on national security and the economy:
.
Feel free to add your own.
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on national security and the economy:
.
Feel free to add your own.
security is better?Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
economy is better?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ducks
No. That's kinda my point. I was hoping a board lib can point to ONE, just ONE, policy of this admin that has improved ANYTHING.
Any takers?
He's made date night for married couples popular. That's important.
Bush/Obama's TARP+stimulus *might* have averted a deflationary death spiral. That's the only thing I can think of, and it isn't provable.
But really, it's a little early to be passing judgment on Obama, especially since we're still waiting for the *verdict of history* on the policies of his predecessor.
At an equivalent stage of his presidency, what had GWB accomplished?
6 months and he is a failure? wtf did you do when your were 6 months old? lmao at all the haters!
went over ducks head... :wakeup
No terrorist strikes on U.S. soil.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
Ouch :lolQuote:
Originally Posted by PixelPusher
image of the U.S. on world stage...
....respect back to the presidency....(wow a Prez who reads books)
According to a recent HuffPo report, Bush reads more books.
What kinda books? Comics?
http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/ar...7bushbooks.htm
Camus? Never would have taken him for an existentialist.
I guess Obama has brought back the shiny happy people face of the progressive, militarist, imperial presidency.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PixelPusher
:lmao y'all must be 57 state believers as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by Nbadan
It started a few days after the election.Quote:
Originally Posted by redskinfan
Reneges on promise before even taking office: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
Poll numbers falling, 3/14/09: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
Obama may not have what it takes, 3/12/09: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
Honeymoon over, 3/10/09: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
Dow Jones dropping: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
IPod: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
Suicide of American Sovereignty: http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...ighlight=Obama
Huh, never thought I'd be accused of giving GWB too much credit...was there some terrorist strike between Jan and June of 2001 we're missing?Quote:
Originally Posted by Viva Las Espuelas
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
Somebody did their homework! wow!:wgaf:
It was reel easy.
Well, he has only been in office for 1/8 of his term. It might take a little while to determine the good effects.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
I can think of some hostages that are pretty happy about one of his decisions though.
Other taking the same "failed Bush economic policies" he ran against, adopting them for himself and putting them on steroids, proposing a budget that will put us deeper into debt in 4 years than Reagan/Bush/Clinton/Bush did in 28, use the power of his office to circumvent bankruptcy laws for the personal benefit of massive campaign donors, make the American taxpayer responsible for subsidizing private business losses, cause China and Russia to start lobbying for the replacement of the U.S. dollar as the international currency and block attempts by the public to find out exactly where and to whom on wall street our money is being given to he really hasn't had time to do anything yet.
I guess it's better than having eight years to portray America as a bunch of people in favor of torture, showing great ineptness in intelligence, taking 3 years too long to reverse course in Iraq, not finding Bin Laden, responding horribly to a devastating hurricane... etc etc :)Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
I'm sorry, I thought this thread was about Obama.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
No unecessary wars started.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
Quote:
Originally Posted by George Gervin's Afro
Just continued. :toast
Someone mentioned no terrorist attacks on US soil. Well, not counting the murders of an abortion doctor and a guard at the Holocaust museum (thank's Keith Olbermann). No terrorist attacks on US soil is actually a good thing.
No one mentioned a surge (of sorts) in Afghanistan. I think this is positive.
People keep mentioning that he's only been POTUS for 6 months. While this is true, it must be pointed out that in those 6 months, he has made numerous changes in the financial sector, for better or worse. He also has plans for radical changes in the fields of health care and energy, neither of which I agree with. His admin is taking on more in 6 months than I've ever witnessed by a POTUS in my lifetime.
If he really has improved the "image" of the POTUS, then I suppose that is a good thing too. It's my opinion that it's not "arrogant" for a POTUS to aggressively and unapologetically pursue the best interests of the US.
a lot more respect for out country around the world, thats a no brainer.
