Game Thoughts: Spurs vs. Suns Apr. 9

[timvp]

What a pitiful performance by the Spurs. Entering the day with a decent shot at attaining the number one seed in the Western Conference, the Spurs instead rolled over and died against the Suns. Now San Antonio has to fight just to have homecourt advantage in the first round.

The Phoenix Suns came into San Antonio and were smarter, executed better and were more physical than the Spurs. Basically, the Suns just out-Spursed the Spurs. No matter what runs the Spurs made, the Suns just kept executing and eventually the Spurs sputtered. The Suns entered with a gameplan and worked that gameplan flawlessly.

The Shaquille O’Neal trade has worked out wonderfully for Phoenix. Against the Spurs, the Suns are now the bigger, stronger and more athletic team. And when O’Neal plays hard all game, they are also more talented and just as determined. A lot of supposed NBA experts ripped Steve Kerr and the Suns but the trade is looking brilliant. For the first time in the Steve Nash Era, the Suns actually have a legitimate chance to win a championship. In this game particularly, the only thing that kept the Suns from really destroying the Spurs was foul trouble for O’Neal and Amare Stoudemire.

My hopes of the Spurs winning a championship this season have reached a new low. This was a game the Spurs really needed – and the result was blowout win for the Suns. The Spurs tried step on the gas at various points in the game but there was just nothing in the tank. It’s like the Spurs let their guard down after their recent winning streak and now that they are trying to turn it up a notch, they are having problems doing so.

Overall, this is a very disappointing turn of events. Not too long ago, it appeared as if the Spurs had begun to figure things out. Now it’s back to square one with only four games to go in the regular season.

-Tim Duncan did not have a good game. Honestly, he got abused by O’Neal when it mattered on both ends of the court. O’Neal deserves some credit because when he wants to, he can guard Duncan better than anyone ever has. But Duncan should have played a lot better than he did. One of his main problems right now is his whining. Instead of manning up and playing, he’s looking for calls every other time up the court. He also has to come with a better plan of attack against O’Neal. No-look fade-away hooks from ten feet out aren’t the answer. Defensively, Duncan wasn’t doing much to stop O’Neal or Stoudemire. On the night, Duncan finished with 23 points, ten rebounds and two blocks, on 9-for-21 shooting from the floor. Numbers look decent but his play was severely lacking.

-Speaking of severely lacking, that also described Manu Ginobili’s performance accurately. He tried to up his level of aggression tonight but he just wasn’t playing well. To the naked eye, one would assume Ginobili is worn out by watching him play. Hopefully Ginobili isn’t showing signs of having to expend more energy than usual during this regular season. The explosion that was in Ginobili’s legs early in the season isn’t there and he looks unsure of himself on his outside shooting. I do also think that Ginobili has scaled back his effort level in recent weeks and that has hurt his overall output. Whatever the cause, Ginobili needs to find his game again before the playoffs arrive. If he doesn’t, it’s going to be a long summer for the Spurs. Against the Suns, Ginobili had eight points, four rebounds and four assists, while shooting 3-for-12 from the court.

-Of the big three, Tony Parker played the best – but that’s not saying much. He appeared to be the only Spur not intimidated and would drive the ball to the basket. The problem was he didn’t do it enough. The way this game was going, Parker needed to take 25 to 30 shots for the Spurs to win. Duncan and Ginobili were off and no one else was getting clean looks. This was a perfect time for Parker to keep shooting until the Suns started sending help. At that point, the Spurs might get a few open looks from the perimeter. On the night, Parker had 20 points and four assists on 9-for-17 shooting from the field. Parker didn’t stay in continuous attack mode and that was yet another problem for the Spurs on this night.

-Bruce Bowen defended Steve Nash all game and did a pretty good job. Nash wasn’t able to find many free shots for himself. He had ten assists, which is about par for Nash. However, Nash had zero turnovers and that was a huge plus for the Suns. Bowen didn’t let Nash explode but he also didn’t rattle him too much. Bowen is best against Nash when he flusters Nash and forces mistakes. Offensively, Bowen wasn’t helping matters as he hit only 2-of-8 shots from the perimeter.

-You don’t hear a Spurs fan say this much but Michael Finley needs to shoot the ball more. And honestly, it’s not his fault. Finley had to take and make difficult shots tonight. He finished 4-for-5 in 29 minutes, with only one of those shots being clean looks. The problem is the team is playing at such a slow pace offensively that opposing teams haven’t been forced to help and no mismatches are being created. The team needs to play faster and that will allow shooters like Finley to get more open looks. On the night, the Spurs only had nine three-point attempts as a team. That number is less than half what they average and it points to the opposition being able to get back and set their defense.

-What part of Fabricio Oberto not being able to guard O’Neal does Pop not understand? Oberto. Can. Not. Guard. Shaq. When O’Neal has Oberto on him, the best possible outcome for Oberto is if he can flop his way to an offensive foul. Otherwise, O’Neal is going to get an easy shot, draw a foul, injure Oberto or do a combination of those three things. In 23 minutes, Oberto had six points and four rebounds, while shooting 3-for-8 from the court. He shouldn’t have played as many minutes as he did, especially with how much he was being dominated.

-Ime Udoka played 26 minutes and finished with two points, six rebounds, two assists and three steals. Udoka was asked to guard Boris Diaw for a lot of the game – inexplicably, really. Diaw is too tall and too thick for Udoka to guard, especially on the low post. Offensively, he wasn’t getting many open looks for the same reasons Finley wasn’t getting open looks. On the whole, Udoka played pretty well but he was put in a lot of situations where he couldn’t succeed.

-I really wish the Jacque Vaughn of a couple weeks ago would return. Once Pop gave him back his job full-time, Vaughn played great basketball for a two-week stretch. Now he’s playing poorly again. I’m not sure what changed but Vaughn needs to find that mojo before the playoffs begin.

-Kurt Thomas missed all four of his shots in his 13 minutes of action but he was playing well. In fact, I think Pop should have played him a lot longer. He was the only defender who seemed to bother O’Neal. Everyone else, Duncan included, was getting dominated by O’Neal in the low block. Offensively, I could live with the misses. They were good, clean looks that he’ll knock down more often than not. The only times in the game the Spurs weren’t the softer bunch were the minutes Thomas was on the floor. Pop dropped the ball by not playing him more.

-I though Pop had one of his worst coaching performances of the season. First of all, Oberto cannot guard O’Neal. I’m not sure what it’s going to take for Pop to realize this. O’Neal has owned Oberto since Oberto arrived in the United States. That is not changing anytime soon. Thomas should be on O’Neal. If not Thomas, then Duncan.

Second of all, has Pop not watched Diaw play before? He was putting a small on Diaw like Diaw is actually a threat to hit a jumper. Making adjustments because Boris freakin’ Diaw enters the game is a mistake. Keep a big on him and force him to shoot jumpers all night long. You put a small on him and suddenly he wakes up because he can go in the low block and post up.

I’ve also never been a fan of putting Bowen on Nash all game long. Let Parker chase him around the first two and a half quarters and then throw Bowen at him as a change of pace. The Spurs have a long history of success against Nash-lead teams when Parker defends him. Bowen on his for 48 minutes is an unnecessary gimmick.

Pop has to do something to get this team running again. This walk-it-up-the-court Spurs won’t be able to win a playoff series. They are playing like it’s 2001 all over again. Once they begin running, the offense will open right back up. Right now, they are making the game too difficult and they aren’t getting any of their trademark wide open three-point attempts that the Spurs have feasted on for the last decade.

Defensively, Pop wasn’t helping the team succeed. Allowing the Suns to shoot 51.9% is unacceptable. A large part of the problem was Pop forcing the team into bad matchups (Oberto on O’Neal, Udoka on Diaw, etc.).

The bottomline is this was a horrific loss. The offense was listless. The defense was gimmicky and weak. I still believe in this team but this was an ominous sign with the playoffs looming around the corner.

The Spurs have been extremely streaky as of late so hopefully they are getting their last bad streak out of their system. However, it’s officially time to buckle down, sack up and get the last four games on the schedule. It starts Wednesday in a must-win game against the Seattle Supersonics.

Believe.

[MannyIsGod]

The Spurs are running FAR too much isolation offense as of late. And its the reason that they get shut down so easily. Look at their assist numbers, they're horrible. Overall the last few games against WC playoff teams have had them looking completely outclassed. I don't want to give up on this team, but in complete honestly nothing of with the exception of the Houston game has inspired confidence over the past month.

The Lakers game is a huge huge huge game. They need to do something in that game to show they're for real.

[polandprzem]

I can't agree more on that one Derren

Spurs looked lost like they did against Suns the prevoius game. Same situation

The problem is the team is playing at such a slow pace offensively that opposing teams haven’t been forced to help and no mismatches are being created.
That is what I said when spurs got spanked by Suns last time.
It realy does not help the shooters and frankly dammit we have only one shooter on our team. Good he can hit some shots if he would be off the spurs could be the worst team of all 8 west teams.
We also have not good ball movenment and with zone it disappears and how can you break a zone without people making outside shots?

I can't remember much of a good p&r again. Maybe because I woke up (being exhaused the day before with sickness) at 3:42am to watch my lovely spurs giving up.
I don't know but I think that playing against Phoenix you must use as much screenrolls as possible esp. against Shaq.

And the most important thing.
I must admitt that Suns look better with Shaq against Spurs on the short period of time he was with the team (diferent story is Suns with Shaq all year). We are hre and now - Suns are rolling, smiling and joking, looks motivated - big part of it is Shaq and Hill.

Dayumn

[timvp]

The Spurs are running FAR too much isolation offense as of late. And its the reason that they get shut down so easily. Look at their assist numbers, they're horrible.All the problems I see on offense point to a lack of energy (or laziness, which classification you prefer). The pace is incredibly slow. And then even if they have TD posting up, there is no movement off the ball. Duncan has one freakin' assist in the last four games. That points to a lot of people standing around watching him operate.

Running more and more movement in the halfcourt would do wonders for this team. Ball movement is a bit of a problem but the bigger problem is player movement.


Overall the last few games against WC playoff teams have had them looking completely outclassed. I don't want to give up on this team, but in complete honestly nothing of with the exception of the Houston game has inspired confidence over the past month.

The Lakers game is a huge huge huge game. They need to do something in that game to show they're for real.True. This upcoming Laker game will tell a lot. If the Spurs lay yet another egg, it's really time to start panicking.

[Quasar]

First Utah, then this disaster in a must-win game! A loss such as this coming so late in the season is extremely disappointing and severely dampens the championship hopes of many fans.

It surely had an effect on the confidence of many of the players too!

CIA Pop?!?

I couldn't watch the game as usual, so I'm just theorizing here. It may go a long way into explaining this... Pop can't be so stupid that he thought that those defensive matches and substitutions he did would work.

Could he be thinking that the Spurs are not winning it with the lackadaisical way they've been playing? It does seem that the Spurs are still in auto-pilot mode... These guys are in for a shock if they continue playing that way. And perhaps Pop thought he'd shock them prematurely to avoid a loss in the first game of the playoffs!

Barry - hurry back!! Our offense needs you!

[timvp]

CIA Pop?!?It's too late in the season for Pop to be pulling any CIA maneuvers. This is real.

