Brutally Honest Truths

Before the Lakers game, I had the Spurs at about a 1-in-200 longshot at winning the NBA championship. After the Lakers forcibly took advantage of the Spurs without Kobe and Bynum, I'm going to lower those chances to zero. For the first time in the Tim Duncan Era, I'm watching a healthy team with absolutely no chance of winning a championship. I still think they will make the playoffs but the chances of a fifth title isn't slim ... it's none.

-You can't fault Tim Duncan's effort. But the reality is that he's no longer in a tier by himself. He used to easily be the best bigman in the game. Now he's in the same tier as players like Dwight Howard, Pau Gasol and Dirk Nowitzki. It is painful to admit it ... but it's sadly the truth. Wear and tear has allowed the pack to catch up to him.

-Manu Ginobili's normal gait has never returned since his surgery following the Olympics. His run is more like a fast waddle. He's lost at least one step, is a streak shooter, struggles to defend in one-on-one situations and just isn't as dangerous as he was prior to March of 2008. He's gone from a damn good NBA player to a damn good bench player.

-Tony Parker ruined himself by overworking with the French national team. Not only is he beat up physically, he doesn't have it mentally. Evidence of that is seen when he explodes for one half and then disappears for another half -- as he's done way too often this season. He used to have great focus and would stay in attack mode for weeks at a time. Now we're lucky if we see him in attack mode for an entire quarter. He plays like he's physically, mentally and emotionally drained.

-It's not gonna happen. Richard Jefferson won't fit on this team. It's not so much his skillset is incompatible, it's more to do with his fragile psyche. You really don't know how a player will fit on a championship level team until he's thrown into the fire. He's been thrown into the fire -- and has melted. He's an inconsistent offensive threat who does absolutely nothing positive when his shot isn't going in. And as the pressure mounts on him to perform, he's just going to become more and more inconsistent. I can't imagine a happy ending with Jefferson in San Antonio.

-When the Spurs signed Antonio McDyess, they hoped old age wouldn't catch up to him right away. Unfortunately, it did. He's already a shell of what he was last season. He's getting better but he just isn't the defensive presence he used to be. He's no longer a championship quality player as a starter.

-God bless DeJuan Blair but when size is your weakness and the team you have to go through has length as their main strength ... that's a bad combination.

-George Hill has come up big lately but the bottom line is he's a 6-foot-2 tweener who loses his confidence at the drop of a hat. When he loses his confidence, he turns into an indecisive dribbling machine. There's hope he can remedy that flaw before the end of the season but that type of growth is measured in years, not games. And while he's solid in most other aspects, he's not good enough in any one category to overcome passive play.

-Matt Bonner isn't going to regain his pre-injury level of play this season. He's a rhythm and confidence player who is playing with neither rhythm nor confidence. He might as well go start running the hills in New Hampshire now to get ready for next season.

-He had his moments but Roger Mason, Jr.'s run as a Spur is over. Pop doesn't like him anymore. He can't play well without quality minutes. The question is just whether or not the Spurs trade him now or let him walk after the season.

-Michael Finley's NBA career should have been over at least two seasons ago. I'll give him credit ... the guy tries hard and is at times the team's most physical player, but he's over the hill, all the way onto the other side and walking in quicksand.

-No matter how hard Pop hopes and wishes, Keith Bogans will never be more than a homeless version of an old Bruce Bowen.

-Speaking of Pop, he has historically been a very good coach but he nowhere near Phil Jackson's level. If Phil Jackson is Michael Jordan, Pop is Craig Ehlo. Pop is great at coaching players with that innately have a huge amount of self confidence ... but when it comes to coaching players who aren't brimming with self assurance, he's just not very good. Jefferson is simply the latest example of an otherwise quality player who can't handle the pressure of Pop's coaching style and complex system. On top of that, Pop not selecting a rotation has the Spurs stuck in neutral. They can't gain any momentum because no one knows who is playing on a nightly basis. To date, this has by far been Pop's worst coaching job of his career; in fact, he's done more to hurt than help this team.

-I feel for you, Peter Holt. You gave the Spurs and Spurs fans what they wanted when you opened your wallet to spend millions in an effort to get one last championship during the Tim Duncan Era. Your gesture should have be rewarded. It hasn't. If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

Oh wow, wasn't expecting this from you. Very well thought of views on everything though.

good points its tough to admit but theres no way we win a title at this rate its not even plausible

If it makes you guys feel better . . .

At least you didn't put money down in Vegas on the Spurs before the season. :depressed

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Your gesture should have be rewarded. It hasn't. If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

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Count me in understanding the failure of the stimulus program as well.

Well said timvp...! :toast

Agree 100%, but I did think Finley had a few moments in last years playoffs..he hit a few key shots...

It's painful to watch..it's time to recognize and quit fighting it. Time for a change.

Vinsanity.

:toast

i agree with you, timvp.

i expect at most a first round exit. this is the worst year we got out of everyone. Our Big 3 has been reduced to role players. We no longer have a superstar that can take over. Our role players also get scared in big games. Players like Horry, Bowen, and Barry were always different makers because they show up in big games. Hill, Finley, Mason, Bogans, and Bonner only look confident against shitty teams and that is sad.

Timvp meltdown!

You were too kind to Pop. I still think this team can be the second best team in the west with a coach that possesses a common sense.

Sad day to be a Spurs fan. This one hurt.

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Originally Posted by timvp

-No matter how hard Pop hopes and wishes, Keith Bogans will never be more than a homeless version of an old Bruce Bowen.

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:lmao

I'm glad you've finally come to admit what many of us had been saying for months...now the healing can begin.

good points, maybe pop should step aside like dunlevy and move to FO ... its gotten stale ...

What a drama queen :married:

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Originally Posted by DeJuanitoBlair

typical newbie post...rambling. Where is Kori to clean this up?

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Newbie or not alot of that is true, we are not going to win a thing with this team, it's that simple. Some fans need to just relax and see it is what it is now.

I feel you timvp. This is complete bullshit that I am having to watch over and over. Small ball lineups are not going to get you past a team like the Lakers.

:depressed

why i agree to some extent with all your points i still believe that a deal by the deadline can rejuvinate this team. the whole locker room mentality needs to change and a trade bringing in new blood and players that are looking to play hard, physical and want to win could do that,

im not giving up just yet.

I disagree about Holt..this team won him multiple titles without a high payroll, it was his obligation to do this IMO..

