Possible Trade Scenarios?

[DPG21920]

Everyone is talking strictly about FA signings, what are some ideas for good trades to improve the Spurs? My first crack at it is this:

The Bulls need active big men that are veterans and have high basketball I.Q. The Spurs need to get younger, more athletic and need some upside at the 2 spot and the 3/4 spots. I feel this trade solves both problems. Let me know what you think:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=1996~2805~3028~3032&teams=4~4~24~24&te=&cash=

[cze1860]

Everyone is talking strictly about FA signings, what are some ideas for good trades to improve the Spurs? My first crack at it is this:

The Bulls need active big men that are veterans and have high basketball I.Q. The Spurs need to get younger, more athletic and need some upside at the 2 spot and the 3/4 spots. I feel this trade solves both problems. Let me know what you think:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/feature...4~24&te=&cash=

yes，对suprs need younger palyer，同意你的观点。

[AFBlue]

No one is talking trade because the Spurs have no assets that anyone else would want. At this point, Free Agency and the Draft are far more likely to be the sources by which the Spurs replenish their role players.

[DPG21920]

That is incredibly untrue. The Spurs have a Big 3 that anyone would want (although the Spurs will not trade any of them more than likely) as well as solid veterans such as Oberto, Bowen and Barry. Oberto is a championship caliber center and has a lot of skills and an extremely reasonable contract that many teams would find attractive. He makes 3.5 million compared to someone like Eric Dampier who makes 10.5 million.

[T Park]

No way in hell the Bulls would do that trade.

[ss1986v2]

the bulls wouldnt trade thabo alone for that package, let alone throw in tyrus. god awful...

spurs just dont have the assets to pull any major moves aside from shuffling our junk with others junk.

[cze1860]

if Suprs need trade，we need a better C。

[Pistons < Spurs]

Oberto is a championship caliber center and has a lot of skills and an extremely reasonable contract that many teams would find attractive.

:wtf:wtf:wtf

[timvp]

Bonner has the lowest basketball IQ on the Spurs. The Bulls wouldn't do that trade if you added in two first round picks.

[Pistons < Spurs]

Thabo and Tyrus for Bonner and Oberto???? Are you serious? You couldn't get one of those players for Bonner and Oberto, let alone both.

[AFBlue]

That is incredibly untrue. The Spurs have a Big 3 that anyone would want (although the Spurs will not trade any of them more than likely) as well as solid veterans such as Oberto, Bowen and Barry. Oberto is a championship caliber center and has a lot of skills and an extremely reasonable contract that many teams would find attractive. He makes 3.5 million compared to someone like Eric Dampier who makes 10.5 million.

Big 3, like you said, are untouchable.

Oberto is not a championship-calibur center. He's a center who happens to be on a championship-calibur team. I'm not demeaning his importance to the Spurs because he's full of intangibles....but those intangibles make him far more valueable to this team as a player and not as trade bait.

Bowen is the Spurs defensive stopper and as much a part of the team's recent success as the Big 3. AT 37, he is also much more valueable to this team as a player and not as trade bait.

And Barry, he makes vet min and he's 36yrs old. When he was making $6M, he was a valuable trade commodity....and was used as such to acquire Kurt Thomas. Now he's just an over-the-hill shooter making pennies. He'd probably retire if the Spurs didn't bring him back.

Bottom Line: The only Spur that is likely to get traded in the coming months is Matt Bonner, and that would mostly be in an effort to shed salary. Others aren't worth enough or don't make enough to justify what the Spurs would likely receive in return.

[DPG21920]

What has Thabo done that garners so much respect? Oberto has high basketball I.Q. and a ring and a gold medal. He is a starting center in the NBA on a championship team, you guys are seriously underestimating how many teams would like Oberto, not as their star, but a super solid role player.

[AFBlue]

What has Thabo done that garners so much respect? Oberto has high basketball I.Q. and a ring and a gold medal. He is a starting center in the NBA on a championship team, you guys are seriously underestimating how many teams would like Oberto, not as their star, but a super solid role player.