I wish it were CIA Pop, though :depressed

[DAF86]

This upcoming Laker game will tell a lot. If the Spurs lay yet another egg, it's really time to start panicking.

I'll get worry if we play like this in the playoffs. I don't care about regular season games. Pop doesn't like to show anything on these games. Besides the big three will play together a lot more minutes in the playoffs.

[MannyIsGod]

I'm fairly certain we can forget about Barry doing anything this year. The same can be said for Horry. There's no time to acclimate them in. We're going to have to win what we have out there right now.

[Kori Ellis]

I'm fairly certain we can forget about Barry doing anything this year. The same can be said for Horry. There's no time to acclimate them in. We're going to have to win what we have out there right now.

I think Horry will play. I doubt Barry will.

[Obstructed_View]

Pop can't be so stupid that he thought that those defensive matches and substitutions he did would work.
See 2006 Western Conference Semifinals.

[MannyIsGod]

I'll get worry if we play like this in the playoffs. I don't care about regular season games. Pop doesn't like to show anything on these games. Besides the big three will play together a lot more minutes in the playoffs.These aren't normal regular season games. For all intents and purposes each game against a WC playoff team at the moment IS a playoff game. Not only that but if you look at the way the Spurs finish regular season they are almost always on a run and not floundering the way they are now.

I honestly cannot remember the last time the Spurs consistently played this poorly in 2nd halves. Its not typicaly the first half that does them in, but the droughts that come after halftime. I don't know if this is an indicator of a lack of energy and legs due to age, but the thought is really starting to cross my mind.

[objective]

Pop and Oberto is just the latest example of how stubborn Pop can be. Usually people only notice that stubbornness when he sticks someone in his doghouse and never lets them out, but when the stubborn kicks in it can hurt the team in other ways.

[DAF86]

These aren't normal regular season games. For all intents and purposes each game against a WC playoff team at the moment IS a playoff game. Not only that but if you look at the way the Spurs finish regular season they are almost always on a run and not floundering the way they are now.

I honestly cannot remember the last time the Spurs consistently played this poorly in 2nd halves. Its not typicaly the first half that does them in, but the droughts that come after halftime. I don't know if this is an indicator of a lack of energy and legs due to age, but the thought is really starting to cross my mind.

Parker was playing great until pop took him out for the usual rest. He was about 8 minutes out of the game. Do you think that is going to happen in the playoffs?

[roycrikside]

The problem is that the offense has gotten incredibly predictable. When Timmy and Tony are in the game, they take almost all the shots and no plays are run for Manu and really he doesn't even get to touch the ball very much. Usually Parker just dribbles around, waits to see if a crease will open up to drive and if there is, great, and if not, he just dribbles around some more, let's the clock run down to 2 and fires up a jumper.

Or more often, we run the play for Duncan in the post, but our post entry is so difficult because everyone knows it's coming so they front him, double him, do whatever, and most of our guys SUCK at throwing a post entry pass, especially Fin. By the time Tim touches it, there's like 8 seconds left and not too much time for him to pass it to an open guy. Hell, most of the time the defense wants Tim to shoot the ball and doesn't even double because he catches it in such a non-advantageous position for him, it's like "go ahead, do your dinky 15 foot fadeaway turnaround jumper, we won't double."

The only time Pop runs plays for Manu anymore is when Vaughn is in there with him. Our pace is excruciatingly slow and we suck to watch right now. We were playing a lot faster and getting a lot more high quality scoring shots for everyone when the offense was being run through Manu more, but it's just not happening. Tony can't make the same decisions and he certainly can't make them as fast. The only guy he can create for is occasionally Bruce in the corner.

I know nobody in the forum, especially people in charge, like Manu vs. Tony posts, but you tell me why the offense is so boring and slow right now. All we're doing is watching Tony Parker dribble dribble dribble or Tim try to back people down and taking every possession down to the gun.

It's embarrassing to play this way, especially at home. You are literally putting your fans to sleep with all this god forsaken holding of the ball and dribbling. Give the ball to your best decision maker. Even when he can't shoot well he can get other guys lay-ups and in rhythm open shots.

Anyone who is watching these games and thinks the only difference is Manu's effort is a damn blind fool. It's not the same offense, it's not the same distribution and it's certainly not the same amount of touches. He's gone to 3rd banana again and that shit hasn't worked all year, certainly not against good teams. Every time we've had a decent winning streak or we've beaten a good team this calender year it's been because Manu was 1st or 2nd in the team in attempts. Now we change everything? It makes no sense.

Is Tony's ego that god damn fragile where he can't play as the 3rd guy? He did it fine in 2005. Now he thinks he's some star? He either has to be the 2nd guy or he's gonna pout and not be able to play?

This team isn't '06 and it isn't 07. It needs Manu to shoot more and play more. The role players are old and they are incredibly limited offensively, more than ever. Manu needs to take a bigger role for the team to win, as has been the case all year. If you try to run the '08 offense the '06 way, well you get '01 results.

[roycrikside]

Pop ruined everything in the 3rd quarter. Starting Manu was dumb and playing Tony all 12 mins was dumb. I don't know why he thinks Tony is like Allen Iverson. He's not used to playing all 12 mins of a quarter and he's certainly not conditioned to do so. He gets fatigued by the 9 min mark like everyone else. He should have stuck to the 1st half rotation because it was working fine. He played Tony the whole quarter and wouldn't you know, he made a bunch of mental and physical fatigue mistakes he normally wouldn't make.

I don't blame Tony at all, it's all on Pop. He's coaching like an arrogant dumbass.

[Kori Ellis]

:lol @ roycrikside

So freakin predictable. When has Tony ever pouted about being the 3rd guy? :lol

Things have certainly changed for Manu. But it's not all on Pop/Tony/Tim. A part of it is on Manu.

Manu is obviously in funk and he looks like he doesn't have any explosiveness in his legs. He shot 7-8 times in the first half. That's not less touches than he normally gets. In tonight's game, you can see Tony passing it Manu several times, and Manu passing it right back. He obviously just didn't have it this game.

[polandprzem]

Pop ruined everything in the 3rd quarter. Starting Manu was dumb and playing Tony all 12 mins was dumb. I don't know why he thinks Tony is like Allen Iverson. He's not used to playing all 12 mins of a quarter and he's certainly not conditioned to do so. He gets fatigued by the 9 min mark like everyone else. He should have stuck to the 1st half rotation because it was working fine. He played Tony the whole quarter and wouldn't you know, he made a bunch of mental and physical fatigue mistakes he normally wouldn't make.

I don't blame Tony at all, it's all on Pop. He's coaching like an arrogant dumbass.

Tony had a lot of games playing 12 first minutes of the game

[Kori Ellis]

Pop ruined everything in the 3rd quarter. Starting Manu was dumb and playing Tony all 12 mins was dumb. I don't know why he thinks Tony is like Allen Iverson. He's not used to playing all 12 mins of a quarter and he's certainly not conditioned to do so. He gets fatigued by the 9 min mark like everyone else. He should have stuck to the 1st half rotation because it was working fine. He played Tony the whole quarter and wouldn't you know, he made a bunch of mental and physical fatigue mistakes he normally wouldn't make.

I don't blame Tony at all, it's all on Pop. He's coaching like an arrogant dumbass.

This part I agree with. I told LJ the same thing during the game. It's bad coaching. Tony needs to come out around the 9 min mark in the first and the third.

[DAF86]

Pop has to oblige Gino to take shots like he does with Tony, Manu needs to think a little bit less and let it fly to regain confidence

[Kori Ellis]

Pop has to oblige Gino to take shots like he does with Tony, Manu needs to think a little bit less and let it fly to regain confidence

Manu is allowed to take as many shots as he wants. He has the green light and has for years.

[DAF86]

Manu is allowed to take as many shots as he wants. He has the green light and has for years.

I know that, but he is passing on too many shots 'cause he's lacking confidence. Pop needs to OBLIGE manu to take those shots.

[MannyIsGod]

I really doubt Manu has a lack of confidence.

[roycrikside]

:lol @ roycrikside

So freakin predictable. When has Tony ever pouted about being the 3rd guy? :lol

Things have certainly changed for Manu. But it's not all on Pop/Tony/Tim. A part of it is on Manu.

Manu is obviously in funk and he looks like he doesn't have any explosiveness in his legs. He shot 7-8 times in the first half. That's not less touches than he normally gets. In tonight's game, you can see Tony passing it Manu several times, and Manu passing it right back. He obviously just didn't have it this game.

Not verbally, but certainly physically. When Tony's third in shot attempts he's usually not shooting a very good percentage and his defense is poor and the announcers say stuff like "he's floating out there" and all the other stuff we're used to. It just seems like if Tony isn't our best or 2nd best player in a given game, he plays absolutely terrible. He can't just be consistently above average, every night.

Then again, maybe that problem is affecting Manu now as well. He's been the team's best or 2nd best player for months, and now he's not used to playing as the 3rd option and he's lost.

Whatever, either way the offense looks horrid. And their chemistry together is bad. I know for a fact they got into a little verbal exchange in the Portland game so they're not exactly thrilled with each other on the court at the moment.

[DAF86]

I really doubt Manu has a lack of confidence.

What then? he lost all of his skills?

[timvp]

:lol How the hell is it always Parker's fault when Manu has a bad game? No matter what happens, you get Manu Fans coming onto the forum blaming Parker for Manu playing poorly. Has Manu ever had a bad game simply because he played bad? Or is that not possible?

Manu played nine and a half minutes without Parker in this game. He went 1-for-5 from the floor. What is the excuse for those nine and a half minutes? Ginobili is getting the same amount of touches he has always gotten when the big three has been healthy. Not as many touches as when Parker was hurt but that's to be expected. But Ginobili isn't doing much lately with or without Parker on the court. If Ginobili were setting the world on fire when he played without Parker, that'd be one thing. But that's simply not the case.

Ginobili's aggression level just isn't what it was earlier in the season. Now when he gets the ball, it seems like his first option is hitting Oberto after Oberto has slipped a pick. That's a pretty good play ... the first dozen times they do it. After that it becomes pretty obvious what is going to happen.

Ginobili has been at his best this season when he looks to attack the rim coming out of the gates. Then he gets his defenders sagging on him and he can hit threes. If they start sending help, Ginobili then can find open three-point shooters. Recently, Ginobili has come in thinking pass. He needs to come in and begin firing right away. He's not Kobe in that he can ease his way into a game knowing he'll get plenty of shots down the stretch. He has to cause havoc right away.

Parker has been far from flawless recently but to blame him for Ginobili's struggles not only doesn't make sense, it's just not statistically accurate.

[roycrikside]

All I know is it should not be this god damn hard to score points. Just fucking run a pick and roll against Shaq instead of trying to back him down and score one on one against him. He'll give you open shots all day if you just face the basket. Just give the ball to Manu and let him run a pick and roll with someone, anyone. For crying out loud he got Fab two lay-ups. Fab! He can certainly make it work with Duncan.

No matter how soft he's playing and how off his shot is, Manu can still pass the ball and knows how certain basic basketball plays are supposed to be run. I'm sick and tired of seeing an offense where nobody knows what they're doing, everyone is standing around and a contested shot is being fired up with 1 second to go.

[MannyIsGod]

What then? he lost all of his skills?More than likely a loss of his legs.