The front office fucked up a long time ago..it made sense to surround the big 3 with old veterans when the big 3 itself was young, but now that they got older, it only made sense to surround them with younger/more athletic players..the FO has failed to do this..

It wouldn't have won us a title, but it would have made us more competitive..

I agree with pretty much all the points in this article. You can see them play out when you watch the games. Pop doesn't even yell at RJ anymore.

Pop isn't putting this team in it's best position to win games. His decisions in this game were mind boggling.

Trade Jefferson for expirings. Trade Mason to a contender for their 1st round pick and an expiring who is worthless.

Trade Manu to the Cavs and let him help LeBron beat the Lakers. Ask them for Big Z back, JJ hickson and their 1st rounder.

Go into the off-season under the cap by 20 million. Go after Bosh. Bring over Splitter and use your 3 first round picks wisely.

The End. It was fun guys. Hell of a ride.

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Originally Posted by DAF86

You were too kind to Pop.

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.

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Originally Posted by DesignatedT

why i agree to some extent with all your points i still believe that a deal by the deadline can rejuvinate this team. the whole locker room mentality needs to change and a trade bringing in new blood and players that are looking to play hard, physical and want to win could do that,

im not giving up just yet.

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Good luck!

homless version of bowen is being to nice

So what you're saying is...we're are a season away from being the Detroit Pistons? FUCK!!!!

My first post on this forum was so hopeful, even if it was after we lost in the playoffs. I saw Timmy never giving up, even at the end and it stuck with me. There must be a way, some way to at least get us in a position where we aren't a total mess...let Timmy throw his punches, let Manu leave with dignity rather than just quietly in the off season! LET IT ALL BE FOR SOMETHING! There are 10 days left to make a change, right? If we're losing the house, let's throw a fuckin party and wake the neighbors. :toast

:flag::flag::flag:

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Originally Posted by timvp

If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

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I'm feeling that this is pretty much a 99% possibility at this point. There's a point where you have to cut your losses. A championship is a pipe dream at this point. Holt needs the team to make the playoffs this year and next, nothing more. To that end, the chances of trading for any contract past next year is a very long shot, and hence the chances of getting any real talent to compete is pretty much not going to happen.

At least that's my view.

Spursfan needs to start to root for the playoffs instead of going all-in for a championship. I hope we make the playoffs these next couple years, because we won't see them for a long time after that. All these threads to tank and such are retarded. We're going to have YEARS of tanking after TD is gone.

Enjoy what you have while you can.

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Originally Posted by timvp

-Tony Parker ruined himself by overworking with the French national team. Not only is he beat up physically, he doesn't have it mentally. Evidence of that is seen when he explodes for one half and then disappears for another half -- as he's done way too often this season. He used to have great focus and would stay in attack mode for weeks at a time. Now we're lucky if we see him in attack mode for an entire quarter. He plays like he's physically, mentally and emotionally drained.

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This might be the most overlooked contributing factor to the Spurs being a slightly above average team. Parker has gone from a superstar last season to a good player this season. It's damning for any team to lose a top 10 player in the league.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Before the Lakers game, I had the Spurs at about a 1-in-200 longshot at winning the NBA championship. After the Lakers forcibly took advantage of the Spurs without Kobe and Bynum, I'm going to lower those chances to zero. For the first time in the Tim Duncan Era, I'm watching a healthy team with absolutely no chance of winning a championship. I still think they will make the playoffs but the chances of a fifth title isn't slim ... it's none.

-You can't fault Tim Duncan's effort. But the reality is that he's no longer in a tier by himself. He used to easily be the best bigman in the game. Now he's in the same tier as players like Dwight Howard, Pau Gasol and Dirk Nowitzki. It is painful to admit it ... but it's sadly the truth. Wear and tear has allowed the pack to catch up to him.

-Manu Ginobili's normal gait has never returned since his surgery following the Olympics. His run is more like a fast waddle. He's lost at least one step, is a streak shooter, struggles to defend in one-on-one situations and just isn't as dangerous as he was prior to March of 2008. He's gone from a damn good NBA player to a damn good bench player.

-Tony Parker ruined himself by overworking with the French national team. Not only is he beat up physically, he doesn't have it mentally. Evidence of that is seen when he explodes for one half and then disappears for another half -- as he's done way too often this season. He used to have great focus and would stay in attack mode for weeks at a time. Now we're lucky if we see him in attack mode for an entire quarter. He plays like he's physically, mentally and emotionally drained.

-It's not gonna happen. Richard Jefferson won't fit on this team. It's not so much his skillset is incompatible, it's more to do with his fragile psyche. You really don't know how a player will fit on a championship level team until he's thrown into the fire. He's been thrown into the fire -- and has melted. He's an inconsistent offensive threat who does absolutely nothing positive when his shot isn't going in. And as the pressure mounts on him to perform, he's just going to become more and more inconsistent. I can't imagine a happy ending with Jefferson in San Antonio.

-When the Spurs signed Antonio McDyess, they hoped old age wouldn't catch up to him right away. Unfortunately, it did. He's already a shell of what he was last season. He's getting better but he just isn't the defensive presence he used to be. He's no longer a championship quality player as a starter.

-God bless DeJuan Blair but when size is your weakness and the team you have to go through has length as their main strength ... that's a bad combination.

-George Hill has come up big lately but the bottom line is he's a 6-foot-2 tweener who loses his confidence at the drop of a hat. When he loses his confidence, he turns into an indecisive dribbling machine. There's hope he can remedy that flaw before the end of the season but that type of growth is measured in years, not games. And while he's solid in most other aspects, he's not good enough in any one category to overcome passive play.

-Matt Bonner isn't going to regain his pre-injury level of play this season. He's a rhythm and confidence player who is playing with neither rhythm nor confidence. He might as well go start running the hills in New Hampshire now to get ready for next season.

-He had his moments but Roger Mason, Jr.'s run as a Spur is over. Pop doesn't like him anymore. He can't play well without quality minutes. The question is just whether or not the Spurs trade him now or let him walk after the season.

-Michael Finley's NBA career should have been over at least two seasons ago. I'll give him credit ... the guy tries hard and is at times the team's most physical player, but he's over the hill, all the way onto the other side and walking in quicksand.

-No matter how hard Pop hopes and wishes, Keith Bogans will never be more than a homeless version of an old Bruce Bowen.

