ian is nowhere near being a contributer. him and bonner should both stay on the bench and let dice and blair play the minutes. or bring in 1 more big.
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ian is nowhere near being a contributer. him and bonner should both stay on the bench and let dice and blair play the minutes. or bring in 1 more big.
Way to be completely wrong. Here's the link to his stats:Quote:
Originally Posted by wildbill2u
Dice's Stats
You'll find that his numbers (and minutes) have steadily increased over the previous 4 seasons. Holla at me if you need help with the math.
Maybe you mean a different Dice? If you were talking about me personally then you were spot on.
Scrowned!
It's called "getting your rhythm back". He just came back from an injury guys. An injury on his shooting hand! Nobody was complaining when Tony and Manu were having bad games when they were coming off injuries.
Eh, doesn't matter. When Bonner starts hitting 3-pointers from everywhere again, people will be right back on his nuts.
Not me...trade him...& when he hits some 3 pointers thats great..at the same time go & check out how many points & rebounds he has given up to opposing big men & SF's during the game...my bet is he will be at a -#...Quote:
Originally Posted by JustinJDW
Quote:
Originally Posted by TJastal
Possibly the lamest argument/arguer this week. (I wanted to say "this weak" but figured the pun would go over the heads of adults who don't understand the difference between "your" and "you're". But there, I said it anyway). Bummer cause I thought better of you, TJastal
But for Zosa's sake let's examine the words of the genius calling people, "spastic little creeps."
If you don't know what stats Zosa is looking at, why don't you ask? That might be a better way of getting the information than saying, "I don't know wtf your[hahahaha] looking at, but..." now who's being spastic?
Regarding the production vs minutes for McDyess- You have heard of "per 48" or "per 36", right? If you haven't then go look it up and then act like you "know shit about basketball".
I don't understand what's the point of this lame argument. Yes, there are stupid opinions but you're not gonna score any points with thoughtless arguments. Are you saying that you've NEVER criticized McDyess? I'm pretty sure you're NOT saying that we should apply conditional criticism to everyone and everything in basketball(even though we should). ..what I see is that you're totally pissed that someone is criticizing McDyess but you would go ape shit about Bonner or RJ or whomever.
Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe you've become enlightened and realize that we should save all the harsh words that we've been aiming at the team.
Yes, we can cut McDyess slack for a few months.
Yes, we can cut Bonner slack because he just missed over a month of the season and has a healing hand.
But I don't think this is the case. Unfortunately, I think some of us are so frustrated with the season that we find it cathartic to take it out on other members and the team itself. ...and that's just not cool. There's a difference between wanting a player to perform better and inappropriately, "spastically creeping" on them. And there's a difference between telling a fellow board member, "hey I think you're out of line" and being the one to cross the line by cussing and calling names.
Bonner is having a quite good season but he is caught in a number game. We almost all agree that Spurs first priority in a trade should be to get a good defensive bigman.
Antonio McDyess is nearly untradable. Last year, he was traded to a good team (Nuggets) and worked on a buyout to go back to Detroit. If Spurs trade him, all signs point in the direction that he will also ask to be bought out. I don't see a team wanting to trade for a player with a contract that goes until 2012 and who won't play for them. On top of that he has a 10% trade kicker in his contract.
DeJuan Blair is locked on a cheap long term contract, he is having a promising rookie season so he is a keeper. The only way Spurs trade him is if the another team really wants him. I don't think it will happen: teams have passed on him because of his knees during the draft and Blair playing a half NBA season at 18mpg surely isn't enough to change their opinion about his health. I don't see at all Blair being moved.
So Spurs have two options if they do a trade for a good defensive bigman: either Bonner will be part of it or their frontcourt rotation will be loaded with Duncan, the new guy, McDyess, Blair and Bonner. I don't really see the point to keep Bonner with a $3.3M salary if his only task is to play 10/15mpg if there is an injury or if Blair struggles during the playoffs. So if Spurs trade for a bigman, Bonner should be one of the first to be traded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno
I think you're on top this except for the McDyess buy out factor. I don't think we can/will trade him but I definitely don't think teams will be concerned about the buy out. Even if they wanted a buyout for salary savings they wouldn't count on it. It was well documented at the time that McDyess was blindsided by the trade, was committed to finally getting the ring in Detroit and keeping his family in Detroit(and kids in school). It seemed like that was an accepted fact from the moment the trade was public and I wouldn't be surprised if Denver took the trade expecting that(didn't that give them a little cap relief?)
Disagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by draft87
Dice has said he would have likely retire if Spurs hadn't signed him. If he is traded, he will likely seek a buyout and it surely hurts his trade value. With the trade kicker and the buyout, the other team will pay at least $5M for nothing. I can't see a team being happy with that.
i was at the game and when tony went out ATL chose Ian to shoot the free throws. well he went in and he was really excited that he was going to play you could see he wanted to get and show what he can do. but pop (sucks) decided to take him out after 2 minutes cause he is a EGO maniac thinking he is the best but just look at his rotations they are never good so he decided to put in slow ass Bonner with messed up hand cause he is an idiot and they could never get on a roll after that.
thanks Tim for saving POPS ass again....
As usual, the Matt Bonner hate is ridiculous and mostly unfounded. There are times when I really feel bad for the guy. With his great work ethic, down-to-earth personality, and downright likability, he deserves to be a fan favorite. Instead, he's ridiculed at every chance (at least on SpursTalk; I get the feeling he's at least relatively well-liked by the average Spurs fan at large).
As far as simple basketball goes, the animosity seems to stem from the fact that circumstances forced him to play a starter's role last year. As much as he tried to step up, Matt is a role player, and whenever you try to put a role player into a starting position on a team with championship aspirations, you set him up for failure.
With the above mentioned, I'm fine with trading Bonner for the right piece(s). He has a fair amount of value, both as a decent sized expiring contract and as a big man who can hit the outside shot at a ridiculous rate. However, as Bruno mentioned, his role on this particular Spurs team is limited and ill-defined at best, and is only poised to decrease next year if Splitter is brought in. If the Spurs choose to hold on to him, I do think he can contribute in 8-16 mpg, both this year and next year, but it may very well turn out that he's more valuable as a trade chip at this point.
Concerning his recent mini-slump since returning from injury, I'll save some energy and just quote myself from the Hawks game blog:
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker23
Quote:
Originally Posted by lurker23
Bonner and a lap dance from Pop for Amare
Done.
Well, their not booing him at the games although they shouldQuote:
Originally Posted by lurker23
Similar complains can be made of the people that defend him on this forum. You people take team loyalty way too far. If he became our starting PG you people would still be defending him just because he's wearing a Spurs jersey
If he were a Laker everyone here would be united that he has a weak player that we should immediately exploit
Instead you have people blinded by loyalty. Snap out of it
The man never had a rhythm in the first place.. Plus Manu and TP still produce something when they're hurt. Yeah he'll start hitting 3's from everywhere again, but I know and most everyone else knows that he will VANISH when it matters, when the real games count.Quote:
Originally Posted by JustinJDW
Shutup, get off thatQuote:
Originally Posted by JustinJDW
The Bonner haters here are consistent, regardless of him hitting 3s or not
We can be consistent when he's making shots and you fools will be saying, "you can never make haters happy"
when he's not hitting shots its "just you wait you bandwagoners"
the problem with bonner is not hitting 3's, its the fact that he's useless in every other aspect of the game. hit 3's AT WHAT EXPENSE? at the expense of giving up rebounds and playing no interior defense. when he is hitting 3's he is counter-productive to our defense at best.
when he's missing 3's HE IS USELESS
hey here's an idea: let's play big men that grab rebounds. enough foolishness, enough arguing, lets get back to winning championships
Like I said before.... His Cons far, far, far outweigh the pros with this sorry excuse for a PF.......
thatQuote:
Originally Posted by z0sa
Bonner threads are starting to look like threads in the political forum. Regardless of what one side says the other side will never agree. There are several types of threads I don't post in because arguing about it is pointless...I think I will add Bonner threads to that list.
Offensive rating: 124Quote:
Originally Posted by VivaPopovich
Defensive rating: 106
Per 100 possessions, Bonner gives us the HIGHEST point differential when he is on the court on the team besides Tim Duncan. Counter-productive my ass. Bonner's ability to spread the floor, with or without him hitting 3s helps the offense.
I wish he was as aggressive with the ball as he is with his sandwiches. :lolQuote:
Originally Posted by init2winit
Manu still finds a way to contribute with rebounds, steals or hustle plays. Plus you can't really compare the quality of Manu vs. Bonner. come one :rolleyesQuote:
Originally Posted by vander
Thats the Bonner I know... I'm mostly critical of him because he takes away minutes from Blair and Dice who we know can contribute on the boards where he lacks the most in.Quote:
Originally Posted by VivaPopovich
Play Bonner when it suits the matchup. Not all opposing teams have big men that can score coming off the bench. When one of these types gets inserted into the game (big defensive rebounder) put Bonner in to force him away from the basket. Bonner hit's his shots and he'll effectively "beat" his man in terms of production. Won't always happen but I still think he's got enough to offer not to use him a little.
If you can trade him and Finley for someone else, by all means do so-as long as it actually benefits the team. But after seeing Ian play and his physical abilities, I can't help but wonder if any other big would actually do any better coming into this system.