[MannyIsGod]

All I know is it should not be this god damn hard to score points. Just fucking run a pick and roll against Shaq instead of trying to back him down and score one on one against him. He'll give you open shots all day if you just face the basket. Just give the ball to Manu and let him run a pick and roll with someone, anyone. For crying out loud he got Fab two lay-ups. Fab! He can certainly make it work with Duncan.

No matter how soft he's playing and how off his shot is, Manu can still pass the ball and knows how certain basic basketball plays are supposed to be run. I'm sick and tired of seeing an offense where nobody knows what they're doing, everyone is standing around and a contested shot is being fired up with 1 second to go.The problem is htat teams are zoning the Spurs up a lot recently. You can say run pick and roll all you want but the spacing out there is horrible. Teams are daring the Spurs to hit jumprs in a lot of spots and its not going to happen.

Parker has done a good job of breaking down those zones to an extent, but more importantly the Spurs need to get a lot more easy buckets in transition than they have as of late.

[roycrikside]

:lol How the hell is it always Parker's fault when Manu has a bad game? No matter what happens, you get Manu Fans coming onto the forum blaming Parker for Manu playing poorly. Has Manu ever had a bad game simply because he played bad? Or is that not possible?

Manu played nine and a half minutes without Parker in this game. He went 1-for-5 from the floor. What is the excuse for those nine and a half minutes? Ginobili is getting the same amount of touches he has always gotten when the big three has been healthy. Not as many touches as when Parker was hurt but that's to be expected. But Ginobili isn't doing much lately with or without Parker on the court. If Ginobili were setting the world on fire when he played without Parker, that'd be one thing. But that's simply not the case.

Ginobili's aggression level just isn't what it was earlier in the season. Now when he gets the ball, it seems like his first option is hitting Oberto after Oberto has slipped a pick. That's a pretty good play ... the first dozen times they do it. After that it becomes pretty obvious what is going to happen.

Ginobili has been at his best this season when he looks to attack the rim coming out of the gates. Then he gets his defenders sagging on him and he can hit threes. If they start sending help, Ginobili then can find open three-point shooters. Recently, Ginobili has come in thinking pass. He needs to come in and begin firing right away. He's not Kobe in that he can ease his way into a game knowing he'll get plenty of shots down the stretch. He has to cause havoc right away.

Parker has been far from flawless recently but to blame him for Ginobili's struggles not only doesn't make sense, it's just not statistically accurate.

As I said, I'm not really blaming Tony. He just does what Pop tells him to do, he runs the plays that are called. But he will look for his shot first, above all else, we know this. I think Pop has just done a piss poor job of handling the balance between the big three of late (a problem he didn't have half the year it seems since one or another was hurt or limited) and I think a lot of it stems for him taking Manu's coachability for granted. Don't just assume he's going to come out firing. Maybe his confidence is down or he's in a funk or whatever. Do something to physically get him going. Run a couple plays for him, with Tim and Tony in there, specifically designed to get him shots.

Right now he's floating out there like he doesn't have to wake up til Vaughn is on the court. It's not good. Him and Duncan have to run a few pick and rolls and a few give and gos. Him and Tony have to run the occasional god forsaken fast break together. Right now the chemistry is terrible. It's like I feel Pop needs to get the big three in his office, plop them down in a chair and make them watch videos of Game 6 vs Phx and Game 1 vs Utah last year.

[naico]

I really don't see us winning it this year..It ain't gonna happen. Hopefully they proove me wrong in the playoffs but their play has been very dissapointing.

[MannyIsGod]

Its just a sad fact that right now we have a very poor offense. We've gotten by at times this year simply by riding the fact that we have 3 very capable scorers but I honestly think no one saw how important (except maybe for Whottttttttt) Brent Barry was at getting the ball moving in our offense.

I cringe when the 2nd unit is in at the start of the 2nd and 3rd. I know what the Spurs are going to do, You know what the Spurs are going to do, my fucking cat knows what the Spurs are going to do and the opposition DAMN sure knows that the Spurs are going to run pick and rolls with Manu.

So what do they do? They pressure him coming off the screen and shut down the passing lanes as much as possible forcing the ball into the hands of players like Jacque Vaughn in places where they then have to either hit a mid range jumper or try to create. Those aren't things Vaughn excels at. Thats probably way the Spurs did so well when Vaughn was clicking on all cylinders, but I think we can agree that was an aberration and not the norm.

I don't know what they can do other than run more. The faster they get into their sets and the more they get penetration/kicks just to get the defenses rotating and reacting the better off they'll be. But if they walk it up each time and force the ball into an isolation with under 10 to go on the clock then we'll be in serious trouble.

What makes me believe that we're already in serious trouble is that they should know this by now. There is no reason for them to not have identified the problem at this point in the season which means that their inability to solve it isn't because they're not willing but because they're not able.

[Allanon]

Very good and honest take TiMVP.

Shaq has been looking very good lately, either he was faking it in Miami or the Suns own the fountain of Youth. Shaq was brought in specifically to counter Tim Duncan...the rest of the team has always been good but too small so they were killed on the boards.

Shaq can't defend the high pick and roll well so I think the Spurs will work on this.

Aside from Shaq, Diaw caused all kinds of problems for the Spurs, probably the best I've seen him play all year. Diaw's post up threw the Spurs defense off kilter. I am not sure who the Spurs have that can guard Diaw other than maybe Bowen.

That play with the two behind the backs in the paint was really crazy. There was another behind the back at the baseline. Both led to turnovers and during a critical part of the game. I think Ime was in on both of them so that dude's gotta quit the Harlem Globetrotter stuff.

I don't know why Finley didn't shoot more often...he was making practically all his shots. TP played great in the first half but lost his mojo in the second. I can't help but wonder if Manu's foot is injured when he tweaked it a week ago (but played in the 4th quarter after that). He doesn't seem to be the same since then...

We all know the Lakers game will be huge and I very much look forward to it..but I'll be watching the Seattle game on Friday, Spurs have to take care of business in their quest for a repeat...Playoff game or not.

PS: Yes, I think the Spurs should also pick up the pace a bit.

[timvp]

All I know is it should not be this god damn hard to score points. Just fucking run a pick and roll against Shaq instead of trying to back him down and score one on one against him. He'll give you open shots all day if you just face the basket. Just give the ball to Manu and let him run a pick and roll with someone, anyone. For crying out loud he got Fab two lay-ups. Fab! He can certainly make it work with Duncan.

No matter how soft he's playing and how off his shot is, Manu can still pass the ball and knows how certain basic basketball plays are supposed to be run. I'm sick and tired of seeing an offense where nobody knows what they're doing, everyone is standing around and a contested shot is being fired up with 1 second to go.The answer is running. You want an easy shot against Shaq? You run. Manu ran plenty of pick and rolls but he wasn't attacking Shaq too often. Can't really blame him because Shaq intimidates basically every player who has ever lived.

No player on the team is running hard right now. Parker runs hard about 40% of the time. Duncan and Ginobili aren't running. The other wings aren't running.

When they play this walk it up slow down BS offense they are going to have trouble scoring. Especially against a Shaq team. But if they run, they'll get into the offense quicker. Cause mismatches. Give Duncan more than five seconds to create a shot. Allow Ginobili easy transition looks to get rolling. Allow the three-point shooters the ability to get open.

Seriously, for the Suns to score under 100 points while shooting 51%+, the pace has to be ungodly slow. For the new age Suns with Shaq in the middle, that actually hurts the Spurs more than the Suns. The Spurs can get back on transition defense and contest shots. Shaq hasn't contested a shot in transition since 2001.

[MannyIsGod]

Why AREN'T they running though. The Spurs have always run - especially against Phoenix - but it seems that now they walk it up every god damn time.

Are they really this old?

[timvp]

Why AREN'T they running though. The Spurs have always run - especially against Phoenix - but it seems that now they walk it up every god damn time.

Are they really this old?Good question. Ever since Pop went to his "winning doesn't matter because homecourt doesn't matter ... just don't get hurt" card this team has turned into the 2001 Spurs. Ginobili isn't his usual reckless self. Duncan is playing softer offensively than he has all year. Parker gives up running after he realizes that when he runs, it turns out to be 1-on-5.

I'm hoping it's just effort. Pop has all but said he doesn't care about winning right now. That message hasn't been received well. They were running and the offense was flowing fine just three games ago. But these last three games have been horrendous in terms of running.

The Spurs, since about 2002, have relied on running to get them 15-20 easy points per game. These last three games, they totaled about 20 easy points ... maybe less than that.

If it's not effort, then I guess it could be a combination of old age and the drain of trying to survive such a tough conference. I guess we'll see soon enough. If they don't pick up the pace, they'll be bounced in the first round most likely.

[DAF86]

As I said, I'm not really blaming Tony. He just does what Pop tells him to do, he runs the plays that are called. But he will look for his shot first, above all else, we know this. I think Pop has just done a piss poor job of handling the balance between the big three of late (a problem he didn't have half the year it seems since one or another was hurt or limited) and I think a lot of it stems for him taking Manu's coachability for granted. Don't just assume he's going to come out firing. Maybe his confidence is down or he's in a funk or whatever. Do something to physically get him going. Run a couple plays for him, with Tim and Tony in there, specifically designed to get him shots.

Right now he's floating out there like he doesn't have to wake up til Vaughn is on the court. It's not good. Him and Duncan have to run a few pick and rolls and a few give and gos. Him and Tony have to run the occasional god forsaken fast break together. Right now the chemistry is terrible. It's like I feel Pop needs to get the big three in his office, plop them down in a chair and make them watch videos of Game 6 vs Phx and Game 1 vs Utah last year.

The problem isn't the amount of plays called for Ginobili, the problem for me (like i said 100 times) it's his confidence. He's passing the ball a lot more 'cause of this and that's why it seems like Pop isn't calling his number. Not to mention the broken plays where Manu usually takes charge and now he's just giving the ball to someone else.

[WalterBenitez]

4 times were shown on ARG National TV, and they sucks ... that early-white-flag fashion sucks ... suddenly we are too old to play.

At this point, I am worried, we can't play with intensity for 4 quarters ups and lows are extremes.

With this style of giving up, with that sad coaching, we can only win in play station.

TD isn't playing as his SuperStar status, at least he is trying.
Manu sucks from the bench.
TP is making his shots, but he's not involving the team, only run smiling for photos.
Oberto can't catch the ball, etc. etc. etc.

POP sucks!

[Supergirl]

I disagree that Duncan's poor game had anything to do with Shaq- I didn't see anything out there remotely resembling defense from anyone except maybe Raja Bell. Mostly, the Suns defense consisted of hanging on to the Spurs - literally - for which they NEVER ONCE got called.

But whatever, the refs are going to be the refs. The Spurs could not make shots. They had perfectly clean looks most of the time (see above - no defense in sight) and didn't get enough rebounds to make up for missing so much. Parker was penetrating, hitting shots, and passing out, but the problem was, no one else was making their shots.

I still like the Spurs' chances in a 7 game series. But I think the Suns would be a dangerous team to meet in the 1st round, because the whole team will be playing with a chip on their shoulder, with something to prove. But Manu and Tim have a history of elevating their game in the playoffs, so my hope is that they can do it again this year.

