who will we sign with our LLE?

Apparently, M. Haislip wasn't signed with the LLE but with the veteran minimum for 2 years. There's definitely a chance that we don't use our LLE since we are already about 10 mil over the cap, but if we do, i really hope we use it to sign a defensive-minded SG/SF.

M. Daniels: SG, 6-6, 220 lbs, 28 yrs old: coming off one of his best year in which he averaged 13.6 ppg. he can play all three perimeter positions, decent mid-range game, decent athleticism, good defender; but can't shoot the 3 ball. he most likely will be out of our price range, but i also don't see him going for the full MLE, so if we get lucky, we might be able to pick him up, but highly unlikely.

J. Moon: SF, 6-8, 200 lbs, 29 yrs old: a very versatile defender in which in his 2 years in the NBA, he average over 1 spg and 1 bpg in only 25 mpg. he is very long, very athletic, very energetic, very good defender; but has a shaky jump shot and not a particularly high basketball IQ. he will probably be within our price range, and the fact that the Heats are planning on starting M. Beasley at SF and already committed 4 mil next yr in J. Jones, there's a chance that i don't see the Heat matching the offer since he's a RFA.

M. Barnes: SF, 6-7, 226 lbs, 29 yrs old: has improved his offensive game over the years, he came off a year in which he averaged 10.2 ppg. he is very active, decent athleticism, decent defender; but even though he has improved his offense, he is still more of a hustle player and there are times in which he would take a few bad shots. Suns are not interested in resigning him, and i believe he's price range is definitely around the LLE.

C. Delfino: SG, 6-6, 230lbs, 26 yrs old: decent offensive player in which he averaged 9 ppg off the bench in 24 mpg. he is pretty strong, pretty athletic, decent ball handling skills, decent defender; but he forces things a big and is not a particularly good passer. even though he is a RFA, i don't see Raptors signing him since they now have so many players at the 2 and 3 with the recent acquisitions of H. Turkuglo, A. Wright, D. George, and supposedly L. Kleiza. we have been interested in C. Delfino last year, still i think it may be a bit hard to sign him for that cheap.

James White!

No way the Spurs land Moon, Daniels or Delfino with the LLE. Barnes is the only possible one on your list but he sucks and has balked at coming to play in San Antonio about a half dozen times.

we should be patient. just wait and see how other teams respond.

ps. hell no to moon. he may average 1 blk 1 stl but hes a poor defender.

Back court:

Parker/Hill/Mason/Manu/McClinton

Front Court:

RJ/Battier/Hairston/Gist/Duncan/Blair/Haslip/Dice/Ian

agree about Moon amd his overrated defense. blocking shots isn't at all a sign for good defense. see Josh Smith, who also is a bad defender overall, but his block numbers make some people (even some experts) believe he was a great defender.

Delfino and Moon are out of the LLE range and their teams would love to match this anytime.
not so sure about Daniels. sure, he will ask for more, he made something like 6 or even 7 million last year, but I'm not sure if he won't need to reduce his asking price. he might find himself in a Matt Barnes situation, who also had delivered decent numbers, but couldn't get more than the vet. min.

Barnes definitely is a LLE player, but as mentioned, why should the Spurs once more call, when they are obviously not very high on his wish list. you just don't sign a player, who would prefer 10 other places over SA.

if that are our options, I'd rather give Holt a break, safe some bucks (overall the LLE + the same amount in lux tax) and play our young players

I just dont like anyone of them.

I could see Bruce playing for it, rather than only the vet min...he deserves it!

If it's true we did't sign Haislip with the LLE, I'd really like to try to take Rasho back...
He already knows the system anfd can give as a special and not so usual asset in a "defense first" oriented team...plus, if ther's something we still lack is shot blocking.
However I'km not sold on the fact that Spurs have given up trading...Bonner, Finley and Mason expiring contracts are all very, very valuable assets in this buyer's market.
So I really think (more hope) that before august we could make another very good deal....for the future 2/3 years of "open window" for the title!

reportedly the Spurs were also interested in Frye. (most fans hated this idea, not without a reason).
but for the LLE? Frye has length and athleticism and none doubts that some talent is also included. for the LLE I would risk this signing. maybe Pop and the veteran environment can inject some toughness and defense into Frey. if yes, he could become a decent player.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by venitian navigator

If it's true we did't sign Haislip with the LLE, I'd really like to try to take Rasho back...
He already knows the system anfd can give as a special and not so usual asset in a "defense first" oriented team...plus, if ther's something we still lack is shot blocking.
However I'km not sold on the fact that Spurs have given up trading...Bonner, Finley and Mason expiring contracts are all very, very valuable assets in this buyer's market.
So I really think (more hope) that before august we could make another very good deal....for the future 2/3 years of "open window" for the title!

