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View Full Version : Game Thoughts: Spurs @ Blazers Apr. 6



timvp
04-07-2008, 09:17 AM
If you were told going into the game on Sunday that the Spurs were going to score only 72 points, you’d probably expect another unsightly loss. However, not only did the Spurs win the game, they won fairly handily.

Although it ugly for almost the entire contest, the Spurs were able to beat the Blazers 72-65 in Portland. The game was relatively close throughout the second half but the outcome was never really in doubt. The Spurs did a good job of keeping the Blazers from making a legit run in the fourth quarter, though truthfully it would have been nice to see the Spurs administer a knockout punch at some point in the second half.

The Blazers are destined to be an elite team in the Western Conference for a long time. Greg Oden, LaMarcus Aldridge and Brandon Roy form a hell of a core. Add to that a group of very good role players (Steve Blake, Joel Przybilla, Travis Outlaw, Martell Webster, etc.) and a quality head coach in Nate McMillan, not to mention a Spurs-trained front office, and there’s no reason why the Blazers won’t win at least one championship in the next decade.

As far as the 2008 championship is concerned, the Spurs still appear to be in decent enough shape. Their offense struggled but I don’t think it’s anything to be too worried about. The main reason the offense is struggling right now is they aren’t getting any easy baskets. The guards aren’t doing a good enough job pushing the break and the result is an amazingly slow pace. In fact, the Spurs were held without a fast break point against the Blazers. Once the offense picks up the pace, they’ll get back to scoring enough points.

Defensively, the Spurs were solid. They weren’t as spectacular as the 65 points would make you think, mostly due to the slow pace, however it was a really nice defensive showing. The Blazers were held to 34.2% shooting from the floor as the Spurs did a good job of challenging almost every shot.

Overall, I’ll take the win. It wasn’t pretty and the offense needs to get back into gear but it was an extremely important victory. The Spurs need every game from here on out to secure a top-two seed in the Western Conference.

-I was really happy with how Tim Duncan played. The guards weren’t helping him much by scoring easy baskets, so Duncan was forced to do a lot of the heavy lifting. He was active and attentive all game long and was easily the best player on the court for either team. While I do think he was still whining a bit too much, he wasn’t as bad as he was against the Jazz. On the night, Duncan finished with 27 points, 11 rebounds, one block and one turnover, while shooting 10-for-22 from the court. This was a vintage Duncan game in that everyone on the Spurs was coasting, while Duncan continuously gave effort until the victory was secured.

-I’m not sure if Manu Ginobili is being commanded by Pop to not go 100% against non-playoff teams, but his lack of effort against sub par teams has been apparent for the last couple weeks. It’s like he plays just hard enough against non-playoff teams to keep the Spurs up and he won’t turn on the jets unless the Spurs need a push. While this is a very un-Manu-like strategy, I think it’s actually pretty smart. I want Ginobili as healthy as possible for the playoffs. If he wants to just go through the motions against sub par teams, so be it. In this contest, Ginobili had ten points, six assists, three rebounds and four turnovers, while shooting 3-for-5 from the floor.

-Tony Parker couldn’t buy a bucket – but other than that actually played well. He missed 12-of-16 shots from the floor on his way to eight points, seven assists, three rebounds and no turnovers. Defensively, Parker was also really good against both Blake and Jarrett Jack. Offensively, he needs to start pushing the pace more. Even though he tried a few times, he needs to be more persistent – even if no one else on the team wants to run with him. Parker attacking teams in the open court is arguably the Spurs' best offensive weapon.

-Bruce Bowen played a team-high 39 minutes and had a quality game overall. His defense against Roy was good throughout. Roy hit a few tough shots in the second half but Bowen couldn’t have guarded him much better. Offensively, Bowen hit 4-of-7 shots on his way to ten points, three rebounds and one assist. Bowen was 2-for-4 on threes – while the team was a combined 2-for-11.

-Finley was on the court for only 20 minutes but his shot looked good. His rhythm on his jumper was noticeable and he even created a couple looks for himself. Finley finished with seven points, three rebounds and one assist, while shooting 3-for-4 from the field. His defense wasn’t especially good but he was at least active.

-Fabricio Oberto was better than he was against the Jazz, however he still needs to improve a lot before the playoffs begin. He played 15 minutes and had three points and four rebounds. He again lost time to Kurt Thomas, who has outplayed him in the last few ballgames. Oberto bringing better focus and effort would do wonders for his consistency.

