Manu's Agent says....

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Originally Posted by benefactor

I know this is tough for Manu...but even though you take a lot of pride in your own country and want to represent them you still have a job that you are paid for. There is loyalty involved in both with regards to the fans, but you have co-workers that are depending on you. Its not fair to them for you jeopardize what all of them work so hard to achieve every year because you feel a sense of obligation to your country regardless of your health. You can't let loyalty and national pride turn into selfishness...and you are riding that line with this decision.

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This call should be easy for Manu. You have a gold medal and you ended the year hurt, sit home this summer and get healthy for your team paying you millions of bucks to be healthy.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

Manu's job entails being a great athlete, not having his ass chained to a desk, surely you see a diference there?? Some people have it in their contracts that they can't ride motorcycles, in the offseason, and if they get hurt bye bye salary. That is having fun in the offseason isn't it?? But you don't do it if it means kissing a payday goodbye. Tell me or anyone with a straight face you would risk your health if you knew that if you got hurt you would lose out on 10 mil. Manu can do this because that is not at risk nomatter what.

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Ofcourse he would still do it even if he would lose 10 million. That's what you can't seem to get through your thick head. And injury would set him back, at worse, one year. After that he can easily sign a $60+ million contract.
You know, I wouldn't pass up on 10 million because I'll probably never see that kind of money again. But Manu is basically getting paid below average money for a ex-All Star player still in his prime.

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Originally Posted by benefactor

I know this is tough for Manu...but even though you take a lot of pride in your own country and want to represent them you still have a job that you are paid for. There is loyalty involved in both with regards to the fans, but you have co-workers that are depending on you. Its not fair to them for you jeopardize what all of them work so hard to achieve every year because you feel a sense of obligation to your country regardless of your health. You can't let loyalty and national pride turn into selfishness...and you are riding that line with this decision.

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How is this selfish?
It's deciding between co-workers depending on you, or your entire country counting on you.
It's like having to decide between my co-workers or my family. This is a no-brainer.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

How is this selfish?
It's deciding between co-workers depending on you, or your entire country counting on you.
It's like having to decide between my co-workers or my family. This is a no-brainer.

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What? Entire country =/= family.

I'm not sure what the odds are, but I think that Ginobili getting injured further is more probable than his leading Argentina to another gold medal.

And another poster said that Tim may have played if he had been okay in 2000. That's the thing, he wasn't okay, hence he did not play. Simple. He decided against mortgaging the future. Realizing that the NBA overpays its players probably didn't escape his mind either.

Trade him. Larry Bird wants to get rid of Jamaal Tinsley's contract. Danny Granger would fit right in here. Those two contracts would work with Manu's.

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Originally Posted by v2freak

What? Entire country =/= family.

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Family > Country > Coworkers

When it comes to sports, both fans and players are super prideful. You need to realize that Argentina never won ANYTHING in basketball, before this generation of players. 15 years ago it was unthinkable that a player from Argentina, who historically sucked at Basketball, would play in the NBA and even less win 3 championships. So Manu, along with Nocioni, Oberto, Scola, etc basically know they're writing the history book of Argentina's basketball every time they play.
There's a reason they call them the Golden generation.

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I'm not sure what the odds are, but I think that Ginobili getting injured further is more probable than his leading Argentina to another gold medal.

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And you base this on what exactly? They're the defending Olympic champions, and the only team to beat team USA twice. They're playing under international rules that favor them. I think along with Spain, Greece and the US, they are candidates.

As far as I'm concerned, Manu can do whatever is within his right in his contract with the Spurs. This is a FACT.

I'm pretty sure he wouldn't play if he didn't feel like he could go at some sort of competitive level. Not only would he be risking his own long term health, but selfish in taking a spot in the Argentinian team that another player could've taken.

And from I what I've seen of Manu on the court, I couldn't label him as having a selfish personality. And this is fundamentally what people are questioning.

I say Go Manu. You have my benefit of the doubt.

Baring he hasn't a significant risk to turn his injury into a long-term one, that is to say at least season ending injury, I'm all for Manu playing the Olympics. That's areally big even for him.

However, I'm quite concerned about Manu's ankle. I wonder how bad is his arthritis and if it will hurt him in the long term.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

Family > Country > Coworkers

When it comes to sports, both fans and players are super prideful. You need to realize that Argentina never won ANYTHING in basketball, before this generation of players. 15 years ago it was unthinkable that a player from Argentina, who historically sucked at Basketball, would play in the NBA and even less win 3 championships. So Manu, along with Nocioni, Oberto, Scola, etc basically know they're writing the history book of Argentina's basketball every time they play.
There's a reason they call them the Golden generation.

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So automatically fans of the Spurs deserve to be held in a much lower regard than Argentinean fans of their NT?