[Supergirl]

Also, I disagree that Oberto can't defend Shaq - from what I saw, he did a pretty good shot. He's not going to stop him from scoring - no one can, but he made him work, and Duncan did a decent job on him too in the second half.

[The Truth #6]

I suppose this is a good time to say JAMES WHITE!

Joking...

[Mr. Body]

Wow. I crashed in the 3rd quarter and wake up to find they got creamed. This ain't looking so good for the Silver and Black. They have absolutely no fourth scorer... against Phoenix! It looks like the GM failed to add youth and talent to the bench and it's truly hurting now, with days left to the season. By the way, I was looking at the other boxscores, specifically the Houston boxscore and... nevermind...

Play Matt Bonner!!

[DarrinS]

Great breakdown of the game (as usual).


No ball movement + Manu not showing up + bad gameplan on Shaq = horrific loss


I watched the game on my Tivo and I could tell early in the 3rd quarter that this was going to be a shitty loss. Sure enough, I fast forwarded to the end and it was.


This team cannot win a championship without #20 playing at a HIGH level.

[1Parker1]

Ginobili isn't his usual reckless self. Duncan is playing softer offensively than he has all year. Parker gives up running after he realizes that when he runs, it turns out to be 1-on-5.

This is getting old. If it weren't for Parker, do you realize the Spurs would probably average abuot 2 fast break points per game? I've seen it happen way too many times where Parker pushes the ball up the court and he looks around and the rest of the Spurs are still on the other end of the court and Parker takes it himself.

I love how Pop ended up playing Ginobili about 40 minutes per game for a stretch there against teams like the Knicks, Seattle, etc and now when Pop should be increasing Ginobili's minutes against the quality teams, he can't because Ginobili is too tired. I'd rather the Spurs have lost some of those games against sub .500 teams with Ginobil playing less minutes and have the Spurs play him bigger minutes against the teams they'll actually meet in the playoffs.

[Shred]

Reasoned, well-written posts like yours (timvp) have no place on this board, sir.

[George Gervin's Afro]

As mentioned earlier our offense has become predictable, stale, and ineffective.

We are a very soft team... well one that has 3 out of the last 5 championships but soft none the less..

[George Gervin's Afro]

This is getting old. If it weren't for Parker, do you realize the Spurs would probably average abuot 2 fast break points per game? I've seen it happen way too many times where Parker pushes the ball up the court and he looks around and the rest of the Spurs are still on the other end of the court and Parker takes it himself.

I love how Pop ended up playing Ginobili about 40 minutes per game for a stretch there against teams like the Knicks, Seattle, etc and now when Pop should be increasing Ginobili's minutes against the quality teams, he can't because Ginobili is too tired. I'd rather the Spurs have lost some of those games against sub .500 teams with Ginobil playing less minutes and have the Spurs play him bigger minutes against the teams they'll actually meet in the playoffs.


It bothers me when TP dirbbles the ball around for 20 seconds and jacks up a contested 20 footer.. our margin for error has diminished and we have to start treating each possession with more urgency... During the Suns run our offense was TP going one on five.. The suns adjusted and wern't going to allow him to penetrate yet instead of finding the open guy he forces up nad shots... It's the timing of his selfishness is what irks me. I like him being aggressive and I don't mind an occasional out of control drive but when a team is beginning to pull away it's time to play smarter..

[George Gervin's Afro]

One other thing I noticed.. those plays drawn up for Bruce Bowen when the game was still in doubt were fantastic... he was wide open.. :lol

[spurschick]

Timmy seems to go through these heightened periods of whining during games, then Pop tells everyone to shut the hell up and play and they respond by being more aggressive. Hope that's the case this time.

As for Manu, if I didn't know any better, it appears that he's trying not to get hurt before the playoffs. Knowing Manu, as we do, to have a devil-may-care attitude when it comes to throwing his body around, it's hard to imagine that he's developed the willpower to tone his game down. CIA Manu? I agree with most though that he's in a slump – he was definitely due for one. He goes through these a few times every season and, with the season he's had, I have to say that I'm okay with him going through a slump at this moment. IMO, it points to him having a great post-season.

[FromWayDowntown]

The 2001 comments are exactly what last night had me thinking about. Last night, the Spurs capitulated. Their 4th quarter effort was poor. I could deal with poor execution on both ends if the effort was there, but it wasn't. The game got a little tough and the Spurs just packed up their tents and went home.

With Stoudemire and O'Neal in foul trouble, the Spurs built their lead to 66-61. At that point, the offense didn't just become stagnant -- it ceased to exist. On about 4-5 consecutive possessions, with the chance to build a double-digit lead, the Spurs had no ball movement (as Manny's original post noted) and hoisted up a series of ridiculous shots as a result. The undermanned Suns capitalized on that and ended the 3rd on something like an 9-2 or 11-2 run. Down 4 entering the 4th at home has rarely been a daunting hill to climb for these Spurs, but it's much, much harder to overcome that obstacle when you maintain a one-pass or two-pass offense and have a bunch of guys just standing around watching the stars try to get something done on their own.

The 4th quarter was horrific. It's not just that they played bad offense (11 points again) or bad defense; it's that they looked uninspired and, ultimately, somewhat intimidated. The most telling stat, to me, about last night's 4th was that the Suns weren't called for a single team foul during that quarter. I realize some will say that this evidences bad officiating, but frankly, the Spurs did nothing to cause the Suns to draw any fouls. They didn't challenge the defense and they didn't play with any aggression. I can't remember a championship-caliber team playing an important regular season home game and offering such a poor effort that it couldn't even draw a single measly foul on the opponent.

Perhaps the most disappointing thing I saw last night occurred during a timeout with about 3 minutes left. While the Spurs huddled, Tim Duncan meandered around on the floor, at least 10 feet away -- not sitting with his teammates. He walked around like he was dazed and couldn't explain what was going on; he kept looking into the stands with what seemed like a 500 mile stare. Like timvp, I think Tim Duncan played an absolutely horrible basketball game last night and was a big reason for the egg the Spurs laid. And I don't get this funk that he's in of late, either. It's not just the detachment from the team in that moment; the game was over, so it's not the physical detachment that concerns me, it's the mental softness that Duncan seemed to display in that moment. I can appreciate that he might be frustrated. But Tim seemed to have given up much earlier than that, in the 4th quarter -- on one play, Duncan got the ball on the block, tenatively dribbled right and put up a passive jump hook on Shaq in the lane that missed horribly, and then ran back up the court with his head hung in defeat. He looked mentally soft to me last night, and that's not a good sign. That moment during that timeout was troubling to me because Tim's body language suggested that he didn't know what had happened. That shocks me.

In some senses, last night's loss wasn't the end of the world. Even had the Spurs beaten the Suns last night, the game on Sunday in LA was likely going to be decisive in terms of the seeding of those two teams. That was true whether the teams were tied entering the game or whether either team was a game up. Assuming they enter tied, the Spurs can still move really close to a #2 seed if they beat Seattle and LA. Of course, at this point, rolling over and dying at Sacramento seems particularly likely and beating LA seems to be a bit of a long shot.

[daslicer]

Honestly I thought Shaq played out of his ass tonight. I really don't see him doing that for a 7 game series. He could have one or two games where he plays like that but the rest of the time he's mediocre. It kind of reminds me of David Robinson when he was old that if he had 3-4 days off like Shaq did before this game he would transform back into an all-star player just for one game.

Duncan played bad in the second half tonight. I thought he should have attacked the basket more and try to draw fouls on Shaq. Even if he misses and doesn't get the foul it is still better to attack the basket because it will eventually open up other shots for the spurs.

Also I didn't think the Suns D was great it was moreso the spurs just sucking. Literally they were times when they were open for jumpshots and they just wouldn't make them. On top of that the spurs lacked instensity tonight I didn't see them playing like they really wanted to win this game. Suns did a good job of slowing the game down it felt like a 90's cavs game. Waste the whole entire shot clock until the final 2-3 seconds take a shot and hope it comes in.

[FromWayDowntown]

One other thing I haven't seen mentioned -- during the second half warmups, Manu spent several moments talking with Will Sevening (trainer), Dr. David Schmidt (orthopaedist), and Mike Brungardt (strength and conditioning coach) and seemed to almost be convincing them that he was okay. It was odd, particularly, to see Dr. Schmidt on the floor in that moment. It made me wonder if there isn't something physically wrong with Manu.

[DarrinS]

One other thing I haven't seen mentioned -- during the second half warmups, Manu spent several moments talking with Will Sevening (trainer), Dr. David Schmidt (orthopaedist), and Mike Brungardt (strength and conditioning coach) and seemed to almost be convincing them that he was okay. It was odd, particularly, to see Dr. Schmidt on the floor in that moment. It made me wonder if there isn't something physically wrong with Manu.


Something has to be wrong with him. I noticed he was unwilling to drive to the rim and sacrifice his body. That kind of aggressiveness was sorely missing from all Spurs (except Parker) last night. I hope this doesn't turn out like 2006, when the Spurs were worn out from a very tough first round opponent and then met a fairly well rested 2nd round opponent.

[wildchild]

Let's see if we can clarify this. YOU NOT SCORE, YOU NOT WIN. Udoka 25' and 2 points. Manu 27' and 8 points. Thomas 13' and 0 points. Jacques 14' and 0 points.



-You don’t hear a Spurs fan say this much but Michael Finley needs to shoot the ball more.

:tu


-What part of Fabricio Oberto not being able to guard O’Neal does Pop not understand? Oberto. Can. Not. Guard. Shaq. When O’Neal has Oberto on him, the best possible outcome for Oberto is if he can flop his way to an offensive foul. Otherwise, O’Neal is going to get an easy shot, draw a foul, injure Oberto or do a combination of those three things. In 23 minutes, Oberto had six points and four rebounds, while shooting 3-for-8 from the court. He shouldn’t have played as many minutes as he did, especially with how much he was being dominated


Also, I disagree that Oberto can't defend Shaq - from what I saw, he did a pretty good shot. He's not going to stop him from scoring - no one can, but he made him work, and Duncan did a decent job on him too in the second half.

I agree with Supergirl

How many points did Shaq score on Oberto? 20/25?
C'mon. He finished with 16 and the most of those points he scored on Tim, not on Fab.

Do you see the play by play?
In his 25' of game, Shaq scored only 6 points on Oberto.
timvp, What's. the. big. deal?

Spurs didn't lose 'cause Oberto was guarding Shaq, Spurs loss 'cause not scored in the 4th quarter.
Tim drew Amare's fouls and it out of him. Oberto drew 2 Shaq's fouls and it out of him, sit him. Sadly, again the Spurs didn't take a adventage for the Suns without Amare or Shaq.



Ime Udoka played 26 minutes and finished with two points, six rebounds, two assists and three steals. Udoka was asked to guard Boris Diaw for a lot of the game – inexplicably, really. Diaw is too tall and too thick for Udoka to guard, especially on the low post. Offensively, he wasn’t getting many open looks for the same reasons Finley wasn’t getting open looks. On the whole, Udoka played pretty well but he was put in a lot of situations where he couldn’t succeed

Well, timvp who could guard Diaw? Parker? Ginobili? Vaughn? Bruce on Nash, Tim on Amare, Oberto on Shaq.
C'mon, dude. I don't understand what you mean. :rolleyes

[FromWayDowntown]

One other intangible that bothered me last night was Pop's seeming indifference to the Phoenix run in the late 3rd and early 4th. To see the Spurs go through that (and particularly some of the passivity that enabled the run) without Pop storming around and calling timeouts to get on his guys was a shock to me.

