Austin Toros Contribution to the Spurs Thread

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Originally Posted by 20beastie45

Ginobili played most of the fourth quarter in the clinching finals game.:toast:toast:toast

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All those guys got a chance to contribute in the playoffs.

Of course apparently none of it means anything now that Malik Hairston is gone.............

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Originally Posted by ohmwrecker

I assumed OV meant in the playoffs, but, yeah, wrong either way.

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Hill played 4 playoff games at 19 minutes per game his rookie year (First round loss), and Blair played in 10 games at 9.1 minutes per game (Second round loss).

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Originally Posted by coyotes_geek

All those guys got a chance to contribute in the playoffs.

Of course apparently none of it means anything now that Malik Hairston is gone.............

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He's not called Obstructed View for nothing. :lol

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

How has that worked out better for the Spurs? No draft and stash has fared any better than the D-league guys. In fact, the Spurs' recent draft record is growing more and more dismal by the day.

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:rolleyes Spurs recent draft record is growing more dismal? So John Solomon, Luis Scola, Leonardo BarBosa, Beno Udrih, Tiago Splitter, George Hill, and Dejuan Blair, are dismal huh?

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

Going by history, Pop doesn't trust or play rookies, even really good ones.

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Except recent history says your wrong. Hill, Blair, and Temple did play as rookies. And Pop does play "even really good ones". Wern't Duncan and to a lesser extent, Parker "really good ones" that Pop played their rookie seasons?

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Originally Posted by Cane

He's not called Obstructed View for nothing. :lol

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I'm just curious what exactly obstructs his view? :downspin:

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Originally Posted by jjktkk

Except recent history says your wrong. Hill, Blair, and Temple did play as rookies. And Pop does play "even really good ones". Wern't Duncan and to a lesser extent, Parker "really good ones" that Pop played their rookie seasons?

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If you have to include Duncan and Parker to make your point, then you probably know that Pop didn't give Blair or Hill enough playing time and you just want to be argumentative.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

If you have to include Duncan and Parker to make your point, then you probably know that Pop didn't give Blair or Hill enough playing time and you just want to be argumentative.

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Actually, if you are talking about rookies drafted by the Spurs then Duncan and Parker should be included...otherwise you're cherry picking your sample to suit your conclusion...

I live in Austin and even though Toros games are cheap I would much rather spend my money seeing the Spurs. D-League games are painful to watch... kind of like watching pickup games at the Y.

The Toros may create added "Spurs interest" in Austin. Austinites may be more loyal to the Spurs with that connection. (Don't be surprised if that's why the Spurs keep them on.)

In fact, that may actually justify their existence. Nothing else does.

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Originally Posted by Russ

The Toros may create added "Spurs interest" in Austin. Austinites may be more loyal to the Spurs with that connection. (Don't be surprised if that's why the Spurs keep them on.)

In fact, that may actually justify their existence. Nothing else does.

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The Toros don't create Spurs interest in Austin. Those residents of Austin who were already Spurs fans create Toros interest.

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Originally Posted by coyotes_geek

The Toros don't create Spurs interest in Austin. Those residents of Austin who were already Spurs fans create Toros interest.

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Damn straight.

Several people in this thread have hit on the main point that should be made: the Toros aren't the problem, the D-League as a whole is. It's a very low level league with very low level salaries. Thus, you get very low level talent. On rare occasions you find players who are near NBA-ready, but it's really hard to evaluate because they're playing against scrubs for the most part.

I hope major details about the D-League change in the new CBA. As it is, it's the equivalent of baseball teams trying to bring guys up from Class-A ball.

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Originally Posted by Obstructed_View

Manu was under contract with Kinder Bologna, was he not? Unless I'm remembering things incorrectly the Spurs didn't have any choice about how long it was going to take for him to join the team.

If we're talking about guys that the Spurs drafted based on potential and sent to Europe to improve, then Splitter, Scola and Manu aren't on that list. They were all NBA talents with questionable availibility due to obligations to other teams. That's closer to David Robinson than Romain Sato. So far, James Gist hasn't outshone Malik Hairston.

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Right. Manu was such an NBA ready talent that the Spurs used their THIRD pick of the draft,and second of the second round, to make sure that they got him. He didn't even play for just one team in Italy while they were waiting and evaluating him. He was with Reggio Calabria when drafted, and signed with Kinder Bolognia in 2000 (meaning he was available, if not yet NBA ready).

You remembered wrong. Manu was a draft and stash.

Can someone provide a list of DLeaguers who have made a legit contribution to any NBA team?

Not trying to be facetious, I really am curious

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Originally Posted by gospursgojas

Can someone provide a list of DLeaguers who have made a legit contribution to any NBA team?