---

i don't really see the need to sign one more big man; as our current roster stands its going to be hard to give enough minutes to our backup bigs in D. Blair, M. Haislip, M. Bonner, I. Mahinmi; why would we waste the LLE on someone who might not even crack into the rotation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bless1187

i don't really see the need to sign one more big man; as our current roster stands its going to be hard to give enough minutes to our backup bigs in D. Blair, M. Haislip, M. Bonner, I. Mahinmi; why would we waste the LLE on someone who might not even crack into the rotation.

---

The concern with the big rotation is that it's very young and unproven.

Duncan - proven
McDyess - proven
Blair - unproven (injury concerns)
Mahinmi - unproven (injury concerns)
Haislip - unproven
Bonner - proven
Gist - unproven

There are only 3 proven players on that list and two of them are way on the wrong side of 30 and one of them is Bonner. The rest of the guys are all unknowns on the NBA level. So another big isn't too weird of a suggestion. What if Blair's knees flake out, Mahinmi gets hurt....again, and Haislip rebusts. All of those are very possible and it would leave you with very little rotation up front.

My dream scenario would be Gooden taking the LLE to stay here

Don't want the other possibilies named in here, excluding Bruce, but fuck giving him the LLE, lol.

Daniels can play but he is a grade A asshole and gangsta and Pop wouldnt tolerate his BS.

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Originally Posted by Dro210

My dream scenario would be Gooden taking the LLE to stay here

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That would be amazing. Honestly, if you can scoop up Gooden for the LLE (especially on more than just a 1 year deal) then why wouldn't you? Gooden is an amazing offensive player right now. I don't care about developing a guy like Mahinmi if I can put together a good team now. This team is going to implode in a few years, but thats ok. At this point it's all about the present.

It would just be a waste of money. Not enough minutes to go around if it was for a 1.9 mil/ per wing.

I don't understand how we aren't considering bringing Bruce back, or Kurt...damn I was a big fan of both...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

It would just be a waste of money. Not enough minutes to go around if it was for a 1.9 mil/ per wing.

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At that point you're probably running a rotation of 4 bigs: Duncan/McDyess/Gooden/Blair. Mahinmi and Haislip can have the opportunity to compete for minutes, but realistically they're not going to get much. If you're serious about winning now then that might be what you need to do. That big rotation is capable of scoring, defending and rebounding - first and second units.

Now is that realistic? No. We won't land Gooden for nearly THAT cheap. Mahinmi and Haislip will both get a real chance too. But honestly if you could bring in Gooden for that cheap I think he'd be a great fit as an off the bench post scorer and rebounder.

Shelden Williams would be worth picking up for the LLE. He is a solid low post player who has not received more than 15-18 mpg on average.

I like Gooden and more than all the fact that he expressed his positive feelings for the team and the fans...plus, his a valuable player in his prime considering his age.
So, it could be awesome to have him back...
Imho the only way to have Gooden back is if some team with cap space (OKC ?) sign him and then trade him to us for the some amount...after all they could like some role players (Bonner ? Finley ?) to fill their roster without compromising the minutes they need to give to the young fellas for their improvement.
And we could add something spicey like (possibly 2econd) draft choices...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mcdunk

Shelden Williams would be worth picking up for the LLE. He is a solid low post player who has not received more than 15-18 mpg on average.

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+1

Although the LLE might not be enough.

I would try my hardest to sign Gooden. In the worst case he will be a nice trade asset. He could help us get rid of Bonner and maybe Finley in a package midseason.

In the best case? we could have the most complete frontcourt in the NBA

Makes more sense to wait till the summer league is over so they can evaluate this rush of youth before writing or trading anyone off. Gooden can't be had for the LLE.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nkdlunch

I would try my hardest to sign Gooden. In the worst case he will be a nice trade asset. He could help us get rid of Bonner and maybe Finley in a package midseason.

In the best case? we could have the most complete frontcourt in the NBA

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:downspin: That would be sick. And if we can grab bell to piss kobe off and sour the lakers flow. oooooooowwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeee

what about Rashad McCants for the LLE?
he is very good 3 point shooter and also can drive the ball with his athleticism

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kobyz

what about Rashad McCants for the LLE?
he is very good 3 point shooter and also can drive the ball with his athleticism

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If you're going to sign a wing player I think it needs to be a defense-minded player. Theres only one ball to go around and we already have plenty of scorers on the wing:

Ginobili, Jefferson, Mason, Finley and McClinton are all primarily known as scorers. Why do we need another one?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MrChug

I don't understand how we aren't considering bringing Bruce back, or Kurt...damn I was a big fan of both...