[101A]

important regular season home game I honestly believe that statement is an oxymoron to these Spurs.

They don't care about the Regular Season AT ALL - and Pop, I believe is convinced that W/L and homecourt is irrelevant to his team.

I think Pop continues to tinker, and not leave what works out there for the too long, I guess because he doesn't want the opponent to get too used to it.

Rose colored glasses? Denial? Sure, but it keeps me from wringing my hands; and until the Spurs have lost 4 in 7; I feel they can turn it on, and beat anyone, anywhere.

BTW; Before the Utah game, what seed were the Spurs?

What seed are they now?

Before these past three games, how did the Spurs offense look for the previous 8 games?

Are we absolutely sure these games are that important?

Do the Spurs even want HCA against the Suns? With the first two at home; what happens to the Suns confidence if they steal one in SA? On the other hand, isn't the series all but over if it starts in Phoenix and SA steals the first one AGAIN?

What is the worst case scenario?

Spurs are swept out in the first round; and STILL have 4 championships.

It's lovely in my world, some of you ought to try it.

[101A]

One other intangible that bothered me last night was Pop's seeming indifference to the Phoenix run in the late 3rd and early 4th. To see the Spurs go through that (and particularly some of the passivity that enabled the run) without Pop storming around and calling timeouts to get on his guys was a shock to me.That's what I'm talking about; fits my world-view just fine.

[FromWayDowntown]

That's what I'm talking about; fits my world-view just fine.

I agree with you, to an extent. A difference for me is that Pop has always preached that they have to improve and continue to play better -- as if that is really the paramount concern. Last night, that wasn't happening and Pop just let the tape run. I can see, certainly, that allowing things to go as they did without coaching interference affords Pop and opportunity to unload on them. But that decision was pretty much as un-Poplike as any I've seen in quite a while.

[SAGambler]

Throw in my 2 cents worth here.

Anyone that thinks either Barry or Horry is going to be a savior for the Spurs this year is out of their minds. So we can just forget that.

I think Manu may actually be hurting. He doesn't have the drive, nor the legs under him on 3 pointers.

But then again, who knows. Maybe they are dumping these games on purpose, trying to catch Houston in the first round. To me, that would be the ideal matchup for the Spurs.

Or maybe they are just trying to save as much energy as possible for the playoffs, knowing they will be the older team out there.

All I know is the Spurs are in the playoffs. And that means they have as good a shot as any other team in the West, HCA advantage or not.

I know we have all seen the Spurs come to life before, after playing several bad games. Maybe it is just that Pop has it right. Get into the playoffs and get there healthy. With these games now, suddenly being near playoff level, the chance for someone to get injured is high, especially driving lanes against players like Shaq. I won't give up on the Spurs until someone knocks them out of the playoffs. Until then, I will be rooting them on.

[101A]

I agree with you, to an extent. A difference for me is that Pop has always preached that they have to improve and continue to play better -- as if that is really the paramount concern. Last night, that wasn't happening and Pop just let the tape run. I can see, certainly, that allowing things to go as they did without coaching interference affords Pop and opportunity to unload on them. But that decision was pretty much as un-Poplike as any I've seen in quite a while.At the end of the first quarter of both the Phoenix and Utah games, the Spurs were, relatively, in control. They then proceeded, in very Un-Spurslike fashion to melt down for the remaining three, and get blown out. By playoff teams, late in the season. Again very unspurlike.

In preseason games, in any sport, I watch the first quarter to know where "my" team is. Starter on Starter; after that, I don't care. If Pop is really looking at pretty much this entire regular season as a pre-season; then, again, that fits. He verifies in the first quarter that what he thinks is going to work, DOES work; Check in both cases. He then gets to make note of what the other coach does to adjust. If Pop saves HIS adjustment to that for the playoffs, isn't that just wise? Especially if the seeding looks better from a lower spot right about now?

Again, why everyone is so concernced about HCA is beyond me.

The Spurs were, what 7-1 or 7-2 ON THE ROAD in the playoffs last year? They haven't lost a road playoff series since 2002!

Pop has said that he must see improvement, and that that is important; but what he has said is MOST important is health entering the playoffs.

Manu playing calm, slow? Makes sense.

D'Antoni had Stoudamire in the game with under 3 minutes and a 17 point lead.

[BigVee]

I thought Manu re-sprained his ankle on the last play of the first half...came down on someone's foot and limped off the court. Did I imagine that?

[Obstructed_View]

Do you see the play by play?
In his 25' of game, Shaq scored only 6 points on Oberto.
timvp, What's. the. big. deal?

Do you see the actual game? Because I saw Shaq score six points on Oberto. In a row.

[tav1]

The key sequence of the game was when Amare and Shaq both went to the bench with foul trouble--and then the Suns outplayed the Spurs. Inexcusable Pop was outmastered by The Stashe. I think we have the personnel to beat this Suns team.

A healthy Brent Barry would be such a big help right now. He gives the Spurs another ball handler, can push the pace, spreads the floor for Timmy, and swings the ball to his teammates.

Overall, TimVP is correct that the big problem is pace and ball movement. The Spurs need to take it to the Suns, and Duncan--especially Duncan--should go at Amare and/or Shaq whenever they're matched-up. Amare simply can't play D, and Shaq does not have the lateral quickness and lift, although last night he showed heart and pride, to guard Duncan.

This will sound crazy, and I can't believe I'm writing it, but a couple minutes of Ian Mahinmi here and there could pose problems for the Suns. He doesn't know how to do much right now but pic/roll and dunk, but that's the perfect formula against the defenseless Stoudemire and the aging Shaq. Mahinmi can also play at a blitzing pace. Not for this season, I know, but if Ian continues to develop over the next year.

Finally, the Spurs must upgrade their back up point in the off season. Vaughn kills us the second he comes in the game. The offense just shuts down. I'd rather see Andre Barrett out there. In fact, can we still do that? When does Bobby Jones' deal expire?
Pop has underperformed this year, eh.

[George Gervin's Afro]

can someone tell me who # 42 is?

[MoSpur]

Pop hasn't figured out how to coach against these new Suns. Shaq on that team is a world of difference. Even with Shaq and Amare in foul trouble, the Spurs somehow find a way to lose the game. That's pitiful.

Manu looked horrible. I agree with timvp, Duncan looks like a sissy out there at times and its shameful.

The Spurs look horrible on offense right now and as of late. The Spurs coaching staff need to figure out how to get the offense flowing again. Barry needs to comeback or the Spurs need to go out and sign Spree.

[MoSpur]

#42 is Bobby Jones.

[MoSpur]

Give credit to where it is due. The Suns outplayed and were better than the Spurs last night. Shaq is a big difference maker on that team. He has given that team a ton of confidence.

I still think the Spurs can take them in a seven game series.

[Budkin]

There's gotta be some level of CIA going on... Pop just isn't this shitty of a coach. There's no other explanation unless he is going senile.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Give credit to where it is due. The Suns outplayed and were better than the Spurs last night. Shaq is a big difference maker on that team. He has given that team a ton of confidence.

I still think the Spurs can take them in a seven game series.


Don't forget being outcoached as well..

[Slippy]

The first half was a complete turnaround to the second. The Spurs looked like they came ready to play. The defense was holding strong, even when Amare went off. On offense Tim and Tony were scoring with ease. When pop went smal-ball the team really began to struggle. I agree that Pop's choice for Diaw was wrong. He too big to have UDoka playing on him. That move was costly.

The Spurs faded big time in the second half. The offense dried up and defense looked tired. Team play went out the door and too many shots were forced. The Suns upped the tempo, the Spurs couldn't keep. They also didn't counter the Sun's zone d too well. Spacing wasn't well placed . Aside from Fin, it didn't help that no one could hit a 3 to break it open. Another big factor was Shaq. His D on Tim was really effective and offense the bigs had no asnwer for him. When he got into the paint, it was like seeing the Shaq of old. The guy just rolled to basket and dominated with his jump hook.

If not for Tony, the Spurs would of have been in trouble a lot earlier. Hard to fault him at all. He set the tone on offense and showed no fear in the paint . In the second half the Suns adjusted to his attacking and he forced a few but like others i think that had more to do with him being tired. Pop's subs pattern on Tony for the whole game didn't make sense. It was odd considering for this game he was the spur's best scoring option.

Manu was a shadow of his former self on offense. He looked hesitent and at times seemed lost like he was a rookie just starting out. When he did shoot they were usually trashy jumpers. The aggression just wasn't there. I hope his poor game of late has more to do with him trying to pace himself til the play-offs start than lacking energy and confidence excuse. This was a big game for sure , still the big picture is the play-offs.

[SenorSpur]

I keep hearing all this talk about how the Spurs simply DO NOT CARE about the regular season at all. I'm sure that's true to an extent. However, I believe that is more of a fallacy than anything - especially when you take into account what competitors Manu and Tim are.

What I cannot accept is how an experienced, championship-caliber team, like the Spurs, can come out on their own homecourt and throw down such an awful showing on both ends of the court in the 2nd half - especially against a horrific defensive team like the Suns. Duncan DID look like a big sissy out there. Vaughn is crushing the team's offense. Manu looks tired, hurt, or both. Tony seemingly ran out of gas. Finley looks bashful. Udoka appeared to press himself too much.

How can this happen with 2 days of rest? Recall the last time the Spurs lost to the Suns in PHX, they were operating off 3 days rest. Meanwhile, the Suns had played the night before. Yet it was the Spurs who came out sluggish and lethargic and appeared to be the team on the 2nd night of a B2B. Their performance in that game mirrored this one.

Also, let's not forget this is the second blowout loss in their last 3 games versus another potential playoff opponent. If this team is truly conserving their energy and taking these games lightly, they've got NO shot at defending their title. The so-called "flipping the switch" philosophy is a flawed one that catches up with many teams ('03 Fakers) that have had championship success.

This team looks pitiful on offense and, while they may play the best defense in the Western Conference, they are not as good defensively as they were last year. It's very obvious. Also, I agree completely with the assertion that Barry and Horry should not be counted on for playoff contributions. I don't see it happening. One thing is for sure, the next several weeks will determine whether age has really caught up with this team, as the recent losses to both Utah and Phx have seemed to indicate.

[1usamotorsports.com]

Im sure the spurs know what there doing . There Not going to go into overdrive until its playoff time . Im sure energy is being saved and being healthy is a must . Come playoff time its a different ball-game .

[Budkin]

I've decided that Pop purposely left KT off Shaq because he will be on him in the playoffs - I knew it was CIA! Please?

[1Parker1]

One other intangible that bothered me last night was Pop's seeming indifference to the Phoenix run in the late 3rd and early 4th. To see the Spurs go through that (and particularly some of the passivity that enabled the run) without Pop storming around and calling timeouts to get on his guys was a shock to me.


That's the most surprising thing of all to me this season. Pop did the same thing in the Jazz game. Normally Pop would be storming about defense and bad rotations and being selfish on offense. Instead his answers and belief on offense really seem to be just that "Oh we couldn't get the ball in the hole, simple as that." He thinks its just a matter of Spurs missing shots. And he hasn't been preaching defense and rotations nearly enough. :depressed

[1Parker1]

I think their post game quotes and lack of anger upset me more...