-Kurt Thomas had one of his better games as a Spur. In 26 minutes of the bench, Thomas had two points and 13 rebounds. Of his 13 rebounds, nine came in the first half. Pop used a small ball alignment that featured Thomas as the big and he reacted by becoming a beast on the boards. If he can continue to grab rebounds when the Spurs go small, Pop may toy with that lineup more often.

-Ime Udoka returned to where he spent last season, his college days and his high school days. The Portland native played decently in his homecoming, although it was obvious he was pressing at times. To his credit, he did hit a big three-pointer in the second half. On the night, Udoka had five points and one steal, while shooting 2-for-7 from the floor. As of late, Udoka’s rebounding has been erratic, which is a concern. He needs to make rebounding a priority on a nightly basis.

-Jacque Vaughn and Damon Stoudamire split the backup point guard minutes yet again. I’m hypothesizing that Pop went with Stoudamire in the second half to try to wakeup the team’s stagnant offense. Stoudmaire responded by missing all three of his shots, but truthfully he didn’t play that bad. He pushed the pace a bit and got the Spurs into their offense decently enough. I’m a bit concerned with Vaughn because his heroic five or six game stretch where he played like the best backup point guard in the NBA is over – and apparently the real Jacque Vaughn has returned.

-Matt Bonner, Brent Barry and Robert Horry didn’t play. Barry and Horry continue to battle injuries. Bonner actually played but I don’t feel like typing about how he performed. If you missed out on his one minute of garbage time, it’s your loss.

-I’m sure Pop doesn’t like seeing the offense this stagnant but I find it hard to believe that he’s too worried. It’s obvious that once Parker and Ginobili start pushing the pace more, the offense will be able to return. Right now, the Spurs are grinding it out offensively even more than usual and the result is ugly, low scoring affairs.

While I grimaced when Stoudamire entered the game, Pop is smartly trying to rebuild Stoudamire’s confidence after a couple horrible outings in the last few weeks. There may come a time when Stoudamire is needed in the playoffs so Pop might as well give him playing time here and there to keep him sharp.

The bottomline is the Spurs are in a position where every game has huge playoff implications. With five games left on the schedule, the Spurs can’t afford to go through a rough patch. They need to keep winning – especially this coming Wednesday against the Phoenix Suns. It’s time to give Sun Fan yet another thing to complain about.

Believe.

wildbill2u
04-07-2008, 09:30 AM
A forgettable game.

BIG z
04-07-2008, 10:14 AM
TP looked really tired...

DAF86
04-07-2008, 10:21 AM
If Manu isn't going 100% against teams as a strategy i don't like it. This could affect Manu's confidence for the playoffs

BigVee
04-07-2008, 10:42 AM
Manu's confidence will be fine if he is doing this purposely. I agree with timvp's analysis, manu is shying away from driving in traffic and trying to stay on the perimeter or drive just enough to create a pass to a teammate. He is trying to avoid knees in the thighs, ankle sprains, etc. He will be ready when the chips are on the table.

TMTTRIO
04-07-2008, 10:44 AM
I don't think Pop is telling Manu anything. I just think he has gone into one of his usual funks now. Hopefully it won't last too long.

SAGambler
04-07-2008, 10:58 AM
Well, there has to be something going on. Manu only took 5 shot attempts. Sometimes he takes that many in 5 minutes or less.

But then I think back to how the playoffs will be slowed down and scoring so many points won't become a necessity. Didn't we win a finals game last year only scoring like 75?

I also agree that Portland is poised to become another beast of the west. Getting Oden back and another top pick along with the talent they have, I can certainly see them becoming a perennial contender for the next several years.

thispego
04-07-2008, 11:03 AM
The Blazers are destined to be an elite team in the Western Conference for a long time. Greg Oden, LaMarcus Aldridge and Brandon Roy form a hell of a core. Add to that a group of very good role players (Steve Blake, Joel Przybilla, Travis Outlaw, Martell Webster, etc.) and a quality head coach in Nate McMillan, not to mention a Spurs-trained front office, and there’s no reason why the Blazers won’t win at least one championship in the next decade.
I dont get all the Oden and Trail Blazers dick sucking thats been going on since Oden was drafted. He hasn't played a single NBA game yet and has already had knee reconstruction. Hopefully he is good and the trailblazers do have success in the future but Oden hasnt shown me shit yet. He was good in college. just good and tall.

