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Ignignokt
06-19-2008, 09:36 PM
So much for being principled.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080619/ap_on_el_pr/obama_money


By JIM KUHNHENN, Associated Press Writer
Thu Jun 19, 7:27 PM ET



WASHINGTON - Barack Obama is abandoning public financing for his presidential campaign, reversing his earlier stance in bold certainty he can raise millions more on his own as the first major-party candidate to bypass the tax-checkoff system that was hurried into place after the Watergate scandal.

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Obama has shattered fundraising records during the primary season, and he promptly showed off his financial muscle Thursday with his first commercial of the general election campaign. The ad, a 60-second biographical spot, will begin airing Friday in 18 states, including historically Republican strongholds.

Though it opens him to charges of hypocrisy, Obama's fundraising decision was hardly a surprise, given his record in raising money from private sources. Some $85 million in public money is available to each major party nominee during the fall campaign if they agree to forgo other contributions.

McCain told reporters in Minnesota on Thursday, "We will take public financing."

As for his opponent, he said Obama "said he would stick to his word. He didn't."

Obama has proven himself to be a prodigious fundraiser who could easily raise more than the public fund supplies. And while he and his advisers know McCain and other Republicans will criticize his decision, they understand that issues of campaign finance do not rank high in most voters' minds.

By releasing his first ad of the general election, Obama also diluted the impact of the money story with a strong visual that was likely to dominate television coverage of the campaign. Obama will draw attention to his finances again on Friday, when his campaign files its May fundraising report with the Federal Election Commission.

Obama's decision represents a significant milestone in the financing of presidential campaigns. President Bush was the first candidate to reject public financing of primaries when he ran in 2000. But no candidate has ignored the general election funds since the law setting up the presidential finance system was approved in 1976.

"It's not an easy decision, and especially because I support a robust system of public financing of elections," Obama told supporters in a video message Thursday. "But the public financing of presidential elections as it exists today is broken, and we face opponents who've become masters at gaming this broken system."

McCain sharply rebuked the Illinois senator on Thursday.

"This election is about a lot of things. It's also about trust," McCain said. "It's about keeping your word."

Last year, Obama filled out a questionnaire where he vowed to "aggressively pursue an agreement with the Republican nominee to preserve a publicly financed general election." But since clinching the Democratic nomination earlier this month, Obama has not broached the subject with McCain. The only discussion occurred about two weeks ago between Obama's and McCain's lawyers,

Obama lawyer Robert Bauer said he discussed the public financing issue for 45 minutes on June 6 with McCain counsel Trevor Potter. In interviews and e-mails, both Bauer and Potter agree that Bauer raised concerns about McCain having a head start because he had secured the nomination in early March and Obama did not until June 3. Potter said he told Bauer that given Obama's fundraising "I was sure there would be no McCain advantage by the end of the summer."

That meeting, Potter said, "was not part of any negotiation" on public financing.

"There was no aggressive pursuit of negotiations with the McCain campaign, there was no pursuit, period, of negotiations with the McCain campaign," Potter added later in a conference call with reporters.

At a breakfast with reporters Thursday, Bauer said that after his meeting with Potter, "It became clear to me, and I reported to the campaign, that there really wasn't a basis for further discussion."

Several campaign finance watchdog groups voiced dismay at Obama's decision, with Democracy 21 President Fred Wertheimer noting that the conditions Obama had initially set for accepting public funds had been met.

Sen. Russ Feingold, a Wisconsin Democrat who has worked with McCain on campaign finance laws in the past, praised Obama for his support of current campaign finance legislation, but added: "This decision was a mistake."

Obama raked in more than $265 million as of the end of April. Of that, nearly $10 million was for the general election, reserved for spending after the party's national convention in August. McCain had raised nearly $115 million by the end of May, eligible for spending before the convention.

McCain filed his May fundraising report Thursday with the Federal Election Commission, showing he raised $21 million during the month and started June with $31.5 million cash on hand. McCain had announced those numbers earlier this month. He spent a total of $11.7 million in May.