-Speaking of Pop, he has historically been a very good coach but he nowhere near Phil Jackson's level. If Phil Jackson is Michael Jordan, Pop is Craig Ehlo. Pop is great at coaching players with that innately have a huge amount of self confidence ... but when it comes to coaching players who aren't brimming with self assurance, he's just not very good. Jefferson is simply the latest example of an otherwise quality player who can't handle the pressure of Pop's coaching style and complex system. On top of that, Pop not selecting a rotation has the Spurs stuck in neutral. They can't gain any momentum because no one knows who is playing on a nightly basis. To date, this has by far been Pop's worst coaching job of his career; in fact, he's done more to hurt than help this team.

-I feel for you, Peter Holt. You gave the Spurs and Spurs fans what they wanted when you opened your wallet to spend millions in an effort to get one last championship during the Tim Duncan Era. Your gesture should have be rewarded. It hasn't. If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

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my rant was way funnier.

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Originally Posted by DAF86

You were too kind to Pop. I still think this team can be the second best team in the west with a coach that possesses a common sense.

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This.

Otherwise I agree pretty much with everything. Maybe you have more faith in Bonner than I do, but the rest looks about right...

We're just simply back to being an slightly above average team, like in the Pre TD era

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

I disagree about Holt..this team won him multiple titles without a high payroll, it was his obligation to do this IMO..

The front office fucked up a long time ago..it made sense to surround the big 3 with old veterans when the big 3 itself was young, but now that they got older, it only made sense to surround them with younger/more athletic players..the FO has failed to do this..

It wouldn't have won us a title, but it would have made us more competitive..

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Yep! then the Big 3 were the youth. Now the big 3 are the old vets.

The TNT announcers did have one good point: the lack of a vocal player like a Mario or AJ to step up and whip some asses into shape is just killing the Spurs.

And I'm still saying there's a 30% (and rising) chance they don't make the playoffs.

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Originally Posted by sabar

Enjoy what you have while you can.

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No thanks...give me the lottery balls and the chance to pair the big 3 with a lottery player than wasting time with first round sweeps...

So timvp... do we rebuild? Some say all teams go through a few bad years, as we would eventually if we keep Duncan, Manu etc. until the end; if we trade them before the end, though (Duncan only if he is willing) we might reduce the number of years the Spurs spend wandering in the wilderness.

As I said in another thread, I think they should go one more year (see if Splitter and RJ's expiring can swing one more potential run), and if it seems to be failing, see if Duncan wants to go to a contender for many, many draft picks.

Agree with every word.

Allow me to pile on by criticizing Pop for failing to develop a young nucleus of bench players. The manner in which the Spurs have handled Ian Mahinmi is especially disturbing. The game against the Fakers was yet another remider as to how poor this team is along the frontline. The Fakers badly exposed the Spurs lack of length, shotblocking and athleticism along the frontline. Meanwhile the most athletic big on the Spurs roster continues to rot away in street clothes.. I don't know what Ian has, but I do not trust or believe the guy can't play simply because Pop refuses to play him.

This isn't the only example of Pop failing to develop a young players that could've easily provided talent relief. This is just merely the latest. Failing to identify and grow a young SF would've prevented having to waste money on RJ's sorry ass. Again, I blame Pop for all of this.

Pop has been so preoccupied with the "right now" that he's ignored the future. Outside of Hill and Blair, Pop has attached himself to a roster of old players, who are literally out of gas, injured or both. Now he's reaping the consequences and we're all witnesses.

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Originally Posted by timvp

-Speaking of Pop, he has historically been a very good coach but he nowhere near Phil Jackson's level. If Phil Jackson is Michael Jordan, Pop is Craig Ehlo. Pop is great at coaching players with that innately have a huge amount of self confidence ... but when it comes to coaching players who aren't brimming with self assurance, he's just not very good. Jefferson is simply the latest example of an otherwise quality player who can't handle the pressure of Pop's coaching style and complex system. On top of that, Pop not selecting a rotation has the Spurs stuck in neutral. They can't gain any momentum because no one knows who is playing on a nightly basis. To date, this has by far been Pop's worst coaching job of his career; in fact, he's done more to hurt than help this team.

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The most brutally honest truth of them all. And I agree 95% with the rest of your truths. We thought this team had untapped potential and Pop just needed time to get the results required. There's a lot to swallow right now for spurfan.

That said, I have to disagree with dropping the faith before we're even to the all-star break or trade deadline. Miracles have happened before.

There was a game awhile back when the Spurs were killed on the boards...I thought Pop learned his lesson then...I guess not. I don't get it.

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Originally Posted by ShoogarBear

The TNT announcers did have one good point: the lack of a vocal player like a Mario or AJ to step up and whip some asses into shape is just killing the Spurs.

And I'm still saying there's a 30% (and rising) chance they don't make the playoffs.

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We have vocal guys, they just don't do it for the camera. Also Pop used to be the alpha male top dog screaming at everybody. He just lost his fire.

Right now this team better make changes and not ride out the rest of Tims career. PLEASE FO DON"T WASTE THE END OF TIMMYS CAREER! At least keep trying to reach that championship goal be it trade or watever just do what it takes to get it done.

Yeah, piling on the Mahinmi thing. It's one thing to determine that somebody can't play. It's another to determine they can't play when YOU HAVEN'T EVEN PLAYED THEM.

How can you look at Mahinmi's career stats versus Matt Bonner's and determine that one deserves a few minutes every night and one should never play?

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Originally Posted by z0sa

The most brutally honest truth of them all. And I agree 95% with the rest of your truths. We thought this team had untapped potential and Pop just needed time to get the results required. There's a lot to swallow right now for spurfan.

That said, I have to disagree with dropping the faith before we're even to the all-star break or trade deadline. Miracles have happened before.

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But at least we all can agree that Spurs do need a "Miracle"

Man in Black asked me to throw this out there...Timvp..if Pop is incapable of leading this team then who is?

The David Lynch version of Paul Atreides could scream at the guys all game long, it just won't turn back the hands of time, heal nagging injuries, instill toughness in softies, or turn 6'7" swingmen into power forwards.

Props to timvp for a fantastically sobering and realistic post.

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Originally Posted by ShoogarBear

Yeah, piling on the Mahinmi thing. It's one thing to determine that somebody can't play. It's another to determine they can't play when YOU HAVEN'T EVEN PLAYED THEM.