He's also clearly limited offensively and had next to no athleticism when the Spurs brought him on board a few years ago...now he's practically nailed to the floor.

I love Oberto for what he brings to the Spurs, but to think that other teams would appreciate those intangibles enough to give up high-potential players on rookie contracts....it's not sound logic.

[AFBlue]

And BTW, we're not banging on you because you're the "new guy"....

WELCOME! :toast

[ss1986v2]

What has Thabo done that garners so much respect? Oberto has high basketball I.Q. and a ring and a gold medal. He is a starting center in the NBA on a championship team, you guys are seriously underestimating how many teams would like Oberto, not as their star, but a super solid role player.
head over to any bulls or nba board for that matter. propose oberto for thabo straight up. prepare to be laughed/flamed right off the board. you seriously overate the rest of the leagues interest in oberto. KT holds more value than oberto around the league.

[Big P]

What has Thabo done that garners so much respect? Oberto has high basketball I.Q. and a ring and a gold medal. He is a starting center in the NBA on a championship team, you guys are seriously underestimating how many teams would like Oberto, not as their star, but a super solid role player.

We are not underestimating how many teams would like to have Oberto, we are saying that you will not get back players like TT or Sefolosha for Oberto, Bonner etc.

[Pistons < Spurs]

And BTW, we're not banging on you because you're the "new guy"....

WELCOME! :toast

+1

Welcome to ST!

[tav1]

Everyone is talking strictly about FA signings, what are some ideas for good trades to improve the Spurs? My first crack at it is this:

The Bulls need active big men that are veterans and have high basketball I.Q. The Spurs need to get younger, more athletic and need some upside at the 2 spot and the 3/4 spots. I feel this trade solves both problems. Let me know what you think:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=1996~2805~3028~3032&teams=4~4~24~24&te=&cash=

To quote a man we love dearly, "Step away from the crackpipe."

[smrattler]

I like this trade!

A couple more like it and we're back!

[SPURSGOAT]

we have no one to trade... the big 3 are not going to be traded...

[remingtonbo2001]

As timvp mentioned in another thread, we do have our trade exception.

If you couple that with our picks and Bonner, the Spurs might be able to pull some magic outta the hat.

We'll see.

[cdcast]

A team like the Nuggets that's in luxury tax hell might be willing to sell their 20th pick. The Nets have two #1's. Their 21st pick could be available. They can then package their 26th pick with one of these picks plus Udoka for something.

Portland needs a star SF. If they go after Carmelo, Deng , or Marion, the Spurs need to get in on some of this action. 3 team trades are the best way.

Example: Portland gets Deng, the Bulls get Webster, the 13th, 20th, and 26th picks, and the Spurs get Frye and Jack OR instead just get the 13th pick for Rush or Alexander---an extreme long-shot but something along those lines.

Team A gets the star player, Team B gets the young players and picks to rebuild, and Team C (Spurs) get a good player.

[rascal]

Every year good players are traded for expiring contracts and or picks or in quality for quantity type of deals. The spurs never get into the action to make any of these type of trades to improve. They have to be near the bottom of the league when it comes to making trades .

[wildchild]

KT holds more value than oberto around the league.

I'm not sure about KT right now. Other teams are interested in him? I doubt it. Maybe this is the reason why KT resign for 4/5 mill/year less next season.
Oberto is a good player, he played many great games and a few weak games in the regular season but we need young blood like Tyrus and Tabo.
I like the trade.:tu

[djohn14]

That is incredibly untrue. The Spurs have a Big 3 that anyone would want (although the Spurs will not trade any of them more than likely) as well as solid veterans such as Oberto, Bowen and Barry. Oberto is a championship caliber center and has a lot of skills and an extremely reasonable contract that many teams would find attractive. He makes 3.5 million compared to someone like Eric Dampier who makes 10.5 million.

Oberto isnt a championship caliber center in the D-League.