Spurs Head Coach Gregg Popovich

On the game - “Phoenix played well, they did a great job, and they beat us good.”
On what happened in the fourth quarter - “We only scored 11 points and it was only a four point game going into the fourth quarter. We just didn’t score.”

On when asked if it was just a matter of missing shoots in the fourth - “It’s never just one thing. It’s a little bit of the defense, it’s a little bit of us maybe not playing well, not shooting well, but they get credit for their defense also.”

On seeing if the Suns have gelled with O’Neal - “Absolutely, they’ve been playing very well.”

On if fouls had anything to do with the loss - “Fouls had nothing to do with us getting beat. They played well and beat us good, there’s no excess.”


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Manu Ginobili

On their offensive struggles - “It’s turning into a big concern because that’s three games that we have really struggled offensively. I think defensively we were pretty good in the last couple games. We made way too many mistakes down the stretch (tonight), but now the main concern is offensively we’re not sharp enough. We are not making shots. We’re too slow. We have to work on that.”
On fatigue being a factor - “We haven’t been playing that well in the fourth quarter, but it’s not like we’ve been playing that well in the first three quarters either. It’s not that we scored 80 in the first three and then 10 in the fourth, we’re scoring 70 points (total). That’s not enough to beat a great team like Phoenix…or Utah.

“I think we are just in a slump. We are not playing confidently. We are playing slow. I don’t feel tired. I doubt it’s a conditioning thing.”


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Tim Duncan

On the game - “I thought we moved the ball well, especially there in the first half. Like I said…a lot of credit to Phoenix…their defense was solid. They had a good game plan and there wasn’t a lot of rotation from them. We played a lot of one-on-one basketball and on a nightly basis we do pretty good by that…tonight we didn’t.
On the fourth quarter - “Defense was solid enough, we just couldn’t sustain miss after miss. A lot of that falls on me…I got a lot of shots in the fourth quarter…what I felt were good looks and they just didn’t go down for me. Credit to Phoenix for pushing it right back at us and scoring the ball. We just gotta find a way for something to go down in the fourth.”


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Suns Head Coach Mike D’Antoni

On the game - “Well you know, I think you see what Shaq does for us, and our defense stiffened up in the second half. It was a great win but it still doesn’t mean a whole lot except we are a bit closer to them in the standings and we’ll move on, and I’m sure they’ll regroup and maybe we’ll meet some place down the road. But we’re pretty happy with what happened tonight.”
On playing without Amare - “With Shaq we just have another option in there, and Shaq really turned it on. They had six second chance points all game and usually they have about 25. Boris did a great job, we went small, and were able to defend them and do a lot of switching so everything seemed to work tonight. Its just one of those days where we played well, and our different guys were really contributing.”

On how Shaq changes things - “Well you know he’s 7’2’’ and 325 or whatever, nobody’s knocking him off, he’s right there in your face its tough all night. I don’t want to get ahead of ourselves we played well and I think right now for San Antonio it’s a little funk about scoring and its just not against us, they haven’t scored in the last two or three games, so they’ll come out of it. But you see how we can go into him and he scores or they might have to start doubling him, and he turned it on tonight he was about the best he has looked.”

On the team defense - “We should be good defensively, we’ve got Raja Bell, first team all NBA defensively, and Grant Hill can defend, and we’ve got length, and we’ve just got a lot of different answers that we haven’t had in the past, but its being anchored now by Shaq, and that’s kind of giving everybody a little bit more freedom to get up on their man and play a little bit harder on the perimeter knowing that you’ve got a guy in the back that you know you cant shoot over.”

On a potential playoff meeting - “They’re too good for that, the same as us, you cannot win a game because some guys are a little off, some guys are this and that, and they’re too smart and too good, and Pop’s too good to even think that ‘oh ya we’ve got them psychologically’ its just not going to happen. If we do meet it’ll be a battle, and we’re looking forward to it, and hopefully we meet in the last round, I’d hate to see them right in the first round, but you know we’ll see how it goes.”


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Shaquille O’Neal

On the game - “We just wanted to play through everything and suck it up in the fourth quarter. Amare along with myself were in foul trouble so the rest of the guys did a great job on playing defense and we were able to come in a hostile building and get a win.”
On how far the team has to go to be where they want to be - “Unless you’re on a team that has been there a lot, like the Spurs, when you put together a new team you never know what it takes to get there unless you’re there and you’re winning. Of course we have all the pieces on paper but we really don’t know until we go through all our trials and tribulations.”


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Grant Hill

On the difference between the game before and the game now with Shaq - “Before with Duncan, we had to double and scramble as he is one of the best passers when doubled. And with Shaq, he has done a very good job with Duncan as he can guard him straight up and Tim’s such a great player that sometimes he gave Shaq a match, so hopefully if we play them again Shaq can continue to guard him the same way.”
On guarding Tony Parker - “Well he definitely gets going, but we just try to go big on him, use our length and we did it the last time we played him and we had success then like we had success tonight. We’re getting there and I think it was great this season to win three out of four games against them.”


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Boris Diaw

On the game - “I thought we really kept the ball down defensively. We were really disciplined and we really forced them to our bigs and we didn’t give away too many jump shots and were able to rebound the ball which is good against a team like San Antonio. They are so big and so good on the defensive glass that you don’t want them to get two or three looks at it because they have really good offensive players, but I think we did well tonight.”
On relating to Bruce Bowen - “Due to the fact that we both are given assignments of guarding tough players, I can relate to Bruce. I think me and Bruce go about it two different ways though.”

[SenorSpur]

Perhaps the most disappointing thing I saw last night occurred during a timeout with about 3 minutes left. While the Spurs huddled, Tim Duncan meandered around on the floor, at least 10 feet away -- not sitting with his teammates. He walked around like he was dazed and couldn't explain what was going on; he kept looking into the stands with what seemed like a 500 mile stare. Like timvp, I think Tim Duncan played an absolutely horrible basketball game last night and was a big reason for the egg the Spurs laid. And I don't get this funk that he's in of late, either. It's not just the detachment from the team in that moment; the game was over, so it's not the physical detachment that concerns me, it's the mental softness that Duncan seemed to display in that moment. I can appreciate that he might be frustrated. But Tim seemed to have given up much earlier than that, in the 4th quarter -- on one play, Duncan got the ball on the block, tenatively dribbled right and put up a passive jump hook on Shaq in the lane that missed horribly, and then ran back up the court with his head hung in defeat. He looked mentally soft to me last night, and that's not a good sign. That moment during that timeout was troubling to me because Tim's body language suggested that he didn't know what had happened. That shocks me.


Duncan needs to go back and watch tape of his performance in the 2003 WCSF versus the Fakers. He needs to riddle Shaq with his footwork, upfakes and his ambidextrous shooting skills inside, while mixing in his bank shot outside. He can easily get Shaq or anyone else into foul trouble if he's in the right frame of mind.

I agree with you. It appeared that Tim was not mentally into this game. Therefore, it showed up by way of his passive approach at both ends. He became far too predicitable and timid.

[degenerate_gambler]

I thought Manu re-sprained his ankle on the last play of the first half...came down on someone's foot and limped off the court. Did I imagine that?


I don't know if it was his ankle/knee or whatever but he did limp off the court after he tried that halfcourt shot to end the half.

[degenerate_gambler]

Did SA even run one double team at Shaq at all last nite? When he gets the ball down low on the left block and can swing into the lane, he's almost automatic. Last nite, I didn't see any help come his defenders way once, especially in the 4th.

[wildchild]

I've decided that Pop purposely left KT off Shaq because he will be on him in the playoffs - I knew it was CIA! Please?

Shaq's offensive isn't a problem and don't care who guard him.Oberto and Thomas did a good job on him. see that.

http://www.nba.com/games/20080409/PHXSAS/playbyplay.html

Shaq finished with 16 points but Barbosa with 14 Nash with 12 Diaw with 11 and Udoka with 2 Manu with 8 Vaughn with 0 Thomas with 0.

The problem with Shaq, is his defensive on Tim.

And the problem with the Suns, is our offensive sucked.

[wildbill2u]

:lol @ roycrikside

So freakin predictable. When has Tony ever pouted about being the 3rd guy? :lol

Things have certainly changed for Manu. But it's not all on Pop/Tony/Tim. A part of it is on Manu.

Manu is obviously in funk and he looks like he doesn't have any explosiveness in his legs. He shot 7-8 times in the first half. That's not less touches than he normally gets. In tonight's game, you can see Tony passing it Manu several times, and Manu passing it right back. He obviously just didn't have it this game.
NAILED IT! Manu gave up on himself last night and refused to take the ball and attack or shoot several times.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

The problem with Shaq is that he can get any shot he wants with Tim guarding him, yet TD struggles to get a shot off when Shaq is on him.

[tlongII]

What a pitiful performance by the Spurs. Entering the day with a decent shot at attaining the number one seed in the Western Conference, the Spurs instead rolled over and died against the Suns. Now San Antonio has to fight just to have homecourt advantage in the first round.

The Phoenix Suns came into San Antonio and were smarter, executed better and were more physical than the Spurs. Basically, the Suns just out-Spursed the Spurs. No matter what runs the Spurs made, the Suns just kept executing and eventually the Spurs sputtered. The Suns entered with a gameplan and worked that gameplan flawlessly.

The Shaquille O’Neal trade has worked out wonderfully for Phoenix. Against the Spurs, the Suns are now the bigger, stronger and more athletic team. And when O’Neal plays hard all game, they are also more talented and just as determined. A lot of supposed NBA experts ripped Steve Kerr and the Suns but the trade is looking brilliant. For the first time in the Steve Nash Era, the Suns actually have a legitimate chance to win a championship. In this game particularly, the only thing that kept the Suns from really destroying the Spurs was foul trouble for O’Neal and Amare Stoudemire.

blah-blah-blah


What a bunch of CRAP! The Suns should have won the title LAST YEAR and would have if not for a ridiculous ruling by the league office.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

What about game 6? oh yeah

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I'd add something to Timvp's analysis if there was actually any more that could be said but he summed things up perfectly.

Believe is being tested in this even-numbered year.

[wildchild]

The problem with Shaq is that he can get any shot he wants with Tim guarding him, yet TD struggles to get a shot off when Shaq is on him.

It's true. Shaq scored more on TD than over Oberto/Thomas.

Anyway, if Shaq score 16 points and Duncan 23 I could live with that.

But, I couldn't live with our offensive in the last quarter.

[florige]

I'm confident that we will get this crap together come the playoffs. We have too much talent not to. I did not watch the game yesterday, but reading what you guys wrote down I got a pretty good picture on what the heck happened. I really just hate losing to Phx and those two prudes Shaq and Stoudamire. I really can;t stand listening to those two talk.

[Xylus]

Shaq went at Oberto on 3 straight possessions in the 3rd quarter, I believe, and scored effortlessly everytime. Duncan at least held his position and forced Shaq to shoot from a little farther out. Unfortunately for the Spurs, Shaq's hook shot was automatic last night.

Oberto only allowed 6 Shaq points, but they were the easiest 6 points Shaq had all night. Your best option is putting Kurt Thomas--who did a great job defensively--on Shaq in the first three quarters, and then stick Duncan on him in the final 12 minutes of the game.