How can you look at Mahinmi's career stats versus Matt Bonner's and determine that one deserves a few minutes every night and one should never play?

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Ian played in one game and had better stats than any other Spur in the history of the organization not named David Robinson.

I'm siding with a combined version of Sabar and Manu4Tres's posts here..

I don't want to tank since I think it's pointless(the odds of getting the #1 pick in 3 straight lotteries is pretty much impossible + while Wall is a great prospect, he's not Tim Duncan or Lebron James..by the time he potentially becomes a superstar, Duncan and Parker will be done)..I'd rather just accept what we have, make the playoffs so we can see our big 3 perform together a few more times..

With that being said, I would still dump RJ and whoever else, and I would begin the youth movement..try to acquire a decent prospect and/or a 1st round pick in any trades..play the big 3 + Hill + Blair + Malik + Ian + any potential prospect we get in a trade and just live with what happens..title contender? absolutely not..threat to make the WCF? absolutely not..but just play, see what we have in our young guys, there's no harm in it at this point..

We'll have a better idea of what we have in on this team..it'll give the FO an easier assessment of what is needed in the off-season, and hopefully we can bring in Splitter..

The biggest problem I see...is that Pop has TOO MUCH POWER...when Pop was ON---this was a reassuring thing...to have a coach,GM,LEADER,talent evaluator,prez,etc
not even reporters summoned up the courage to question his moves,decisions,plays,rotations,etc...

but now this has become a problem, because he has really hurt this team for the last two seasons---but there is no-one there to put him to the fire--so-to speak,

Peter Holt is an awesome owner to not interfere with the coaching staff---but now---it also becomes a bad thing because he will undoubtedly just keep faith in Pop...

it becomes difficult because there is no-one to intervene and try to right the ship...

at one time I thought Tim or Tony or Manu could do some of this...but obviously the fact that ALL three are in the same mold (respectful team players and very,very professional) this won't happen either...

so we are stuck with a coach who was once great, but appears to have lost his touch and will be the main factor in the demise of a once great team.

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Originally Posted by SequSpur

Ian played in one game and had better stats than any other Spur in the history of the organization not named David Robinson.

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If Ian was 6'7" and about 32, 33 . . . We'd be in business boys!

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Originally Posted by objective

If Ian was 6'7" and about 32, 33 . . . We'd be in business boys!

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:lol . . . and coming off an injury.

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Originally Posted by HarlemHeat37

I'm siding with Sabar and Manu4Tres together here..

I don't want to tank since I think it's pointless(the odds of getting the #1 pick in 3 straight lotteries is pretty much impossible + while Wall is a great prospect, he's not Tim Duncan or Lebron James..by the time he potentially becomes a superstar, Duncan and Parker will be done)..I'd rather just accept what we have, make the playoffs so we can see our big 3 perform together a few more times..

With that being said, I would still dump RJ and whoever else, and I would begin the youth movement..try to acquire a decent prospect in any trades..play the big 3 + Hill + Blair + Malik + Ian and just live with what happens..title contender? absolutely not..threat to make the WCF? absolutely not..but just play, see what we have in our young guys, there's no harm in it at this point..

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if your gonna lose might as well and give that guy in your avatar some run too

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Originally Posted by timvp

-It's not gonna happen. Richard Jefferson won't fit on this team. It's not so much his skillset is incompatible, it's more to do with his fragile psyche. You really don't know how a player will fit on a championship level team until he's thrown into the fire. He's been thrown into the fire -- and has melted. He's an inconsistent offensive threat who does absolutely nothing positive when his shot isn't going in. And as the pressure mounts on him to perform, he's just going to become more and more inconsistent. I can't imagine a happy ending with Jefferson in San Antonio.

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I agree with most of your assessment and just wanted to focus on Dickhead and a few other points. I've watched dick (and played with him a few times!! hehe...but no really i did play with him while at UA) a lot throughout his career and like timvp has pointed out he has resorted back to his lackadaisical ways. He looks like there's absolutely not a bone in his body with energy, he doesn't even look for the ball, and consistently stands around the 3 point line not budging. To go on top of that it seems he makes stupid ass defensive plays over and over-piling up stupid fouls just so people notice he's even on the court. His confidence is low and he is pouting...thus leading to another huge problem timvp pointed out

Look how many players on the spurs are confidence players...a lot! Parker, ginobili, jefferson, hill....that's all your good guards...mason also but mason just sucks. There is no chemistry now and everyone is down, ginobili seems to be shaking his off a little but I don't see jeff turning it around. Having that many players that are pouty and get down on themselves is a problem and a reason why this team continues not to glue.

Another team observation is there is no emotion out there. No one is communicating, no one is smiling, no one is yelling, no one is even looking energetic or interested. This team sorely needs a player that will bring some "swagger", some fun, some emotions to this team. Hating myself for bring Stephen Jackson up again but a player like him is exactly something the spurs need. A player to stir the pot, a player who doesn't get all sad and depressed when not playing up to par, a player that will keep firing and stay energetic even when having the bad games. Too bad i don't think we can get someone like that in a trade this year.

The bright side if there is any to me is Dicks contract will become an expiring during the season next year and we very well could find a team who wants a salary dump and pick up a guy that will bring some fire to the team. But i agree this team is going nowhere this year-too many "truths" to overcome.

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Originally Posted by silverblk mystix

The biggest problem I see...is that Pop has TOO MUCH POWER...when Pop was ON---this was a reassuring thing...to have a coach,GM,LEADER,talent evaluator,prez,etc
not even reporters summoned up the courage to question his moves,decisions,plays,rotations,etc...

but now this has become a problem, because he has really hurt this team for the last two seasons---but there is no-one there to put him to the fire--so-to speak,

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I never thought of this, but it's a good point. With Pop having so much organizational control, where are the checks & balances? Who overrules Pop if it's believes his decisions are shortsighted, when it comes to personnel?

I know Holt leaves most personnel decisions to Pop and RC, but after this RJ debacle, both of these guys now have chinks in their armor. They've not made many bad decisions, but this one is, by far, the worst of the bunch.

Also, I'd wanna know why they elected not to pickup the option of the most athletic big on the roster? And even more, why is the former 1st round pick not playing at all?

Even if we were to make a trade this year, there's not enough time to work the person in and realistically contend for this years title. Maybe if it was Lebron...and I'm serious. It would take that kind of player to give this team any hope

Gasol > Duncan

Phil >>>>>> Pop

not you too timvp
BELIEVE

There's checks & balances in the front office, and everyone has a role to fill.