[DPG21920]

He's also clearly limited offensively and had next to no athleticism when the Spurs brought him on board a few years ago...now he's practically nailed to the floor.

I love Oberto for what he brings to the Spurs, but to think that other teams would appreciate those intangibles enough to give up high-potential players on rookie contracts....it's not sound logic.

Once again, I have to respectfully disagree. The Bulls do need size, they have enough youth, and they are over crowded at the two spot. They have a new coach, no one with any championship experience, and Thabo was often lost in the shuffle. Oberto is not offensively limited (athletically he is), he is system limited. Have you guys watched him play freely, or for Argentina? You saw what he can do passing the ball, good finisher around the rim and has a nice jumper when he does not hesitate. Think of Hedo Turkoglu when he was a Spur. He was the same player, but not one of the top 3 options, same as Barry. You see what some of those guys can do when you go to them, which I think the Bulls would more often than the Spurs do.

[DPG21920]

Thabo and Tyrus for Bonner and Oberto???? Are you serious? You couldn't get one of those players for Bonner and Oberto, let alone both.

You are crazy!! Center that have nice skill sets and high basketball I.Q. are extremely rare in this league, especially ones that have a ring and cost only 3.5 million dollars. That is a downright steal at that price considering Dampier makes 10.5 million. The Bulls would definitely give up one of those players for Oberto straight up, but it does not work that way because of salary reasons. They need a center who can make plays at both ends and be a locker room guy. The Bulls were ready to ship Tyrus out in many deals this year, but none got done because everyone wanted Deng.

[ss1986v2]

You are crazy!! Center that have nice skill sets and high basketball I.Q. are extremely rare in this league, especially ones that have a ring and cost only 3.5 million dollars. That is a downright steal at that price considering Dampier makes 10.5 million. The Bulls would definitely give up one of those players for Oberto straight up, but it does not work that way because of salary reasons. They need a center who can make plays at both ends and be a locker room guy. The Bulls were ready to ship Tyrus out in many deals this year, but none got done because everyone wanted Deng.
http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a62/photohosting1234/Fail/fail-1.gif

[DPG21920]

If Tyrus and Thabo are so good, then why did they not crack the rotation consistently? They have potential, but have shown nothing incredible yet. Oberto, you know what you can get out of him. I think some of you are way off base. Big men are always more valuable then little guys, that is why the same ones are always in the league, I mean who would have thought the Foyle and Mbenga and Mihm and players like that would be on rosters still, but guys with potential like James White, Gerald Green and other "young ballers" are out of the league.

[DPG21920]

I guess Hedo Turkoglu was offensively limited as well when he was on the Spurs? Why then is he capable of doing what he does now? Same as Brent Barry, but yet when we let him handle the ball and shoot, he does very well. Players like Oberto play within a system, and while he is not the best player in the world, if allowed to, he could easily be scoring 12 points a game and grabbing 8 rebounds along with 2 assists. He is just in the Spurs system where they do not allow him to do certain things, just like Barry, just like Turkoglu. Just like Beno. All examples of guys you all probably said had no trade value, especially Beno, and now look at ya, fools.

[DPG21920]

Probably the same guys who wanted James White to start, obviously coaches think like you!

[ynh]

If Tyrus and Thabo are so good, then why did they not crack the rotation consistently? They have potential, but have shown nothing incredible yet. Oberto, you know what you can get out of him. I think some of you are way off base. Big men are always more valuable then little guys, that is why the same ones are always in the league, I mean who would have thought the Foyle and Mbenga and Mihm and players like that would be on rosters still, but guys with potential like James White, Gerald Green and other "young ballers" are out of the league.


Bulls would never do that.. they are not going to trade one, let alone two, promising young players for Oberto.. and you really overvalue Oberto.

[DPG21920]

Bonner was involved in the trade as well, and the Spurs could include the #26 pick. I am not saying it is the best trade in the world, but for people to act like the Bulls would not even consider giving up one of those players for Oberto is outrageous to me. I was arguing that Oberto is worth one of those players for sure, especially since they need veteran centers. The trade was for two players because it would have to be for salaries to match-up, but I do not think it is that far fetched. The argument for saying go on the Bulls forum and ask about Oberto is just dumb, considering the average NBA fan does not watch Oberto play on a night-in, night-out basis. That is the same people who say that the Minnesota trade giving up Garnett was just as bad as the Memphis trade giving up Gasol. They never watched Al Jefferson play in Boston because they sucked and they do not watch Minnesota now and realize that Al Jefferson was 1 of 5 guys to average 20 points and 10 boards. That was a great trade for Minnesota.

[ynh]

How is Oberto going to help them? They don't need a mediocre center they need someone with a back to the basket game.. and even if they wanted to move one of those two young players for a center they could get someone better then Oberto.. hell they could get someone for the MLE better or atleast equal to that. The bulls would have no reason to make that deal.. and the 26th pick is a crap shoot and chances are your not getting anything more then a bench player there.

[DPG21920]

That is the point, Oberto makes way less the MLE, he makes 3.5, that is an absolute steal. He would help them greatly especially defensively, obviously he helped the Spurs to a championship and Argentina to a gold medal. How can you act like he sucks when he starts for the Spurs? He has more game than he shows (you see it in flashes) he just does not get any plays called for him. If he was on another team, he could open up his game, just like Scola does for the Rockets.

[DPG21920]

Name who they can get for that price that is better. With his kind of pedigree or resume (NBA championship starting center, Olympic gold medal winner starting center).

[DPG21920]

Oberto is not the answer to all their problems, but that would be a solid trade for both teams in my opinion.

[Sigz]

"facepalm"

The Bulls would be idiots to agree to that trade.

[DPG21920]

But I guess it is hard to give up young talent for guys like Oberto

[ynh]

Um.. honestly just sticking with Thomas and Theoblo or whatever his name is would be better.. that's why they wouldn't do it. Just cause Oberto is the spurs starting center doesn't mean he's all that good or that he's a championship calliber center.. the guy next to him is Tim Duncan that's the only reason he is a "championship center". And again even if they wanted to move those guys.. they could put them in an even bigger deal to get more worth out of them and get someone allot better then Oberto. And Oberto wouldn't be Scola on a different team.

[DPG21920]

How do you know that? Did you follow Scola and Oberto? You only know what you have seen this year. Scola is more talented than Oberto, but not by light years...

[DPG21920]

But I doubt the Spurs would give up Oberto, Pop loves him. Unless it is a no-brainer.

[DPG21920]

What did you guys think of Beno when he was on the Spurs? 90% of you thought he had no trade value and that he was a scrub. Now, when given a chance to run a team in a different system, he is excelling.

[DPG21920]

Another question: So do you think that if Tyrus Thomas switched with Oberto, the Spurs would do better this year in the playoffs, or last year when they won? You never answered my question, name a guy of his skill set that makes around 3.5 million that you could get.

[ynh]

I honestly don't have the time to sit here and look up saleries. Point is they wouldn't make the trade.. I don't think anyone on here agreed that they would think of making the trade. You don't trade young for old and Oberto is nothing more then a PJ Brown level player, ring or no ring.

[DPG21920]

Um.. honestly just sticking with Thomas and Theoblo or whatever his name is would be better.. that's why they wouldn't do it. Just cause Oberto is the spurs starting center doesn't mean he's all that good or that he's a championship calliber center.. the guy next to him is Tim Duncan that's the only reason he is a "championship center". And again even if they wanted to move those guys.. they could put them in an even bigger deal to get more worth out of them and get someone allot better then Oberto. And Oberto wouldn't be Scola on a different team.

They tried to trade those players in bigger deals and no one took it. It shows you something. Everyone turned down the trade because Luol Deng was not included, but everyone else was. So the Bulls were willing to part with them.

[DPG21920]

Exactly, why did so many teams want PJ Brown?

