Initial Reaction: Spurs @ Mavs - Game 4

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Originally Posted by loveforthegame

It's two different game plans at work and Dallas is winning hands down.

The Spurs are happy with taking Dirk and Terry out of the equation and letting everyone else beat them. Those guys are getting open looks consistently and have brought more hunger and energy. They believe and when they smell blood they go for the kill. It's given them confidence to be left open time after time and they're feeding off of it. Props to them for stepping up.

The Mavs are probably laughing in the locker room when they see Duncan and Parker do all the scoring. Oh they talk about wanting to stop Parker but they could care less if he scores 60 if it means no one else is doing any damage and they still lose. They have to be thrilled watching our two weapons do all the damage while all the role players get an open look or two or just stand around and watch the Parker-Duncan show. It's a shame they're not doing more defensively, or getting on the boards, and bringing some energy of their own, even though they're not involved offensively.

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Yup...this is why the Spurs are struggling in this series...that, and Pop is on crack. :lol

It is disgusting how important rebounding is in this series. The Spurs, if they have any hope of winning any games, must win the battle of the boards.

It is not that Dallas's defensive game plan is genius. The Spurs are getting plenty of good offensive situations (TP penetration, TD isolations, open looks for role players), but they are not stepping up outside of TP.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

It is not that Dallas's defensive game plan is genius. The Spurs are getting plenty of good offensive situations (TP penetration, TD isolations, open looks for role players), but they are not stepping up outside of TP.

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Yeah, I agree with this. Some are insinuating that the Mavs have tried to take out the role players. I haven't see any evidence of that.

The same shots are available that were available in Game 1. The problem is that if Parker or Duncan don't carry the offensive load, the team just stops scoring. For example, to start the third quarter Parker and Duncan went to the role players for some help. But after they either missed or refused to shoot, Parker and Duncan realized it was either take over the game or get blown out.

Some random thoughts:

There's been a lot of talk about how much Bonner has choked. I'm not disagreeing with that. In one of the threads before the series began I thought he would be fairly useless. However, he does play much better at home. If we bench everyone that choked last game we wouldn't be able to start 5 people. I wouldn't count on Bonner in crunch time but he needs to be given a shot early to see if he's able to contribute. Put another way - with this anemic roster, what other choice do we have?

Regarding Hill, I think he will get more minutes next game but it could easily be as a "small forward" or some other odd way to use him. There's no reason at all to think Pop is able to adapt this quickly, and actually use Hill as the backup PG, unless he privately feels the season is over.

Off-season rambling:

Regarding Pop, I think fans are probably too quick to throw him out the door. Obviously new talent needs to be fit into the roster as soon as possible next year. And the way this series is heading (first round exit), maybe, maybe, Pop will realize Finley is not the answer; Ime is not the next Bowen; and Bonner is not the next Horry.

What I hope for is not to blow up the team and the coaching staff, but for the FO to radically alter their approach. A long shot I admit, but there will be new players next year whether Pop cares for it or not. He's going to have to adapt even if he'd rather not. The goal should be to transition new players into the team and try to teach them whatever remains of the system. Blowing things up, getting a new coach would be more devastating then having at least some veterans around to help new players transition into the league when at least there's still some semblance of a winning tradition.

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Originally Posted by kace

you wonder about Beno ? See what he's doing now.

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Making $5.5 M playing in the NBA?

TP, he really was outstanding and should have a play on the mvp list, or be mvp this year. anyway, bad and a shame they did not manage to hold the mavs down. This game would make things lot easier for us, now it will be hard to win the series. but im still confident. GO SPURS!

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Originally Posted by The Truth #6

Some random thoughts:

There's been a lot of talk about how much Bonner has choked. I'm not disagreeing with that. In one of the threads before the series began I thought he would be fairly useless. However, he does play much better at home. If we bench everyone that choked last game we wouldn't be able to start 5 people. I wouldn't count on Bonner in crunch time but he needs to be given a shot early to see if he's able to contribute. Put another way - with this anemic roster, what other choice do we have?

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"Much better" for Bonner at home is generous. What did he do in game 1? What shots or plays did he make in game 2 before Tony Parker near-singlehandedly got the Spurs a double digit lead?

For the last 10 years the Spurs have won so many big games and 4 titles because they have had the combination of 3 great stars and solid bench contribution.

What we saw saturday was that they still get great play from their stars but there is no contribution from the bench any more.

When Parker and Duncan score almost 70 and Dirk and Jet score less than 30 and the Mavs win by 9 is a eye opener. The Mavs are getting the timely scoring from their secondary players like JJ, Bass, Wright, Damp and Kidd. Not exactly hall of famers there.

