Does anyone have any on-topic observations?
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Does anyone have any on-topic observations?
I haven't read the book... I figured the topic of wealth/value/money/resources was on-topic. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
The snippet posted is almost fortune cookie short...
It is. Your contribution received a hat tip from me upstream. :flag:Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
If you've read the book, feel free to throw something up. I'm always up for a discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
I like this quote by Mencken...
Quote:
The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.
I noticed! I doff my hat to you, good sir.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
The reason I used the term "value" instead of money or wealth, is relatively simple.
Money can be created, as is shown easily.
Wealth can be created, or destroyed, but there can obviously not be unlimited wealth, as that would destroy the meaning of the term. Wealth is just a comparison term. If everyone had a car, then that would not mean everyone were 'wealthy'. Wealthy would then come to mean two cars or more.
Value fits best. Given the above example, a man grows a tree, and then makes something out of the wood grown. The value of the furniture might be greater than the tree, but it is only as useful as the value I attach to it. Once I attach a high enough value to it, then I may purchase it, but only after lowering the perceived value of other items I could purchase with my cash.
Not long after the economic crisis began I said to you in a thread something along the lines of I thought (hoped) we were seeing a shift in the american psyche away from materialism and that it would ultimately be a good thing. I still think that. Although I think things need to become much worse before there is a permanent shift.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
I remember around that time I heard a guy call into a talk radio show and he had lost his job and had to sell alot of things (tv, kid's xbox, etc.). Then he added that in a way it was kind of nice because his family now has dinner at the table, plays board games with his kids, and was generally much closer to his family. Getting away from the pursuit of materail things really might be what americans need.
I only read and commented on the snippet. I'm pretty sure I don't have any additional thoughts worth mentioning.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
I'd be happy to respond to yours, though.
I hope you're right.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBoy
I hope you're wrong, but fear you're right.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBoy
I'm sure someone will give me shit for this but my wife taped an Oprah show for me to watch that was on this very topic (seriously, I don't watch Oprah LOL). A few families had to give up their toys, shopping, etc. for a whole 7 days. If it wasn't totally staged, we have a LONG way to go. It was pathetic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
Here's a clip, I guess Oprah doesn't let old shows be posted anywhere.
http://www.oprah.com/media/20090506-...eriment-haynie
2012 is coming soon...........
Maybe a more interesting topic related to the OP is what happens if americans do shift away from the shop till you drop with a credit card mentality. Obviously it's not good for the economy in the short run but let's say the american personal savings rate goes to 10% for the next ten years. What does this mean for america's postion in the world? How does it effect the national debt? What does it do to China's position in the world?
Thrift is making a comeback for sure.
I see that as a net good in spite of what it means in the short run for demand. People will start to deleverage their lives, and start to carry their own weight without exposing themselves so imprudently to risk or indebtedness, all the while laying up a bank against future contingencies. It used to be normal behavior. It will be again.
Honestly, I don't know how increased saving effects the national debt or our relationship with China. I don't really do macro. I'd just be making it up.
I don't know the answers to those questions either. I did see a show (I.O.U.S.A perhaps) where they said China's average salary was $2k but their saving rate was 50%, which is why they have so much money to loan. So I would think there are some implications for our relationship with China if we start saving and building up our own cash reserves.
On the national debt, I just remember the argument from the 80's that the debt wasn't a huge issue since it was money we owed to ourselves. Unlike todays debt.
Maybe if they let interest rates creep up enough, there would be a real incentive for savers again; and enough fear to inspire borrowers -- and lenders -- to proceed with all due diligence.
Oh, fuck it...I do it all the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Winehole23
:lol