Barack Obama invokes Jesus more than Bush.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0609/23510.html

He’s done it while talking about abortion and the Middle East, even the economy. The references serve at once as an affirmation of his faith and a rebuke against a rumor that persists for some to this day.

As president, Barack Obama has mentioned Jesus Christ in a number of high-profile public speeches — something his predecessor George W. Bush rarely did in such settings, even though Bush’s Christian faith was at the core of his political identity.

In his speech Thursday in Cairo, Obama told the crowd that he is a Christian and mentioned the Islamic story of Isra, in which Moses, Jesus and Mohammed joined in prayer

At the University of Notre Dame on May 17, Obama talked about the good works he’d seen done by Christian community groups in Chicago. “I found myself drawn — not just to work with the church but to be in the church,” Obama said. “It was through this service that I was brought to Christ.”

And a month before that, Obama mentioned Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount at Georgetown University to make the case for his economic policies. Obama retold the story of two men, one who built his house on a pile of sand and the other who built his on a rock: “We cannot rebuild this economy on the same pile of sand,” Obama said. “We must build our house upon a rock.”

More than four months into the Obama presidency, a picture is emerging of a chief executive who is comfortable with public displays of his religion — although he has also paid tribute to other faiths and those he called “nonbelievers” during his inaugural address.

Obama’s invocation of the Christian Messiah is more overt than Americans heard in the public rhetoric of Bush in his time in the White House — even though Bush’s victories were powered in part by evangelical voters.

“I don’t recall a single example of Bush as president ever saying, ‘Jesus’ or ‘Christ,’” said Tony Perkins, president of the conservative Christian group Family Research Council. “This is different.”

To Perkins, Obama’s overtly Christian rhetoric is a welcome development from an administration that he largely disagrees with on the issues, though Perkins sees a political motive behind it, as well.

“I applaud that. It gives people a sense of comfort,” Perkins said. “But I think it’s a veneer, a facade that covers over a lot of policies that are anti-Christian.” That includes, in his view, Obama’s stance in favor of abortion rights.


Good for him. :tu

......and your point is..............................

The last eight years of officials clowning for the religious right might have gotten us used to it. Maybe not.

All the religious cooing is really in bad taste IMO, but it's still a commonplace of retail politics. I don't really expect that to change much.

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Originally Posted by Viva Las Espuelas

......and your point is..............................

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That Barack Obama invokes Jesus into his speeches more than Bush did. All that whining about how President Obama wouldn't talk about his religion was for naught.

That is all.

But he's an Arab Muslim!

An Israeli woman said so!

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Originally Posted by JoeChalupa

That Barack Obama invokes Jesus into his speeches more than Bush did. All that whining about how President Obama wouldn't talk about his religion was for naught.

That is all.

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i thought religion was something everyone wants to get away from. people bash the religious right yet write this about obama. classic. i wonder what percentage of people that voted and support obama are actually believers. both sides playing the middle. laughable.

I wish Obama was an atheist. I have my doubts that he's a true believer anyway. You shouldn't have to pander to a religion in order to get votes.

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Originally Posted by Viva Las Espuelas

i thought religion was something everyone wants to get away from.

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Not religion itself -- religion in government.

At least he wasn't stupid enough to say the US military was fighting a crusade in the middle east.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Not religion itself -- religion in government.

At least he wasn't stupid enough to say the US military was fighting a crusade in the middle east.

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at least someone fought instead of just talking.

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Originally Posted by Viva Las Espuelas

at least someone fought instead of just talking.

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Pssst....we are still fighting.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Not religion itself -- religion in government.

At least he wasn't stupid enough to say the US military was fighting a crusade in the middle east.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Franklin D. Roosevelt

Last night when I spoke with you about the fall of Rome, I knew at that moment troops of the United States and our allies were crossing the channel in another and greater operation. It has come to pass with success thus far. And so in this poignant hour I ask you to join with me in prayer.