[DPG21920]

How is Oberto going to help them? They don't need a mediocre center they need someone with a back to the basket game.. and even if they wanted to move one of those two young players for a center they could get someone better then Oberto.. hell they could get someone for the MLE better or atleast equal to that. The bulls would have no reason to make that deal.. and the 26th pick is a crap shoot and chances are your not getting anything more then a bench player there.

But you said if they wanted to move one of the younger players they could get a better center or I quote: "hell they could get someone for the MLE better or at least equal to that". If there is that many centers that are better naming 1 for that price should not be difficult.

[ynh]

They tried to trade those players in bigger deals and no one took it. It shows you something. Everyone turned down the trade because Luol Deng was not included, but everyone else was. So the Bulls were willing to part with them.

So... they are just going to give the up for Oberto, Bonner and the 26th pick.. yeah.

[ynh]

But you said if they wanted to move one of the younger players they could get a better center or I quote: "hell they could get someone for the MLE better or at least equal to that". If there is that many centers that are better naming 1 for that price should not be difficult.


Is there a point to this.. Jesus.. Diop ummm PJ Brown.. I told you I don't have the time to look up saleries and I'm not really that interested in proving that this trade wouldn't happen (when everyone knows it wouldn't) to sit here and look up FA and pay.

[manufor3]

huh really why would the bulls go for that?

[ynh]

huh really why would the bulls go for that?

Cause Oberto is a Championship Caliber Center.:rolleyes

[DPG21920]

Because the Bulls have plenty of people at that position (sg/sf), they have no veteran leadership in the position they desperately need and Oberto has an extremely reasonable contract. The Bulls also have to tie up major money in re-signing Luol Deng and Ben Gordon. So when those two players (Thabo and Tyrus) have contracts that expire in 2 years, they will have to go way over the cap to re-sign them. Can not keep everyone and the Bulls are cheap, hence, Vinny Del Negro...

[DPG21920]

Vhn: you have dodged all my questions. At least I am trying to back up what I say with logic and quantifiable answers. You just say random things. By the way P.J. Brown and Diop are no better than Oberto. They are solid, just like Oberto.

[coachmac87]

huh really why would the bulls go for that?

well because they need a decent cheap big man....


oberto didnt have a really good year. to me he was WAY better last year and finished really well around the basket.

i think the bulls would love to have someone like oberto. its just they dont have another big that will compliment him well like duncan does.

but i can see them maybe doing oberto for thomas... but thats it not both players.

bulls could careless about thomas right now...especially since they should draft beasley

[ynh]

Just cause they can careless about them doesn't mean they are going to give him away along with another young guy.

And I made my case DPG.. Diop and Brown are both FA this summer (I think on Diop) and they can be had.. and as you say are maybe not better then Oberto but just as solid.. so why give up two young guys for someone that you don't need to trade for? Thomas still has value around the league.. hell if Darko can get you the 15th pick (stuckey) I'm sure they can do better then the 26th and Oberto. And even with that I still say they get better value throwing them in a bigger deal.. and Oberto still doesn't answer their need for a back to the basket center. Anways IMO the bulls are just going to small ball it with Noah at center.. that's what they did last year.. and if they need a vet presence that bad they will swing the number one for Wade or some real Championship Caliber player. I mean does Oberto make them better? No... Is Oberto worth giving up a 2 players on their rookie contracts that have potential (one being a top 5 pick a couple years ago?) NO. Bulls have no reason to do it.. this is a trade that helps you guys but does nothing for the Bulls.

[DPG21920]

There is such a thing as salary cap though, and like I said, you trade to get contracts that will allow for you to be reasonable. They can not just sign everyone they want, there are only so many roster spaces and so much money to go around. That is why a trade works. Not saying it is perfect, but I do not think it is terrible.

[ynh]

Yea and if they are over the cap they have the MLE to work with and can offer one of them half of that.. still no reason to trade them for the package..

[ynh]

It's not terrible it's just not realistic. Sorry to say but as an outside fan of your team you have nothing outside the big three that is of real trading value.

[DPG21920]

Well that is where we disagree my friend!

[ynh]

That's cool.