Duncan played with no heart last night, but I expect to see a different kind of Timmy in the playoffs.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

It's true. Shaq scored more on TD than over Oberto/Thomas.

Anyway, if Shaq score 16 points and Duncan 23 I could live with that.

But, I couldn't live with our offensive in the last quarter.


The scary thing is that Shaq was like 3-3 in the fourth quarter, whereas TD was like 1-5.

Shaq won't log 40 minutes a night (though god knows with Dumbtoni) but I do expect his minutes to go up come playoff time, and if he can stay out of foul trouble it could be a whole other problem for us.

[Xylus]

Oh, and...

FUCK YEAH!

I love beating the San Antonio Fucking Spurs.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Shaq went at Oberto on 3 straight possessions in the 3rd quarter, I believe, and scored effortlessly everytime. Duncan at least held his position and forced Shaq to shoot from a little farther out. Unfortunately for the Spurs, Shaq's hook shot was automatic last night.

Oberto only allowed 6 Shaq points, but they were the easiest 6 points Shaq had all night. Your best option is putting Kurt Thomas--who did a great job defensively--on Shaq in the first three quarters, and then stick Duncan on him in the final 12 minutes of the game.

Duncan played with no heart last night, but I expect to see a different kind of Timmy in the playoffs.


By the way Xylus, props on the win last night. Very impressive that 2 of the 3 PHX wins this season against SA have been on the road.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Oh, and...

FUCK YEAH!

I love beating the San Antonio Fucking Spurs.


you just couldn't hold back, could you

[Xylus]

Watching Nash dump it into Shaq in the post over and over and over was a very welcome sight. You can't imagine how it feels, as a Suns fan, to finally have a low-post presence on this team. I'm about as big of an Amare fan as there is, but he just doesn't have a low-post facet to his game.

[Xylus]

you just couldn't hold back, could you
Sorry, I've been holding that in.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Sorry, I've been holding that in.

haha, nah it's cool, I know this was probably the biggest win of the season so far for you guys. As well as a nice rebound from the Dallas game.

[SenorSpur]

What a bunch of CRAP! The Suns should have won the title LAST YEAR and would have if not for a ridiculous ruling by the league office.

Common shortsighted opinion

[SenorSpur]

Shaq exposes Oberto in a real way. This brings up the fact that the Spurs are somewhat shorthanded on the frontline when it comes to defending guys like Shaq and Yao. KT is adequate, but overmatched - as is Duncan.

[Whisky Dog]

The team is worn down. They have no energy as shown in the complete lack of any movement on offense and a lack of energy to finish games on defense. It's just not there. The energy required to lock down on defense in the playoffs is just too much for this team with basically the same exact lineup to do it two years in a row for 4 rounds. That's the even year curse, the team and especially the stars are worn out in the playoffs after winning a title the year before. If this team somehow manages to turn it up in the playoffs and win another title this year, it would rank with the absolute greatest team accomplishments in NBA history in a single season. To go through this gauntlet of a playoff year while worn out and still win would be just about the most remarkable thing I've ever seen on a basketball court.

[wildchild]

Shaq went at Oberto on 3 straight possessions in the 3rd quarter, I believe, and scored effortlessly everytime. Duncan at least held his position and forced Shaq to shoot from a little farther out. Unfortunately for the Spurs, Shaq's hook shot was automatic last night.

Oberto only allowed 6 Shaq points, but they were the easiest 6 points Shaq had all night. Your best option is putting Kurt Thomas--who did a great job defensively--on Shaq in the first three quarters, and then stick Duncan on him in the final 12 minutes of the game.

Duncan played with no heart last night, but I expect to see a different kind of Timmy in the playoffs.

I like Kurt over Shaq. But I think Oberto didn't a bad job.

the easiest 6 points Shaq? :rolleyes

However. At least Oberto took adventage of cutting at the rim and scored 6 points, too. And drew 2 Shaq fouls and sit him. Not bad.

[SenorSpur]

The team is worn down. They have no energy as shown in the complete lack of any movement on offense and a lack of energy to finish games on defense. It's just not there. The energy required to lock down on defense in the playoffs is just too much for this team with basically the same exact lineup to do it two years in a row for 4 rounds. That's the even year curse, the team and especially the stars are worn out in the playoffs after winning a title the year before. If this team somehow manages to turn it up in the playoffs and win another title this year, it would rank with the absolute greatest team accomplishments in NBA history in a single season. To go through this gauntlet of a playoff year while worn out and still win would be just about the most remarkable thing I've ever seen on a basketball court.

If this proves to be the unraveling of this squad in the playoffs, I'll continue to curse R.C. and Pop for choosing NOT to infuse the roster with a least 1 or 2 younger players. such an infusion of young talent would have provided the necessary energy boost, athleticism and active legs this team is sorely lacking.

[wildchild]

Shaq exposes Oberto in a real way. This brings up the fact that the Spurs are somewhat shorthanded on the frontline when it comes to defending guys like Shaq and Yao. KT is adequate, but overmatched - as is Duncan.

Last 2 games against Rockets (game 2 and 3), we hadn't problem with Yao offensive.

Overmatched? Tim didn't show much over Shaq last night, on O neither on D.

[hitmanyr2k]

Duncan needs to go back and watch tape of his performance in the 2003 WCSF versus the Fakers. He needs to riddle Shaq with his footwork, upfakes and his ambidextrous shooting skills inside, while mixing in his bank shot outside. He can easily get Shaq or anyone else into foul trouble if he's in the right frame of mind.

I agree with you. It appeared that Tim was not mentally into this game. Therefore, it showed up by way of his passive approach at both ends. He became far too predicitable and timid.

The whole team needs to look at Game 2 of the 2005 Finals and watch the clinic they ran on the Pistons in that game. It's probably the best I've ever seen the Spurs offense (or any offense for that matter) executed. This team looks lost right now and the first person you blame is the coach for his dumbass gameplan and rotations.

[spurs_fan101]

yo bitch is stupid




:elephant

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

The optimist in me wants to believe that Pop was taking this chance to try keep testing some things against the new look Suns. Or perhaps he was just drunk. Either way, I'm dumping this loss at his feet.

Bottom line, if Shaq is on the floor, KT needs to be there too. He and Tim have good enough jumpers that they can either draw him out of the paint or punish them for leaving them open. Defensively he was the only option we had against Shaq last night. And the second Shaq sits, he needs to come off the floor. If Shaq's not there, no way in hell can he handle the pace. Meanwhile, Oberto inexplicably seems to defend Amare pretty well, and against the Suns second unit (with Manu feeding him the ball) he scored possibly the easiest points the Spurs got all night.

And I agree 182% with the statement that the Spurs need to pick up the pace, especially Parker. It'll make Shaq run, make Nash run, and Tony should still be able to beat them both up the floor. And if he can do that he'll stand a good chance of being able to attack the basket for 2 or force Amare to guard the rim, where he's gotten into foul trouble in the past.

I didn't see anything last night that I don't think can be fixed. I still believe.

[spurs_fan101]

The problem with Shaq is that he can get any shot he wants with Tim guarding him, yet TD struggles to get a shot off when Shaq is on him.thats b/c timmy d sux alotmof penis :hungry: and shaq is a fat old bastard

[spurs_fan101]

Common shortsighted opinionure a ridiculous bunch of poop :drunk

[spurs_fan101]

[U] searchn fo matthew rogers on here

[spurs_fan101]

Shaq's offensive isn't a problem and don't care who guard him.Oberto and Thomas did a good job on him. see that.

http://www.nba.com/games/20080409/PHXSAS/playbyplay.html

Shaq finished with 16 points but Barbosa with 14 Nash with 12 Diaw with 11 and Udoka with 2 Manu with 8 Vaughn with 0 Thomas with 0.

The problem with Shaq, is his defensive on Tim.

And the problem with the Suns, is our offensive sucked.
dont you dare hate on my spurs biatch, :madrun your suns should be kicke dout of the league :donkey :donkey cuz u seuck :donkey :donkey

[Budkin]

The optimist in me wants to believe that Pop was taking this chance to try keep testing some things against the new look Suns. Or perhaps he was just drunk. Either way, I'm dumping this loss at his feet.

Bottom line, if Shaq is on the floor, KT needs to be there too. He and Tim have good enough jumpers that they can either draw him out of the paint or punish them for leaving them open. Defensively he was the only option we had against Shaq last night. And the second Shaq sits, he needs to come off the floor. If Shaq's not there, no way in hell can he handle the pace. Meanwhile, Oberto inexplicably seems to defend Amare pretty well, and against the Suns second unit (with Manu feeding him the ball) he scored possibly the easiest points the Spurs got all night.

And I agree 182% with the statement that the Spurs need to pick up the pace, especially Parker. It'll make Shaq run, make Nash run, and Tony should still be able to beat them both up the floor. And if he can do that he'll stand a good chance of being able to attack the basket for 2 or force Amare to guard the rim, where he's gotten into foul trouble in the past.

I didn't see anything last night that I don't think can be fixed. I still believe.

Agree wholeheartedly with your take. :tu

[wildchild]

dont you dare hate on my spurs biatch, :madrun your suns should be kicke dout of the league :donkey :donkey cuz u seuck :donkey :donkey

Don't drink, sis! Are you Princess Pimp? :lol

[ploto]

The Suns had improved transition defense.

Grant Hill did a pretty decent job on Tony Parker for a stretch in the second half.

I can not believe that is the same Giricek I saw play last year. Phoenix suits him.

Fans need to believe finally that Phoenix can play a half court game.

The Spurs need to learn this one thing-- their small line up does not match up with the athletic small lines up in the NBA. Period.

[BonnerDynasty]

Loved Udoka's defense but he needs to quit turning over the fucking ball every time down the court.

[TampaDude]

I honestly believe that statement is an oxymoron to these Spurs.

They don't care about the Regular Season AT ALL - and Pop, I believe is convinced that W/L and homecourt is irrelevant to his team.

I think Pop continues to tinker, and not leave what works out there for the too long, I guess because he doesn't want the opponent to get too used to it.

Rose colored glasses? Denial? Sure, but it keeps me from wringing my hands; and until the Spurs have lost 4 in 7; I feel they can turn it on, and beat anyone, anywhere.

BTW; Before the Utah game, what seed were the Spurs?

What seed are they now?

Before these past three games, how did the Spurs offense look for the previous 8 games?

Are we absolutely sure these games are that important?

Do the Spurs even want HCA against the Suns? With the first two at home; what happens to the Suns confidence if they steal one in SA? On the other hand, isn't the series all but over if it starts in Phoenix and SA steals the first one AGAIN?

What is the worst case scenario?

Spurs are swept out in the first round; and STILL have 4 championships.

It's lovely in my world, some of you ought to try it.

I admire your optimism...and I agree to an extent...I hope the Spurs prove us both right in the playoffs. :toast

[TampaDude]

Oh, and...

FUCK YEAH!

I love beating the San Antonio Fucking Spurs.

The Suns just plain outhustled the Spurs last night...congrats on the (regular season) win... :toast

[roycrikside]

The big three are not using each other very well at all. Everything is isolation. There are Tim plays, Tony plays and Manu plays. Tim is covered, he passes to Fin or Ime. Tony is covered he passes to Bruce or Kurt. Manu is covered he passes to Fab or Jacque.