Pop is there to make sure Finley and Bonner get new contracts. RC is there to degrade Scola. And KGB Lindsey is there to make sure Scola goes to his old team.

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Originally Posted by sabar

Spursfan needs to start to root for the playoffs instead of going all-in for a championship.

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Uh no. Spurfan needs to start rooting for the draft lottery. And not because we're seeking the possibility of a number one pick. No. The draft if the quickest and cheapest way to start getting better, if you make good decisions. Stockpiling picks would really help, but that's probably out of the question.

Making the playoffs as 7th or 8th seeds and the accompanying first round exits are just keeping this roster on life support. If you want to rebuild on the fly, the draft, and an occasional key free agent, is the best approach.

It might be time to tank another season.

For the first time since '02 the Spurs are not title contenders.

That's the easy part.

The hard part for the Spurs is what to do next.

Ahhhh.. It was a good run.
I will always remember the years of Duncan in his prime.
Now we'll watch Pop run this team to the ground.

This team ain't winning anything. And I don't see a realistic move that would get us past the 2nd round.

Mine as well get something for Manu while we can.

Not to mention just get back expirings for Jefferson.

I'd even look into trading McDyess to a contender for expirings and a 1st rounder.

Start rebuilding now.

If we wait to long, the longer the rebuilding process would be.

Maybe I'm overreacting but I think it's best to pull the plug and get as many first rounders we can get and start clearing space up for next off-season.

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Originally Posted by Russ

For the first time since '02 the Spurs are not title contenders.

That's the easy part.

The hard part for the Spurs is what to do next.

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Personally, I think the hard part is to get the FO to "get over themselves" and their much-publicized pristine track record, long enough for them to realize that they need to make some drastic personnel decisions.

First up, is to start divorcing themselves from their "vets only" philosophy,

I wonder how empty this forum will be when the Spurs rebuild. No offense to Pistons fans, but I hope its not like their forum.

I think there are lots of coaches out there who could coach the talent on this team to a 2nd or 3rd in the West. There's really no excuse for a team this healthy, with this much talent, and payroll, to be lower than 3rd.

But that coach just isn't going to be Popovich. He's getting the least out of his team than any coach in the league this year. His ragaholic disciplinarian routine is tired and old and nonsensical in the first place. I'll tell you what his legacy should be...that of the luckiest coach in the history of the league.

The Spurs wilt too often and play with no confidence much of the time. That's because Popovich's style is to beat on them and degrade them -- everybody except for Finley and Bogans, neither of whon have an ounce of talent left, and arguably shouldn't be in the league.

And then he does things like play smallball, which takes them out of games they could win. Tonight against the Lakers, we were cutting the lead in the 4th, trying ot make arun. And who doe he put in the game...Bogans. Who on the Lakers is slow enough for Bogans to guard besides Fisher?

We could have cut the lead down to five, as Doug Collins said, if the three-point shot Parker's pass set up in the corner had fallen. Who took that shot? Bogans. As if that's ever going to go in. Bogans never should have been on the floor. If any other 2 or 3 on the team takes that shot, it has a better chance of going in.

Just another example of how Pop is making this team worse, not better. Timvp very accurately stated that fact in his excellent original post.

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Originally Posted by timtonymanu

I wonder how empty this forum will be when the Spurs rebuild. No offense to Pistons fans, but I hope its not like their forum.

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Joe Dumars did a horrible job in his rebuilding. He overpaid Ben Gordan, gave an old veteran a new contract worth 60 million. Traded their best player and McDyess for Iverson straight up ( No assets for the future). He got no assets for the future in any moves he made.

Spurs would be wise to start cutting their losses now and getting picks for Manu and McDyess most specifically. Not to mention getting expirings for Richard Jefferson. That would speed up the rebuilding process by a huge margin for the Spurs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by timtonymanu

I wonder how empty this forum will be when the Spurs rebuild. No offense to Pistons fans, but I hope its not like their forum.

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Hey, I'll still be around lurking or posting.

The brutal honest truth is we suck.

I'm blaming Pop for a lot too, but we really don't have the talent to compete..people need to stop saying this..

Parker and Ginobili have been inconsistent all year..while Tony will show flashes on a semi-consistent basis, Manu only brings it out once in a while..it's safe to say that Manu is no longer an all-star caliber player..

Jefferson is an average player..

This team has too many old players and no athletes that get court time..

We have only 1 shot blocker and he's 33 years old..our other bigs have serious flaws..

We don't have any perimeter stoppers..

Where is all this talent that some people speak of?..

This is a sad, sad day

At least I might be able to enjoy other nba games more

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

Joe Dumars did a horrible job in his rebuilding. He overpaid Ben Gordan, gave an old veteran a new contract worth 60 million. Traded their best player and McDyess for Iverson straight up ( No assets for the future). He got no assets for the future in any moves he made.

Spurs would be wise to start cutting their losses now and getting picks for Manu and McDyess most specifically. Not to mention getting expirings for Richard Jefferson. That would speed up the rebuilding process by a huge margin for the Spurs.

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I agree with you. However the problem is most teams aren't willing to part with picks. Most sellers will be looking to get rid of bad salaried players too, while looking to get youngsters in return.

I hope Atlanta or Orlando comes out of the East.

And Denver comes out of the West.

I cant stomach Shaq or Kobe getting a 5th ring. I dont want Boston to win again cause KG will go in full douchebag mode again. Also Dallas cause I enjoy their winless franchise.

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Originally Posted by SenorSpur

I agree with you. However the problem is most teams aren't willing to part with picks. Most sellers will be looking to get rid of bad salaried players too, while looking to get youngsters in return.

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

Send Manu and Theo Ratliff to Cleveland for Big Z's expiring contract, JJ Hickson and a 1st round pick.

Send McDyess to Boston for Scalabrine expiring/ Sheldon Williams expiring and their 1st round pick

Trade Jefferson and Mason to Clippers for Camby's expiring and Rasual Butler's expiring.

Tell Duncan to go to Virgin Islands. Tell Parker to go lay low with Eva. Tell the media they broke their foot and would be out for the rest of the year.

Tank the rest of the season.

Use our new 3 first round picks wisely.

Bring Splitter over.

Go after Bosh with the 20 million of cap space we have.



What do you think?

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Contenders would part with picks.