Really? From whom? North Korea is taunting us. Israel is ignoring us. China is warning us. Europe is lecturing us. I'm certain that there's global joy about Bush being gone, but it seems to me like the rest of the world is seeing Obama as someone they can push around. That's not respect.Quote:
Originally Posted by sook
respect is what you get after getting an apology from slanderers like David Letterman.
Obama should take note.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
That is probably the stupidest thing I've ever heard.
driving the wrongies and hate-media to even stinkier, lying, slanderous attacks and characterizations as their "base", and their dicks, shrink before our eyes.
naw, trying to dog Obama's supposed lack of accomplishments 6 months into office is easily stupider.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
I came up with more positives than you did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
Quote:
His admin is taking on more in 6 months than I've ever witnessed by a POTUS in my lifetime.
Oh, with your post I thought it was just about bashing our non-favorite political characters blindly and one-sidedly. My mistake.Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
And if N Korea and China loved us, I'm sure you'd be going on about how we're appeasing them, or how No Korea loves America because they think Obama's weak, or some other spin.Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
Let's face it, N Korea has been working on nukes for YEARS now, and China is pissy because they trusted the dollar and got burned. Israel is pissed because we mentioned that we might not back absolutely everything they do. And since when do conservatives care what Europeans think? Oh no, Europe is lecturing us. Boo fucking hoo.
no you didn't. You just listed a bunch of things Obama has done so far and you clearly stated "for better or worse" in the middle of the post. That in itself makes the point that 6 months is not enough time to judge anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
Now 8 years on the other hand is plenty of time to look back on the negatives and failures of a presidency.
You guys are gonna have to make up your mind about whether they should be considered "terrorists" or not. It's pretty amazing to me that even when you're now on the short end of the stick, you still don't grasp the danger inherent in applying this catchall label.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
Quote:
Originally Posted by PixelPusher
Timothy McVeigh was a domestic terrorist. These other two incidents were murders by nutjobs.
So in other words, none of them have any more respect for the U.S. than they did under Bush. Which was the point I was trying to make. Thanks for agreeing with me.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
Credit Card Holder Bill of Rights - Been in the works for years, but finally passed.
And there we go. That's a good piece of legislation. Kudos to Obama and the Democrats for passing that.Quote:
Originally Posted by jacobdrj
Agreed. Individuals within the country may think that the US has changed, and who knows, it might. But the ruling powers don't care.Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacobdrj
That's a good one. I wish they'd let us deduct CC interest from taxable income too.
That's a ridiculous idea!Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
Yeah, the cc legislation was pretty good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
Yeah I agree. it seems the rest of the world has pretty much figured the guy is all sizzle with no substance,and some of them realize he's an idiot. It seems that the nation is slowly coming to that realization too as polls show his policies are not popular, despite the medias smoke and mirrors.Unfortunately too many Americans eat the consent being manufactured by the media, or close their eyes and pray that the goverment will take care of them, makes snake handeling look positively scientific.
What, this isn't a socialist anti-capitalist bill? :D *tongue-in-cheek*Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
:toastQuote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
See, I don't hate everything he does. Just most of it. :D
How is this different from the Bush years?Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
It's not any different at all. Darrin's original post asked what positive effects Obama has had. Someone else said that Obama has garnered the U.S. more respect around the world. I disagreed. I don't think the U.S. is any more, or less, respected around the globe than we were under Bush.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChumpDumper
It's not...:rolleyesQuote:
Originally Posted by ChumpDumper
:lol Chump just pwned himself.
No, that's exactly what I meant.
I love the magic wand theory to which board Republicans subscribe now that they are out of power.
Obviously it's a bit early for a review. But at some point it'll be fair to do so, given not only the specific promises of his campaign, but the general hubris from his supporters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
Isn't this the first president in the electronic age that hasn't had a positive impact in the first 100 days?Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
I guess it depends on how you define *the electronic age*.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
You actually remember what Obama, GWB, Clinton, GHWB, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, Johnson and Kennedy did in their first 100 days?