TampaDude
04-07-2008, 11:48 AM
Fuck it...it's a win.

roycrikside
04-07-2008, 12:29 PM
Don't you think some blame has to go to Pop or Tony for Manu's 5 FGA attempts there TimVP? One calls the plays, the other makes the decisions. Again, as has been the case a lot lately, Manu is on the court for minutes at a time with Parker and doesn't touch the ball and I don't think Pop calls any plays for him unless he's playing with scrubs. Four of Manu's five shot attempts were with Parker on the bench. The pattern I've noticed of late is that Pop doesn't call plays for Manu with the other members of the big three on the floor unless it's a close game in the 4th quarter.

Something really needs to be done about this, it's pretty inexcusable for Parker to have 16 shots and Manu to have five when the former is shooting so poorly and the latter is doing relatively well. You can talk about aggressiveness and playing less than 100% all you want, I know Manu had six assists so he had the ball a little bit, but you can't tell me with a straight face he's getting as many touches now as he used to.

Ed Helicopter Jones
04-07-2008, 02:13 PM
I didn't get to watch the game but I like the 13 boards from Thomas. As I've said before, it will be great for this team if there is a true anchor in the middle when Timmy sits.

MrChug
04-07-2008, 02:51 PM
I'd love a TALL player in the middle, primarily for shotblocking or shot-altering. He doesn't have to be an athlete with muscle like Tim/Kurt in there...but alas, I'm thinking about next year. Robert Swift of the Sonics/Biedrins (I can dream)/Brendan Haywood/Tyson Chandler-type.

timaios
04-07-2008, 02:52 PM
Don't you think some blame has to go to Pop or Tony for Manu's 5 FGA attempts there TimVP?

Manu played plenty of time without Tony... and he made passes to vaughn or made turnovers when he tried to get in the paint.
I remember when the spurs played the jazz, Tony made a pass to Manu who was totally open at the 3, then Tony defensive man came to Manu who gave the ball back to Tony at the 3. Tony was "WTF", he took the 3 and missed it.
I think Manu has lost a little confidence. I don't know why.
Maybe he saved himself for the Suns wednesday.
:ihit

wildchild
04-07-2008, 03:46 PM
I'd love a TALL player in the middle, primarily for shotblocking or shot-altering. He doesn't have to be an athlete with muscle like Tim/Kurt in there...but alas, I'm thinking about next year. Robert Swift of the Sonics/Biedrins (I can dream)/Brendan Haywood/Tyson Chandler-type.

Tiago Splitter could be your answer. Tall and young. Ian, too :tu.

1Parker1
04-07-2008, 03:53 PM
Bonner actually played but I don’t feel like typing about how he performed. If you missed out on his one minute of garbage time, it’s your loss.

:lol :tu

I am really, really, really interested to see how the Spurs play on Wed against the Suns. You can make the argument that the reason the Suns haven't gone the way of the Mavs because of the surge of confidence they got from winning against the Spurs last month. I really think that win pushed them into being contenders. Spurs have got to win Wed, not for seeding reasons, but for confidence reasons. Give that win to the Suns, and they'll have all the confience should they meet in the postseason.

Amuseddaysleeper
04-07-2008, 04:01 PM
don't forget the Suns will be on a b2b

so we can have that excuse covered :lol

Spurs Dynasty 21
04-07-2008, 04:22 PM
I'm sure Pop is telling Manu to slow down

timvp
04-07-2008, 05:01 PM
Don't you think some blame has to go to Pop or Tony for Manu's 5 FGA attempts there TimVP?No. I know Manu Fan likes to blame others when Manu doesn't have a monster game, but the facts just don't add up in this case. No one is holding Manu back -- except for Manu.

Manu played six and a half minutes in the second half without Parker on the floor. In that time, he went scoreless and attempted just one field goal. How was Parker holding him back then? And Pop can't be blamed because Manu touched the ball as much as he wanted to in that stretch of time.

Just looking at the stats, it's pretty obvious that Manu had the ball a lot. You don't get six assists and four turnovers without getting plenty of touches.

Again, I truly think it's a matter of Manu just pacing himself against sub par teams. My only question is whether that pacing is being ordered by Pop or Manu is doing it himself. Either way, I think it's a good thing. We all know Manu can take over when needed ... no point in proving that versus teams the Spurs can beat without Manu putting his body on the line.

It's not a coincidence that lately Manu barely uses any energy against bad teams and then goes all out versus good teams. I'd be worried about Manu's rhythm going into the playoffs if the pattern weren't so obvious. This coming Wednesday, I fully expect Manu to be in full Manu mode.