You should put coworkers/boss, because we both know that part of the reason he is able to live comfortably with his family in his country in the offseason is because of his coworkers/boss. His salary should be a huge deal in this argument. It's a lot of money to me, you, Ginobili, the Spurs, etc.

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And you base this on what exactly? They're the defending Olympic champions, and the only team to beat team USA twice.

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Not the same US team now

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They're playing under international rules that favor them.

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Agree 100%

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I think along with Spain, Greece and the US, they are candidates.

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The Miami Heat may have been the NBA champions in 2006, but they got embarassed in 2007. That was year to year. I don't think that after 4 years, this team could have possibly stayed as sharp as in 2004. Every player has aged and/or injured and it seems that international teams do not shift their rosters around as much as, say, the US. Just my 2 cents though, I have no idea how it will turn out.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

You have a choice to be an olympian or take the summer off and see to it you come in ready to go for your team paying you millions of dollars.

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Manu has decided to be an Olympian, represents his country in the world's biggest stage and has a life outside the Spurs/NBA. He is exercising his basic rights. Who are we to deny someone something so fundamental, so human?

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

I actually agree with Mark Cuban on this one. Why should we pay these guys so much money and have them risk it all playing for another team in the summer?? The problem is guaranteed money here.

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Unlike us mere mortal, guaranteed money in NBA is in fact--dont hold your breath--LEGAL. Something legal is never a problem. If Mark Cuban does not want to pay guaranteed money, he can choose not to "play" in NBA.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

They get it, injured or healthy, so they can risk whatever the hell they want.

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Just because the NBA millionnaires have the money does not mean they can (or want) to risk their health. Your concise argument earlier is getting incoherent here. Have you been injured yourself? Do you consciously want to trade money with injury? I don't think so. Manu can play hurt. He cannot play injured. Relax. Manu is not our nor the Spurs' property.

dbreiden83080, I'm not asking this to be downright contrary. I just want to know. Do you have any confirmation that Manu is still hurt?

I just don't see what the fuss is all about. He already said before that if the injury turns out to be really serious (which we'll know in four or five days), he will sit it out. I don't think he said what he said to be spiteful and say "Fuck it. Injured or not, I'm going to play." To go from "more worried and concerned than all of you" to almost certain that he will be able to play in a span of two weeks, Manu must have significant reason to believe that indeed he is healthy enough. Besides, from the last column he wrote in his website, he says that the Spurs and Argentine doctors are already on the same page and working together with him. If they say he's fine, let the guy defend his medal.

Hey, can you post a link of that atricle?

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Originally Posted by Manufan909

Hey, can you post a link of that atricle?

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http://www.lanacion.com.ar/nota.asp?...6607&high=manu

Thanks

EDIT: And is there an english version somewhere?:(

Manu is playing regardless of how he feels. This was just the politically correct thing to do/say.

I love the Spurs already, but I love the fact they will not discuss any contract extension until after his Olympic play is over. Obviously we don't want him if he shows continued wear on that ankle, and has a terrible outing or even worse re-injures it.

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Originally Posted by Manufan909

Hey, can you post a link of that atricle?

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http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100391

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Originally Posted by urunobili

(I think he wrote all this at the airport when boarding to go to San Antonio)

“Being the flag bearer is a distinction that I can’t enjoy; my head is everywhere right now”

By Manu

I am at full speed right now and doing several things in my visit to Buenos Aires, being there for my commercial compromises and leaving to San Antonio in a couple of hours. There were some changes regarding my rehab with the ankle and I had to set up this trip almost urgently. As the work and treatment on the ankle is finished and now I need a final injection to lower the tendon size on the ankle, the doctors thought it was more convenient if I do this in San Antonio

Luckily, now the specialists here and the ones hired by the Spurs are agreeing and thinking the same way. The fact that both parties are now on the same page alleviates me a big deal. It also favors me having this trip earlier than originally scheduled in 4, 5 days from now, because that way, I could start with the preparation earlier and go to the training camp in Rosario next Friday.

We now have to wait the results of the injection; it won’t be immediate because I’ll have to immobilize the ankle for 4 days after it. If everything goes well, great, otherwise we’ll have to make a decision about my trip to Beijing. Furthermore, it wasn’t any good wait too long because the spur that I had on the ankle could make me lose strength on my leg’s muscles. Things changed now, but we are all lucky that everybody agrees on the following steps to follow and it is also possible that the Spurs kinesiologyst travel with me to check on the rehab and workouts.

So far, i have done all the treatments that were recommended during my days in Bahia Blanca, and that wasn’t a show stopper for me to get good rest, spend a lot of time with family and friends and ate all the “asados” (barbecues) I wanted.