They're not passing it to each other, there's no chemistry there.

I said it before and I'll say it again, Pop needs to sit the three of them down and make them watch tapes of Game 6 vs Phx and Game 1 vs Utah

[vanvannen]

I'm very dissapointed. I expected the Spurs to make a statement game both in Salt Lake City and in San Antonio, and we only got ran out of the gym by both teams. I don't know what the fuck is wrong with Ginobili, but he must start picking it up cause we will be fishing in May otherwise. Right now it seems Spurs can't beat any healthy elite team, whether it's the Suns, Mavs, Jazz, Celtics...
The only Spur hitting a freaking shot in the second half was Finley. The rest where just terrible.

[Xylus]

The Suns just plain outhustled the Spurs last night...congrats on the (regular season) win... :toast
Thanks. It was a big regular season win for us, especially since we want that 3-seed badly.

[SpurYank]

Hey Tampa Dude, I'm glad someone else feels like I do. The Wizards kicked the Celtic's butts again for the third time, and I'll bet no one in Boston is crying about it. As I recall that seven game championship series with the Pistons, the Spurs looked like a Division B team during those games in the motor city. Yet, when push came to shove, they won it all again. I remember the Suns coming in here and taking game 1 of a playoff series, and we still won it all. WE SAW THIS GAME LAST NIGHT AS A PLAYOFF GAME. The Spurs didn't.

When I turned the game off and went to bed my thoughts were that the Suns beat us because their shots were falling. Ours weren't. Give the Suns some credit. It easily could have been the other way around.

[timvp]

How many points did Shaq score on Oberto? 20/25?
C'mon. He finished with 16 and the most of those points he scored on Tim, not on Fab.

Do you see the play by play?
In his 25' of game, Shaq scored only 6 points on Oberto.
timvp, What's. the. big. deal?The big deal is that Oberto gets buried under the basket when trying to guard Shaq. That usually forces immediate help ... and then the Suns end up getting an open look. If the Spurs don't send help, Shaq can easily score on Oberto.

Shaq has dominated Oberto since Oberto came into the NBA. He's injured Oberto at least twice and I've never seen Oberto have a quality stretch against Shaq. Like I said earlier, Oberto's only hope against Shaq is to attempt to draw an offensive foul. Other than that, he needs constant help against Shaq.


Well, timvp who could guard Diaw? Parker? Ginobili? Vaughn? Bruce on Nash, Tim on Amare, Oberto on Shaq.
C'mon, dude. I don't understand what you mean. :rolleyesDiaw plays power forward or center for the Suns. Put a power forward or center against him. For example, Oberto against Diaw is a good matchup for the Spurs. Going small ball against Diaw is just playing into Diaw strengths. If you put a big on him, that forces him into becoming a jumpshooter and that's the weakest part of his game.

[Spurs Dynasty 21]

Manu being not being 100% in the playoffs = one and done, NO WAY Spurs can get past the second rd with Manu having a groin injury



at least Scola is here to pick up the slack

[duncan228]

...at least Scola is here to pick up the slack

Your act is so fucking old even you can't be enjoying it anymore.

Let it go.

[Spurs Dynasty 21]

Your act is so fucking old even you can't be enjoying it anymore.

Let it go.


enjoy what?



watching Scola being a damn good NBA player on the Rockets while the Spurs struggle to find TD help and Manu is out with injury right before the playoffs?


sound like fun :rolleyes

[LavaLamp]

The Spurs are still the smartest and toughest team in the NBA. Last night's regular season loss to the Suns means little.

[duncan228]

enjoy what?

Enjoy being a bitch harping about Scola. I thought you'd get tired of it. But you haven't.
It didn't happen, he's not a Spur, he won't be a Spur.

Let it go. Or become a Rockets fan and enjoy watching him without the fucking drama queen act you put in every post here.

[Spurs Dynasty 21]

Enjoy being a bitch harping about Scola. I thought you'd get tired of it. But you haven't.
It didn't happen, he's not a Spur, he won't be a Spur.

Let it go. Or become a Rockets fan and enjoy watching him without the fucking drama queen act you put in every post here.



see the title under you forum name?



take that advice

[duncan228]

Fuck you.

[T Park]

Spursdynasty.

do the World a favor and shoot yourself.

[T Park]

BTW Congrats to the Suns.

They showed me tonight a team that will not be beat in the playoffs.

[vanvannen]

So TPark, are you saying that in your opinion Spurs/Mavs/Celts can't beat the Suns?

[T Park]

So TPark, are you saying that in your opinion Spurs/Mavs/Celts can't beat the Suns?

Spurs and Mavs? No.

Celtics? Yes.

But I think Suns Celtics would go 7, and who knows what would happen.

Spurs won't beat the Suns though no.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

Fuck you.
duncan228's first Fuck you, I believe. :clap
Nicely timed too.

[duncan228]

duncan228's first Fuck you, I believe. :clap
Nicely timed too.

There have been others, but this might be my first to a Spurs fan. Or a supposed Spurs fan anyway.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

see the title under my forum name?
I should change it to I'm a fag.
Fixed.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

There have been others, but this might be my first to a Spurs fan. Or a supposed Spurs fan anyway.
Head-case masochism attention whore fan, more like it.

[duncan228]

Head-case masochism attention whore fan, more like it.

That works. :)

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

:lol

[slayermin]

The optimist in me wants to believe that Pop was taking this chance to try keep testing some things against the new look Suns. Or perhaps he was just drunk. Either way, I'm dumping this loss at his feet.

It sure looked like Pop was experimenting.

Tim looked like he was in lab mode too with his lefty jump hooks.

We've beaten Shaq in his prime. We've beaten the Suns when Amare goes off for 40 points a game. So it's not like we haven't seen this stuff before.

Someone call up PJ, damn it.

[T Park]

It sure looked like Pop was experimenting.

Tim looked like he was in lab mode too with his lefty jump hooks.

We've beaten Shaq in his prime. We've beaten the Suns when Amare goes off for 40 points a game. So it's not like we haven't seen this stuff before.

Someone call up PJ, damn it.

Pssh Pj :lol

[BIG z]

I hope we dont have to play them in the playoffs, this year, honestly Duncan is really intimidated by shaq.......

[Brutalis]

Tension I feel among Spurs Family. Worry us not for today we sleep, and tomorrow we rise as Champions.

We are going to be fine. I can feel it. And I don't give a fuck what happens till playoff time. We get who we get and they get to see something rare before the glitter squashes them. Utah and Phoenix branded our asses, and I'm already over it. This was going to happen sometime because it does to everyone and whatever.

[Obstructed_View]

Tension I feel among Spurs Family. Worry us not for today we sleep, and tomorrow we rise as Champions.

We are going to be fine. I can feel it. And I don't give a fuck what happens till playoff time. We get who we get and they get to see something rare before the glitter squashes them. Utah and Phoenix branded our asses, and I'm already over it. This was going to happen sometime because it does to everyone and whatever.
The Spurs have had difficulty focusing for otherwise big games before, but this season is so eerily reminiscent of the 2006 season that there's cause for concern when they can't put complete games together, get up for big opponents, play both offense and defense at the same time or get some momentum going into the playoffs. If they are able to just switch it on for the postseason and suddenly start playing 48 minutes of good basketball they'll be fine, but I don't really see any evidence to suggest it's likely.

I guess that's where the B word comes in.

[polandprzem]

Fuck you.
:nope






:D




---

I don't thnk that Pop is making experiments that late in the season, he never did, but even if he did the spurs were winning. Now they were totally crashed by Suns. Come on let's go come on sunds funny but when you have success behind it there is nothing you can do other that STFU.
Umm after spurs lost it, all my day was like the Spurs lost in the playoffs and that was end of a year for them. I don't know I just had that kind of feeling.

:pctoss Manu

[Spurs Dynasty 21]

LOL @ these idiots patting themselves on the back like it matters

[leemajors]

I do think pop was truly a spectacle in HD, last game was the first time I had seen closeups of him on my new TV.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

If we start Kurt Thomas and Finley at the 3rd quarter we win this game. I don't think playing tit for tat in the first half was bad for us.

We were actually up a few points in the late 2nd, with both shaq and nash on the bench. What happened, is we lost focus, and let the Suns score easy points, which was one of the most crucial things of all, because with nash on the bench is the time to really up your lead.

Then to start the 2nd half, with Oberto there, there was no doubt in anyone's mind they'd go to shaq every time, especially cuz he is as fresh as he'd be for the rest of the game. And having Ginobili in the starting lineup in that half was just cutting your own dick off. Pop lost that game for us ugly style with that move.

When we weathered a decent suns run, we had no energy to jolt us back into contention. Parker was obviously gassed after his aggressive first half, and Duncan was playing uninspired and whiney. That equalled to more suns runs after which we just gave up. And that was before the fourth quarter even started.
Lots of bad things happened in this game, but the first domino was the lack of focus to close the 1st half after playing decent, then the 2nd domino was Pop's genius lineup.

[Brutalis]

The Spurs have had difficulty focusing for otherwise big games before, but this season is so eerily reminiscent of the 2006 season that there's cause for concern when they can't put complete games together, get up for big opponents, play both offense and defense at the same time or get some momentum going into the playoffs. If they are able to just switch it on for the postseason and suddenly start playing 48 minutes of good basketball they'll be fine, but I don't really see any evidence to suggest it's likely.

I guess that's where the B word comes in.
I agree for the most part but I just have had a feeling over the past couple weeks. I can't explain exactly why I think and feel it, but we will survive and win.

[Obstructed_View]

I agree for the most part but I just have had a feeling over the past couple weeks. I can't explain exactly why I think and feel it, but we will survive and win.

I think they can, and part of me thinks that they're just waiting until the playoffs to turn on the effort. That hasn't worked well for very many teams before. If they are playing well and healthy, they'll win another title, period. That's a big-assed if at this point, though.

[wildchild]

Well, timvp, could guard Diaw? Parker? Ginobili? Vaughn? Bruce on Nash, Tim on Amare, Oberto on Shaq.
C'mon, dude. I don't understand what you mean? :rolleyes



Diaw plays power forward or center for the Suns. Put a power forward or center against him. For example, Oberto against Diaw is a good matchup for the Spurs. Going small ball against Diaw is just playing into Diaw strengths. If you put a big on him, that forces him into becoming a jumpshooter and that's the weakest part of his game.

Thanks, timvp for your explanation. I was annoyed at myself two days ago and wasn't thinking cleary. People usually say to me after the loss, don't freak out, don't let it make you mad but I've not any sucess with that.

[bigfundamental21]

I couldn't even bring myself to comment on this game until today as I was so disappointed in our showing. To make matters worse, the Rockets proceeded to thump the Suns last night and made our loss look even worse than it already was.

I could see frustration from Duncan, but it didn't translate into an improved effort. I truly hope that he can get out of the funk he has been in. And I hope he can get away from complaining to the refs every play. He just needs to go out and play and leave the refs to their job (even if the calls are not going his way). I believe Duncan will do better, but we need him to do it fast. Sunday's game would be a great time to get started.

The fourth quarter woes of late are a huge concern. I hope this is not a sign of things to come and that we can get some momentum going to hit a stride going in. Unfortunately, now we only have 3 games left to figure it out.