Initial Reactions: Spurs vs. Mavs - Game 1

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Originally Posted by timvp

The dumbest part about that Bonner play is that if didn't flop (or play for the offensive foul, however you want to look at it) and just stood his ground, Dampier probably miss. Damp has no post game and his one move is an ugly hook that he usually misses. Bonner is strong enough to hold his ground against Damp and make him do anything other than dunk it on him.

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yup. his late hedge on barea where he knocked out ime was embarassing too, plus his steal on dirk only to throw it right to kidd. just an embarassing performance.

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Originally Posted by timvp

The dumbest part about that Bonner play is that if didn't flop (or play for the offensive foul, however you want to look at it) and just stood his ground, Dampier probably miss. Damp has no post game and his one move is an ugly hook that he usually misses. Bonner is strong enough to hold his ground against Damp and make him do anything other than dunk it on him.

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Damp's also a terrible free throw shooter. If nothing else, keep your feet under you and just foul him if he gets any better position. You can't really defend a dunk from your ass. Bonner was a fool for thinking he was going to get a call like that. Again, item 137 on the list of Matt Bonner criticisms.

tonight showed why Ron Howard is the only ginger in history to do anything good.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

When a starter doesn't play any defense, gets one rebound, doesn't block shots, gets one shot attempt IN THE WHOLE GAME, doesn't draw fouls, doesn't go to the line, and plays five minutes in the fourth quarter where a four point deficit turns into a ten point deficit, only a 100 percent dumbass wouldn't think that is a considerable part of an 8 point loss.

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:toast

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Originally Posted by Mugen

tonight showed why Ron Howard is the only ginger in history to do anything good.

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http://www.insidesocal.com/tomhoffarth/33-11121-F.jpg

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Originally Posted by Mugen

that was the worst flop ive ever seen from a spur.

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i concur. so much worse than anything Manu ever pulled. and big men just shouldn't flop at all.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

"If an offensive player causes contact with a defensive player who has estab-lished a legal position, an offensive foul shall be called and no points may be scored."

Nowhere in the NBA rulebook is there a distinction drawn between lowering one's shoulder and backing into a player. Bonner had established a legal defensive position in an area where the no-charge circle wasn't a factor. Offensive foul.

Of all the things Matt Bonner did in the game that I'm extraordinarily pissed about, that defensive job on Dampier, which resulted in only two points, is WAY fucking down on my bitch list.

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So anytime a guy isn't giving ground to an offensive player who he's bainging there should be an offensive foul called? IMO, you have to use your best judgement as an official otherwise there'd be a lot more of those calls made in the NBA even without guys falling to the ground premeditatively.

It's not at the top of my list either, but I figured I'd chime in. Not fighting over smaller guards setting screens on you and allowing your starting PG to get demolished as a result is pretty high up there though.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

http://www.insidesocal.com/tomhoffarth/33-11121-F.jpg

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tell that to his knees.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

Damp's also a terrible free throw shooter. If nothing else, keep your feet under you and just foul him if he gets any better position. You can't really defend a dunk from your ass. Bonner was a fool for thinking he was going to get a call like that. Again, item 137 on the list of Matt Bonner criticisms.

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:lol you reference a list of criticisms for a roleplayer?

I could make a list of 100 criticisms for mike finley or kurt thomas, hell there's plenty of shit Bruce Bowen could be criticised for. they're roleplayers they have flaws. Good one :donkey

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Originally Posted by NewJerSpur

So anytime a guy isn't giving ground to an offensive player who he's bainging there should be an offensive foul called? IMO, you have to use your best judgement as an official otherwise there'd be a lot more of those calls made in the NBA even without guys falling to the ground premeditatively.

It's not at the top of my list either, but I figured I'd chime in. Not fighting over smaller guards setting screens on you and allowing your starting PG to get demolished as a result is pretty high up there though.