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Sundiata James of the Jazz is the only one I can think of and that's not a great example.

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Originally Posted by gospursgojas

Can someone provide a list of DLeaguers who have made a legit contribution to any NBA team?

Not trying to be facetious, I really am curious

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Go down Golden State's roster: Azabuike and Morrow come to mind.

yup, d league seems pretty worthless. hairston dominated the league, dropping 40 pt games left and right. yet he hasn't improved enough to play in the nba? don't see how much more he can improve in the d league.

In a roundabout way (and by that I mean, it honestly has nothing to do with the Toros' contribution to the Spurs), I'd have to go with ChumpDumper.

He'd definitely get my vote.

What do you expect to get from D-League players?

I saw plenty of people clamoring for Matt Barnes recently, would you have wanted him?

Chris Anderson, how 'bout him?

Kelenna Azubuike?

Bobby Simmons when he was Most Improved Player of the Year?

Anthony Morrow got out of a contract at the last minute playing overseas because the Warriors took a shot on him after going undrafted.

There are players to be found that can play a role for a team if just given the opportunity. That's really all that sets a lot of the role players of teams apart from some of these D-League and overseas players: opportunity.

If the NBA could ever build the D-League into a 30 team league, where every NBA team owns its own NBDL team, then I think you will see more benefits. You will see teams being able to use the DLeague as a farm system and even a valuable rehab option for players coming back from injury.

I'm not even sold on there being 30 NBA teams.

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Originally Posted by urunobili

Maybe I'm just a little disappointed that Malik is gone now but I think it's time to draw a line and evaluate the true contribution of the Toros to the big team.

We used the system to develop Marcus Williams, Ian Mahimni, Malik Hairston among others (those three were the ones that spent more time there) and no results for the big team thus far.

Can someone please remind me of the value of having the franchise run the Spurs system if they haven't been able to produce contributors?

Hopefully this thread will make me eat crow this year with Jerrells and Gee; hopefully. I'll gladly do so.

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One positive take is if a particular D-League player is not good enough for Pop & the Spurs but, is good enough to make a team like Dallas then I'd say we are ahead of the game.

One other thing is it allows the Spurs management a good evaluation period before they get in too deep with what most of these guys will end up being...the 10th, 11th, 12th or lo and behold, the 13th option.

How did we miss this?


http://www.48minutesofhell.com/2010/...antonio-spurs/

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Originally Posted by Biggems

If the NBA could ever build the D-League into a 30 team league, where every NBA team owns its own NBDL team, then I think you will see more benefits. You will see teams being able to use the DLeague as a farm system and even a valuable rehab option for players coming back from injury.

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I posted some thoughts on what I felt the D-League should do about 6 months ago. By no means is this an exhaustive list, but it's a start.

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Originally Posted by lurker23

I always felt the D-League would eventually expand in scope. I personally would like to see any player be able to sent down there on a voluntary basis, such as for injury rehab (similar to MLB). However, I can see why the players union would fight hard against that; 8-year vets being subtly forced to go down to the D-League or be waived would be a very bad situation.

As far as non-NBA players in the D-League, I think there's a few changes that would benefit the league as a whole:

1.) Salaries need to be improved across the board to make money closer to at least the low-to-mid level European leagues. Right now the D-League is only a viable alternative to Europe for players who a.) have extenuating circumstances, real or imagined, for why they can't leave the states, or b.) are (for good reasons or not) convinced that they can be a legitimate NBA players in 4 months or less, and don't want to risk that chance for a longer-term commitment in Europe. I'm not saying these guys should make half a million dollars; I'm just saying the quality of players you get could potentially rise a lot if you changed the salary range from $27,500-40,000 to $50,000-150,000.

2.) The league should continue to expand until it is a true minor league, with one team per NBA team (or, at the very least, there should be no more than 2 NBA teams per D-League team). I think this is already in the plans.

3.) Teams in general need to move to bigger cities to become more financially viable (see #1). I'm not saying every team should have their D-League affiliate in their own town (see LA D-Fenders) or the absolute largest markets they can find, but they should be in decent sized markets in the same general vicinity as their parent club. The Toros/Spurs set-up is perfect. I'd like to see more teams follow that model. Examples: The Wizards should have a team in Baltimore, the Grizzlies should have a team in Nashville, the Cavaliers should have a team in Akron, etc.

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Originally Posted by lurker23

The more I think about this, the more I think it could be a great idea. How much money could the teams make just from rehab assignments alone? "For two nights only, come see Tim Duncan play for the Austin Toros." Even if he only plays 10 minutes a night to get back into some kind of game-rhythm, they'd sell-out the house and make a ton in concessions and merchandise.

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