Grades - Spurs vs. Celtics Mar. 20

Tim Duncan C+
He looked somewhat better physically but nowhere near the championship-level Duncan we know and love.

Tony Parker B+
Those four missed free throws at the end of the game ruined his otherwise stellar performance.

Roger Mason, Jr. D+
His defense was poor and he struggled offensively in most facets of the game.

Matt Bonner B+
Bonner played well but he's not spreading the court as much as he needs to for the Spurs.

Michael Finley C
Defensively, Finley was actually above average but his bad shooting and missed free throws hurt.

George Hill A-
I thought his defense was absolutely fantastic for much of his 22 minutes of action.

Bruce Bowen A-
This might have been the best D we've seen from Bowen since the All-Star break.

Kurt Thomas B+
Did a great job on defense and on the boards, though could have helped a bit more offensively.

Drew Gooden B
Got in the way a few times here and there but looked to be on the road to understanding Spurs Basketball.

Ime Udoka B
Only played a few minutes but he made a few plays on the defensive end.

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Please submit your own grades for this game. I will post the cumulative SpursTalk.com grades in two hours from the time of this post.

(Grading now closed. Results below.)

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SpursTalk's Average Grades

Tim Duncan C+

Tony Parkerhttp://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif A-

Roger Mason, Jr.http://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif C-

Matt Bonnerhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif B-

Michael Finleyhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif C-

George Hillhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif B

Bruce Bowenhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif B+

Kurt Thomashttp://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif A-

Drew Goodenhttp://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif B+

Ime Udokahttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif C+

Interesting twist to the game thoughts package. :tu

No grade for Popovich?

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Originally Posted by mexicanjunior

No grade for Popovich?

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Good idea. I'll add that for next game.

Is the grade survey new? I hadn't seen it before.

TP deserves at least an A-!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:downspin:

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Originally Posted by Libri

Is the grade survey new? I hadn't seen it before.

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Yeah. Test driving it to see whether it should be made a full-time feature or not.

Great one timvp

Yup, Bowen Deserves an A, Pierce was destroyed!

Great idea! Do we still get INSTANTREACTION????????

You'd think they would have won with those grades at home?


and George Hill's stats certainly don't indicate he had a good game...

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Originally Posted by timvp

Michael Finley C
Defensively, Finley was actually above average but his bad shooting and missed free throws hurt.

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Pop had to be happy with his defensive effort tonight. His defense has actually been good these last 3 games despite his crap shooting spell in that span.

Love the game recaps, initial reactions, or grades. Thanks for doing them. :blah

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Originally Posted by bugmenot

Great idea! Do we still get INSTANTREACTION????????

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Yes. :reading

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George Hill A-
I thought his defense was absolutely fantastic for much of his 22 minutes of action.

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Hill is getting better and better if he can add a reliable J to his game he'll be very good

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Originally Posted by Spurs Brazil

Hill is getting better and better if he can add a reliable J to his game he'll be very good

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I liked how he tried to run with Allen and stay in front of him but he was pretty much non-existent on offense.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Tim Duncan C+
He looked somewhat better physically but nowhere near the championship-level Duncan we know and love.

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timvp, if this trend continues (a la David Robinson), does this shoot some mighty big holes in the big "2010 everybody come play for the Spurs and win a title" theory? Wouldn't the FO be wise to start making a plan B, or do they expect these nagging injuries to clear up in the future?

imo TP deserved a better grade then B+ tonight so I gave him a higher grade. IF it wasn't for him I don't know how we could have stayed in the game with Boston, I admit I was angry when he missed those free throws at the end but I think he was completely out of gas. He wasn't getting any lift for his legs on those free throw shoots. I really do think it was more fatigue then choke for him tonight.

Tony was good offensively, aside from the missed free throws. But defensively, Tony wasn't very good.

Roger Mason and Drew Gooden were ineffective on both ends.

Outside of those guys, the Defense was actually pretty good but offense was offemsive.

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Originally Posted by Allanon

Tony was good offensively, aside from the missed free throws. But defensively, Tony wasn't very good.

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I think give Rondo those open Js were the plan

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Originally Posted by Spurs Brazil

I think give Rondo those open Js were the plan

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Ah, thankyou for the clarification, that is a good gameplan since Rondo is pretty inconsistent with his J.

Rondo also had a quiet 12 assists.

gooden played well, he was +8 the whole game. when he was in, spurs were able to tread water and make a small run. i would like to see him play a slightly larger role with smarter plays. he rebounded well and got to the free throw line. thomas, bowen, and hill played well defensively but provided no relief to the the sputtering offense. mason and finley, the supposed sharp shooters, did not step up.

I'm not sure if you get sick of hearing it, but thanks for all of the analysis, LJ!

As others have mentioned, good grades for what otherwise was a losing effort. I'm just watching the game now, but it sounds like the Spurs put up a good effort, just fell short and missed their chance at the end.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Matt Bonner B+
Bonner played well but he's not spreading the court as much as he needs to for the Spurs.