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Bruce needs to get cut first before we can consider bringing him back.

I think the Spurs will end up using a chunk of their LLE on Blair, probably something in the $600-$750 range, and then just not use the rest. Right now none of the guys who you could get for the LLE are worth the x2 luxury tax hit.

Bobby Jackson. (vet min)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darkwaters

If you're going to sign a wing player I think it needs to be a defense-minded player. Theres only one ball to go around and we already have plenty of scorers on the wing:

Ginobili, Jefferson, Mason, Finley and McClinton are all primarily known as scorers. Why do we need another one?

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because i dont believe in Mason and for the defense i hope we will bring Bruce

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dbestpro

Bobby Jackson. (vet min)

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I'd love it. I'm sure he could be had for the vet minimum and a chance to win a championship. As a Kings fan I'd hate to lose him but he'd be perfect for the Spurs and the 3rd pg option. :tu

I don't know if the LLE is enough but Carney would be a nice choice. He is long,young, athletic and fine with not taking a bunch of shots.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dbestpro

Bobby Jackson. (vet min)

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good thinking :toast

Raef LaFrentz (vet min.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BlackBellamy

Raef LaFrentz (vet min.)

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What the fuck dude

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tp2021

What the fuck dude

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Whew! I was waiting for someone to comment on that one. I was taking silence as the rest of the board agreeing. :lmao

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BlackBellamy

Whew! I was waiting for someone to comment on that one. I was taking silence as the rest of the board agreeing. :lmao

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I'm glad you were joking. I thought you were serious

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tp2021

I'm glad you were joking. I thought you were serious

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Sorry for that. :lol I was trying to think of a truly worthless and injury prone free agent big who would also be redundant with our line-up. Like, the failingest fail I could fail with, y'know?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dbestpro

Bobby Jackson. (vet min)

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Absolutely. Hes a vet with a lot of experience and poise. He can defend and shoot the 3. He'll probably take the minimum I think and would be a guy willing to take the bench and fill in when needed. But I think hes very capable when called upon. There are concerns about his health, but if we just keep him shelved until needed then it might not matter.

But if Hill were to have issues with the point position I think Bobby could fill in admirably.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BlackBellamy

Sorry for that. :lol I was trying to think of a truly worthless and injury prone free agent big who would also be redundant with our line-up. Like, the failingest fail I could fail with, y'know?

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Maybe failing at failing makes you a winner? Or a super fail dunce, either way.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tp2021

Maybe failing at failing makes you a winner? Or a super fail dunce, either way.

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I'd say judging from your initial reaction, that I did an admirable job at failing.

wayyyy too early for this..

let's look at how the young guys play in the Summer League first..and then wait until August, because there will still be a number of guys looking for contracts, and might play for cheaper than they'd usually be worth in better economic times..we could find a bargain..

SL first though..if some of them show a lot of potential, it might be better to just keep the $ in Holt's account..

spend it on a veteren back up point ... what if hill is unable to produce.. we need some insurance there ... pg = parker / hill (unproven) .. sg = manu/ mason sf = rj, finley, PF/c = Duncan, mcdyess, bonner + young 'uns ....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by loveforthegame

I'd love it. I'm sure he could be had for the vet minimum and a chance to win a championship. As a Kings fan I'd hate to lose him but he'd be perfect for the Spurs and the 3rd pg option. :tu

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3rd my ass...he'd be the backup...Jacque Vaughn ain't any better than him...Pop wants Hill as a 2 guard, and McClinton is the same...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BlackBellamy

Raef LaFrentz (vet min.)

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:wow>>>>>:lol>>>>>:rollin>>>>>:lmao

Quote:

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Originally Posted by celldweller

:wow>>>>>:lol>>>>>:rollin>>>>>:lmao

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Thank you, thank you. You're lovely people, I'll be here all week. Please tip your bartenders. G'night everybody!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BlackBellamy

Thank you, thank you. You're lovely people, I'll be here all week. Please tip your bartenders. G'night everybody!

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Encore Please!! :lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spursfan092120

3rd my ass...he'd be the backup...Jacque Vaughn ain't any better than him...Pop wants Hill as a 2 guard, and McClinton is the same...

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Jacque Vaughn is gone. Contract expired. We should consider signing him to a deal as a coach though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by celldweller

Encore Please!! :lol

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:downspin:

Steve Kerr.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Chieflion

Steve Kerr.

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:depressed

doesn't matter

Quote:

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Originally Posted by z0sa

doesn't matter

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:wow

I think a proven backup pg is the last piece that we are lacking right now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JsnSA

I think a proven backup pg is the last piece that we are lacking right now.