It just amazes me how a majority of Spurs fans don't hold Manu accountable for his own play. If anyone on the team outside of Manu has an off night, it's because they don't have Manu's heart. If Manu has an off night, it's because Parker didn't pass him the ball enough and Pop was being mean.

Spurs fans amaze me.

:dizzy

Allanon
04-07-2008, 06:21 PM
I dont get all the Oden and Trail Blazers dick sucking thats been going on since Oden was drafted. He hasn't played a single NBA game yet and has already had knee reconstruction. Hopefully he is good and the trailblazers do have success in the future but Oden hasnt shown me shit yet. He was good in college. just good and tall.

I'm not sold on Oden either, but I also think the Blazers are going to be badass in a year or two. Brandon Roy, LaMarcus Aldridge, Travis Outlaw are serious ballers...they are very smooth in everything they do. Steve Blake, Martell Webster and Pryzbilla are great roleplayers.

Blazers have been off since LaMarcus got injured a few weeks ago but they are the best built young team in the NBA. Shooting, inside game and point guard leadership.

Roy and Travis Outlaw have the desire to be the best...I don't know about Aldridge yet.

Oden doesn't have to be the next Shaq/Kareem/Robinson...if he's only as good as Chris Kaman that will be enough to make the Blazers into a top 8 West team.

bigfundamental21
04-07-2008, 07:26 PM
Bottom line is we won and we needed to bounce back from the ugly loss to the Jazz. Now with a couple of days off, we need to prepare for the game vs. the Suns on Wednesday. It will definitely be a good tune up for the playoffs.

DAF86
04-07-2008, 10:18 PM
No. I know Manu Fan likes to blame others when Manu doesn't have a monster game, but the facts just don't add up in this case. No one is holding Manu back -- except for Manu.

Manu played six and a half minutes in the second half without Parker on the floor. In that time, he went scoreless and attempted just one field goal. How was Parker holding him back then? And Pop can't be blamed because Manu touched the ball as much as he wanted to in that stretch of time.

Just looking at the stats, it's pretty obvious that Manu had the ball a lot. You don't get six assists and four turnovers without getting plenty of touches.

Again, I truly think it's a matter of Manu just pacing himself against sub par teams. My only question is whether that pacing is being ordered by Pop or Manu is doing it himself. Either way, I think it's a good thing. We all know Manu can take over when needed ... no point in proving that versus teams the Spurs can beat without Manu putting his body on the line.

It's not a coincidence that lately Manu barely uses any energy against bad teams and then goes all out versus good teams. I'd be worried about Manu's rhythm going into the playoffs if the pattern weren't so obvious. This coming Wednesday, I fully expect Manu to be in full Manu mode.

It just amazes me how a majority of Spurs fans don't hold Manu accountable for his own play. If anyone on the team outside of Manu has an off night, it's because they don't have Manu's heart. If Manu has an off night, it's because Parker didn't pass him the ball enough and Pop was being mean.

Spurs fans amaze me.

:dizzy

:wtf You were the first to give Manu an excuse suggesting that he could be playing like this as a strategy instead of saying that he's just playing bad.
I think that there is no strategy and he's just out of confidence. He needs to shot more mid range jumpers 'cuz the 3's aren't falling and every time he attacks the rim he turns the ball over or takes very though shots.

SequSpur
04-07-2008, 10:47 PM
I didn't see the game, so I can't comment.

Amuseddaysleeper
04-07-2008, 10:50 PM
I didn't see the game, so I can't comment.

damn

ducks
04-07-2008, 11:19 PM
It just amazes me how a majority of Spurs fans don't hold Manu accountable for his own play. If anyone on the team outside of Manu has an off night, it's because they don't have Manu's heart. If Manu has an off night, it's because Parker didn't pass him the ball enough and Pop was being mean.

Spurs fans amaze me.

:dizzy

do not get me started
manu had the dagger not tp even though tp hit the 2 big jumpers last night
and put the lead to much for blazers to come back
it had to be the manu dunk

timaios
04-08-2008, 01:38 AM
do not get me started
manu had the dagger not tp even though tp hit the 2 big jumpers last night
and put the lead to much for blazers to come back
it had to be the manu dunk

"6 years old child" comment

timaios
04-08-2008, 01:42 AM
Again, I truly think it's a matter of Manu just pacing himself against sub par teams. My only question is whether that pacing is being ordered by Pop or Manu is doing it himself.