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:lmao

Bonner: 30 Minutes 7 points 7 Rebounds
Gooden: 16 Minutes 7 points 7 rebounds

If Bonner isn't going to continuously fight to free himself for jump shots then he's a liability, because he defense sucks.

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Originally Posted by mexicanjunior

I liked how he tried to run with Allen and stay in front of him but he was pretty much non-existent on offense.

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I will take Hill's defense over Mason when he is missing shots because Mason's defense can go from average to poor at times. If Mason isn't hitting shots and playing average defense I'd rather Pop get Hill out there and sit Mason.

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Originally Posted by Dex

I'm not sure if you get sick of hearing it, but thanks for all of the analysis, LJ!

As others have mentioned, good grades for what otherwise was a losing effort. I'm just watching the game now, but it sounds like the Spurs put up a good effort, just fell short and missed their chance at the end.

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+ 1

thanks for your analysis Timvp

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Originally Posted by celldweller

:lmao

Bonner: 30 Minutes 7 points 7 Rebounds
Gooden: 16 Minutes 7 points 7 rebounds

If Bonner isn't going to continuously fight to free himself for jump shots then he's a liability, because he defense sucks.

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Bonner was playing against the starters, IIRC.

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Originally Posted by tp2021

Bonner was playing against the starters, IIRC.

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I repeat "Bonner's Defense Sucks" IIRC :ihit

One of the more disturbing things about this loss was Garnett not even playing the 4th quarter. It was like Rivers was just experimenting to see if his team without Garnett could handle the Spurs, I guess they passed the test...

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Originally Posted by Texas 2 Step

Entire team FAIL! We have a bunch of mental midgets on our team. TP missed four ft.........a game we needed. This team is done, I can see us falling down to the 5-8 seed, which would be pointless. Tank the season, take the lottery pick.

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The chicken head, cursing(well, insulting but i was close) Spurs poster I described in the missed fts thread. They are all over the place.:lol

And like celldweller, I was suprised Gooden got the same number of pts/boards in half the time. Can't wait til he starts consistently playing 25+ minutes like Bonner has. If he does, he'll have to play half of that with with Tim. Can't wait to see that, and find out which 13 min he is more productive.

And I'm annoyed at Matts crappy 3pt shooting, but the law of averages seems to be at work. If it's truly Gooden looming, then he doesn't deserve the starting spot. Give it to KT or Fab, who won't wilt under the threat of less time on the court.

What do you think timvp, is it law or gooden?

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Originally Posted by celldweller

I repeat "Bonner's Defense Sucks" IIRC :ihit

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I'm pretty sure Gooden was never matched up on Garnett. Either way, Garnett only had 10 points, and if that's all Bonner's going to give up, I'll take it.

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Originally Posted by mexicanjunior

One of the more disturbing things about this loss was Garnett not even playing the 4th quarter. It was like Rivers was just experimenting to see if his team without Garnett could handle the Spurs, I guess they passed the test...

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I would counter that by saying Pop's experiment to see if the team can stay afloat without Manu for extended periods, is a HUGE SUCCESS.

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Originally Posted by tp2021

I'm pretty sure Gooden was never matched up on Garnett. Either way, Garnett only had 10 points, and if that's all Bonner's going to give up, I'll take it.

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Garnett only played 15 minutes...

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Originally Posted by tp2021

I'm pretty sure Gooden was never matched up on Garnett. Either way, Garnett only had 10 points, and if that's all Bonner's going to give up, I'll take it.

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I just hope:pop: Pop at least gives Gooden a chance to showcase his ability.:worthy:

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Originally Posted by tp2021

I would counter that by saying Pop's experiment to see if the team can stay afloat without Manu for extended periods, is a HUGE SUCCESS.

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I don't think Manu being out is by choice...River's could have easily put Garnett in to help his team and decided to let it ride with role players. If Pop had that luxury with Manu, he wouldn't be sitting the entire 4th quarter.

Hey, how would everyone describe Gooden on O and D this game. I couldn't watch the game, and I'm curious as to how many post up pts he got, as well as jumpers.

I've watched the game with a friend at his place. I really don't understand ST.

We played a Boston team with all the starters Allen Rondo KG and Pierce against a Spurs team w/o Manu, Tim not 100% healthy, Gooden with just 4 games in the legs and shooting 52% at the FTs there is nothing to be ashamed of.

Believe instead of bashing !

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Originally Posted by Brazil

I've watched the game with a friend at his place. I really don't understand ST.

We played a Boston team with all the starters Allen Rondo KG and Pierce against a Spurs team w/o Manu, Tim not 100% healthy, Gooden with just 4 games in the legs and shooting 52% at the FTs there is nothing to be ashamed of.

Believe instead of bashing !

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I might not lose my calm like most here, but 50% fts is to be ashamed of, might as well let Shaq take them.

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Originally Posted by Manufan909

I might not lose my calm like most here, but 50% fts is to be ashamed of, might as well let Shaq take them.

