Hindsight: Which Swingman You Want?

Well in this hypothetical, for reasons Mel and objective pointed out, it'd be between Jack and Ariza. Ariza would've been the best move for the business model and probably fit in seamlessly, but you know what Jack could do and bring; give me Ariza.

And I honestly don't think the Spurs would've been worse off record wise having not signed 'Dyess. Thomas and Oberto would've allowed the Spurs to maintain that corporate knowledge and chemistry to start the season, helping them to get off to a better start, and then could've been packaged mid-season to acquire the frontline help needed to put the team over the top; the mix would've have been much better having your stopper be your second or third best wing player and adding a legitimate number two big to play alongside Tim could've very well completed the puzzle..

In hindsight, JR Smith...

Stephen Jackson is unstoppable! Once he starts jacking up horrible shots, no one can get him to stop. He's 31 years old and is averaging 17.5 FGA per game (career high) while shooting .413 from the field and .298 on the 4.7 3PT attempts he makes per game. He's pulling down 4.8 rebounds, and dishing out 3.7 assists while turning the ball over 3.2 times per game. Why you would want this guy on the Spurs is astounding to me.

Here's his per 36 minutes stats 2009-2010:
6.6 FGs on 16.1 attempts (.413) with 1.3 made 3PT on 4.3 attempts (.298) 4.4 rebounds, 3.4 assists, 1.5 steals, 2.9 turnovers.

Mystery Player's per 36 minutes stats 2009-2010:
5.3 FGs on 12.0 attempts (.447) with 2.3 made 3PT on 5.9 attempts (.392) 3.9 rebounds, 3.7 assists, 0.6 steals, 1.6 turnovers.

What if we could sign this "mystery player" instead for less money? Oh wait, those are Roger Mason Jr.'s stats!

I think everyone remembers how great SJax was in the playoffs for the Spurs one year and has ignored the entire rest of his career, like that time he fired a gun in a strip club.

Jax without question


But the spurs had the opportunity of having both Jax and RJ. They should had traded Mason, Bonner, and a 1strounder for Jax. Maybe throw in Splitter as well.

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Originally Posted by quentin_compson

Nah, he has no three point shot.

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That really matters when Manu does not drive into the paint like he does in the past? I wished someone had the balls to attack the paint and had the ability to steal and block shots like Gerald on this team.

Having both Jax and RJ would have been nice, but we still need a big man, and trading those contracts for a big man is still the better idea..

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Originally Posted by androck

In hindsight, JR Smith...

Stephen Jackson is unstoppable! Once he starts jacking up horrible shots, no one can get him to stop. He's 31 years old and is averaging 17.5 FGA per game (career high) while shooting .413 from the field and .298 on the 4.7 3PT attempts he makes per game. He's pulling down 4.8 rebounds, and dishing out 3.7 assists while turning the ball over 3.2 times per game. Why you would want this guy on the Spurs is astounding to me.

Here's his per 36 minutes stats 2009-2010:
6.6 FGs on 16.1 attempts (.413) with 1.3 made 3PT on 4.3 attempts (.298) 4.4 rebounds, 3.4 assists, 1.5 steals, 2.9 turnovers.

Mystery Player's per 36 minutes stats 2009-2010:
5.3 FGs on 12.0 attempts (.447) with 2.3 made 3PT on 5.9 attempts (.392) 3.9 rebounds, 3.7 assists, 0.6 steals, 1.6 turnovers.

What if we could sign this "mystery player" instead for less money? Oh wait, those are Roger Mason Jr.'s stats!

I think everyone remembers how great SJax was in the playoffs for the Spurs one year and has ignored the entire rest of his career, like that time he fired a gun in a strip club.

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I'm all for stats, but that post is a great example of how stats don't necessarily measure the true value of all players.

Things not captured by those statistics:

1. Jax is a cold-blooded killer when the game is on the line - he has taken and made big time, momentum swinging shots his whole career. Occasionally he'll shoot you out of the game, but under a disciplined coach like Pop or Larry that's less of an issue.

