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That's another side effect of tasking LE with immigration responsibilities. Not only will will illegal immigrants tend to avoid reporting crimes or cooperating with investigations, when personally wronged some people might be tempted to take justice into their own hands.
The first thing a policeman does after pulling someone over is ask for their license, registration, and proof of insurance. Do you think you could get away with refusing? So how is this any different? Do you honestly think the police are just going to pull a car over for no real reason just because the driver is hispanic?
I've never been arrested, but don't they always check your ID when you are? So again, what's different about this law?
I really don't get all the uproar. Of course, maybe it's just the stupid people like the ones at MSNBC who had this on the bottom of the screen:
Arizona law makes it a crime to be an illegal immigrant
Well duh - doesn't the word "illegal" denote something criminal? This is just more bitching from the PC crowd, and those who think we should keep our borders open so anyone can come over.
http://iowaindependent.com/32851/the...th-certificateQuote:
A Latino truck driver outside Phoenix was taken into custody by law enforcement at a weigh station. He pulled in to have the truck looked at, was apparently approached by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) agents and asked for ID. He showed them his commercial driver’s license. They asked him for more ID. He told them his social security number. They cuffed him took him to the central office in Phoenix and called his wife to bring his social security card and birth certificate. The man is identifying himself to media only as “Abdon” and he is an American citizen born in the USA.
Pretty fucking awful.
I'm waiting for all the Hispanics in AZ to only speak Spanish in public, that'll show everyone who the real minority is!
The Hispanics will outfuck everyone and take over this bitch, don't think we won't try!
Wow. Unfuckinreal. I really hope I'm not in the wrong place at the wrong time when the first racial riot breaks out in this state. Words cannot describe how amazed I am at how much this law blatantly violets constitutional rights.
The policeman needs a valid reason to pull over a driver, and he then asks for those items because state law requires every driver to have those items in order to drive. If you refuse to show them, then you get cited and pay fines; in other words, you have committed new traffic offenses. With a traffic ticket, an officer bases his decision to pull over someone on a violation of the traffic laws that he observes (speeding is observable by pacing or radar; it's clear if someone doesn't use a blinker; rolling through a stop sign is an observable offense; etc). This AZ law says an officer can approach and question somebody on suspicion of being in that state illegally. What would an officer observe to arouse his suspicions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
This law reverses the order. They check your ID first, and then arrest you .Quote:
I've never been arrested, but don't they always check your ID when you are? So again, what's different about this law?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stringer_Bell
LOL since when have hispanics been organized enough to do so? (besides Cesar)
The resemblance is semantic. Immigration courts are administrative law courts, not criminal courts. US law has never treated illegal immigrants as criminals. That is brand new. You've been demagogued, Crookshanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
this does not exclusively apply to just routine traffic stops.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
Did you read the actual law I posted? Nowhere does it say an officer can approach and question someone soley to check their immigration status. It says they must check while having "lawful contact". Again, I think some of you are getting your shorts in a wad over nothing.Quote:
This AZ law says an officer can approach and question somebody on suspicion of being in that state illegally
Personally - I don't really care - I say send all the illegals back to where they came from. Illegal is illegal is illegal. You want to come to the United States - then use the proper channels. And I also think they should go after companies that hire illegals. They should receive huge fines, and jail time for subsequent offenses. If you dry up the source of jobs - the illegals will go home. That, and take away their benefits like free schooling for their kids.
What's ironic is that Mexico some of the toughest immigration laws in the world. Yet, they want us to look the other way while all their citizens come into our country illegally.
are the tales of kidnapping, drop houses, murders really getting out of hand? I want to see the factual numbers. I can understand drastic measures need to be put into effect if these things are true. On the other hand however, you can't just take away constitutional rights.
you act as if there has never been a case of an officer using his or her discretion to create a reason for "lawful contact". it is not very difficult for a "tip" to be phoned in on "suspicious activity" at a home or work site.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
in crookskanks world the police never do anything to create a situation to check someone out.. he lives in a utopiaQuote:
Originally Posted by rjv
he is a she, and she's never been arrested cuz they don't have lane bryant sized cells. har harQuote:
Originally Posted by George Gervin's Afro
You should do stand-up comedy clam - you're so hilarious. :rolleyes I haven't been arrested because I make it a habit to obey the law - except for speeding - I do like to drive faster than the posted speed limit. :lolQuote:
Originally Posted by clambake
you know i was kidding.
but you shouldn't speed. i'd hate to be your airbag. har har
But if a cop pulls somebody over, they're going to ask for identification anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by LnGrrrR
Start outside the Home Depots. These illegals are not hiding, yet. We needed a law like this past so we can confront them and get them the hell out of here. Next, any meskin mowing a yard, stop them and ask for ID. Make it simple for awhile. The obvious hot spots.
I heard this evening that the Arizona police had a hand in crafting this bill. They said all those who go through the Police Academy are taught about reasonable suspicion and probable cause and that this law doesn't change that. And he again reiterated that this law specifically prohibits racial profiling.
I'm all for racial profiling. Best way to find illegals.
Yes, you can get away with refusing. Check this case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiibel_...ourt_of_Nevada
So it's mandatory to identify yourself, but not hand over documents. (If you're driving, you may have to produce a driver's license to prove you're able to drive, but that's a separate issue from having to ID yourself just because.)Quote:
Here the Nevada statute is narrower and precise.” The Nevada Supreme Court had held that the Nevada statute required only that the suspect divulge his name; presumably, he could do so without handing over any documents whatsoever. As long as the suspect tells the officer his name, he has satisfied the dictates of the Nevada stop-and-identify law.
I thought conservatives were supposed to be against more power in our government?Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
Are you seriously saying you don't see a possibility for this law to be abused?
just keep wearing your white hood. you'll be cool.Quote:
Originally Posted by jack sommerset
How do you know who is legal or not before the police attempts any "lawful contact"? How many times American citizens of Latino descent, or lawful residents need to be asked for papers or corroborate their nationality before you see this law is a mediocre attempt to solve a legitimate problem?Quote:
Originally Posted by Crookshanks
And the police are granted no deportation rights. All the police can do is detain and eventually hand it over to ICE, who then could deport if the alien doesn't appeal. In the meantime, we have more jails crowded, more money spent processing these people, and eventually all of them back somewhere else a couple of weeks after deportation because the border is still open.
Why is anybody surprised that the usual suspects aren't worried about this legislation? They don't expect to suffer as a result of it, and they clearly don't have the imagination to empathize with those who might. Hmmmm... in what other nations has this mentality been present?