On the other hand, Obama's clear financial advantage over McCain is offset in part by the resources of the Republican National Committee, which has far more money in the bank than the Democratic National Committee. Both national parties can spend money on behalf of the presidential candidates.

Obama said McCain and the Republican National Committee are fueled by contributions from Washington lobbyists and political action committees.

"And we've already seen that he's not going to stop the smears and attacks from his allies running so-called 527 groups, who will spend millions and millions of dollars in unlimited donations," Obama said.

Despite that claim, few Republican-leaning groups have weighed into the presidential contest so far. In fact, Obama allies such as MoveOn.org are the ones that have been spending money on advertising against McCain.

McCain and Obama both declined public financing in the primary contests, thus avoiding the spending limits that come with the money. McCain had initially applied for the money, however, and has been in a dispute with the Federal Election Commission over whether he needed its approval to decline the funds. The FEC insists that he does, but has not had a quorum to act because four of its six seats have been vacant pending Senate confirmation of presidential nominees. McCain lawyers have disputed the need for FEC approval.

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JoeChalupa
06-19-2008, 09:46 PM
This is not news to me. I knew he was going to go this route in order to have the best campaign possible. Yes he flip-flopped but it was a wise decision, IMO.

clambake
06-20-2008, 09:49 AM
strategic move.........and......

:lmao at the filthiest, nastiest political machine crying foul!:lmao

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 11:09 AM
So conservatives are angry that A Democrat isn't spending $84 million of their tax money?

AZLouis
06-20-2008, 11:46 AM
Obama is supposed to compete with a guy who wrote loopholes into the "reform" that allowed him to use his wife's personal fleet?

The never of that Obama character, using a different form of public finance.

The real story is that McCain had to do it, there was no other way for that kind of money to land into his campaign's piggy bank.

JoeChalupa
06-20-2008, 11:55 AM
I was watching Morning Joe this morning and both he and Pat Buchanan said they would have made the same decision as Barack did. Barack should have stated his position more clearly though.

Other agree.

Author Of McCain-Feingold: Obama Smart To Opt Out Of Public Funds

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/19/author-of-mccain-feingold_n_108132.html

One of the principal authors of the most significant campaign finance legislation since Watergate said he was neither "outraged" nor "surprised" with Barack Obama's decision to forgo public funding in the general election.

Norm Ornstein, a fellow at the conservative American Enterprise Institute and substantial contributor to the Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act -- also known as the "McCain-Feingold" campaign finance legislation -- said on Thursday that Obama's move was "pragmatically the right decision to make," and that, if the Senator had not chosen that path, "I would have sued him for political malpractice."

"What I told a bunch of people a few weeks ago," said Ornstein, "is that while it would be nice if he decided he felt honor bound to stay within the system and take the money, if he did so I might join a group of people who sued him for political malpractice. When you have the ability to raise the kind of money that he could raise and do it without selling your soul to spend all the time between now and the election on fundraisers, your goal is to win an election and not turn your back on the people voting. There will be outraged editorials and McCain will be justifiably pissed. But it was pragmatically the right decision for him to make."

Anyone with any political sense would do the same.

u2sarajevo
06-20-2008, 12:00 PM
I don't get the uproar from the Republican angle on this. Is it because some time period has expired and now only Obama has this option? If McCain can still go this route now I don't see what the problem is.

Now if some time for making this decision has expired and McCain is stuck having a limited amount he can spend because of it and Obama said he would do the same..... well that's a different story. That is the only way I see this being an actual issue.

Could anyone clarify this?

balli
06-20-2008, 12:15 PM
Repugs are pissed off about this? What fucking joke. I almost can't even believe it that they'd call opting out of public funds "unprincipled". Give me a fucking break.

xrayzebra
06-20-2008, 01:06 PM
So conservatives are angry that A Democrat isn't spending $84 million of their tax money?

Not this conservative. Let him and his bunch of PAC's spend all the money they want. McCain would have done the same. But then again all Obama shows is that he is what he is a political hack who will do what ever it takes to try and get elected. So what's new pussy cat.........yeouuuuu, yeouuuuu (or something like Dean's sound):lol

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 01:54 PM
McCain would have done the same.He could have but didn't.