Anyhow, the situation is not easy. Uncertainty is big and in this moment I am more concerned about my ankle than of the Olympics. I don’t even know which teams we have friendly matches scheduled against in our preparation tour. The only thing I want is to heal, be fine and start training because I already lost a lot of time. Normally, ten days before camp I start running and weight lifting, but this time I couldn’t. that’s one of the things bothering me already.

I generally don’t have a tendency to gain weight because of inactivity and before Japan’s World cup, 4 weeks of intense training was enough for me to be fine. But this time is different because my ankle has been immobilized and I have walked very little. I didn’t do any physical activity.

Spurs being worried is very logic. We had a couple of phone calls with Pop the first week and then just a couple of emails to coordinate my trip.

It has been brought to my attention that some people are saying that I don’t want Togo to the Olympics. Unfortunately I can’t convince all first hand of the opposite, but Confederation Front Office, my teammates, the coaching staff, the doctors here and in San Antonio and my family know very well that I am doing all possibly to be in Beijing. If they don’t believe that I can’t do anything for them.

In regards to the condition of being the flag bearer that the Argentinean Olympic committee has just designated for me, it does not mean additional pressure because I still have the same willingness to play that I always had. The flag does not change my objective. It isn’t also a distinction that I could enjoy today or even get to understand. I have my head somewhere else. When the time passes by I will probable value that fact that the flag will be give to me by the president next Friday at Cenard (Argentinean High Performance Sports Facility). Surely the 8th August in Beijing, I will know what it means and I will feel a great emotion and happiness.

I do not want to say goodbye without referring to Ruben Wolkowyski’s declarations in the press. The first thing I want to say is that I don’t share his opinion and the coaching staff has my absolute support. Those were critics that do not bring anything and have little sense to be said on this moment. I hope that this doesn’t affect the team. Probably he being left out for this team provoked his anger and that’s why he said it.

Past tomorrow I’ll be back to join the team at Rosario’s camp. I hope everything goes fine. For now, I have great expectations and a big uncertainty.

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Manu wants to play and I'm fine with it.

Play and win Manu

I could care less whether he plays or not.

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Originally Posted by v2freak

So automatically fans of the Spurs deserve to be held in a much lower regard than Argentinean fans of their NT?

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He's a native from Argentina. What do you think?
Kobe said it best: When you play for your team you're just representing a market. When you play for the NT you're representing your entire country.
That's not to say that Manu doesn't care about Spurs fans. He cares enough to earn less money to play with our team. But if you put him in a bind to select between San Antonio vs Argentina, he'll pick the latter 10 out of 10 times.

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Originally Posted by v2freak

You should put coworkers/boss, because we both know that part of the reason he is able to live comfortably with his family in his country in the offseason is because of his coworkers/boss. His salary should be a huge deal in this argument. It's a lot of money to me, you, Ginobili, the Spurs, etc.

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He does his job throughout the year. He's been bailing out co-workers (Hedo, Finley) that can't came off the bench for years. He's a talented player. You seem to ignore that if he wouldn't be working for us, he would be working for another NBA team, or even an Euro team, where he won't have to deal with all this bitching and still have a very comfortable offseason with his family.
So let's just be grateful the guy came over back in '02 and played VERY hard for our team to win 3 championships.

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Originally Posted by v2freak

Not the same US team now

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It's not about Team USA. It's about playing (probably for the last time) an Olympic competition with a team that's been together for a decade or more, and that is writing Argentina's basketball history.

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Originally Posted by v2freak

The Miami Heat may have been the NBA champions in 2006, but they got embarassed in 2007. That was year to year. I don't think that after 4 years, this team could have possibly stayed as sharp as in 2004. Every player has aged and/or injured and it seems that international teams do not shift their rosters around as much as, say, the US. Just my 2 cents though, I have no idea how it will turn out.

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I have not idea how it will turn out either. But when you looked at the '04 Olympic team, it was pretty much the same as looking at this US team: Iverson, Duncan, Wade, Lebron, Carmelo, Boozer, Odom, etc.
That's why they play the games...

LINK

"Es un momento bastante especial. No saben el honor y la alegría que siento en este momento por haber sido elegido como representante del grupo increíble de atletas que va a estar en Beijing", dijo Manu tras recibir la bandera de manos de la Presidenta.

"El sueño de cada atleta es competir en los Juegos Olímpicos. Yo encima estoy representando a 35 ó 40 millones de personas. El honor es enorme y el orgullo es incalculable, así que haré lo posible para estar ahí", concluyó Ginóbili, quien esta mañana regresó de Estados Unidos, donde fue revisado por el cuerpo médico de San Antonio Spurs. El zurdo terminó la temporada de la NBA con una lesión en el tobillo izquierdo y aún no está confirmada su presencia en Beijing 2008.