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Somehow talk the Nuggets into trading Carter for some Taco Cabana.

I still vote Hermann

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bishopospurs

I still vote Hermann

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He is a little too old and short on performance, not to mention the team is stacked at the SF and PF position.

Stacked at SF? We need another center I don't trust Ian, I am okay with Hill as the back up point. Who is stacking the SF spot? Finley? Gist? I don't know. I saw someone moving Bonner to SF, if we thought he couldn't guard centers looking out.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JsnSA

I think a proven backup pg is the last piece that we are lacking right now.

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Ya, Steve Kerr.

The backcourt is set, the frontcourt has alot of question marks, but unquestionably the biggest gaping hole is behind Richard Jefferson at SF. I absolutely DO NOT want Finley averaging 15 minutes per game off the bench this year.

The problem is...I don't see a player at the LLE that is an upgrade to Fin.

grant hill?

Flip Murray?

Spurs need another big man and another SF. I'd like to see them sign Rasho and then trade some of their expiring contracts for a SG or SF. Someone like SJax would be ideal.

To round out the roster I would do this:

Trade Williams/Finley/Bonner to Sacto for Andres Nocioni

Sign one of Drew Gooden/Shelden Williams/Rasho Nesterovic with the LLE

Send McClinton to Europe

Sign Gist and send to Austin

Parker
Hill

Ginobili
Jefferson
Mason
Nocioni
Hairston
Gist

Duncan
McDyess
Blair
Nesterovic/S. Williams/Gooden
Haislip
Mahinmi

Roster stands at 14. IR Gist and a big or maybe Hairston if hes not getting minutes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JsnSA

I think a proven backup pg is the last piece that we are lacking right now.

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I guess i dont understand why everybody is down on george hill. the guy had flashes of brillance last year especially on defense. people have to remember that he was a rookie last year and he has the tools and the coaches to improve his game. also y is evrybody hating on roger mason? the guy hit countless game winners last year. i agree that he didnt play up to par in the playoffs but again the guy can flat out play and i believe he deserves another chance. as for finley i have to agree that he needs to be taken out of the rotation. he just doesnt have the speed and athletics that he used to. the guys can shoot but i dont believe he should playing over mason or even hairston. i believe they have a good rotation with
parker/ hill pg
jefferson/mason/manu/hairston/finley
duncan/ mcdyess/ blair/ mahimi/ bonner
and u never know they may be able to get bowen or thomas back if they are bought out and that would just be gravy
:flag::lobt::lobt2::lobt2::lobt2:maybe :lobt2:on the way?

sign rasho, at least he knows the system

trade away finley + mason + bonner for someone

look for a pg....

Marvin Williams can play SF?PF and C in a small ball lineup

Hill just backed up my thoughts after 1 game..he clearly has the talent to be a legit backup PG this season..it's all about the mentality, and he looks like he's thinking to attack a lot more..

Hairston will be a better backup SF than anybody we should spend the LLE on..he's going to be just as good, and he'll be cheaper..book it..

Ian will have to play a lot better though, or we'll need to sign or acquire a C..too early to judge though..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TDMVPDPOY

sign rasho, at least he knows the system

trade away finley + mason + bonner for someone

look for a pg....

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so trade three solid rotation players for a backup pg that will play like 10 to 15 mins a game? how does that make any sense? i ll give tha fin is past his prime but mason is not nor is bonner. bonner and fin could play spot duty and mason is a rotaion player who deserves 20 minutes a game at least.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ginomvp

so trade three solid rotation players for a backup pg that will play like 10 to 15 mins a game? how does that make any sense? i ll give tha fin is past his prime but mason is not nor is bonner. bonner and fin could play spot duty and mason is a rotaion player who deserves 20 minutes a game at least.

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FINLEY and bonner will get us nothing, u have to add mason to get it done since we not givin up on any other players....

if i had the chance i sign 3 scarecrows would do a better job defending the paint than these 3

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TDMVPDPOY

FINLEY and bonner will get us nothing, u have to add mason to get it done since we not givin up on any other players....

if i had the chance i sign 3 scarecrows would do a better job defending the paint than these 3

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In the NBA nobody trades players...they trade contracts. We're in the business of alleviating somebody's financial strain by freeing them up from a burdensome contract. Hence, expiring contracts have considerable value. Looking to free up cap space? Take Bonner and Finley and we'll take this heavy contract off your back. It's a match made in heaven. :married:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TDMVPDPOY

FINLEY and bonner will get us nothing, u have to add mason to get it done since we not givin up on any other players....

if i had the chance i sign 3 scarecrows would do a better job defending the paint than these 3

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i didnt know that mason and finley were inside defenders hmmmm. seriously though with george hill the spurs dont need to give up mason or bonner for that matter. they really need their ability to space the floor with mcdyess and blair coming in as well as jefferson's ability to drive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TDMVPDPOY

sign rasho, at least he knows the system

trade away finley + mason + bonner for someone

look for a pg....