Back in the day the spurs used guys like Kerr or Big Shot Bob or Bowen and recently Finely but those guys are gone or too old. And the new guys like Mason, Bonner, Hill or Gooden just aren't delivering.

If Ginob can come back next year at 90% or better then the Spurs will be a contender. But the time is running out fast on this team.

The Window has been open a loooong time for the Spurs but it is about to shut unless some real changes are made next year. But it has been a HELL of a run!

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Originally Posted by 41times

for the last 10 years the spurs have won so many big games and 4 titles because they have had the combination of 3 great stars and solid bench contribution.

What we saw saturday was that they still get great play from their stars but there is no contribution from the bench any more.

When parker and duncan score almost 70 and dirk and jet score less than 30 and the mavs win by 9 is a eye opener. The mavs are getting the timely scoring from their secondary players like jj, bass, wright, damp and kidd. Not exactly hall of famers there.

Back in the day the spurs used guys like kerr or big shot bob or bowen and recently finely but those guys are gone or too old. And the new guys like mason, bonner, hill or gooden just aren't delivering.

If ginob can come back next year at 90% or better then the spurs will be a contender. But the time is running out fast on this team.

The window has been open a loooong time for the spurs but it is about to shut unless some real changes are made next year. But it has been a hell of a run!

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QFT :toast

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Originally Posted by 41times

For the last 10 years the Spurs have won so many big games and 4 titles because they have had the combination of 3 great stars and solid bench contribution.

What we saw saturday was that they still get great play from their stars but there is no contribution from the bench any more.

When Parker and Duncan score almost 70 and Dirk and Jet score less than 30 and the Mavs win by 9 is a eye opener. The Mavs are getting the timely scoring from their secondary players like JJ, Bass, Wright, Damp and Kidd. Not exactly hall of famers there.

Back in the day the spurs used guys like Kerr or Big Shot Bob or Bowen and recently Finely but those guys are gone or too old. And the new guys like Mason, Bonner, Hill or Gooden just aren't delivering.

If Ginob can come back next year at 90% or better then the Spurs will be a contender. But the time is running out fast on this team.

The Window has been open a loooong time for the Spurs but it is about to shut unless some real changes are made next year. But it has been a HELL of a run!

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good post. and so true.

I think its easy to say now, that Kurt Thomas really did just run out of juice during his killer stetch earlier in the year.

He helped keep us afloat, but he doesn't have anything left.

believe

Pop pulled the right string by finally starting Bowen...but at the wrong players expense in Roger Mason Jr. The starters should be TP, Mason, Bowen, TD, and Gooden OR Thomas. No more Bonner.

Formula for Game 5 win:

1. More and more Hill. He proved is ready for this stage in Game 4.

2. More Gooden and/or Thomas, LESS Bonner.

3. TD & TP step up once again, which I have no doubt that they will.

4. No more Mason at PG, he is strictly a shooter.

5. Crunch-time lineup of TP, Hill, Bowen, TD, and any other big BESIDES Bonner.

I know Gooden didn't have a great game, but he only played 8 minutes. And in that eight minutes he got 3 boards, which is three times more than Bonner got in nearly 3 times as much time on the court. In fact, Gooden rebounded at a better rate than Duncan or Bowen. If I were Pop I would have played Gooden a hell of a lot more, but after a couple of fouls i would have warned him that we need him in the game so to try not to foul out.

I've said it since the day we got Gooden. If he doesn't start and Bonner does, Pop is being pig-headed. Further, I've said for weeks that Bowen has got to get lots of minutes as he is the best perimeter defender. I've also said that Hill should be used more, as his defense is pretty remarkable for a rookie.

Pop has not followed any of my advice, so we find ourselves down 3-1. No fucking surprise to me AT FUCKING ALL.

Fire Pop! He's a douchebag now.

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Originally Posted by LEONARD

believe Pop is moron.

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It's all about how to play on the road without fear. It sad to say but nobody outside Timmy, Manu and Tony can elevate their game on the road. Which makes it impossible to win in the playoffs.

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Originally Posted by objective

"Much better" for Bonner at home is generous. What did he do in game 1? What shots or plays did he make in game 2 before Tony Parker near-singlehandedly got the Spurs a double digit lead?

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Relax. I said he's fairly useless. Playing better at home doesn't imply he's actually a good player.

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Originally Posted by DBMethos

So Pop has basically killed Mason's game by forcing him to play a position that he's bad at. When Mason fails at this (as any reasonable person would expect him to), Pop benches him for his poor play and leaves him off the court when we'd actually need him (say, for clutch 3 pointers at the end of tight ballgames). Instead, we're forced to watch Matt Bonner, a guy who has made maybe 1 pressure shot in his entire pro career, jack up a bunch of badly missed 3's in said tight ballgame.

Good stuff.

