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Another good point. In fact, they seem to be taking the same developmental approach with Ibaka, that the Spurs took with Ian.Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
Also, anybody get a look at Ibaka the other night? Led the Thunder in rebs and produced a double-double. Not too shabby.
I just don't see how he can help the way Thabo can. I'm not sure hes really good enough to crack the rotation ahead of the guys we already have in anything more than spot minutes. As a long-term fit hes certainly more valuable than Thabo (bigs almost always are) but I'm of the "all-in" mindset for the next 2-3 years. Thabo seems to fit that bill better than Ian.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
That would be severely overstating it. I think hes completely unproven and I'm highly suspicious of his level of injury-proneness. But many of those comments that you listed came as a response to somebody creaming themselves and severely overstating his ability to contribute (ie, "start Ian!!!!!!!1!!!"). The guy is simply probably not ready to be that big of a contributor (especially with better options ahead of him) right NOW. People are still talking about starting the guy when hes pretty much done nothing outside the D-League. Thats not bias, thats fact.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
And I'm not anti-Ian. I hope he becomes the greatest player he can possibly be. Especially if it's in a Spurs uni. But the truth of the matter is that he IS a trade asset. Most of this team's assets are in the form of expiring contracts (which not all teams are seeking). When dealing with some teams the old Vaughn+Bonner trade has no value...even as expirings. Sometimes you have to give up talent to get talent.
Uh hello, haven't we been talking for the last few weeks about trading for Raja Bell? Or Andres Nocioni? How is that sane and yet Sefolosha is ridiculous?Quote:
Originally Posted by EricB
Malik Hairston probably deserves a shot at the rotation. But again, hes largely untested. And Bruce Bowen's return is absolute fantasy at this point. Is it possible? Sure. But I have seen no concrete proof that it WILL happen.
Agreed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
So again, trade a need for a mystical need.
Got it.
exactly. and next season they will play Green full time at PF (because Harden will play full time SG, so Durant will play full time SF), additionally they have also White and Mullens, another 2 rookies in the big department. if there is any need the Thunder don't have, it's another rookie PF.Quote:
Originally Posted by coyotes_geek
You said that Gist>Mahinmi.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
Given that Sefolosha is that great for you, Spurs should give up a better trade asset for him like Gist.
Whenever there is a thread about Mahinmi, you post negative things about him. So, even if you say you aren't an "anti-Ian", you're one.
Trading away a big with loads of potential with a bargain of a contract for a wing that would have trouble getting playing time makes no sense. Especially for the fact that Spurs are thin in the front court and especially since Spurs lack a 6'11 athletic big man who can play inside, run the floor, block shots from the weak side. Not to mention he's only 22. Spurs have been looking for a big man with those qualities for a long while, and hopefully patience will pay off this time around.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
Why should I even react to your comment? It's not like I'm the only one that has been talking about getting a defensive wing. Countless threads talk about guys like Raja Bell and Andres Nocioni. So why is it that I'm the retarded one in suggesting this? If timvp had suggested we pick up a defensive wing you wouldn't be saying the same thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by EricB
Am I on trial?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
When did this thread become about me?
And I made the Gist comments pre-SL assuming he could fill small-ball 4 minutes. Hes obviously not ready for that now.
Spurs need a shot blocking, shot altering big and Mahinmi is the best possibility.
The only wing I'd add is Bruce Bowen, outside of that, I think they are set.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
Trading a 22 year old 7 foot talented bigman would NOT be a way I'd want to add to the team.
I actually want to see what Ian can do on the pro level before the spurs bring in Splitter (If that ever happens) and before we
trade him.. Which i doubt.
The thunder are high on Thabo Sefolosha right now. They're not looking to trade him.
So you'd trade Mahinmi for a wing, and have a small power forward whos underperforming take his place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
You created a thread with a Mahinmi trade and I just pointed out that you don't like it. It's quite obvious that it's a big reason why you want to trade him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
I don't see where is the trial...