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Originally Posted by MaNu4Tres

Contenders would part with picks.

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If they can get it done, it certainly doesn't hurt to ask.

Draft picks, and in turn young, talented players, are just the antidote this aging franchise needs. Call it rebuilding, reloading or whatever, the time has come.

All the losses the Spurs have stockpiled against upper-echelon teams means they're starting that long walk on the "treadmill of mediocrity." A place you don't want to be.

I agree with AJ and Ellie being a vocal leaders, yes it truly does help and I would feel much more comfortable with losing close games if there was a guy like Mario or AJ around to be loud and get people motivated in that way. The thing is we won 3 championships without guys like that. Well maybe 2 without guys like that, im sure SJax fired some people up. I don't think that was a main problem until now. Someone needs to yell at this team and get their fucking heads straight.

I don't know what the hell POP is doing... He had Blair going up against a lineup of Gasol, Artest, and Odom? WTF... Why didn't POP throw Ratliff out against Pau for a few mins? Why the hell did you sign Ratliff if you aren't even going to play him against bigger lineups? POP's strategy against a big lineup is to play nanoball????

For a guy that keeps on experimenting lineups, he never tries a bigger lineup...he only experiments small and nano lineups...it's really baffling!!

time to rebuild as quickly as possible. hopefully by the time the spurs are done, they can squeeze out one final championship for duncan's final year. jefferson's contract will be expiring next year so it will be a huge asset. get some experience for hill and blair, bring splitter over, lowball ginobili to a $5-6 million contract, keep parker healthy, use jefferson's expiring or mcdyess's partially guaranteed contract to get a star level player, bring in a younger coach, and win again in 2 years.

tanking next season is a good idea as well. might be too obvious though.

not much to tank for guys, at least as far as still contending in the future with Duncan.

The work stoppage coming in 2011 is going to be brutal and could cost an entire season. Even if the resulting deal is similar with regards to being able to sign new players, how good do you expect Duncan to look 24 months from now?

Unless something big and ridiculous happens before the deadline . . . the era is over. It's just time for the long goodbye.

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Originally Posted by objective

not much to tank for guys, at least as far as still contending in the future with Duncan.

The work stoppage coming in 2011 is going to be brutal and could cost an entire season. Even if the resulting deal is similar with regards to being able to sign new players, how good do you expect Duncan to look 24 months from now?

Unless something big and ridiculous happens before the deadline . . . the era is over. It's just time for the long goodbye.

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A good point. Because even a lockout will not stop the aging process of these players. In fact, it will only compound matters.

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/medi...luis_scola.jpg

There lies the first blow in the death of the Spurs

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Originally Posted by timvp

Before the Lakers game, I had the Spurs at about a 1-in-200 longshot at winning the NBA championship. After the Lakers forcibly took advantage of the Spurs without Kobe and Bynum, I'm going to lower those chances to zero. For the first time in the Tim Duncan Era, I'm watching a healthy team with absolutely no chance of winning a championship. I still think they will make the playoffs but the chances of a fifth title isn't slim ... it's none.

-You can't fault Tim Duncan's effort. But the reality is that he's no longer in a tier by himself. He used to easily be the best bigman in the game. Now he's in the same tier as players like Dwight Howard, Pau Gasol and Dirk Nowitzki. It is painful to admit it ... but it's sadly the truth. Wear and tear has allowed the pack to catch up to him.

-Manu Ginobili's normal gait has never returned since his surgery following the Olympics. His run is more like a fast waddle. He's lost at least one step, is a streak shooter, struggles to defend in one-on-one situations and just isn't as dangerous as he was prior to March of 2008. He's gone from a damn good NBA player to a damn good bench player.

-Tony Parker ruined himself by overworking with the French national team. Not only is he beat up physically, he doesn't have it mentally. Evidence of that is seen when he explodes for one half and then disappears for another half -- as he's done way too often this season. He used to have great focus and would stay in attack mode for weeks at a time. Now we're lucky if we see him in attack mode for an entire quarter. He plays like he's physically, mentally and emotionally drained.

-It's not gonna happen. Richard Jefferson won't fit on this team. It's not so much his skillset is incompatible, it's more to do with his fragile psyche. You really don't know how a player will fit on a championship level team until he's thrown into the fire. He's been thrown into the fire -- and has melted. He's an inconsistent offensive threat who does absolutely nothing positive when his shot isn't going in. And as the pressure mounts on him to perform, he's just going to become more and more inconsistent. I can't imagine a happy ending with Jefferson in San Antonio.

-When the Spurs signed Antonio McDyess, they hoped old age wouldn't catch up to him right away. Unfortunately, it did. He's already a shell of what he was last season. He's getting better but he just isn't the defensive presence he used to be. He's no longer a championship quality player as a starter.

-God bless DeJuan Blair but when size is your weakness and the team you have to go through has length as their main strength ... that's a bad combination.

-George Hill has come up big lately but the bottom line is he's a 6-foot-2 tweener who loses his confidence at the drop of a hat. When he loses his confidence, he turns into an indecisive dribbling machine. There's hope he can remedy that flaw before the end of the season but that type of growth is measured in years, not games. And while he's solid in most other aspects, he's not good enough in any one category to overcome passive play.

-Matt Bonner isn't going to regain his pre-injury level of play this season. He's a rhythm and confidence player who is playing with neither rhythm nor confidence. He might as well go start running the hills in New Hampshire now to get ready for next season.

-He had his moments but Roger Mason, Jr.'s run as a Spur is over. Pop doesn't like him anymore. He can't play well without quality minutes. The question is just whether or not the Spurs trade him now or let him walk after the season.

-Michael Finley's NBA career should have been over at least two seasons ago. I'll give him credit ... the guy tries hard and is at times the team's most physical player, but he's over the hill, all the way onto the other side and walking in quicksand.

-No matter how hard Pop hopes and wishes, Keith Bogans will never be more than a homeless version of an old Bruce Bowen.

-Speaking of Pop, he has historically been a very good coach but he nowhere near Phil Jackson's level. If Phil Jackson is Michael Jordan, Pop is Craig Ehlo. Pop is great at coaching players with that innately have a huge amount of self confidence ... but when it comes to coaching players who aren't brimming with self assurance, he's just not very good. Jefferson is simply the latest example of an otherwise quality player who can't handle the pressure of Pop's coaching style and complex system. On top of that, Pop not selecting a rotation has the Spurs stuck in neutral. They can't gain any momentum because no one knows who is playing on a nightly basis. To date, this has by far been Pop's worst coaching job of his career; in fact, he's done more to hurt than help this team.