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Wonderful job. Did you know that without this site, no real reporters in SA would ever get their paychecks. hahahahahaha

"THIS IS A MESSAGE TO POPOVICH"

You are starting to find out what is it to coach a team, its all fun & games when everyone is healthy and playin well, but when peices are missing and you actually have to coach thats when your true skills come out. Let me be one to point this out to you POP! YOU SUCK at coaching and your perfomance is proof enough............

If Game 4 can't convince some Spurs fans that this team is hopeless, nothing will.

If I'm Tony Parker or Tim Duncan, deep down, though I might say otherwise, I know I can't count on my teammates. Maybe I'll keep passing the ball and playing the scheme because I'm supposed to, but I know those other guys aren't going to hit the shots, grab the rebounds, make the stops, or do much of anything, except fail miserably.

Gregg Popovich is a great coach for veteran players and knows how to develop a yoingster if he has to. But he is stubborn. This mindset that the Spurs have to play the veterans and cross their fingers that it all works out has left the team at a dead end. This team isn't going anywhere. The only upside would be if Roger Mason and George Hill could log some playoff minutes and build experience and confidence. Instead, Pop is doing his best systematically to destroy their confidence.

Michael Finley is done as a professional basketball player. He cannot do anything on a basketball court anymore. If the Spurs were to start a steaming turd at small forward, at least there would be a chance an opposing player might slip on it.

Roger Mason is a shooting guard. Asking him to play point guard is like asking Kurt Thomas to play small forward. It is setting him up for failure. There is no evidence that Mason has any competence handling the ball like that. The only reason I can think of that Pop placed him in that role over Hill is that after seeing Tony Parker and Beno Udrih struggle as young players in the playoffs he simply has no confidence that a young player can do it. The obvious rebuttal is that George Hill certainly could not do any worse than Mason. Benny Hill couldn't do any worse.

Bruce Bowen, despite his obvious decline, differs from several other Spurs in that he apparently is still capable of making a few things happen on a basketball court.

Matt Bonner is meant to be the 11th or 12th player on an NBA roster. That he ends up logging significant minutes on the Spurs only underscores the front office's failure to field a competitive supporting cast. He is not athletic. He cannot rebound. When he is not hitting three-pointers --shots that he can't create for himself but rather depends upon stars to create for him--, he is useless. That somebody in the front office thought he could replace Robert Horry is laughable.

Kurt Thomas is washed up. He is done.

Fabricio Oberto is washed up. He is done.

Jacque Vaughn is washed up. He is done.

Ime Udoka is at best a third-string player on a deep lottery team. That the Spurs' front office imagined him to be a Bruce Bowen replacement is a mockery.

Drew Gooden has some obvious talent and can create shots for himself, unlike every other Spur who isn't one of the Big 1 and Medium 2. However, he obviously isn't very smart and doesn't have a feel for the game on either end of the court, which is why he is bouncing all over the league.

I don't see what the Spurs have to play for in Game 5 other than pride in not being eliminated at home. Making it to the second round is no accomplishment for this franchise. There is nothing from these playoffs that this team can build on, since this iteration of the team is at an end. Beating the Mavs is no great accomplishment. The only upside I see, again, is for Hill and Mason to get experience in roles they can actually fulfill, but if Pop does that, he probably signals to the team that he has put up the white flag (if they don't have that message already).

The Spurs will end this season in total disarray. They face the prospect of two of their top three players being in decline. They have no credible NBA players at any of the three frontcourt positions other than Tim Duncan, and few prospects to procure any. The two decent prospects they have behind their star guards have had their confidence wrecked. The team looks for all the world like it is coming apart.

Since Tim Duncan probably can be Tim Duncan for the first half of a season before his knees break down again, and Tony Parker is at his peak, the Spurs probably can avoid a total breakdown like what the Pistons just went through. They can put up their 50 fools-gold wins next season if they so desire, and make some fans believe there is still a chance. But what we are seeing in this series is what this team really is when the chips are down.

Diddo!!!! To what whats mentioned above, except for the part about "POP" being a good coach..... All the mistakes you mentioned above are why he is not a good coach.........Unwilling to make changes, poor in game descions, amongust the hundrends of other mistakes he made over the 2nd half of season........... Coachs have been fired for less in this league......

Next yr, SPURS hopefully can learn from this year and hit the talent pool hard, finally spend some green and take a chance.........

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Originally Posted by DaBears

Diddo!!!! To what whats mentioned above, except for the part about "POP" being a good coach..... All the mistakes you mentioned above are why he is not a good coach.........Unwilling to make changes, poor in game descions, amongust the hundrends of other mistakes he made over the 2nd half of season........... Coachs have been fired for less in this league......

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Be sure to keep a plenty of Kleenex on hand for Pop's inevitable induction into the Basketball Hall of Fame.