He's going to spend $84 million in your tax dollars.

balli
06-20-2008, 01:56 PM
Jesus fucking christ. The "people" bashing Obama over this are just clutching at straws. Desperately. If you're one of them you can go fuck yourself.

xrayzebra
06-20-2008, 02:09 PM
He could have but didn't.

He's going to spend $84 million in your tax dollars.

Not mine. I don't check off anything on my tax form. Now it may be yours. If so, let me thank you on behalf of the Republican Party....:lol:lol

And Yale and UC has a PAC you can donate to for Barack. Is America great or what!

Wild Cobra
06-20-2008, 04:04 PM
Repugs are pissed off about this? What fucking joke. I almost can't even believe it that they'd call opting out of public funds "unprincipled". Give me a fucking break.

Maybe that/s one of the problems with you lemming liberals. You believe what you are told by the establisment.

I don't give a fuck. The only concern I hear is that he doesn't stand by his word.

Isn't someones word important?

I love the idea. How many people will give to his campaign rather than the DNC? How many dmocrat representatives and senators will be vulnerable, and have less financing? I don't know, but I'll bet enough that it matters!

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 04:10 PM
Not mine. I don't check off anything on my tax form. Now it may be yours. If so, let me thank you on behalf of the Republican Party....:lol:lol:lol

I didn't, but it's hilarious that the Republicans now have to rely on taxes to run an election when Democrats don't.

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 04:12 PM
Maybe that/s one of the problems with you lemming liberals. You believe what you are told by the establisment.

I don't give a fuck. The only concern I hear is that he doesn't stand by his word.

Isn't someones word important?Do you really want to get into a pissing contest about candidates flip-flopping? McCain seems to be pretty far ahead in that department -- and on issues of actual policy, not whether he is going to use public funds in an election.

Wild Cobra
06-20-2008, 04:20 PM
Do you really want to get into a pissing contest about candidates flip-flopping? McCain seems to be pretty far ahead in that department -- and on issues of actual policy, not whether he is going to use public funds in an election.
First of all, changing ones mind in the short term vs. the long term is a different thing.

Second, McCain has done several 'flips,' in that he has changed his mind over a longer time. To really count as a 'flip-flop,' you don't really establish a position, but go back and fourth as the wind changes.

As for defending McCain. I might play along a little, but I don't want to see him as president. I'm fine if Obama wins. I see it as a disaster either way.

balli
06-20-2008, 04:20 PM
Maybe that/s one of the problems with you lemming liberals. You believe what you are told by the establisment.

I don't give a fuck. The only concern I hear is that he doesn't stand by his word.

Isn't someones word important?

I love the idea. How many people will give to his campaign rather than the DNC? How many dmocrat representatives and senators will be vulnerable, and have less financing? I don't know, but I'll bet enough that it matters!


Jesus fucking christ. The "people" bashing Obama over this are just clutching at straws. Desperately. If you're one of them you can go fuck yourself.

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 04:24 PM
First of all, changing ones mind in the short term vs. the long term is a different thing.

Second, McCain has done several 'flips,' in that he has changed his mind over a longer time. To really count as a 'flip-flop,' you don't really establish a position, but go back and fourth as the wind changes.So Obama didn't flip-flop.

Ok.


As for defending McCain. I might play along a little, but I don't want to see him as president. I'm fine if Obama wins. I see it as a disaster either way.The current presidency is the disaster. There's no way to go but up.

Wild Cobra
06-20-2008, 04:46 PM
The current presidency is the disaster. There's no way to go but up.
I think you'll change your mind when we have a president Obama, or even McCain. Things will be worse. I don't see how they can get better under either as president.

Keep in mind, I agree president Bush has some pretty undesirable traits. I will maintain my contention that both are far worse. McCain does have several good qualities. However, they don't com close to compensating for the bad ones.

Now McCain is the lesser of two evils. However, like I said several times in the past. I would prefer a democrat take this nation rather than a republican. My hope is that the democrats never recover from what happens in 2009 to 2012. I'd rather see their party harmed raher than the republicans. Look at how the republicans were harmed because of the outlook with president Bush!

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 04:50 PM
I think you'll change your mind when we have a president Obama, or even McCain. Things will be worse. I don't see how they can get better under either as president.Nope. Bush is the worst. It'll will get better from here no matter who wins.


Keep in mind, I agree president Bush has some pretty undesirable traits. I will maintain my contention that both are far worse. McCain does have several good qualities. However, they don't com close to compensating for the bad ones.I maintain Bush is far worse.


Now McCain is the lesser of two evils. However, like I said several times in the past. I would prefer a democrat take this nation rather than a republican. My hope is that the democrats never recover from what happens in 2009 to 2012. I'd rather see their party harmed raher than the republicans. Look at how the republicans were harmed because of the outlook with president Bush!Bush sucked and Republicans backed him to the hilt, so they are now paying the price.

jochhejaam
06-20-2008, 06:01 PM
Do you really want to get into a pissing contest about candidates flip-flopping? McCain seems to be pretty far ahead in that department -- and on issues of actual policy, not whether he is going to use public funds in an election.

McCain never "promised" not to flip-flop. Therein lies the difference...

ChumpDumper
06-20-2008, 06:07 PM
:lol

If you want to get into semantics, the conditions Obama put out for public funding were never met. So he didn't even change his mind.

ElNono
06-20-2008, 06:43 PM
Not this conservative. Let him and his bunch of PAC's spend all the money they want. McCain would have done the same. But then again all Obama shows is that he is what he is a political hack who will do what ever it takes to try and get elected. So what's new pussy cat.........yeouuuuu, yeouuuuu (or something like Dean's sound):lol

You mean McCain won't? You're not THAT naive, are you?

ElNono
06-20-2008, 06:44 PM
I don't give a fuck. The only concern I hear is that he doesn't stand by his word.

Isn't someones word important?


Didn't McCain also flip-flopped on offshore drilling?
How important is his word?

jochhejaam
06-20-2008, 07:04 PM
Didn't McCain also flip-flopped on offshore drilling?
How important is his word?

I believe he did, and when you take into consideration skyrocketing fuel costs, along with ever increasing demand, it was probably the right decision.

Someone's going to get it sooner or later, it may as well be us, now.



Flip-flop doesn't necessarily have to carry with it a bad connotation.

ElNono
06-20-2008, 07:05 PM
Flip-flop doesn't necessarily have to carry with it a bad connotation.

I actually agree with you on this. It just bothers me to no end that a politician can't change his mind on a subject, even if it's the sound thing to do, without being accused of flip-flopping.

Wild Cobra
06-20-2008, 07:09 PM
Didn't McCain also flip-flopped on offshore drilling?
How important is his word?
When things and situations change, so do peoples perspective. There are some things can should be accepted as a rasonable change of mind.

Do you never change your mind as something important around you changes?

Wild Cobra
06-20-2008, 07:12 PM
I actually agree with you on this. It just bothers me to no end that a politician can't change his mind on a subject, even if it's the sound thing to do, without being accused of flip-flopping.

That is why I make the distiction clear. If it is just a change, then take it as that. If a person is acting on poll results, goes back on their word, or back and forth on issues, that becomes flip-flopping.

jochhejaam
06-20-2008, 09:10 PM
:lol

If you want to get into semantics, the conditions Obama put out for public funding were never met. So he didn't even change his mind.

Obama and his Staff made this decision based on the fact that he's running for President, not trying to become a Martyr <not that he wouldn't go on to win it either way>.


Who wants "He stuck to his guns, and it cost him the White House" etched into his gravestone.

Wild Cobra
06-23-2008, 06:22 PM
:lol

If you want to get into semantics, the conditions Obama put out for public funding were never met. So he didn't even change his mind.

I'd be curious just what he said. My uderstanding is that he said he would ake the public funding unless McCain doesn't.