-I feel for you, Peter Holt. You gave the Spurs and Spurs fans what they wanted when you opened your wallet to spend millions in an effort to get one last championship during the Tim Duncan Era. Your gesture should have be rewarded. It hasn't. If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

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Very interesting Tim,..

However, in regards to the owner abandoning the price tag isn't the problem. The core of this spurs team is in fact still NBA championship capable. The facts of the matter is he needs to look at Popovich and Buford as those out of date and or touch.

Noway should they'd missed the look on how vital a post big to play off / with Duncan is while spending all that money. To include having lost all perspective on how much help a role playing shooter would bolster this team.

They had Drew Gooden in the fold and Popovich ran him to Dallas. Now Duncan plays the post all but alone and the rest of the team shows the effects. Then they { Pop and Buford } went out and acquired players that would require an entirely different manner of attack than the core is suited for,..mistakes that cost that much requires somebody getting fired.

I mean there's no question that Tim Duncan is the rock, anchor, pillar, heart, soul and best player on this team. Yet in assembling this roster they did nothing to show they understood that.

Believe it or not it was quiet easily fixable before picking up the options on a couple players and not acquiring available free agent talent to turn this thing around. Now in this economy nobody's going to jump at picking up the contracts of Jefferson, McDyess, Finley, Mason nor any groundswell to take Bonner, Hairston, Bogans nor Mahinmi either,..big problem.

It's clear that teams acquire and keep players that their coach can mesh with. But in the manner of how stringent that coach can be it limits the teams chances of success. With free agency, the money crunch and getting the best out of an aging core the coach has to think outside of his temperamental comfort zone box,..Pop can't do it and the needed players have looked the other way.

Thus as I see it from whats been shown, Is the high stakes NBA game has passed Popovich and Buford by via philosophical differences. Of which their reliance upon Duncan and Pop's inability to attract / keep free agents is costing too much. As GM had those players and price tags been mention on my watch they'd have gotten nixed because they

spurs shouldn't do anything drastic before the trade deadline like take back a long contract of a decent player. the last thing they want to do is panic and pull a pistons. that team will be stuck in mediocrity for some time. i doubt small fixes will turn this team into a championship team because the problem lies within the big 3. they just aren't big anymore. now that the spurs know they can't win, they should be patient and hopefully speed up the rebuilding process by waiting for the right opportunity to come along. rather than destroying the franchise through a panic move (suns), they should be patient like the rockets.

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Originally Posted by baseline bum

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/medi...luis_scola.jpg

There lies the first blow in the death of the Spurs

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It's 100% true, and people that had a clue could see it at the time.

You're a team that doesn't spend outrageous amounts of money, you're not a big time market, and there aren't other teams willing to collude with you and gift you all-star players.

You can't afford to pass up youthful legit NBA rotation players and possible starters on relatively cheap contracts just out of spite or foolishness.

You . . . just . . . can't. And not have it haunt you.

There was a legit PF right there in their laps. They had his rights. They had a key piece to their own future in their hands. And they blew it.

It isn't the last blow that shatters a dynasty, but all the blows that came before it. :depressed

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Originally Posted by objective

It isn't the last blow that shatters a dynasty, but all the blows that came before it. :depressed

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ouch.....that hurts :depressed

Should have this quote framed up at Pop's office

Would RJ, Manu, Splitter rights, and a 1st rd. pick be enough
to get Iggy/ Dalembert?

They then trade their expirings for a Salmons/Thomas or
Sessions/ Gomes type trade?

The good news for Spurs there's alot of teams looking to
make moves.

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Originally Posted by baseline bum

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/medi...luis_scola.jpg

There lies the first blow

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Add in the fact that Lamar Odom usually struggles against him.

That's a brutally honest truth.

I'll make the coffee and get the tissue boxes and we can all snuggle and cry about it on the couch together.

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Originally Posted by Allanon

Add in the fact that Lamar Odom usually struggles against him.

That's a brutally honest truth.

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Haha, don't say that man.... it's bad enough already.

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Originally Posted by Dro210

Haha, don't say that man.... it's bad enough already.

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:lol It's true, unfortunately.

Lamar's my favorite player but one of the main reasons why the Rockets took the Lakers 7 games last year was due to Odom losing the Scola matchup.

To me, Spurs need to fix 3 things:

- The mental aspect. A lot of Spurs trouble are related to a lack of mental strength. Spurs were a strong and resilient team in the past and they need to go back at that state of mind. It's easy to say than this team need a psychological turning point. It could be a player only meeting, Holt talking to them or a crazy game but something has to happen.

- Pop needs to coach better. For the moment, he has refused to make choices when choices had to been made or he has made poor ones. He needs to figure it out how to use the team.

- A trade need to be done. It doesn't really need to be a big one if it's a smart one but Spurs don't have the roster to compete with other true contender.

If these 3 things are done, Spurs will be for real. If one isn't, Spurs aren't a contender.

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Originally Posted by timvp

Before the Lakers game, ...

... If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

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Originally Posted by Kori Ellis

What a drama queen :married:

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:lol You guys are some of my favourite people. As long as you keep this forum, it will always be a place I like to visit daily and share thoughts and/or argue with friends.
And don't think you're getting rid of me just because the Spurs suck :D

Now to the subject at hand. I agree with pretty much everything and props for spelling out what most of us were thinking more and more as this season progressed.

The baffling thing in all of this to me is Pop. I have always had the highest respect for his methods and above all his intellect. Has he gone senile or has he realized the real situation way before us and this is his last - desperate - attempt at shaking things up? I know I'm grasping at straws, but how has CIA Pop - one of the smartest coaches of all times - gone to AARP Pop so quickly?

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Originally Posted by timtonymanu

...

I cant stomach Shaq or Kobe getting a 5th ring. I dont want Boston to win again cause KG will go in full douchebag mode again. Also Dallas cause I enjoy their winless franchise.

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:lol

Oh, and +1

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Originally Posted by objective

...

It isn't the last blow that shatters a dynasty, but all the blows that came before it. :depressed

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Ouch!

Sadly... I'm officially signing off on trading Ginobili and/or Parker.