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I get what you're saying, but who's going to shoot 40%+ from 3pt range. Maybe Manu but that's it.

Isn't Williams an expiring contract as well?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Demo Dick Marcinko

I get what you're saying, but who's going to shoot 40%+ from 3pt range. Maybe Manu but that's it.

Isn't Williams an expiring contract as well?

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Non-Guaranteed. He has a contract for next season but can be waived before a certain date and be an automatically expiring deal.

This was the allure of Fabri Oberto and Bruce Bowen. Both were only partially guaranteed, meaning that once they were waived the cap hit was lessened immediately.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thekingrobert

Marvin Williams can play SF?PF and C in a small ball lineup

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I have been a champion of the Spurs going after Williams this offseason, but at this point, he is unattainable. Since Atlanta tendered him, he has a one year contract offer of over 7 million on the table. Atlanta is willing to pay that for him this coming season and its only a one year deal. So expirings are not good enough to get them to trade him, you have to offer them value as well...what are you going to add. Hill, Splitter, draft picks??? None of those are good enough to get it done...as much as this Duke fan would like to see this Tar Heel in silver and black, it just isn't happening.

Hawks, Williams Close On Deal

Marvin Williams is close to signing a multi-year contract with the Atlanta Hawks, according to sources that spoke with HoopsWorld's Joel Brigham.

Williams was hoping for a contract the $40 million range, and Atlanta's initial offer was reportedly around $37.5 million.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_ar...close_on_deal/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Darkwaters

To round out the roster I would do this:

Trade Williams/Finley/Bonner to Sacto for Andres Nocioni

Sign one of Drew Gooden/Shelden Williams/Rasho Nesterovic with the LLE

Send McClinton to Europe

Sign Gist and send to Austin

Parker
Hill

Ginobili
Jefferson
Mason
Nocioni
Hairston
Gist

Duncan
McDyess
Blair
Nesterovic/S. Williams/Gooden
Haislip
Mahinmi

Roster stands at 14. IR Gist and a big or maybe Hairston if hes not getting minutes

---

I like the way you are thinking... I would sign Bowen to the vet min if he becomes available.

Starters
1 Parker
2 Manu
3 RJ
4 Duncan
5 Dice

Bench
1 Hill
2 Mason
2/3 Bowen
3/4 Nocioni
4 Blair
4/5 Haislip
4/5 Mahinmi

IR
1/2 McClinton
2/3 Hairston

14 players total, with the option to sign one more addition with the LLE or vet min if necessary, or the flexibility to sign someone to a 10-days contract.

Send Gist to Europe for 1 more year if he is not ready.

If Mahinmi and/or Blair are not ready for prime time, sign someone like Gooden for the LLE.

Nocioni would be ideal as a 4 in small-ball, he is a matchup nightmare at 4 for most teams.

The new small-ball lineup:
TP, Manu, RJ, Nocioni, Duncan. (Sheeeshh... I can't believe I am advocating small-ball now!)

• 3 penetrators in TP, Manu and RJ, with Noch potentially a 4th depending on matchups.
• 3 capable 3-point shooters in Manu, RJ and Noch.
• defensively small but still with good defensive rebounders in Manu, RJ and Noch.
• Noch could hold his own defensively against most 4s in the league (I've seen him in many games defending Odom and KG pretty well, but Sheed is the only player that give him serious problems due to his length).
• Offensively, he is a matchup nightmare due to his 3-pt range, and speed advantage against most 4s.

In any case, the above roster would be an extremely talented, balanced and deep team.

options for the LLE:
Jamario Moon - long shot
Matt Barnes
Rodney Carney
Marquis Daniels - long shot
Joey Graham
Desmond Mason
Rashad McCants
Flip Murray
Wally Szczerbiak
Von Wafer

Spurs could wait it out and see if a decent free agent is left standing as the free agency musical chairs play out. They could potentially land Gooden for the LLE if they offer him an option to become a free agent next summer when they will have his Early Bird Rights. In a 'normal' market Gooden would at least get a 3 year, $14 mil offer from someone. But it's hard to say that he will today.

Nesterovic might be a good target for the LLE, but the league has moved away from him being useful. And Pop was sitting his arse in the postseason a few years back anyways.