Almighty God, our sons, pride of our nation, this day have set upon a mighty endeavor, a struggle to preserve our republic our religion and our civilization, and to set free a suffering humanity. Lead them straight and true; give strength to their arms, stoutness to their hearts, steadfastness in their faith. They will need Thy blessings their road will be long and hard, for the enemy is strong he may hurl back our forces success may not come with rushing speed, but we shall return again and again. And we know that by Thy grace and by the righteousness of our cause, our sons will triumph.

They will be sore tried by night and by day, without rest until the victory is won. The darkness will be rent by noise and flame, men's souls will be shaken with the violence's of war. For these men are lately drawn from the ways of peace. They fight not for the lust of conquest, they fight to end conquest. They fight to liberate, they fight to let justice arise, and tolerance and goodwill among all Thy people. They yearn but for the end of battle, for their return to the haven of home. Some will never return, embrace these, Father, and receive them Thy heroic servants into thy kingdom.

And for us at home, fathers, mothers, children, wives sisters and brothers of brave men overseas, whose thoughts and prayers are ever with them. Help us, almighty God, to rededicate ourselves with renewed faith in Thee in this hour of great sacrifice.

Many people have urged that I call the nation into a single day of special prayer. But because the road is long, and the desire is great, I ask that our people devote themselves in a continuance of prayer. As we rise to each new day, and again when each day is spent, let words of prayer be on our lips, invoking Thy help to our efforts. Give us strength too, strength in our daily task, redouble the contributions we make in the physical and material support of our armed forces. And let our harts be stout, to wait out the long travail, forbear sorrows that may come, to impart our courage unto our sons where so ever they may be.

And, oh Lord, give us faith; give us faith in Thee, faith in our sons, faith in each other, faith in our united crusade. Let not the keenness of our spirit ever be dulled. Let not the impact of temporary events, of temporal matters, of fleeting moments, let not these deter us in our unconquerable purpose.

With Thy blessing we shall prevail over the unholy forces of our enemy. Help us to conquer the apostles of greed and racial arrogances. Lead us to a saving of our country, and with our sister nations into a world unity that will spell a sure peace. A peace invulnerable to the schemings of unworthy men, and a peace which will let all men live in freedom, reaping the just rewards of their honest toil.

Thy will be done, almighty God. Amen.

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Originally Posted by JoeChalupa

Pssst....we are still fighting.

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pssssst.....we were already there lonnnnnnng before 12009


pssssst.......north korea
psssssst. .......pakistan
psssssst..........iran
chatter chatter chatter

When did it become such a negative thing to be a religious person?

Just curious.

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

[stupid post.]

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Was FDR talking about a war specifically in the middle east against Muslims?

No he was not.

DarrinS,

We were fighting Nazis back then... the best enemies ever. It's different. :D

Honestly, I really don't care if someone is religious and looks at our war with that mindset, as long as they're not sending us over there for THAT reason.

I don't think it's negative to be religious; I just think it's negative to use religious reasons alone to try to make policy. If you can persuade me with a useful reason, great, I don't care if there are also religious overtones. (ie. saying that you disagree with abortion due to religious reasons, but also using moral reasons to argue is 100% acceptable to me. Trying to tell me abortions are unacceptable because God says so does nothing for me.)

"it's bad form to wash your clean linen in public."

"negative thing to be a religious person"

when "Religious" people impose, intolerantly, their morals and fantasies into Caesar's realm, and into purposely secular/non-denominational areas.

Obama is no more a christian than Osama - he invokes religion when it serves his purpose and to gain approval. It's all a calculated facade.

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Originally Posted by LnGrrrR

I don't think it's negative to be religious; I just think it's negative to use religious reasons alone to try to make policy. If you can persuade me with a useful reason, great,

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I'll give you a good example: Christian evangelical abolitionist movement of the 1800's.

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Originally Posted by Crookshanks

Obama is no more a christian than Osama - he invokes religion when it serves his purpose and to gain approval. It's all a calculated facade.