2. When motivated and commited, Jax is an excellent defender and has shown that he can defend Spur-killas like Dirk.

3. Jax under the influence of Pop and Timmy is clearly a different player and a different man to Jax left to roam on his own. He's the kind of guy who thrives under strong leadership and flounders otherwise. As a Spur, I think you'd see a bit more discipline and restraint in his game (and probably his life), and somewhat more efficient statistics.

Actually, he wasn't in the poll, but I agree with Chieflion - Gerald Wallace would fit our team like a glove. And as to quentin_compson's comment that he has no 3pt shot, we have enough guys who can do that. Wallace would be the ideal small ball 4 for us, and would be able to cover Bonner's rebounding deficiencies in a bigger lineup with Wallace at the 3. Of course, it ain't gonna happen though...

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Originally Posted by Chieflion

That really matters when Manu does not drive into the paint like he does in the past? I wished someone had the balls to attack the paint and had the ability to steal and block shots like Gerald on this team.

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Can't say I disagree on the attacking-the-basket part, but we still took 25 threes last night, which is more than any other team save the Knicks and the Magic.

G-Force on the Spurs is an instant title.

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Originally Posted by timvp

I added in Shawn Marion. Let me know if I forgot anyone else who fits into the discussion.

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Shane Battier wouldve been a nice fit here.

He does so much for the Rockets he is probably their one 'untouchable' active player right now. Per of +10

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

Still here..he hasn't "broken" Orlando's offense, he doesn't coach the team..

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lol, thinking a player can't break the offense. VC takes too many shots and not good ones. He's at career lows for FG% and his 3G% is lower than any time but his rookie year (.389/.303), and Dwight Howard's offense is suffering as a result. Put it this way: he's playing worse this year than the year he was dogging it to get out of Toronto (.411/.322), yet another reason I didn't want this selfish prick anywhere near the Silver and Black.

VC has 494 FGA. Dwight Howard has 363 FGA. Call me crazy, but I think the guy shooting .601 needs more touches that the idiot shooting .389. SVG is about to put his gunner ass on the bench, and it's about time.

SJax, not because I think it would have definitely worked, but because of the great story - the last charge of Tim Duncan and his core '03 Title Squad. That would have been awesome.

Also, I like Jeff but he seems timid at times, Jax would have brought the balls.

Trade RJ + Finley for Battier & Ariza. :D

I selected Marion 'cause I didn't see Ariza's option. I wanted a defensive minded wing but RJ is OK too, Pop needs to call more plays for him and tell him to be agressive.

Something annoying about the RJ acquisition is that the Spurs are currently #26 in the NBA in fast break points..Jefferson is known as one of the better fast break players in the NBA, that's always been a significant part of his game..we heard during the Summer how the Spurs were going to utilize this more often, and we haven't seen that yet..

It's just strange to me that they would acquire somebody and not use him as much as they should or at least use him in a way that he would be more comfortable..it's not like this team doesn't have players that can run a capable fast break with him, as we've seen this year when Manu runs with him..

I like RJ. I think too many people have given up on Dice early. I agree that the early returns don't look promising, but I am not ready to bury him yet.

Even if you take out the Dice argument and just look at each players abilities, I still think RJ is right there with everyone else if not ahead. Adding Dice to the equation makes this a no brainer imo.

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

Something annoying about the RJ acquisition is that the Spurs are currently #26 in the NBA in fast break points.

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If that's not a telling indictment of Pop's coaching I don't know what is. Extremely frustrating and disappointing.
Regrettably, PJ's jab about the Spurs "simulator crew" is all-too accurate at times.

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Originally Posted by DPG21920

I like RJ. I think too many people have given up on Dice early. I agree that the early returns don't look promising, but I am not ready to bury him yet.

