

[peewee's lovechild]

Who are you to tell me how I'd act in certain situations?


Who the hell are you to call me a pussy when I want to make sure I keep myself safe for my family?

[CuckingFunt]

Who the hell are any of us to decide that there's only one right way to act in that situation?

I can't in good conscience condemn someone who decides that their own life, or especially being around to take care of their children, is an important consideration in a potentially dangerous environment. At the same time, however, I can't condemn someone who risks their own life, and risks not being there for their children, in the pursuit of helping or protecting someone who is being harmed.

[BacktoBasics]

Who are you to tell me how I'd act in certain situations?I'm more interested as to where you draw the line with your own life.

If a guy was beating down a cat or rabbit would you jump in and try to stop him? What if the guy was shooting at anthills with his .45? Would you save the ants? What about fisherman and shrimpers? The list could go on.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

Comparing the atrocities of war with not wanting to get killed while two people are having it out is a stupid ass bullshit statement.

If everyone in the United States took your point of view there would be no cops, no firemen, no soldiers.

If everyone said "I'm not going to intervene because my familly is the #1 priority", we'd let whatever threatens us w/ death blow right by without giving a shit.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

I'm more interested as to where you draw the line with your own life.

If a guy was beating down a cat or rabbit would you jump in and try to stop him? What if the guy was shooting at anthills with his .45? Would you save the ants? What about fisherman and shrimpers? The list could go on.

okay, that was funny.

[BacktoBasics]

If everyone in the United States took your point of view there would be no cops, no firemen, no soldiers.

If everyone said "I'm not going to intervene because my familly is the #1 priority", we'd let whatever threatens us w/ death blow right by without giving a shit.I think you're making a serious mistake comparing the two.

Soldiers, fireman, cops....public servers do their jobs with backup and training and because its their calling in life or the benefits are good and they can swing an ax. Its just not the same its not that black and white.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

I agree with cuckingfunt. She's (yea, she) looking at it with some objectivity, and I'll admit that none of us have the answers to these questions.

[Ronaldo McDonald]

I think you're making a serious mistake comparing the two.

Soldiers, fireman, cops....public servers do their jobs with backup and training and because its their calling in life or the benefits are good and they can swing an ax. Its just not the same its not that black and white.

It is. forget the money, the benefits, training - the possibility of dying is still there, especially with the amount of cases they are confronted with on a daily basis.

They're making the neccessary sacrifices (familly) to help others. bottom line.

the only diff is they are willing to sacrifice and others are not.

[BacktoBasics]

It is. forget the money, the benefits, training - the possibility of dying is still there, especially with the amount of cases they are confronted with on a daily basis.

They're making the neccessary sacrifices (familly) to help others. bottom line.

the only diff is they are willing to sacrifice and others are not.You can't discount the money, benefits, training and so forth. Its a job they do it all day long and thats how they survive and feed their family. I'm sure if the police force cut their pay in half you'd a shit load less cops because the risk out weighs the reward. They don't it all for the love of being a good human being some do but to most its a job and way to survive.

Volunteer Fireman would be the exception and look at how few of them there are....and even get paid a little. And get training and so forth.

This is why we don't live in a world full of human superhero's. They don't get paid for it. For them the reward and job out weigh the risk.

[JoeChalupa]

Can't say for sure, but I am fairly sure I would at least call the police. I can't beleive there are people who wouldn't do at least that. I understand not physically intervening ... I get that. But not calling the police? It's anonymous, what the hell kind of harm can that do?

I concur. I've asked myself the "what would I have done" question many times. And the answer is always, "I just don't know".

[Ronaldo McDonald]

You can't discount the money, benefits, training and so forth. Its a job they do it all day long and thats how they survive and feed their family. I'm sure if the police force cut their pay in half you'd a shit load less cops. They don't it all for the love of being a good human being some do but to most its a job and way to survive.

Volunteer Fireman would be the exception and look at how few of them their are....and even get paid a little. And get training and so forth.

This is why we don't live in a world full of human superhero's. They don't get paid for it. For them the reward and job out weigh the risk.

Yea, but from what I understand about your POV, familly is numero 1. Which means it supercedes money, training etc - because the mere possbiltiy of losing your life an leaving familly behind isn't worth the money or any of the factors (like training) that make the possibility of this happening less likely.

I'm saying that if eveyone thought that way, we'd have no cops, firemen, soldiers etc.