I don't think Manu can pacing himself !
He is an always 100% guy.

roycrikside
04-08-2008, 04:02 AM
The fact remains, one shot attempt in all the time he played with Parker and there were sequences, whole stretches at a time where he never touched the ball. I'm sure some of it is his doing, but some of it is Pop's and Tony's as well. Spread the blame 33% each and call it a day.

And I wouldn't be too concerned about it and would chalk it up to the bad team Manu/good team Manu theory, but even in the Utah game, they didn't go to him very much at all the first three quarters (especially when he played with Tim and Tony) and then we he tried to rev it up in the 4th, he just couldn't. He even said something like "I couldn't do anything in the 4th when it's my time of the game."

I don't like that he has a designated "time of the game" now. Generally your 2nd best player should be used from the moment he steps on the floor.

The Suns game on Wednesday will tell the tale I guess.

roycrikside
04-08-2008, 04:05 AM
do not get me started
manu had the dagger not tp even though tp hit the 2 big jumpers last night
and put the lead to much for blazers to come back
it had to be the manu dunk

You've got a lot of nerve trumpeting the heroics of a guy who was 2 of 14 before he hit his last two shots, Ducks. That's a pretty crappy night for a guy who shoots mostly lay-ups and floaters.

anakha
04-08-2008, 04:09 AM
......aaaaaaaand Round 15,482 of the ongoing CoM vs ducks battle is now underway.

Ding!

Slippy
04-08-2008, 06:16 AM
No.Again, I truly think it's a matter of Manu just pacing himself against sub par teams. My only question is whether that pacing is being ordered by Pop or Manu is doing it himself. Either way, I think it's a good thing. We all know Manu can take over when needed ... no point in proving that versus teams the Spurs can beat without Manu putting his body on the line.



I agree with your thinking that Manu is holding back by choice although I'd say both he and Pop probably found some common ground on this one. To be honest , i've always thought Manu plays it out this way when Tim and Tony offer the team the best chance of scoring and his all out play is not needed. Ultimately, it benifits Manu and the team for others to get involved. They all need to be firing and get into play-off form. At the same time a refreshed Manu saves his best for when it matters knowing opposing defenses will be focused on his teammates and less on him.

All this goes out the door if the team struggles and Manu's forced to make more of a impact before the play-offs start.

timvp
04-09-2008, 07:58 PM
The fact remains, one shot attempt in all the time he played with Parker and there were sequences, whole stretches at a time where he never touched the ball. I'm sure some of it is his doing, but some of it is Pop's and Tony's as well. Spread the blame 33% each and call it a day. I don't really care how blame is spread. However, it's just weird that Ginobili is the only player on the team that gets excuses made for him whenever he doesn't have a big game. If Parker or Duncan have an off game, it's due to them sucking. If Ginobili has an off game, it's because Parker didn't pass him the ball, Pop wasn't calling plays for him and Duncan got the ball on the post too much.


And I wouldn't be too concerned about it and would chalk it up to the bad team Manu/good team Manu theory, but even in the Utah game, they didn't go to him very much at all the first three quarters (especially when he played with Tim and Tony) and then we he tried to rev it up in the 4th, he just couldn't. He even said something like "I couldn't do anything in the 4th when it's my time of the game."It is Ginobili's time of game when Pop trots out the lineup featuring only Ginobili with Duncan and Parker resting. That was Ginobili taking the fall for the loss; not him saying he only gets shots in the fourth.


I don't like that he has a designated "time of the game" now. Generally your 2nd best player should be used from the moment he steps on the floor. Ginobili usually gets involved right away when he comes off the bench. That's why he's so successful coming in that role. It takes him no time to warm up and get into the action. He just comes into the game ready to roll. I don't know of anybody else in the league capable of doing that.

And really, I don't see the point of using the "2nd best player" line. Offensively, this team is split almost exactly between the big three. The big three couldn't split shot attempts more evenly if they tried. And it really depends on the scenario to determine who the "best" player is ... it's not set in stone. During the 2005 playoff run and this regular season, I'd say Ginobili would be ranked as the "best". However, Parker was better than Ginobili in the 2006 regular season and the 2007 playoffs. Duncan was probably only the third best player in the 2006 regular season. Overall, Duncan is almost always the most valuable due to his role on the team but who is "best" changes too often to put a hard label on the big three.


The Suns game on Wednesday will tell the tale I guess.True. I'm expecting Ginobili to come out with both guns blazing.

:hat