Even if you take out the Dice argument and just look at each players abilities, I still think RJ is right there with everyone else if not ahead. Adding Dice to the equation makes this a no brainer imo.

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I'm a bit disappointed in Dice at this point given that I thought from the start that he was our guy over Sheed and that he'd fit in very quickly. However, he is a second half of the season player, and is looking increasingly comfortable, so I think he has a lot of room to grow over the coming months and a lot of people will be surprised by his contribution come playoff time.

at the time the spurs made the trade, i was clearly all for RJ rather than any other swingman avaible.


Now, i'll stick with RJ, but it's a lot more close when you look at timvp list. i still hope he will be more consistent and that this trade will be a succes.

I'm missing one name. (even if I know what reaction to expect):
Mike Miller
yes, I know. he is neither a perimeter stopper, nor athletic and he wasn't healthy much this season.
but here is asked for a swingman, right.
first off, I have always been a big fan of MM's game. and fact is, the Spurs did inquire for him at last dead line. (if this trade happens, Spurs don't trade for RJ, something a lot of Spurs fans would prefer at this point)
in theory, the Spurs could still trade for him at this deadline.
(and yes, I agree that we have other priorities, like a big or a real stopper. but what if we can't find any of these player types, who are good enough to in fact improve the Spurs)
Miller for Mason, Fin, Ian, Haislip works. trow in a pick and the Wizards do it, they no Miller will leave that mess the moment his contract expires.
what's the upside?
aside his defense (Miller is better than given credit though. likely better than RJ) Miller is Pop's dream. a fantastic shooter (better than Mason, who struggles when defended intensively), a very efficient scorer, who is smart enough to do the right thing at the right time. very good ball handler, who can play the point. (other than Mason). pretty good rebounder.
he is more or less a 6'8'' 29 years old version of Brent Barry.

what would make him most intriguing IMO at this moment, is how he would fit with this roster.
he would bring a huge size advantage, if played at SG. this would compensate for some of the lack of size most of the current Spurs line ups display. especially when Spurs go small and play RJ at PF.

another point: Spurs would also get his bird rights. Miller likely won't get more than MLE offers this summer. if he woks nice with this team, they could re sign him at MLE level, without spending the MLE. (which will be used for Splitter). MM will be 30 this summer. a 3 years contract at MLE looks nice in my book.

[email protected] callin out jax

yeh sure jax is a volume shooter or a chucka whatever you wanna call it, u know whats the difference he doesnt care to pull the trigger and he makes them when it counts, his intensity to make love to pressure is something some of the spurs players are missing. His defense and ballhandling duties is enough to cover up his negative chucka game....

The soft spot in my heart for the 2003 team would not let me choose any other than SJax.

I never thought of Mike Miller. His skill set does fit very well for this team and he has an expiring deal.

That said, he has been battling a calf injury since late November. Unless he proves that he can stay healthy for an extended string of games I don't see any reason to pursue him.

Artest would foul out of every game if he was a spur. The refs would be all over him like stink on shit. He'd have to tone down the most effective part of his game in order to make it to the 4th quarters as a spur. As a laker, its a much better situation because he will get away with tons more contact on both ends of the floor. I think he has fouled out of maybe 1 game all year long on the lakers which is a miracle considering the way he plays.

Ariza would have probably done well on the spurs. He faired well in his role on the lakers as a standstill 3 pt shooter, and that's the role he'd have with the spurs. Helluva perimeter defender too and that's where the spurs would really have cashed in with this guy.

Jackson would have been a nice addition as well. He has much better handles than Jefferson and can create for others. It's clear that Jefferson needs to be force fed the ball in order to produce. Jackson wouldn't have needed that as much.

Overall I'd give the nod to Jackson, followed closely by Ariza then Jefferson.

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Originally Posted by timvp

I added in Shawn Marion. Let me know if I forgot anyone else who fits into the discussion.

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Caron Butler

I'm going with RJ.
I believe Pop said it best "RJ is Stephen Jackson without the drama."