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How uncharitable. He's like Osama to you?

Pobrecita! :lol

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

I never have anything useful to add.

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ok

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

ok

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You actually think you add anything?

:lmao

Having faith in a higher power, supreme being, creator, etc. is no crazier than worshiping a teleprompter quoting community organizer than hasn't accomplished jack squat as POTUS. Just saying.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

You actually think you add anything?

:lmao

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Good example.

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

I'll give you a good example: Christian evangelical abolitionist movement of the 1800's.

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So, you're telling me there aren't good non-religious reasons to support abolition?

Again, I don't care if people support something from a religious mindset. I don't even care if they support something ONLY due to a religious mindset, as long as they can provide good non-religious reasons to support their cause.

In the case of abolition, there were obviously moral arguments to be made that were independent of God.

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Originally Posted by LnGrrrR

In the case of abolition, there were obviously moral arguments to be made that were independent of God.

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What makes something moral?

:stirpot:

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

Having faith in a higher power, supreme being, creator, etc. is no crazier than worshiping a teleprompter quoting community organizer than hasn't accomplished jack squat as POTUS. Just saying.

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Who's this in response to? I couldn't see how it's in response to me, as I've called out Obama when I feel he deserves it.

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

Good example.

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Seriously, let's hash this out.

Please answer the question.

In your example, was FDR speaking of a war in which Americans were fighting Muslims exclusively in the middle east?

Yes or no.

Let's see what you have to add here.

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Originally Posted by LnGrrrR

Who's this in response to? I couldn't see how it's in response to me, as I've called out Obama when I feel he deserves it.

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It's a response to his pet strawman - he never posts in any thread without it.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Seriously, let's hash this out.

Please answer the question.

In your example, was FDR speaking of a war in which Americans were fighting Muslims exclusively in the middle east?

Yes or no.

Let's see what you have to add here.

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You know, there is an actual definition of the word "crusade" and it doesn't always refer to "The Crusades". Maybe Muslims are too fucking stupid to know the difference. After all, they want to hunt down and kill anyone who makes a cartoon about a religious figure.

:lmao

Priceless -- you are adding so much to this board.

Thanks for not answering the question.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JoeChalupa

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0609/23510.html

He’s done it while talking about abortion and the Middle East, even the economy. The references serve at once as an affirmation of his faith and a rebuke against a rumor that persists for some to this day.

As president, Barack Obama has mentioned Jesus Christ in a number of high-profile public speeches — something his predecessor George W. Bush rarely did in such settings, even though Bush’s Christian faith was at the core of his political identity.

In his speech Thursday in Cairo, Obama told the crowd that he is a Christian and mentioned the Islamic story of Isra, in which Moses, Jesus and Mohammed joined in prayer

At the University of Notre Dame on May 17, Obama talked about the good works he’d seen done by Christian community groups in Chicago. “I found myself drawn — not just to work with the church but to be in the church,” Obama said. “It was through this service that I was brought to Christ.”

And a month before that, Obama mentioned Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount at Georgetown University to make the case for his economic policies. Obama retold the story of two men, one who built his house on a pile of sand and the other who built his on a rock: “We cannot rebuild this economy on the same pile of sand,” Obama said. “We must build our house upon a rock.”

More than four months into the Obama presidency, a picture is emerging of a chief executive who is comfortable with public displays of his religion — although he has also paid tribute to other faiths and those he called “nonbelievers” during his inaugural address.

Obama’s invocation of the Christian Messiah is more overt than Americans heard in the public rhetoric of Bush in his time in the White House — even though Bush’s victories were powered in part by evangelical voters.

“I don’t recall a single example of Bush as president ever saying, ‘Jesus’ or ‘Christ,’” said Tony Perkins, president of the conservative Christian group Family Research Council. “This is different.”

To Perkins, Obama’s overtly Christian rhetoric is a welcome development from an administration that he largely disagrees with on the issues, though Perkins sees a political motive behind it, as well.

“I applaud that. It gives people a sense of comfort,” Perkins said. “But I think it’s a veneer, a facade that covers over a lot of policies that are anti-Christian.” That includes, in his view, Obama’s stance in favor of abortion rights.


Good for him. :tu

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Silly.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

:lmao

Priceless -- you are adding so much to this board.

Thanks for not answering the question.

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Bush wasn't referring to THE Crusades either.


You're so smart.

Are you saying it was the best word to use given the circumstances?

Yes or no.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Are you saying it was the best word to use given the circumstances?

Yes or no.

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Given that these people become outraged over a cartoon of Allah, the use of the word crusade was not the best choice.

Given that the word "crusade" has a pretty negative connotation in the Arab world, was it a good choice of words?

Yes or no.

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Given that the word "crusade" has a pretty negative connotation in the Arab world, was it a good choice of words?

Yes or no.

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Look up.

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

Look up.

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Do you agree that the word crusade has a pretty negative connotation in the Arab world?

Yes or no.

darrin don't like that question.

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Originally Posted by clambake

darrin don't like that question.

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I don't like being repeatedly asked the same dumb question that I've already answered.

Am I being too vague?

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

Given that these people become outraged over a cartoon of Allah, the use of the word crusade was not the best choice.

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It's a different question.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Do you agree that the word crusade has a pretty negative connotation in the Arab world?

Yes or no.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by da_suns_fan

Silly.

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Got you to respond. :lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Given that the word "crusade" has a pretty negative connotation in the Arab world, was it a good choice of words?

Yes or no.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Do you agree that the word crusade has a pretty negative connotation in the Arab world?

Yes or no.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

It's a different question.

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I already agreed with your premise that it has a negative connotation and that it was a poor choice of words.

Can you not read?

I don't think Obama believes in God. Nothing wrong with that but using it for votes is another thing. He lied about never hearing Rev Wright. He knew that guy 20 years. George Afro- Another lie Obama told. They will add up one day for you and you will understand why Obama is the biggest liar I have ever seen.

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

I already agreed with your premise that it has a negative connotation and that it was a poor choice of words.

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Great.

What was your argument about it again?

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Originally Posted by jack sommerset

I don't think Obama believes in God. Nothing wrong with that but using it for votes is another thing. He lied about never hearing Rev Wright. He knew that guy 20 years. George Afro- Another lie Obama told. They will add up one day for you and you will understand why Obama is the biggest liar I have ever seen.

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So that is you proof that he lied?

Quote:

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I don't think Obama believes in God.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by jack sommerset

I don't think Obama believes in God. Nothing wrong with that but using it for votes is another thing. He lied about never hearing Rev Wright. He knew that guy 20 years. George Afro- Another lie Obama told. They will add up one day for you and you will understand why Obama is the biggest liar I have ever seen.

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When did he say he never heard Wright?

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Originally Posted by ChumpDumper

Great.

What was your argument about it again?

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I think the point of the OP was that people would recoil when they heard Bush use religious language, but Obama has been using religious language as much, if not more than Bush. (Bill Maher's head explodes)

I just posted an FDR speech to show that he, as well as numerous other past POTUS have used such language. It doesn't bother me -- it only bothers the far, secular left.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

I think the point of the OP was that people would recoil when they heard Bush use religious language, but Obama has been using religious language as much, if not more than Bush.

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That certainly didn't seem to be Joe's point.

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I just posted an FDR speech to show that he, as well as numerous other past POTUS have used such language.

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You posted that as a direct response to my bringing up Bush's use of the word crusade because you quoted me.

Damn, you are disingenuous.

If God were real he'd hate politicians so it's all good.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarrinS

I just posted an FDR speech to show that he, as well as numerous other past POTUS have used such language. It doesn't bother me -- it only bothers the far, secular left.

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I wouldn't consider myself "far" left, but I am secular. I don't really care.