Remarkable. Could you run it down for us WC?
Sorry, I cannot. I remember the presidents since Nixon as all not having remarks of no accomplishments in their first few months in office though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
Face it. President Obama is a joke.
Obama is POTUS in an unprecedented time and can do some real good and mark his place in history. I fear that his "walking on pins and needles" diplomatic style will hinder this. I'm also starting to notice that he leads with with his thumb to the winds of the weekly polls, ala Clinton. While this may seem like a good thing, a.k.a. "refining his position" on various matters, it also makes it difficult to see what the man really stands for.
A leader does not legislate by polls. A good leader knows how to change the mind of the people to what is right. It should be easy since he has the media on his side.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
I warned you all he had no executive experience. Now our nation is getting more and more fucked up.
Thank-You Obama supporters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Well, I think he fully intended to do things like closing Gitmo, but then the polls cam out and....
Regardless of what people think of Bush (I thought he had terrible judgement in people he appointed), at least he cared more about what he thought was right vs. being popular. It's very obvious, now, that the man didn't worry about popularity.
If so, the joke's on us.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Coming from you though, this judgment isn't too credible. You already had your mind made up.
If Obama keeping GWB's SECDEF and his war/CT/national security policies in place doesn't sway you probably nothing will.
His party probably wishes now that he had cared a little more.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
True. Gitmo won't be closed but that's not Obama's fault. Congressional democrats were fine using Gitmo as a talking point to win the election, but once Obama got in they all became gutless bastards who didn't want to run the political risk of actually following through.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
True.Quote:
Regardless of what people think of Bush (I thought he had terrible judgement in people he appointed), at least he cared more about what he thought was right vs. being popular. It's very obvious, now, that the man didn't worry about popularity.
What gets me is that this guy ran for Class President, like in High School, and won!Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
Do we really have that may stupid people here?
What a travesty. I have a hard time getting over that too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
C'mon. Don't be coy. Say what you really mean.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Anyone who disagrees with WC is ipso facto an idiot.
Right?
"You know, I'm the President during this period of time, but I think when the history of this period is written, people will realize a lot of the decisions that were made on Wall Street took place over a decade or so, before I arrived in President, during I arrived in President." --George W. Bush, ABC News interview, Dec. 1, 2008Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Not at all. I disagree with some pretty intelligent people at work. I simply cannot believe how many people cannot see past the public face. They are likely the same people that get taken by used car salesmen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
One of the guys I disagree with most, before the election, only had one good thing to say about electing President Obama. That it should put the black/white issue to rest. That was his best reason besides not liking president Bush.
Is that a good reason to vote for him? Just because he's Black? I guess it made allot of white people feel less guilty over race.
then you hang out with stupid peopleQuote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
LOL...Quote:
Originally Posted by Blake
OK, I made a rash statement. I'll change that to ignorant.
It appears to all be relative...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nbadan
LOL, c'mon dan. That is nothing more than media propaganda.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nbadan
I love it when he just blatantly makes shit up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
So you don't agree with the way he handled the hostage negotiation with the pirates?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Blame yourself. You voted for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by DarrinS
That was the on scene commanders call, not the President.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
True, but without due authorization from POTUS, he probably wouldn't have made the call.Quote:
Originally Posted by PEP
For doing that any president could do sleep-walking?Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
I give him credit for doing the right thing. That's all. I would be happier if they actively started finding and start blowing those bastards off the surface. We have good enough satellite tracking for slow moving targets to monitor them and take action as required.
Time will tell on this one. Maybe they are doing more. I'll give him a pass if it never happens again to a US flag ship during his one or two terms. Failure if it happens again.
Ah, so you admit he's had one positive outcome from a decision. Thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
And is it your logic that if something goes bad and a President makes a decision on it, and that bad thing repeats, that the President is a failure?
Additionally, the US has been using drones to hunt down drug-trafficking targets... wouldn't be surprised if they start using it for pirates too.