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What I'm saying is we are not going to shoot 50% FTs in a regular basis, this kind of bad stat happen nothing alarming. In 82 games how many games the spurs shoot at 50% FTs ? one ? two ? this is one of this game.

I think the grades were much worse and timvp needs to watch a game completely.

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Originally Posted by Brazil

What I'm saying is we are not going to shoot 50% FTs in a regular basis, this kind of bad stat happen nothing alarming. In 82 games how many games the spurs shoot at 50% FTs ? one ? two ? this is one of this game.

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Dude, we're focusing on this ONE GAME. And for this particular game, the Spurs combined to shoot 3 or so percentage points over Shaqs avg in fts. Fuck, his ft avg this season is better than that, by 10%.:depressed

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Originally Posted by Manufan909

Dude, we're focusing on this ONE GAME. And for this particular game, the Spurs combined to shoot 3 or so percentage points over Shaqs avg in fts. Fuck, his ft avg this season is better than that, by 10%.:depressed

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Dude we are not going to make a nervous breakdown because we choked at the FT line in RS. I would understand a meltdown if it was a PO game but not a fucking RS game.

How can you take my posts as a meltdown??? And you should have put have instead of make. Also ST will always have a meltdown after a loss, no matter what. I'm waiting for awhile to look at all the threads so I can dodge all the bitching and moaning. Only grades/instant reaction/gts are safe.:lol

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Originally Posted by tlongII

You'd think they would have won with those grades at home?


and George Hill's stats certainly don't indicate he had a good game...

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Yes. But in this game, the Celtics just scored better grades.

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Originally Posted by Ice009

I will take Hill's defense over Mason when he is missing shots because Mason's defense can go from average to poor at times. If Mason isn't hitting shots and playing average defense I'd rather Pop get Hill out there and sit Mason.

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+1

But aside from TP, and TD occasionally, no other player in the Spurs line-up was consistent in offense. Especially from the 3 :depressed

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Originally Posted by SequSpur

I think the grades were much worse and timvp needs to watch a game completely.

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hes right with most.

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Originally Posted by Manufan909

Only grades/instant reaction/gts are safe.:lol

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On this point we agree :toast

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Originally Posted by Brazil

Dude we are not going to make a nervous breakdown because we choked at the FT line in RS. I would understand a meltdown if it was a PO game but not a fucking RS game.

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And you forgot they choked on 3s too. Idk about you but I didn't choke on anything. Does Brazil=Finley?:rollin

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Originally Posted by Brazil

On this point we agree :toast

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Half isn't bad. Even if it's the insignificant point.
:flag:

Cool addition to game thoughts and initial reaction.

I spend most of the game raving about George Hill's defense. He is a young Bruce Bowen. No exaggeration. And Bowen looked great too. That 4th quarter line up which included Hill and Bowen was actually looking good. Deflating ending, but Hill was all over Allen. Bowen blanketed Pierce. Fun to watch.

SpursTalk's Average Grades

Tim Duncan C+

Tony Parkerhttp://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif A-

Roger Mason, Jr.http://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif C-

Matt Bonnerhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif B-

Michael Finleyhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif C-

George Hillhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif B

Bruce Bowenhttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif B+

Kurt Thomashttp://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif A-

Drew Goodenhttp://spurstalk.com/up_arrow.gif B+

Ime Udokahttp://spurstalk.com/down_arrow.gif C+

Damn, you guys really disagreed with what I saw out of Hill :lol

Thanks to all who participated :tu

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Originally Posted by timvp

Damn, you guys really disagreed with what I saw out of Hill :lol

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I think people are real pissed and pessimistic.

I was too late! :cry

Awesome tho I will keep an eye on this.

Tony can't get an A..he played a great game, but you just can't get an A if you choke at the line when your team needs you..I understand he was tired from carrying us, but you HAVE to hit your free throws when it matters..especially when you make NONE out of 4..

also, the Celtics are the defending champs, nothing to be embarrassed about..apparently a lot of you have forgotten the fact that we beat Boston on the road when both teams were healthy..it wasn't that long ago..

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

Tony can't get an A..he played a great game, but you just can't get an A if you choke at the line when your team needs you..I understand he was tired from carrying us, but you HAVE to hit your free throws when it matters..especially when you make NONE out of 4..

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SpursTalk gave him an A- ... but yeah I agree with your premise.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Tim Duncan C+
He looked somewhat better physically but nowhere near the championship-level Duncan we know and love.

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I think we'll see that Tim Duncan in all due time.

LOL @ RMJ and Parker's grades rising while Hills decreased.

el
oh
el

as if George Hill didnt deserve at least a B+

Cool is this going for every game?

bench overall grade vs starters? :stirpot:

George deserves better, his tenacity on defense was great, especially for a rookie. Plus he had some nice drives. He played his role, what else could he have done?

Our defense didn't pretty damn good. Offesense was a different story.

This was a gimmie, sad loss.

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Originally Posted by wuss cones

Cool is this going for every game?

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I'll try it out for the next few games to decide whether it's worthwhile or not.