So Mahinmi is above Gist after these 3 SL games while you were convinced that Gist was better than him before them ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
There is absolutely no time available for a player of Thabo's stature or a defensive wing on the cheap(Yes even Bruce Bowen or Keith Bogans would have an abundance of DNP nights with the way we are loaded on the wing). Also considering GH will find time at the 2 this year. What don't you understand about that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
In order to get Nocioni and Bell, Spurs more than likely would have to pony up Mason/ Bonner to get those guys or maybe Finley/ Bonner and a 1st for Bell. Right now it would be a premature move by the Spurs FO, considering they don't know what Mahimni and Blair will actually bring from the bench next year. If they end up playing above or up to expectations Bonner will become VERY expendable and Spurs could look for such a move.
Reason why people mention Bell and Nocioni is because they make the most sense both ways.
(1) Bell has an expiring contract and more than likely won't be back in Charlotte therefore could be attainable by offering expirings close to the deadline( Finley/ Bonner and 1st). *This happens if Mahimni and Blair fill in the void in the frontcourt.*
(2) Kings are looking to unload payroll and Nocioni fits that bill. Spurs have expirings and a pick they could include in such a trade or even the rights to Splitter. *This happens if Mahimni and Blair fill in the void in the frontcourt*.
(3)Thunder traded a 1st round pick for Thabo not even a year ago knowing his contract is up in two years. Thunder would not trade Thabo for an unproven commodity in Mahimni right now ( even though he was Presti's pick. At the same time, Spurs don't have the minutes for Thabo and are thin at the C/ PF position. Those two scenarios don't match up.
And the trade scenario's for Nocioni and Bell do match up. That's why people have been proposing such deals over yours.
On the other hand if Mahimni and Blair or if theres a scenario to where Bonner is getting 25 minutes a night again. Then Spurs could include Mahimni as a deal sweetener close to the deadline along with Bonner/ Mason or Finley plus 1st to get a guy like Camby.
Any move right now by the Spurs FO would be a little premature. Let's see how the big tandem in Mahimni/ Blair/ Haislip do the first 2-3 months of the year and hold on to our trading assets. By then we will know whats more of a need a Nocioni/ Bell caliber 3rd wing? Or a Camby like big man?
No....if you actually read the previous posts I said that you would pursue signing a guy like Rasho or Gooden with the LLE after that. Nothing in this thread that I've said indicates that.Quote:
Originally Posted by EricB
The Gist thing was only brought up because pre-SL I said that Gist would probably be ahead of Ian in the rotation because of his ability to potentially play the small ball 4.
It's just asinine to thin out our front court anymore. The Spurs would be dumb to pull the trigger on a trade like this. Mahinmi is young too you know. He'd probably get more minutes than Sefolosha anyway.
A player like Nocioni would played a lot of minutes at PF for Spurs.
Gooden can't be had with the LLE first off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
Second, you want more defense, yet you wan to bring back Gooden?
huh!?!?
I've never tried to cover up my dismay with Ian. But a lot of my issues are not with him but with people that think he can be a 20/10 guy on day 1. Sometimes teams trade projects (even good ones) for players that are solid NOW to get them where they want to get.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
Almost certainly. And I didn't so much think Gist looked better...he just held a very niche position (small ball 4) where he could help. But Gist has looked completely lost in his transition from 4 to 3. I don't think hes viable in the big league right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
Mahinmi has actually looked pretty damn good since the first game. Game 2 he did a bit of everything (and his fouls were largely silly or bad officiating) and Game 3 was very solid. But I never made any negative comments about those games. In fact, I haven't made any comments at all. I was gone in Spain. Ian has frustrated me for a while. But I haven't been out to get him, just bring people back to earth on what he will probably really give us this year.
I admit I have been highly critical of Mahinmi. But you initially made it seem like this was Salem and I've been on a witch-hunt for the guy. It's not like I've been a kill_bill_pana like rage in reverse over this guy. This is, in fact, the first time I've offered up a specific trade where we could move Mahinmi.
Are you so sure? Whos offering him more than that right now?Quote:
Originally Posted by EricB
True. But Raja Bell would not. And hes been discussed at length.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
Read my post.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkwaters
We wouldn't be as thin as you think. If the Spurs felt confident that they could get a guy like Rasho then it would actually be ok.Quote:
Originally Posted by TimDunkem
Two awesome vets: Duncan, McDyess
Two decent vets: Bonner, Rasho
One awesome youth: Blair
One decent youth: Haislip
Considering you'll probably only play 4 of those 6 you're really not looking bad at all.