I'm not willing to go that far. How can you say that what should have been done is a positive? I go as far as giving him credit as to not making it a negative. To say he did something positive over the matter so far is as far fetched as congratulating a police officer for writing a speeding ticket. It's his job. Just that simple. I will congratulate him if he takes a proactive support to neutralize them.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
meh... just sounds like more Obama derangement syndrome.
What about Obama keeping in place the idea of state secrets to prevent disclosure of possible terrorism details in court? You don't approve of that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Anything that could possibly seen as a positive he'll just rationalize it as "something he should have done".
No matter what Obama does he's not gonna give credit. There's a "should have done it" and a "shouldn't have done it"... there is no slot for "good job that he did it"
Yonivore at least acknowledged the areas of continuity with GWB and gave Obama props for his *good judgment*; WC seems to lack the intellectual integrity to do so, or even to acknowledge that Obama may gotten a thing or two right.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Were you in the military? Because one thing I can't stand is some repub/conservo guy that views our servicemen as just expendable lives just to achieve their sadistic political views. Even if you did serve in the military, its still bad but not just as bad as some politcal computer geek screaming for war like its a RISK game.
You are so un-American.. don't you know that conservatives have the issue of patriotism cornered?Quote:
Originally Posted by Creepn
Again, he's just doing something he's expected to. Has he actually done anything positive, or can you only come up with neutral stuff?Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
Approval? Maybe it's the right word. Nothing better than that though.
Again, has he actually done anything positive? Something that likely wouldn't be done with just anyone else sitting at his desk? Isn't that what this thread is about?
11 years and 20 days active.Quote:
Originally Posted by Creepn
Really?Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
I gave him props for his signing statements, that he will not congress infringe on his Article II powers. Don't you remember? Who's being intellectually dishonest?
You never got back to me about any of President Bush's signing statements being different.
Again, who's lacking intellectual integrity? You expect something that amounts to a grade of "C" to be something to jump for joy about? I freely admit I do not like President Obama. I am taking this thread at face value. Is it positive. Doing what is right and expected does not sway my needle. He gets a passing grade of a "C" for these actions. Nothing better, nothing worse.
I'll be nice and pretend you really aren't that ignorant/stupid/intolerant (please choose the appropriate word.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Creepn
What grade does Bush get? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Is there anything that Obama COULD do, that you would consider positive, that you wouldn't consider something he's "just supposed to do"?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
Sure. I just cannot imagine him doing it. He could continue with the "Bush Tax Cuts." He could reverse his position on socializing things. He could tell congress he wants them to take back all the bailout money not spent yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
In short, anything that defies liberalism and isn't an expected part of his position.
Better, but not a whole lot more on average. I give him D's and F's for some things. At least he knew tax cuts were good and tried to be a good Commander in Chief. I give him A's for these.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
Given this, I think that there's a good chance you'll go the next 4 years without anything you see as 'positive'.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
I forgot about that. That makes me dishonest? Oh well...thanks for the reminder. Your posts hitherto in this thread created a different impression.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Cobra
I never saw your *challenge* until just now. As usual, you sought to rely on others to do your homework for you, and got spanked by FWD. I have nothing useful to add to the record. Signing statements are not objectionable per se, but can be pernicious in their effects. This has nothing to do with the precise wording, but with the legal theories and opinions underpinning them. The burden of showing they are the same for Obama and Bush is yours, since yours was the original post. Good luck.Quote:
Originally Posted by WC
That's fine. You're swaying back and forth a bit on the point, but that is neither here nor there. Whatever Obama may do right is neutral to you. Does not move the needle. This restates jman's characterization upstream, FWIW.Quote:
Originally Posted by WC
Very possible. The signing statements will likely be the best I will give him because he had to in essence defy his congress, and after chastising President Bush for the same things he's doing. Similar things as that, where he ends up breaking his promises for the right reasons may cross into the positive territory.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR