Does it really matter? I mean ... can either of these teams beat the Lakers?

Ehh I could see Denver beating the Lakers. It would be a long shot 7 game series, but they could do it. The Mavs-Spurs series was mainly just for pride I guess.

Does it really matter... what a silly question. Why don't the Mavs sit out next year if you guys think like that. Because the Lakers aren't going anywhere.

Also why are people applauding his reasoning? Finally a Mavs fan that gets it? What realization has he come to exactly?

It's understandable to try and find solace after defeat, but that attitude of "oh well even if we did win we have to play the Lakers" is weak.


What matters to me is how the Spurs fare and the way they are playing win or lose.

Truthfully I know the Spurs have no business winning the LOB this year, not with the level of their play, the uncertainty of the team, lack of stalwart defense and execution, mental blips... dearth of talent, or its failure to manifest, on top of being banged up, and missing a key player.

Never so late in the season have I seen the Spurs in this state.

I am disappointed but still hold out hope.

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Originally Posted by DubMcDub

That's because Spurs fans and players collectively suffer from a massive case of self-entitlement. But that doesn't mean it's a reasonable or logical way to approach things. The issue of whether there's only one ultimate goal is separate from the issue of whether there's only one barometer of "success."

If you have a season like the Spurs did last year, that's a damn good season. It's not a complete success, but it's nothing to be ashamed of. You got to enjoy a lot more games than most NBA fans.

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I don't think the Spurs players believe themselves entitled to anything. In fact, I find that statement to be bizarrely unsupportable.

I think they get easily disappointed and frustrated at this point because things aren't as easy for them as they've been in the past. And I do think that if your expectations are championships and you fall short, it's reasonable to consider that season a failure. I HOPE the Spurs players expect championships and I HOPE they're disappointed if their season ends without one. Even if such a season is objectively successful (relative to all but a small number of other clubs), I HOPE that being disappointed by only relative success is a motivator for the next season.

Spurs fans (in many cases) have gone overboard with the belief that a season is unenjoyable without a championship; but I think Spurs players have, by and large, been gracious (if extremely competitive) losers when they haven't won and very gracious winners when they have. Having listened to just about every post-game from just about every playoff game that this team has played for the last 12 years, I think you'd be really hard-pressed to point to anything suggesting that they have the smug sense of entitlement that the Shaq/Kobe Lakers manifested.

No way in hell. No one is beating the Lakers except maybe the Cavs.

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Originally Posted by DubMcDub

That's because Spurs fans and players collectively suffer from a massive case of self-entitlement. But that doesn't mean it's a reasonable or logical way to approach things. The issue of whether there's only one ultimate goal is separate from the issue of whether there's only one barometer of "success."

If you have a season like the Spurs did last year, that's a damn good season. It's not a complete success, but it's nothing to be ashamed of. You got to enjoy a lot more games than most NBA fans.

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What are you talking about? You mean the Spur players and fans, in your opinion, must be satisfied with advancing and having a good showing in the postseason even if they don't win the LOB or else they suffer from a sense of entitlement? That's pretty far reaching. But, I guess it's all relative depending on which player or which fan you ask.

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Originally Posted by FromWayDowntown

I think it does matter, but not for this year. I'd agree with the general proposition that there isn't a team in the West that will beat LA, absent a rash of key injuries in Los Angeles. They're too long and athletic for everyone and when all else fails, they have Kobe's big-game ego to fall back upon.

Where I think the course of this series does matter is in deciding how to proceed from here. Maybe a continued struggle to find scoring from sources beyond the Big 3 convinces Spurs management that it's time to recrack the window on the Duncan era by finally committing to youth (ala the summer of 2002). Maybe it convinces them to find whatever way possible to get Tiago Splitter here -- or to get something truly useful from his rights. Maybe it convinces the Spurs to pony up the $3 million it might take to buy someone's #1 pick and infuse youth that way.

Whatever the path, getting bounced early (all relative, I guess -- so many teams would love to be facing the possibility of not winning a series for the first time in nearly a decade) might be the impetus that the Spurs need to make changes; winning the series and advancing a couple of rounds might be worse for the Spurs by suggesting (erroneously) that a healthy Manu is all that separates the Spurs from a real shot at another title.

Props to the Mavs for playing harder and better through 4 games than the Spurs have.

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Originally Posted by FromWayDowntown

I don't think the Spurs players believe themselves entitled to anything. In fact, I find that statement to be bizarrely unsupportable.

I think they get easily disappointed and frustrated at this point because things aren't as easy for them as they've been in the past. And I do think that if your expectations are championships and you fall short, it's reasonable to consider that season a failure. I HOPE the Spurs players expect championships and I HOPE they're disappointed if their season ends without one. Even if such a season is objectively successful (relative to all but a small number of other clubs), I HOPE that being disappointed by only relative success is a motivator for the next season.

Spurs fans (in many cases) have gone overboard with the belief that a season is unenjoyable without a championship; but I think Spurs players have, by and large, been gracious (if extremely competitive) losers when they haven't won and very gracious winners when they have. Having listened to just about every post-game from just about every playoff game that this team has played for the last 12 years, I think you'd be really hard-pressed to point to anything suggesting that they have the smug sense of entitlement that the Shaq/Kobe Lakers manifested.

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These two posts are, bar none, the most intelligent bits of commentary I've read on these boards in...well, since I started reading these boards.

I've thoroughly enjoyed this season, and it's been great fun to watch the Spurs play. They've had some great games...and, of course, some games I'd rather forget about. TP has been great; Manu has been invisible. Wins against the Lakers and Celtics had me cheering; games against OKC had me moaning.

It's been a great season.

If they can't make it out of the first round (which, granted, would suck), then I hope they can come back with some fire and energy next year (as well as...AHEM...some good offseason player movement).

It isn't over yet. But whatever happens, win or lose tomorrow, I'm a fan for life.

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Originally Posted by DubMcDub

That's because Spurs fans and players collectively suffer from a massive case of self-entitlement.

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Wow. Just wow. One of THE most ridiculous statements I've ever read this year.

^I think you are entitled to an explanation... :D

in a word.....no

Perhaps the extra revenue is important to the the team.

I didn't think the Spurs sans Manu could take the Mavs to six games, and I'm sure neither team can beat either the Lakers or the Nuggets.

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Originally Posted by TampaDude

Yeah...the sad truth is that nobody is getting by the Lakers in the West this year.

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that writing's been on the wall for a while.