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Dude, that quote is directly from the NBA rulebook. Why more guys don't just stand their ground in the post is puzzling to me. If someone tried that with Duncan, he'd go right around them or shoot while they had their feet flat on the ground. Dampier is not an elite post player, he was just lucky to have an even worse defender on him who has no credibility whatsoever with the zebras.

Who are the Spurs ?

The Spurs are Tim Duncan, Manu Ginobili, Tony Parker... and some guys who know their role and accept it.
Without 1 of the big 3, the team concept of the Spurs is fucked !

The Spurs are not the better team without Manu, period.

The Mavs have some great players and are healthy !

The Spurs will need to play out of their minds to beat the Mavs in a seven-game series.

I hope they will !

:flag::flag::flag:

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Originally Posted by z0sa

:lol you reference a list of criticisms for a roleplayer?

I could make a list of 100 criticisms for mike finley or kurt thomas, hell there's plenty of shit Bruce Bowen could be criticised for on offense. they're roleplayers they have flaws. Good one :donkey

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No wonder Matt Bonner had a bad game; he had to drag you around with your mouth attached to his fucking nut-sack.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

No wonder Matt Bonner had a bad game; he had to drag you around with your mouth attached to his fucking nut-sack.

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defending a player from unmerited personal attack doesn't = on his nutsack.

:lol at personally insulting me now just because you're guilty of being a total douchebag. shouldn't you go back to making your lists of role player criticisms? Perhaps starting an exciting new addition on kyle Korver or nick collison or josh powell now?

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

Dude, that quote is directly from the NBA rulebook. Why more guys don't just stand their ground in the post is puzzling to me. If someone tried that with Duncan, he'd go right around them or shoot while they had their feet flat on the ground. Dampier is not an elite post player, he was just lucky to have an even worse defender on him who has no credibility whatsoever with the zebras.

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I agree with you OV about Damp. I'm just saying that it'd be impossible to go by the letter of the law on plays like that because most of the league would be in foul trouble for most of a lot of games (against teams with decent post play anyway). That's why it's up to refs to make judgement calls on the matter.

The Mavs, yet again, exposed the same defensive flaws, as they did in the WCSF series 3 years ago. Sure, some of the names have changed for both sides, but the results are the same. The Mavs had unquestionably too many playmakers then, when Pop tried shuffling Bowen from one hot Mav to the next. Three years later, it looks like nothing has changed at all.

I find it absolutely unacceptable that the Spurs have not improved their roster, such that they can better defend the many shot-makers the Mavs have. The sad thing is the Mavs are almost as old as the Spurs, yet look shockingly more athletic.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

No wonder Matt Bonner had a bad game; he had to drag you around with your mouth attached to his fucking nut-sack.

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I think it's pretty clear that Zosa is a Bonner relative.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

The Mavs, yet again, exposed the same defensive flaws, as they did in the WCSF series 3 years ago. Sure, some of the names have changed for both sides, but the results are the same. The Mavs had unquestionably too many playmakers then, when Pop tried shuffling Bowen from one hot Mav to the next.

I find it absolutely unacceptable that the Spurs have not improved their roster, such that they can better defend the many shot-makers the Mavs have. The sad thing is the Mavs are almost as old as the Spurs, yet look shockingly more athletic.

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The more frustrating thing is that the Spurs have made some adjustments since 2006, but one of our best solutions is rotting on the bench, and when Pop does decides to finally stick to playing big, we beg for small ball since it means less Bonner.

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Originally Posted by EricB

Bonner has to be Benoed.

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Wow about fucking time you've finally realized it.

some random thoughts on this game:

- Way too harsh on Bonner: he played decent defense on Dirk and at least didn't try to shoot only one attempt.
- Josh Howard killed us not Barea.
- TP playig 41 mn is way too much, he doesn't have the style of game to play efficient 41 mn.
- I can't believe we lost while shooting 78% on the 3, BTW why when we sot 80% on the 3 we shot only 14 times I've seen some spurs games at less than 30% shooting with 20 - 25 attempts.
- This loss is on Pop incapacity to find a decent solution for running the point while TP is on the bench.