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-You can't fault Tim Duncan's effort. But the reality is that he's no longer in a tier by himself. He used to easily be the best bigman in the game. Now he's in the same tier as players like Dwight Howard, Pau Gasol and Dirk Nowitzki. It is painful to admit it ... but it's sadly the truth. Wear and tear has allowed the pack to catch up to him.

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This has probably been true for several years now. There are reasons we thought this was more of Parkers team last year. A team with Duncan at this level is still capable of good things - including a championship team.

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-Manu Ginobili's normal gait has never returned since his surgery following the Olympics. His run is more like a fast waddle. He's lost at least one step, is a streak shooter, struggles to defend in one-on-one situations and just isn't as dangerous as he was prior to March of 2008. He's gone from a damn good NBA player to a damn good bench player.

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Yup. This is probably the area the Spurs have felt the biggest decline and this is what they will find the biggest to overcome. The big 3 is no more. Its the big two.

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-Tony Parker ruined himself by overworking with the French national team. Not only is he beat up physically, he doesn't have it mentally. Evidence of that is seen when he explodes for one half and then disappears for another half -- as he's done way too often this season. He used to have great focus and would stay in attack mode for weeks at a time. Now we're lucky if we see him in attack mode for an entire quarter. He plays like he's physically, mentally and emotionally drained.

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I think this is true as well, but I have hope that he actually will have something come playoff time. I think the competitive level rises in the playoff in most players and I think that would be good for Tony. On the flip side one has to wonder why he hasn't been able to muster that strength yet this season, of course.

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-It's not gonna happen. Richard Jefferson won't fit on this team. It's not so much his skillset is incompatible, it's more to do with his fragile psyche. You really don't know how a player will fit on a championship level team until he's thrown into the fire. He's been thrown into the fire -- and has melted. He's an inconsistent offensive threat who does absolutely nothing positive when his shot isn't going in. And as the pressure mounts on him to perform, he's just going to become more and more inconsistent. I can't imagine a happy ending with Jefferson in San Antonio.

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I don't get this dude. I know more running will help him offensively, but I just don't understand how George Hill is now better than Richard Jefferson.

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-When the Spurs signed Antonio McDyess, they hoped old age wouldn't catch up to him right away. Unfortunately, it did. He's already a shell of what he was last season. He's getting better but he just isn't the defensive presence he used to be. He's no longer a championship quality player as a starter.

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I'm not too sure this is true. He's played much better as of late and I'm not ready to sell him so short based on tonight. Its also hard to get a read on him when Pop goes to midget ball instead of actually sticking with him when he has a bad night. If Pop treated his bigs the way he treats Finley we might see them play out of of their funks.

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-God bless DeJuan Blair but when size is your weakness and the team you have to go through has length as their main strength ... that's a bad combination.

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Pop set him up to fail tonight by making him the biggest guy on the court. Just hung him out to dry.

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-George Hill has come up big lately but the bottom line is he's a 6-foot-2 tweener who loses his confidence at the drop of a hat. When he loses his confidence, he turns into an indecisive dribbling machine. There's hope he can remedy that flaw before the end of the season but that type of growth is measured in years, not games. And while he's solid in most other aspects, he's not good enough in any one category to overcome passive play.

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I know we're blaming everything up to Global Warming on Pop but I wonder if this isn't his fault too. That being said, with the growth George Hill has made this year I've got nothing but love for him.

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-Matt Bonner isn't going to regain his pre-injury level of play this season. He's a rhythm and confidence player who is playing with neither rhythm nor confidence. He might as well go start running the hills in New Hampshire now to get ready for next season.

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Jury still out on this. Played well in the first half then got no minutes. Pretty hard to get in a rhythm while on the bench.

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-He had his moments but Roger Mason, Jr.'s run as a Spur is over. Pop doesn't like him anymore. He can't play well without quality minutes. The question is just whether or not the Spurs trade him now or let him walk after the season.

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Yup.

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-Michael Finley's NBA career should have been over at least two seasons ago. I'll give him credit ... the guy tries hard and is at times the team's most physical player, but he's over the hill, all the way onto the other side and walking in quicksand.

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Yup

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-No matter how hard Pop hopes and wishes, Keith Bogans will never be more than a homeless version of an old Bruce Bowen.

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Thats being generous. You know, if I told you in the summer after all the signings that Bogans would be playing this much you would probably know there was a problem. Playing this guy makes no fucking sense. Its Jacque Vaugn all over again.

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-Speaking of Pop, he has historically been a very good coach but he nowhere near Phil Jackson's level. If Phil Jackson is Michael Jordan, Pop is Craig Ehlo. Pop is great at coaching players with that innately have a huge amount of self confidence ... but when it comes to coaching players who aren't brimming with self assurance, he's just not very good. Jefferson is simply the latest example of an otherwise quality player who can't handle the pressure of Pop's coaching style and complex system. On top of that, Pop not selecting a rotation has the Spurs stuck in neutral. They can't gain any momentum because no one knows who is playing on a nightly basis. To date, this has by far been Pop's worst coaching job of his career; in fact, he's done more to hurt than help this team.

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I honestly think Pop is done as a coach. its amazing Sloan has lasted as long as he has but coaches never last even as long as Pop and remain effective without some sort of a change in scenery. Since I'm all but certain Pop will never coach another team, I would prefer him moving soley to a front office position and actually bringing in a coach.

Paging Jeff Van Gundy.

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-I feel for you, Peter Holt. You gave the Spurs and Spurs fans what they wanted when you opened your wallet to spend millions in an effort to get one last championship during the Tim Duncan Era. Your gesture should have be rewarded. It hasn't. If you order the abandonment of this ship and a return to payroll normalcy, it'd be a sad day ... but I'd understand.

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Maybe, but maybe not. The one good thing about RJ is that even if it fails this year you can almost certainly flip him next year for someone good. We'll see what TP and Tim have in the tank then.

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Originally Posted by baseline bum

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/medi...luis_scola.jpg

There lies the first blow in the death of the Spurs

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Scola was just traded at a time when Spurs were humped with quality players and a rookie wasn't expected to have the playing time despite his superb performances in FIBA games, while the Rockets at that time were struggling with an exigent need for a decent PF. Spurs just underrated this Argentinian international basketballer and Scola was only considered an equivalent piece of trash as Jakie Butler in that trade, which however turned out to be a horrible mistake soon later.

BTW... Dennis Lindsey??? Has this guy had one single good move since he's been GM?