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"This is a very special moment. I feel honored and happy to be selected the representative of this group of incredible athletes that are heading to Beijing.", said Manu after receiving the flag from the President.

"The dream of every athlete is to compete in the Olympics. I'm also representing 35 to 40 million people. The honor is huge and the pride incalculable, so I'll do what I can to be there", he concluded.
Ginobili returned this morning from the US, where he was examined by the Spur's medical staff. The lefty ended the NBA season with an injury in his left ankle, and his presence in Beijing is still not confirmed.

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Originally Posted by Brutalis

Manu is playing regardless of how he feels. This was just the politically correct thing to do/say.

I love the Spurs already, but I love the fact they will not discuss any contract extension until after his Olympic play is over. Obviously we don't want him if he shows continued wear on that ankle, and has a terrible outing or even worse re-injures it.

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Today, Manu say in the NT press conference that if he feels bad in Spain, he's gonig back to San Antonio. Obviously they want him for more years.

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Originally Posted by ElNono

He's a native from Argentina. What do you think?
Kobe said it best: When you play for your team you're just representing a market. When you play for the NT you're representing your entire country.
That's not to say that Manu doesn't care about Spurs fans. He cares enough to earn less money to play with our team. But if you put him in a bind to select between San Antonio vs Argentina, he'll pick the latter 10 out of 10 times.


He does his job throughout the year. He's been bailing out co-workers (Hedo, Finley) that can't came off the bench for years. He's a talented player. You seem to ignore that if he wouldn't be working for us, he would be working for another NBA team, or even an Euro team, where he won't have to deal with all this bitching and still have a very comfortable offseason with his family.
So let's just be grateful the guy came over back in '02 and played VERY hard for our team to win 3 championships.

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So when does pride become nationalism? I've seen the two be applied to the exact same situation, although one is held in a much more positive light. And the Spurs drafted Ginobili at a ridiculously low number. Had the Spurs not taken a chance on Ginobili, I don't know where he'd be right now. There's also an argument that he's developed tremendously as a player playing next to Duncan, learning the Spurs system and performing against the bad.

Some homers here act like Ginobili single-handedly led the Spurs to 3 championships. He was absolutely critical in 2005 when Duncan was limping - I'll give you that. Without him, the Spurs would not have pulled it out. Still interesting why he only had good games when Duncan did though.

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It's not about Team USA. It's about playing (probably for the last time) an Olympic competition with a team that's been together for a decade or more, and that is writing Argentina's basketball history.


I have not idea how it will turn out either. But when you looked at the '04 Olympic team, it was pretty much the same as looking at this US team: Iverson, Duncan, Wade, Lebron, Carmelo, Boozer, Odom, etc.
That's why they play the games...

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Just explaining why I don't think they will have the same type of success.

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When it comes to sports, both fans and players are super prideful. You need to realize that Argentina never won ANYTHING in basketball, before this generation of players.

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mmmm... do you know wich was the first country to win the world tittle in basketball???

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argenti...asketball_team


Besides that... I believe that Manu knows pretty well that an injury on this olympics could cause big damage to his relationship with the spurs and his career , also he is aware that our nt needs him and that this could be his last chance representing our country.
He is a fighter who ALWAYS wants to win (and to show that he decided to play and put aside the bad relationship he has with the argie coach)... I love the spurs and I love Manu, it would suck if he gets hurt... but I know he will do anything to take good care of himself and get the gold medal.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

What you can control is avoiding the odds of suffering one

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you can avoid the odds, but you cant control the odds. there is a big difference.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

The problem is guaranteed money here. They get it, injured or healthy, so they can risk whatever the hell they want.

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the spurs money isnt at risk, because manu has mandatory insurance for the olympics. if manu gets injured at the olympics, the spurs dont pay a penny; if he gets injured during the season, then they foot the bill (although they probably have insurance for that too.)

so the issue isnt money at all, its performance, and you have no way of knowing how manu, or any other spur, will perform next season.

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Originally Posted by dbreiden83080

Manu's job entails being a great athlete, not having his ass chained to a desk, surely you see a diference there?? Some people have it in their contracts that they can't ride motorcycles, in the offseason, and if they get hurt bye bye salary. That is having fun in the offseason isn't it??

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kind of. manu's job entails being a great BASKETBALL PLAYER. how do you think he became one? by sitting on his ass in the summer? or maybe, by PLAYING BASKETBALL? he's not out riding motorcycles.

Pop (and Kori) said it best- playing organized basketball is the best case scenario for manu.

but please, dont mind reason, carry on complaining about a problem that doesnt exist (oh no, the risk!), and when manu does have a career ending injury, most probably playing for the spurs, tell yourself that it was argentina's fault and that the spurs paid for the right.