Bottom line, we need youth even if it is at the cost of some mental errors.

Watching Barea get into the lane at will, Bass scoring over whoever guarded him, Howard getting whatever he wanted, Dampier roughing us on the offensive boards is painful. Bowen did contain Terry to some extent and Dirk was in foul trouble, but their role players are 10X more athletic than ours.

What we needed was George Hill causing havoc on D and breaking down their D. How the F can Carlisle trust Barea while Pop can't bring himself to trust the more athletic and talented Hill? What we need is another swingman to put on Howard when it's obvious Finley can't contain him.

Pop has indeed maximized the potential of this team by winning 54 games in the regular season, but I'd have traded that for a 6 or 7 seed if it meant having more depth and youth, even if that youth has played (and even lost) some more regular season games.

When we lost 3 of the first 4 in 2006, I still liked the way we were playing and felt we could win the series. Watching this game made me question whether the Spurs would actually win the one game I predicted they would win in the series.

Our defense is simply shit. Mavs in 5. Maybe 4. This sucks.

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Originally Posted by z0sa

defending a player from unmerited personal attack doesn't = on his nutsack.

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Waiting for one example of a personal attack I've EVER made against Matt Bonner, who I am defending in this particular thread. The personal attacks started when you posted the jackass emoticon, fucktard. Don't cry about it now that you can't handle it.

You got your panties in a twist when I mentioned that failing to stop Dampier from dunking is way down on the list of shit Matt has done wrong. I've spent most of the season defending Matt, as his positional defense is usually pretty good, and he manages to get open and isn't afraid to keep taking shots. He hustles for rebounds and runs the floor hard. He didn't do any of that tonight, and you've been running around any thread you can find to go out of your way to defend him, even attempting to point at plus minus numbers, which failed miserably. Everybody that's been on tonight sees what you are doing, so trying to explain it away or distract from it by suggesting I'm being mean isn't really going to help.

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Originally Posted by Brazil

- I can't believe we lost while shooting 78% on the 3, BTW why when we sot 80% on the 3 we shot only 14 times I've seen some spurs games at less than 30% shooting with 20 - 25 attempts.

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I don't recall seeing the Spurs take a three that wasn't within the flow of the game. They were all very high quality shots, which improves the likelihood that they go in. Start looking for excuses to take them and the percentage plummets. The reason they shoot 13-36 some nights is because you almost never get 36 quality looks at a three in a game.

Only thing discomcerting here ...is that vintage games from Finley and Duncan (especially) was wasted.
Still think spurs win but the defense needs to be vintge Spurs as well ...
Mavs great game let's see if you have 7 more and hopefully we can meet in the WCF

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

Waiting for one example of a personal attack I've EVER made against Matt Bonner, who I am defending in this particular thread. The personal attacks started when you posted the jackass emoticon, fucktard. Don't cry about it now that you can't handle it.

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:donkey

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You got your panties in a twist when I mentioned that failing to stop Dampier from dunking is way down on the list of shit Matt has done wrong. I've spent most of the season defending Matt, as his positional defense is usually pretty good, and he manages to get open and isn't afraid to keep taking shots. He hustles for rebounds and runs the floor hard. He didn't do any of that tonight, and you've been running around any thread you can find to go out of your way to defend him, even attempting to point at plus minus numbers, which failed miserably. Everybody that's been on tonight sees what you are doing, so trying to explain it away or distract from it by suggesting I'm being mean isn't really going to help.

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I admitted Bonner had a bad game. :huh

Again, there's a difference between critiquing a player and what's going on here - a total meltdown after a single bad playoff game, really his first. I have the right until I'm banned, to post where I want and defend whom I choose. So stop acting like you weren't being serious when you talked about that mental list of yours concerning Bonner.